The Dalai Lama and its Discussion: 4th hse.

[Guest guest]

Dear Neena and all participating in this discussion,

 

I've had a mail from Vasudev advocating Mars in 4th based solely on

the invasion of the Dalai Lama's homeland. However, as we know, 4th

house governs much, much more than this...

 

I'm rather pushed for time at the moment so I must make this brief

(for now)...perhaps we can discuss it in greater length another time.

 

Briefly then, we know that 12th (from any house) has basically the

same significance in relation to the house it's positioned from as

12th from 1st has on the native himself. 12th is first and foremost

the house of loss and, with 3rd lord in 4th (12th from 4th), it can

certainly indicate loss in connection to the native's homeland.

Looking back in history it seems that Tibet might have been a

province of the Chinese at the time of the Yuan Dynasty. How true

this is I truly don't know and I certainly don't want to stray into

the political arena. However, if this is so, then 3rd lord MOON in

4th assumes much, much greater significance.

 

We also need to consider the position of 4th lord Sun who occupies

nakshatra of Rahu, is conjunct Ketu and aspected by Rahu's dispositor

(8th lord) etc, etc.. It's not difficult to see the difficulties

related to the DL's homeland with the Taurus lagna. But, as I said,

4th house governs many things, and certainly, the qualities of

compassion, devotion and kindness that everyone recognises in the

Dalai Lama's character are a testament to lagnesh Venus in this

house. The aspect on 10th lord in 10th is further testament to his

efforts to promote peace and harmony in this world.

 

Compare this with F/M Mars in 4th aspecting 10th...with no benefic

aspect! Does this Mars speak of a heart full of loving kindness, of

his sincere actions in this world to promote peace and harmony. We

know these are not the qualities of aggressive Mars - his nature is

to fight, to retaliate (he is the commander in chief after all). Can

we honestly say this is the Dalai Lama the world knows! He has never

fought back against the Chinese but has rather sought peaceful means

to resolve the situation.

 

Best Wishes,

Mrs. Wendy

http://JyotishVidya.com

______________________________

[Guest guest]

-

"Sean Patrick Kelly" <toosean

<jyotish-vidya>

Tuesday, April 04, 2006 4:22 AM

Re: The Dalai Lama and its Discussion: 4th hse.

 

 

jyotish-vidya, "Wendy Vasicek" <jyotish

wrote:

<snip>

>

> Compare this with F/M Mars in 4th aspecting 10th...with no benefic

> aspect! Does this Mars speak of a heart full of loving kindness, of

> his sincere actions in this world to promote peace and harmony. We

> know these are not the qualities of aggressive Mars - his nature is

> to fight, to retaliate (he is the commander in chief after all).

> Can

> we honestly say this is the Dalai Lama the world knows! He has

> never

> fought back against the Chinese but has rather sought peaceful

> means

> to resolve the situation.

 

Namaste

 

This is all ground that we've covered before.

 

Here is my 2 cents on it again:

 

I really do not think based on what I've learned so far that the 4th

house indicates one's actions/intentions & general nature. However,

one would get that impression based on what Wendy has written above.

 

What I have learned is that one's intentions are more seen by the 3rd

house and one's overall nature is seen more by lagna, lagnesh, and

Moon.

 

Does Mars in the 4th necessarily have to affect one's nature and the

quality of one's actions? I don't think so. This Mars is not

aspecting lagna or lagnesh or Moon or 3rd house. However, it

strongly energizes and disrupts the 4th house significations and this

makes a great deal of sense given what we've learned about the Dalai

Lama's life.

 

The problems in Tibet are really the only source of any hint of anger

that the Dalai Lama has felt -- and he HAS been quoted as saying he

does feel some anger about that but he is able to let it go quickly

and it does not affect his actions or the way he deals with others.

 

And CLEARLY the major 4th house significations have been the source

of the most challenges, worries, and obstacles the Dalai Lama has

faced. He has even faced challenges and some contention in India, his

current residence.

 

"The qualities of aggressive Mars - his nature is to fight, to

retaliate (he is the commander in chief after all" -- this does

definitely describe the nature of the Dalai Lama's obstacles relating

to 4th house matters. The 4th house matters have also been where

Dalai Lama has had to spend the most energy dealing with. He was

said that if it was up to him he would live a simple life of a monk,

but Mars in 4th and Ketu/Rahu in 1st/7th does seem to indicate him

being compelled out into the world (Rahu in 7th) by disruption of

home/homeland (Mars in 4th). No other Dalai Lama has formed the

relationships with foreigners, has traveled as extensively, has been

known to the world like this current Dalai Lama has.

 

The Dalai Lama had said himself that he wouldn't have the status/fame

that he has (i.e. 10th house indication) if it wasn't for the Chinese

and there occupation of Tibet (Mars in 4th casting aspect on 10th).

 

As I said all along, at the very least, it is easy to see how Gemini

lagna is as plausible as a Taurus lagna, if not more so. I did some

browsing around on the internet, reading other interpretations of the

Dalai Lama's chart and I found no one else who advocates a Taurus

lagna, nor who finds the Gemini lagna as anything but fitting. Of

course, that is certainly not proof of anything except that the

Gemini lagna is at least plausible.

 

Take it easy,

Sean

[Guest guest]

Sean Wrote:

//I really do not think based on what I've learned so far that the

4th house indicates one's actions/intentions & general nature.

However, one would get that impression based on what Wendy has

written above.//

 

It was never said that one's intentions are seen from 4th house Sean.

What has been pointed out is that one's actions in this world are

seen from 10th house, and the quality of one's heart, feelings,

emotions, moral virtues, righteous conduct, devotion to God, piety

etc are seen from 4th.

 

//What I have learned is that one's intentions are more seen by the

3rd house and one's overall nature is seen more by lagna, lagnesh,

and Moon.//

 

Motives, intentions, desires are certainly seen from 3rd. With Gemini

lagna, 3rd lord Sun is in lagna whilst his nakshatra lord (Rahu)

occupies 7th house. For Taurus lagna, 3rd lord Moon occupies 4th

house in nakshatra of Venus...what does this tell you about his

intentions, his desires? As you yourself have stated, his desire is

that of a simple monk...his devotion to God is his overriding desire!

 

//Does Mars in the 4th necessarily have to affect one's nature and

the quality of one's actions? I don't think so. This Mars is not

aspecting lagna or lagnesh or Moon or 3rd house. However, it

strongly energizes and disrupts the 4th house significations and this

makes a great deal of sense given what we've learned about the Dalai

Lama's life.//

 

You're correct, Mars in 4th DOES disrupt the affairs of 4th

house...character, relationship with mother, happiness & contentment,

close friends, well-wishers and so forth. You may certainly choose to

ignore (disbelieve) these significations of 4th house if it suits you

to do so...this tells me only that your understanding is lacking.

 

//The problems in Tibet are really the only source of any hint of

anger that the Dalai Lama has felt -- and he HAS been quoted as

saying he does feel some anger about that but he is able to let it go

quickly and it does not affect his actions or the way he deals with

others.//

 

Anger arises in us all from time to time but the mere fact that anger

does not (ever) take hold of his emotions or influence his actions in

this world is a sure testament that he does NOT have Mars in 4th.

 

As you've said, the rest (of your post) is ground we've already been

over so there's no need to comment again.

 

Neena Wrote:

//We will perhaps never be able to get the absolutely right birthtime

ever, so let us all agree to disagree between the two lagnas and get

along with other astro topics. Though my vote would be for Taurus.//

 

Agreed!!

 

Best Wishes,

Mrs. Wendy

http://JyotishVidya.com

______________________________