For Sanjay and others, my advice if you care...

[Guest guest]

Hey Sanjay dude,

 

A tip: Dinanath, is not a "normal" Westerner, in that, he is VERY involved

in ISKCON, and in India no less. So this is highly unusual.

 

Most Westerners, will not feel comfortable with the "ownership" and

"connectivity" feelings which are so normal to Indians. The statement below,

wherein you clealry say, "see, you've learned so much from me", made ME feel

uncomfortable just hearing you say it. It's a kind of territorial and heavy

relating kind of thing.

 

Remember, the West is ruled by Saturn, a Vatta increasing, windy, detached,

planet. The people are more or less like that. They are not so into feeling

connected. Fierce independence would be more appropriate to understand.

 

That's why, here, things have developed the way they have. It's why there

are no more lineages, Gurus, etc., in the West, really. It doesn't work

here. It's better to offer something, have a price, and give the exchange,

and put all things into that.

 

Like for example, I have this Chi-Kung kit (Qiqong), it's a type of secret

science from the Shaolin Masters of China. This is equivalent to your

situation.

 

Herein, a Master named Chunyi Lin is teaching an energy balancing system and

how to mystically heal people. It's the kindof knowledge that used to be

locked up in Chinese "Sampradays" if you will. So there is the usual

master/disciple issues, and other issues.

 

In the kit, he clearly states, with no apology, that NOBODY can be a HEALER

unless they are FORGIVING AND LOVING, and so on. He says it, just like it

says it in BPHS. So this is the Kula Yuga, and in the West, way...

 

You SAY IT. You leave it at that. It's up to the person to pay attention.

 

It used to be that the Guru would simply not admit a bad student to his

ashram or Gurukula.

 

However, now, you do not know who is buying your course, attending your

classes, etc.

 

If you want to keep your trip to just those who are qualified, you can do

that, but forget about working much in the West, not much, because, you're

gonna find alot of unqualified people and you're gonna seem like a

judgemental and uptight person if you turn people away, so that's heavy, and

difficult to face, but you can do it, it's your right.

 

So like, I distribute Jyotish software, and I'm twice now initiated as a

Brahmin, once in ISKCON, and once in Gaudiya Math. Whatever. Anyway, I have

great respect for Veda, and it's admonitions regarding distribution of the

knowledge to the unqualified, non-theistic, non-sattvic (me ;-() etc....

 

So, what I do, is I put tons of Krishna all over it, and make sure that it's

said clealy on my website and literature, that this is a theistic

possession, a possession of the sampradayas who brought it down, and I leave

it at that.

 

In general, most people LOVE ME for what I've done, and how I do it. Many

have found Hinduism through me, and benefitted. So, as Sridhar said, "Mercy

before Justice". The west, looking from Puri, is a place one gives mercy.

So, distribution of sciences helps, it does. I've seen this. People "Get it"

more if they get the inside scoops, like Jyotish, Ayurveda, Meditation,

Mantra, and so on. These things help the West greatly.

 

I no longer see myself as a White Guy who hates the West, loves India, and

converted. I see myself now as a person who is Celt, and Pict, and Germanic,

and proud of our own histories, and a current representation of our

evolution, and a member therefore of the Western-Saturn camp of humans, who

has gotten ALOT from Sister India, and is bringing that good stuff back to

my own people, to help them, because they need help in many ways, and I

believe I found some good stuff from Sister India and her teachers who were

merciful to give it to me clearly, including my Gurus, and BV Raman, KN Rao,

You, and many others, Dr Charak, and many white people who preceded me on

this quest including David Frawley, Dennis Harness, Drew Lawrence, Nalini

Kanta, and so many others. I thank you all.

 

Trying to set up Brahminical system of free teaching, and other things, even

the so called Sampradaya you're trying to get going, calling teachers Gurus,

personally, I think it's a mistake. The term Guru here now has become VERY

tainted. You are almost harming your friends by encouraging this word.

