Source...of ...Desire &/or sufferings, > Mark Kincaid...Quote: Maharishi Mahesh Yogi

[Guest guest]

Hi amit,

 

Rather than desiring for Moksha and to elminate path

of hindrance towards Moksha,Just start doing it,don't

desire.Live the way it comes.Just be truth to yourself

and you will feel you don't have desire for that thing

at all.

So moral is just do it,rather than thinking

about,because you know it vey well about what you are

doing,other than anyone else.If you don't know,than

very sorry to say, time has not come yet,just than do

your karma, so time will definately come.But be truth

to yourself,damn you know it.

 

--- amit_call <amit_call wrote:

 

>

> HI Sripal ji,

> You are right that Desires are hindranec in path to

> salvation.

> you said:

> > Who went to even Moksha they didn't desire for

> > that,they reached or were in such a state that

> > thoughts doesn't exist,they just know means they

> just

> > know.

> this is true.

> Beacuse just like a person trying to go into sleep

> finds it dificult

> and sleep comes eventually.Sahaj bhav se.

> We are essentially Pure Souls,above

> lingabheda(gender

> diffrence),beyond time and space.

> But saying or reading this does nothing.

> As you have also said don't think ,know...

> but I do not realize this thing as an experience.

> what to do.

> even it is said one has to become actionless.....the

> actionless state

> reveals all Truth......

> now to achieve that state what one can do....

> humans searches for action or karma.......

> Because we are not in awareness we need to do

> something to attain

> that state...

> for that we need to ASPIRE for that..........

> this aspiration for Moksha is needed for a

> sadhak.........

> this we can say desire for moksha.........

> yet this is true that moksha is state acieved being

> desireless.....yet to initiate on the path one needs

> desire for it....

> Its weakness of Human nature........

> HENCE ONE SHOULD ELIMINATE WORLDY MEAN DESIRES WHICH

> ARE HINDRANEC TO

> THE DESIRE FOR GOD............THEN THIS ONE POINTED

> DESIRE FOR GOD

> WILL LET YOUR DEVOTION GROW DAY BY DAY AND ONE DAY

> YOUR DESIRE WILL

> VANISH GIVING YOU DESIRELESS STATE SAHAJ HI.........

> Till then desire for God (we should call aspiration

> for God) should

> give us strenghth..................................

>

> Aspiring..........

> Amit Kumar

>

> Spirituality_Astrology,

> Shripal

> <d_shripal> wrote:

> > Hi Mark,

> >

> > What you are talking in term of our existence and

> in

> > that case you are very right.Thoughts are a root

> cause

> > of all grief.But thoughts exist because of desire.

> >

> > Why we say you are male,she is female.Why we are

> bound

> > to time.In reality male,female and time doesn't

> exist.

> > There is no brightness nor darkness.In fact

> nothing

> > exist,that is a only truth and real truth.

> >

> > Thoughts exist because desire exist.Something is

> still

> > there which needs to be fulfilled because of karma

> and

> > we are re-born,what is that thing desire,desire

> can be

> > for anything,So at higher level if you try to

> realize

> > it is desire,rather than thoughts.Thoughts are

> desire.

> >

> > Who went to even Moksha they didn't desire for

> > that,they reached or were in such a state that

> > thoughts doesn't exist,they just know means they

> just

> > know.

> >

> > AS Morpheus in Matrix Movies has said,"Don't think

> you

> > can,know you can"

> >

> > --- Mark Kincaid <m.kincaid@m...> wrote:

> >

> > > Dear Shripal:

> > >

> > > My Guru says, that used to be thought of as the

> > > 'root cause of all grief',

> > > however,

> > > he believes, that it's not the desire,...that's

> the

> > > problem...

> > >

> > > but it's the identification.

> > >

> > > "If you identify with any desire, thought,

> feeling,

> > > or perception, there's

> > > some chance that that desire is not in-tune with

> all

> > > the laws of Nature.

> > > The key is to develop the human nervous system

> so

> > > that whatever thought,

> > > perception or feeling arises, we spontaneously

> do

> > > the right thing.

> > >

> > > This is one of the greatest mysteries in life.

> > >

> > > Desire was thought to be the culprit, but in

> Truth,

> > > it's a lack of

> > > identification with our True, inner Nature. Not

> > > knowing who we are, and

> > > acting from a level of 'ignorance', is the real

> > > source of all sufferings and

> > > unhappinesses in life."

> > >

> > >

> > > I couldn't have said it better, myself...

