Fw: >The Case For Regime Change

[Guest guest]

>The Case For Regime Change

>By Ted Rall

>10-1-2

>

>NEW YORK -- Making the case for United Nations intervention against the

>United States, Iranian President Mohammad Khatami told the organization

>yesterday that military action will be "unavoidable" unless the U.S. agrees

>to destroy its weapons of mass destruction. In a much-anticipated speech to

>a

>special session of the U.N. General Assembly held in Brussels, Khatami

>launched a blistering attack against American leader George W. Bush,

>accusing

>him of defying U.N. resolutions and using his country's wealth to line the

>pockets of wealthy cronies at a time when the people of his country make do

>without such basic social programs as national health insurance. "Nearly

>two

>years ago, the civilized world watched as this evil and corrupt dictator

>subverted the world's oldest representative democracy in an illegal coup

>d'état," said Khatami. "Since then the Bush regime has continued America's

>systematic repression of ethnic and religious minorities and threatened

>international peace and security throughout the world. Thousands of

>political

>opponents and ordinary citizens have been subjected to arbitrary arrest and

>imprisonment. Basic civil rights have been violated. This rogue state has

>flouted the international community on legal, economic and environmental

>issues. It has even ignored the Geneva Conventions on the treatment of

>prisoners of war by denying that its illegal invasion of Afghanistan--which

>has had a destabilizing influence throughout Central Asia--was a war at

>all."

>Khatami said the U.S. possesses the world's largest arsenal of nuclear

>weapons, weapons "that, when first developed, were used immediately to kill

>half a million innocent civilians just months after acquiring them. No

>nation

>that has committed nuclear genocide can be entrusted with weapons of mass

>destruction.Bush has invaded Afghanistan and is now threatening Iraq. We

>cannot stand by and do nothing while danger gathers. We can't for this

>tyrant

>to strike first. We have an obligation to act pre-emptively to protect the

>world from this evildoer," Khatami said. As delegates punctuated his words

>with bursts of applause, Khatami noted that U.S. intelligence agencies had

>helped establish and fund the world's most virulent terrorist

>organizations,

>including Al Qaeda, and the Taliban regime that harbored them. "The U.S.

>created the Islamist extremists who attacked its people on September 11,

>2001," he stated, "and Bush's illegitimate junta cynically exploited those

>attacks to repress political dissidents, make sweetheart deals with

>politically-connected corporations and revive 19th century-style colonial

>imperialism." Khatami asked the U.N. to set a deadline for Bush to step

>down

>in favor of president-in-exile Al Gore, the legitimate winner of the 2000

>election, the results of which were subverted through widespread voting

>irregularities and intimidation. "We favor not regime change, but rather

>restoration and liberation," he said. In addition, Khatami said, the U.S.

>must dismantle its weapons of mass destruction, guarantee basic human

>rights

>to all citizens and agree to abide by international law or "face the

>consequences." Most observers agree that those "consequences" would likely

>include a prolonged bombing campaign targeting major U.S. cities and

>military

>installations, followed by a ground invasion led by European forces.

>"Civilian casualties would likely be substantial," said a French military

>analyst. "But the American people must be liberated from tyranny."

>Khatami's

>charges, which were detailed in a dossier prepared by French President

>Jacques Chirac, were dismissed by a representative of the American

>strongman

>as "lies, half-truths and misguided beliefs, motivated by the desire to

>control a country with oil, natural gas and other natural resources."

>National Security Minister Condoleezza Rice denied that the U.S. maintains

>weapons of mass destruction and invited U.N. inspectors to visit Washington

>to "see for themselves that our weapons are designed only to keep the

>peace,

>subject of course to full respect for American sovereignty." The U.N. is

>expected to reject any conditions for or restrictions on arms inspections.

>Experts believe that the liberation of the United States will require a

>large

>ground force of European and other international troops, followed by a

>massive rebuilding program costing billions of euros. "Even before Bush,

>the

>American political system was a shambles," said Prof. Salvatore Deluna of

>the

>University of Madrid. "Their single-party plutocracy will have to be

>reshaped

>into true parliamentary-style democracy. Moreover, the economy will have to

>be retooled from its current military dictatorship model--in which a third

>of

>the federal budget goes to arms, and taxes are paid almost exclusively by

>the

>working class--to one in which basic human needs such as education and

>poverty are addressed. Their infrastructure is a mess; they don't even have

>a

>national passenger train system. Fixing a failed state of this size will

>require many years." (Ted Rall's latest book, a graphic travelogue about

>his

>recent coverage of the Afghan war titled "To Afghanistan and Back," is now

>in

>its second edition. Ordering and review-copy information are available at

>nbmpub.com.) http://story.news./news?tmpl=story2&cid=127&e=16&

>u=/020927/7/2bxul.html

>

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Martin,

Satire it is, and I think very good satire (though I somewhat regret not

captioning it as such). I don't think it drivel at all, but respect your right

to name it so.

You have a lot of spirit (which I really value), so I want you to know beyond

any question that although I definitely question your politics, I appreciate

your presence on this list and extend my hand to you in the fellowship that's

part of the very nature of the Jyotir Vidya.

