Guest guest Posted April 3, 2006 Report Share Posted April 3, 2006 RRji, "All we see around is more individuals interested in > jyotish but not increasing certainty in the average person's life. " Being lazy by copying n pasting but......arent we negating life itself by seeking total caertainty. Afterall, life should remain uncertain to a certain extent. regards rishi , "crystal pages" <jyotish_vani wrote: > > The name is Rohiniranjan, Krishnan! > > There is no room for laziness and I see that quite a bit out there! > New students don't want to work their bacon, pardon my non-sattwic > expression -- and all of them are waiting for that yellow (hardly > Jovian-jupitarian) titled, "Jyotish for Dummies" (I hope some of the > members would be familiar with that series and not take this as some > personal insult and waste many lines on that subject :-( > > Actually, Jyotish for dummies has been written and rewritten in small > booklet (pocketbooks they called when I was growing up in India > decades ago) format for now many many decades. Many of Raman and > Raoji's and Shrimaliji and Gopesh Ojha and Chowdhriji (OOPS!) have > been small books. All we see around is more individuals interested in > jyotish but not increasing certainty in the average person's life. > Maharshi Yogi stated very clearly that if there are a critical > numbers of Yogis, the world would be quieter, peaceful and more > importantly be still here! Hmm... > > I like ASTROLOGY better because it is more directly testable and on > an individual basis! NO disrespect to any TEACHER intended! When a > prediction fails, most astrologers of any sincerity automatically > blame themselves and work harder -- and not blame others because > nowhere in astrology is it claimed that there need to be a critical > number or mass (as in the atom bomb) before the world will begin to > see the benefits! > > RR > > , vattem krishnan > <bursar_99@> wrote: > > > > Dear Sir, > > Progressively Jyotish is catching to the imagination of educated > people.people evince interest not only just 'coz of personal interest > but also find many vague issues bothering them. > > un like some other lighter branches of futuristic > explorartions,jyotish particularly vedic jyostish needs some > regimentation to learn more through phladeepika,sarvardha chintamani > and Brihat parasarhora. > > As we read some of these books and basics are clear,you will get > many other aids to help in understanding jyotish. > > ceratinly the ongoing works in Astrology(particularly sideral) > and even in fixed zodiac etc are no doubt interesting but their value > addition to resolve problems and find consistency is a mute > point.when questions are asked and apprehensions are made known,we > have to take rescue of the fundamentals.unflinching faith is > rudimenatary to vedic jyotish and various pariharas have significance. > > To speak of an instance one of my colleague worried much for not > having progeny even after 13/14 years of married life,has atlast been > blessed recently.Though frustated due to various interrogations,it > was really difficult to have answered.At 40s to fulfil wish of having > a child is difficult to explain.I know the parents at coimbatore in > their old age must be greatly delighted.This has taken place with > faith and ofcourse awareness of jyotish.the lady,my friend had done > all kind of poojas.the blessings were delayed but not denied. > > The soldier approach of ICAS was helpful as to grind the > principles.once the element of confidence is instilled,we are able to > decipher and speak palnetary language.i think curiosity is momentary > to know of the issues involved.when however serious bother many > people and find no logic,we have to pound through basics and resolve. > > Ecclestical approach,is always helpful and KP is more specific of > the stellar roles in resolving many issues and helps in > application.Clarity is fundamental to explore futuristic studies and > these approaches that supplement are of great value additions > > krishnan > > > > crystal pages <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > Dear Krishnan ji, > > > > I thought ICAS trained jyotishis but you say soldiers! :-) Pardon > my > > levity!! > > > > I myself am indebted to Prof. Raman's scholarly written books and > > articles which was pretty much what was written in lucid and > logical > > english. There were books in hindi and other authors in english too > > but let us not go there. More importantly, I am indebted to his > > ayanamsha which together with K.P. opened my mind to the real > > possibility of using vimshottari dasha and I am indebted to Sri > > Nirmal Chandra Lahiri for his value without which I would not have > > seriously opened my eyes to dasa durations other than the > > conveniently prevailing norm imposed by recent Masters and Lords. > > > > I have already written about illustrious Sri KN Rao and I am fast > > approaching the line-limit that irritates