Guest guest Posted March 15, 2006 Report Share Posted March 15, 2006 Dear Ramji, Im my opinion, unless we impose or believe there is or has to be maya, I dont see any maya. We souls travel to earth in a group, so all our relations or other souls are not new to us, we shared some sort of relation in our previous lives, we come here as part of our karma, to learn and to help others learn. All souls are equal, but some have something to do with us so they form a relationship, so we have to deal with them or share life with them, this is the lesson in love, in sharing and compassion we learn a lot, I agree Jesus, Bhddha, etc are great and noble souls who could see past, present and future, but that dosent mean there is maya and others cannot see, well depending our spirituality and open mind we can see a lot unless we create a shell of maya and escape from truth. Om namah shivaya, Divakar. --- Ram Lubhaya Vashisth <rlvashisth wrote: > Dear Divakara, > I have read theory of karma and know that a > jeeva takes worth on this earth with his > destiny and a life span.DESTINY is the bunch of > his such karma,fruits of which the jeeva has to > taste in the present birth and is the part of the > Total karma of that jeeva known as the "sanchit > karma". > The soul which takes birth as someone`s > son/daughter,do so due to previous relations.This > theory is well defined in Padam Puran. > You are right that the soul nither takes birth nor > dies and do not indluge in MAYA.But > dear friend reality or truth lives under the cover > of Maya.Leaving exceptions,every body > is under the influnce of Maya and do not see the > truth.Most of us consider this physical > body as them selves(not the soul).Every one of us > that this son is mine,this daughter is > mine and so on.This we do under the influnce of > Maya otherwise who son,who father, > all are the similar souls,like waves in an ocean. > Actually speaking, existing of this world(sansar) > without Maya is not possible.For one, > who can see things in reality without the > influance or interfearance of Maya,there is no > world for Him.And when there is no world for Him > then there is also no rebirth for him. > Such souls which are capable of seeing beyond > Maya,we call them Mohamad,Jesus, > Budh,Krishna,Rama,Nanak,Kabir and............. > With regards > > > > Divakara Tanjore <div_tan wrote: > Dear Ram, > > if you read the book "Many Masters and Many lives" > written by Dr.Weiss, you will understand the reason > for our birth/deaths, each soul has a purpose when > it > comes to earth, whether it lives 100 years or 1 day > or > a few minutes, each soul accomplishes in learning or > imparting learning to others. we are all spirit, > this > is absolute truth, there is no maya in it. > > Om namah shivaya, > Divakar. > > --- Divakara Tanjore <div_tan wrote: > > > Dear Ram, > > > > We die ( physical body) because our time for > > learning > > is over on earth, we as souls have to return to > > wherever we came from (maybe heaven). Soul never > > dies > > it is truth, where is maya in it. > > > > Om namah shivaya, > > Divakar. > > > > --- Ram Lubhaya Vashisth <rlvashisth > > wrote: > > > > > Dear Friend, > > > When all the things are real > then > > > why :- > > > our physical body donot remain for ever > > and > > > we die against our will. > > > our parents and other loving ones are > > > separated from us. > > > we had to sow crops and plant trees > again > > > and again. > > > sarashwati,the Holy river vanished. > > > Tihri, a beautiful town,drowened. > > > > whyyyyyyyy.................. > > > > > > > > > > > > brijesh bagga <brij731 wrote: > > > obviously that all is maya which attracts you > > > towards that it is not that misled people advice > > > anyone just think when you leave or quit your > > goals > > > and get attracted and then the desires come to > > > obtain that thing its all maya. As rajneesh was > on > > > the right path in 60 and early 70;s but when he > > saw > > > big bunch of top people got attracted and he > left > > > his original goal this is all maya. > > > > > > Divakara Tanjore <div_tan wrote: > > > Nothing is maya, everything is real, all our > > > relationships and our existance is real, we as > > souls > > > come to this earth to learn and pass on, There > is > > a > > > meaning to the whole purpose of Gods creation > and > > > life. > > > > > > When we assume that life is maya, then life > > becomes > > > easy, we dont have to take responsibility or > > > accountable for the things we do, Hinduism never > > > tells > > > life is maya, some misled gurus and people do > for > > > selfish reasons. > > > > > > Om namah shivaya, > > > Divakar. > > > > > > --- Sarabhanga Giri <sarabhanga > wrote: > > > > > > > Namaste Divakar, > > > > > > > > You say that "only people who are mislead will > > say > > > > that marriage, > > > > parents, children etc are Maya". However, > since > > > the > > > > entire manifest > > > > universe is generally considered as Maya or a > > > > production of Maya, it is > > > > not unreasonable that marriage, parents, > > children, > > > > etc., are also > > > > regarded in the same light! And only those > > Hindus > > > > who are misled (or > > > > misleading) will claim otherwise. > > > > > > > > Only Sannyasins are urged to completely sever > > ALL > > > > ties with marriage > > > > and family. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam > > > protection around > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Relax. Mail virus scanning helps detect > > > nasty viruses! > > > > > > > > > Lord shiva > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Visit your group "" on > > the > > > web. > > > > > > To from this group, send an > email > > > to: > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Er. Ram Lubhaya Vashisth, Astrologer > === message truncated === Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 15, 2006 Report Share Posted March 15, 2006 Namaste Divakar, Maya is characterized by birth (and thus also death). Maya is characterized by change, and can only exist in a dimensional frame. The whole of Creation is born and will eventually suffer destruction, and its perceived (conventional or practical) reality is only temporary. Every manifest thing is a production of Maya, and every relationship is a production of Maya. The ultimate Truth is eternal and unborn, and all other "realities" are only the offspring of Maya. Maya, however, has Her own rules and practical realities, and (unless one is prepared to sever all ties with worldly existence) there is NO advice or compulsion to ignore the manifest condition of the world with all of its intimate relationships and natural laws. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2006 Report Share Posted March 16, 2006 As I see, "Grahasthya jeevan" in itself is a "TAP" or tapasya, one of the most difficult tapasya, which teaches us how should we live a self-less life and learn to "give" without any expectations. A selfless service or duty from wife to husband, husband to wife, parents to children or child to his/her parents and similarly our interactions with our own surroundings, lusts, attractions etc. If we succeed in winning over our weaknesses while performing our duties, our tapasya is successful and that should be the only motive of our lives. Our life style should be just like the Lotous (Kamal Ka Phool)which does not get affected by its surroundings i.e. "daldal". This "daldal" could be seen as a symbolic of this world. "Nishkaam seva " is the only way to our "Mukti". I believe Yudhishter's life is a real example of "niskaam seva" while fulfilling all the worldly duties and responsibilities. Regards. Vijay Shanker , "b_jamnadas" <b_jamna> wrote: > > Divakar Ji, > > There are various paths to god, lets just agree to that. The point > is that in our lives, we go thru so many different experiences, we > try to acquire happiness this way and that way and it simply makes > our lives more and more complicated. If we were to spend this effort > in god realisation such as sadhana and mediation, our lives would me > much simpler and we would be more contented. > > Look at a child, first all it needs is nurturing, then it needs toys > otherwise it is not going to be satisfied.Then the parents send this > child for education so that he/she can get a nice job, good money, > good wife/husband, car house etc. The child goes thru some > expereince at school. Some don't find it easy at all, for some it is > ok and some simply do not go to the scholl fopr the intended > purpose. Some have problems with school bullies and some have > problems simply coping with the studies. At thne end, not anyone is > happy at schooll and looking towards the day they don't have to go > to school again. Now out of school, either succesfully or not, they > have to get a job, after all, what else to do becuase they need > money to surive and save face in the society. So they get a job. > Some are happy with their job and some are not and ultimately no > body is happy with their pay. Then they want to get married and with > a married life, they need a better job that better fulfills the > financial requirements. But with a better paying job, this means > less time with the family and more time at work(this may not be the > case with you but it happens in a lot of houses.) Than the couple > need child and with a child, more family expenses. So now either the > husband works more shifts or the wife gets a job. So the couples > hardly meet now. Here in canada, just to have family expenses going, > there are houses where couple go to work and they never see each > others face until then weekend. What sort of reality is this > Divarkrji? Was establishing such relationships in quest for > happiness really did provide happiness? The kids that these couple > are working so hard for will one day go away and start his/her own > family. Do you think that buy giving birth to a child, the child > owes the parents something? Couples have a child becuase they want > it. What fault of the child that he has this life and will go thru > all the pain and suffereings as per the karma. In mahabharata, Ganga > drowns all the children she has with Shaantano just so that the > child doesn't have to go thru the suffering. Would you call Ganga to > have neglected on her duty to provide to the child, or would she be > the compassionate one who could not bear to the pain the her child > will go thru and so decided to end the pain right at birth? > > The thing is Divakarji, we create these relationships and then we > justify it as necessary and then we make it our duty to nurture > them. Of course, if you have a wife, then you have to take care of > her. The same goes with children and the parents. We go thru so much > effort in try to acquire happiness but in each step, we go thru > pain. Everything the we acquire will go away, wife, children, house > and cars usually do not last more then 10 years anyways. All the > effort is ultimately in vain. > > In Siva Purana, Brahma is making efforts to create a class of being > who are always going to be living in pain due to their karmas and > will be required to continuously propitiate the gods. He tried to > force his sons to procreate but they wouldn't. Then when in extreme > anger, Rudra imerged from Brahma. Brahma made the same request to > Rudra, i.e. to help him create such beings. Rudra replied that he, > in this form of preceptor cannot create beings that are always going > to live in fear and agony. He warned Brahma the he was making a > mistake. We are that mistake. > > The are various paths to god Divakar Ji. If there is someone > preaching something that is not conventional, I do not see it wrong > if they discuss it in this forum. > > Sincerely, > Bhupendra. > > , Divakara Tanjore > <div_tan@> wrote: > > > > Dear Jamnadas ji, > > > > What is kundalini?, it is life force, it increases or > > raises if we realise god or awaken the divine within. > > Bad desires and bad emotions will weaken the lifeforce > > not good ones. true love, true bhakti and compassion > > will raise it. > > > > Only people who are mislead will say that marriage, > > parents, children etc are maya etc. but in contrary > > lord shiva will like us more if we fulfil our > > responsibilities as a son/daughter, father/mother and > > husband/wife correctly. Life is about love and > > compassion, it is about selfless service and giving. > > > > if we consciously and selfishly follow moksha we will > > not get it, he who is selfless will get it. > > > > Lord Shiva wants us to live like him, to live life as > > it is eternal, Look at lord shiva, be like him, fulfil > > all the responsibilities like him, isnt Lord Shiva > > married, dosent he have children, isnt he worried > > about all of us. > > > > Lord shiva is inherently present in us, we dont have > > to do anything to merge with him, only thing we have > > to do is do good things, think good and act like him. > > > > Om namah shivaya, > > Divakar. > > > > > > --- b_jamnadas <b_jamnadas@> wrote: > > > > > Divakar Ji, > > > > > > I really do not know much about Brahma Kumari sect > > > and I have no > > > interest in it. But your reply caught my attention. > > > Lately I have > > > been trying to learn Kundalini yoga and pranayam and > > > al;l the text > > > that I have tried to read about it. And one thing > > > the books all talk > > > about is detachment of maya, maya being the way we > > > have been living > > > like family, wife, children possessions etc. It > > > emphasises that even > > > a family person who is deeply intesrested in > > > activating the > > > kundalini and ultimately merge Siva has to free > > > himself from > > > emotions, exercise niyama and yama. I would not go > > > into much detail > > > since I am a beginner but there a lot of free books > > > online available > > > from sivananda website. I am pasting a quotations > > > from sivananda > > > that I receive daily in email: > > > > > > > > > > > ******************************************************** > > > The mind always wants to be doing something. When it > > > attaches itself > > > to the objects it cherishes, the mind feels amused > > > and happy. There > > > can be attraction without attachment. You can be > > > attracted to a > > > beautiful rose, but you are not attached to it. > > > Attachment comes > > > after possession and enjoyment. > > > > > > Attachment, love, ananda (bliss), all go together. > > > You are attached > > > to your wife and children and so on. You love them > > > because they give > > > you ananda. As this world is illusory and as, > > > through this illusion, > > > pain appears as pleasure, you must cut asunder all > > > worldly > > > attachments ruthlessly. Direct your love and > > > attachment towards the > > > reality, towards Brahman, towards the substratum > > > which lies at the > > > back of all objects, which is the witness of all > > > activities taking > > > place in the buddhi (intellect). > > > > > > It is difficult to divert the mind which from early > > > childhood has > > > fallen into the pernicious habit of seeking external > > > pleasures and > > > which continues to do so unless yougive it something > > > superior to be > > > amused with. Intellectual pleasure is far superior > > > to sensual > > > pleasure. So too, ananda (joy from meditation) is > > > far superior to > > > intellectual pleasure. Spiritual bliss gained from > > > self-realisation, > > > is infinite, immeasurable, unbounded. It is > > > anandaghana (a solid > > > mass of bliss). > > > > > > Keep the mind in a state of moderation. The mind > > > likes always to run > > > to extremes. It runs either to extreme joy or > > > extreme depression. > > > Extremes meet and bring about a reaction. In > > > excessive joy the mind > > > cannot be calmed. Hence let the mind always be calm > > > and cheerful. > > > > > > Ghee (clarified butter) has two states - solid and > > > liquid. So it is > > > with the mind. In the waking state it is solid and > > > in the deep sleep > > > state it is liquid. In the solid state it is limited > > > and gross. This > > > is why it has finite experiences. In the liquid > > > state it is > > > limitless and so the jiva (soul) experiences the > > > homogeneous and > > > limitless bliss. In the deep sleep state there is no > > > ego, no desire, > > > hence it experiences the limitless bliss of the > > > atman. > > > > > ************************************************************* > > > > > > , > > > Divakara Tanjore > > > <div_tan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear BK, > > > > > > > > True Spirituality and Spiritualism is about > > > attachment > > > > not detachment. Lord Shiva is a symbol of true > > > passion > > > > and love, attachment is required to understand > > > that. > > > > > > > > In my opinion the things you practice at Brahma > > > kumari > > > > is escapism, if you cannot face it escape by > > > > detachment, but God is not like that and we should > > > not > > > > live like that. we have to live with passion, with > > > > complete commiment, which comes from attachment > > > not > > > > detachment. > > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya, > > > > Divakar. > > > > > > > > --- B K <bkgswu@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine soul, > > > > > > > > > > Om Shanti. > > > > > > > > > > Thanking you for giving an opportunity, making > > > me > > > > > an instrument to reveal the Truth about God. You > > > > > might have received lots and lots of Blessings > > > from > > > > > God for being an instrument to carry out His > > > work. > > > > > > > > > > If you are hurt by the comments given by me, > > > > > really I am very sorry for that, hope it will > > > not > > > > > happen again. > > > > > > > > > > It is like this if we know that we are a soul > > > with > > > > > original nature of Purity, Knowledge, Peace, > > > Love, > > > > > Happiness, Bliss and Powers, no situation and no > > > > > email replies can hurt us because we see things > > > as > > > > > something not attached to us. > > > > > > > > > > Now we get hurt because we see our soul and > > > > > happenings around as one not separate.We get > > > > > attached to the situations. If we are in the > > > > > conscious of soul or in other words if we are > > > > > detached from the situations, nobody in this > > > world > > > > > can hurt us or make me feel sad. Instead, I will > > > be > > > > > always ever happy, contented with my original > > > > > nature. > > > > > > > > > > The words i used in my reply in reality are > > > not my > > > > > words at all. They are the words of Supreme > > > Soul. > > > > > > > > > > It is said in Scriptures that when irreligion > > > > > exists , God will descend on Earth and when it > > > is, > > > > > nobody knows. But in reality, that Same God , > > > who is > > > > > a point of light, soul has come on Earth and > > > > > revealed His identity and He has revealed and > > > > > revealing everything(Past, Present and Future), > > > > > about Him and the wrong notion that prevailing > > > on > > > > > Earth about Him. > > > > > > > > > > When we souls, point of lights, can come on > > > earth > > > > > to play our roles, why it is not possible for > > > the > > > > > Supreme soul to come on Earth, Once He comes, He > > > > > reveals the World Cycle, the Truths about the > > > past > > > > > and Future etc.,, > > > > > > > > > > And there are lots and lots I want to share > > > with > > > > > you and everyone, but I am short of time..If you > > > are > > > > > able to contact Brahma kumari Centre, I think > > > there > > > > > is no local centre near your place but you can > > > > > contact Sonah nagassar, whose relative is a BK > > > to > > > > > know real Truth about God. > > > > > > > > > > I am not talking about God of Brahma Kumari, I > > > am > > > > > talking about God of Hindu, Muslim, Christian, > > > > > Buddhist, Jains,.....and Your's and mine. > > > > > === message truncated === > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2006 Report Share Posted March 16, 2006 of our lives. Our life style should be just like the Lotous (Kamal Ka Phool)which does not get affected by its surroundings i.e. "daldal". This "daldal" could be seen as a symbolic of this world. "Nishkaam seva " is the only way to our "Mukti". I believe Yudhishter's life is a real example of "niskaam seva" while fulfilling all the worldly duties and responsibilities.Regards.Vijay Shanker--- In , "b_jamnadas" <b_jamna> wrote:>> Divakar Ji,> > There are various paths to god, lets just agree to that. The point > is that in our lives, we go thru so many different experiences, we > try to acquire happiness this way and that way and it simply makes > our lives more and more complicated. If we were to spend this effort > in god realisation such as sadhana and mediation, our lives would me > much simpler and we would be more contented. > > Look at a child, first all it needs is nurturing, then it needs toys > otherwise it is not going to be satisfied.Then the parents send this > child for education so that he/she can get a nice job, good money, > good wife/husband, car house etc. The child goes thru some > expereince at school. Some don't find it easy at all, for some it is > ok and some simply do not go to the scholl fopr the intended > purpose. Some have problems with school bullies and some have > problems simply coping with the studies. At thne end, not anyone is > happy at schooll and looking towards the day they don't have to go > to school again. Now out of school, either succesfully or not, they > have to get a job, after all, what else to do becuase they need > money to surive and save face in the society. So they get a job. > Some are happy with their job and some are not and ultimately no > body is happy with their pay. Then they want to get married and with > a married life, they need a better job that better fulfills the > financial requirements. But with a better paying job, this means > less time with the family and more time at work(this may not be the > case with you but it happens in a lot of houses.) Than the couple > need child and with a child, more family expenses. So now either the > husband works more shifts or the wife gets a job. So the couples > hardly meet now. Here in canada, just to have family expenses going, > there are houses where couple go to work and they never see each > others face until then weekend. What sort of reality is this > Divarkrji? Was establishing such relationships in quest for > happiness really did provide happiness? The kids that these couple > are working so hard for will one day go away and start his/her own > family. Do you think that buy giving birth to a child, the child > owes the parents something? Couples have a child becuase they want > it. What fault of the child that he has this life and will go thru > all the pain and suffereings as per the karma. In mahabharata, Ganga > drowns all the children she has with Shaantano just so that the > child doesn't have to go thru the suffering. Would you call Ganga to > have neglected on her duty to provide to the child, or would she be > the compassionate one who could not bear to the pain the her child > will go thru and so decided to end the pain right at birth?> > The thing is Divakarji, we create these relationships and then we > justify it as necessary and then we make it our duty to nurture > them. Of course, if you have a wife, then you have to take care of > her. The same goes with children and the parents. We go thru so much > effort in try to acquire happiness but in each step, we go thru > pain. Everything the we acquire will go away, wife, children, house > and cars usually do not last more then 10 years anyways. All the > effort is ultimately in vain.> > In Siva Purana, Brahma is making efforts to create a class of being > who are always going to be living in pain due to their karmas and > will be required to continuously propitiate the gods. He tried to > force his sons to procreate but they wouldn't. Then when in extreme > anger, Rudra imerged from Brahma. Brahma made the same request to > Rudra, i.e. to help him create such beings. Rudra replied that he, > in this form of preceptor cannot create beings that are always going > to live in fear and agony. He warned Brahma the he was making a > mistake. We are that mistake.> > The are various paths to god Divakar Ji. If there is someone > preaching something that is not conventional, I do not see it wrong > if they discuss it in this forum.> > Sincerely,> Bhupendra.> > --- In , Divakara Tanjore > <div_tan@> wrote:> >> > Dear Jamnadas ji,> > > > What is kundalini?, it is life force, it increases or> > raises if we realise god or awaken the divine within.> > Bad desires and bad emotions will weaken the lifeforce> > not good ones. true love, true bhakti and compassion> > will raise it.> > > > Only people who are mislead will say that marriage,> > parents, children etc are maya etc. but in contrary> > lord shiva will like us more if we fulfil our> > responsibilities as a son/daughter, father/mother and> > husband/wife correctly. Life is about love and> > compassion, it is about selfless service and giving. > > > > if we consciously and selfishly follow moksha we will> > not get it, he who is selfless will get it.> > > > Lord Shiva wants us to live like him, to live life as> > it is eternal, Look at lord shiva, be like him, fulfil> > all the responsibilities like him, isnt Lord Shiva> > married, dosent he have children, isnt he worried> > about all of us.> > > > Lord shiva is inherently present in us, we dont have> > to do anything to merge with him, only thing we have> > to do is do good things, think good and act like him.> > > > Om namah shivaya,> > Divakar.> > > > > > --- b_jamnadas <b_jamnadas@> wrote:> > > > > Divakar Ji,> > > > > > I really do not know much about Brahma Kumari sect> > > and I have no > > > interest in it. But your reply caught my attention.> > > Lately I have > > > been trying to learn Kundalini yoga and pranayam and> > > al;l the text > > > that I have tried to read about it. And one thing> > > the books all talk > > > about is detachment of maya, maya being the way we> > > have been living > > > like family, wife, children possessions etc. It> > > emphasises that even > > > a family person who is deeply intesrested in> > > activating the > > > kundalini and ultimately merge Siva has to free> > > himself from > > > emotions, exercise niyama and yama. I would not go> > > into much detail > > > since I am a beginner but there a lot of free books> > > online available > > > from sivananda website. I am pasting a quotations> > > from sivananda > > > that I receive daily in email:> > > > > > > > >> > ********************************************************> > > The mind always wants to be doing something. When it> > > attaches itself > > > to the objects it cherishes, the mind feels amused> > > and happy. There > > > can be attraction without attachment. You can be> > > attracted to a > > > beautiful rose, but you are not attached to it.> > > Attachment comes > > > after possession and enjoyment.> > > > > > Attachment, love, ananda (bliss), all go together.> > > You are attached > > > to your wife and children and so on. You love them> > > because they give > > > you ananda. As this world is illusory and as,> > > through this illusion, > > > pain appears as pleasure, you must cut asunder all> > > worldly > > > attachments ruthlessly. Direct your love and> > > attachment towards the > > > reality, towards Brahman, towards the substratum> > > which lies at the > > > back of all objects, which is the witness of all> > > activities taking > > > place in the buddhi (intellect).> > > > > > It is difficult to divert the mind which from early> > > childhood has > > > fallen into the pernicious habit of seeking external> > > pleasures and > > > which continues to do so unless yougive it something> > > superior to be > > > amused with. Intellectual pleasure is far superior> > > to sensual > > > pleasure. So too, ananda (joy from meditation) is> > > far superior to > > > intellectual pleasure. Spiritual bliss gained from> > > self-realisation, > > > is infinite, immeasurable, unbounded. It is> > > anandaghana (a solid > > > mass of bliss).> > > > > > Keep the mind in a state of moderation. The mind> > > likes always to run > > > to extremes. It runs either to extreme joy or> > > extreme depression. > > > Extremes meet and bring about a reaction. In> > > excessive joy the mind > > > cannot be calmed. Hence let the mind always be calm> > > and cheerful.> > > > > > Ghee (clarified butter) has two states - solid and> > > liquid. So it is > > > with the mind. In the waking state it is solid and> > > in the deep sleep > > > state it is liquid. In the solid state it is limited> > > and gross. This > > > is why it has finite experiences. In the liquid> > > state it is > > > limitless and so the jiva (soul) experiences the> > > homogeneous and > > > limitless bliss. In the deep sleep state there is no> > > ego, no desire, > > > hence it experiences the limitless bliss of the> > > atman.> > >> > *************************************************************> > > > > > --- In ,> > > Divakara Tanjore > > > <div_tan@> wrote:> > > >> > > > Dear BK,> > > > > > > > True Spirituality and Spiritualism is about> > > attachment> > > > not detachment. Lord Shiva is a symbol of true> > > passion> > > > and love, attachment is required to understand> > > that. > > > > > > > > In my opinion the things you practice at Brahma> > > kumari> > > > is escapism, if you cannot face it escape by> > > > detachment, but God is not like that and we should> > > not> > > > live like that. we have to live with passion, with> > > > complete commiment, which comes from attachment> > > not> > > > detachment.> > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya,> > > > Divakar.> > > > > > > > --- B K <bkgswu@> wrote:> > > > > > > > > Dear Divine soul,> > > > > > > > > > Om Shanti.> > > > > > > > > > Thanking you for giving an opportunity, making> > > me> > > > > an instrument to reveal the Truth about God. You> > > > > might have received lots and lots of Blessings> > > from> > > > > God for being an instrument to carry out His> > > work.> > > > > > > > > > If you are hurt by the comments given by me,> > > > > really I am very sorry for that, hope it will> > > not> > > > > happen again.> > > > > > > > > > It is like this if we know that we are a soul> > > with> > > > > original nature of Purity, Knowledge, Peace,> > > Love,> > > > > Happiness, Bliss and Powers, no situation and no> > > > > email replies can hurt us because we see things> > > as> > > > > something not attached to us.> > > > > > > > > > Now we get hurt because we see our soul and> > > > > happenings around as one not separate.We get> > > > > attached to the situations. If we are in the> > > > > conscious of soul or in other words if we are> > > > > detached from the situations, nobody in this> > > world> > > > > can hurt us or make me feel sad. Instead, I will> > > be> > > > > always ever happy, contented with my original> > > > > nature.> > > > > > > > > > The words i used in my reply in reality are> > > not my> > > > > words at all. They are the words of Supreme> > > Soul.> > > > > > > > > > It is said in Scriptures that when irreligion> > > > > exists , God will descend on Earth and when it> > > is,> > > > > nobody knows. But in reality, that Same God ,> > > who is> > > > > a point of light, soul has come on Earth and> > > > > revealed His identity and He has revealed and> > > > > revealing everything(Past, Present and Future),> > > > > about Him and the wrong notion that prevailing> > > on> > > > > Earth about Him.