These days ~

November 21, 2002

Dear list ~

Being born in 1955 and raised in the Canadian, North American culture

.... I remember vividly the late 50's and right up until now. As a little

girl I closely observed and felt my way along in the circle of influence I

was born into. Thankfully, then, my parents and relatives and close family

friends seemed to be a happy enough, optimistic group of young families. In

those days, we never locked our doors. People weren't afraid of people

then. If something bad happened, it was an exception and people really

cared and helped each other. When we spoke to our elders we addressed them

with respect, calling them Mr. & Mrs. and the world seemed like a more

formal, friendly, sane and safe place to be.

Fast forward to the present day. I am aware of a much different experience

of life. I feel my own fear and the fear of those around me, although

most people do not acknowledge the fear too often in plain language, with

the exception of Das ... bless his heart. Still ... it is can be seen and

detected easily in a number of other ways besides and including verbally.

I realize that people born in the 70's and 80's and 90's do not have the

benefit of remembering the warmer , happier and more innocent times in the

1950's. In fact it seems to me that during the process of evolution the

young people today and born today must experience life with a more dog eat

dog - only the strong survive mentality and I'd go as far as to say that we

are evolving into a different species from my elders and I. A species who

have not known the safety and innocence of an era when people were more

wholesome in many ways.

The recent Michael Jackson press coverage which shows him dangling his 8

month old baby over the balcony of a 5 story apartment building in Berlin;

and then the next day, a picture of Michael Jackson and his two young

children at the zoo with their heads covered strangely. It makes me

shudder and quake almost. I hope and pray, for his children's sake that

someone with influence is going to recognize this as an unconscious cry for

help. It is much more difficult to intervene in the affairs of the rich

and famous because money buys so much! But, regardless of how much fame and

money Jackson has, intervention is clearly a necessity.

The personal details of Michael Jackson's history are quite unknown to me

since I have never been a fan but I remember his as a child star and he had

the appearance of a regular African American boy. To look at him now

reveals that he has been though a process of prolific and intense plastic

surgeries which have caused his features to resemble a rather androgynous,

Caucasian looking individual. He is reportedly a gay pedophile who has

arranged out of court and private settlements with his victims' families.

As well, I do know that he pays women to father children for him to keep.

And if this isn't enough to alarm you ... now he is dangling his

defenseless baby out of a balcony and covering his toddlers heads strangely

as they walk around a public Zoo.

As a world society and civilization, since the 1950's, our social

skills, values and integrity have adjusted down; down; down and down again

so slowly and gradually that we haven't realized how low we have actually

deteriorated, individually and collectively and certainly as our brothers'

keepers.

I play backgammon at a multi-cultural Internet game site where people use

monikers rather than their real names. Believe me ... there are a lot of

very hurt people in the world. Most people are barely civil to each other

at best. Behaviors range from falling in love with each other sight unseen

and most often already married to other people to the majority of folks who

often don't even bother saying hello or acknowledging each other - even

though they will spend the next 15 - 30 minutes together in a game

room. At worst, people on those sites act as predators and name callers

exhibiting the worst kinds of prejudice and disrespect for each

other. When I've inquired directed as to why they behave this way, many

tell me that to them, the experience is not real ... since it's

anonymous ... but ... to me ... every moment is real and counts. I am

now conducting an informal survey of the people with no social skills and

so far I'm sorry to report that the worst offenders of hate are the Americans.

We can only control our own words and behaviors but it is very important

that we do. Being kind or at the very least socialized enough to say hello

is our own responsibility and contributes to the higher good. Please don't

give up being kind even when you are in the midst of evil. There are few

leaders but many followers among us and it is proven that people have a

wild wolf pack mentality in groups. We seem to imitate and practice the

most dominant social behaviors surrounding us, matching good with good and

evil with evil. It is crucial in these times to choose the high road

whenever possible.

In Vedic astrology we don't use the outer planets because of their distance

from the Earth affects us collectively more than individually , yet, this

would be a great time to study them to determine the astrological reasons

we have collectively turned against each other with such wrath. Since the

turn of this century, life seems to have speeded up and we notice and

experience more harshness in human dynamics.

I'm feeling quite hopeless about our civilization right now. Someone, I

apologize for not remembering who, mentioned there is a Bach Flower remedy

available for hopelessness. Does anyone know which Bach Flower Remedy it

is? I would appreciate knowing, so I can buy some.

God Bless us all ~

Chandra Devi

~

---

Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.

Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release 6/20/02

November 21, 2002

I sent this once at 3:59, But I did't see it come around Chandra. So here

you go!!!

Dear Chandra

The Bach Flower Remedy for hopelessness, And I quote (We should

understand more clearly why GORSE is for those who feel crushed and hopeless

by the weight of their karma, pain and suffering; and CLEMATIS seeks

withdrawal from a prison wherein sorrow and suffering reign supreme, i.e.,

the physical body; and SWEET CHESTNUT mirrors the of isolation of those who

have become, if only momentarily the seal of the planetary logos.) ESOTERIC

HEALING by Dr. Douglas Baker. Page 193 "Capricorn"

Not more then a few hours ago I sat in my chair crying like a baby,

praying to god for help, I am so sick! I haven't cried like that since my

mother died in 1988. The only thing that I could think of was a prayer

circle at http;//www.yogananda-srf.org/aboutsrf/prayer.cgi where you inter

your name and the monks pray every day for you for a month. After I entered

my name a affirmation came up and I quote once more.( I relax and cast aside

all mental burdens, allowing god to express through me his perfect love,

peace and wisdom.) As I closed my eyes and repeated this over and over for a

few minutes a sense of peace came over me. I slowly opened my eyes and the

only sun in my room was reflecting of an object on my desk and lighting up

the forehead of a 16 x 14 color picture of Paramahansa Yogananda that I have

on my wall. I have had a few experiences like this before when I am

desperate.

Point being that times like this puts things in perspective; and YES I

will go back to my studies from the SRF.

I too was reared when respect seemed to be important and went through a

faze where I saw the world as an ugly place, but I am different now! Thanks

to SRF and the book " THE HOLY SCIENCE" by Swami Sri Yukeswar, Paramahansa

Yogananda guru. With this book I saw the world in a evolutionary period that

was unmistakable and clear. Everything is as it's suppose to be.

About a year ago a lady came into where I work. She was depressed and

suicidal, look for a quick fix. Herbs etc. I ask her what she thought was

cause this! she said that she could not take that fact that so many women

were getting rapped. I asked her how often she watched the news. she said

she watched it three times a day. I told her to turn the dam thing off, that

women have been getting rapped since the beginning of time. The only

difference is she was bringing it in to her living room three times a day.

Point being Chandra that the world is as it should be. It is our

perception of it that hurts. Let it go Sweet girl and be with God! A lesson

we all need to learn ..... Noel ......

-

Chandra Devi <wraye

Thursday, November 21, 2002 11:40 AM

[GJ] These days ~

> Dear list ~

>

> Being born in 1955 and raised in the Canadian, North American culture

> ... I remember vividly the late 50's and right up until now. As a little

> girl I closely observed and felt my way along in the circle of influence I

> was born into. Thankfully, then, my parents and relatives and close

family

> friends seemed to be a happy enough, optimistic group of young families.

In

> those days, we never locked our doors. People weren't afraid of people

> then. If something bad happened, it was an exception and people really

> cared and helped each other. When we spoke to our elders we addressed them

> with respect, calling them Mr. & Mrs. and the world seemed like a more

> formal, friendly, sane and safe place to be.

>

> Fast forward to the present day. I am aware of a much different experience

> of life. I feel my own fear and the fear of those around me, although

> most people do not acknowledge the fear too often in plain language, with

> the exception of Das ... bless his heart. Still ... it is can be seen

and

> detected easily in a number of other ways besides and including verbally.

>

> I realize that people born in the 70's and 80's and 90's do not have the

> benefit of remembering the warmer , happier and more innocent times in

the

> 1950's. In fact it seems to me that during the process of evolution the

> young people today and born today must experience life with a more dog

eat

> dog - only the strong survive mentality and I'd go as far as to say that

we

> are evolving into a different species from my elders and I. A species who

> have not known the safety and innocence of an era when people were more

> wholesome in many ways.

