Guru Parampara ki!jay

[Guest guest]

Dear Tripada Prabhu, PAMHO. AGTSP!

 

Thank you for your quotes. But as you may have already noticed, it is not

possible the defeat IRM members by quoting Srila Prabhupada. Even if you

could present a signed written document from Srila Prabhupada saying

"Herewith I authorize XYZ Swami to ge guru and initiate disciples", they

would not accept it. They would say the by "guru" Srila Prabhupada meant

"siksa-guru" any by "initiate disciples" he meant "initiate disciples as

ritviks".

 

Better you defeat them by their own arguments. In the beginning of "The

Final Order" is a very good argument against the ritvik theory:

 

"Anyone who knew Srila Prabhupada would often note his meticulous nature.

His fastidious attention to every detail of his devotional service was one

of Srila Prabhupada's most distinguishing characteristics; and for those who

served him closely, was profound evidence of his deep love and devotion to

Lord Sri Krsna. His whole life was dedicated to carrying out the order of

his spiritual master, Srila Bhaktisiddhanta, and in that duty he was

uncannily vigilant. He left nothing to chance, always correcting, guiding

and chastising his disciples in his effort to establish ISKCON. His mission

was his life, he even said ISKCON was his body.

 

It would certainly have been entirely out of character for Srila Prabhupada

to leave an important issue, such as the future of initiation in his

cherished society, up in the air, ambiguous, or in any way open to debate or

speculation." (End of quote)

 

In his books, lectures and letters Srila Prabhupada many times said that the

disciple becomes the next guru. But in his books, lectures and letters Srila

Prabhupada never described a post-samadhi ritvik system. And he gave the

instruction that we should read his books. He also gave the instruction that

we must always compare guru with sadhu and sastra. Further, in our

sampradaya since at least Madhvacarya, the disciple became the next guru

after the departure of the guru. So if Srila Prabhupada as a meticulous

person really wanted the ritvik system to be continued after his departure,

then he would have at least once given the clear, I repeat, clear

instruction that the ritvik system introduced in 1971 or so is to be

continued after his departure.

 

IRM cannot present such a clear instruction, preferably in writing. The

phrase "must be my disciple" in the testament is not that clear instruction,

as expected from a meticulous person. Neither the oral statement "I shall

recommend some of you to act as officiating acaryas". And the July 9th

letter neither introduced the ritvik system nor does it say when it should

stop.

 

ys Ramakanta dasa

[Guest guest]

 "The guru must be situated on the topmost platform of

devotional service. There are three classes of

devotees, and the guru must be accepted from the

topmost class." (C.c. Madhya, 24.330, purport)

 

 

 

 

--- "Tripada (das) (Split - HR)" <Tripada (AT) pamho (DOT) net>

wrote:

 

> Notice Srila Prabhupada says: “I am (in) the

> initiator guru”, not “I am (in)

> one of the initiator gurus”. Do you have a statement

> from Srila Prabhupada

> indicating that he had authorised hundreds of diksa

> gurus, or latent diksa

> gurus? If not then you have failed to challenge

> point a). The onus is on you

> to prove there was someone else, apart from Srila

> Prabhupada, who he

> established as initiator/s within ISKCON. The burden

> of proof is on you, not

>

>

> "Everyone can, whoever is initiated,

> he is

> competent to make disciples. But as a

> matter of

> etiquette they do not do so in the

> presence of

> their spiritual master. This is the

> etiquette.

> Otherwise, they are competent. They

> can make

> disciples and spread they are

> competent to make

> disciples."

>

> Detroit, July 18, 1971

>

>

-----------------------

> To from this mailing list, send an email

> to:

> Initiations.in.ISKCON-Owner (AT) pamho (DOT) net

>

 

 

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