status of astrology debate my part 24/2

February 24, 2006

Dear all,

When internet messages under creation suddenly disappear because of

hitting a wrong key (cramped keyboard, fat and sluggish fingers!) or

computer crashes (cheap equipment or poor connections!) some tend to

take those as the Universe stepping in and blocking the message for

whatever reason. At other times, moderators take on that role

(Tanvir and Neeraj -- You have been promoted to being the

Intelligent Universe for this board!!).

But sometimes it is just an accident and so if a message is felt to

be important it must be posted. In face soon after the first message

vanished we felt a tremor in Ottawa, Ontario, Canada (Friday, 24

February 2006, 20:41 hrs EST). Very interesting!

The gist of what I posted just prior to the quake -- repeating here

again, perhaps tempting fate was:

If the common person out there thinks that astrology is superstition

and it gets reflected in novels and movies, astrologers should not

just ignore that and assume that it is an expression and reflection

of kaliyuga or impact of western rationalistic materialistic

influence.

While that may be true, I feel that it also has to do with how we

send out the message, how we communicate with the great unwashed

(not using that expression arrogantly but chidingly towards us

jyotishis and our attitudes!). Part of this is that we are poor

communicators and cannot translate astroreality down to the common

person in a form or format that is intelligible or makes sense or

fits in with the rest of his reality.

This is not a situation to walk away from (as you see I am not --

and hence reposting!). We need to not assume that pieces will fall

in place and our great craft will automatically remain in its high

position and so would we, simply and naturally.

If we care for what people out there think, about us and our beloved

craft of jyotish, then we owe it to jyotish to serve it through

communicating it clearly, and perhaps working on our communication

skills is a good starting point! We owe it to jyotish because

through knowing it, it has given us expanded sight, and that is not

arrogance but the truth that most of us feel and know. Those of us

who have dedicated part of our life to it, sincerely and plan to

continue to do that, godwilling, in future.

We cannot just curl up and look away, because we are the voice of

jyotish. Left to itself, it is silent, crippled in a sense and needs

us, the peripherals using computer jargon to express what the CPU is

capable of! Almost like the SOUL which is pure consciousness, but

can express itself, make its presence known only through its carnate

expressions, us and the other worldly objects. I have always thought

that as one of our reasons for coming to and populating/creating

this reality because if it remains unexpressed, the SOUL and GOD and

all that spiritual reality simply remains nonexistant. Like the tree

that fell in a forest and no one heard it!

We have a purpose -- to give legitimacy and expression to the bigger

reality of consciousness which exists unexperienced unless it

expresses itself through our experiences!

RR, Prashant Kumar G B

<gbp_kumar wrote:

>

> Hi VK, RR AJ, DR and all

>

> I am sure people agree there is a lot of systmatic research of

many cultures in the west - Indian astrology too, u will find

their libraries equiped with more of India htan many of our own

here even country libraries on all cultures for that matter.

>

> vedic astrology magazines in US circulate more in no there than

the best here

>

> we r left on a few stools so we r confused to move on rely on

our so called rationalists or thinkers like Prof Yeshpal, J Jayanth

etc eminent scientis who rebuke, bedunk astrology every time they

come media.

> every movie tv serial has a dialouge " you are educated and u

believe in these.....?" somewhat scornfully, and worse the same

writers also show tantric eposides on innocent characters intier

works, so plople r surely confused.

>

> UNTILL WE KNOW WHEN CHILDREN FOLLOW THEIR ELDERS AND ALSO SEEK

ADVICE FROM THEM AND THEIR COUNSELLORS-BE I T DOCS, ASTROLOGERS,

LAWYERS THE FAMILY MAN IS MISSING AS FAMILIES ITSLEF R BREAKING,

LOOSING ITS relevance 4-5 marriages break up in 3 yrs of marriage

itself sure the stats here will agree so how will u convince the

disbilevers, confused.

> poople r not matching horoscopes they r matching

> what is the bank balance of the couple their parents

> the education

> age or culture, caste nothing is stopping them as used to be and

marriage in haste and repent in leisure is becoming the norm.

>

> i am not adovation caste marriages only I meant anytig that is

matchable msut be compatiblity and not the material issues as given

above. as material levels can change compatiblity must be avg or

overall consitant with soem high and lows not mountains and oceans.

>

> THE BASICS OF FAMILY, ELDERS, SEEK ADIVCE BEFORE U BLURT, OR

BREAK UP AND ALSO that u can make mistakes line any1 else and redo

them and try to work for a solution is important.