>

> The recent Michael Jackson press coverage which shows him dangling his 8

> month old baby over the balcony of a 5 story apartment building in Berlin;

> and then the next day, a picture of Michael Jackson and his two young

> children at the zoo with their heads covered strangely. It makes me

> shudder and quake almost. I hope and pray, for his children's sake that

> someone with influence is going to recognize this as an unconscious cry

for

> help. It is much more difficult to intervene in the affairs of the rich

> and famous because money buys so much! But, regardless of how much fame

and

> money Jackson has, intervention is clearly a necessity.

>

> The personal details of Michael Jackson's history are quite unknown to me

> since I have never been a fan but I remember his as a child star and he

had

> the appearance of a regular African American boy. To look at him now

> reveals that he has been though a process of prolific and intense plastic

> surgeries which have caused his features to resemble a rather androgynous,

> Caucasian looking individual. He is reportedly a gay pedophile who has

> arranged out of court and private settlements with his victims' families.

> As well, I do know that he pays women to father children for him to keep.

> And if this isn't enough to alarm you ... now he is dangling his

> defenseless baby out of a balcony and covering his toddlers heads

strangely

> as they walk around a public Zoo.

>

> As a world society and civilization, since the 1950's, our social

> skills, values and integrity have adjusted down; down; down and down again

> so slowly and gradually that we haven't realized how low we have actually

> deteriorated, individually and collectively and certainly as our

brothers'

> keepers.

>

> I play backgammon at a multi-cultural Internet game site where people use

> monikers rather than their real names. Believe me ... there are a lot of

> very hurt people in the world. Most people are barely civil to each other

> at best. Behaviors range from falling in love with each other sight

unseen

> and most often already married to other people to the majority of folks

who

> often don't even bother saying hello or acknowledging each other - even

> though they will spend the next 15 - 30 minutes together in a game

> room. At worst, people on those sites act as predators and name callers

> exhibiting the worst kinds of prejudice and disrespect for each

> other. When I've inquired directed as to why they behave this way, many

> tell me that to them, the experience is not real ... since it's

> anonymous ... but ... to me ... every moment is real and counts. I am

> now conducting an informal survey of the people with no social skills and

> so far I'm sorry to report that the worst offenders of hate are the

Americans.

>

> We can only control our own words and behaviors but it is very important

> that we do. Being kind or at the very least socialized enough to say hello

> is our own responsibility and contributes to the higher good. Please don't

> give up being kind even when you are in the midst of evil. There are few

> leaders but many followers among us and it is proven that people have a

> wild wolf pack mentality in groups. We seem to imitate and practice the

> most dominant social behaviors surrounding us, matching good with good

and

> evil with evil. It is crucial in these times to choose the high road

> whenever possible.

>

> In Vedic astrology we don't use the outer planets because of their

distance

> from the Earth affects us collectively more than individually , yet, this

> would be a great time to study them to determine the astrological reasons

> we have collectively turned against each other with such wrath. Since the

> turn of this century, life seems to have speeded up and we notice and

> experience more harshness in human dynamics.

>

> I'm feeling quite hopeless about our civilization right now. Someone, I

> apologize for not remembering who, mentioned there is a Bach Flower remedy

> available for hopelessness. Does anyone know which Bach Flower Remedy it

> is? I would appreciate knowing, so I can buy some.

>

> God Bless us all ~

> Chandra Devi

> ~

>

Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya; Hare Krishna; Om Tat Sat

> : gjlist-

>

> Your use of is subject to

>

----------

----

>

> ---

> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.

> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

> Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release 6/20/02

>

November 21, 2002

Dear Noel and Chandra

I'll second you on that one . If you want to get back your balance throw out

your TV . We do not need to watch endless coverage of September 11 ,the bali

bombings , the Chechnya kidnappings etc. interspersed with voluptuos models

beaming because they have bought this or that product . We don't have to

have every local,national and international problem in our lounge rooms .The

atrocities afflicted by Hitler,Stalin and Tojo and their goons in the 40s

were at least as bad as what is going on now . The mass media is considered

ruled by Rahu and thus it gives excessive attention to miscreants and

proportionately neglects those who do good in their family,society work and

spiritual practises .

Best Wishes

Nicholas

>

> About a year ago a lady came into where I work. She was depressed and

> suicidal, look for a quick fix. Herbs etc. I ask her what she thought was

> cause this! she said that she could not take that fact that so many women

> were getting rapped. I asked her how often she watched the news. she said

> she watched it three times a day. I told her to turn the dam thing off,

that

> women have been getting rapped since the beginning of time. The only

> difference is she was bringing it in to her living room three times a day.

November 21, 2002

Hi Nicholas

I hate to say this but some times reading about the effect of the

planets is like watching the news. It's hard to over come. You know turn it

off. I know it's all here for a reason, and were suppose to be smart enough

to figure it out but I don't think it's going to happen tonight I'm to tired

bless you my friend ...... Noel.....

-

Nicholas <jyotish108

Thursday, November 21, 2002 10:01 PM

Re: [GJ] These days ~

> Dear Noel and Chandra

> I'll second you on that one . If you want to get back your balance throw

out

> your TV . We do not need to watch endless coverage of September 11 ,the

bali

> bombings , the Chechnya kidnappings etc. interspersed with voluptuos

models

> beaming because they have bought this or that product . We don't have

to

> have every local,national and international problem in our lounge rooms

..The

> atrocities afflicted by Hitler,Stalin and Tojo and their goons in the 40s

> were at least as bad as what is going on now . The mass media is

considered

> ruled by Rahu and thus it gives excessive attention to miscreants and

> proportionately neglects those who do good in their family,society work

and

> spiritual practises .

>

> Best Wishes

> Nicholas

> >

> > About a year ago a lady came into where I work. She was depressed

and

> > suicidal, look for a quick fix. Herbs etc. I ask her what she thought

was

> > cause this! she said that she could not take that fact that so many

women

> > were getting rapped. I asked her how often she watched the news. she

said

> > she watched it three times a day. I told her to turn the dam thing off,

> that

> > women have been getting rapped since the beginning of time. The only

> > difference is she was bringing it in to her living room three times a

day.

>

> Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya; Hare Krishna; Om Tat Sat

> : gjlist-

>

> Your use of is subject to

>

November 22, 2002

Dear Noel

I accept your point .Astrologers also need to keep their lives in balance .

Cheers

Nicholas

-

"Noel" <sattva

Friday, November 22, 2002 5:42 PM

Re: [GJ] These days ~

> Hi Nicholas

> I hate to say this but some times reading about the effect of the

> planets is like watching the news. It's hard to over come. You know turn

it

> off. I know it's all here for a reason, and were suppose to be smart

enough

> to figure it out but I don't think it's going to happen tonight I'm to

tired

> bless you my friend ...... Noel.....

November 22, 2002

Here's a 3rd from me. Last night I was really tired. Little sleep the

night before and lots of heavy gardening during the day and rode my exercise

bike for 30 minutes in the evening. Just to let you know, I was tired and

receptive. I went channel surfing and found nothing of value! All those

channels and all that fear. Even the animal shows were about life and death

struggles. I watched the Food channel cooking shows and a landscaping show.

Even the latter frustrated me as the owners chopped down beautiful old trees

to make room for trendy new trees! Arrrgh!

Well, now that I said that, I guess you know who won't be watching TV

tonight.

It seems that the media has long-since sold its value out to the lower

chakras: sex and fear. Fear grabs the attention of the viewer. Even when

there is no bad weather coming, they hype the storm 5 years ago to get you

to stay tuned. Is this a culmination of Pluto lingering in Jyeshta? Since

9-11th, the no-good news channels have taken to running a written line of

text beneath the story at the time. So much information is itself

unsettling.

Rahu is addictions and we are both addicted to oil and to fear. In Rohini,

Rahu is extremely seductive. Perhaps there will be enough people coming

together to protest by tuning out when Rahu dances through Krittika to make

a difference.

