Re : Hare Krishna Maha Mantra ...

[Guest guest]

Hare Krishna.

 

Regarding the Maha Mantra, I have heard certain explanations regarding the

reason for the reversal.

Apart from the fact that more than one version of the sequence of the mantra

exist in the extant versions of the

relevant upanishads, it is also said that this idea prevailed amongst the

caste conscious brahmanas who were influential

in society during the time of Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu. In order to chant

the Mantra with Rama first, their claim to qualification was the claim to

brahmana birth and qualification, which automatically discredited many a

persons. Since the Lord was distributing the Holy Name to all souls

regardless of varna affiliations, He is said to have reversed the sequence

to overcome this claim since chanting Krishna first was not monopolised in

that manner.

 

While shastra is the guiding light, not everything in shastra can be had

without the guidance of the Acharya. It is said therefore that Acharya

purusho Veda - that what constitutes the essence of the Veda Vedanta Shastra

is to be had with the Acharya sankalpa or the mercy of the Acharya. As

such, if we are to accept Sriman Mahaprabhu as Acharya, what to speak of as

Krishna Himself, then we have to follow His version as given in the

parampara system. We do not have the purity or the ability to approach

shastra directly to decipher the meanings. Merely providing technical

evidence alone will not do. One has to be self-realised to understand the

esence of the text and the way of presenting the essentials according to

time, place and circumstances. Those who rigidly stick to externals alone

without grasping the essential spirit are like parrots mouthing words

without absorbing the implications. Best to take the version of the Acharya

in the line of the greatest preceptor of the Holy Name and attain

perfection.

 

Hare Krishna

 

your servant,

R. Jai Simman

Singapore

[Guest guest]

Aside from the Ramanandis there are also other Vaishnavas who

claim that the maha-mantra should begin with the words, Hare

Rama. There is one such group here in Orissa known as the Atibori

sampradaya. They claim to be followers of Sri Chaitanya

Mahaprabhu. However, even amongst mundane scholars they are not

considered to be genuine followers of Mahaprabhu as they have

their own distinctly differerent philosophy. Two major

differences between them and the Gaudiya sampradaya is one that

they consider the topmost aspect of the supreme truth to be the

impersonal brahman, the second is that they chant the

maha-mantra beginning with Hare Rama. They founder of their sect

is named Jagannath Das who some say was an associate of

Mahaprabhu. One of the followers of Jagannath Das wrote a book a

few hundred years ago called Jagannath Caritamrita. A story is

related in this book regarding how Mahaprabhu supposedly told

Jagannath Das to chant the maha-mantra beginning with Hare Rama

rather than Hare Krishna.

 

This story is not accepted amongst Gaudiya scholars for several

reasons. One of which is that in Caitanya Bhagavat, Vrindavan Das

mentions three times how Mahaprabhu was chanting the maha-mantra

beginning with Hare Krishna (adi 14.145; madhya 23.76; antya 9.46

and antya 3.164). Also in his Laghu Bhagavatamrta (1.4) Srila

Rupa Goswami has described:

 

sri caitanya-mukhodgirna hare krsneti varnakah

 

"The words 'Hare Krishna came from the mouth of Sri Chaitanya

Mahaprabhu."

 

R. Jai Simman wrote:

 

> Regarding the Maha Mantra, I have heard certain explanations

regarding the

> reason for the reversal.

> Apart from the fact that more than one version of the sequence

of the mantra

> exist in the extant versions of the

> relevant upanishads, it is also said that this idea prevailed

amongst the

> caste conscious brahmanas who were influential

> in society during the time of Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu. In

order to chant

> the Mantra with Rama first, their claim to qualification was

the claim to

> brahmana birth and qualification, which automatically

discredited many a

> persons. Since the Lord was distributing the Holy Name to all

souls

> regardless of varna affiliations, He is said to have reversed

the sequence

> to overcome this claim since chanting Krishna first was not

monopolised in

> that manner.