>

> Prashant

> so avg Indian is still confused

>

> vattem krishnan <bursar_99 wrote: Dear ShriRanjan Ji,

> Probably we have unwritten mandate to convince about the

utility of Astrology and make it to raise it's head.If in the past

all kings as rulers and rule took the subject to heart,the only

change has come or being witnessed is due to change over of several

cultures causing confusion.otherwise human values are same.Belifs

are same.Faith is also not different.So how can we just be quiet to

accept:astrology in any of its forms is not all that popular to

shape or shake any culture or nation, despite what astrological

magazines toot about, every month, as do some 'astrologers!'

> What is the harm and why Astrology van not be a tool to shape or

shake any culture and nation.Every nation wants to prosper and

every culture wants to diversify and all these structures have give

and take.Is it that we misrepresent or misguide for personal

gains.There is somewhere somekind of slip

> krishnan

>

> rohiniranjan <rrgb wrote:

> Hmm ... what a beautiful example of "mundane reality -- when

rubber

> hits the road, etc.!"

>

> Nalini ji, your personal painful journey that has been so kindly

and

> openly shared by you with all of us strangers (obviously not for

you

> or why would you open your heart so easily, so readily?) from

all

> over the globe -- is much appreciated and has been genuinly

> touching. We all pray for your improvement and recovery.

>

> The tantrik aspects that have become incorporated into jyotish

are a

> very interesting facet of the entire experience. And the most

ill-

> documented and poorly-shared part is the feedback about the

remedies

> that exist and get prescribed, and let us not lump all of those

into

> one common bag. There are different levels of remedies, ranging

from

> gemstones to poojas to fasts and charity and services to all

> varieties of lifeforms -- old, mobility impaired seniors to

birds

> and other animal species, even plants and trees.

>

> Please do not take this as a criticism or cynicism but since

jyotish

> is supposed to be a science, and a very pragmatic modern remedy

in a

> sense to the suffering multitude disillusioned by other

conventional

> healing modalities, I would love to hear from the thousands or

even

> hundreds of recipients (we are a large group,but I am pragmatic

when

> it comes to getting responses!) who choose to remain silent and

not

> from just the one or two or twenty "doctors" who prescribe!

>

> This is a CONSUMER forum, let us hear some good news stories and

> some that fall into that other basket some of us are so allergic

and

> intolerant to hearing about, and notwithstanding the recent (ab)

> reaction towards one member who was recently shushed down for

> posting their personal experience about astrologers, certain

> astrologers!

>

> Democracy and transparency and openness are vital and quite

frankly -

> - unlike what you, I and the rest of us 5000 members here think,

it

> is safe to say that astrology in any of its forms is not all

that

> popular to shape or shake any culture or nation, despite what

> astrological magazines toot about, every month, as do

> some 'astrologers!'

>

> The population of this spaceship of ours, Gaia, is close to 7

> billion and if all astrology forums are consolidated, and

duplicate

> memberships eliminated -- we will probably end up with 10000

> individuals interested in this view of reality and only 100 of

those

> actually discussing and talking and caring about it, really.

>

> 7 billion individuals (two billions at least if you drop the

infants

> and toddlers and the others who have not discovered internet

yet!)

>

> Estimated 10000 -- maybe 20000 d to astrology forums --

let

> us be generous (20000/2000000000 = 0.001%). You know that is not

so

> shabby, we could be potentially reaching 1 in every thousand

that

> are living their lives unguided! Let the missionary spirit

continue!

> We have much work to do ;-)

>

> Oh about the remaining 999 out of each thousand. They are going

to

> hell (kumbhipak or rourav?) for sure :-)

>

> RR

>

, "auromirra19"

> <nalini2818@> wrote:

> >

> > Sri krishnan ji,

> > Is it only black crows, or even white crows can be fed? In NZ

the

> > crows are very less in number and are almost white.

> > Kindly advise.

> > Nalini

> > , vattem krishnan

> > <bursar_99@> wrote:

> > >

> > > i think your POR is london.feeding crows is okay.rahu

stptram

> must

> > also be recited.

> > > krishnan

> > >

> > > ricky88888765 <jassa_69@> wrote:

> > > Dear krishnan ji

> > >

> > > would feeding crows / Ravens help to please rahu every

saturdays?

> > >

> > > Sahota

> > >

> > > , vattem krishnan

> > > <bursar_99@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > The best way to please Rahu and pacify is to have long and

> deep

> > > breath and recite hanmad gayatri

> > > > krishnan

> > > >

> > > > jigyasu_007 <jigyasu_007@> wrote:

> > > > Pranam Krishnanji,

> > > > thanks for your advice, what you have said is true..I am

more

> > > > emotional than logical and then feel bad later..in your

> opinion

> > > > should I do any astrological remedies or just have more

self-

> > > control?

> > > > regards,

> > > > Jigyasu

> > > > , vattem krishnan

> > > > <bursar_99@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Friend,

> > > > > Jigyasu Ji!