Sorry for babbling

c

-

"Nicholas" <jyotish108

Friday, November 22, 2002 12:01 AM

Re: [GJ] These days ~

> Dear Noel and Chandra

> I'll second you on that one . If you want to get back your balance throw

out

> your TV . We do not need to watch endless coverage of September 11 ,the

bali

> bombings , the Chechnya kidnappings etc. interspersed with voluptuos

models

> beaming because they have bought this or that product . We don't have

to

> have every local,national and international problem in our lounge rooms

..The

> atrocities afflicted by Hitler,Stalin and Tojo and their goons in the 40s

> were at least as bad as what is going on now . The mass media is

considered

> ruled by Rahu and thus it gives excessive attention to miscreants and

> proportionately neglects those who do good in their family,society work

and

> spiritual practises .

>

> Best Wishes

> Nicholas

> >

> > About a year ago a lady came into where I work. She was depressed

and

> > suicidal, look for a quick fix. Herbs etc. I ask her what she thought

was

> > cause this! she said that she could not take that fact that so many

women

> > were getting rapped. I asked her how often she watched the news. she

said

> > she watched it three times a day. I told her to turn the dam thing off,

> that

> > women have been getting rapped since the beginning of time. The only

> > difference is she was bringing it in to her living room three times a

day.

>

> Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya; Hare Krishna; Om Tat Sat

> : gjlist-

>

> Your use of is subject to

>

November 22, 2002

Dear Cynthia

Good points

Rahu as karaka for mass media represents distortion unnecessary fears

,obsessions etc .preoccupation with glamor rather than substance.

Another way of looking at it is that we pay our taxes for the government to

employ people to sort out the problems caused by terrorists , rapists

,criminals and so on and so we do not need to own every problem . Certainly

nobody has appointed me to solve all the world's problems .

Kind regards

Nicholas

-

"cynthia novak" <cynthianovak

Saturday, November 23, 2002 1:37 AM

Re: [GJ] These days ~

> Here's a 3rd from me. Last night I was really tired. Little sleep the

> night before and lots of heavy gardening during the day and rode my

exercise

> bike for 30 minutes in the evening. Just to let you know, I was tired and

> receptive. I went channel surfing and found nothing of value! All those

> channels and all that fear. Even the animal shows were about life and

death

> struggles. I watched the Food channel cooking shows and a landscaping

show.

> Even the latter frustrated me as the owners chopped down beautiful old

trees

> to make room for trendy new trees! Arrrgh!

>

> Well, now that I said that, I guess you know who won't be watching TV

> tonight.

>

> It seems that the media has long-since sold its value out to the lower

> chakras: sex and fear. Fear grabs the attention of the viewer. Even when

> there is no bad weather coming, they hype the storm 5 years ago to get you

> to stay tuned. Is this a culmination of Pluto lingering in Jyeshta?

Since

> 9-11th, the no-good news channels have taken to running a written line of

> text beneath the story at the time. So much information is itself

> unsettling.

>

> Rahu is addictions and we are both addicted to oil and to fear. In

Rohini,

> Rahu is extremely seductive. Perhaps there will be enough people coming

> together to protest by tuning out when Rahu dances through Krittika to

make

> a difference.

>

> Sorry for babbling

>

November 22, 2002

Dear Noel ~

Thank you for the information you have provided. I deeply appreciate

it. I hope you're feeling better now ... I know I am feeling more

positive than yesterday and I appreciate Nicholas and Cynthia for sharing

as well.

I would like to say that I understand that all is perfect in the world from

a cosmic perspective. That all this pain in the world is teaching us to do

it differently. Yet .. on a more subjective level we are definitely

experiencing a dark veil over the planet called Kali Yuga. My guru told me

that Kali Yuga is like a table with only 1 leg to hold it up with. Strange

analogy.

Thank you again for your feedback and perspective.

Warmly ~

Chandra

~

At 07:47 PM 11/21/02, you wrote:

>I sent this once at 3:59, But I did't see it come around Chandra. So here

>you go!!!

>

>Dear Chandra

> The Bach Flower Remedy for hopelessness, And I quote (We should

>understand more clearly why GORSE is for those who feel crushed and hopeless

>by the weight of their karma, pain and suffering; and CLEMATIS seeks

>withdrawal from a prison wherein sorrow and suffering reign supreme, i.e.,

>the physical body; and SWEET CHESTNUT mirrors the of isolation of those who

>have become, if only momentarily the seal of the planetary logos.) ESOTERIC

>HEALING by Dr. Douglas Baker. Page 193 "Capricorn"

>

> Not more then a few hours ago I sat in my chair crying like a baby,

>praying to god for help, I am so sick! I haven't cried like that since my

>mother died in 1988. The only thing that I could think of was a prayer

>circle at http;//www.yogananda-srf.org/aboutsrf/prayer.cgi where you inter

>your name and the monks pray every day for you for a month. After I entered

>my name a affirmation came up and I quote once more.( I relax and cast aside

>all mental burdens, allowing god to express through me his perfect love,

>peace and wisdom.) As I closed my eyes and repeated this over and over for a

>few minutes a sense of peace came over me. I slowly opened my eyes and the

>only sun in my room was reflecting of an object on my desk and lighting up

>the forehead of a 16 x 14 color picture of Paramahansa Yogananda that I have

>on my wall. I have had a few experiences like this before when I am

>desperate.

>

> Point being that times like this puts things in perspective; and YES I

>will go back to my studies from the SRF.

>

> I too was reared when respect seemed to be important and went through a

>faze where I saw the world as an ugly place, but I am different now! Thanks

>to SRF and the book " THE HOLY SCIENCE" by Swami Sri Yukeswar, Paramahansa

>Yogananda guru. With this book I saw the world in a evolutionary period that

>was unmistakable and clear. Everything is as it's suppose to be.

>

> About a year ago a lady came into where I work. She was depressed and

>suicidal, look for a quick fix. Herbs etc. I ask her what she thought was

>cause this! she said that she could not take that fact that so many women

>were getting rapped. I asked her how often she watched the news. she said

>she watched it three times a day. I told her to turn the dam thing off, that

>women have been getting rapped since the beginning of time. The only

>difference is she was bringing it in to her living room three times a day.

>

> Point being Chandra that the world is as it should be. It is our

>perception of it that hurts. Let it go Sweet girl and be with God! A lesson

>we all need to learn ..... Noel ......

>

>-

>Chandra Devi <wraye

><gjlist>

>Thursday, November 21, 2002 11:40 AM

>[GJ] These days ~

>

> > Dear list ~

> >

> > Being born in 1955 and raised in the Canadian, North American culture

> > ... I remember vividly the late 50's and right up until now. As a little

> > girl I closely observed and felt my way along in the circle of influence I

> > was born into. Thankfully, then, my parents and relatives and close

>family

> > friends seemed to be a happy enough, optimistic group of young families.

>In

> > those days, we never locked our doors. People weren't afraid of people

> > then. If something bad happened, it was an exception and people really

> > cared and helped each other. When we spoke to our elders we addressed them

> > with respect, calling them Mr. & Mrs. and the world seemed like a more

> > formal, friendly, sane and safe place to be.

> >

> > Fast forward to the present day. I am aware of a much different experience

> > of life. I feel my own fear and the fear of those around me, although

> > most people do not acknowledge the fear too often in plain language, with

> > the exception of Das ... bless his heart. Still ... it is can be seen

>and

> > detected easily in a number of other ways besides and including verbally.

> >

> > I realize that people born in the 70's and 80's and 90's do not have the

> > benefit of remembering the warmer , happier and more innocent times in

>the

> > 1950's. In fact it seems to me that during the process of evolution the

> > young people today and born today must experience life with a more dog

>eat

> > dog - only the strong survive mentality and I'd go as far as to say that

>we

> > are evolving into a different species from my elders and I. A species who

> > have not known the safety and innocence of an era when people were more

> > wholesome in many ways.

