Guest guest Posted October 26, 2004 Report Share Posted October 26, 2004 Dearly beloved, If one is patient and listening actively (=open) one soon comes across many versions of the same mantra. And, one comes across instances where mantras even when mispronounced or grammatically incorrect are accompanied by accounts of gains, spiritual and otherwise, desired and some unexpected. And, there are those other instances of shuddha everything, ritual, and otherwise but zilch in the area of results! Why is this so? What is missing when we pay too much attention to the form and structure of mantra, like giving CPR to a dying person or even an already dead person. Despite our attention what we put so much energy into reviving, just goes away or never comes back. And those other instances, referred to in the beginning of this message. Like a childbirth, where everything was done inappropriately, but the child was born healthy and as most every medical student conducting his or her first delivery experiences, birth just happens! What makes it come alive, what is missing in the other instances? Experiences as opposed to rules and theories, please! Thanks RR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 27, 2004 Report Share Posted October 27, 2004 Dear RR, I have had a couple of experiences with mantras that I have already shared with you earlier .. once with gayathri mantra where I saw a tremendous light (with percieved noise) .. but this was for a few instants ... The second is with laghu shyamala mantra .. as I kept doing it I saw the image of a godess in my vision .. and it was interesting later to read mantra mahodadi listing the same form that I had seen while doing the mantra .. My teacher (phd in Mantra shastra - to keep other things under wrap) feels that doing a mantra without a person with mantra siddhi instilling it in you is like having a body without life in it ... There is no doubt pronounciation and grammer are important .. I believe the process of shuddha has only ritualistic value (unless the person has siddhi) ... its like saying "yedanhat kurute papam tadanhat pratimutyate" in sandhyavandan ... I dont think sins die just because of doing sandhyavandan ... Coming back to gains when mantras are mispronounced .... there are many components of doing mantra sadhana .... dhyanam, visualization, dharana, bhavana ... these also help !! I have much more to say .. but since you have asked "no theories" I should now shut up with mute acceptance of my limited knowledge !! any cents worth? --- rohiniranjan <rrgb wrote: > > Dearly beloved, > > If one is patient and listening actively (=open) one > soon comes > across many versions of the same mantra. > > And, one comes across instances where mantras even > when mispronounced > or grammatically incorrect are accompanied by > accounts of gains, > spiritual and otherwise, desired and some > unexpected. > > And, there are those other instances of shuddha > everything, ritual, > and otherwise but zilch in the area of results! > > Why is this so? What is missing when we pay too much > attention to the > form and structure of mantra, like giving CPR to a > dying person or > even an already dead person. Despite our attention > what we put so > much energy into reviving, just goes away or never > comes back. > > And those other instances, referred to in the > beginning of this > message. Like a childbirth, where everything was > done > inappropriately, but the child was born healthy and > as most every > medical student conducting his or her first delivery > experiences, > birth just happens! > > What makes it come alive, what is missing in the > other instances? > > Experiences as opposed to rules and theories, > please! > > Thanks > > RR > > > > Mail - You care about security. So do we. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 27, 2004 Report Share Posted October 27, 2004 Thanks a lot for sharing. I have nothing against theories or hypothesizing, but for this thread wanted to limit focusing on real (as in measurable) effects, such as a change in surroundings or other similar things in the 'remedial' context. This is not to mean that other subjective perceptions and spiritual gains are not important as an outcome of mantra-jaap, but they can be rationalized in so many different ways and I did not want to go there :-) RR , surya vishnubhotla <surya_prakashv> wrote: > Dear RR, > > I have had a couple of experiences with mantras that I > have already shared with you earlier .. > once with gayathri mantra where I saw a tremendous > light (with percieved noise) .. but this was for a few > instants ... > > The second is with laghu shyamala mantra .. as I kept > doing it I saw the image of a godess in my vision .. > and it was interesting later to read mantra mahodadi > listing the same form that I had seen while doing the > mantra .. > > My teacher (phd in Mantra shastra - to keep other > things under wrap) feels that doing a mantra without a > person with mantra siddhi instilling it in you is like > having a body without life in it ... > > There is no doubt pronounciation and grammer are > important .. I believe the process of shuddha has only > ritualistic value (unless the person has siddhi) ... > its like saying "yedanhat kurute papam tadanhat > pratimutyate" in sandhyavandan ... I dont think sins > die just because of doing sandhyavandan ... > > Coming back to gains when mantras are mispronounced > ... there are many components of doing mantra sadhana > ... dhyanam, visualization, dharana, bhavana ... these > also help !! > > I have much more to say .. but since you have asked > "no theories" I should now shut up with mute > acceptance of my limited knowledge !! > > any cents worth? > > --- rohiniranjan <rrgb@s...> wrote: > > > > > Dearly beloved, > > > > If one is patient and listening actively (=open) one > > soon comes > > across many versions of the same mantra. > > > > And, one comes across instances where mantras even > > when mispronounced > > or grammatically incorrect are accompanied by > > accounts of gains, > > spiritual and otherwise, desired and some > > unexpected. > > > > And, there are those other instances of shuddha > > everything, ritual, > > and otherwise but zilch in the area of results! > > > > Why is this so? What is missing when we pay too much > > attention to the > > form and structure of mantra, like giving CPR to a > > dying person or > > even an already dead person. Despite our attention > > what we put so > > much energy into reviving, just goes away or never > > comes back. > > > > And those other instances, referred to in the > > beginning of this > > message. Like a childbirth, where everything was > > done > > inappropriately, but the child was born healthy and > > as most every > > medical student conducting his or her first delivery > > experiences, > > birth just happens! > > > > What makes it come alive, what is missing in the > > other instances? > > > > Experiences as opposed to rules and theories, > > please! > > > > Thanks > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mail - You care about security. So do we. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 27, 2004 Report Share Posted October 27, 2004 Dear Rohiniranjan, I chant the mantras without pronouncing as someone told me if you speak the mantra and with a mistake so thats not good. Brijesh --- rohiniranjan <rrgb wrote: > > Thanks a lot for sharing. I have nothing against > theories or > hypothesizing, but for this thread wanted to limit > focusing on real > (as in measurable) effects, such as a change in > surroundings or other > similar things in the 'remedial' context. This is > not to mean that > other subjective perceptions and spiritual gains are > not important as > an outcome of mantra-jaap, but they can be > rationalized in so many > different ways and I did not want to go there :-) > > RR > > , surya > vishnubhotla > <surya_prakashv> wrote: > > Dear RR, > > > > I have had a couple of experiences with mantras > that I > > have already shared with you earlier .. > > once with gayathri mantra where I saw a tremendous > > light (with percieved noise) .. but this was for a > few > > instants ... > > > > The second is with laghu shyamala mantra .. as I > kept > > doing it I saw the image of a godess in my vision > .. > > and it was interesting later to read mantra > mahodadi > > listing the same form that I had seen while doing > the > > mantra .. > > > > My teacher (phd in Mantra shastra - to keep other > > things under wrap) feels that doing a mantra > without a > > person with mantra siddhi instilling it in you is > like > > having a body without life in it ... > > > > There is no doubt pronounciation and grammer are > > important .. I believe the process of shuddha has > only > > ritualistic value (unless the person has siddhi) > ... > > its like saying "yedanhat kurute papam tadanhat > > pratimutyate" in sandhyavandan ... I dont think > sins > > die just because of doing sandhyavandan ... > > > > Coming back to gains when mantras are > mispronounced > > ... there are many components of doing mantra > sadhana > > ... dhyanam, visualization, dharana, bhavana ... > these > > also help !! > > > > I have much more to say .. but since you have > asked > > "no theories" I should now shut up with mute > > acceptance of my limited knowledge !! > > > > any cents worth? > > > > --- rohiniranjan <rrgb@s...> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dearly beloved, > > > > > > If one is patient and listening actively (=open) > one > > > soon comes > > > across many versions of the same mantra. > > > > > > And, one comes across instances where mantras > even > > > when mispronounced > > > or grammatically incorrect are accompanied by > > > accounts of gains, > > > spiritual and otherwise, desired and some > > > unexpected. > > > > > > And, there are those other instances of shuddha > > > everything, ritual, > > > and otherwise but zilch in the area of results! > > > > > > Why is this so? What is missing when we pay too > much > > > attention to the > > > form and structure of mantra, like giving CPR to > a > > > dying person or > > > even an already dead person. Despite our > attention > > > what we put so > > > much energy into reviving, just goes away or > never > > > comes back. > > > > > > And those other instances, referred to in the > > > beginning of this > > > message. Like a childbirth, where everything was > > > done > > > inappropriately, but the child was born healthy > and > > > as most every > > > medical student conducting his or her first > delivery > > > experiences, > > > birth just happens! > > > > > > What makes it come alive, what is missing in the > > > other instances? > > > > > > Experiences as opposed to rules and theories, > > > please! > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mail - You care about security. So do we. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 30, 2004 Report Share Posted October 30, 2004 Dear Rohiniranjan Ji, Your question is hard to answer without resorting to theories :- ). "What makes it come alive, what is missing in the other instances?" is somewhat subjective, is it not? My theory is faith, and by that I don't mean faith that my desire will be fulfilled, as much as faith that a higher power knows what is best for me better than I do, and will fulfil those desires that are right for me. I know, I know, that doesn't help answer your question. :-) Are you looking for instances where a mantra worked? I have one from a couple of years back, and now that I have learnt a bit more, I see that that was not the "correct" solution for the problem, but it still worked :-). (Not that I'm complaining!) Is that the kind of data you are looking for? Sreelatha , "rohiniranjan" <rrgb@s...> wrote: > > Dearly beloved, > > If one is patient and listening actively (=open) one soon comes > across many versions of the same mantra. > > And, one comes across instances where mantras even when mispronounced > or grammatically incorrect are accompanied by accounts of gains, > spiritual and otherwise, desired and some unexpected. > > And, there are those other instances of shuddha everything, ritual, > and otherwise but zilch in the area of results! > > Why is this so? What is missing when we pay too much attention to the > form and structure of mantra, like giving CPR to a dying person or > even an already dead person. Despite our attention what we put so > much energy into reviving, just goes away or never comes back. > > And those other instances, referred to in the beginning of this > message. Like a childbirth, where everything was done > inappropriately, but the child was born healthy and as most every > medical student conducting his or her first delivery experiences, > birth just happens! > > What makes it come alive, what is missing in the other instances? > > Experiences as opposed to rules and theories, please! > > Thanks > > RR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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