> > > > > Just because Rahu is in forth things do not really

become

> > > > problematic.Rahu has it's own character and traits and the

> real

> > > > behaviour is possible to felt during das and antar dasa

> periods

> > > > relating to the bahva.being fourth bahva it relates to

> education

> > > and

> > > > being 12th to 5th it may slightly effect intutive ness as

it

> > adds

> > > to

> > > > emotions.what is more important is also the sign in which

it

> is

> > > > located.In your case it is scorpio leading to it's place

of

> > > > exaltation in capricorn.Being fixed sign and watery in

nature

> > and

> > > > also sign known as secret sign,your ideas need further

> > > strengthened

> > > > and make them more logical not just emotional.

> > > > > Same Rahu if you seen navamsa it joins venus already

> > > retrograde

> > > > and in fourth but effecting 12th bhava.and coming under

the

> > aspect

> > > > of Mars located in 9th.This suggests that your approach to

> > > comforts

> > > > need refinement and with regards to your creative

abilities

> take

> > > > your own time to judge before you rush to act.Also dasa of

> venus

> > > > your 10th and 3rd lords.Your venus is palced in lagna of

the

> > sign

> > > > leo.take care of your eyes and also put in more efforts to

> > > > succeed.may be do not be too pessimistic

> > > > > krishnan

> > > > >

> > > > > jigyasu_007 <jigyasu_007@> wrote:

> > > > > Pranam Ashutoshji,

> > > > > I am a new member here and I have rahu in the fourth

house

> > too,

> > > > > could you kindly advice on its effects and what I can do

to

> > > > overcome

> > > > > the same..

> > > > > my details:

> > > > > dob:25.08.75 tob:0655am place:cochin,kerala,india

> > > > > regards,

> > > > > Jigyasu.

> > > > >

> > > > > --- In

> , "astrologerashutosh"

> > > > > <astrologerashutosh@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear Nalini,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > It is Rahu at its best. I have

seen that

> > the

> > > > > maladies caused by Rahu are best treated by naturopathy,

> > > pranayams

> > > > > and yoga. Rahu has control over the sub-conscious. Only

> > through

> > > > > proper relaxation techniques and meditations, its

effects

> can

> > be

> > > > > controlled.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Rahu strikes when you are least expecting it

to do

> > so.

> > > > And

> > > > > it will be totally absent when you are prepared for it.

> > Present

> > > > > transit of ketu over your natal rahu requires caution,

> > > especially

> > > > > when mercury enters pisces on 25th feb'06.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Ashutosh

> > > > > >

> > > > > > -

> > > > > > auromirra19

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Wednesday, 22 February, 2006 11:17

> > > > > > Re: what is GANDMOOL??....Sahota

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear sir Ashutosh ji,

> > > > > > I recently underwent a surgical procedure in new

Zealand,

> > > > > (August2005)

> > > > > > angiogram. (thorugh the wrist-Right). No blocks but

> there

> > > was

> > > > a

> > > > > > coronary spasm at the artery and doctors say no

> medication

> > > for

> > > > > it

> > > > > > except use beta blockers and hope for the best.They

cant

> > > > > concretely

> > > > > > say my heart is Ok but nothing apparently wrong with

it.

> > It

> > > is

> > > > a

> > > > > > paradox. yeah, during March 1999 my thyroid was not

> > abnormal

> > > > but

> > > > > > sightly higher that normal which was not very

serious.I

> > was

> > > in

> > > > > ICU

> > > > > > for a couple of days and told that had I not been

> brought

> > in

> > > > at

> > > > > that

> > > > > > time it could have been fatal.

> > > > > > Now, Even the doctors are unable to figure out

exactly

> why

> > > > > things

> > > > > > are happening how they are and come up with medical

> > > > > prescriptions

> > > > > > and resorting to trial and error.

> > > > > > Regards

> > > > > > Nalini

> > > > > > --- In

> > > , "astrologerashutosh"

> > > > > > <astrologerashutosh@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Dear Nalini,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Though hypothyroidism is

sometimes

> > > related

> > > > > to

> > > > > > heart troubles, but, not always. In both your and

> Sahota's

> > > > case,

> > > > > > there are inherent heart related maladies. In both

> cases,

> > > the

> > > > > heart

> > > > > > has been affected and is/was malfunctioning.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > The ECG or other cardiac tests do not

always

> > help

> > > in

> > > > > > correct diagnosis. Some of my close aquaintances

have

> > > suffered

> > > > > heart

> > > > > > attacks even when their diagnosis, a few days

earlier,

> > > > revealed

> > > > > no

> > > > > > trouble to the heart.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Of course, the hormonal imbalance is

> > contributive

> > > to

> > > > > the

> > > > > > problem, but you were not having the thyroid thing

in

> 1990

> > > > > march. It

> > > > > > was purely related to the heart.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Rahu is a very illusive planet. It takes

one

> by

> > > > > surprise.