> >

> > The recent Michael Jackson press coverage which shows him dangling his 8

> > month old baby over the balcony of a 5 story apartment building in Berlin;

> > and then the next day, a picture of Michael Jackson and his two young

> > children at the zoo with their heads covered strangely. It makes me

> > shudder and quake almost. I hope and pray, for his children's sake that

> > someone with influence is going to recognize this as an unconscious cry

>for

> > help. It is much more difficult to intervene in the affairs of the rich

> > and famous because money buys so much! But, regardless of how much fame

>and

> > money Jackson has, intervention is clearly a necessity.

> >

> > The personal details of Michael Jackson's history are quite unknown to me

> > since I have never been a fan but I remember his as a child star and he

>had

> > the appearance of a regular African American boy. To look at him now

> > reveals that he has been though a process of prolific and intense plastic

> > surgeries which have caused his features to resemble a rather androgynous,

> > Caucasian looking individual. He is reportedly a gay pedophile who has

> > arranged out of court and private settlements with his victims' families.

> > As well, I do know that he pays women to father children for him to keep.

> > And if this isn't enough to alarm you ... now he is dangling his

> > defenseless baby out of a balcony and covering his toddlers heads

>strangely

> > as they walk around a public Zoo.

> >

> > As a world society and civilization, since the 1950's, our social

> > skills, values and integrity have adjusted down; down; down and down again

> > so slowly and gradually that we haven't realized how low we have actually

> > deteriorated, individually and collectively and certainly as our

>brothers'

> > keepers.

> >

> > I play backgammon at a multi-cultural Internet game site where people use

> > monikers rather than their real names. Believe me ... there are a lot of

> > very hurt people in the world. Most people are barely civil to each other

> > at best. Behaviors range from falling in love with each other sight

>unseen

> > and most often already married to other people to the majority of folks

>who

> > often don't even bother saying hello or acknowledging each other - even

> > though they will spend the next 15 - 30 minutes together in a game

> > room. At worst, people on those sites act as predators and name callers

> > exhibiting the worst kinds of prejudice and disrespect for each

> > other. When I've inquired directed as to why they behave this way, many

> > tell me that to them, the experience is not real ... since it's

> > anonymous ... but ... to me ... every moment is real and counts. I am

> > now conducting an informal survey of the people with no social skills and

> > so far I'm sorry to report that the worst offenders of hate are the

>Americans.

> >

> > We can only control our own words and behaviors but it is very important

> > that we do. Being kind or at the very least socialized enough to say hello

> > is our own responsibility and contributes to the higher good. Please don't

> > give up being kind even when you are in the midst of evil. There are few

> > leaders but many followers among us and it is proven that people have a

> > wild wolf pack mentality in groups. We seem to imitate and practice the

> > most dominant social behaviors surrounding us, matching good with good

>and

> > evil with evil. It is crucial in these times to choose the high road

> > whenever possible.

> >

> > In Vedic astrology we don't use the outer planets because of their

>distance

> > from the Earth affects us collectively more than individually , yet, this

> > would be a great time to study them to determine the astrological reasons

> > we have collectively turned against each other with such wrath. Since the

> > turn of this century, life seems to have speeded up and we notice and

> > experience more harshness in human dynamics.

> >

> > I'm feeling quite hopeless about our civilization right now. Someone, I

> > apologize for not remembering who, mentioned there is a Bach Flower remedy

> > available for hopelessness. Does anyone know which Bach Flower Remedy it

> > is? I would appreciate knowing, so I can buy some.

> >

> > God Bless us all ~

> > Chandra Devi

> > ~

> >

> > Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya; Hare Krishna; Om Tat Sat

> > : gjlist-

> >

> > Your use of is subject to

> >

>

>----------

>----

>

> >

> > ---

> > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.

> > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

> > Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release 6/20/02

> >

>

>Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya; Hare Krishna; Om Tat Sat

>: gjlist-

>

>Your use of is subject to

>

>---

>Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.

>Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

>Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release 6/20/02

---

Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.

Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release 6/20/02

November 22, 2002

Dear Chandra

Nice to hear that you are feeling more positive about things .

Another point is that the 50s were a time of endemic racism against

indigenous and black people .So if we consider carefully some things are

definetly better nowadays than they were 50 years ago .

Warm regards

Nicholas

-

"Chandra Devi" <wraye

Saturday, November 23, 2002 5:49 AM

Re: [GJ] These days ~

> Dear Noel ~

>

> Thank you for the information you have provided. I deeply appreciate

> it. I hope you're feeling better now ... I know I am feeling more

> positive than yesterday and I appreciate Nicholas and Cynthia for sharing

> as well.

>

> I would like to say that I understand that all is perfect in the world

from

> a cosmic perspective. That all this pain in the world is teaching us to

do

> it differently. Yet .. on a more subjective level we are definitely

> experiencing a dark veil over the planet called Kali Yuga. My guru told me

> that Kali Yuga is like a table with only 1 leg to hold it up with.

Strange

> analogy.

>

> Thank you again for your feedback and perspective.

>

> Warmly ~

> Chandra

> ~

>

> At 07:47 PM 11/21/02, you wrote:

>

> >I sent this once at 3:59, But I did't see it come around Chandra. So here

> >you go!!!

> >

> >Dear Chandra

> > The Bach Flower Remedy for hopelessness, And I quote (We should

> >understand more clearly why GORSE is for those who feel crushed and

hopeless

> >by the weight of their karma, pain and suffering; and CLEMATIS seeks

> >withdrawal from a prison wherein sorrow and suffering reign supreme,

i.e.,

> >the physical body; and SWEET CHESTNUT mirrors the of isolation of those

who

> >have become, if only momentarily the seal of the planetary logos.)

ESOTERIC

> >HEALING by Dr. Douglas Baker. Page 193 "Capricorn"

> >

> > Not more then a few hours ago I sat in my chair crying like a baby,

> >praying to god for help, I am so sick! I haven't cried like that since my

> >mother died in 1988. The only thing that I could think of was a prayer

> >circle at http;//www.yogananda-srf.org/aboutsrf/prayer.cgi where you

inter

> >your name and the monks pray every day for you for a month. After I

entered

> >my name a affirmation came up and I quote once more.( I relax and cast

aside

> >all mental burdens, allowing god to express through me his perfect love,

> >peace and wisdom.) As I closed my eyes and repeated this over and over

for a

> >few minutes a sense of peace came over me. I slowly opened my eyes and

the

> >only sun in my room was reflecting of an object on my desk and lighting

up

> >the forehead of a 16 x 14 color picture of Paramahansa Yogananda that I

have

> >on my wall. I have had a few experiences like this before when I am

> >desperate.

> >

> > Point being that times like this puts things in perspective; and

YES I

> >will go back to my studies from the SRF.

> >

> > I too was reared when respect seemed to be important and went

through a

> >faze where I saw the world as an ugly place, but I am different now!

Thanks

> >to SRF and the book " THE HOLY SCIENCE" by Swami Sri Yukeswar,

Paramahansa

> >Yogananda guru. With this book I saw the world in a evolutionary period

that

> >was unmistakable and clear. Everything is as it's suppose to be.

> >

> > About a year ago a lady came into where I work. She was depressed

and

> >suicidal, look for a quick fix. Herbs etc. I ask her what she thought was

> >cause this! she said that she could not take that fact that so many women

> >were getting rapped. I asked her how often she watched the news. she said

> >she watched it three times a day. I told her to turn the dam thing off,

that

> >women have been getting rapped since the beginning of time. The only

> >difference is she was bringing it in to her living room three times a

day.

> >

> > Point being Chandra that the world is as it should be. It is our

> >perception of it that hurts. Let it go Sweet girl and be with God! A

lesson

> >we all need to learn ..... Noel ......

> >

> >-

> >Chandra Devi <wraye

> ><gjlist>

> >Thursday, November 21, 2002 11:40 AM

> >[GJ] These days ~

> >

> > > Dear list ~

> > >

> > > Being born in 1955 and raised in the Canadian, North American culture

> > > ... I remember vividly the late 50's and right up until now. As a

little

> > > girl I closely observed and felt my way along in the circle of

influence I

> > > was born into. Thankfully, then, my parents and relatives and close

> >family

> > > friends seemed to be a happy enough, optimistic group of young

families.