> > > > > > > > > > When we souls, point of lights, can come on> > > earth> > > > > to play our roles, why it is not possible for> > > the> > > > > Supreme soul to come on Earth, Once He comes, He> > > > > reveals the World Cycle, the Truths about the> > > past> > > > > and Future etc.,,> > > > > > > > > > And there are lots and lots I want to share> > > with> > > > > you and everyone, but I am short of time..If you> > > are> > > > > able to contact Brahma kumari Centre, I think> > > there> > > > > is no local centre near your place but you can> > > > > contact Sonah nagassar, whose relative is a BK> > > to> > > > > know real Truth about God.> > > > > > > > > > I am not talking about God of Brahma Kumari, I> > > am> > > > > talking about God of Hindu, Muslim, Christian,> > > > > Buddhist, Jains,.....and Your's and mine.> > > > > === message truncated ===> > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam protection around > > > >> banner|**| --> Visit your group "" on the web. To from this group, send an email to: Your use of is subject to the -->Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam protection around Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2006 Report Share Posted March 16, 2006 Absolutely true, Om namah shivaya, Divakar. --- Vijay <vijayyshanker wrote: > As I see, "Grahasthya jeevan" in itself is a "TAP" > or tapasya, > one of the most difficult tapasya, which teaches us > how should we > live a self-less life and learn to "give" without > any expectations. > A selfless service or duty from wife to husband, > husband to wife, > parents to children or child to his/her parents and > similarly our > interactions with our own surroundings, lusts, > attractions etc. > If we succeed in winning over our weaknesses while > performing our > duties, our tapasya is successful and that should be > the only motive > of our lives. Our life style should be just like the > Lotous (Kamal > Ka Phool)which does not get affected by its > surroundings > i.e. "daldal". This "daldal" could be seen as a > symbolic of this > world. "Nishkaam seva " is the only way to our > "Mukti". I believe > Yudhishter's life is a real example of "niskaam > seva" while > fulfilling all the worldly duties and > responsibilities. > > Regards. > Vijay Shanker > > , > "b_jamnadas" > <b_jamna> wrote: > > > > Divakar Ji, > > > > There are various paths to god, lets just agree to > that. The point > > is that in our lives, we go thru so many different > experiences, we > > try to acquire happiness this way and that way and > it simply makes > > our lives more and more complicated. If we were to > spend this > effort > > in god realisation such as sadhana and mediation, > our lives would > me > > much simpler and we would be more contented. > > > > Look at a child, first all it needs is nurturing, > then it needs > toys > > otherwise it is not going to be satisfied.Then the > parents send > this > > child for education so that he/she can get a nice > job, good money, > > good wife/husband, car house etc. The child goes > thru some > > expereince at school. Some don't find it easy at > all, for some it > is > > ok and some simply do not go to the scholl fopr > the intended > > purpose. Some have problems with school bullies > and some have > > problems simply coping with the studies. At thne > end, not anyone is > > happy at schooll and looking towards the day they > don't have to go > > to school again. Now out of school, either > succesfully or not, they > > have to get a job, after all, what else to do > becuase they need > > money to surive and save face in the society. So > they get a job. > > Some are happy with their job and some are not and > ultimately no > > body is happy with their pay. Then they want to > get married and > with > > a married life, they need a better job that better > fulfills the > > financial requirements. But with a better paying > job, this means > > less time with the family and more time at > work(this may not be the > > case with you but it happens in a lot of houses.) > Than the couple > > need child and with a child, more family expenses. > So now either > the > > husband works more shifts or the wife gets a job. > So the couples > > hardly meet now. Here in canada, just to have > family expenses > going, > > there are houses where couple go to work and they > never see each > > others face until then weekend. What sort of > reality is this > > Divarkrji? Was establishing such relationships in > quest for > > happiness really did provide happiness? The kids > that these couple > > are working so hard for will one day go away and > start his/her own > > family. Do you think that buy giving birth to a > child, the child > > owes the parents something? Couples have a child > becuase they want > > it. What fault of the child that he has this life > and will go thru > > all the pain and suffereings as per the karma. In > mahabharata, > Ganga > > drowns all the children she has with Shaantano > just so that the > > child doesn't have to go thru the suffering. Would > you call Ganga > to > > have neglected on her duty to provide to the > child, or would she be > > the compassionate one who could not bear to the > pain the her child > > will go thru and so decided to end the pain right > at birth? > > > > The thing is Divakarji, we create these > relationships and then we > > justify it as necessary and then we make it our > duty to nurture > > them. Of course, if you have a wife, then you have > to take care of > > her. The same goes with children and the parents. > We go thru so > much > > effort in try to acquire happiness but in each > step, we go thru > > pain. Everything the we acquire will go away, > wife, children, house > > and cars usually do not last more then 10 years > anyways. All the > > effort is ultimately in vain. > > > > In Siva Purana, Brahma is making efforts to create > a class of being > > who are always going to be living in pain due to > their karmas and > > will be required to continuously propitiate the > gods. He tried to > > force his sons to procreate but they wouldn't. > Then when in extreme > > anger, Rudra imerged from Brahma. Brahma made the > same request to > > Rudra, i.e. to help him create such beings. Rudra > replied that he, > > in this form of preceptor cannot create beings > that are always > going > > to live in fear and agony. He warned Brahma the he > was making a > > mistake. We are that mistake. > > > > The are various paths to god Divakar Ji. If there > is someone > > preaching something that is not conventional, I do > not see it wrong > > if they discuss it in this forum. > > > > Sincerely, > > Bhupendra. > > > > , > Divakara Tanjore > > <div_tan@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Jamnadas ji, > > > > > > What is kundalini?, it is life force, it > increases or > > > raises if we realise god or awaken the divine > within. > > > Bad desires and bad emotions will weaken the > lifeforce > > > not good ones. true love, true bhakti and > compassion > > > will raise it. > > > > > > Only people who are mislead will say that > marriage, > > > parents, children etc are maya etc. but in > contrary > > > lord shiva will like us more if we fulfil our > > > responsibilities as a son/daughter, > father/mother and > > > husband/wife correctly. Life is about love and > > > compassion, it is about selfless service and > giving. === message truncated === Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2006 Report Share Posted March 16, 2006 Surely Grahastya Jeevan is a "TAP", but it is, but it is certainly not the only way to god. BTW, when talking about SELF-LESS Service, how does getting married fit in this picture? People certainly don't get married to help some lonely man or women they feel sorry about. Sincerely, Bhupendra. , "Vijay" <vijayyshanker wrote: > > As I see, "Grahasthya jeevan" in itself is a "TAP" or tapasya, > one of the most difficult tapasya, which teaches us how should we > live a self-less life and learn to "give" without any expectations. > A selfless service or duty from wife to husband, husband to wife, > parents to children or child to his/her parents and similarly our > interactions with our own surroundings, lusts, attractions etc. > If we succeed in winning over our weaknesses while performing our > duties, our tapasya is successful and that should be the only motive > of our lives. Our life style should be just like the Lotous (Kamal > Ka Phool)which does not get affected by its surroundings > i.e. "daldal". This "daldal" could be seen as a symbolic of this > world. "Nishkaam seva " is the only way to our "Mukti". I believe > Yudhishter's life is a real example of "niskaam seva" while > fulfilling all the worldly duties and responsibilities. > > Regards. > Vijay Shanker > > , "b_jamnadas" > <b_jamnadas@> wrote: > > > > Divakar Ji, > > > > There are various paths to god, lets just agree to that. The point > > is that in our lives, we go thru so many different experiences, we > > try to acquire happiness this way and that way and it simply makes > > our lives more and more complicated. If we were to spend this > effort > > in god realisation such as sadhana and mediation, our lives would > me > > much simpler and we would be more contented. > > > > Look at a child, first all it needs is nurturing, then it needs > toys > > otherwise it is not going to be satisfied.Then the parents send > this > > child for education so that he/she can get a nice job, good money, > > good wife/husband, car house etc. The child goes thru some > > expereince at school. Some don't find it easy at all, for some it > is > > ok and some simply do not go to the scholl fopr the intended > > purpose. Some have problems with school bullies and some have > > problems simply coping with the studies. At thne end, not anyone is > > happy at schooll and looking towards the day they don't have to go > > to school again. Now out of school, either succesfully or not, they > > have to get a job, after all, what else to do becuase they need > > money to surive and save face in the society. So they get a job. > > Some are happy with their job and some are not and ultimately no > > body is happy with their pay. Then they want to get married and > with > > a married life, they need a better job that better fulfills the > > financial requirements. But with a better paying job, this means > > less time with the family and more time at work(this may not be the > > case with you but it happens in a lot of houses.) Than the couple > > need child and with a child, more family expenses. So now either > the > > husband works more shifts or the wife gets a job. So the couples > > hardly meet now. Here in canada, just to have family expenses > going, > > there are houses where couple go to work and they never see each > > others face until then weekend. What sort of reality is this > > Divarkrji? Was establishing such relationships in quest for > > happiness really did provide happiness? The kids that these couple > > are working so hard for will one day go away and start his/her own > > family. Do you think that buy giving birth to a child, the child > > owes the parents something? Couples have a child becuase they want > > it. What fault of the child that he has this life and will go thru > > all the pain and suffereings as per the karma. In mahabharata, > Ganga > > drowns all the children she has with Shaantano just so that the > > child doesn't have to go thru the suffering. Would you call Ganga > to > > have neglected on her duty to provide to the child, or would she be > > the compassionate one who could not bear to the pain the her child > > will go thru and so decided to end the pain right at birth? > > > > The thing is Divakarji, we create these relationships and then we > > justify it as necessary and then we make it our duty to nurture > > them. Of course, if you have a wife, then you have to take care of > > her. The same goes with children and the parents. We go thru so > much > > effort in try to acquire happiness but in each step, we go thru > > pain. Everything the we acquire will go away, wife, children, house > > and cars usually do not last more then 10 years anyways. All the > > effort is ultimately in vain. > > > > In Siva Purana, Brahma is making efforts to create a class of being > > who are always going to be living in pain due to their karmas and > > will be required to continuously propitiate the gods. He tried to > > force his sons to procreate but they wouldn't. Then when in extreme > > anger, Rudra imerged from Brahma. Brahma made the same request to > > Rudra, i.e. to help him create such beings. Rudra replied that he, > > in this form of preceptor cannot create beings that are always > going > > to live in fear and agony. He warned Brahma the he was making a > > mistake. We are that mistake. > > > > The are various paths to god Divakar Ji. If there is someone > > preaching something that is not conventional, I do not see it wrong > > if they discuss it in this forum. > > > > Sincerely, > > Bhupendra. > > > > , Divakara Tanjore > > <div_tan@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Jamnadas ji, > > > > > > What is kundalini?, it is life force, it increases or > > > raises if we realise god or awaken the divine within. > > > Bad desires and bad emotions will weaken the lifeforce > > > not good ones. true love, true bhakti and compassion > > > will raise it. > > > > > > Only people who are mislead will say that marriage, > > > parents, children etc are maya etc. but in contrary > > > lord shiva will like us more if we fulfil our > > > responsibilities as a son/daughter, father/mother and > > > husband/wife correctly. Life is about love and > > > compassion, it is about selfless service and giving. > > > > > > if we consciously and selfishly follow moksha we will > > > not get it, he who is selfless will get it. > > > > > > Lord Shiva wants us to live like him, to live life as > > > it is eternal, Look at lord shiva, be like him, fulfil > > > all the responsibilities like him, isnt Lord Shiva > > > married, dosent he have children, isnt he worried > > > about all of us. > > > > > > Lord shiva is inherently present in us, we dont have > > > to do anything to merge with him, only thing we have > > > to do is do good things, think good and act like him. > > > > > > Om namah shivaya, > > > Divakar. > > > > > > > > > --- b_jamnadas <b_jamnadas@> wrote: > > > > > > > Divakar Ji, > > > > > > > > I really do not know much about Brahma Kumari sect > > > > and I have no > > > > interest in it. But your reply caught my attention. > > > > Lately I have > > > > been trying to learn Kundalini yoga and pranayam and > > > > al;l the text > > > > that I have tried to read about it. And one thing > > > > the books all talk > > > > about is detachment of maya, maya being the way we > > > > have been living > > > > like family, wife, children possessions etc. It > > > > emphasises that even > > > > a family person who is deeply intesrested in > > > > activating the > > > > kundalini and ultimately merge Siva has to free > > > > himself from > > > > emotions, exercise niyama and yama. I would not go > > > > into much detail > > > > since I am a beginner but there a lot of free books > > > > online available > > > > from sivananda website. I am pasting a quotations > > > > from sivananda > > > > that I receive daily in email: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ******************************************************** > > > > The mind always wants to be doing something. When it > > > > attaches itself > > > > to the objects it cherishes, the mind feels amused > > > > and happy. There > > > > can be attraction without attachment. You can be > > > > attracted to a > > > > beautiful rose, but you are not attached to it. > > > > Attachment comes > > > > after possession and enjoyment. > > > > > > > > Attachment, love, ananda (bliss), all go