Guest guest Posted July 31, 2005 Report Share Posted July 31, 2005 Deva Evu Lawrie <evulawrie wrote:I remember reading in "The Hindu" a leading English Daily in India about a ghastly incident that had taken place in Rajasthan, India some months back. It so happened that two Dalit men (low caste men) were cutting an old dead cow. (They had not killed it since it had died naturally). A large group of fanatic high caste Hindus hearing about it rushed to the spot and killed the two Dalit men. These people who are against the slaughtering of animals even for food or protection have no qualms about killing human beings in the name of religion. It is really a pity. I hope our friend Pankaja Dasa understands this. (Pankaja I guess means - Lotus). In this context I would also like to mention a saying "The Greatest hatred is Religious Hatred and the First murder was Religious Murder". By the way, I would like to mention that the words 'Hindu' or 'India' did not originate from any religion. They originated from the name of a river called INDUS ( S - being silent). India was the region where the river INDUS was flowing even in the days of King Ahasuerus of the Bible and also Alexander, The Great Greek Emperor. Alexander seems to have come up to the western bank of river Indus and left. At that time in the Southern parts of the present India there were local deities worshipped by the people. In the First Century A.D., Christianity was the major religion that entered India through Apostle Thomas in the Southern parts of the present India including Kerala and Tamil Nadu where he was martyred. Therefore one can easily see that Christianity was the first major religion that swept the South. Later when the Muslim Rulers came, they united many different parts of the present India and called it India. The British then united all the states including Pakistan and Bangladesh and states of South India and called the Federation as India in their turn. When the British left India they partitioned it as India, West Pakistan and East Pakistan which is Bangladesh today. Fortunately or Unfortunately, the original land of India where the river Indus flows is now called Pakistan. In the clash or amalgamation of the cultures of the North and the South, the majority want to assert, dominate and enforce their culture and religion upon the South and also upon the minority religions in India such as Islam and Christianity. Therefore they call their culture Hindutva (Indutva) which at present has no meaning or relevance being far away from the Original India or the River Indus. With Regards Deva Evu Lawrie - Brother Shane Pankaja Dasa Cc: bibletruths_forbelievers Saturday, July 30, 2005 11:28 AM Re: Fwd: [bibletruths_forbelievers] Re: Thou Shall not kill Thank you for your kind, loving and caring words, my dear Hindu friend! I can see that your gita book has taught you well. As far as me killing cows...i don't know what ever gave you that idea. Seems you skipped over most of what i wrote (by the way, i read every word you write ). Pankaja, God does not kill cows. He doesn't really kill anything. Man kills. I said that, when we are in heaven, we will be as God is. We can speak anything we want into existance. If i want to eat a steak then i can just speak and a steak will appear before me. I don't have to kill anything. Besides, you made an assumption that i was referring to beef steak. A steak can come from many different animals...but a steak in heaven would not come from anything dead. Because there is no death in God's Kingdom. Am so glad you appreciate what the Lord Jesus Christ has created! Too many people do not see the beauty in nature. Brother Branham was also a nature lover. You should read of the time he prayed for a wounded opposum mother. It's a moving testimony! He had such a deep love of all of God's creatures! I have not read this gita book you are talking about...but I'm sure there is truth in it. Are you referring to the Baghavadgita (not sure of the spelling)? If so, then i have read a few parts of it. It's many, many books in one. Some call it the 'Hindu Bible'. I believe much of it was written before the great flood. Back when Krishna was a king. Nearly 6,000 years ago! Quite an amazing book. Too bad you cannot see that i am sincere in everything i say. My friends know me and they can tell you i mean what i say and i say what i mean. I'm an aries/tiger, in the zodiac. People born under these signs are fiercly and brutally honest. Not that i mean to offend people but sometimes i unintentionally do. I don't read horrorscopes but i do believe that we are born under the influence of stars and gravitational fields. It does effect our personality somewhat. Brother Branham talked about it a bit, and he also said even your name can have an effect on your personality. My name, Shane, is a Gaelic or Keltic name. It's John in English. It has a good meaning and I'm thankful i have it. By the way, what does Pankaja mean? It has a nice sound to it. Well, you seem to be a bit sleepy, so I'll stop chewin your ear off and let you go get some rest. Calling me a dog...come on now! You need some winks my friend. A dog goes back to his own vomit...sort of like a person that has forsaken the good things God gave him, to go eat something man