> >In

> > > those days, we never locked our doors. People weren't afraid of people

> > > then. If something bad happened, it was an exception and people

really

> > > cared and helped each other. When we spoke to our elders we addressed

them

> > > with respect, calling them Mr. & Mrs. and the world seemed like a more

> > > formal, friendly, sane and safe place to be.

> > >

> > > Fast forward to the present day. I am aware of a much different

experience

> > > of life. I feel my own fear and the fear of those around me,

although

> > > most people do not acknowledge the fear too often in plain language,

with

> > > the exception of Das ... bless his heart. Still ... it is can be

seen

> >and

> > > detected easily in a number of other ways besides and including

verbally.

> > >

> > > I realize that people born in the 70's and 80's and 90's do not have

the

> > > benefit of remembering the warmer , happier and more innocent times

in

> >the

> > > 1950's. In fact it seems to me that during the process of evolution

the

> > > young people today and born today must experience life with a more

dog

> >eat

> > > dog - only the strong survive mentality and I'd go as far as to say

that

> >we

> > > are evolving into a different species from my elders and I. A species

who

> > > have not known the safety and innocence of an era when people were

more

> > > wholesome in many ways.

> > >

> > > The recent Michael Jackson press coverage which shows him dangling his

8

> > > month old baby over the balcony of a 5 story apartment building in

Berlin;

> > > and then the next day, a picture of Michael Jackson and his two young

> > > children at the zoo with their heads covered strangely. It makes me

> > > shudder and quake almost. I hope and pray, for his children's sake

that

> > > someone with influence is going to recognize this as an unconscious

cry

> >for

> > > help. It is much more difficult to intervene in the affairs of the

rich

> > > and famous because money buys so much! But, regardless of how much

fame

> >and

> > > money Jackson has, intervention is clearly a necessity.

> > >

> > > The personal details of Michael Jackson's history are quite unknown

to me

> > > since I have never been a fan but I remember his as a child star and

he

> >had

> > > the appearance of a regular African American boy. To look at him now

> > > reveals that he has been though a process of prolific and intense

plastic

> > > surgeries which have caused his features to resemble a rather

androgynous,

> > > Caucasian looking individual. He is reportedly a gay pedophile who

has

> > > arranged out of court and private settlements with his victims'

families.

> > > As well, I do know that he pays women to father children for him to

keep.

> > > And if this isn't enough to alarm you ... now he is dangling his

> > > defenseless baby out of a balcony and covering his toddlers heads

> >strangely

> > > as they walk around a public Zoo.

> > >

> > > As a world society and civilization, since the 1950's, our social

> > > skills, values and integrity have adjusted down; down; down and down

again

> > > so slowly and gradually that we haven't realized how low we have

actually

> > > deteriorated, individually and collectively and certainly as our

> >brothers'

> > > keepers.

> > >

> > > I play backgammon at a multi-cultural Internet game site where people

use

> > > monikers rather than their real names. Believe me ... there are a lot

of

> > > very hurt people in the world. Most people are barely civil to each

other

> > > at best. Behaviors range from falling in love with each other sight

> >unseen

> > > and most often already married to other people to the majority of

folks

> >who

> > > often don't even bother saying hello or acknowledging each other -

even

> > > though they will spend the next 15 - 30 minutes together in a game

> > > room. At worst, people on those sites act as predators and name

callers

> > > exhibiting the worst kinds of prejudice and disrespect for each

> > > other. When I've inquired directed as to why they behave this way,

many

> > > tell me that to them, the experience is not real ... since it's

> > > anonymous ... but ... to me ... every moment is real and counts. I

am

> > > now conducting an informal survey of the people with no social skills

and

> > > so far I'm sorry to report that the worst offenders of hate are the

> >Americans.

> > >

> > > We can only control our own words and behaviors but it is very

important

> > > that we do. Being kind or at the very least socialized enough to say

hello

> > > is our own responsibility and contributes to the higher good. Please

don't

> > > give up being kind even when you are in the midst of evil. There are

few

> > > leaders but many followers among us and it is proven that people have

a

> > > wild wolf pack mentality in groups. We seem to imitate and practice

the

> > > most dominant social behaviors surrounding us, matching good with

good

> >and

> > > evil with evil. It is crucial in these times to choose the high road

> > > whenever possible.

> > >

> > > In Vedic astrology we don't use the outer planets because of their

> >distance

> > > from the Earth affects us collectively more than individually , yet,

this

> > > would be a great time to study them to determine the astrological

reasons

> > > we have collectively turned against each other with such wrath. Since

the

> > > turn of this century, life seems to have speeded up and we notice and

> > > experience more harshness in human dynamics.

> > >

> > > I'm feeling quite hopeless about our civilization right now. Someone,

I

> > > apologize for not remembering who, mentioned there is a Bach Flower

remedy

> > > available for hopelessness. Does anyone know which Bach Flower Remedy

it

> > > is? I would appreciate knowing, so I can buy some.

> > >

> > > God Bless us all ~

> > > Chandra Devi

> > > ~

> > >

> > > Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya; Hare Krishna; Om Tat Sat

> > > : gjlist-

> > >

> > > Your use of is subject to

> > >

> >

>

>---------

-

> >----

> >

> > >

> > > ---

> > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.

> > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

> > > Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release 6/20/02

> > >

> >

> >Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya; Hare Krishna; Om Tat Sat

> >: gjlist-

> >

> >Your use of is subject to

> >

> >---

> >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.

> >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

> >Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release 6/20/02

>

> Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya; Hare Krishna; Om Tat Sat

> : gjlist-

>

> Your use of is subject to

>

----------

----

>

> ---

> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.

> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

> Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release 6/20/02

>

November 22, 2002

There were/are, according to Hinduism, four legs of dharma, the last

remaining in Kali Yuga is said to be Truthfulness, the only thing that can

save this age, the ones missing be cleanliness, austerity, and mercy.

So it is said. Whatever. I know I appreciate truth. It helps. Fear makes us

avoid it- like we don't tell people things, fearing to hurt them, and thus

without that honesty, they have no real guidance.

I have been slammed by my nature, into humility moreso, and it feels good.

The truth when accepted is better than illusions. Jacko, maybe he needs a

deflating, a dose of reality, to mention Chandras earlier mention of him.

Pain humiliates, brings us real. Hopefully the Earth won't need a huge jolt.

Hopefully not, but we'll see.

I wish you all peace and contentment. I'm finding it more, in a smaller

world, a smaller head, a more humble space.

peace all

r

November 22, 2002

I am put in mind of a story from a friend of mine, demonstrates how we

'remember' the good

and forget the bad.

He was shopping in an upscale men's clothing store. The radio was on in the

store and they were

playing an early rock and roll song from the fifties, the 'retro radio' station

in the area. The young, black

clerk, in his impeccable suit and tie, paused for a minute in helping my friend

as the song changed.

He got a look of whistful nostalgia in his eyes, and said, "Oh, I wish I could

have lived in that era!"

My friend, looked at the man agast. It was obvious that he had been born circa

1982 or so. He

responded, "You what?? If you had been born in the fifties, you would more than

likely be wearing

a faded pair of blue jeans, an old shirt, be working in 'Steel Town' (the

foundry section of Chicago), and

living in a walkup. You surely wouldn't be working here, wearing that suit, or

have any of the nice

things you have! What are you, nuts??"

I remember the fifties, we spent our childhood in fear of Nuclear Annihilation

(Duck and Cover), listened

to Joe McCarthy, Richard Nixon, J. Edgar Hoover, and Joe Cohen (AKA "Citizen

Cohen") find Commies

under every bed, parkbench and garbage can. We had racisim (Blacks, Jews,

Catholics were all fair

game) nationalism, and mores that bordered on Puritanical (unmarried mothers

were scorned and shunned

in society, instead of being treated as though they had a slip of judgement, BTW

the males were NEVER

at fault; women belonged at home, in the kitchen making dinner for their

hardworking men. Communication

and entertainment was radio, and movies. Sometimes TV, but mostly it was on the

fritz.)