 

Some new people like to play the India game, and get titles like that. In

general, people are very tired of Gurus in the Western new age circles,

generally speaking, it's true.

 

Those who are successful, such as Hart Defouw and Maharishi, they don't do

that.

 

You could TRANSLATE the ESSENCE into new modern terms. For example, you

could have the "Sanjay Stamp of Approval" which you give, and remove, at

your whim. Simply have a website of YOUR OWN which thereon you list who you

recognize as representing what you've given. END OF STORY. It's THAT simple.

 

Those people could then put that on their literature "I am Sanjay Approved".

And their prospects could check your site to see the proof. You could remove

names easily. This is no big deal. That's modern Sampradaya. It's called

"references". "Check their references" we say.

 

People CALL ME TO CHECK YOUR REFERENCES ALL THE TIME.

 

In other words Sanjay, I AM a Sampradaya by my actions. I get asked often if

YOU and YOUR GROUP are "GOOD" in my estimation. So you see, this is how it

works here, as in business now in India. "Please the customer" and the show

goes on nicely. Don't please that person, and you're finished.

 

So this is the modern western paradigm.

 

You know what I see, I see that you have brought something ancient to the

modern times and places and it's blowing up in your face. Messing wiith

those deeply entrenched in ISKCON is mistake #1. They are fanatics, always.

You are too, by dint of your birth and place, but for you it's natural, for

them it is usually a manifestation of self hate, hatred of their own

peoples, and so on. As I've said, MOST white people in ISKCON have serious

issues with self love. They often hate their own families, cultures, etc.

There has been MUCH pain here, over the last 2000 years, and there is much

healing to be done.

 

The system of Guru/Sisya and all the devotion and formalities, etc., is very

foreign to this place.

 

At the conference, I saw Indians bowing to the feet of white Gurus. Yes, I

saw young Indians, and older ones, BOWING at the feet of Brenden Feeley.

That's FINE WITH ME. I am familiar with all this. I've done it TONS of

times. However, it WILL CAUSE YOU PROBLEMS and it will SHRINK your mission

tremendously. You are already suffering the typical cult crap right here and

now. This is oh so typical. This is all the Gaudiya Math and ISKCON do. They

constantly fight, do politics, etc.

 

Check this out: EVERY DEVOTEE bootlegs my software if possible. What is

that? The Prabhupada Folio software has to have a friggin hardware dongal

on it. This is because they have a mandate to be dishonest. This is insane,

for a so called holier than everybody religious movement. It shows the

disease.

 

The age of the power of being a pure Guru, with all the bowing and all that,

is basically over. Even if one has the qualities internally, better, at

least in the West, to do here as we do here, when in Rome, act Roman.

 

Make products, and teaching is a product. Have the products parameters of

delivery very clear. Then stick to that system. Have one price, and charge

it. People are selling astrology and astrological teaching now. There's NO

USE in bucking this trend. You are setup to be one of the Kings of this

field.

 

I suggest you here me, or stay in your way and be Guru and all that, but

understand you yourself will lose the cash generated (maybe you don't care),

and your sampraday of teachers will bicker, fight, and go away, very soon.

Your knowledge will be picked up by others, who will teach it for a price.

There is no such thing as real devotion to a teacher here. Forget it. Just

see how those who brought Rao here have left him, you yourself are teacing

some of his "students" and so on.

 

It's a free market here. That's what's happening here. So either you make

the sale, or somebody else will. Do you want to be Bruce Lee, and get next

to nothing for what you yourself brought and carry, or do you want to be the

movie producers, who make millions on his image?

 

There is NOTHING WRONG with charging for your services and knowledge. I hope

you get this, and teach this. It seems to me you fueled Dinanath. You are

even now claiming "see how much you learned from me" thus you are STILL

trying to connect him to yourself in some loving way. He is not actually

that way. His act of total devotion, Sattvic ways, Hindu ways, it will go

away in time. It's false. He IS a westerner, and HE WILL ACT like one

eventually. Stop holding onto him. You are grasping Saturn and hugging him,

which is only gonna piss him off more. Let Saturn blow free. That's the only

way he'll be nice to you.