together. > > > > You are attached > > > > to your wife and children and so on. You love them > > > > because they give > > > > you ananda. As this world is illusory and as, > > > > through this illusion, > > > > pain appears as pleasure, you must cut asunder all > > > > worldly > > > > attachments ruthlessly. Direct your love and > > > > attachment towards the > > > > reality, towards Brahman, towards the substratum > > > > which lies at the > > > > back of all objects, which is the witness of all > > > > activities taking > > > > place in the buddhi (intellect). > > > > > > > > It is difficult to divert the mind which from early > > > > childhood has > > > > fallen into the pernicious habit of seeking external > > > > pleasures and > > > > which continues to do so unless yougive it something > > > > superior to be > > > > amused with. Intellectual pleasure is far superior > > > > to sensual > > > > pleasure. So too, ananda (joy from meditation) is > > > > far superior to > > > > intellectual pleasure. Spiritual bliss gained from > > > > self-realisation, > > > > is infinite, immeasurable, unbounded. It is > > > > anandaghana (a solid > > > > mass of bliss). > > > > > > > > Keep the mind in a state of moderation. The mind > > > > likes always to run > > > > to extremes. It runs either to extreme joy or > > > > extreme depression. > > > > Extremes meet and bring about a reaction. In > > > > excessive joy the mind > > > > cannot be calmed. Hence let the mind always be calm > > > > and cheerful. > > > > > > > > Ghee (clarified butter) has two states - solid and > > > > liquid. So it is > > > > with the mind. In the waking state it is solid and > > > > in the deep sleep > > > > state it is liquid. In the solid state it is limited > > > > and gross. This > > > > is why it has finite experiences. In the liquid > > > > state it is > > > > limitless and so the jiva (soul) experiences the > > > > homogeneous and > > > > limitless bliss. In the deep sleep state there is no > > > > ego, no desire, > > > > hence it experiences the limitless bliss of the > > > > atman. > > > > > > > ************************************************************* > > > > > > > > , > > > > Divakara Tanjore > > > > <div_tan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear BK, > > > > > > > > > > True Spirituality and Spiritualism is about > > > > attachment > > > > > not detachment. Lord Shiva is a symbol of true > > > > passion > > > > > and love, attachment is required to understand > > > > that. > > > > > > > > > > In my opinion the things you practice at Brahma > > > > kumari > > > > > is escapism, if you cannot face it escape by > > > > > detachment, but God is not like that and we should > > > > not > > > > > live like that. we have to live with passion, with > > > > > complete commiment, which comes from attachment > > > > not > > > > > detachment. > > > > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya, > > > > > Divakar. > > > > > > > > > > --- B K <bkgswu@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine soul, > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Shanti. > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanking you for giving an opportunity, making > > > > me > > > > > > an instrument to reveal the Truth about God. You > > > > > > might have received lots and lots of Blessings > > > > from > > > > > > God for being an instrument to carry out His > > > > work. > > > > > > > > > > > > If you are hurt by the comments given by me, > > > > > > really I am very sorry for that, hope it will > > > > not > > > > > > happen again. > > > > > > > > > > > > It is like this if we know that we are a soul > > > > with > > > > > > original nature of Purity, Knowledge, Peace, > > > > Love, > > > > > > Happiness, Bliss and Powers, no situation and no > > > > > > email replies can hurt us because we see things > > > > as > > > > > > something not attached to us. > > > > > > > > > > > > Now we get hurt because we see our soul and > > > > > > happenings around as one not separate.We get > > > > > > attached to the situations. If we are in the > > > > > > conscious of soul or in other words if we are > > > > > > detached from the situations, nobody in this > > > > world > > > > > > can hurt us or make me feel sad. Instead, I will > > > > be > > > > > > always ever happy, contented with my original > > > > > > nature. > > > > > > > > > > > > The words i used in my reply in reality are > > > > not my > > > > > > words at all. They are the words of Supreme > > > > Soul. > > > > > > > > > > > > It is said in Scriptures that when irreligion > > > > > > exists , God will descend on Earth and when it > > > > is, > > > > > > nobody knows. But in reality, that Same God , > > > > who is > > > > > > a point of light, soul has come on Earth and > > > > > > revealed His identity and He has revealed and > > > > > > revealing everything(Past, Present and Future), > > > > > > about Him and the wrong notion that prevailing > > > > on > > > > > > Earth about Him. > > > > > > > > > > > > When we souls, point of lights, can come on > > > > earth > > > > > > to play our roles, why it is not possible for > > > > the > > > > > > Supreme soul to come on Earth, Once He comes, He > > > > > > reveals the World Cycle, the Truths about the > > > > past > > > > > > and Future etc.,, > > > > > > > > > > > > And there are lots and lots I want to share > > > > with > > > > > > you and everyone, but I am short of time..If you > > > > are > > > > > > able to contact Brahma kumari Centre, I think > > > > there > > > > > > is no local centre near your place but you can > > > > > > contact Sonah nagassar, whose relative is a BK > > > > to > > > > > > know real Truth about God. > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not talking about God of Brahma Kumari, I > > > > am > > > > > > talking about God of Hindu, Muslim, Christian, > > > > > > Buddhist, Jains,.....and Your's and mine. > > > > > > > === message truncated === > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam protection around > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2006 Report Share Posted March 16, 2006 It is true that "Grahasthya Jeevan" is not the only way to GOD. But certainely, this is one of the most important ways. In Gita, Lord Krishna has emphasized that it is the "motive" which is the most important aspect behind any action or work. If someone's motive of getting married is to simply enjoy this worldly (materialistic)life, he would definetley be trapped into all sorts of materialistic weaknesses like ego, greed, lust, sense satisfactions, jealousness frustations, anger etc.. All these are the components of worldly "Daldal" and the person would be drowned in this "daldal", a sheer wastage of this most precious life. He would be completely a failure peroson, no matter if he has earned crores of rupees in this life. But if a person takes marriage as a "tapsya" with his heart and mind, he would fulfill all his worldly duties in a most sacred manner, always keeping God in his mind. By following this, he would keep all the dirts like greed, lust, anger etc. of this worldly life away from his lifestyle. Whatever sorrows or happiness comes in his life, whether through his wife, parents,children, relatives or from social surroundings, he would accept it as a grace of god, without loosing calm. By practicing this, he would always keep his "UNIOUN" with the God. And this would be the biggest achievement of his life. In a sense, this "grahasthya jeevan" has helped him in achieving God. We should not take the purpose of marriage in a shallow manner. According to me, today most of us have forgetten the basic purpose of our lives and that is why treat marriages as a path of achieving worldly enjoyments, sense satisfaction. And that is the reason of their sufferings. They have forgotten the ultimate purpose of life and got into the trap of worldly achievements. This is how I see this life. Vijay Shanker , "b_jamnadas" <b_jamna> wrote: > > Surely Grahastya Jeevan is a "TAP", but it is, but it is certainly > not the only way to god. BTW, when talking about SELF-LESS Service, > how does getting married fit in this picture? People certainly don't > get married to help some lonely man or women they feel sorry about. > > Sincerely, > Bhupendra. > > , "Vijay" > <vijayyshanker@> wrote: > > > > As I see, "Grahasthya jeevan" in itself is a "TAP" or tapasya, > > one of the most difficult tapasya, which teaches us how should we > > live a self-less life and learn to "give" without any > expectations. > > A selfless service or duty from wife to husband, husband to wife, > > parents to children or child to his/her parents and similarly our > > interactions with our own surroundings, lusts, attractions etc. > > If we succeed in winning over our weaknesses while performing our > > duties, our tapasya is successful and that should be the only > motive > > of our lives. Our life style should be just like the Lotous (Kamal > > Ka Phool)which does not get affected by its surroundings > > i.e. "daldal". This "daldal" could be seen as a symbolic of this > > world. "Nishkaam seva " is the only way to our "Mukti". I believe > > Yudhishter's life is a real example of "niskaam seva" while > > fulfilling all the worldly duties and responsibilities. > > > > Regards. > > Vijay Shanker > > > > , "b_jamnadas" > > <b_jamnadas@> wrote: > > > > > > Divakar Ji, > > > > > > There are various paths to god, lets just agree to that. The > point > > > is that in our lives, we go thru so many different experiences, > we > > > try to acquire happiness this way and that way and it simply > makes > > > our lives more and more complicated. If we were to spend this > > effort > > > in god realisation such as sadhana and mediation, our lives > would > > me > > > much simpler and we would be more contented. > > > > > > Look at a child, first all it needs is nurturing, then it needs > > toys > > > otherwise it is not going to be satisfied.Then the parents send > > this > > > child for education so that he/she can get a nice job, good > money, > > > good wife/husband, car house etc. The child goes thru some > > > expereince at school. Some don't find it easy at all, for some > it > > is > > > ok and some simply do not go to the scholl fopr the intended > > > purpose. Some have problems with school bullies and some have > > > problems simply coping with the studies. At thne end, not anyone > is > > > happy at schooll and looking towards the day they don't have to > go > > > to school again. Now out of school, either succesfully or not, > they > > > have to get a job, after all, what else to do becuase they need > > > money to surive and save face in the society. So they get a job. > > > Some are happy with their job and some are not and ultimately no > > > body is happy with their pay. Then they want to get married and > > with > > > a married life, they need a better job that better fulfills the > > > financial requirements. But with a better paying job, this means > > > less time with the family and more time at work(this may not be > the > > > case with you but it happens in a lot of houses.) Than the > couple > > > need child and with a child, more family expenses. So now either > > the > > > husband works more shifts or the wife gets a job. So the couples > > > hardly meet now. Here in canada, just to have family expenses > > going, > > > there are houses where couple go to work and they never see each > > > others face until then weekend. What sort of reality is this > > > Divarkrji? Was establishing such relationships in quest for > > > happiness really did provide happiness? The kids that these > couple > > > are working so hard for will one day go away and start his/her > own > > > family. Do you think that buy giving birth to a child, the child > > > owes the parents something? Couples have a child becuase they > want > > > it. What fault of the child that he has this life and will go > thru > > > all the pain and suffereings as per the karma. In mahabharata, > > Ganga > > > drowns all the children she has with Shaantano just so that the > > > child doesn't have to go thru the suffering. Would you call > Ganga > > to > > > have neglected on her duty to provide to the child, or would she > be > > > the compassionate one who could not bear to the pain the her > child > > > will go thru and so decided to end the pain right at birth? > > > > > > The thing is Divakarji, we create these relationships and then > we > > > justify it as necessary and then we make it our duty to nurture > > > them. Of course, if you have a wife, then you have to take care > of > > > her. The same goes with children and the parents. We go thru so > > much > > > effort in try to acquire happiness but in each step, we go thru > > > pain. Everything the we acquire will go away, wife, children, > house > > > and cars usually do not last more then 10 years anyways. All the > > > effort is ultimately in vain. > > > > > > In Siva Purana, Brahma is making efforts to create a class of > being > > > who are always going to be living in pain due to their karmas > and > > > will be required to continuously propitiate the gods. He tried > to > > > force his sons to procreate but they wouldn't. Then when in > extreme > > > anger, Rudra imerged from Brahma. Brahma made the same request > to > > > Rudra, i.e. to help him create such beings. Rudra replied that > he, > > > in this form of preceptor cannot create beings that are always > > going > > > to live in fear and agony. He warned Brahma the he was making a > > > mistake. We are that mistake. > > > > > > The are various paths to god Divakar Ji. If there is someone > > > preaching something that is not conventional, I do not see it > wrong > > > if they discuss it in this forum. > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > Bhupendra. > > > > > > , Divakara Tanjore > > > <div_tan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Jamnadas ji, > > > > > > > > What is kundalini?, it is life force, it increases or > > > > raises if we realise god or awaken the divine within. > > > > Bad desires and bad emotions will weaken the lifeforce > > > > not good ones. true love, true bhakti and compassion > > > > will raise it. > > > > > > > > Only people who are mislead will say that marriage, > > > > parents, children etc are maya etc. but in contrary > > > > lord shiva will like us more if we fulfil our > > > > responsibilities as a son/daughter, father/mother and > > > > husband/wife correctly. Life is about love and > > > > compassion, it is about selfless service and giving. > > > > > > > > if we consciously and selfishly follow moksha we will > > > > not get it, he who is selfless will get it. > > > > > > > > Lord Shiva wants us to live like him, to live life as > > > > it is eternal, Look at lord shiva, be like him, fulfil > > > > all the responsibilities like him, isnt Lord Shiva > > > > married, dosent he have children, isnt he worried > > > > about all of us. > > > > > > > > Lord shiva is inherently present in us, we dont have > > > > to do anything to merge with him, only thing we have > > > > to do is do good things, think good and act like him. > > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya, > > > > Divakar. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- b_jamnadas <b_jamnadas@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Divakar Ji, > > > > > > > > > > I really do not know much about Brahma Kumari sect > > > > > and I have no > > > > > interest in it. But your reply caught my attention. > > > > > Lately I have > > > > > been trying to learn Kundalini yoga and pranayam and > > > > > al;l the text > > > > > that I have tried to read about it. And one thing > > > > > the books all talk > > > > > about is detachment of maya, maya being the way we > > > > > have been living > > > > > like family, wife, children possessions etc. It > > > > > emphasises that even > > > > > a family person who is deeply intesrested in > > > > > activating the > > > > > kundalini and ultimately merge Siva has to free > > > > > himself from > > > > > emotions, exercise niyama and yama. I would not go > > > > > into much detail > > > > > since I am a beginner but there a lot of free books > > > > > online available > > > > > from sivananda website. I am pasting a quotations > > > > > from sivananda > > > > > that I receive daily in email: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ******************************************************** > > > > > The mind always wants to be doing something. When it > > > > > attaches itself > > > > > to the objects it cherishes, the mind feels amused > > > > > and happy. There > > > > > can be attraction without attachment. You can be > > > > > attracted to a > > > > > beautiful rose, but you are not attached to it. > > > > > Attachment comes > > > > > after possession and enjoyment. > > > > > > > > > > Attachment, love, ananda (bliss), all go together. > > > > > You are attached > > > > > to your wife and children and so on. You love them > > > > > because they give > > > > > you ananda. As this world is illusory and as, > > > > > through this illusion, > > > > > pain appears as pleasure, you must cut asunder all > > > > > worldly > > > > > attachments ruthlessly. Direct your love and > > > > > attachment towards the > > > > > reality, towards Brahman, towards the substratum > > > > > which lies at the > > > > > back of all objects, which is the witness of all > > > > > activities taking > > > > > place in the buddhi (intellect). > > > > > > > > > > It is difficult to divert the mind which from early > > > > > childhood has > > > > > fallen into the pernicious habit of seeking external > > > > > pleasures and > > > > > which continues to do so unless yougive it something > > > > > superior to be > > > > > amused with. Intellectual pleasure is far superior > > > > > to sensual > > > > > pleasure. So too, ananda (joy from meditation) is > > > > > far superior to > > > > > intellectual pleasure. Spiritual bliss gained from > > > > > self-realisation, > > > > > is infinite, immeasurable, unbounded. It is > > > > > anandaghana (a solid > > > > > mass of bliss). > > > > > > > > > > Keep the mind in a state of moderation. The mind > > > > > likes always to run > > > > > to extremes. It runs either to extreme joy or > > > > > extreme depression. > > > > > Extremes meet and bring about a reaction. In > > > > > excessive joy the mind > > > > > cannot be calmed. Hence let the mind always be calm > > > > > and cheerful. > > > > > > > > > > Ghee (clarified butter) has two states - solid and > > > > > liquid. So it is > > > > > with the mind. In the waking state it is solid and > > > > > in the deep sleep > > > > > state it is liquid. In the solid state it is limited > > > > > and gross. This > > > > > is why it has finite experiences. In the liquid > > > > > state it is > > > > > limitless and so the jiva (soul) experiences the > > > > > homogeneous and > > > > > limitless bliss. In the deep sleep state there is no > > > > > ego, no desire, > > > > > hence it experiences the limitless bliss of the > > > > > atman. > > > > > > > > > ************************************************************* > > > > > > > > > > , > > > > > Divakara Tanjore > > > > > <div_tan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear BK, > > > > > > > > > > > > True Spirituality and Spiritualism is about > > > > > attachment > > > > > > not detachment. Lord Shiva is a symbol of true > > > > > passion > > > > > > and love, attachment is required to understand > > > > > that. > > > > > > > > > > > > In my opinion the things you practice at Brahma > > > > > kumari > > > > > > is escapism, if you cannot face it escape by > > > > > > detachment, but God is not like that and we should > > > > > not > > > > > > live like that. we have to live with passion, with > > > > > > complete commiment, which comes from attachment > > > > > not > > > > > > detachment. > > > > > > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya, > > > > > > Divakar. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- B K <bkgswu@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine soul, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Shanti. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanking you for giving an opportunity, making > > > > > me > > > > > > > an instrument to reveal the Truth about God. You > > > > > > > might have received lots and lots of Blessings > > > > > from > > > > > > > God for being an instrument to carry out His > > > > > work. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you are hurt by the comments given by me, > > > > > > > really I am very sorry for that, hope it will > > > > > not > > > > > > > happen again. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is like this if we know that we are a soul > > > > > with > > > > > > > original nature of Purity, Knowledge, Peace, > > > > > Love, > > > > > > > Happiness, Bliss and Powers, no situation and no > > > > > > > email replies can hurt us because we see things > > > > > as > > > > > > > something not attached to us. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now we get hurt because we see our soul and > > > > > > > happenings around as one not separate.We get > > > > > > > attached to the situations. If we are in the > > > > > > > conscious of soul or in other words if we are > > > > > > > detached from the situations, nobody in this > > > > > world > > > > > > > can hurt us or make me feel sad. Instead, I will > > > > > be > > > > > > > always ever happy, contented with my original > > > > > > > nature. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The words i used in my reply in reality are > > > > > not my > > > > > > > words at all. They are the words of Supreme > > > > > Soul. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is said in Scriptures that when irreligion > > > > > > > exists , God will descend on Earth and when it > > > > > is, > > > > > > > nobody knows. But in reality, that Same God , > > > > > who is > > > > > > > a point of light, soul has come on Earth and > > > > > > > revealed His identity and He has revealed and > > > > > > > revealing everything(Past, Present and Future), > > > > > > > about Him and the wrong notion that prevailing > > > > > on > > > > > > > Earth about Him. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When we souls, point of lights, can come on > > > > > earth > > > > > > > to play our roles, why it is not possible for > > > > > the > > > > > > > Supreme soul to come on Earth, Once He comes, He > > > > > > > reveals the World Cycle, the Truths about the > > > > > past > > > > > > > and Future etc.,, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And there are lots and lots I want to share > > > > > with > > > > > > > you and everyone, but I am short of time..If you > > > > > are > > > > > > > able to contact Brahma kumari Centre, I think > > > > > there > > > > > > > is no local centre near your place but you can > > > > > > > contact Sonah nagassar, whose relative is a BK > > > > > to > > > > > > > know real Truth about God. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not talking about God of Brahma Kumari, I > > > > > am > > > > > > > talking about God of Hindu, Muslim, Christian, > > > > > > > Buddhist, Jains,.....and Your's and mine. > > > > > > > > > === message truncated === > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam protection > around > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 17, 2006 Report Share Posted March 17, 2006 grand children and insome cases, if possible with their grand-grand children! And there lies the crux of the problem. If you want to enjoy the wordly life unlimitedly, till your end, you are supposed to undergo the pains associated with it also, till your end. You can't complain on that, nor you can blame Gods for such state of affairs. For a Sanyasi, this wordly life is abostely a Maya. Only one who reasliss this can escape from this Maya and take your life to another level. Regards, Babu Vijay <vijayyshanker (AT) vsnl (DOT) net> wrote: It is true that "Grahasthya Jeevan" is not the only way to GOD. But certainely, this is one of the most important ways. In Gita, Lord Krishna has emphasized that it is the "motive" which is the most important aspect behind any action or work. If someone's motive of getting married is to simply enjoy this worldly (materialistic)life, he would definetley be trapped into all sorts of materialistic weaknesses like ego, greed, lust, sense satisfactions, jealousness frustations, anger etc.. All these are the components of worldly "Daldal" and the person would be drowned in this "daldal", a sheer wastage of this most precious life. He would be completely a failure peroson, no matter if he has earned crores of rupees in this life.But if a person takes marriage as a "tapsya" with his heart and mind, he would fulfill all his worldly duties in a most sacred manner, always keeping God in his mind. By following this, he would keep all the dirts like greed, lust, anger etc. of this worldly life away from his lifestyle. Whatever sorrows or happiness comes in his life, whether through his wife, parents,children, relatives or from social surroundings, he would accept it as a grace of god, without loosing calm. By practicing this, he would always keep his "UNIOUN" with the God. And this would be the biggest achievement of his life. In a sense, this "grahasthya jeevan" has helped him in achieving God. We should not take the purpose of marriage in a shallow manner. According to me, today most of us have forgetten the basic purpose of our lives and that is why treat marriages as a path of achieving worldly enjoyments, sense satisfaction. And that is the reason of their sufferings. They have forgotten the ultimate purpose of life and got into the trap of worldly achievements. This is how I see this life.Vijay Shanker, "b_jamnadas" <b_jamna> wrote:>> Surely Grahastya Jeevan is a "TAP", but it is, but it is certainly > not the only way to god. BTW, when talking about SELF-LESS Service, > how does getting married fit in this picture? People certainly don't > get married to help some lonely man or women they feel sorry about.> > Sincerely,> Bhupendra.> > , "Vijay" > <vijayyshanker@> wrote:> >> > As I see, "Grahasthya jeevan" in itself is a "TAP" or tapasya, > > one of the most difficult tapasya, which teaches us how should we > > live a self-less life and learn to "give" without any > expectations. > > A selfless service or duty from wife to husband, husband to wife, > > parents to children or child to his/her parents and similarly our > > interactions with our own surroundings, lusts, attractions etc. > > If we succeed in winning over our weaknesses while performing our > > duties, our tapasya is successful and that should be the only > motive > > of our lives. Our life style should be just like the Lotous (Kamal > > Ka Phool)which does not get affected by its surroundings > > i.e. "daldal". This "daldal" could be seen as a symbolic of this > > world. "Nishkaam seva " is the only way to our "Mukti". I believe > > Yudhishter's life is a real example of "niskaam seva" while > > fulfilling all the worldly duties and responsibilities.> > > > Regards.> > Vijay Shanker> > > > --- In , "b_jamnadas" > > <b_jamnadas@> wrote:> > >> > > Divakar Ji,> > > > > > There are various paths to god, lets just agree to that. The > point > > > is that in our lives, we go thru so many different experiences, > we > > > try to acquire happiness this way and that way and it simply > makes > > > our lives more and more complicated. If we were to spend this > > effort > > > in god realisation such as sadhana and mediation, our lives > would > > me > > > much simpler and we would be more contented. > > > > > > Look at a child, first all it needs is nurturing, then it needs > > toys > > > otherwise it is not going to be satisfied.Then the parents send > > this > > > child for education so that he/she can get a nice job, good > money, > > > good wife/husband, car house etc. The child goes thru some > > > expereince at school. Some don't find it easy at all, for some > it > > is > > > ok and some simply do not go to the scholl fopr the intended > > > purpose. Some have problems with school bullies and some have > > > problems simply coping with the studies. At thne end, not anyone > is > > > happy at schooll and looking towards the day they don't have to > go > > > to school again. Now out of school, either succesfully or not, > they > > > have to get a job, after all, what else to do becuase they need > > > money to surive and save face in the society. So they get a job. > > > Some are happy with their job and some are not and ultimately no > > > body is happy with their pay. Then they want to get married and > > with > > > a married life, they need a better job that better fulfills the > > > financial requirements. But with a better paying job, this means > > > less time with the family and more time at work(this may not be > the > > > case with you but it happens in a lot of houses.) Than the > couple > > > need child and with a child, more family expenses. So now either > > the > > > husband works more shifts or the wife gets a job. So the couples > > > hardly meet now. Here in canada, just to have family expenses > > going, > > > there are houses where couple go to work and they never see each > > > others face until then weekend. What sort of reality is this > > > Divarkrji? Was establishing such relationships in quest for > > > happiness really did provide happiness? The kids that these > couple > > > are working so hard for will one day go away and start his/her > own > > > family. Do you think that buy giving birth to a child, the child > > > owes the parents something? Couples have a child becuase they > want > > > it. What fault of the child that he has this life and will go > thru > > > all the pain and suffereings as per the karma. In mahabharata, > > Ganga > > > drowns all the children she has with Shaantano just so that the > > > child doesn't have to go thru the suffering. Would you call > Ganga > > to > > > have neglected on her duty to provide to the child, or would she > be > > > the compassionate one who could not bear to the pain the her > child > > > will go thru and so decided to end the pain right at birth?> > > > > > The thing is Divakarji, we create these relationships and then > we > > > justify it as necessary and then we make it our duty to nurture > > > them. Of course, if you have a wife, then you have to take care > of > > > her. The same goes with children and the parents. We go thru so > > much > > > effort in try to acquire happiness but in each step, we go thru > > > pain. Everything the we acquire will go away, wife, children, > house > > > and cars usually do not last more then 10 years anyways. All the > > > effort is ultimately in vain.> > > > > > In Siva Purana, Brahma is making efforts to create a class of > being > > > who are always going to be living in pain due to their karmas > and > > > will be required to continuously propitiate the gods. He tried > to > > > force his sons to procreate but they wouldn't. Then when in > extreme > > > anger, Rudra imerged from Brahma. Brahma made the same request > to > > > Rudra, i.e. to help him create such beings. Rudra replied that > he, > > > in this form of preceptor cannot create beings that are always > > going > > > to live in fear and agony. He warned Brahma the he was making a > > > mistake. We are that mistake.> > > > > > The are various paths to god Divakar Ji. If there is someone > > > preaching something that is not conventional, I do not see it > wrong > > > if they discuss it in this forum.> > > > > > Sincerely,> > > Bhupendra.