> > > > > > You must have heard of white-collar hypertension. It

is

> > also

> > > > an

> > > > > act

> > > > > > of rahu.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > In both cases, yours and Sahota's, the

heart

> is

> > > weak

> > > > > and

> > > > > > is susceptible. Sahota will have temporary relief in

> moon

> > > > dasha,

> > > > > but

> > > > > > what about when mars and rahu periods come?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > If you see the transits of march 1999,

you

> will

> > > see

> > > > > that

> > > > > > the fourth lord was in debiliation, just like your

natal

> > > > chart,

> > > > > and

> > > > > > the dasha was also of ketu-mer.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Ashutosh

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > -

> > > > > > > auromirra19

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Wednesday, 22 February, 2006 05:56

> > > > > > > Re: what is GANDMOOL??....Sahota

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sri Tatvamasi ji, Ashutosh ji,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I too have rahu in the fourth and was

hospitalised

> in

> > > > March

> > > > > 1999

> > > > > > for

> > > > > > > palpitaions(very High), my ECG has always been

> > > abnormal.I

> > > > > still

> > > > > > have

> > > > > > > the palpitaions and have been on medication ever

> > since.

> > > > > though

> > > > > > > Dcotors say nothing is wrong with my heart as

such.

> I

> > > have

> > > > > now

> > > > > > been

> > > > > > > diagnosed with Hypo thyroidism among a host of

other

> > > > things

> > > > > > which is

> > > > > > > avery long list. The actual disease I am

suffering

> > from

> > > is

> > > > > still

> > > > > > > very inconclusive. Could the rahu placement be

the

> > cause

> > > > > here

> > > > > > too?

> > > > > > > My birth date is 28.02.1960, 14.42 hrs, Madras,

> > > > > > > Regards

> > > > > > > Nalini

> > > > > > > ,

Tatvamasi

> > > > > > > <om_tatsat_om@> wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Dear Sahota,

> > > > > > > > I just checked your chart.

> > > > > > > > My finding says that you are suffering from

> > Hyper/Hypo

> > > > > > > > Thyroid function as your retro mercury with

saturn

> in

> > > > > > > > the 3rd house shows imbalance of Hormones in

your

> > > > > > > > body.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Presence of Rahu in 4th from Lagna gives you a

fear

> > > > > > > > psychosys and anxiety. This adds to your heart

> rate.

> > > > > > > > Same Rahu may make you addicted to drugs in

> indirect

> > > > > > > > way. Over usage of caffinated drinks may

become

> your

> > > > > > > > allergy.

> > > > > > > > Please ask your doc for Thyroid proble,

> > > > > > > > Nothing wrong with Heart.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Tatvam-Asi

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > --- astrologerashutosh <astrologerashutosh@>

> > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Dear Sahota,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I had already told you

the

> > > > > > > > > basics about Gandmool and how they are seen,

in a

> > > > > > > > > reply to your similar post in another group,

> > > > > > > > > yesterday.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Now, coming to the apparent heart-

> problem;

> > > > > > > > > you are definetely prone to suffer from heart

> > > > > > > > > troubles. There are many factors in your

> horoscope

> > > > > > > > > which point towards that.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > The entry of ketu over your natal

> > > > > > > > > rahu-ven-mars in fourth house in march-end

last

> > year

> > > > > > > > > also coincides with the beginning of

> palpitations

> > in

> > > > > > > > > april 2005. The palpitations and related

> anxieties

> > > > > > > > > will finally stop when ketu leaves virgo in

> > sept'06.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > The heart problems are not due to

anxiety

> > > > > > > > > but they have a definite cause. But, the

> presence

> > of

> > > > > > > > > rahu in your natal chart, in fourth house, is

> > > > > > > > > hampering any correct diagnosis. Be ready

for

> some

> > > > > > > > > worsening of condition in next two months.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > It is in no way related to

gandmool and

> > you

> > > > > > > > > were not born in gandmool either.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > A procedure involving minimal

surgery

> will

> > > > > > > > > be required in april to cure it effectively.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Regards,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Ashutosh

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > [The services of this astrologer are free on

the

> > > > > > > > > astrology group, but consultations on

personal

> > > > > > > > > e-mail are chargeable]

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > -

> > > > > > > > > ricky88888765

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Monday, 20 February, 2006 14:17

> > > > > > > > > Re: what is GANDMOOL??

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Dear RR jee,

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > My parents went to this pandit jee to have

a

> look

> > > > > > > > > at my chart

> > > > > > > > > because I have been suffering from these

> strange

> > > > > > > > > heart

> > > > > > > > > palpitations, spasming and chest pains.