 

I saw KN Rao blow it here, acting all Indian. Now he doesn't want to return,

and nobody wants him either, hardly nobody at all. Including me. It's too

hard to deal with Indians in THEIR way. We're not used to it. It's VERY

sticky. It's like ETERNAL relationships are constantly being set up and

eventually most people just want to get away from that.

 

I am in a cityn where modern thinking develops. From here, modern thought

emanates, rather than being received. I know what I'm saying. The future in

the West is more so what I'm saying, not less. More and more the divine

knowledge is being given freely, but at each class, in each book, there is

always the introduction which clearly states the exact material

qualifications, such as truthfulness, etc., that should be in the person for

any success in the subject to manifest.

 

This is the way now. Fighting it will lead to failure.

 

If you figure out what you got that works, and then make a program of OWNING

the products yourself, then you will be wealthy. Fight this, and you will be

India based, with little connection to success in the West. I don't care.

It's totally up to you. I'm just telling it like IT IS.

 

If there was a "Sanjay Rath Kit", which included books, tapes, CD's, Videos,

you could sell that thing for years, at $295 a pop, or $195, and people

would appreciate that they didn't HAVE TO GO to a seminar to hear you, see

you, take your classes, etc.

 

Then, you could have a "Mastery Course", which is ONLY IN PERSON, and even

ONLY IN INDIA, if you wanted. You can have many levels. But EVERYTHING

should have a material MONEY price. NEVER should you force people to go for

any kind of relating which is artificial to their hearts, and believe me,

this Guru/Sisya stuff is artificial to us. Some who are lost, may get off on

getting an identity, but do you only want them?

 

 

DO YOU ONLY WANT TO KNOW THOSE WHO HAVE LOST THEIR POWER ????

 

 

Do it the right way, and you'll be like Deepak Chopra, known and successful.

What do you want? Do you want to be small and hide, or be big and strong?

 

Also, talking about curses, so much, is not going to be good for you here at

all.

 

I would like to see you successful. I would like to see Indians not blow it

here so often, which they seem to always do, because of the vast cultural

differences.

 

Marc Boney and the like who are so into saying Sri Rao and Sri Rath, and

playing all those respect games, they are not directing you properly in my

opinion. Nobody says Sri Deepak, and he's the one winning big bucks. Not

that money is the only aim, but I'm trying to make it clear to you what

country you are dealing with. This is NOT india AT ALL.

 

And again I declare loud and clear:

 

 

We Westerners are NOT BAD AND EVIL. Just because America has serious

problems, doesn't mean everything about white people sucks. I will not go

for that any longer. I know too much history now to be so foolish and turn

my back on my own evolution.

 

We are good, but we are not just like India. India is not the boss of us,

and will never be. India has alot and can give alot. It's wealth is in it's

ancient culture, and you are bringing a portion of that very well, to the

West. You are young, able, good looking, intelligent, properly birthed, for

the whole thing. Success, grand success, huge success, COULD BE YOURS if you

would realize what country you are dealing with, and how things work here.

 

See yourself on Larry King Live in a couple years if you play it right.

 

Yes, you could be that big, if you play it right.

 

Dinanaths will appear over and over so long as you try to Indianize

Westerners.

 

The few, like Brenden, Robert, Myself, and others who are ex ISKCON and like

movement followers, we will fool you. We are SUCH A MINORITY here. Most

people do not know, and do not like the sight and smell of, the kinds of

things we few do- because we learned them in India. Gosh, Brenden and

Robert and myself, we, like Dinanath too, we have spent SO MUCH TIME chasing

India and it's gifts, for our own reasons. We will fool you. We are easy,

but we are only your landing pillow. You have to learn beyond us, how to

deal with Westerners in their way, and sell yourself here.

 

 

IF YOU WANT TO DO SO.