Things are better now, albeit never perfect. While they are better, we

sometimes mistake the complexity

of modern life for evil. The trick is to make your life less complex, by

elimination of the extraneous things

that clutter up the scenery. It is hard to pick the apples in an orchard, if

there are brambles growing between

the trees.

Namaste'

John

*********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********

On 11/23/02 at 5:57 AM Nicholas wrote:

>Dear Chandra

>Nice to hear that you are feeling more positive about things .

>Another point is that the 50s were a time of endemic racism against

>indigenous and black people .So if we consider carefully some things are

>definetly better nowadays than they were 50 years ago .

>Warm regards

>Nicholas

Strange but stupid:

"One of the main causes of the fall of the Roman Empire was that, lacking zero,

they had no way to indicate successful termination of their C programs"

(Weren't Roman C programs always 500 lines long?)

John F (Jack) Melka

November 22, 2002

Dear Chanda

I know that most people who are aware of the hindu scriptures Believe

that we are still in the Kali Yuga, But Swami Sri Yukteswar (a self

realized master) Has pointed out this error and has proven in his one and

only book " The Holy Science" That we entered the Dwapara Yuga in 1894.

Thus proved buy the present on going discovery of all the electrical forces

on which the creation depends for it's existence. So as we have gone from

the Iron age to the bronze age and its only a hop, skip, and jump to the

silver age and then on to the golden age. It's easier to maintain a positive

mood (unless your sick) piece of cake uh! At least were headed in the right

direction. We could have been in the descending age instead of the ascending

age and just entering the 1,200 year Kali Yuga which will arrive again in

25,308 years if my calculations are correct.But I plane on being out of here

by then. I don't really want to go around again, I think I've had enough.

Bless You my friend ... Noel ...

-

Chandra Devi <wraye

Friday, November 22, 2002 10:49 AM

Re: [GJ] These days ~

> Dear Noel ~

>

> Thank you for the information you have provided. I deeply appreciate

> it. I hope you're feeling better now ... I know I am feeling more

> positive than yesterday and I appreciate Nicholas and Cynthia for sharing

> as well.

>

> I would like to say that I understand that all is perfect in the world

from

> a cosmic perspective. That all this pain in the world is teaching us to

do

> it differently. Yet .. on a more subjective level we are definitely

> experiencing a dark veil over the planet called Kali Yuga. My guru told me

> that Kali Yuga is like a table with only 1 leg to hold it up with.

Strange

> analogy.

>

> Thank you again for your feedback and perspective.

>

> Warmly ~

> Chandra

> ~

>

> At 07:47 PM 11/21/02, you wrote:

>

> >I sent this once at 3:59, But I did't see it come around Chandra. So here

> >you go!!!

> >

> >Dear Chandra

> > The Bach Flower Remedy for hopelessness, And I quote (We should

> >understand more clearly why GORSE is for those who feel crushed and

hopeless

> >by the weight of their karma, pain and suffering; and CLEMATIS seeks

> >withdrawal from a prison wherein sorrow and suffering reign supreme,

i.e.,

> >the physical body; and SWEET CHESTNUT mirrors the of isolation of those

who

> >have become, if only momentarily the seal of the planetary logos.)

ESOTERIC

> >HEALING by Dr. Douglas Baker. Page 193 "Capricorn"

> >

> > Not more then a few hours ago I sat in my chair crying like a baby,

> >praying to god for help, I am so sick! I haven't cried like that since my

> >mother died in 1988. The only thing that I could think of was a prayer

> >circle at http;//www.yogananda-srf.org/aboutsrf/prayer.cgi where you

inter

> >your name and the monks pray every day for you for a month. After I

entered

> >my name a affirmation came up and I quote once more.( I relax and cast

aside

> >all mental burdens, allowing god to express through me his perfect love,

> >peace and wisdom.) As I closed my eyes and repeated this over and over

for a

> >few minutes a sense of peace came over me. I slowly opened my eyes and

the

> >only sun in my room was reflecting of an object on my desk and lighting

up

> >the forehead of a 16 x 14 color picture of Paramahansa Yogananda that I

have

> >on my wall. I have had a few experiences like this before when I am

> >desperate.

> >

> > Point being that times like this puts things in perspective; and

YES I

> >will go back to my studies from the SRF.

> >

> > I too was reared when respect seemed to be important and went

through a

> >faze where I saw the world as an ugly place, but I am different now!

Thanks

> >to SRF and the book " THE HOLY SCIENCE" by Swami Sri Yukeswar,

Paramahansa

> >Yogananda guru. With this book I saw the world in a evolutionary period

that

> >was unmistakable and clear. Everything is as it's suppose to be.

> >

> > About a year ago a lady came into where I work. She was depressed

and

> >suicidal, look for a quick fix. Herbs etc. I ask her what she thought was

> >cause this! she said that she could not take that fact that so many women

> >were getting rapped. I asked her how often she watched the news. she said

> >she watched it three times a day. I told her to turn the dam thing off,

that

> >women have been getting rapped since the beginning of time. The only

> >difference is she was bringing it in to her living room three times a

day.

> >

> > Point being Chandra that the world is as it should be. It is our

> >perception of it that hurts. Let it go Sweet girl and be with God! A

lesson

> >we all need to learn ..... Noel ......

> >

> >-

> >Chandra Devi <wraye

> ><gjlist>

> >Thursday, November 21, 2002 11:40 AM

> >[GJ] These days ~

> >

> > > Dear list ~

> > >

> > > Being born in 1955 and raised in the Canadian, North American culture

> > > ... I remember vividly the late 50's and right up until now. As a

little

> > > girl I closely observed and felt my way along in the circle of

influence I

> > > was born into. Thankfully, then, my parents and relatives and close

> >family

> > > friends seemed to be a happy enough, optimistic group of young

families.

> >In

> > > those days, we never locked our doors. People weren't afraid of people

> > > then. If something bad happened, it was an exception and people

really

> > > cared and helped each other. When we spoke to our elders we addressed

them

> > > with respect, calling them Mr. & Mrs. and the world seemed like a more

> > > formal, friendly, sane and safe place to be.

> > >

> > > Fast forward to the present day. I am aware of a much different

experience

> > > of life. I feel my own fear and the fear of those around me,

although

> > > most people do not acknowledge the fear too often in plain language,

with

> > > the exception of Das ... bless his heart. Still ... it is can be

seen

> >and

> > > detected easily in a number of other ways besides and including

verbally.

> > >

> > > I realize that people born in the 70's and 80's and 90's do not have

the

> > > benefit of remembering the warmer , happier and more innocent times

in

> >the

> > > 1950's. In fact it seems to me that during the process of evolution

the

> > > young people today and born today must experience life with a more

dog

> >eat

> > > dog - only the strong survive mentality and I'd go as far as to say

that

> >we

> > > are evolving into a different species from my elders and I. A species

who

> > > have not known the safety and innocence of an era when people were

more

> > > wholesome in many ways.

> > >

> > > The recent Michael Jackson press coverage which shows him dangling his

8

> > > month old baby over the balcony of a 5 story apartment building in

Berlin;

> > > and then the next day, a picture of Michael Jackson and his two young

> > > children at the zoo with their heads covered strangely. It makes me

> > > shudder and quake almost. I hope and pray, for his children's sake

that

> > > someone with influence is going to recognize this as an unconscious

cry

> >for

> > > help. It is much more difficult to intervene in the affairs of the

rich

> > > and famous because money buys so much! But, regardless of how much

fame

> >and

> > > money Jackson has, intervention is clearly a necessity.

> > >

> > > The personal details of Michael Jackson's history are quite unknown

to me

> > > since I have never been a fan but I remember his as a child star and

he

> >had

> > > the appearance of a regular African American boy. To look at him now

> > > reveals that he has been though a process of prolific and intense

plastic

> > > surgeries which have caused his features to resemble a rather

androgynous,

> > > Caucasian looking individual. He is reportedly a gay pedophile who

has

> > > arranged out of court and private settlements with his victims'

families.

