moon

[Guest guest]

> But the moon is not 94,000,000 miles away from the earth? It is (+/-)

> > 258,000 as confirmed by sastra (surya siddhanta). It is not a matter

> > of interpretation, or vieuwpoint. 258,000 bas.

 

No there are two pespectives and two models. One is your limited vision

(also depicted in SSidhanta) and one is how it is depicted in Bhagavatam

(from the point of view of deva)

 

Actually if you want to be scentific then even in science the dimentions

between two points is not always a straight line. You must know it. It

depends on the model, in relativity model -- dimentions are different to

non-relativity model. In modern phisics dimentions of small particls are

also not linear. It is an illusion to think that its ether right or

left.

 

So Prabhupada is perfect and has perfect knowledge since he is Bhagavata

and he is teaching Bhagavatam and Bhagavatam is non different

krsna-tulya from Krishna The Bhagavan.

 

Sri Caitanya Caritamrita

 

Madhya 24.318

 

krsna-tulya bhagavata — vibhu, sarvasraya

prati-sloke prati-aksare nana artha kaya

 

in every syllable of Bhagavata Purana; nana artha kaya — there are

varieties of meanings

 

Also if you remember the story how Prabhupada used to chant Bhaja Sri

Krsna Caitanya and then corrected himself and all devotees. He was

perfect in his knowledge since he follows sastra, "to know" means to

know Krsna who appears to us in the form of Bhagavatam.

 

Surya Siddhanta is just one of many siddhantas -- concepts of astronomy.

Do you need the list?

 

See what GNd wrote:

<<It is two different systems, thats why there is difference in numbers.

 

But actually it is one and the same thing, just described in two

different ways. Your mind is thinking 3 dimensions, thats why you have

problem. Answer is not in 3 dimensions. You can describe universe in

many ways. 3D is one way. There are other ways to do it. Bhagavatam is

another view on the same thing. It is not 3D view, as we perceive it

with our senses, obviously. Some say that SB describes higher

dimensional way, although this can be misleading. Higher-dimensional is

relative term, just like love or peace, or God. Higher dimensions, each

person can understand it in his own way.

>>

 

 

>

> OK it is also 1,600,000 miles above the bhu mandala as opposed to >

> 800,000 miles (the sun). So this might take some spiritual >

> understanding or realization. But 1,600,000 is still not 94,000,000 >

> bas.

>

>

> Dear Prabhu, I`m just trying to understand how Srila Prabhupada is >

> perfect. I might have committed some offences in the past, due to >

> envy, insincerity, and inexperience (I`m a neophyte), but all I`m >

> trying to do is to understand how we should understand a pure >

> devotee, and him being perfect, all knowing, tri kala jnana, above >

> the four defects etc. Now if anybody thinks we should not discuss >

> this, fine, but be so kind to explain it to this offender. Let us >

> focus on this moon "thing" but proceed with extreme caution. "Fools >

> rush in where angels fear to tread" So I`m a fool, hopefully you can >

> help me.

>

>

>

> "Rädhä-vallabha: Yes. That’s the system actually. There are some >

> other... There actually is a big department. There are about eight or

> > nine boys. They’re all getting very good. Now Jagannätha had some >

> questions on corrections in the book. In verse twenty-eight it says, >

> “Then he worshiped Çré Kåñëa, the essence of all Vedas, with this >

> hymn.” Prabhupäda: Where it is? Brahma-saàhitä?

> Rädhä-vallabha: Yes.

> Prabhupäda: What is that?

> Rädhä-vallabha: So it says, “Then he worshiped Çré Kåñëa, the essence

> > of all Vedas, with this hymn.” > Prabhupäda: Where it is?

> Rädhä-vallabha: It’s verse twenty-eight, “Then he worshiped Çré >

> Kåñëa.” So Jagannätha said it should be, “Then he worshiped...” >

> Prabhupäda: No, no. Jagannätha cannot correct. That bad habit he must

> > give up.

> Rädhä-vallabha: So we should just leave it exactly.

> Prabhupäda: Oh, yes. You should not be more educated.

> Rädhä-vallabha: He wasn’t changing any of the words. He was just... >

> Prabhupäda: Nothing of the... This of should be strictly forbidden. >

> Rädhä-vallabha: So no corrections. That makes it simple.

> Prabhupäda: They can divide the synonyms. That’s all.

> Rädhä-vallabha: Synonyms. So even...

> Prabhupäda: That is his tendency, to correct. That’s very bad. He >

> should not do that.

> Rädhä-vallabha: So I’ll just forget this, then.

> Prabhupäda: The system is: whatever authority has done, even there is

> > mistake, it should be accepted.

> Rädhä-vallabha: Oh.

> Prabhupäda: Asa-präya(?) That is ha... He should not become more >

> learned than the authority. That is very bad habit.

