beatting women

[Guest guest]

> In one sense, how can Vedas advocate protection of the women,

> and the sametime making a provision for beating them. You protect someone,

> and then you smack the person on the head; the pieces just doesn't match

> together.

 

This is interesting conclusion. Why would protecting one mean that you make

him/her/it feel good momentarily? And why would using physical force exclude

protection. Not to cause more disturbance to already enough disturbed female

members, lets switch to child protection. For example, it was a common

practice in schools, not so long ago, to punish children physically. And it

was ment to educate and protect them. Mother Yasoda surely scared Krsna by

showing him a stick, and why would he cry because of seeing a stick? If I

show stick to my kids, they just lough at me, they take it as a joke. So, in

the past, there must have been something else in the mind of children, to

make them cry upon seeing a stick... Anyway, there are numerous details of

protecting with educational punishment. Like from certain Nimai-lila:

 

"This naughty boy has spoiled the offering." When Jagannatha Misra heard

this he prepared to beat the boy in anger, but he was stopped by the

brahmana's request.

>>> Ref. VedaBase => CBP 5: Eating the Mendicant Brahmana's Offerings

 

or

Everyone present tried to restrain Misra, but he said, "Leave me alone.

Today I'll beat Him!"

>>> Ref. VedaBase => CB Adi-khanda 5.71

 

or

"Misra, you are supposed to be a cultured Aryan! What is the use of beating

this ignorant boy?

COMMENTARY

The brahmana said, "O Misra, you are elderly and respectable, and He is only

a foolish child. So it is not worth while to punish Him for His

foolishness."

>>> Ref. VedaBase => CB Adi-khanda 5.39

 

 

So maybe in some "cultured" parts of the world there is jail punishment for

strictness in physical way. But in many parts of the world it is not so

black/white. I come from southern europe and it seems that I can see things

a bit differently then Canadian or US born devotees.

 

I'm more disturbed by this artificial sentimentalism, then violence in the

name of protection. Domesting violence, as they like to call it nowadays,

was usual part of life for a long time, even to the point, that it is

mentioned in sastras. This is not at all disturbing to me. It doesn't mean,

that I will beat my wife and kids now, but also I will not get on case and

blaspheme devotees, who want to discuss this things. Using force in

education was there in time of Krsna and Caitanya, it is there nowadays, and

it will be there even after western artificial sentimentalism is long gone.

It is a way to educate and protect. And what disturbs me, is that some

people now make a real big thing out of it, like it is most sinful and

anybody doing it deserves to go to jail, or at least be thrown out of

ISKCON. Like queen Kunti, who put her own child in basket and sent him down

the river. If any woman would nowadays do this, put her newborn child in

basked and send it down the river, she would be considered crazy, charged of

attempted murder, and put to jail for eternity. Thats what I call artificial

western sentimentalism. Everybody is so careful, that everybody is happy and

feeling good... Cheating, just cheating!

 

Anyway, I can see that such subjects cause strong emotions to surface, so I

will not push it any further here. Basically, this subject seems to be just

another on a long list of undefined ISKCON (mis)understandings. And untill

ISKCON comes up with some unified decision for us how to view on this

things, everybody is mercilessly left on his own with his own opinion. We

may fight about it, who is right, but it is useless. Rather I suggest, that

leaders come up with some ISKCON law regarding this subject, and then it

will be simple - either one is with ISKCON, or one distances himself from

ISKCON.

 

your servant Giri-nayaka das

 

 

> The whole idea varies from culture to culture. Certain places,

> especially in some States in US, like California, if you dare touch a

> woman in an aggresive way, not to talk of beating her, by law, you will go

> to jail.

>

> It's better we are cool-headed and not be strong-headed in showing our

> machoness, just because we are male. A brahmana does not see a woman, a

> sudra, a cow, a dog or a dog-eater, rather he sees the spirit soul

> dwelling in all bodies. Srila Prabhupada said, in Krishna consciousness

> movement, we are trying to create brahmanas.

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 12/7/2005 11:01:11 PM Pacific Standard Time,

Indrani.BCS (AT) pamho (DOT) net writes:

Maybe you should be beating up, killing others in the vedic sense means to

equals and not to fysical weaker persons.

 

You should give protection and only then a woman can surrender and not

otherwise.

 

Your servant,

Indrani dasi .

very good Mataji , I am glad some ladies are speaking out, to beat a woman is

a great offence, especially if she is a vaisnavi it is vaisnava aparadha, and

it will never please Sri Sri Radha and Krsna