has perverted. I really despise man-made things. Nothing makes me happier than to be out with nature. I can stand under a grove of palm trees and talk to them like they were my own brethren. Have you ever done that Pankaja? By the way, if you stepped in a fire ant hill, or had cockroaches crawling all over you, would you be kind to them too? Have a nice nap! God bless all that Love the Lord Jesus Christ. Your friend (by faith), Brother Shane p.s. - i do not believe that animals have souls. Yes, they have a spirit, but all spirits come from God and will go back to Him, when the creature dies. I do believe many animals will be a part of God's Kingdom, but they do not have to gain their salvation as we do, for they did not sin...therefore, they do not need a soul. Do they have feelings? Yes, i know they do. So did the Lamb of God, Jesus, when He suffered and died for you. Pankaja Dasa <pankaja_dasa wrote: Hare Krishna Jaya Gauranga! I left because I didn't find anything of interest, plus I posted a question, which never got posted. Anytime I post somebody and people don't bother to even inform me of why that is, i don't bother with them, simple as.. So Brother Shane 'thou art so merciful' you would eat a steak in heaven. God must love killing cows. Cows who give milk. Sweet cows. Would you kill your own mother? Or did you kill your own mother after she breast feed you when you were a child? You discust me. Cows are the most sacred animal in the World. It gives milk for all of HUMANITY. And what does HUMANITY do? It kills it. Good way to show Gratititude. Are you still reading? Or do you skip what I say? You act like Jesus Christ is merciless. What is the difference between you and a dog? A god eats, mates has sex, has meat food. You do the same. Only difference is you have 2 legs and it has 4 legs. Thats the way i see you. And you call yourself BROTHER Shane, like you are so merciful to all living beings. Tell me how a Cow cannot have a soul? How can a consiouss being not have a soul? Look in a Cows eyes before its being killed you will see tears in it's eyes... is that false? Is fire hot when you touch it? It a cows tears simply imagination, will science prove it a false hood? Oh nO thats just a checimal reaction. Why don't you admit your love to kill animals for the pleasure of your tongue? You talk about also Krishna like you know EVERTHING about Him. Have you ever read Gita? I bet Gita is just as good as Bible if not better, because Krishna is speaking Himself. You WILL not find any better scripture than Gita. Its teaches everything about God consciousness in 700 verses? Can 'NORMAL' person do this? Do YOU understand Gita? Are you still reading, BROTHER shane? I was expecting to talk to an open minded person. Give up your false name, your nothing but a hypocrite. Brother Shane <truebeliever_777 wrote: You did not ask if we will eat meat in Heaven. You asked if we will eat animals in Heaven. There's a big difference. I don't know what all i will eat in heaven, but if i want to chow-down on a thick, juicy steak then i shall. Doesn't mean i will have to kill anything to do it. We will be as God...all we'll have to do is speak, and it will be. Jesus Christ is God. The Bible tells us this in several different Scriptures. You just don't want to accept it because that would mean you'd have do denounce Krishna as your God. There is only one Lord for me. The Lord Jesus Christ. You keep saying that i don't follow Jesus. The Bible is where His Words are recorded. All His commandments are there. He said, "...if you love me, then obey my commandments...". Well, He said that he is the only way to salvation. So, why don't you follow what He says? The trouble with people like you is, they only want to follow what doesn't offend them. If it suits your needs then it's ok. If it makes you feel condemned then you will reject it as nothing. You came to my group wanting answers. You were given answers. From the Bible. Anything else you want an answer for...since you're the one that came onto my forum and asked for an answer...then ran away when you didn't get the answer you wanted to hear...why did you even bother? If you weren't curious to seek other answers then why ask? You surely weren't looking to convert anybody...or else you wouldn't have run off so quickly. So, tell me my Krishna worshipping friend, what was your true purpose in joining my group, asking a question, then leaving when i gave you a Biblical answer? Answer that with sincerety and then we'll call it even. If you want to know more then i am here for you. My friendship is available to anyone that wants it...but no one can force you to be my friend. It's up to you. Sincerely, and in the Love of the Lord Jesus Christ, Brother Shane Pankaja Dasa <pankaja_dasa wrote: WEll If i am Hindu, then I cannot be a Christian can I? If I can then was I a Hindu in the 1st place? I think I know perfectly well what I am. You seem to see onenes in everything, you still didn't answer my question whether you will eat meat in Heaven? If you goto America they will say I am american, almost everybody is in this consicouness. Jesus Christ to me is the Son of God, there is no need to imagine Him to be God. He is God's representative. I don't know why you don't follow what He