They

> > start

> > > > > > > > > last year around

> > > > > > > > > April 2005, but only a few times last

year.

> But

> > in

> > > > > > > > > the last two

> > > > > > > > > months they have gone really bad, in fact

most

> > > > > > > > > days. I have been to

> > > > > > > > > the hospital around 6 times this years for

> check

> > > > > > > > > ups, they found

> > > > > > > > > nothing wrong with my heart, but tests are

> still

> > > > > > > > > on going. They have

> > > > > > > > > suggested it may be anxiety. I am

suffering

> from

> > > > > > > > > that but only when

> > > > > > > > > I get the pains and heart palpitations.

> Everytime

> > > > > > > > > this happens I get

> > > > > > > > > the feeling as if I am having a heart

attack

> and

> > I

> > > > > > > > > am about to die,

> > > > > > > > > but after tests for heart attack the

results

> are

> > > > > > > > > thankfully

> > > > > > > > > negative. The doctors say I have a healthy

> heart

> > > > > > > > > I am really worried. Also my life is just

full

> of

> > > > > > > > > delays and nothing

> > > > > > > > > seems to work out for me, always

obstructions.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > So that is way my parents went to this

pandit

> > jee,

> > > > > > > > > they did ask him

> > > > > > > > > what it is....he says I was was born in

certain

> > > > > > > > > Nakshtra, I think

> > > > > > > > > its called "moola", which needs

pacification

> and

> > > > > > > > > is related to te

> > > > > > > > > problems I have having. can anyone help me?

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > kind regards

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sahota

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > ,

> > > > > > > > > "rohiniranjan" <rrgb@>

> > > > > > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I take it you don't trust this pandit

jee?

> > > > > > > > > > Did he/could he not tell you what it was

> about

> > > > > > > > > and did you not ask?

> > > > > > > > > > How is the gandamoola affecting you, at

> least

> > in

> > > > > > > > > your perception?

> > > > > > > > > > Why did you go to this panditjee

initially

> but

> > > > > > > > > not going there

> > > > > > > > > > anymore?

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Always curious about such enquiries!

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > RR

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > ,

> > > > > > > > > "ricky88888765"

> > > > > > > > > > <jassa_69@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Dear Group,

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I was old by a pandit jee that I have

> > > > > > > > > grandmool and that I need

> > > > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > > > > perform a remedy for this.. Can some

tell

> me

> > > > > > > > > what this is? here

> > > > > > > > > > are

> > > > > > > > > > > details of my horoscope

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > D.O.B : 15th Aug 1978

> > > > > > > > > > > P.O.B : London, U.K

> > > > > > > > > > > T.O.B : 01.13 AM

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Dayligh saving time was on.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > chart as follows :

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > 1st house - ASC gemini 5:40

> > > > > > > > > > > 2nd house - jup(2:06), sun(28.16)

> > > > > > > > > > > 3rd house - mer(5:10), saturn

(8:49) -

> both

> > > > > > > > > combust

> > > > > > > > > > > 4th house - Venus(13:43), Mars

(13:43),

> > > > > > > > > Rahu(3:42)

> > > > > > > > > > > 5th house - n/a

> > > > > > > > > > > 6th house - n/a

> > > > > > > > > > > 7th house - Moon(10:13)

> > > > > > > > > > > 8th house - n/a

> > > > > > > > > > > 9th house - n/a

> > > > > > > > > > > 10th house - Ketu(3:42)

> > > > > > > > > > > 11th house - n/a

> > > > > > > > > > > 12th house - n/a

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Sahota

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE

ULTIMATE

> > > > > > > > > DIVINITY AND RELISH THE TASTE OF ABSOLUTE

BLISS.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Hindu astrology Vedic

> astrology

> > > > > > > > > Free vedic astrology

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > --------------

----

> --

> > --

> > > --

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > ----

> > > > > > > -----------

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > a.. Visit your

group "" on

> the

> > > > > > > > > web.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > b.. To from this group,

send an

> > > > > > > > > email to:

> > > > > > > > > -

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > c.. Your use of is

subject to

> > the

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > --------------

----

> --

> > --

> > > --

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > ----

> > > > > > > -----------

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > > > > > > > > removed]

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam

> > > protection

> > > > > > around

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE ULTIMATE

> > DIVINITY

> > > > AND

> > > > > > RELISH THE TASTE OF ABSOLUTE BLISS.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Vedic astrology Astrology

chart

> > > > Astrology

> > > > > > software

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > ------------------

----

> --

> > --

> > > --

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > -----------

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > a.. Visit your group "" on

the

> web.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > b.. To from this group, send an

email

> > to:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > c.. Your use of is subject to

the

> > >

> > > > > Terms

> > > > > > of Service.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > ------------------

