ISKCON Solidarity Ki Jaya!

[Guest guest]

My Dear Vaisnavas,

Please accept my humble obeisances.

All glories to His Divine Grace Srila Prabhupada.

 

Our KK Desai's rhetorical prowess is indeed

amazing. Sometimes I think the KK stands for

"Kesava Kasmiri," the digvijaya pandit. We

have to remember though in this connection

that the mighty conquering pandit who caused

all the local Navadvipa pandits to leave town

was completely conquered by Nimai Pandit.

 

Krishna Kant is so powerful in the art of argument that he

can argue a case unlimitedly even when he has not a shred

of evidence to support his case. This is called expertise,

amazing expertise. Srila Prabhupada one time said that we

should know our opponent's arguments so well that we can defeat

our own position by using their arguments. I sometimes do mock

debates with my wife where I take the ritvik position and argue

against the Guru Parampara position. However, she's a pretty

fierce debater. I usually get heavily smashed.

 

So it is a fact that I admire and and am fascinated by Krishna

Kant's talent. In fact I am using what I have learned from debating

with him to more effectively argue against Mayavadis, Scientists,

pseudo-Christians, etc. Thank you, Krishna Kant, you are helping

my preaching.

 

My bone of contention with "Kesava Kasmiri" is

that he is calling me a deviator from Srila Prabhupada

because I am initiating disciples. Srila Prabhupada

clearly instructed that he wanted his disciples to become

initiating acharyas. The truth of this remains whether the

GBC upholds it or not, or how they uphold it. (It can be

noted here that the GBC does agree with me that I have

the right and the duty to initiate disciples.) I have an

order from my Guru Maharaja and I must faithfully execute it.

Bas. "Kesava Kasmiri" is accusing me of being a deviator.

I have every right to defend myself against his attack.

 

We can bring numerous proofs from Prabhupada's instructions.

Instead of hearing submissively what Srila Prabhupada has

said Krishna Kant will cut apart Srila Prabhupada's words

and rearrange them to suit his position. This is not the

proper mood for a follower of Srila Prabhupada. I take Srila

Prabhupada's words as they are, not as they are interpreted

by Krishna Kant.

 

One very effective propaganda technique that he employs

is to give the example of one ISKCON guru after another

who went astray. I have to admit I share the same disgusted

feelings that Krishna Kant has in this regard. I can also

laugh and cry with him about gurus flying on broomsticks, etc.

 

However, this is not a valid argument. There were many

disciples of Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati who tried and failed

to properly execute the position of guru. This is no

way discredited the legitimacy of our Srila Prabhupada.

Just because many ISKCON gurus went astray doesn't mean

that they are all necessarily bad. Everyone has to be judged

on their own individual merits or demerits. Anyone who

purely follows Srila Prabhupada will become a powerful link in the

chain of disciplic succession. This is what Srila Prabhupada

wants. This is what will continue for the next 10,000 years.

The dogs may bark, but the caravan will pass.

 

Hare Krishna! ISKCON solidarity ki jaya!

 

Hoping this meets you in good health,

Always your humble servant,

Sankarshan Das Adhikari

 

====================================================

Contact Information:

Ph: 1-512-835-2121

Mail: ISKCON, 10700 Jonwood Way, Austin, Texas 78753 USA

 

 

 

 

 

Krishna Desai [kkdesai (AT) vsnl (DOT) net]

Tuesday, February 10, 2004 1:02 PM

Samba (das) SDG; Initiations in ISKCON

RE: May be you will find something interesting

 

 

 

Dear Vaisnavas,

 

Please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada.

It is interesting that Samba prabhu thinks that it is very clear that

the parampara should continue in the 'natural way that it has

done for millenia'. Maybe he can tell us what this method is:

 

Is it:

 

1) That ANY sannyasi can become a Diksa Guru merely by virtue of being a

Sannyasi, which Samba prabhu appears to be agreeing with now.

2) Or is it that anyone who simply thinks that they 'know the science of

Krishna consciousness' can automatically become a Diksa Guru, as put

forward by Sankarsana prabhu.

3) Or maybe it is the system where, the disciple in the PRESENCE of his

own Diksa Guru becomes a Diksa Guru, which is the system which

Jayadvaita Maharaja believes in.

4) Or maybe it is the system whereby only those who get the necessary

number

of votes from the GBC become Diksa Gurus.

 

ETC. ETC.

 

The reality is that the system is so 'clear' that no one is able to

present a clear non-contradictory position paper, except it seems the

IRM with "The Final Order". The GBC cannot decide which of their 3

contradictory papers are correct. The members of this conference

definitely don't seem to agree with ANY of the GBC's position papers,

and neither with each other it seems. The only thing some of the

participants seem to be agreed on is that SOMEHOW

or other they be allowed to be Gurus and take disciples, with no

consensus on exactly HOW and WHEN Srila Prabhupada authorized this

activity to occur.

 

I see no logic that dictates that the individual opinion of Samba

prabhu, or the individual opinion of Sankarsana prabhu, is more worthy

of discussion than that of the 'managing authority' of ISKCON. And if as

Samba Prabhu says, lets forget the GBC because their position CANNOT be

defended, then how can anyone at the same criticize the IRM for not

submitting to the GBC,

and hence being 'outside' ISKCON? If the GBC do not have a position that

can be defended, then it must also be reasonable for the IRM to NOT be

following a GBC which is deviating?

 

Thank You,

 

Your servant,

Krishnakant

 

 

 

 

 

Samba (das) SDG [samba.SDG (AT) pamho (DOT) net]

Monday, February 09, 2004 11:52 AM

Initiations in ISKCON

May be you will find something interesting

 

Very nice texts, thank you prabhu.

 

Its very clear that Srila Prabhupada intended the parampara to continue

on

in the natural way that it has done for millenia.

 

No need to concoct some new theory based on the flimsy evidence of some

latter day letters, when the evidence from all over Srila Prabhupadas

books

CLEARLY indicates that the parampara system will go on.

 

In one sense the irm would be pretty harmless if they just stuck to

preaching Krsna Consciousness and distributing Srila Prabhupadas books,

because by reading those books people will do what they feel is right,

and

if they become convinced to surrender to someone who inspires them to

take

initiation, then really, who is to stop it? The irm cannot stop it no

matter

how much they try (except where they are able to exert their will).

 

The problem is that in their desperation to force us to accept their

viewpoint that no one can be a diksa guru any more apart from Srila

Prabhupada, they are resorting to all kinds of vaisnava aparadhas. Of

course

ultimately no one has to worry about this except them, and those that

support the aparadhas.

 

As Maharaja pointed out, the irm's position is that according to them

the

parampara does indeed stop with Srila Prabhupada, because they will not

allow any of his disciples to carry on with the transcendental Gaudiya

family business of paramapara.

 

Anyway we can almost guarantee that they will never agree to this idea,

and

will stubornly keep on insisiting that they are right. What to do!

 

Your servant

Samba das

 

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