Sincerely,

J. I. Abbot

JIA,

Do you actually BELIEVE this drivel? This has GOT to be some form of satire...

hahaha

Martin

[Guest guest]

Jiabbot (AT) cs (DOT) com [Jiabbot (AT) cs (DOT) com]Sent:

Thursday, October 03, 2002 11:52 PMgjlistSubject: [GJ] Fw:

>The Case For Regime Change

> (BTW, Martin, neither GWB nor Cheney have *combat* experience. Check your

sources.) I never said they had "combat" experience, I said they had military

experience: GWB in the

National Guard, Cheney as Sec. of Defense. Sorry if you misunderstood.

 

>The Case For Regime Change>By Ted Rall>10-1-2>>NEW YORK -- Making the case for

United Nations intervention against the>United States, Iranian President

Mohammad Khatami told the organization>yesterday that military action will be

"unavoidable" unless the U.S. agrees>to destroy its weapons of mass

destruction. In a much-anticipated speech to >a special session of the U.N.

General Assembly held in Brussels, Khatami>launched a blistering attack against

American leader George W. Bush, >accusing him of defying U.N. resolutions and

using his country's wealth to

>line the pockets of wealthy cronies at a time when the people of his country

>make do without such basic social programs as national health insurance.

>"Nearly two years ago, the civilized world watched as this evil and corrupt

dictator>subverted the world's oldest representative democracy in an illegal

coup>d'état," said Khatami. "Since then the Bush regime has continued

America's>systematic repression of ethnic and religious minorities and

threatened>international peace and security throughout the world. Thousands of

>political opponents and ordinary citizens have been subjected to arbitrary

>arrest and imprisonment. Basic civil rights have been violated. This rogue

state has>flouted the international community on legal, economic and

environmental>issues. It has even ignored the Geneva Conventions on the

treatment of>prisoners of war by denying that its illegal invasion of

Afghanistan--which>has had a destabilizing influence throughout Central

Asia--was a war at >all.">Khatami said the U.S. possesses the world's largest

arsenal of nuclear>weapons, weapons "that, when first developed, were used

immediately to kill>half a million innocent civilians just months after

acquiring them. No >nation that has committed nuclear genocide can be entrusted

with weapons

>of mass destruction.Bush has invaded Afghanistan and is now threatening

>Iraq. We cannot stand by and do nothing while danger gathers. We can't for this

>tyrant to strike first. We have an obligation to act pre-emptively to protect

the>world from this evildoer," Khatami said. As delegates punctuated his

words>with bursts of applause, Khatami noted that U.S. intelligence agencies

had>helped establish and fund the world's most virulent terrorist

organizations,

>including Al Qaeda, and the Taliban regime that harbored them. "The

U.S.>created the Islamist extremists who attacked its people on September

11,>2001," he stated, "and Bush's illegitimate junta cynically exploited

those>attacks to repress political dissidents, make sweetheart deals

with>politically-connected corporations and revive 19th century-style

colonial>imperialism." Khatami asked the U.N. to set a deadline for Bush to

step >down in favor of president-in-exile Al Gore, the legitimate winner of the

2000>election, the results of which were subverted through widespread

voting>irregularities and intimidation. "We favor not regime change, but

rather>restoration and liberation," he said. In addition, Khatami said, the

U.S.>must dismantle its weapons of mass destruction, guarantee basic human

>rights to all citizens and agree to abide by international law or "face

the>consequences." Most observers agree that those "consequences" would

likely>include a prolonged bombing campaign targeting major U.S. cities and

>military installations, followed by a ground invasion led by European

forces.>"Civilian casualties would likely be substantial," said a French

military>analyst. "But the American people must be liberated from tyranny."

>Khatami's charges, which were detailed in a dossier prepared by French

>President Jacques Chirac, were dismissed by a representative of the American

>strongman as "lies, half-truths and misguided beliefs, motivated by the

desire to>control a country with oil, natural gas and other natural

resources.">National Security Minister Condoleezza Rice denied that the U.S.

maintains>weapons of mass destruction and invited U.N. inspectors to visit

Washington>to "see for themselves that our weapons are designed only to keep

the >peace, subject of course to full respect for American sovereignty." The

U.N. is>expected to reject any conditions for or restrictions on arms

inspections.>Experts believe that the liberation of the United States will

require a >large ground force of European and other international troops,

followed by a>massive rebuilding program costing billions of euros. "Even

before Bush, >the American political system was a shambles," said Prof.

Salvatore Deluna of >the University of Madrid. "Their single-party plutocracy

will have to be >reshaped into true parliamentary-style democracy. Moreover,

the economy

>will have to be retooled from its current military dictatorship model--in which

a third >of the federal budget goes to arms, and taxes are paid almost

exclusively by >the working class--to one in which basic human needs such as

education and>poverty are addressed. Their infrastructure is a mess; they don't

even have >a national passenger train system. Fixing a failed state of this size

will>require many years." (Ted Rall's latest book, a graphic travelogue about

>his recent coverage of the Afghan war titled "To Afghanistan and Back," is now

>in its second edition. Ordering and review-copy information are available

at>nbmpub.com.)

http://story.news./news?tmpl=story2&cid=127&e=16&>u=/020927/7/2bxul.html>

 

JIA,

 

Do you actually BELIEVE this drivel? This has GOT to be some form of satire...