says, instead of talking nonsence all day, and preaching about sinning, you kill animals, drink alcohol everyday. This is food in the mode of IGNORACNE. Fruits, vegis are foods in mode of Goodness. And it seems you have a problem with Lord Krishna, I don't have any problem with Jesus, why is it you show your offensive nature, when so far I have not been? Goodye Brother Shane <truebeliever_777 wrote: I doubt i kill any more animals than you do. But that wasn't what i was referring to. You cannot understand that God was a man, and at the same time God, in Jesus Christ. Do you even know what the name Jesus Christ means? Jesus (Y'shua): Jehovah (Father/Almighty Creator/I AM), has become our savior. Christ (Messiah): The annointed one. He has other names as well... Emmanuel is one of them, which means, 'God with us'. The prophet Isaiah said He would also be called, 'Everlasting Father' and 'Mighty God'. The flesh was the son. The Spirit was the Father. That's why He told them, "...when you've seen me, you've seen the father..." Read also I TIMOTHY 3:16. By the way, Krisha is a Hindu diety. He did not come from America. Therefore, and according to your own words, that would make him a Hindu. A devotee of Vishnu is not called a Vishnu or Vishnuite...he is called a Hindu. Regardless of where he lives. If you're from America, well, America was founded by Christians...and as a Christian nation. That would mean, because you're from America, you're supposed to be a Christian. But, you decided to forfeit your inheritance, for that of a Hindu diety. Therefore, you are now a Hindu. Yes, a Hindu is someone from India...and the old name of India was Hindustan...but it's also a religion. If you told a Christian or Muslim, living in India, that he is a Hindu, i think he'd beg to differ with you. Have a nice day. Pankaja Dasa <pankaja_dasa wrote: Well, I said a lot of things. But you still cannot provide any logical proof of why you kill so many animals. And you keep calling me a Hindu. I am a devotee of Krishna, Hindu means somebody from India. Answer me this: Do they eat animals in the Kindgom of God? Brother Shane <truebeliever_777 wrote: There's nothing you can say. Pankaja Dasa <pankaja_dasa wrote: Son of God. I have nothing more to say. Goodday. Thx for talking. Brother Shane <truebeliever_777 wrote: The Bible says, "ALL THE FULNESS OF THE GODHEAD DWELLS IN HIM, BODILY" I would call that God. William Branham prophesied thousands of times. His visions were never wrong. Not once. I'll take his word over your's any day. Pankaja Dasa <pankaja_dasa wrote: Nityananda-Gauranga! To be poilite was not my goal. Only truth. |You cannot change thr truth] Ever. Nobody can. I didn't say Lord Jesus Christ was Krishna, Krishna is God, Jesus is representative of God. This make us worship Jesus ts we can GOTO Krishna, that is the meaning of 'nobody goes unto God except thru me'. You are created sectarian religion... by saying Yours and mine. Vaishnava is really very diverse. It is about loving God. I admit many Hindus have forgotten what Krishna is about, this is due to time. This happens with all people. That is why God sends his messangers every now and again to stir things up. Somtimes God comes Himself, this happened 5000 Years ago, and also 500 years ago with the appearace of Gauranga Mahaprabhu, in Mayapura India. Many Vaishnava regard Jesus as thier Guru, and gain an immence thought and knowledge about loving God from books like the Srimad Bhagavatam. I admit the part about Hindus. We shouldn't think Jesus would not want us to go further in our search for the truth. Truth is to be found, wherever it shall be. You must goto it... lets be rational. Also think about the Kingdom of God, do they eat meat there? Are you not making your life geared towards serving Guru [Jesus]. ? We all should be serving 100%, its not easy to but we need to try. Please don't be offended by what I say. I am also not is USA. I am in UK ha! And don't get caught up in trying to understand Jesus Christ, better do what he says, then automatically you will understand. All this is He that or this, what many of you do is useless. Unless you have some purity you cannot possibly understand Him. Only if God reveals then you can. Jesus stated many times He serves God. So don't make Him out to be actually God, that is the most offensive thing. But to say He is representattive of God and deserves same respect is nice. Otherwise I am seeing that you all are turning into Impersonalists, many Christaians are turning to Athiesum due to lack of knowledge. Just try and think about this, open-minded. Jesus mercy is there for all. I feel it too. I have been a Krishna devotee since my very birth. And when I ask myself to Jesus shall I serve Krishna, answer is i need to follow rules and regulations and Worship. BOTH Guru and Gauranga, thats Jesus and Krishna. If you follow what Jesus says that's following, theres no need to go around professing anything to anybody. When Guru is pleased you will automatically know who you are, and who God is. Then the love can flow. Gauranga Mahaprabhu gave this love freely. He was Radha-Krishna combined. So anyway my point is instead of tying to understand by means of logic Jesus, it's better to serve His Vani [instructions]. There's not much else