 

If you care about teaching the West BIG TIME, then change your Modus

Operandus VERY SOON, as this little war is only the first wave of what

you're gonna get if you keep up the current MO.

 

I'd hate to see you run and hide as others have done.

 

But if that's what to be, as in "this is my last letter on this matter",

then so be it. Kindof sad. "Et tu brute" you're own people will stab

you if you do things a certain way. There are ways where this is not what

happens, at all.

 

Interesting the title including 1040, which is the number American hate the

most, because 1040 is the name of our yearly tax form we fill out. We call

it "Form 1040" all across America. Just seeing that number sends shivers

down our spines. It's GOVERNMENT PERSONIFIED and it's on April 15th (Sun

entering Aries) that we MUST submit them to the big guns, big guys, the guys

in power.

 

And interestingly, that form was ORIGINALLY intended for only Canadians

filing who work in the US. So, our tax system is rooted in Sham, and related

to foreignors... strange but true.

 

Anyway, it's an omenic example.

 

I know many are flocking to you and your Gurus for training. JHLite software

has deeply reduced my sales. You are making an impact. Personally, I don't

like alot of the info and teachings. Too strange to me, curses and remedies.

I ain't into it personally. But apparently many are so far.

 

I see however that what is going on, mainly with this new organization, has

already wrought havoc and despair, big time.

 

That's probably why I broke down at Laksmis. Feeling it, just wiped me out.

I know Robert and Brenden for years. I've known Laksmi forever as well. I

know what we want and need, and I don't see it from yet another "Indian at

the top" sampradaya, with all the kissing of rings and feet, and clamoring

for position, that goes with it. This is not the way for us here and now, in

my opinion. In my opinion, a big mistake was made by trying to organize a

movement, a sampradaya, a system of Gurus, etc. It was a mistake.

 

Drop the word and MO of Guru completely, and go Western. If you are going to

distribute Indian knowledg to Westerners, then do it so that they can GET

IT.

 

It's a matter of targetting your audience in THEIR LANGUAGE

 

If you want to confuse and make it hard, then lecture in Hindi in America.

That would be more honest.

 

I will be blunt and say that there are some people amongst us, some

westerners, who want the distinction offered by the title of "Guru", and for

them, this clarity with an Indian official stamp is required for them to

operate the way they want. They don't like the market standard here, and

want that kind of hierarchy.

 

They will keep you locked in the old and small. It's simply true. Sorry.

 

So it's up to you, what do you want, old and small, with lots of fighting

for position going on around you always, or big and new, successful, where

you meet the powerful people, and work with them?

 

 

It's your choice, my choice, all our choice.

 

 

It's 2002. This is English. Guru is not a word in our language, neither is

Sisya, Sampradaya. The english equivalents

 

 

Priest/Bishop

Disciple

Discipleship/Monastery

 

 

These are words most people RUN FROM FAST

 

If you want success, you don't want to pin these badges on yourself.

 

 

I hope I have been clear, and that others don't think I don't believe in God

or some stupid thing. I am only talking about how to move for success of

purpose, and I think we are after that. Success of our missions.

 

Peace, and do as you will. I am only giving free advice. I am not seeking

any.

 

 

 

 

Thanks,

 

 

 

 

Das Goravani, President

 

2852 Willamette St, #353

Eugene, OR, 97405, USA-America

Voice: or in America

fax: 541-343-0344

 

 

http://www.DancingMoonInc.com

 

 

 

> "Sanjay Rath" <daivagyna

> gjlist

> Thu, 3 Oct 2002 19:24:03 +0530

> "SJC" <>, "Varahamihira (AT) (DOT) "

> <varahamihira>, "Vedic-Astrology (AT) (DOT) "

> <vedic astrology>, "Gjlist (AT) (DOT) "

> <gjlist>

> [GJ] Digest Number 1040

>

> This proves how much you have learnt from me. Everyone is well aware that

> those good yogas will also fructify in their time just like the curse in

> fructifying in its time.