 

hahaha

 

Martin

[Guest guest]

My honest two cents:

 

GWB is a victim, as are ALL, of his karma, which includes the times, and our

process as a species, under God and Goddess.

 

GWB is a very likeable fellow, to me personally. I like a guy like him. He

reminds me of all the fellows I grew up around. He is not that much older

than I, and I understand him easily.

 

However, he is aligned with a consciousness and others who are not very

amicable to other races and faiths, and this will have now it's play, and

it's toll, and we shall all share in that outcome, for it is time for that

consciousness to come fully out, and so it shall. It is time for a large

adjustment on the Anglo Saxxon spinal column.

 

Arabs are a race with a stunning past, serious achievements, a great

yearning for grace and purity, and they are and have always been, a huge and

significant race, making massive contributions of significance to world

history. Iraq should be honored, much moreso than it is. Out of convenience

for a current and relative agenda, they are being slighted greatly as a

people, as an ancient land. We are abusing even Saddam Hussein, who doesn't

deserve all that has been heaped upon him. If we do not recognize the

greatness seen in him by Arabs, then we are fools. I fear our bigotry in

this regard.

 

I pray for a balance to come to American minds, wherein Muslims and Arabs

are respected as our equals, and not a lesser thing, which is not the

current case. Until we love our neighbors as much as ourselves, there will

not be peace.

 

There is no question we have "might". We can bomb them back to the stone age

as they say, but we will no have success, nor peace, from doing anything of

that sort. ONLY understanding and equality with respect will solve these

problems.

 

Arabs do not have it in them to be violent and vicious as a rule. This is

ludicrous. They are a noble people, who are basically more or less under our

constant watch and threat, as if they are terrible criminals. This is the

cause of the problem. It is our fears of them. And these fears are

unfounded. This what I'm expressing is the solution. Acceptance, dropping

fear, dropping hatred, starting with respect.

 

The Jyotish of this is simple- it's the primeval Sun-Saturn problem. They

are older, darker, we are newer, lighter. Sun represents power, force and

bright things. That's the US. Saturn represents older, darker, more stoic

and worker placed things, dry windy places like deserts, the tolerance

required to live there, etc, and so this is Iraq and Afghanistan. When we

love them, they will be friends.

 

If Americans would all spend some time learning about and loving Arabs,

Islam, etc., then there would be peace, easily. The one in power has to

start with the mercy, not the other way around.

 

It's up to us to START the peace process through loving exchanges.

 

Mother Green, our Marine Killing Machine, is unparalelled. Of this there is

no doubt. We are the Sun. Nothing can touch us so it seems right now, except

our own internal black spots, and we have them, they are here, waiting to

cause solar flares.

 

 

Das Goravani, President

 

2852 Willamette St, #353

Eugene, OR, 97405, USA-America

Voice: or in America

fax: 541-343-0344

 

 

http://www.DancingMoonInc.com

[Guest guest]

Dear JIA -

 

Sorry about the drivel comment. I HAD intended to remove that when I realized it WAS satire,

but my work very often distracts me from more important stuff like these lists. I appreciate

good humor as much - probably more - than most. I actually agree with a historical writer who

said that you can judge a nation by not only how it treats it's prisoners, but by how good it's

sense of humor is about itself. I myself am quite notorious for my very bad puns, and rather

creative practical jokes. Once, when I was a fairly young enlisted man, I broke

into my Lt.'s

desk when he took leave and stole the large flat drawer. Upon his return he

found it completely

encased in Lemon Jell-O, with all of his stuff still inside the drawer - great fun.

 

And some of these conversations are a hoot - though it is a shame that they take place at all.

 

Politically, we are probably opposed to at least some extent, but that doesn't mean we can't be

friends. Thank you, and again - sorry, I did intend to remove that.

 

Best regards,

Martin

Jiabbot (AT) cs (DOT) com [Jiabbot (AT) cs (DOT) com]Sent:

Friday, October 04, 2002 10:29 AMgjlistSubject: Re: [GJ]

Fw: >The Case For Regime ChangeIn a message dated 10/4/2002 11:12:43 AM Eastern

Standard Time, mm6365 (AT) sbc (DOT) com writes: Dear Martin,Satire it is, and I think very

good satire (though I somewhat regret not captioning it as such). I don't think

it drivel at all, but respect your right to name it so. You have a lot of

spirit (which I really value), so I want you to know beyond any question that

although I definitely question your politics, I appreciate your presence on

this list and extend my hand to you in the fellowship that's part of the very

nature of the Jyotir Vidya.Sincerely,J. I. Abbot

JIA, Do you actually BELIEVE this drivel? This has GOT to be some form of

satire... hahaha MartinOm Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya; Hare Krishna; Om Tat

Sat:

gjlist-http://www.goravani.comYour use of

is subject to the