----

> --

> > --

> > > --

> > > > --

> > > > > ----

> > > > > > -----------

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

removed]

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE ULTIMATE

DIVINITY

> > AND

> > > > > RELISH THE TASTE OF ABSOLUTE BLISS.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Vedic astrology Astrology chart

> > Astrology

> > > > > software

> > > > > >

> > > > > > ----------------------

----

> --

> > --

> > > --

> > > > --

> > > > > -----------

> > > > > >

> > > > > > a.. Visit your group "" on the

web.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > b.. To from this group, send an email

to:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > c.. Your use of is subject to the

>

> > > > Terms

> > > > > of Service.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > ----------------------

----

> --

> > --

> > > --

> > > > --

> > > > > -----------

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE ULTIMATE DIVINITY

AND

> > > RELISH

> > > > THE TASTE OF ABSOLUTE BLISS.

> > > > >

> > > > > Vedic astrology Astrology chart Astrology

> software

> > > > >

> > > > > Visit your group "" on the web.

> > > > >

Terms

> > of

> > > > Service.

> > > > >

> > > > > Mail

> > > > > Use Photomail to share photos without annoying

attachments.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE ULTIMATE DIVINITY

AND

> > RELISH

> > > THE TASTE OF ABSOLUTE BLISS.

> > > >

> > > > Vedic astrology Astrology chart Astrology

software

> > > >

> > > > Visit your group "" on the web.

> > > >

Terms

> of

> > > Service.

> > > >

> > > > Autos. Looking for a sweet ride? Get pricing,

reviews,

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> > > more on new and used cars.

> > > >

> > >

> > > SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE ULTIMATE DIVINITY AND

> RELISH

> > THE TASTE OF ABSOLUTE BLISS.

> > >

> > > Vedic astrology Astrology chart Astrology

software

> > >

> > > Visit your group "" on the web.

> > >

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of

> > Service.

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> > > Brings words and photos together (easily) with

> > > PhotoMail - it's free and works with Mail.

> > >

> >

>

SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE ULTIMATE DIVINITY AND

RELISH THE TASTE OF ABSOLUTE BLISS.

>

> Vedic astrology Astrology chart Astrology software

>

> Visit your group "" on the web.

>

> Terms of

Service.

>

> Mail

> Use Photomail to share photos without annoying attachments.

>

> SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE ULTIMATE DIVINITY AND

RELISH THE TASTE OF ABSOLUTE BLISS.

>

> Vedic

astrology Astrology

chart Astrology

software

>

> Visit your group "" on the web.

>

> Terms of

Service.

>

> Prashant

>

> What are the most popular cars? Find out at Autos

>

February 24, 2006

In my observation, belief in jyotish is a part of

Indian psyche.Recent surveys in Indian youth have

shown that a staggering 95% plus have faith in God and

some form of religion.And this is the English speaking

section of Indian youth which so categorically asserts

this. Let me add that in any belief system crafts such

as Jyotish almost become an extension of the religion.

The rationalists, poor guys, are the ones who are

outnumbered. What they write makes good copy and is

read and then immediately forgotten.

I have come across people who do not favour Jyotish

and ppl who oppose it but my assesment would put it as

less than ten percent.

In fact, RRji, very few are headed for that dreaded

hell!

Newspapers, Magaiznes, all print media, all visual

media have a permanent space for astrology generally.

Each village has its set of jyotishis, each town a

cluster of them. It is difficult to gather a number,

but one can be on the safer side and say that India

would have atleast a couple of million jyotishis

practising fulltimers, parttimers included. The

followers of jyotish.....one can safely assume that

all those who believe in some form of divine design

also in some way or the other have faith in some form

of astrology.

Jyotish has a trememdous credibility and it has

survived the jyotishis and their whims.

Its the jyotishis who are doubted even if their

evaluation and predictions do not come true, jyotish

remains intact.

The very close linkage between the concept of God, His

intelligent designs for each individual, the

intricately linked questions of karma and fate

continue to ensure that Jyotish will not only survive

but also flourish.

Who doesnt want to know the future!

We have recently debated the use of jyotish in finding

what Gods to pray to. It is only the natural extension

of the concept of jyotish as a part of religion.

If there is an intelligent design only then we can

trace patterns and predict flow of life and specific

events.

And unless we are told how to pray, how do we atone

for bad karma or bad planetary configurations.

My assertion is astrology is popular.

Astrologers as a group may not have the capacity to

change or influence social norms , individual

astrologers have shown that they can contribute in

their own way.

Sharing of knowledge, logical research are the keys to

the desired direction of Jyotish.

The efficacies of remedies tried and observed

empirically. But all this is will remain a distant

dream till we jyotishis feel that jyotish knowledge

is to be kept secretive. Till they feel that this

knowledge will end up hurting people if it reaches the

wrong hands,till they feel that only the jyotishis are

responsible persons and the person outside their

circle is likely to misuse the knowledge.