 

I would be interested if you have a reference for this story.

During a discussion I had here with some Vaishnava scholars I

mentioned this story as a possible reason why we chant the

maha-mantra in the way we do. Although the story was well known

to the persons present it was not accepted by them. They

requested that I give some evidence for it, which I was unable to

do.

 

Das anudas, Madhavananda Das

[Guest guest]

> relevant upanishads, it is also said that this idea prevailed amongst the

> caste conscious brahmanas who were influential

> in society during the time of Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu. In order to chant

> the Mantra with Rama first, their claim to qualification was the claim to

> brahmana birth and qualification, which automatically discredited many a

> persons. Since the Lord was distributing the Holy Name to all souls

> regardless of varna affiliations, He is said to have reversed the sequence

> to overcome this claim since chanting Krishna first was not monopolised in

> that manner.

 

....because then, technically, the Hare Krishna mahaa-mantra was not a shruti

mantra, and thus could be chanted by everyone. This is the logic behind that

particular story.

 

I have also heard the same explanation, but unfortunately it did not come

from Srila Prabhupada or anyone in our paramparaa as far as I know. Hence, I

strongly urge all devotees to reject this explanation until someone can

provide more explicit evidence that it is valid. It may seem like a trivial

point, but in fact I think it is far more significant than many realize.

 

First of all, the idea that Mahaaprabhu changed the mantra in order to

appease the caste-conscious brahmins makes little sense within context. Had

He done such a thing, it would imply that Mahaaprabhu actually held those

opinions in high regard. Is that likely, given that Mahaaprabhu's spiritual

successors so explicitly denounce the idea that brahminical birth guarantees

brahminical qualification?

 

Secondly, the changelessness of the shrutis is a sacred principle for all

Vedaanta schools. See Govinda-bhaashya 1.3.29: "ata eva cha nityatvam - And

for this very reason the eternity (of the Veda is proved)." Srila Baladeva

Vidyabhushana's comments on this and its neighboring suutras bring this

point out in detail. For someone to change the mantras of the shruti texts

is very much a direct challenge to this principle. While it could be argued

that Mahaaprabhu was Lord Krishna Himself, and thus not limited by such

principles, the important point was that Krishna came in the form of His own

devotee, in the form of a spiritual master, and as such He respected other

customs that brahmins were obligated to follow (such as taking diksha from a

guru, and so on) just to set the proper example.

 

> While shastra is the guiding light, not everything in shastra can be had

> without the guidance of the Acharya. It is said therefore that Acharya

> purusho Veda - that what constitutes the essence of the Veda Vedanta

Shastra

> is to be had with the Acharya sankalpa or the mercy of the Acharya. As

> such, if we are to accept Sriman Mahaprabhu as Acharya, what to speak of

as

> Krishna Himself, then we have to follow His version as given in the

> parampara system. We do not have the purity or the ability to approach

 

While this is not incorrect, it should be pointed out that offering such an

answer will likely be seen as sentimental. After all, the original question

as we understood it was what to say to someone who challenges that our

mantra is not the correct one. Merely asserting that it is correct because

our spiritual masters have given it to us is unconvincing, and only serves

to incriminate our spiritual masters as well. The proper way to glorify them

is to give the scholarly answer - to refer to shaastras, in this case the

Kalisantaarana Upanishad. If the opponents object that some versions of the

KU have the mantra reversed, no more really need be said on our part. It may

very well be difficult to prove that one recension is the correct one (in

which case it would be difficult for them to prove as well). On the other

hand, if they are going to claim that their recension is correct and ours

the interpolation, then we can perhaps refer to the research of Dr. Fakir

Mohan das alluded to by Madhavananda Prabhu.

 

Actually, if Madhavananda Prabhu would be willing to find more details on

that research (i.e.- where and when it was published), that might be useful

"ammunition" to have in the event that such a challenge does come to the

surface.

 

your servant,

 

Krishna Susarla