Official Ramakanta vs. IRM discussion thread

[Guest guest]

Posted by Yaduraja on Feb 28, 2006:

 

Dear Ramakanta Prabhu,

PAMHO. AGTSP!

 

> I wrote: "Note that although ISKCON has been incorporated in 1966, it

> already existed in 1965."

>

> This is confirmed by Srila Prabhupada:

>

> "After struggling for one year, in 1966 I incorporated this Krishna

> consciousness, International Society for Krishna Consciousness." (Lecture

> on November 10, 1971)

>

> "And thus this movement was started in 1965 from New York." (Lecture on

> March 2, 1975)

>

> You surely agree that by "this movement" Srila Prabhupada meant ISKCON.

 

No. He is not referring to the legal entity called the The International

Society for Krishna Consciousness. I have already explained all this and

presented my evidence:

 

"It is just a comparison, a little comparison, but this Krishna

consciousness movement was started, practically, from 1967. I went there in

1965, and for one year I could not do anything. In 1966 this movement was

registered in New York, and from 1966 it is spreading". (Lecture Nov 8th

1972)

 

"So in 1965 I first came in New York. Then in 1966 this society was

regularly registered in New York, and from 1967 this movement is regularly

going on in America, Europe, Canada, and south of Pacific Ocean, Australia,

and throughout the whole world." (Lecture July 12 1975)

 

"Since I came to your country in 1965... Of course, for one year I was

travelling here and there, but in 1966 I established first my class in New

York at 26 Second Avenue". (lecture April 29th 1969)

 

"So I came here in September, 1965. Then, for one year, I was travelling in

many parts of your country. In the beginning I was in Pennsylvania,

Pittsburgh, and then I went to Philadelphia. Then I came to New York. And in

this way I was travelling, not very much. And in 1966, in July 1st, I

started my class in New York at 26 Second Avenue. That is my first

starting." (Lecture Feb 1968)

 

"I came here in 1965. Quote:

But for one year there was no program

; I was loitering only. And then, in 1966, July, I registered this society

in New York, and gradually these students... I rented one storefront in New

York, Second Avenue, and in this way practically it was started in 1966."

(Conv July 5th 1975)

 

"Therefore, with great difficulty I came here in 1965. In 1966 I registered

the Society with the help of some friends and disciples, and the movement

was started regularly in 1966, July, from New York." (Letter 16th july 1970)

 

"Since then in 1965 I came to America and started this missionary activity

from New York in 1966." (letter 7th August 1975)

 

So Srila Prabhupada says he came in 1965 as part of his mission, but for one

year he ‘could not do anything’. Things only really got started when he

registered his society in 1966:

 

‘That is my first starting’, ‘practically it was started in 1966’ ‘the

movement was started regularly in 1966' .

 

So whilst it is true Srila Prabhupada came to start his mission in the West

in 1965, and therefore loosely speaking the Movement began at that time,

legally speaking, and certainly for the parameters of this debate, it is not

possible to be the diksa guru for a society unless that society exists as a

legal entity.

 

Srila Prabhupada could only be the diksa guru for ISKCON once ISKCON

existed.

 

So it is lucky you no longer require an apology.

 

Just remember that if you keep asserting that he was the diksa guru for

ISKCON in 1965 I shall keep saying that you are claiming ISKCON existed

before it existed.

Is that clear now? If it is I shall go on to the next point.

Best wishes

Ys

Yadu