> > >

> > >

> > > Sincerely,

> > >

> > >

> > > Mark Kincaid

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Shripal <d_shripal>

> > > AyurvedJyotishYoga

> > > Thu, 27 Jan 2005 22:17:28 -0800 (PST)

> > > Spirituality_Astrology

> > > [AyurvedJyotishYoga] Re: Desire

> > >

> > >

> > > Hi Mark,

> > >

> > > Root cause of all our grief is desire.A man is

> born

> > > and being he is born,while he is for 9 month in

> > > Mother's womb,He swear's in front of GOD that he

> > > will

> > > fulfill, 4

> > > things in his life and his aim should be go to

> > > Moksha

> > > and than only GOD will aloow his to come out of

> that

> > > very torture room of mother's womb,If he doesn't

> > > fulfill 4 things that is artha,dharma,kama and

> > > Moksha

> > > than he has to go through a hell lot of his

> life.

> > >

> > > But when he/she is born, he forget's all those

> thing

> > > and thinks he wons everthing and everthing is

> > > mine,even body and that desire of being in a

> Body,

> > > which is degrading every moment in his life,

> takes

> > > him

> > > toward his own destroy path.So desire for

> anything

> > > is

> > > a root cause of all grief and desired person

> will

> > > never go to moksha.

> > >

> > > It is better to destroy desire at its root, and

> for

> > > that you should know a root.

> > >

> > > I read somewhere this bharamand is compared with

> > > women.You understand a women,you have understood

> a

> > > universe and if you understand a universe you

> have

> > > understood a women.

> > >

> > > A person see's s women's beauty from outside or

> a

> > > person is prone to one's skin.One should see a

> > > women's

> > > a nirakar swaroop, a unseen object in which a

> > > universe

> > > lies or universe is in that or she is in a

> > > universe.Often you must have some to hear a

> mukti is

> > > feminie and not masculine in nature.

> > >

> > > Nature is in women or Women is in nature, one

> and a

> > > same thing.So many shastra are written on women

> and

> > > not on man.

> > >

> > > A ascetic person marries a Nature and Sansarik

> > > person

> > > marries a sansarik woman.Both ambition is

> same,only

> > > path are different.

> > >

> > > Ascetic is a long path without any

> disguise.while

> > > sansarik is a path which has lots of illusion

> and

> > > mystrerious,which one has to find and destroy

> > > it.Root

> > > cause of all sansarik people is desire which one

> has

> > > to destroy it at it's root.Lord shiva was a

> first

> > > one

> > > to do that.

> > >

> > > To won a battle, you have to be in a battle.

> > >

> > >

> > > --- Mark Kincaid <m.kincaid@m...> wrote:

> > >

> > > >

> > > > Dear Amit & All:

> > > >

> > > > It's such a fascinating aspect of life, this

> > > > deterministic quality of

> > > > karma...and this freedom aspect of 'life'....

> > > >

> > > > The more I'm alive, however, the more I feel

> the

> > > > realities of

> > > > 'both',....hehhehe

> > > >

> > > > I'm always aware of those patterns, those mind

> > > sets,

> > > > attitudes,

> > > > perspectives,....that must come from

> limitations

> > > in

> > > > the 'relative',..

> > > > but each day that I meditate....

> > > > I can feel myself getting more and more

> > > > identified,... with 'that'

> > > > which has no limitations...

> > > >

> > > > In the final analysis, we might say that it's

> > > > probably true, that the

> > > > more we're indentified with 'that' which has

> no

> > > > limitations, then,

> > > > we'll be living true freedom...

> > > >

> > > > but, the extent to which we don't identify

> with

> > > > 'that', and the details

> > > > and specifics of our relative existence

> > > dominate....

> > > > and/or

> > > > over-shadow us,...then,....

> > > > life is more bound...

> > > >

> > > > freedom ..... on the one hand....and

> > > > boundries on the other....

> > > >

> > > > The choice is up to us....

> > > >

> > > > Today, however, it's now possible to find that

> > > pure

> > > > freedom and

> > > > experiencing 'that',.....unfold it more....and

> > > more

> > > > into our relative

> > > > existences....

> > > >

> > > > This is what I love the most about the story

> of

> > > > Christ's miracles,

> > > > and the miracles of the Vedic Seers....and

> > > Yogis....

> > > >

> > > > My own Guru, says, these kind of miraculous

> > > > abilities, are really

> > > > just expressions of our true, full, Spiritual

> and

> > > > Conscious....