> > > > > > , Divakara Tanjore > > > <div_tan@> wrote:> > > >> > > > Dear Jamnadas ji,> > > > > > > > What is kundalini?, it is life force, it increases or> > > > raises if we realise god or awaken the divine within.> > > > Bad desires and bad emotions will weaken the lifeforce> > > > not good ones. true love, true bhakti and compassion> > > > will raise it.> > > > > > > > Only people who are mislead will say that marriage,> > > > parents, children etc are maya etc. but in contrary> > > > lord shiva will like us more if we fulfil our> > > > responsibilities as a son/daughter, father/mother and> > > > husband/wife correctly. Life is about love and> > > > compassion, it is about selfless service and giving. > > > > > > > > if we consciously and selfishly follow moksha we will> > > > not get it, he who is selfless will get it.> > > > > > > > Lord Shiva wants us to live like him, to live life as> > > > it is eternal, Look at lord shiva, be like him, fulfil> > > > all the responsibilities like him, isnt Lord Shiva> > > > married, dosent he have children, isnt he worried> > > > about all of us.> > > > > > > > Lord shiva is inherently present in us, we dont have> > > > to do anything to merge with him, only thing we have> > > > to do is do good things, think good and act like him.> > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya,> > > > Divakar.> > > > > > > > > > > > --- b_jamnadas <b_jamnadas@> wrote:> > > > > > > > > Divakar Ji,> > > > > > > > > > I really do not know much about Brahma Kumari sect> > > > > and I have no > > > > > interest in it. But your reply caught my attention.> > > > > Lately I have > > > > > been trying to learn Kundalini yoga and pranayam and> > > > > al;l the text > > > > > that I have tried to read about it. And one thing> > > > > the books all talk > > > > > about is detachment of maya, maya being the way we> > > > > have been living > > > > > like family, wife, children possessions etc. It> > > > > emphasises that even > > > > > a family person who is deeply intesrested in> > > > > activating the > > > > > kundalini and ultimately merge Siva has to free> > > > > himself from > > > > > emotions, exercise niyama and yama. I would not go> > > > > into much detail > > > > > since I am a beginner but there a lot of free books> > > > > online available > > > > > from sivananda website. I am pasting a quotations> > > > > from sivananda > > > > > that I receive daily in email:> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > ********************************************************> > > > > The mind always wants to be doing something. When it> > > > > attaches itself > > > > > to the objects it cherishes, the mind feels amused> > > > > and happy. There > > > > > can be attraction without attachment. You can be> > > > > attracted to a > > > > > beautiful rose, but you are not attached to it.> > > > > Attachment comes > > > > > after possession and enjoyment.> > > > > > > > > > Attachment, love, ananda (bliss), all go together.> > > > > You are attached > > > > > to your wife and children and so on. You love them> > > > > because they give > > > > > you ananda. As this world is illusory and as,> > > > > through this illusion, > > > > > pain appears as pleasure, you must cut asunder all> > > > > worldly > > > > > attachments ruthlessly. Direct your love and> > > > > attachment towards the > > > > > reality, towards Brahman, towards the substratum> > > > > which lies at the > > > > > back of all objects, which is the witness of all> > > > > activities taking > > > > > place in the buddhi (intellect).> > > > > > > > > > It is difficult to divert the mind which from early> > > > > childhood has > > > > > fallen into the pernicious habit of seeking external> > > > > pleasures and > > > > > which continues to do so unless yougive it something> > > > > superior to be > > > > > amused with. Intellectual pleasure is far superior> > > > > to sensual > > > > > pleasure. So too, ananda (joy from meditation) is> > > > > far superior to > > > > > intellectual pleasure. Spiritual bliss gained from> > > > > self-realisation, > > > > > is infinite, immeasurable, unbounded. It is> > > > > anandaghana (a solid > > > > > mass of bliss).> > > > > > > > > > Keep the mind in a state of moderation. The mind> > > > > likes always to run > > > > > to extremes. It runs either to extreme joy or> > > > > extreme depression. > > > > > Extremes meet and bring about a reaction. In> > > > > excessive joy the mind > > > > > cannot be calmed. Hence let the mind always be calm> > > > > and cheerful.> > > > > > > > > > Ghee (clarified butter) has two states - solid and> > > > > liquid. So it is > > > > > with the mind. In the waking state it is solid and> > > > > in the deep sleep > > > > > state it is liquid. In the solid state it is limited> > > > > and gross. This > > > > > is why it has finite experiences. In the liquid> > > > > state it is > > > > > limitless and so the jiva (soul) experiences the> > > > > homogeneous and > > > > > limitless bliss. In the deep sleep state there is no> > > > > ego, no desire, > > > > > hence it experiences the limitless bliss of the> > > > > atman.> > > > >> > > > *************************************************************> > > > > > > > > > ,> > > > > Divakara Tanjore > > > > > <div_tan@> wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > Dear BK,> > > > > > > > > > > > True Spirituality and Spiritualism is about> > > > > attachment> > > > > > not detachment. Lord Shiva is a symbol of true> > > > > passion> > > > > > and love, attachment is required to understand> > > > > that. > > > > > > > > > > > > In my opinion the things you practice at Brahma> > > > > kumari> > > > > > is escapism, if you cannot face it escape by> > > > > > detachment, but God is not like that and we should> > > > > not> > > > > > live like that. we have to live with passion, with> > > > > > complete commiment, which comes from attachment> > > > > not> > > > > > detachment.> > > > > > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya,> > > > > > Divakar.> > > > > > > > > > > > --- B K <bkgswu@> wrote:> > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divine soul,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Shanti.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanking you for giving an opportunity, making> > > > > me> > > > > > > an instrument to reveal the Truth about God. You> > > > > > > might have received lots and lots of Blessings> > > > > from> > > > > > > God for being an instrument to carry out His> > > > > work.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > If you are hurt by the comments given by me,> > > > > > > really I am very sorry for that, hope it will> > > > > not> > > > > > > happen again.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is like this if we know that we are a soul> > > > > with> > > > > > > original nature of Purity, Knowledge, Peace,> > > > > Love,> > > > > > > Happiness, Bliss and Powers, no situation and no> > > > > > > email replies can hurt us because we see things> > > > > as> > > > > > > something not attached to us.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now we get hurt because we see our soul and> > > > > > > happenings around as one not separate.We get> > > > > > > attached to the situations. If we are in the> > > > > > > conscious of soul or in other words if we are> > > > > > > detached from the situations, nobody in this> > > > > world> > > > > > > can hurt us or make me feel sad. Instead, I will> > > > > be> > > > > > > always ever happy, contented with my original> > > > > > > nature.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > The words i used in my reply in reality are> > > > > not my> > > > > > > words at all. They are the words of Supreme> > > > > Soul.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is said in Scriptures that when irreligion> > > > > > > exists , God will descend on Earth and when it> > > > > is,> > > > > > > nobody knows. But in reality, that Same God ,> > > > > who is> > > > > > > a point of light, soul has come on Earth and> > > > > > > revealed His identity and He has revealed and> > > > > > > revealing everything(Past, Present and Future),> > > > > > > about Him and the wrong notion that prevailing> > > > > on> > > > > > > Earth about Him.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > When we souls, point of lights, can come on> > > > > earth> > > > > > > to play our roles, why it is not possible for> > > > > the> > > > > > > Supreme soul to come on Earth, Once He comes, He> > > > > > > reveals the World Cycle, the Truths about the> > > > > past> > > > > > > and Future etc.,,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > And there are lots and lots I want to share> > > > > with> > > > > > > you and everyone, but I am short of time..If you> > > > > are> > > > > > > able to contact Brahma kumari Centre, I think> > > > > there> > > > > > > is no local centre near your place but you can> > > > > > > contact Sonah nagassar, whose relative is a BK> > > > > to> > > > > > > know real Truth about God.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not talking about God of Brahma Kumari, I> > > > > am> > > > > > > talking about God of Hindu, Muslim, Christian,> > > > > > > Buddhist, Jains,.....and Your's and mine.> > > > > > > > > === message truncated ===> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam protection > around > > > > > > > >> > >> >> Jiyo cricket on India cricket Messenger Mobile Stay in touch with your buddies all the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 17, 2006 Report Share Posted March 17, 2006 if we have the intention to help others we can do anything, God will show the way. Om namah shivaya, Divakar. --- b_jamnadas <b_jamna> wrote: > Surely Grahastya Jeevan is a "TAP", but it is, but > it is certainly > not the only way to god. BTW, when talking about > SELF-LESS Service, > how does getting married fit in this picture? People > certainly don't > get married to help some lonely man or women they > feel sorry about. > > Sincerely, > Bhupendra. > > , > "Vijay" > <vijayyshanker wrote: > > > > As I see, "Grahasthya jeevan" in itself is a "TAP" > or tapasya, > > one of the most difficult tapasya, which teaches > us how should we > > live a self-less life and learn to "give" without > any > expectations. > > A selfless service or duty from wife to husband, > husband to wife, > > parents to children or child to his/her parents > and similarly our > > interactions with our own surroundings, lusts, > attractions etc. > > If we succeed in winning over our weaknesses while > performing our > > duties, our tapasya is successful and that should > be the only > motive > > of our lives. Our life style should be just like > the Lotous (Kamal > > Ka Phool)which does not get affected by its > surroundings > > i.e. "daldal". This "daldal" could be seen as a > symbolic of this > > world. "Nishkaam seva " is the only way to our > "Mukti". I believe > > Yudhishter's life is a real example of "niskaam > seva" while > > fulfilling all the worldly duties and > responsibilities. > > > > Regards. > > Vijay Shanker > > > > , > "b_jamnadas" > > <b_jamnadas@> wrote: > > > > > > Divakar Ji, > > > > > > There are various paths to god, lets just agree > to that. The > point > > > is that in our lives, we go thru so many > different experiences, > we > > > try to acquire happiness this way and that way > and it simply > makes > > > our lives more and more complicated. If we were > to spend this > > effort > > > in god realisation such as sadhana and > mediation, our lives > would > > me > > > much simpler and we would be more contented. > > > > > > Look at a child, first all it needs is > nurturing, then it needs > > toys > > > otherwise it is not going to be satisfied.Then > the parents send > > this > > > child for education so that he/she can get a > nice job, good > money, > > > good wife/husband, car house etc. The child goes > thru some > > > expereince at school. Some don't find it easy at > all, for some > it > > is > > > ok and some simply do not go to the scholl fopr > the intended > > > purpose. Some have problems with school bullies > and some have > > > problems simply coping with the studies. At thne > end, not anyone > is > > > happy at schooll and looking towards the day > they don't have to > go > > > to school again. Now out of school, either > succesfully or not, > they > > > have to get a job, after all, what else to do > becuase they need > > > money to surive and save face in the society. So > they get a job. > > > Some are happy with their job and some are not > and ultimately no > > > body is happy with their pay. Then they want to > get married and > > with > > > a married life, they need a better job that > better fulfills the > > > financial requirements. But with a better paying > job, this means > > > less time with the family and more time at > work(this may not be > the > > > case with you but it happens in a lot of > houses.) Than the > couple > > > need child and with a child, more family > expenses. So now either > > the > > > husband works more shifts or the wife gets a > job. So the couples > > > hardly meet now. Here in canada, just to have > family expenses > > going, > > > there are houses where couple go to work and > they never see each > > > others face until then weekend. What sort of > reality is this > > > Divarkrji? Was establishing such relationships > in quest for > > > happiness really did provide happiness? The kids > that these > couple > > > are working so hard for will one day go away and > start his/her > own > > > family. Do you think that buy giving birth to a > child, the child > > > owes the parents something? Couples have a child > becuase they > want > > > it. What fault of the child that he has this > life and will go > thru > > > all the pain and suffereings as per the karma. > In mahabharata, > > Ganga > > > drowns all the children she has with Shaantano > just so that the > > > child doesn't have to go thru the suffering. > Would you call > Ganga > > to > > > have neglected on her duty to provide to the > child, or would she > be > > > the compassionate one who could not bear to the > pain the her > child > > > will go thru and so decided to end the pain > right at birth? > > > > > > The thing is Divakarji, we create these > relationships and then > we > > > justify it as necessary and then we make it our > duty to nurture > > > them. Of course, if you have a wife, then you > have to take care > of > > > her. The same goes with children and the > parents. We go thru so > > much > > > effort in try to acquire happiness but in each > step, we go thru > > > pain. Everything the we acquire will go away, > wife, children, > house > > > and cars usually do not last more then 10 years > anyways. All the > > > effort is ultimately in vain. > > > > > > In Siva Purana, Brahma is making efforts to > create a class of > being > > > who are always going to be living in pain due to > their karmas > and > > > will be required to continuously propitiate the > gods. He tried > to > > > force his sons to procreate but they wouldn't. > Then when in > extreme > > > anger, Rudra imerged from Brahma. Brahma made > the same request > === message truncated === Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 17, 2006 Report Share Posted March 17, 2006 Yes, but is that why people marry? Bhupendra? , Divakara Tanjore <div_tan wrote: > > if we have the intention to help others we can do > anything, God will show the way. > > Om namah shivaya, > Divakar. > > --- b_jamnadas <b_jamna> wrote: > > > Surely Grahastya Jeevan is a "TAP", but it is, but > > it is certainly > > not the only way to god. BTW, when talking about > > SELF-LESS Service, > > how does getting married fit in this picture? People > > certainly don't > > get married to help some lonely man or women they > > feel sorry