we can do. Jesus said to worship the Father. This is what we do, but ignorant people don't see that Vaishnava is about serving Krishna 24/7 Not every Sundays. It's to become fully God conscious. Goto a Hare Krishna Temple and you will see.. or chant Nityananda-Gauranga! All Glories to Lord Jesus Christ! Brother Shane <truebeliever_777 wrote: You are grossly decieved my friend. And you are not from India. You are just an American, trying to be something you're not. Hindu's from India are much more polite. They also speak with more wisdom. Krishna is not Christ. Pankaja Dasa <pankaja_dasa wrote: Gauranga! Hare Krishna, Same old same old. Jesus is only way etc. Look up in the sky, the same Sun shines for entire mankind. God doesn't belong to anybody, He is belongs to EVERYBODY. Jesus says I am the way, nobody comes to the Father except by me. Who is the Father? I will pray to Jesus Christ to bless you, so you can understand more about who the father is. Christ is also derived from Krishna, Kristos. And I also pray to Christ to bless me to understand Krishna more, and love Him. Guru [Jesus] and Krishna. Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare Start your day with - make it your home page Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare Mail for Mobile Take Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare Start your day with - make it your home page Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare Start your day with - make it your home page Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare Start your day with - make it your home page Visit your group "bibletruths_forbelievers" on the web. bibletruths_forbelievers Start your day with - make it your home page Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 1, 2005 Report Share Posted August 1, 2005 Dear friend, Please do not re-write Indian History. Our history has been tampered by everyone in the world. Our politicians are so great that they never gave any importance to our history. Every where brahmins have been neglected. No importance to intelligence. We have been torn apart by these politicians in each and every sphere. Do not assume that chistianity is the first religion that swept south. It is your mistake to think so. Europeans were able to destroy culture of each and every country that they stepped onto. Only in India, they were not able to do so. So they acted like businessmen and slowly started destroying out culture, religin and every thing. Now it is our politicians, who are very fond of continuing the british tradition. Indians never converted anyone. As out belief is that a person should get birth in Hindu religon and nobody can be converted to hindu. These conversions are spreaded by christians and muslim. God save our country --- Brother Shane <truebeliever_777 wrote: > Deva Evu Lawrie <evulawrie wrote:I > remember reading in "The Hindu" a leading English > Daily in India about a ghastly incident that had > taken place in Rajasthan, India some months back. > It so happened that two Dalit men (low caste men) > were cutting an old dead cow. (They had not killed > it since it had died naturally). A large group of > fanatic high caste Hindus hearing about it rushed to > the spot and killed the two Dalit men. These people > who are against the slaughtering of animals even for > food or protection have no qualms about killing > human beings in the name of religion. It is really > a pity. I hope our friend Pankaja Dasa understands > this. (Pankaja I guess means - Lotus). In this > context I would also like to mention a saying "The > Greatest hatred is Religious Hatred and the First > murder was Religious Murder". > > By the way, I would like to mention that the words > 'Hindu' or 'India' did not originate from any > religion. They originated from the name of a river > called INDUS ( S - being silent). India was the > region where the river INDUS was flowing even in the > days of King Ahasuerus of the Bible and also > Alexander, The Great Greek Emperor. Alexander seems > to have come up to the western bank of river Indus > and left. > > At that time in the Southern parts of the present > India there were local deities worshipped by the > people. In the First Century A.D., Christianity was > the major religion that entered India through > Apostle Thomas in the Southern parts of the present > India including Kerala and Tamil Nadu where he was > martyred. Therefore one can easily see that > Christianity was the first major religion that swept > the South. > > Later when the Muslim Rulers came, they united many > different parts of the present India and called it > India. The British then united all the states > including Pakistan and Bangladesh and states of > South India and called the Federation as India in > their turn. When the British left India they > partitioned it as India, West Pakistan and East > Pakistan which is Bangladesh today. Fortunately or > Unfortunately, the original land of India where the > river Indus flows is now called Pakistan. > > In the clash or amalgamation of the cultures of the > North and the South, the majority want to assert, > dominate and enforce their culture and religion upon > the South and also upon the minority religions in > India such as Islam and Christianity. Therefore > they call their culture Hindutva (Indutva) which at > present has no meaning or relevance being far away > from the Original India or the River Indus. > > With Regards > Deva Evu Lawrie > - > Brother Shane > Pankaja Dasa > Cc: bibletruths_forbelievers > Saturday, July 30, 2005 11:28 AM > Re: Fwd: [bibletruths_forbelievers] Re: > Thou Shall not kill > > > Thank you for your kind, loving and caring words, my > dear Hindu friend! > > I can see that your gita book has taught you well. > > As far as me killing cows...i don't know what ever > gave you that idea. Seems you skipped over most of > what i wrote (by the way, i read every word you > write ). > > Pankaja, God does not kill cows. He doesn't really > kill anything. Man kills. > > I said that, when we are in heaven, we will be as > God is. We can speak anything we want into > existance. If i want to eat a steak then i can just > speak and a steak will appear before me. I don't > have to kill anything. Besides, you made an > assumption that i was referring to beef steak. A > steak can come from many different animals...but a > steak in heaven would not come from anything dead. > Because there is no death in God's Kingdom. > > Am so glad you appreciate what the Lord Jesus Christ > has created! Too many people do not see the beauty > in nature. Brother Branham was also a nature lover. > You should read of the time he prayed for a wounded > opposum mother. It's a moving testimony! He had such > a deep love of all of God's creatures! > > I have not read this gita book you are talking > about...but I'm sure there is truth in it. Are you > referring to the Baghavadgita (not sure of the > spelling)? If so, then i have read a few parts of > it. It's many, many books in one. Some call it the > 'Hindu Bible'. I believe much of it was written > before the great flood. Back when Krishna was a > king. Nearly 6,000 years ago! Quite an amazing book. > > Too bad you cannot see that i am sincere in > everything i say. My friends know me and they can > tell you i mean what i say and i say what i mean. > I'm an aries/tiger, in the zodiac. People born under > these signs are fiercly and brutally honest. Not > that i mean to offend people but sometimes i > unintentionally do. > I don't read horrorscopes but i do believe that we > are born under the influence of stars and > gravitational fields. It does effect our personality > somewhat. Brother Branham talked about it a bit, and > he also said even your name can have an effect on > your personality. > > My name, Shane, is a Gaelic or Keltic name. It's > John in English. It has a good meaning and I'm > thankful i have it. > > By the way, what does Pankaja mean? It has a nice > sound to it. > > > Well, you seem to be a bit sleepy, so I'll > stop chewin your ear off and let you go get some > rest. > > Calling me a dog...come on now! You need some winks > my friend. > > > A dog goes back to his own vomit...sort of like a > person that has forsaken the good things God gave > him, to go eat something man has perverted. > I really despise man-made things. Nothing makes me > happier than to be out with nature. I can stand > under a grove of palm trees and talk to them like > they were my own brethren. Have you ever done that > Pankaja? > > By the way, if you stepped in a fire ant hill, or > had cockroaches crawling all over you, would you be > kind to them too? > > Have a nice nap! > > God bless all that Love the Lord Jesus Christ. > > Your friend (by faith), > > Brother Shane > > p.s. - i do not believe that animals have souls. > Yes, they have a spirit, but all spirits come from > God and will go back to Him, when the creature dies. > I do believe many animals will be a part of God's > Kingdom, but they do not have to gain their > salvation as we do, for they did not > sin...therefore, they do not need a soul. Do they > have feelings? Yes, i know they do. So did the Lamb > of God, Jesus, when He suffered and died for you. > > > Pankaja Dasa <pankaja_dasa wrote: > > > Hare Krishna Jaya Gauranga! > > I left because I didn't find anything of interest, > plus I posted a question, which never got posted. > Anytime I post somebody and people don't bother to > even inform me of why that is, i don't bother with > them, simple as.. > > > > So Brother Shane 'thou art so merciful' you would > eat a steak in heaven. God must love killing cows. > Cows who give milk. Sweet cows. Would you kill > your own mother? Or did you kill your own mother > after she breast feed you when you were a child? > You discust me. Cows are the most sacred animal in > the World. It gives milk for all of HUMANITY. And > what does HUMANITY do? It kills it. Good way to > show Gratititude. > > Are you still reading? Or do you skip what I say? > You act like Jesus Christ is merciless. What is the > difference between you and a dog? A god eats, mates > has sex, has meat food. You do the same. Only > difference is you have 2 legs and it has 4 legs. > Thats the way i see you. And you call yourself > BROTHER Shane, like you are so merciful to all > living beings. Tell me how a Cow cannot have a > soul? === message truncated === Regards, Srinivasa Upadhyaya P, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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