> > > > potential.....

> > > >

> > > > When one can .... fulfill one's desires,

> > > > think,...and see those

> > > > dreams and aspirations ....come into

> fruition....

> > > >

> > > > one not only feels a success....

> > > > but one also feels free....

> > > >

> > > > And that gives us true....fulfillment....

> > > > in life...

> > > >

> > > > What I love about Jyotish's contribution, is

> that

> > > > .... our Jyotish

> > > > charts, understand our...selves.... very

> > > clearly....

> > > >

> > > > Our charts are how 'Nature' or the Guru of

> Jyotish

> > > > sees us...

> > > >

> > > > The benefics are our strengths,....and the

> > > malefics

> > > > correspond

> > > > with the 'things' that we've come to change,

> > > improve

> > > > and grow

> > > > within....

> > > >

> > > > The great advantage of learning our 'malefics'

> and

> > > > what they

> > > > mean,.... is we can stop....undermining,

> and/or

> > > > sabotaging

> > > > ourselves....

> > > >

> > > > Modern Psychology today, says one of the most

> > > > difficult aspects

> > > > of life, is .... how we undermine and sabotage

> our

> > > > lives...

> > > >

> > > > We get these inclinations or patterns from the

> > > > past,.... and

> > > > though we feel 'these' are who we are....and

> are

> > > > 'right'....

> > > > in truth, where we're not in-tune....

> > > > we'll continue making mistakes,..... in-spite

> of

> > > how

> > > > we feel about

> > > > 'them'.....

> > > >

> > > > Then, along comes Jyotish and says 'these'

> > > patterns

> > > > are

> > > > panamount to our 'malefics'.... and instead of

> > > just

> > > > experiencing

> > > > these 'negative' patterns....and

> discovering....

> > > > after the fact,... that

> > > > maybe we were in-correct....

> > > >

> > > > either after an accident....or we get sick....

> > > >

> > > > In Jyotish we have the great opportunity....to

> > > > cognize.... these

> > > > Truths....before hand....

> > > > and before they manifest....as our negative or

> > > > malefic karmas...

> > > >

> > > > If we can only cognize 'these' patterns and

> > > un-wind

> > > > them, then

> > > > we can turn our malefics into strenghts....

> > > > and really....

> > > > live the life that we were born to live....

> > > >

> > > > Thanks for the wonderful thoughts on freedom

> and

> > > > determinism...

> > > >

> > > > Sincerely,

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Mark Kincaid

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > - In Spirituality_Astrology,

> > > > "amit_call"

> > > > <amit_call> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Hi all,

> > > > > The vedic way of living leads one to Moksha

> > > > through

> > > > Awareness and

> > > > > action.

> > > > > We know there is predeterminism parallel to

> Free

> > > > will.

> > > > > Now this free will is limited to different

> > > extent

> > > > for everyone.

> > > > > The limitation is determined by Previous

> life's

> > > > Karmas.

> > > > > Soul tastes the fruit of Good and Bad

> karmas.

> > > > > The events occuring to one may be

> predetermined

> > > > but He is

> > > > free to

> > > > > perform Karma.We need real thirst for God to

> > > > attain

> > > > Moksha.Means Real

> > > > > and only desire for Him.

> > > > > This can be achieved by soul if all of its

> > > desires

> > > > are vanished

> > > > > leaving this eternal desire alone.

> > > > > Once a person suggested me : "Always

> interospect

> > > > yourself

> > > > filtering

> > > > > out your unnecessary desires. Choose desires

> > > which

> > > > can only

> > > > be

> > > > > vanished through fulfilling them."

> > > > > We are always indulged in unnecessary

> things.Be

> > > > sincere and

> > > > strictly

> > > > > work for those desires only which are very

> deep

> > > in

> > > > you. The

> > > > short

> > > > > term desires may be more burning but they

> can be

> > > > eliminated

> > > > just by

> > > > > contemplation and Viveka.

> > > > > This way one will work more sincerely for

> some

> > > > chosen

> > > > desires hence

> > > > > fulfilling them reaching the point of

> saturation

> > > > or inner

> > > > > satisfaction...

> > > > > In Sooofi theory they say "Drink the cup of

> > > > worldly desires to

> > > > > fullest so that your mind gets thirsty for

> true

> > > > Love of devine"

> > > > > But desires are said to be growing in

> multiples

> > > > everytime.