> > > As well, I do know that he pays women to father children for him to

keep.

> > > And if this isn't enough to alarm you ... now he is dangling his

> > > defenseless baby out of a balcony and covering his toddlers heads

> >strangely

> > > as they walk around a public Zoo.

> > >

> > > As a world society and civilization, since the 1950's, our social

> > > skills, values and integrity have adjusted down; down; down and down

again

> > > so slowly and gradually that we haven't realized how low we have

actually

> > > deteriorated, individually and collectively and certainly as our

> >brothers'

> > > keepers.

> > >

> > > I play backgammon at a multi-cultural Internet game site where people

use

> > > monikers rather than their real names. Believe me ... there are a lot

of

> > > very hurt people in the world. Most people are barely civil to each

other

> > > at best. Behaviors range from falling in love with each other sight

> >unseen

> > > and most often already married to other people to the majority of

folks

> >who

> > > often don't even bother saying hello or acknowledging each other -

even

> > > though they will spend the next 15 - 30 minutes together in a game

> > > room. At worst, people on those sites act as predators and name

callers

> > > exhibiting the worst kinds of prejudice and disrespect for each

> > > other. When I've inquired directed as to why they behave this way,

many

> > > tell me that to them, the experience is not real ... since it's

> > > anonymous ... but ... to me ... every moment is real and counts. I

am

> > > now conducting an informal survey of the people with no social skills

and

> > > so far I'm sorry to report that the worst offenders of hate are the

> >Americans.

> > >

> > > We can only control our own words and behaviors but it is very

important

> > > that we do. Being kind or at the very least socialized enough to say

hello

> > > is our own responsibility and contributes to the higher good. Please

don't

> > > give up being kind even when you are in the midst of evil. There are

few

> > > leaders but many followers among us and it is proven that people have

a

> > > wild wolf pack mentality in groups. We seem to imitate and practice

the

> > > most dominant social behaviors surrounding us, matching good with

good

> >and

> > > evil with evil. It is crucial in these times to choose the high road

> > > whenever possible.

> > >

> > > In Vedic astrology we don't use the outer planets because of their

> >distance

> > > from the Earth affects us collectively more than individually , yet,

this

> > > would be a great time to study them to determine the astrological

reasons

> > > we have collectively turned against each other with such wrath. Since

the

> > > turn of this century, life seems to have speeded up and we notice and

> > > experience more harshness in human dynamics.

> > >

> > > I'm feeling quite hopeless about our civilization right now. Someone,

I

> > > apologize for not remembering who, mentioned there is a Bach Flower

remedy

> > > available for hopelessness. Does anyone know which Bach Flower Remedy

it

> > > is? I would appreciate knowing, so I can buy some.

> > >

> > > God Bless us all ~

> > > Chandra Devi

> > > ~

> > >

> > > Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya; Hare Krishna; Om Tat Sat

> > > : gjlist-

> > >

> > > Your use of is subject to

> > >

> >

>

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> >

> > >

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> > >

> >

> >Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya; Hare Krishna; Om Tat Sat

> >: gjlist-

> >

> >Your use of is subject to

> >

> >---

> >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.

> >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

> >Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release 6/20/02

>

> Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya; Hare Krishna; Om Tat Sat

> : gjlist-

>

> Your use of is subject to

>

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> ---

> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.

> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

> Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release 6/20/02

>

November 23, 2002

Om Jum Sah. Vyam Vyaasadevaaya Namah. Sah Jum Om

Dear Noel,

Others have pointed out Sri Yukteswars error. Namely confusing Years of the Gods

with Years of Human beings.

Kali Yuga takes 1200 years of the Gods.

1 year of the Gods, is equal to 360 years of Human beings. This is given in the Vishnu Purana.

So; 1200x360.

Best wishesVisti---Bhagavad Purana: http://www.srimadbhagavatam.orgBrihat

Parasara Hora Shastra:

vedic astrologybphs.zipiTRANS 99 Font:

http://www.omkarananda-ashram.org/Sanskrit/Itranslt.html

-

"Noel" <sattva (AT) pacbell (DOT) net>

Friday, November 22, 2002 11:21 PM

Re: [GJ] These days ~

> > Dear Chanda> I know that most people who are aware of the hindu

scriptures Believe> that we are still in the Kali Yuga, But Swami Sri

Yukteswar (a self> realized master) Has pointed out this error and has proven

in his one and> only book " The Holy Science" That we entered the Dwapara Yuga

in 1894.> Thus proved buy the present on going discovery of all the electrical

forces> on which the creation depends for it's existence. So as we have gone

from> the Iron age to the bronze age and its only a hop, skip, and jump to the>

silver age and then on to the golden age. It's easier to maintain a positive>

mood (unless your sick) piece of cake uh! At least were headed in the right>

direction. We could have been in the descending age instead of the ascending>

age and just entering the 1,200 year Kali Yuga which will arrive again in>

25,308 years if my calculations are correct.But I plane on being out of here>

by then. I don't really want to go around again, I think I've had enough.>

Bless You my friend ... Noel ...> -> Chandra

Devi <wraye (AT) netidea (DOT) com>> <gjlist>> Friday, November

22, 2002 10:49 AM> Re: [GJ] These days ~> > > > Dear Noel ~> >> >

Thank you for the information you have provided. I deeply appreciate> > it. I

hope you're feeling better now ... I know I am feeling more> > positive than

yesterday and I appreciate Nicholas and Cynthia for sharing> > as well.> >> > I

would like to say that I understand that all is perfect in the world> from> > a

cosmic perspective. That all this pain in the world is teaching us to> do> >

it differently. Yet .. on a more subjective level we are definitely> >

experiencing a dark veil over the planet called Kali Yuga. My guru told me> >

that Kali Yuga is like a table with only 1 leg to hold it up with.> Strange> >

analogy.> >> > Thank you again for your feedback and perspective.> >> > Warmly

~> > Chandra> > ~> >> > At 07:47 PM 11/21/02, you wrote:> >> > >I sent this

once at 3:59, But I did't see it come around Chandra. So here> > >you go!!!> >

>> > >Dear Chandra> > > The Bach Flower Remedy for hopelessness, And I

quote (We should> > >understand more clearly why GORSE is for those who feel

crushed and> hopeless> > >by the weight of their karma, pain and suffering; and

CLEMATIS seeks> > >withdrawal from a prison wherein sorrow and suffering reign

supreme,> i.e.,> > >the physical body; and SWEET CHESTNUT mirrors the of

isolation of those> who> > >have become, if only momentarily the seal of the

planetary logos.)> ESOTERIC> > >HEALING by Dr. Douglas Baker. Page 193

"Capricorn"> > >> > > Not more then a few hours ago I sat in my chair

crying like a baby,> > >praying to god for help, I am so sick! I haven't cried

like that since my> > >mother died in 1988. The only thing that I could think

of was a prayer> > >circle at http;//www.yogananda-srf.org/aboutsrf/prayer.cgi

where you> inter> > >your name and the monks pray every day for you for a

month. After I> entered> > >my name a affirmation came up and I quote once

more.( I relax and cast> aside> > >all mental burdens, allowing god to express

through me his perfect love,> > >peace and wisdom.) As I closed my eyes and

repeated this over and over> for a> > >few minutes a sense of peace came over

me. I slowly opened my eyes and> the> > >only sun in my room was reflecting of

an object on my desk and lighting> up> > >the forehead of a 16 x 14 color

picture of Paramahansa Yogananda that I> have> > >on my wall. I have had a few

experiences like this before when I am> > >desperate.> > >> > > Point

being that times like this puts things in perspective; and> YES I> > >will go

back to my studies from the SRF.> > >> > > I too was reared when respect

seemed to be important and went> through a> > >faze where I saw the world as an

ugly place, but I am different now!> Thanks> > >to SRF and the book " THE HOLY

SCIENCE" by Swami Sri Yukeswar,> Paramahansa> > >Yogananda guru. With this book

I saw the world in a evolutionary period> that> > >was unmistakable and clear.

