Guest guest Posted September 23, 2005 Report Share Posted September 23, 2005 Content-Type: message/partial; total=3; id="01C5BFEA.2B0641D0@Vaikunta"; number=1 "solai" <solai (AT) pamho (DOT) net> "Braja Sevaki TKG" <Braja.Sevaki.TKG (AT) pamho (DOT) net>, "Basu Ghosh \(das\) ACBSP \(Baroda - IN\)" <Basu.Ghosh.ACBSP (AT) pamho (DOT) net>, "Bhavananda \(das\) ACBSP" <Bhavananda.ACBSP (AT) pamho (DOT) net>, "Pancaratna ACBSP" <Pancaratna.ACBSP (AT) pamho (DOT) net>, "Ambarisa prabhu" <abford (AT) earthlink (DOT) net>, "Jahnu \(Dvipa das JPS\) \(Mayapur - IN\)" <Jahnu (AT) pamho (DOT) net>, "Sadbhuja das \(Mayapur\)" <Sadbhuja.das (AT) pamho (DOT) net>, "India \(Continental Committee\) Open \(Forum\)" <India.Open (AT) pamho (DOT) net> References: <10420582 (AT) pamho (DOT) net> Re: Response to Solai's letter on Chakra Fri, 23 Sep 2005 08:22:25 +0530 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00DF_01C5C018.44BE7DD0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00DF_01C5C018.44BE7DD0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable -=20 "Braja Sevaki TKG" <Braja.Sevaki.TKG (AT) pamho (DOT) net> "Basu Ghosh (das) ACBSP (Baroda - IN)" <Basu.Ghosh.ACBSP (AT) pamho (DOT) net>; "Bhavananda (das) ACBSP" <Bhavananda.ACBSP (AT) pamho (DOT) net>; "Pancaratna = ACBSP" <Pancaratna.ACBSP (AT) pamho (DOT) net>; "Ambarisa prabhu" <abford (AT) earthlink (DOT) net>; "Jahnu (Dvipa das JPS) (Mayapur - IN)" <Jahnu (AT) pamho (DOT) net>; "Sadbhuja das (Mayapur)" <Sadbhuja.das (AT) pamho (DOT) net>; "solai" <solai (AT) pamho (DOT) net>; "India (Continental Committee) Open (Forum)" <India.Open (AT) pamho (DOT) net> Wednesday, September 21, 2005 8:43 AM Response to Solai's letter on Chakra > MINOR > The Long Term Impact of Criticizing the /\ Mission of the = Founder-acarya > = ______________________ Mataji says, > The temptation to ignore the complaints of "Solai" ("The Long Term = Impact > Of > Urbanizing Mayapur," Chakra, September 19 2005) is a strong one. Yet = when > Srila Prabhup=E4da's mission and followers are criticized in an = attempt to > justify one's viewpoint, it becomes a matter of necessity rather than > choice > to ignore such criticism and speak on behalf of Srila Prabhup=E4da. In = his > final Vyasa-puja offering to Srila Prabhup=E4da, HH Tamal Krishna = Goswami > asked the question: "Who speaks for Srila Prabhup=E4da?" His answer = was that > everyone has their place, and our contributions to the mission of = Srila > Prabhup=E4da, even while riddled with faults, should be taken into > consideration. > > Yet while Solai's interest in the ecological impact constitutes a = great > portion of his text, his points are based on the faulty misconception = that > the pursuit of fulfilling the spiritual master's desires is a burden = to > certain aspects of society, and should be reconsidered so as not to = upset > the status quo of the street and the ecological balance of the area, = which > is, I'm informed, a shifting balance, and one that the Sri M=E4y=E4pur = Project > staff have taken into consideration in their years and years of = research > into the construction of the Temple of the Vedic Planetarium: Srila > Prabhup=E4da's dream for Sri M=E4y=E4pur-dh=E4ma. Can anyone come forward to publicly disclose how much money has been = spent or wasted so far on this preoperative feasibility studies? Do you know = it is mind boggling! Our main mission is preaching and book distribution. Traditionally we have simple places of worship, temple worship is less important in our sampradaya, do we wish to depart from this tradition = and convert ISKCON devotees in to labors to build magical temples in the guise of fulfilling SP's mission? SP our beloved spiritual master also gave us a loop hole, adapt to changing needs and circumstances intelligently, can we not use this liberty in this issue? If we are serious in our environment and sustainability concerns, we = should Prove it first by maintaining the Bath rooms in the ground floor of = Chakra or Long building to the acceptable standards of our Authorities.=20 Why the authorities should maintain locked bathrooms, near the MP office = in the second floor of long building? It is obvious that filth is not tolerable to vested interests and the = common laymen=20 devotee should endure this filthy environment. We want to cage ourselves in a green, clean environment and not bothered = about others. This is the logic of sustainability of SMPDC authorities. Our greatest achievement is, we have built long rows of toilets on the = banks of mother Ganges during last year's GP festivals! we were concerned about the spread of deadly disease like Calera etc=20 and provided Bath rooms in the river bank for public use, an NGO = activity! The cause of this pathetic situation is, ISKCON promoted unsustainable = tourism in the Dham. I have completely studied the report prepared by ENVIRON, these = proposals will never work and will never be implemented by ISKCON, If any one = wants to know