> Rädhä-vallabha: He was always wondering how he should think. So I’ll >

> tell him that. He thinks, “If I think I see a mistake, what should I >

> think?” I’ll tell him what you just said.

> Prabhupäda: He cannot see mistake. He is mistake. (laughter) He >

> should... That is being done by this rascal. I don’t want. And the >

> Hayagréva has..., the Easy Journey, he has changed so many things. >

> That... He is now bad character. You should not maintain him."

>

> "Prabhupäda: So Jagannätha-süta should be strictly advised not to >

> become very learned to correct authorities. No.

> Rädhä-vallabha: Jagannätha däsa.

> Prabhupäda: Jagannätha? He is Jagannätha-süta or where he is?

> Rädhä-vallabha: Jagannätha-süta is Back to Godhead. Jagannätha däsa >

> is Sanskrit.

> Prabhupäda: Oh. That’s it. He should not be very learned.

> Rädhä-vallabha: I think that instruction you gave will help him very >

> much about even if he thinks there is some mistake, just forget about

> > it. Prabhupäda: He is mistake. He should not think his authority >

> mistake. Rädhä-vallabha: He didn’t know what he should do. He didn’t >

> know... Prabhupäda: So why he should be given this business? He’s >

> such irresponsible man. He should not be given any responsible work. >

> Our first business should see how he is advanced in devotion. We >

> don’t want so-called scholars. Rädhä-vallabha: They just leave us. >

> Prabhupäda: Leave, I don’t mind. Just like he became a big scholar. >

> Tamäla Kåñëa: Nitäi.

> Prabhupäda: Nitäi, he’s a rascal.

> Tamäla Kåñëa: Big rascal.

> Prabhupäda: I think that Jagannätha is within his group? Nitäi? >

> Rädhä-vallabha: Jagannätha was somewhat affected by Nitäi, but >

> he’s... Prabhupäda: I know that.

> Rädhä-vallabha: I think he understands what the problem was. I think >

> he understands what his problem was, and that’s why he won’t do >

> anything without asking you.

> Prabhupäda: Don’t allow him to do anything.

> Rädhä-vallabha: Well, now that this system of no corrections

> anywhere, that makes it very simple. Then he can’t do anything. I >

> don’t think he wants to, either. It makes it more simple for him. It >

> makes him very uncomfortable. Prabhupäda: No corrections. He can >

> write that synonym, that’s all, according to the translation. Who is >

> writing the synonym?

> Rädhä-vallabha: Jagannätha.

> Prabhupäda: That’s all right. According to the translation. Not that >

> he becomes a greater scholar than my Guru Mahäräja."Room Conversation

> > -- > February 27, 1977, Mäyäpura

>

>

> "Prabhupäda: You can criticize, if you are right. You cannot

> criticize wrongly."Room Conversation--Våndävana, March 16, 1974, >

> (new98)

>

> "Regarding the scientists, we have entrusted our own three scientists

> > namely Svarupa Damodara, Sadaputa, and Madhva and we leave the

> matter > to them, we do not say anything ourselves, but are leaving it

> to > them."Letter to: Dr. W.H. Wolf-Rottkay

>

> "Prabhupäda: True or nontrue, I am layman. I am saying that if the >

> moon is rising from this side and going to this side, so sun is also >

> rising from this side and going to this side. So if the moon is >

> moving, the sun is moving.

> Tamäla Kåñëa: Common sense.

> Prabhupäda: Huh? Yes, I am a layman. Actually sun is moving, but they

> > say fixed up."Morning Walk--March 18, 1976, Mäyäpura

>

> Can we just simply expalin this away by vaisnava humility?

>

> ys MGd

>

>

>

>

> --

> Chandigarh

> 14 October, 1976

> > > Dear Madhu Gopal Prabhuji,

> > > Please accept my humble obeisances, all Glories to Srila

> > > Prabhupada.

> > > >

> > > > Thank you for your intteligently written letter. I must >

> > > > admit, > > > --

> > > > For now I refrain from commenting on your wonderfull qoutes >

> > > > > > > concerning Rahu, since I prefer, for sake of simpicity

> > > > (let`s > > > > keep it simple), to focus on the moon

> > > > subject. If you insist > > > > though, I will be glad to

> > > > comment anyway.

> > >

> > > Yes. For the sake of THIS discussion please comment on **** > >

> > > > selected below. Please.