> > > > Hence one

> > > > > should work in such a manner that He

> fulfills

> > > > desires and does

> > > > not

> > > > > let new desires grow...

> > > > > This is done by sincere life aimed for

> > > > Moksha.....meditation

> > > > gives

> > > > > this sincerety.

> > > > > Now while working for fulfilling these deep

> > > inner

> > > > desires which

> > > > are

> > > > > esssentially needs to be satisfied for

> further

> > > > development one

> > > > should

> > > > > work Perfectly....Otherwise the desires will

> > > > remain unfulfilled.

> > > > > Krishna in Geeta says "Yoga Karmasu

> > > Kaushlam.."...

> > > > > The perfection of work is Yoga....

> > > > > For this perfection of work one needs to

> know

> > > his

> > > > outer bodies

> > > > which

> > > > > are used for performing action.

> > > > > In performing Karma we are obstructed by

> malefic

> > > > part of our

> > > > outer

> > > > > bodies.Here Astrology can help us in

> identifying

> > > > our malefic

> > > > sides

> > > > > and improving upon them to do action

> perfectly.

> > > > > Also Astrology can help us in identifying

> our

> > > > unnecessary

> > > > desires

> > > > > which are also diverting us.

> > > > > As said by parasuraman ji " Paramatman only

> is

> > > > Real and we

> > > > should try

> > > > > to cultivate a friendship with Him by

> constant

> > > > dialogue directly."

> > > > > With a developed friend ship with God we can

> get

> > > > guidance

> > > > and

> > > > > patience always.

> > > > > We should remember its a long path ...One

> should

> > > > be ready for

> > > > keeping

> > > > > patiennce .

> > > > >

> > > > > Humbly...

> > > > > Amit kumar

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > --- In

> Spirituality_Astrology,

> > > > Parasuraman

> > > > > <parasu41> wrote:

> > > > > > Hi all,

> > > > > > Desire for Moksha will arise only when

> there

> > > is

> > > > contentment

> > > > in

> > > > > material things.

> > > > > > Many people confuse Moksha with going to

> > > Heaven.

> > > > Gods

> > > > are always

> > > > > jealous. They dont want you to improve. That

> is

> > > > why they

> > > > disturb

> > > > > penances by sending Urvashi, Menaka and all.

> > > > Whereas

> > > > Paramatman is

> > > > > always ready to embrace you. Moreover,

> Heaven is

> > > > not that

> > > > good to

> > > > > aspire for. Vedas say "Durbhiksham

> > > devaloka"-there

> > > > is

> > > > starvation in

> > > > > Heaven. They do not have any cultivation.

> Devas

> > > > depend on

> > > > your

> > > > > offerings for their livelihood.

> > > > > > Paramatman only is Real and we should try

> to

> > > > cultivate a

> > > > friendship

> > > > > with Him by constant dialogue directly.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dave <Demersonpws@a...> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Hello all....

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Just a thought..

> > > > > > On 1/18 Mark wrote "There are many 'signs'

> of

> > > > spirituality

> > > > and/or

> > > > > > potentiality for 'moksha' in Jyotish or

> our

> > > > charts.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I think, however, the most important

> feature

> > > > still resides with

> > > > you!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I asked a meditation teacher one time what

> was

> > > > the most

> > > > important

> > > > > > quality for 'enlightenment' and he

> > > > said.....'Desire'....

> > > > > >

> > > > > > "Desire for enlightenment is the most

> powerful

> > > > thing you can

> > > > do",

> > > > > he

> > > > > > said.

> > > > > > Thank-you, Mark. Another person has

> > > > written,.."inherent in

> > > > > your

> > > > > > desire are the mechanics for it's

> > > fulfillment".

> > > > > > Statements like this, passed on from

> > > > modest souls like

> > > > Mark

> > > > > and

> > > > > > others are very encouraging and

> appreciated.

> > > > > > Goodnight from the

> east

> > > > coast(US),

> > > > > >

> > > > Dave

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Links

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

Spirituality_Astrology/

> > > > > >

> > > > > > To from this group, send an

> > > email

> > > > to:

> > > > > >

> > > >

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> > > > > >

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> > > > of

> > > > > Service.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > With Best Regards,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Parasuraman

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Please visit my Homepage:

> > > > http://www.geocities.com/parasu41

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > India Matrimony: Find your life

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> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > > =====

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> > >

> > >

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> > >

> > >

> > > The all-new My - What will yours do?

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> > > Links

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> AyurvedJyotishYoga/

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> > >

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>

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