Regards

Rishi

February 24, 2006

Rishi,

Thanks for your input. I fully agree and yes -- it all boils down to

full and proper communication. And that can only happen when there

is trust!

<For those joining this thread, I am not going to rehash and take up

space. You can continue reading and get the details from Rishi's

post quoted below>

RR

, rishi shukla

<rishi_2000in wrote:

>

> In my observation, belief in jyotish is a part of

> Indian psyche.Recent surveys in Indian youth have

> shown that a staggering 95% plus have faith in God and

> some form of religion.And this is the English speaking

> section of Indian youth which so categorically asserts

> this. Let me add that in any belief system crafts such

> as Jyotish almost become an extension of the religion.

> The rationalists, poor guys, are the ones who are

> outnumbered. What they write makes good copy and is

> read and then immediately forgotten.

> I have come across people who do not favour Jyotish

> and ppl who oppose it but my assesment would put it as

> less than ten percent.

> In fact, RRji, very few are headed for that dreaded

> hell!

> Newspapers, Magaiznes, all print media, all visual

> media have a permanent space for astrology generally.

> Each village has its set of jyotishis, each town a

> cluster of them. It is difficult to gather a number,

> but one can be on the safer side and say that India

> would have atleast a couple of million jyotishis

> practising fulltimers, parttimers included. The

> followers of jyotish.....one can safely assume that

> all those who believe in some form of divine design

> also in some way or the other have faith in some form

> of astrology.

> Jyotish has a trememdous credibility and it has

> survived the jyotishis and their whims.

> Its the jyotishis who are doubted even if their

> evaluation and predictions do not come true, jyotish

> remains intact.

> The very close linkage between the concept of God, His

> intelligent designs for each individual, the

> intricately linked questions of karma and fate

> continue to ensure that Jyotish will not only survive

> but also flourish.

> Who doesnt want to know the future!

> We have recently debated the use of jyotish in finding

> what Gods to pray to. It is only the natural extension

> of the concept of jyotish as a part of religion.

> If there is an intelligent design only then we can

> trace patterns and predict flow of life and specific

> events.

> And unless we are told how to pray, how do we atone

> for bad karma or bad planetary configurations.

> My assertion is astrology is popular.

> Astrologers as a group may not have the capacity to

> change or influence social norms , individual

> astrologers have shown that they can contribute in

> their own way.

> Sharing of knowledge, logical research are the keys to

> the desired direction of Jyotish.

> The efficacies of remedies tried and observed

> empirically. But all this is will remain a distant

> dream till we jyotishis feel that jyotish knowledge

> is to be kept secretive. Till they feel that this

> knowledge will end up hurting people if it reaches the

> wrong hands,till they feel that only the jyotishis are

> responsible persons and the person outside their

> circle is likely to misuse the knowledge.

> Regards

>

> Rishi

>

February 24, 2006

Rishi ji,

The consensus looks to be:

1.people are not averse to jyotish

2.jyotish has all the elements to be trustworthy

3.jyotish can be used for improvement and conditions a lot.

4.be it cultire,nation,people around are all subject to planet rigours

4.people using/knowing have to be prooactive and forthright

5.we in the forum willing to helpful and sympathise with needy

This will give goodwill to jyotish and in turn to one and all

we notice something wrong let us discourage

krishnan

rishi shukla <rishi_2000in wrote:

In my observation, belief in jyotish is a part of

Indian psyche.Recent surveys in Indian youth have

shown that a staggering 95% plus have faith in God and

some form of religion.And this is the English speaking

section of Indian youth which so categorically asserts

this. Let me add that in any belief system crafts such

as Jyotish almost become an extension of the religion.

The rationalists, poor guys, are the ones who are

outnumbered. What they write makes good copy and is

read and then immediately forgotten.

I have come across people who do not favour Jyotish

and ppl who oppose it but my assesment would put it as

less than ten percent.

In fact, RRji, very few are headed for that dreaded

hell!

Newspapers, Magaiznes, all print media, all visual

media have a permanent space for astrology generally.

Each village has its set of jyotishis, each town a

cluster of them. It is difficult to gather a number,

but one can be on the safer side and say that India

would have atleast a couple of million jyotishis

practising fulltimers, parttimers included. The

followers of jyotish.....one can safely assume that

all those who believe in some form of divine design

also in some way or the other have faith in some form

of astrology.

Jyotish has a trememdous credibility and it has

survived the jyotishis and their whims.

Its the jyotishis who are doubted even if their

evaluation and predictions do not come true, jyotish

remains intact.