Everything is as it's suppose to be.> > >> > > About a year ago a lady came

into where I work. She was depressed> and> > >suicidal, look for a quick fix.

Herbs etc. I ask her what she thought was> > >cause this! she said that she

could not take that fact that so many women> > >were getting rapped. I asked

her how often she watched the news. she said> > >she watched it three times a

day. I told her to turn the dam thing off,> that> > >women have been getting

rapped since the beginning of time. The only> > >difference is she was bringing

it in to her living room three times a> day.> > >> > > Point being Chandra

that the world is as it should be. It is our> > >perception of it that hurts.

Let it go Sweet girl and be with God! A> lesson> > >we all need to learn .....

Noel ......> > >> > >> > >-> > >Chandra Devi

<wraye (AT) netidea (DOT) com>> > ><gjlist>> > >Thursday,

November 21, 2002 11:40 AM> > >[GJ] These days ~> > >> > >> > > > Dear

list ~> > > >> > > > Being born in 1955 and raised in the Canadian, North

American culture> > > > ... I remember vividly the late 50's and right up

until now. As a> little> > > > girl I closely observed and felt my way along

in the circle of> influence I> > > > was born into. Thankfully, then, my

parents and relatives and close> > >family> > > > friends seemed to be a happy

enough, optimistic group of young> families.> > >In> > > > those days, we never

locked our doors. People weren't afraid of people> > > > then. If something bad

happened, it was an exception and people> really> > > > cared and helped each

other. When we spoke to our elders we addressed> them> > > > with respect,

calling them Mr. & Mrs. and the world seemed like a more> > > > formal,

friendly, sane and safe place to be.> > > >> > > > Fast forward to the present

day. I am aware of a much different> experience> > > > of life. I feel my own

fear and the fear of those around me,> although> > > > most people do not

acknowledge the fear too often in plain language,> with> > > > the exception of

Das ... bless his heart. Still ... it is can be> seen> > >and> > > > detected

easily in a number of other ways besides and including> verbally.> > > >> > > >

I realize that people born in the 70's and 80's and 90's do not have> the> > > >

benefit of remembering the warmer , happier and more innocent times> in> >

>the> > > > 1950's. In fact it seems to me that during the process of

evolution> the> > > > young people today and born today must experience life

with a more> dog> > >eat> > > > dog - only the strong survive mentality and I'd

go as far as to say> that> > >we> > > > are evolving into a different species

from my elders and I. A species> who> > > > have not known the safety and

innocence of an era when people were> more> > > > wholesome in many ways.> > >

>> > > > The recent Michael Jackson press coverage which shows him dangling

his> 8> > > > month old baby over the balcony of a 5 story apartment building

in> Berlin;> > > > and then the next day, a picture of Michael Jackson and his

two young> > > > children at the zoo with their heads covered strangely. It

makes me> > > > shudder and quake almost. I hope and pray, for his children's

sake> that> > > > someone with influence is going to recognize this as an

unconscious> cry> > >for> > > > help. It is much more difficult to intervene

in the affairs of the> rich> > > > and famous because money buys so much! But,

regardless of how much> fame> > >and> > > > money Jackson has, intervention is

clearly a necessity.> > > >> > > > The personal details of Michael Jackson's

history are quite unknown> to me> > > > since I have never been a fan but I

remember his as a child star and> he> > >had> > > > the appearance of a

regular African American boy. To look at him now> > > > reveals that he has

been though a process of prolific and intense> plastic> > > > surgeries which

have caused his features to resemble a rather> androgynous,> > > > Caucasian

looking individual. He is reportedly a gay pedophile who> has> > > > arranged

out of court and private settlements with his victims'> families.> > > > As

well, I do know that he pays women to father children for him to> keep.> > > >

And if this isn't enough to alarm you ... now he is dangling his> > > >

defenseless baby out of a balcony and covering his toddlers heads> >

>strangely> > > > as they walk around a public Zoo.> > > >> > > > As a world

society and civilization, since the 1950's, our social> > > > skills, values

and integrity have adjusted down; down; down and down> again> > > > so slowly

and gradually that we haven't realized how low we have> actually> > > >

deteriorated, individually and collectively and certainly as our> >

>brothers'> > > > keepers.> > > >> > > > I play backgammon at a multi-cultural

Internet game site where people> use> > > > monikers rather than their real

names. Believe me ... there are a lot> of> > > > very hurt people in the

world. Most people are barely civil to each> other> > > > at best. Behaviors

range from falling in love with each other sight> > >unseen> > > > and most

often already married to other people to the majority of> folks> > >who> > > >

often don't even bother saying hello or acknowledging each other -> even> > > >

though they will spend the next 15 - 30 minutes together in a game> > > > room.

At worst, people on those sites act as predators and name> callers> > > >

exhibiting the worst kinds of prejudice and disrespect for each> > > > other.

When I've inquired directed as to why they behave this way,> many> > > > tell

me that to them, the experience is not real ... since it's> > > > anonymous

... but ... to me ... every moment is real and counts. I> am> > > > now

conducting an informal survey of the people with no social skills> and> > > >

so far I'm sorry to report that the worst offenders of hate are the> >

>Americans.> > > >> > > > We can only control our own words and behaviors but

it is very> important> > > > that we do. Being kind or at the very least

socialized enough to say> hello> > > > is our own responsibility and

contributes to the higher good. Please> don't> > > > give up being kind even

when you are in the midst of evil. There are> few> > > > leaders but many

followers among us and it is proven that people have> a> > > > wild wolf pack

mentality in groups. We seem to imitate and practice> the> > > > most

dominant social behaviors surrounding us, matching good with> good> > >and> >

> > evil with evil. It is crucial in these times to choose the high road> > >

> whenever possible.> > > >> > > > In Vedic astrology we don't use the outer

planets because of their> > >distance> > > > from the Earth affects us

collectively more than individually , yet,> this> > > > would be a great time

to study them to determine the astrological> reasons> > > > we have

collectively turned against each other with such wrath. Since> the> > > > turn

of this century, life seems to have speeded up and we notice and> > > >

experience more harshness in human dynamics.> > > >> > > > I'm feeling quite

hopeless about our civilization right now. Someone,> I> > > > apologize for

not remembering who, mentioned there is a Bach Flower> remedy> > > > available

for hopelessness. Does anyone know which Bach Flower Remedy> it> > > > is? I

would appreciate knowing, so I can buy some.> > > >> > > > God Bless us all ~>

> > > Chandra Devi> > > > ~> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > >

>> > > >> > > > Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya; Hare Krishna; Om Tat Sat> > > > To

, send an email to: gjlist-> > > >

http://www.goravani.com> > > >> > > >> > > > Your use of is

subject to> > > > >> > > >> > >> > >> >>

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Free.> > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).> > > >

Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release 6/20/02> > > >> > >> >

>> > >> > >> > >Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya; Hare Krishna; Om Tat Sat> > >To

, send an email to: gjlist-> >

>http://www.goravani.com> > >> > >> > >Your use of is subject to

> > >> > >> > >> > >---> > >Incoming mail is

certified Virus Free.> > >Checked by AVG anti-virus system

(http://www.grisoft.com).> > >Version: 6.0.372 / Virus Database: 207 - Release

6/20/02> >> >> >> > Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya; Hare Krishna; Om Tat

Sat> > : gjlist-> >

http://www.goravani.com> >> >> > Your use of is subject to

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Database: 207 - Release 6/20/02> >> > > > > Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya;

Hare Krishna; Om Tat Sat> :

gjlist-> http://www.goravani.com> > > Your use of

is subject to > > >

November 23, 2002

Dear Visti

I am not informed enough to argue this point. I am just having faith in

what my master says. Besides I don't think it really maters, everything is as

it's support to be and there's nothing I can do about it, but try to cheer up

this young lady .

Bless you My friend. ....... Noel .......

-

Visti Larsen

gjlist

Saturday, November 23, 2002 2:32 AM