about. > > > > Sincerely, > > Bhupendra. > > > > , > > "Vijay" > > <vijayyshanker@> wrote: > > > > > > As I see, "Grahasthya jeevan" in itself is a "TAP" > > or tapasya, > > > one of the most difficult tapasya, which teaches > > us how should we > > > live a self-less life and learn to "give" without > > any > > expectations. > > > A selfless service or duty from wife to husband, > > husband to wife, > > > parents to children or child to his/her parents > > and similarly our > > > interactions with our own surroundings, lusts, > > attractions etc. > > > If we succeed in winning over our weaknesses while > > performing our > > > duties, our tapasya is successful and that should > > be the only > > motive > > > of our lives. Our life style should be just like > > the Lotous (Kamal > > > Ka Phool)which does not get affected by its > > surroundings > > > i.e. "daldal". This "daldal" could be seen as a > > symbolic of this > > > world. "Nishkaam seva " is the only way to our > > "Mukti". I believe > > > Yudhishter's life is a real example of "niskaam > > seva" while > > > fulfilling all the worldly duties and > > responsibilities. > > > > > > Regards. > > > Vijay Shanker > > > > > > , > > "b_jamnadas" > > > <b_jamnadas@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Divakar Ji, > > > > > > > > There are various paths to god, lets just agree > > to that. The > > point > > > > is that in our lives, we go thru so many > > different experiences, > > we > > > > try to acquire happiness this way and that way > > and it simply > > makes > > > > our lives more and more complicated. If we were > > to spend this > > > effort > > > > in god realisation such as sadhana and > > mediation, our lives > > would > > > me > > > > much simpler and we would be more contented. > > > > > > > > Look at a child, first all it needs is > > nurturing, then it needs > > > toys > > > > otherwise it is not going to be satisfied.Then > > the parents send > > > this > > > > child for education so that he/she can get a > > nice job, good > > money, > > > > good wife/husband, car house etc. The child goes > > thru some > > > > expereince at school. Some don't find it easy at > > all, for some > > it > > > is > > > > ok and some simply do not go to the scholl fopr > > the intended > > > > purpose. Some have problems with school bullies > > and some have > > > > problems simply coping with the studies. At thne > > end, not anyone > > is > > > > happy at schooll and looking towards the day > > they don't have to > > go > > > > to school again. Now out of school, either > > succesfully or not, > > they > > > > have to get a job, after all, what else to do > > becuase they need > > > > money to surive and save face in the society. So > > they get a job. > > > > Some are happy with their job and some are not > > and ultimately no > > > > body is happy with their pay. Then they want to > > get married and > > > with > > > > a married life, they need a better job that > > better fulfills the > > > > financial requirements. But with a better paying > > job, this means > > > > less time with the family and more time at > > work(this may not be > > the > > > > case with you but it happens in a lot of > > houses.) Than the > > couple > > > > need child and with a child, more family > > expenses. So now either > > > the > > > > husband works more shifts or the wife gets a > > job. So the couples > > > > hardly meet now. Here in canada, just to have > > family expenses > > > going, > > > > there are houses where couple go to work and > > they never see each > > > > others face until then weekend. What sort of > > reality is this > > > > Divarkrji? Was establishing such relationships > > in quest for > > > > happiness really did provide happiness? The kids > > that these > > couple > > > > are working so hard for will one day go away and > > start his/her > > own > > > > family. Do you think that buy giving birth to a > > child, the child > > > > owes the parents something? Couples have a child > > becuase they > > want > > > > it. What fault of the child that he has this > > life and will go > > thru > > > > all the pain and suffereings as per the karma. > > In mahabharata, > > > Ganga > > > > drowns all the children she has with Shaantano > > just so that the > > > > child doesn't have to go thru the suffering. > > Would you call > > Ganga > > > to > > > > have neglected on her duty to provide to the > > child, or would she > > be > > > > the compassionate one who could not bear to the > > pain the her > > child > > > > will go thru and so decided to end the pain > > right at birth? > > > > > > > > The thing is Divakarji, we create these > > relationships and then > > we > > > > justify it as necessary and then we make it our > > duty to nurture > > > > them. Of course, if you have a wife, then you > > have to take care > > of > > > > her. The same goes with children and the > > parents. We go thru so > > > much > > > > effort in try to acquire happiness but in each > > step, we go thru > > > > pain. Everything the we acquire will go away, > > wife, children, > > house > > > > and cars usually do not last more then 10 years > > anyways. All the > > > > effort is ultimately in vain. > > > > > > > > In Siva Purana, Brahma is making efforts to > > create a class of > > being > > > > who are always going to be living in pain due to > > their karmas > > and > > > > will be required to continuously propitiate the > > gods. He tried > > to > > > > force his sons to procreate but they wouldn't. > > Then when in > > extreme > > > > anger, Rudra imerged from Brahma. Brahma made > > the same request > > > === message truncated === > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 17, 2006 Report Share Posted March 17, 2006 Dear Jamnadas, Its a very difficult question to answer, I am not an expert or I am not judging others but here is what I believe. Marriage is supposed to be a merger of two souls or solumates who cannot live without eachother and who live for eachother. it is pre-determined based on our karma, as I said earlier souls come to earth in groups with some preset blue prints. To carry out some actions and leran from it and marriage is one of the aspect of it. But in this world of never ending desires and ambition, people are making marriage as a means of convinience to survive and grow in life. Om namah shivaya, Divakar. --- b_jamnadas <b_jamna> wrote: > Yes, but is that why people marry? > > Bhupendra? > , > Divakara Tanjore > <div_tan wrote: > > > > if we have the intention to help others we can do > > anything, God will show the way. > > > > Om namah shivaya, > > Divakar. > > > > --- b_jamnadas <b_jamna> wrote: > > > > > Surely Grahastya Jeevan is a "TAP", but it is, > but > > > it is certainly > > > not the only way to god. BTW, when talking about > > > SELF-LESS Service, > > > how does getting married fit in this picture? > People > > > certainly don't > > > get married to help some lonely man or women > they > > > feel sorry about. > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > Bhupendra. > > > > > > , > > > "Vijay" > > > <vijayyshanker@> wrote: > > > > > > > > As I see, "Grahasthya jeevan" in itself is a > "TAP" > > > or tapasya, > > > > one of the most difficult tapasya, which > teaches > > > us how should we > > > > live a self-less life and learn to "give" > without > > > any > > > expectations. > > > > A selfless service or duty from wife to > husband, > > > husband to wife, > > > > parents to children or child to his/her > parents > > > and similarly our > > > > interactions with our own surroundings, lusts, > > > attractions etc. > > > > If we succeed in winning over our weaknesses > while > > > performing our > > > > duties, our tapasya is successful and that > should > > > be the only > > > motive > > > > of our lives. Our life style should be just > like > > > the Lotous (Kamal > > > > Ka Phool)which does not get affected by its > > > surroundings > > > > i.e. "daldal". This "daldal" could be seen as > a > > > symbolic of this > > > > world. "Nishkaam seva " is the only way to > our > > > "Mukti". I believe > > > > Yudhishter's life is a real example of > "niskaam > > > seva" while > > > > fulfilling all the worldly duties and > > > responsibilities. > > > > > > > > Regards. > > > > Vijay Shanker > > > > > > > > , > > > "b_jamnadas" > > > > <b_jamnadas@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Divakar Ji, > > > > > > > > > > There are various paths to god, lets just > agree > > > to that. The > > > point > > > > > is that in our lives, we go thru so many > > > different experiences, > > > we > > > > > try to acquire happiness this way and that > way > > > and it simply > > > makes > > > > > our lives more and more complicated. If we > were > > > to spend this > > > > effort > > > > > in god realisation such as sadhana and > > > mediation, our lives > > > would > > > > me > > > > > much simpler and we would be more contented. > > > > > > > > > > > Look at a child, first all it needs is > > > nurturing, then it needs > > > > toys > > > > > otherwise it is not going to be > satisfied.Then > > > the parents send > > > > this > > > > > child for education so that he/she can get a > > > nice job, good > > > money, > > > > > good wife/husband, car house etc. The child > goes > > > thru some > > > > > expereince at school. Some don't find it > easy at > > > all, for some > > > it > > > > is > > > > > ok and some simply do not go to the scholl > fopr > > > the intended > > > > > purpose. Some have problems with school > bullies > > > and some have > > > > > problems simply coping with the studies. At > thne > > > end, not anyone > > > is > > > > > happy at schooll and looking towards the day > > > they don't have to > > > go > > > > > to school again. Now out of school, either > > > succesfully or not, > > > they > > > > > have to get a job, after all, what else to > do > > > becuase they need > > > > > money to surive and save face in the > society. So > > > they get a job. > > > > > Some are happy with their job and some are > not > > > and ultimately no > > > > > body is happy with their pay. Then they want > to > > > get married and > > > > with > > > > > a married life, they need a better job that > > > better fulfills the > > > > > financial requirements. But with a better > paying > > > job, this means > > > > > less time with the family and more time at > > > work(this may not be > > > the > > > > > case with you but it happens in a lot of > > > houses.) Than the > > > couple > > > > > need child and with a child, more family > > > expenses. So now either > > > > the > > > > > husband works more shifts or the wife gets a > > > job. So the couples > > > > > hardly meet now. Here in canada, just to > have > > > family expenses > > > > going, > > > > > there are houses where couple go to work and > > > they never see each > > > > > others face until then weekend. What sort of > > > reality is this > > > > > Divarkrji? Was establishing such > relationships > > > in quest for > > > > > happiness really did provide happiness? The > kids > > > that these > > > couple > > > > > are working so hard for will one day go away > and > > > start his/her > > > own > > > > > family. Do you think that buy giving birth > to a > > > child, the child > > > > > owes the parents something? Couples have a > child > > > becuase they > > > want > > > > > it. What fault of the child that he has this > > > life and will go > > > thru > > > > > all the pain and suffereings as per the > karma. > === message truncated === Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 17, 2006 Report Share Posted March 17, 2006 So it not married life as we have come to know today basically. Now I am beginning to see why you would consider married life to be an important aspect for spiritual growth. Married life of the kind that you talk about really requires gods grace to begin with, atleast in these modern times. But I still don't have a clear picture of the kind of married life you are talking about. Might be if you could elaborate. Sincerely, Bhupendra. , Divakara Tanjore <div_tan wrote: > > Dear Jamnadas, > > Its a very difficult question to answer, I am not an > expert or I am not judging others but here is what I > believe. > > Marriage is supposed to be a merger of two souls or > solumates who cannot live without eachother and who > live for eachother. it is pre-determined based on our > karma, as I said earlier souls come to earth in groups > with some preset blue prints. To carry out some > actions and leran from it and marriage is one of the > aspect of it. > > But in this world of never ending desires and > ambition, people are making marriage as a means of > convinience to survive and grow in life. > > Om namah shivaya, > Divakar. > > --- b_jamnadas <b_jamna> wrote: > > > Yes, but is that why people marry? > > > > Bhupendra? > > , > > Divakara Tanjore > > <div_tan@> wrote: > > > > > > if we have the intention to help others we can do > > > anything, God will show the way. > > > > > > Om namah shivaya, > > > Divakar. > > > > > > --- b_jamnadas <b_jamnadas@> wrote: > > > > > > > Surely Grahastya Jeevan is a "TAP", but it is, > > but > > > > it is certainly > > > > not the only way to god. BTW, when talking about > > > > SELF-LESS Service, > > > > how does getting married fit in this picture? > > People > > > > certainly don't > > > > get married to help some lonely man or women > > they > > > > feel sorry about. > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > Bhupendra. > > > > > > > > , > > > > "Vijay" > > > > <vijayyshanker@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > As I see, "Grahasthya jeevan" in itself is a > > "TAP" > > > > or tapasya, > > > > > one of the most difficult tapasya, which > > teaches > > > > us how should we > > > > > live a self-less life and learn to "give" > > without > > > > any > > > > expectations. > > > > > A selfless service or duty from wife to > > husband, > > > > husband to wife, > > > > > parents to children or child to his/her > > parents > > > > and similarly our > > > > > interactions with our own surroundings, lusts, > > > > attractions etc. > > > > > If we succeed in winning over our weaknesses > > while > > > > performing our > > > > > duties, our tapasya is successful and that > > should > > > > be the only > > > > motive > > > > > of our lives. Our life style should be just > > like > > > > the Lotous (Kamal > > > > > Ka Phool)which does not get affected by its > > > > surroundings > > > > > i.e. "daldal". This "daldal" could be seen as > > a > > > > symbolic of this > > > > > world. "Nishkaam seva " is the only way to > > our > > > > "Mukti". I believe > > > > > Yudhishter's life is a real example of > > "niskaam > > > > seva" while > > > > > fulfilling all the worldly duties and > > > > responsibilities. > > > > > > > > > > Regards. > > > > > Vijay Shanker > > > > > > > > > > , > > > > "b_jamnadas" > > > > > <b_jamnadas@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Divakar Ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > There are various paths to god, lets just > > agree > > > > to that. The > > > > point > > > > > > is that in our lives, we go thru so many > > > > different experiences, > > > > we > > > > > > try to acquire happiness this way and that > > way > > > > and it simply > > > > makes > > > > > > our lives more and more complicated. If we > > were > > > > to spend this > > > > > effort > > > > > > in god realisation such as sadhana and > > > > mediation, our lives > > > > would > > > > > me > > > > > > much simpler and we would be more contented. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Look at a child, first all it needs is > > > > nurturing, then it needs > > > > > toys > > > > > > otherwise it is not going to be > > satisfied.Then > > > > the parents send > > > > > this > > > > > > child for education so that he/she can get a > > > > nice job, good > > > > money, > > > > > > good wife/husband, car house etc. The child > > goes > > > > thru some > > > > > > expereince at school. Some don't find it > > easy at > > > > all, for some > > > > it > > > > > is > > > > > > ok and some simply do not go to the scholl > > fopr > > > > the intended > > > > > > purpose. Some have problems with school > > bullies > > > > and some have > > > > > > problems simply coping with the studies. At > > thne > > > > end, not anyone > > > > is > > > > > > happy at schooll and looking towards the day > > > > they don't have to > > > > go > > > > > > to school again. Now out of school, either > > > > succesfully or not, > > > > they > > > > > > have to get a job, after all, what else to > > do > > > > becuase they need > > > > > > money to surive and save face in the > > society. So > > > > they get a job. > > > > > > Some are happy with their job and some are > > not > > > > and ultimately no > > > > > > body is happy with their pay. Then they want > > to > > > > get married and > > > > > with > > > > > > a married life, they need a better job that > > > > better fulfills the > > > > > > financial requirements. But with a better > > paying > > > > job, this means > > > > > > less time with the family and more time at > > > > work(this may not be > > > > the > > > > > > case with you but it happens in a lot of > > > > houses.) Than the > > > > couple > > > > > > need child and with a child, more family > > > > expenses. So now either > > > > > the > > > > > > husband works more shifts or the wife gets a > > > > job. So the couples > > > > > > hardly meet now. Here in canada, just to > > have > > > > family expenses > > > > > going, > > > > > > there are houses where couple go to work and > > > > they never see each > > > > > > others face until then weekend. What sort of > > > > reality is this > > > > > > Divarkrji? Was establishing such > > relationships > > > > in quest for > > > > > > happiness really did provide happiness? The > > kids > > > > that these > > > > couple > > > > > > are working so hard for will one day go away > > and > > > > start his/her > > > > own > > > > > > family. Do you think that buy giving birth > > to a > > > > child, the child > > > > > > owes the parents something? Couples have a > > child > > > > becuase they > > > > want > > > > > > it. What fault of the child that he has this > > > > life and will go > > > > thru > > > > > > all the pain and suffereings as per the > > karma. > > > === message truncated === > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 18, 2006 Report Share Posted March 18, 2006 Two souls before coming to earth will decide to be a couple, sometimes they will be soulmates and want to have a beautiful relationship and sometimes they will be very different personalities and want to or will have a turbulent relationship, All this is a learning process, like we choose our parents before we are born, we choose our other relationships also. Fulfilling our relationships is part of our learning process, we have to use our free will in this life to strengthen our relationships rather than to drift away from them, this will build our good karma and move us towards spiritual upliftment, again some souls achieve this in a few lives and some take more, it is all part of learning. if you have time please read the book, "Many Lives Many Masters" written by Dr. Brian Weiss, it is a beautiful book with ral life examples on karma and re-incarnation which show a path to spiritual development. The relationships we have are continuing from so many re-incarnations and bad karma will continue this cycle, if we indulge in good karma we can stop this and move towards spirituality, but one thing is required here, we have to help other souls also to achieve this, then only god and his kingdom will like us. hope it helps, I am not an expert, this is what I believe, Om namah shivaya, Divakar. --- b_jamnadas <b_jamna> wrote: > So it not married life as we have come to know today > basically. > Now I am beginning to see why you would consider > married life to be > an important aspect for spiritual growth. Married > life of the kind > that you talk about really requires gods grace to > begin with, > atleast in these modern times. But I still don't > have a clear > picture of the kind of married life you are talking > about. Might be > if you could elaborate. > > Sincerely, > Bhupendra. > > , > Divakara Tanjore > <div_tan wrote: > > > > Dear Jamnadas, > > > > Its a very difficult question to answer, I am not > an > > expert or I am not judging others but here is what > I > > believe. > > > > Marriage is supposed to be a merger of two souls > or > > solumates who cannot live without eachother and > who > > live for eachother. it is pre-determined based on > our > > karma, as I said earlier souls come to earth in > groups > > with some preset blue prints. To carry out some > > actions and leran from it and marriage is one of > the > > aspect of it. > > > > But in this world of never ending desires and > > ambition, people are making marriage as a means of > > convinience to survive and grow in life. > > > > Om namah shivaya, > > Divakar. > > > > --- b_jamnadas <b_jamna> wrote: > > > > > Yes, but is that why people marry? > > > > > > Bhupendra? > > > , > > > Divakara Tanjore > > > <div_tan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > if we have the intention to help others we can > do > > > > anything, God will show the way. > > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya, > > > > Divakar. > > > > > > > > --- b_jamnadas <b_jamnadas@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Surely Grahastya Jeevan is a "TAP", but it > is, > > > but > > > > > it is certainly > > > > > not the only way to god. BTW, when talking > about > > > > > SELF-LESS Service, > > > > > how does getting married fit in this > picture? > > > People > > > > > certainly don't > > > > > get married to help some lonely man or women > > > they > > > > > feel sorry about. > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > Bhupendra. > > > > > > > > > > --- In > , > > > > > "Vijay" > > > > > <vijayyshanker@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > As I see, "Grahasthya jeevan" in itself is > a > > > "TAP" > > > > > or tapasya, > > > > > > one of the most difficult tapasya, which > > > teaches > > > > > us how should we > > > > > > live a self-less life and learn to "give" > > > without > > > > > any > > > > > expectations. > > > > > > A selfless service or duty from wife to > > > husband, > > > > > husband to wife, > > > > > > parents to children or child to his/her > > > parents > > > > > and similarly our > > > > > > interactions with our own surroundings, > lusts, > > > > > attractions etc. > > > > > > If we succeed in winning over our > weaknesses > > > while > > > > > performing our > > > > > > duties, our tapasya is successful and that > > > should > > > > > be the only > > > > > motive > > > > > > of our lives. Our life style should be > just > > > like > > > > > the Lotous (Kamal > > > > > > Ka Phool)which does not get affected by > its > > > > > surroundings > > > > > > i.e. "daldal". This "daldal" could be seen > as > > > a > > > > > symbolic of this > > > > > > world. "Nishkaam seva " is the only way > to > > > our > > > > > "Mukti". I believe > > > > > > Yudhishter's life is a real example of > > > "niskaam > > > > > seva" while > > > > > > fulfilling all the worldly duties and > > > > > responsibilities. > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards. > > > > > > Vijay Shanker > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > , > > > > > "b_jamnadas" > > > > > > <b_jamnadas@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Divakar Ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are various paths to god, lets > just > > > agree > > > > > to that. The > > > > > point > > > > > > > is that in our lives, we go thru so many > > > > > different experiences, > > > > > we > > > > > > > try to acquire happiness this way and > that > > > way > > > > > and it simply > > > > > makes > > > > > > > our lives more and more complicated. If > we > > > were > > > > > to spend this > > > > > > effort > > > > > > > in god realisation such as sadhana and > > > > > mediation, our lives > > > > > would > > > > > > me > > > > > > > much simpler and we would be more > contented. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Look at a child, first all it needs is > > > > > nurturing, then it needs > > > > > > toys > > > > > > > otherwise it is not going to be > > > satisfied.Then > > > > > the parents send > > > > > > this > > > > > > > child for education so that he/she can > get a > > > > > nice job, good > > > > > money, > > > > > > > good wife/husband, car house etc. The > child > > > goes > > > > > thru some > > > > > > > expereince at school. Some don't find it > > > easy at > > > > > all, for some > > > > > it > > > > > > is > > > > > > > ok and some simply do not go to the > scholl > > > fopr > > > > > the intended > > > > > > > purpose. Some have problems with school > > > bullies > === message truncated === Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 20, 2006 Report Share Posted March 20, 2006 I see in this way. Our Rishis have shown us number of ways to reach to the GOD - the ultimate goal of any human being. Union of a soul with the GOD is possible through various ways - through knowledge, karma, devotion or Bhakti. The pre-request of getting merged with the GOD is to get oneself purified in total. Purification means to win over the weaknesses like any type of attraction, greediness, lust, egoism, favourtism, nepotism, anger, jealousness and other emotions.etc and complete surrender to God. Unless one is free from all these, it is difficult to achieve the Union with the GOD. Renounciation from within is MUST for achieving this ultimate goal of life. Married Life (i.e. Grihastha jeevan) gives a person an opportunity to face all the above mentioned situations and rise above his or her weaknesses towards worldly attractions. I feel, Grihastha jeevan, in a way is a phase of life as any learning class where either we pass or fail. Mr. Divakar has very rightly mentioned that the souls come on earth in groups based on our pre-dtermined karmas. I very much believe in that and would like to add some more into this. Based on our pre-detreminded karmas, we get the living environments, situations, parents, wife/husband, children and other social relations. Whatever we experience (good or bad)out of these relationships are the outcome of our past karmas. We must experience it boldly and calmly to get ourselves cleaner in this life. Those who have already achieved the level of purifications/ renounciation in their past lives, do not feel going into the family-ife because they have alraedy crossed that level of awareness. Examples are Swami Vivekanand, Shankaracharya, Sirdi ke Sai Baba and many more. The purpose of their lives on this earth was to give us the right directions as our true teachers. In short, married life is one of the ways (and not the only way) which could lead us to the God, provided we have been able to understand it properly and live it successfully. Gristha jeevan teaches us to believe in "Giving" without expectations like father gives his bests to his child and vice-versa, wife gives her bests to her husband and children and vice-versa and the whole family to the society and keeping in mind that whatever service they are giving is actually an offer to God. It teaches us to see God in everything. Marriage is not just for fulfilling the worldly desires but is a "tapasya" if taken in a real sense. Western thinking has changed the meaning of the purpose of our lives on this earth, meaning of relationships with each other, meaning of marriages etc.. That is why the whole troubles in our lives. Regards to all Vijay Shanker , "b_jamnadas" <b_jamna> wrote: > > So it not married life as we have come to know today basically. > Now I am beginning to see why you would consider married life to be > an important aspect for spiritual growth. Married life of the kind > that you talk about really requires gods grace to begin with, > atleast in these modern times. But I still don't have a clear > picture of the kind of married life you are talking about. Might be > if you could elaborate. > > Sincerely, > Bhupendra. > > , Divakara Tanjore > <div_tan@> wrote: > > > > Dear Jamnadas, > > > > Its a very difficult question to answer, I am not an > > expert or I am not judging others but here is what I > > believe. > > > > Marriage is supposed to be a merger of two souls or > > solumates who cannot live without eachother and who > > live for eachother. it is pre-determined based on our > > karma, as I said earlier souls come to earth in groups > > with some preset blue prints. To carry out some > > actions and leran from it and marriage is one of the > > aspect of it. > > > > But in this world of never ending desires and > > ambition, people are making marriage as a means of > > convinience to survive and grow in life. > > > > Om namah shivaya, > > Divakar. > > > > --- b_jamnadas <b_jamnadas@> wrote: > > > > > Yes, but is that why people marry? > > > > > > Bhupendra? > > > , > > > Divakara Tanjore > > > <div_tan@> wrote: > > > > > > > > if we have the intention to help others we can do > > > > anything, God will show the way. > > > > > > > > Om namah shivaya, > > > > Divakar. > > > > > > > > --- b_jamnadas <b_jamnadas@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Surely Grahastya Jeevan is a "TAP", but it is, > > > but > > > > > it is certainly > > > > > not the only way to god. BTW, when talking about > > > > > SELF-LESS Service, > > > > > how does getting married fit in this picture? > > > People > > > > > certainly don't > > > > > get married to help some lonely man or women > > > they > > > > > feel sorry about. > > > > > > > > > > Sincerely, > > > > > Bhupendra. > > > > > > > > > > , > > > > > "Vijay" > > > > > <vijayyshanker@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > As I see, "Grahasthya jeevan" in itself is a > > > "TAP" > > > > > or tapasya, > > > > > > one of the most difficult tapasya, which > > > teaches > > > > > us how should we > > > > > > live a self-less life and learn to "give" > > > without > > > > > any > > > > > expectations. > > > > > > A selfless service or duty from wife to > > > husband, > > > > > husband to wife, > > > > > > parents to children or child to his/her > > > parents > > > > > and similarly our > > > > > > interactions with our own surroundings, lusts, > > > > > attractions etc. > > > > > > If we succeed in winning over our weaknesses > > > while > > > > > performing our > > > > > > duties, our tapasya is successful and that > > > should > > > > > be the only > > > > > motive > > > > > > of our lives. Our life style should be just > > > like > > > > > the Lotous (Kamal > > > > > > Ka Phool)which does not get affected by its > > > > > surroundings > > > > > > i.e. "daldal". This "daldal" could be seen as > > > a > > > > > symbolic of this > > > > > > world. "Nishkaam seva " is the only way to > > > our > > > > > "Mukti". I believe > > > > > > Yudhishter's life is a real example of > > > "niskaam > > > > > seva" while > > > > > > fulfilling all the worldly duties and > > > > > responsibilities. > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards. > > > > > > Vijay Shanker > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > > > > "b_jamnadas" > > > > > > <b_jamnadas@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Divakar Ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are various paths to god, lets just > > > agree > > > > > to that. The > > > > > point > > > > > > > is that in our lives, we go thru so many > > > > > different experiences, > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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