Srila Prabhupad is the Jagat Guru, the rest are just

[Guest guest]

Dear Krishna Priya Mataji, PAMHO. AGTSP!

 

> In principle any disciple of Srila Prabhupada CAN initiated their own

> disciples, but not within ISKCON, as they are doing now.

 

Please present a quote from Srila Prabhupada that confirms this statement.

 

> Srila Prabhupada is A LIVING ACHARYA. He was not some ghost or God. He

> came to this earth in the form of human being and he did establish the

> Ritvik system of INITIATION for ISKCON.

 

On what date did Srila Prabhupada change the temporary ritvik system into a

permanent one? Please quote the statement where he said so.

 

ys Ramakanta dasa

[Guest guest]

Hare Krishna Joey,

I do not mind you asking me question or not agreeing with me or whatever. I

do mind the socalled close disciples of Srila Prahbupada not understanding

our spiritual master though....

 

<<<<<I have one more question and then

I will bow out of this conversation. Suppose you are right, and Ritvik was

Srila Prabhupada's desire. What does it matter? He also left the GBC in

charge.>>>>>

 

The GBC was meant to carry out the instructions of Srila Prabhupada. Since

they have made themselves into 'absolute authority' of ISKCON, there seems

to be indeed very little that can be done to stop them......

 

In fact, Srila Prabhupada's worst expectations from the GBC has become

reality and it breaks the heart of any sincere follower of Srila Prabhupada

to see His Mission shattered as it is at present.

 

"What will happen when I am not here, shall everything be spoiled by GBC?"

(SP letter to Hansadutta, 11/4/72

 

* Srila Prabhupada never authorised the GBC to change any of the systems of

management he personally put in place:

 

"Resolved: The GBC (Governing Body Commission) has been established by His

Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada to represent Him in

carrying out the responsibility of managing the International Society for

Krishna Consciousness of which He is the Founder-Acharya and supreme

authority. The GBC acepts as its life and soul His divine instructions and

recognises that it is completely dependent on His Mercy in all respects. The

GBC has no other function or purpose other than to execute the instructions

so kindly given by His Divine Grace and preserve and spread His Teachings to

the world in their pure form."

(Defenition of GBC, Resolution 1, GBC minutes 1975)

 

"The system of management will continue as it is now and there is no need of

any change.

"(Srila Prabhupada's Declaration of Will, 4th June, 1977)

 

*The ritvik system was his chosen way of managing intitiations within

ISKCON. The job of the GBC is to ensure it runs smoothly, not disband it and

start their own system, and in the proces develop their own philosphy:

 

"The standards I have already given you, now try to maintain them at all

times under standard procedure. Do not try to innovate or create anything or

manufacture anything, that will ruin everything.

"(SP Letter to Bali Mardan and Pusta Krsna, 18/9/72

 

You should also know that Srila Prabhupada at one point was so upset with

the GBC for their mismanagement, that he temporarily took away all power of

control and instructed the Temple Presidents not to listen to them.

 

In my life as a Hare Krishna devotee, I have experienced that GBC have kept

all relevant information to give a clear understanding of the matter well

hidden from the view of the rank and file devotees. Everything was discussed

and kept between the elite group. Thus, in course of time, I have grown to

distrust them, proven to be misguided by them, cheated, told lies etcetera

etcetera.

 

The GBC is simply not following Srila Prabhupada. They are therefore not

really the GBC. But there is no alternative, is there? At the moment, we

still continue to preach within the movement, to make all the devotees

understand the importance of Srila Prabhupada's personal orders in re with

Diksa and GBC....

 

But if they persist in going on the wrong track, what can be done? Only Lord

Caitanya can save His Movement and thus something will happen in the future

that will make matters clear.........that is my conviction.

 

Hope this finds you well and happy in the shelter of Srila Prabhupada,

yours in Srila Prabhupada's service,

Krishnapriya devi dasi

[Guest guest]

Excuse me for butting in here prabhus.

 

Krishna Priya Mataji wrote..

In principle any disciple of Srila Prabhupada CAN

initiated their own disciples, but not within ISKCON,

as they are doing now.

 

Ramakanta asked:

Please present a quote from Srila Prabhupada that

confirms this statement.

 

"Yes, I am the Spiritual Master of this institution,

and ALL the members of the Society, they're supposed

to be MY disciples. They follow the rules and

regulations which I ask them to follow, and they are

INITIATED by me spiritually. So therefore the

Spiritual Master is called Guru. That is Sanskrit

language." (Srila Prabhupada Radio Interview March 12,

1968, San Francisco)

 

The relevant key words here are - "They follow the

rules and regulations which I ask them to follow".

This is what makes them a bona-fide member of ISKCON.

Srila Prabhupada has specifically mentioned the

principle of diksa -vidhana in his books ...

 

"One should take initiation from a bona fide spiritual

master coming in the disciplic succession, who is

authorised by his predecessor spiritual master. This

is called diksa -vidhana." (S.B. 4.8.54, purport)

 

Those that want to be diksa guru **without**

authorisation from Srila Prabhupada will NOT be

"following the rules and regulations which Srila

Prabhupada asks them to follow". Thus they are NOT

factualy ISKCON members, rather they are members of

**MAYA ISKCON**. So by their actions they leave the

shelter of Srila Prabhupada by behaving contrary to

the instructions of HDG. Thus the constant stream of

embarrassing falldowns.

 

 

 

ysmsd

 

 

 

 

--- "Ramakanta (das) HKS (PAMHO.NET SysOp) (Zurich -

CH)" <Ramakanta.HKS (AT) pamho (DOT) net> wrote:

 

> Dear Krishna Priya Mataji, PAMHO. AGTSP!

>

> > In principle any disciple of Srila Prabhupada CAN

> initiated their own

> > disciples, but not within ISKCON, as they are

> doing now.

>

> Please present a quote from Srila Prabhupada that

> confirms this statement.

>

> > Srila Prabhupada is A LIVING ACHARYA. He was not

> some ghost or God. He

> > came to this earth in the form of human being and

> he did establish the

> > Ritvik system of INITIATION for ISKCON.

>

> On what date did Srila Prabhupada change the

> temporary ritvik system into a

> permanent one? Please quote the statement where he

> said so.

>

> ys Ramakanta dasa

>

>

-----------------------

> To from this mailing list, send an email

> to:

> Initiations.in.ISKCON-Owner (AT) pamho (DOT) net

>

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Dear Madhusudana Prabhu, PAMHO. AGTSP!

 

Thank you for confirming my position that no-one can accept disciples

without authorization, even outside of ISKCON.

 

ys Ramakanta dasa