The very close linkage between the concept of God, His

intelligent designs for each individual, the

intricately linked questions of karma and fate

continue to ensure that Jyotish will not only survive

but also flourish.

Who doesnt want to know the future!

We have recently debated the use of jyotish in finding

what Gods to pray to. It is only the natural extension

of the concept of jyotish as a part of religion.

If there is an intelligent design only then we can

trace patterns and predict flow of life and specific

events.

And unless we are told how to pray, how do we atone

for bad karma or bad planetary configurations.

My assertion is astrology is popular.

Astrologers as a group may not have the capacity to

change or influence social norms , individual

astrologers have shown that they can contribute in

their own way.

Sharing of knowledge, logical research are the keys to

the desired direction of Jyotish.

The efficacies of remedies tried and observed

empirically. But all this is will remain a distant

dream till we jyotishis feel that jyotish knowledge

is to be kept secretive. Till they feel that this

knowledge will end up hurting people if it reaches the

wrong hands,till they feel that only the jyotishis are

responsible persons and the person outside their

circle is likely to misuse the knowledge.

Regards

Rishi

SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE ULTIMATE DIVINITY AND RELISH THE TASTE OF

ABSOLUTE BLISS.

Vedic astrology Astrology chart Astrology software

Visit your group "" on the web.

Mail

Bring photos to life! New PhotoMail makes sharing a breeze.

February 26, 2006

Well concluded, Krishnanji.

regards

rishi

, vattem krishnan

<bursar_99 wrote:

>

> Rishi ji,

> The consensus looks to be:

> 1.people are not averse to jyotish

> 2.jyotish has all the elements to be trustworthy

> 3.jyotish can be used for improvement and conditions a lot.

> 4.be it cultire,nation,people around are all subject to planet

rigours

> 4.people using/knowing have to be prooactive and forthright

> 5.we in the forum willing to helpful and sympathise with needy

> This will give goodwill to jyotish and in turn to one and all

> we notice something wrong let us discourage

> krishnan

>

> rishi shukla <rishi_2000in wrote:

>

> In my observation, belief in jyotish is a part of

> Indian psyche.Recent surveys in Indian youth have

> shown that a staggering 95% plus have faith in God and

> some form of religion.And this is the English speaking

> section of Indian youth which so categorically asserts

> this. Let me add that in any belief system crafts such

> as Jyotish almost become an extension of the religion.

> The rationalists, poor guys, are the ones who are

> outnumbered. What they write makes good copy and is

> read and then immediately forgotten.

> I have come across people who do not favour Jyotish

> and ppl who oppose it but my assesment would put it as

> less than ten percent.

> In fact, RRji, very few are headed for that dreaded

> hell!

> Newspapers, Magaiznes, all print media, all visual

> media have a permanent space for astrology generally.

> Each village has its set of jyotishis, each town a

> cluster of them. It is difficult to gather a number,

> but one can be on the safer side and say that India

> would have atleast a couple of million jyotishis

> practising fulltimers, parttimers included. The

> followers of jyotish.....one can safely assume that

> all those who believe in some form of divine design

> also in some way or the other have faith in some form

> of astrology.

> Jyotish has a trememdous credibility and it has

> survived the jyotishis and their whims.

> Its the jyotishis who are doubted even if their

> evaluation and predictions do not come true, jyotish

> remains intact.

> The very close linkage between the concept of God, His

> intelligent designs for each individual, the

> intricately linked questions of karma and fate

> continue to ensure that Jyotish will not only survive

> but also flourish.

> Who doesnt want to know the future!

> We have recently debated the use of jyotish in finding

> what Gods to pray to. It is only the natural extension

> of the concept of jyotish as a part of religion.

> If there is an intelligent design only then we can

> trace patterns and predict flow of life and specific

> events.

> And unless we are told how to pray, how do we atone

> for bad karma or bad planetary configurations.

> My assertion is astrology is popular.

> Astrologers as a group may not have the capacity to

> change or influence social norms , individual

> astrologers have shown that they can contribute in

> their own way.

> Sharing of knowledge, logical research are the keys to

> the desired direction of Jyotish.

> The efficacies of remedies tried and observed

> empirically. But all this is will remain a distant

> dream till we jyotishis feel that jyotish knowledge

> is to be kept secretive. Till they feel that this

> knowledge will end up hurting people if it reaches the

> wrong hands,till they feel that only the jyotishis are

> responsible persons and the person outside their

> circle is likely to misuse the knowledge.

> Regards

>

> Rishi

>

> SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE ULTIMATE DIVINITY AND RELISH

THE TASTE OF ABSOLUTE BLISS.

>

> Vedic astrology Astrology chart Astrology software

>

> Visit your group "" on the web.

>

> Terms of

Service.

>

> Mail

> Bring photos to life! New PhotoMail makes sharing a breeze.

>

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