why, I can elaborate and substantiate my claims scientifically with = the help from "The Indian Institute Science", Bangalore. There are several acharyas and spiritual masters every where, if their disciples start implementing the fanatical desires of their achryas = against the law of the land in a democratic country, it will create havoc in the society. Mataji says, > I'm not qualified to respond to ecological issues, but I'm certainly = sure > that offensive doesn't fall into the category of "uniting us all and > understanding that our strength lay in differences" that Tamal Krishna > Goswami was referring to when he spoke of everyone being encouraged to > contribute. > > Solai writes: > > Authorities in ISKCON are not willing to take the local population > or other Vaishnava communities in to confidence to establish the > need for such a massive temple and infrastructural facilities. > > The "need" for such a massive temple is not dependent on the whims or > opinion of local villagers who remain mostly ignorant of the mission = of > Lord Caitanya-an ignorance that other maths have found just as = difficult > to > address as ISKCON. Nor is Srila Prabhup=E4da's mission dependent upon = the > approval of maths run by his godbrothers. This statement shows a = complete > lack of knowledge of Srila Prabhup=E4da's history with his own = godbrothers, > and his entire life purpose. Is it too much to expect that one who is = so > determined to make public statements might be armed with knowledge = first? We are part of a democratic society, we cannot arrogantly assume that = others are ignorant, it applies to us also! I am not boasting I am = knowledgeable, But I know I have wisdom and intuition! Data---> When organized leads to Information--- when assimilated leads to Knowledge--- condensed through expertise leads to Wisdom!!!!! Gathering knowledge is never ending, we can be sure our knowledge is infinitesimally small compared to the world of knowledge. (There is a = saying in Tamil "Katrathu Kaiman alavu, Kalathathu ulgalavu!) Vedanta literarily means the end of Knowledge, and we are continuously studying Vedanta with the hope of reaching the end! > After ISKCON invested so much of money on infrastructure in the > past, the level of filth and pollution increased manifold. ISKCON > attracted tourists and the local people lured by the opportunity > established business catering to them. Wine, women and meat entered > the market. This trend will be accelerated by the new temple > project, if this is the ultimate result of such hard work of ISKCON > devotees, do we need it? What other great purpose it is going to > serve? The land is already holy, how can new temples make it holier? Mataji Says, > First we are asked to believe that the presence of ISKCON in the holy > dh=E4ma > was the cause of "wine, women, and meat" in M=E4y=E4pur. A more naive = remark I > would be hard-pressed to find. Here we are being asked to believe an > unfounded statement that prior to ISKCON's creation, no such sinful > activity > would have possibly existed here. Even if it didn't at the time = (something > that is almost inconceivable, but an allowance I'll make for the sake = of > argument), was the arrival of these elements only because of ISKCON, = or > might it have had something to do with the influence of Kali-yuga? In > fact, > the point Solai makes is that ISKCON is to blame for the advancement = of > Kali-yuga: a statement that flies in the face of the entire mission = and > purpose of Srila Prabhup=E4da. I have missed the relative term- entered the market "in a big way" My contention is, ISKCON is promoting tourism and the consequent damage = to the spiritual and environmental sustainability of the Dham. It is simply = urbanizing the Dham. You have to study the environment from the point of pre and post ISKCON = era. This will clearly indicate the contribution by ISKCON for the damage to = the environment. I will forward the research paper submitted by the eminent Prof. K.N. Mukerge Retired head of the Dept. of Geography, City College, Calcutta, retired lecturer of the Dept. of Geography, University of Calcutta, Secretary of ILEE and Director of the Research Cell of Sri Caitanya Research Institute, Calcutta, in this = regard. We are accelerating and inviting Kali to settle in the Dham by our = fanatical desires against the law of the land with the excuse of fulfilling the = desire of our founder acharya. > > What other great purpose it is going to serve? The land is already > holy, how can new temples make it holier? > > Here it might serve some purpose to post so many quotes on "what great > purpose" this temple will serve, according to Srila Prabhup=E4da and = our > previous acaryas, and according to scripture. These quotes might go a = long > way in helping to explain what this holy land exists for, and why Sri > Caitanya Mah=E4prabhu came here, and what He came to establish. For = the sake > of brevity, I'll exclude these quotes, which