> > >

> > > > 3 Srimad Bhagavatam 4.29.69:

> > > > Krsna consciousness means constantly associating with the >

> > > > Supreme > > > > Personality of Godhead ****in such a mental

> > > > state that the > > > > devotee can observe the cosmic

> > > > manifestation exactly as the > > > > Supreme Personality of

> > > > Godhead does****. Such observation is > > > > ****not always

> > > > possible, but it becomes manifest exactly like > the > > > >

> > > > dark planet known as Rahu, which is observed in the presence >

> > > > of > > > > the full moon.****

>

> > He does not adress the fact that Mother Yasoda is

> > seeing the universe. He goes on the help us to explain how we can >

> > > get out of this hell hole. To me it seems abvious that although >

> > > Mother Yasoda sees the whole cosmic manifestation, she might not >

> > > know how far away the moon is from the earth.

>

>

> Dear Madhu Gopal Prabhuji

>

> Here is my take on it.

>

> As the saying goes, 'having started on the dance it is no use to draw

> > close the veil.'

>

> An English king introduced the unit of measurement, yard. William of >

> Malmsebury wrote -- yard was the "measure of his (the king's) own >

> arm," So (our example) Henry wanted to have everything in this world >

> to be measured by his own measurements. "Imperial" units.

>

> We are also used to the idea of measuring "universally" the Universe >

> using our own limited "selves" as a unit. (That will remain your >

> perspective and I don't expect you to change it just by reading this >

> text.)

>

> This world is relative and that also means there is birth and death. >

> The death is nothing but our payback time for the fact that we belong

> > to this world and measure it by our "own arms". If only we were to >

> measure it with Gods measurements we would not have to be subjected >

> to birth and death as well as see the Universe as His own, the >

> virat-rupa form.

>

> Keeping in mind that ultimate approximation which is considerable if >

> you ask me I will try to explain the issue of Rahu and its >

> relationship with Moon and Sun.

>

> Of course there is also a perspective of modern science (Decarts >

> model) or a universally measurable space that is but an abstraction >

> of "self-centered" model, that was interestingly resulting from more >

> modern theological concepts after Reformation.

>

> As I have said there are different models and principles of

> methodology which not specific to the area of cosmology, but also to >

> spirituality. Not only they are different, but even if applied to >

> cosmology produce different perspectives and even measurements.

>

> To someone who is trained or otherwise fixed in "self-centered" >

> paradigm and is not ready to paradigm shift an allegorical >

> explanation of the scriptures dealing with Vedic cosmogony is often >

> recommended. Some aspects of Bhagavatam can be explained as allegory >

> thus "self-centered" intellect is not offended by acceptance of >

> unconceivable, achintya.

>

> On the other hand it is not the purpose of Bhagavatam. Purpose of >

> Bhagavatam is to actually achieve Kingdom of God. So obviously >

> humility will be required and that will include acceptance of the >

> authority of the knowledge coming from Bhagavatam itself over the >

> authority of the senses or ones self-centered concepts.

>

> The Bhagavatam refers to the sun, the moon, and the planet Rahu, as >

> persons. Srimad Bhagavatam 4.29.69: "Krsna consciousness means >

> constantly associating with the Supreme Personality of Godhead in >

> such a mental state that the devotee can observe the cosmic >

> manifestation exactly as the Supreme Personality of Godhead does." >

> Everything - the Earth, the moon, the stars, the planets - has a >

> personal conception. In the background of what we can perceive with >

> our dull senses, everything that is said to be matter, there must be >

> a personal conception. There are so many statements on the cosmology >

> of the universe in the scriptures. The spiritually developed men of >

> former times, used to see everything as consciousness. They saw that >

> the shadow is also conscious. The shadow, abhasa, is also considered >

> to be a stage of consciousness. Only through that shadowy stage of >

> consciousness can we come to the material conception of a thing. >

> Before we reach the conception of a shadow, we must pass through some

> > mental stage, and personification may be attached to that mental >

> stage. The personification of the shadow may be referred to as >

> "Rahu."

> "devotee can observe the cosmic manifestation exactly as the Supreme >

> Personality of Godhead does. Such observation is not always possible,

> > but it becomes manifest exactly like the dark planet known as Rahu,

> > which is observed in the presence of the full moon."

>

> Did Srila Prabhupada think the so-called "story" of the origin of >

> planet Rahu, as told in the Srimad-Bhagavatam, was merely >

> allegorical? Not merely, but can be taken as allegorical to the >

> degree that one needs it. "I must try to answer to your satisfaction.

> > Yes, sometimes in Vedas such things like the asura's decapitated

> head > chasing after Candraloka is explained allegorically. .... There

> are > many things which do not corroborate with the so-called modern >

> science." (Letter to Krsnadasa, Vrindaban, Nov. 7, 1972. You should >

> always pay attention to details: "I must try to answer to your >

> satisfaction." If one is not on the level of being able to "observe >

> the cosmic manifestation exactly as the Supreme Personality of >

> Godhead does" one must be answered according to ones realization.

>

> I'm sure Prabhupada knew...