I'm sure most have either > seen > before, or have access to via Folio or publications by Srila = Prabhup=E4da > and > those who represent his institution. Suffice to say, Solai's = speculation > that Srila Prabhup=E4da might be content to leave things as they are = and be > satisfied that we are the most successful math on this road seem more = than > just a little far-fetched. > I have the right to speculate because we are pursuing a minor(may be = major to others!) priority of SP against the law of the land. I will go one = step further to claim that our activities are illegal in this regard and as a citizen of India, I have the constitutional right to defend on the preservation of Mayapur from abuse by vested interests. I wish to point out, why Mataji has conveniently ignored on the Black = money transaction and binami trusts of the land department and SMPDC to = mobilize funds for the new temple? Do you want proof? > Ignorant of our founder-acarya's mission and purpose; content to = ignore > the > teachings and mission of our disciplic succession; oblivious to the > reasons > for the descent of the Supreme Lord in this age---perhaps those who = labor > under the burden of these afflictions should consider that their best > avenue > might be silence. In that way, they might offend less and learn more. = In > the > ensuing silence, an avenue of proper approach may reveal itself to = them. > If > one's desire is to truly better the actions of the institution he is > addressing, they would do well to remember that criticism will turn an = ear > deaf more swiftly than they realize. > I fully agree on this view point, I also understand silence will pacify these emotional issues in my heart, One point still not clear to me is, = how I am offending the Vaishnava's in my presentations? May be I have to substantiate and be humble with the logic, that I am lacking spiritual = Sadana=20 and I do not have the locus standing to project this issue, as per my = daughter Vaikuntha Lakshmi dd.=20 I do not want to stop with criticism, I want to escalate it to the court of law if ISKCON gets the proposal approved by the state Government. Also I am inviting eminent environmentalists and media = people to project it to the world community during the next festival in the year = 2006. May be ISKCON has the might and clout to face it, but I am sure = environmental=20 issues are more dominant than the whims and fancies of devotees as per = the existing environmental protection laws of India. I have also consulted eminent lawyers and environmentalists in this regard and their opinion is = favorable to my views. > Our mission is not to restore the forests and bring back the tigers: = one > who > pursues such noble ideals would be well advised to seek a zoological > society > whose values they can embrace. Until then, despite the obvious desire = some > have to see M=E4y=E4pur maintain its status quo, the mission of Lord = Caitanya > and His most beloved associates and followers will continue---with or > without us. > Ok. But do you agree that our mission is, not to abuse the environment? I wish to live with nature and pursue KC. Simple living and high = thinking,=20 I will add sustainable livelihoods also! It may be a Zoological society as you have suggested. I am getting lot of mails every day on this issue, so many devotees are having similar hidden feelings like me on this project. Most of the devotees are replying anonymously, indicating the threat to their = survival in the movement. The vested interests are so powerful and strong and my daughter advises me, they will kill you or dislodge you from Mayapur=20 if you are writing like this!=20 So many devotees are appreciating me for bringing out this issue = fearlessly. My objective is to expose the facts of the project proposal and I wish ISKCON to share information on this project with the devotee community = in a transparent manner, if they believe they have a strong case to present = in favor of urbanizing Mayapur. In case if any one wish to review lateral opinions on this issue I can forwards the mails sent to me by devotees in this regard. May be soon I = will upload it to my website or blogger space. Your servant, Solai allies Shyammurty das Camp: Belgaum ------=_NextPart_000_00DF_01C5C018.44BE7DD0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; = charset=3Dwindows-1252"> <META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2900.2722" name=3DGENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff> <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT><FONT face=3DArial = size=3D2></FONT><FONT=20 face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT><FONT face=3DArial = size=3D2></FONT><BR>----- Original=20 Message ----- <BR>"Braja Sevaki TKG" <<A=20 href=3D"Braja.Sevaki.TKG (AT) pamho (DOT) net">Braja.Sevaki.TKG (AT) pamho (DOT) net</A>= ><BR>To:=20 "Basu Ghos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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