some minds. > > > > It was nice of you to share your thoughts about your gurus. They > > are/were all great men and great souls. My sense is, though, that > > none of them would be happy if we turn jyotish into some holy > shrine > > where questioning is not permitted and curiosity is squashed. I > would > > consider that akin to infanticide! > > > > RR > > > > > > , vattem krishnan > > <bursar_99@> wrote: > > > > > > Sir, > > > I am ICAS trained soldier as far jyotish aspects are > concerned.my > > unflinching faith in late B.V.Raman's approach (was very good) makes > > to pursue jyotish from research and academic point of view. > > > .i have little to say on the controversies of ayanamsa.In ICAS > it > > is not certainly Raman's ayanamsa which was not given really given > > any crdence. > > > .Some how recognition in 90s earned by shri K.N.Rao (when was > in > > his peak days) and decided to settle down to Bharateeya vidya > > bahvan's Institute and start on his own,the justification made by > him > > to differ with shri B.V.Raman)was never taken kindly even today. > > > it is ofcourse,the stars that play a vital even in the life of > > learned men.Today however he is the one who is very quite and > > ceratinly the year 2002 was also disappointing from predictions > point > > of view for many many astrologers in the circuit as what really > > happened from mudane perspective was never an easy task to > > corroborate with jyotish theory.any way these stories now form part > > of history. > > > Between two different poles(ICAS vs K.N.rao's school of > thoughts) > > iam able to put up and continue.My reverences to Shri K.N.rao as my > > guru are unmistakable.we meet on different fora and i get his > > blessings with whcih iam happy. > > > The ICAS today works more silently and is fulfiling it's > > objectives with out media glare.where as my guru is now often made > > busy by various T.V and print media.Probably he airs his views very > > strongly however unconvincing might be.For me Shri.K.n.rao is man > of > > strong convictions and his style is totally different and is not at > > all client oriented.we are happy with his teachings as he aims in > all > > of us to understand jyotish in most prudent and convincing > ways.gives > > lot of emphais on statistical methods.His earnest desire today is > > that this spirit and interest evinced should be furthered.From this > > perspective he is a moving spirit for us > > > krishnan > > > > > > crystal pages <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > Dear Krishnanji, > > > > > > I have never been fortunate to be Shri KN Rao ji's student but > > my ... > > > is he a breath of fresh air ever that blew over the stale plains > of > > > complacent jyotish? Despite his fairly strong and to some > > irritating > > > views, some almost consider them abrasive -- I have never had any > > > problems in accepting his fire for his sincerity and passion is > so > > > obvious and visible. Lord knows I have given him hard times > almost > > to > > > the point of confornting him on Ben's list and questioning about > > his > > > statistics and sources (82% he said publicly and not 85 but small > > > difference) and yet there is no other modern jyotishi who after > > B.V. > > > Raman has done what KN Rao has done to revive jyotish globally > > since > > > the early 90s! If you read his postings, and I have followed his > > for > > > some years, his personal reverence for Raman and what he has done > > is > > > unmistakable, as is his love for truth, no matter what, at least > as > > > he sees it and no one should ever be blamed for that. > > > > > > It has always pained me to my core to hear/read Shri Rao talk > > rather > > > negatively about contemporary jyotishis in India and elsewhere -- > > but > > > though originally astounded and dumb-founded the more I see, the > > more > > > I see what he has talked about when he talks about the 'jyotish' > > > scenario! > > > > > > It is up to all of us, one and all, successful or not, high or > low > > on > > > the ladder, accomplished or not, to question, question and > question > > > and if someone low or high gets upset or insulted by that or > > attacks > > > us -- well obviously we have pressed some buttons rightly and > > > prevented those from getting complacent and rusted! > > > > > > As PVR says, May Jupiter's LIGHT shine upon us, one bulb at a > time! > > > > > > RR > > > > > > , vattem krishnan > > > <bursar_99@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Friends, > > > > In my contacts with Shri K.N.Rao at his residence I always > > found > > > him not very happy to volunteer for making any > > prediction .certainly > > > through paraasara light he makes a chakra on his own computer and > > > assigns an Id but never gave yes or no immediately to > problems.we > > > all know his theory and principles of jyotish were never found > > > wanting and in some cases hea made revealing forecasts which > > > normal,ordinary astrologer would not have made. > > > > But to us as his students and discipels he always advised to > be > > > systematic and also pragmatic.he insisted that accuracy of data > is > > > always to be checked and tested.somehow he always felt that in > 85% > > of > > > cases data accuracy was questionable that makes predictions go > > > awary.ceratinly he was never comfortable with the the success > rate > > of > > > predictions. > > > > So if this could be the feeling we as novices and always with > > > several if and buts always safe to depend on parrots from > accuracy > > > point of view than to count on individual abilities.it is not > that > > > principles of jyotish are wrong.our predictive techics need > > > refinement.This will always be a question mark and we need to be > > > dediacted to the cause even if we feel and convince that jyotish > > can > > > hand out 60--65% > > > > of correct predictions.the safe bet ceratinly nature's gift in > a > > > parrot.this should not be controversial issue how ever good and > bad > > > our forecasts abilities appear to be > > > > krishnan > > > > auromirra19 <nalini2818@> wrote: > > > > Rishiji, > > > > Sad isnt it, but true. though I would refute that we are both > in > > > the > > > > same rung of the ladder. I am far down and all others are way > up > > > and > > > > I have vertigo! and confusion to confound it. > > > > It all started innocently, I read a few files/posts/articles of > > > > learned members in the fora. Now I am back to where I started. > > Why > > > is > > > > this? Where have I gone wrong? I hate to be "all sound and > fury" > > > but > > > > no susbtance. But I dont give up, shall prod on, let it take > this > > > > lifetime. > > > > Regards > > > > Nalini > > > > , rishi shukla > > > > <rishi_2000in@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > The parrot is a good learner. > > > > > Us beginners in Jyotish not so good as parrots so we > > > > > get confused with ayanamshas, the nodes, the vargas, > > > > > the dasha years ..the list can go on merely > > > > > illustrative and not exhaustive. > > > > > So there we go again, counting the stars in the skies > > > > > till eons. > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > rishi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- crystal pages <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > I hate it when it comes to duel between the psychic > > > > > > parrot or the pot- > > > > > > bellied astropundit! The parrot in some instances > > > > > > may be more > > > > > > accurate, demands fewer resources, a few fistfuls of > > > > > > bengal gram, a > > > > > > few pecks at the gulabi amrud and a few handfuls of > > > > > > green chillies as > > > > > > opposed to the pundit (let us not go there, > > > > > > please!)--- In > > > > > > , rishi shukla > > > > > > <rishi_2000in@> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > True, Sir, but that exactly is the point, either > > > > > > you > > > > > > > predict through a set of principles or you predict > > > > > > > through intutive methods. The prediction through a > > > > > > set > > > > > > > of principles need an understanding of the > > > > > > principles > > > > > > > and when a variety of views float, which is but > > > > > > > natural then confusion gets compounded. > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rishi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- crystal pages <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rishi ji and interested others, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As Shri K.N. Rao ji has expressed on Ben's list > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > few times and I > > > > > > > > hope I am not quoting him incorrectly or out of > > > > > > > > context: The only > > > > > > > > true test for jyotish and jyotishi is through > > > > > > > > prediction and only > > > > > > > > through consistently correct predictions. To > > > > > > which I > > > > > > > > add -- who needs > > > > > > > > further proof or discussion and only silence can > > > > > > > > prevail! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes -- difficult to impossible for most of us > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > something to strive > > > > > > > > for by those who respect and admire Mr. K.N. > > > > > > Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > > > > > > > "rishi_2000in" > > > > > > > > <rishi_2000in@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Welcome, naliniji, to the club wherein > > > > > > realities > > > > > > > > and shadows merge > > > > > > > > > and create confusion for beginners like us. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is so interesting that while various > > > > > > approaches > > > > > > > > to Jyotish can > > > > > > > > > glibly explain the same chart accurately in > > > > > > > > various forms, its > > > > > > > > still > > > > > > > > > contending with major issues > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > Rishi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > > > > > > > "auromirra19" > > > > > > > > > <nalini2818@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -[Om Namo Narayanaya] > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divya, > > > > > > > > > > When it comes to learning or knowledge, age > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > no criterion. I > > > > > > > > > > welcome your advice. Yes I have been mixing > > > > > > up > > > > > > > > too many things. I > > > > > > > > > > thought it prudent to start my study of > > > > > > jyotish > > > > > > > > diligently, > > > > > > > > > > systematically on a particular muhurta. I > > > > > > shall > > > > > > > > certainly , as > > > > > > > > > > advised by you start only from the > > > > > > > > basics/classics. > > > > > > > > > > I did read a couple of articles/lectures of > > > > > > > > learned members in > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > fora, both of Jaimini and Parashara. The > > > > > > > > assimilation part was > > > > > > > > ok, > > > > > > > > > > should have slotted them in the respective > > > > > > > > places but > > > > > > > > > inexperienced > > > > > > > > > > that I am, have bungled. And you know the > > > > > > net > > > > > > > > result, confusion. > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > > > God Bless > > > > > > > > > > Nalini > > > > > > > > > > -- In , > > > > > > Divya > > > > > > > > <touchbase_divya@> > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ||Hare Rama Krsna|| > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Naliniji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What I am writing is little off the > > > > > > topic of > > > > > > > > discussion. > > > > > > > > Also, > > > > > > > > > I > > > > > > > > > > am no expert on the topic. But, being a > > > > > > beginner > > > > > > > > student myself, > > > > > > > > I > > > > > > > > > > am able to understand why you are feeling > > > > > > > > confused. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The topic of discussion was whether Rahu > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > Ketu have > > > > > > > > > aspects. > > > > > > > > > > > You felt that since Ketu is described as > > > > > > > > Mokshakaraka, it > > > > > > > > must > > > > > > > > > > be important. Also you wondered if it is > > > > > > > > considered as a planet > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > all. Later you have also added the word > > > > > > Chara > > > > > > > > Karaka. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think we should go step by step. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What is important is - What is a Graha > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > what forms the > > > > > > > > > basis > > > > > > > > > > of aspects. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why did you feel that being a Karaka, is > > > > > > > > related to aspects? > > > > > > > > I > > > > > > > > > > thought Karaka was a separate topic. Are we > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > mixing up too > > > > > > > > many > > > > > > > > > > things? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The reason I wrote the earlier mail > > > > > > (asking > > > > > > > > you to > > > > > > > > > concentrate > > > > > > > > > > more on the word Graha rather than 'planet') > > > > > > > > was, that I feel > > > > > > > > > > sometimes the English words (which do not > > > > > > > > exactly fit) take our > > > > > > > > > line > > > > > > > > > > of thought in a different direction. Later > > > > > > they > > > > > > > > cause more > > > > > > > > doubts. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But, if we concentrate on 'Graha', their > > > > > > > > nature, why Rahu - > > > > > > > > > Ketu > > > > > > > > > > are called Chaya Graha, also their nature, > > > > > > then > > > > > > > > it is a little > > > > > > > > > > easier to grasp the concept. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Also, one thing I have realised (the > > > > > > hard > > > > > > > > way) is that if I > > > > > > > > > > study basics first and then read the > > > > > > comments of > > > > > > > > learned members > > > > > > > > > > here, I am able to learn and understand > > > > > > better > > > > > > > > than if I try the > > > > > > > > > > other way round. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I thought I'll share my experience with > > > > > > you. > > > > > > > > If there's > > > > > > > > > anything > > > > > > > > > > you didn't like, then being elder to me, > > > > > > please > > > > > > > > forgive it as my > > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated === > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? 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Guest guest Posted April 4, 2006 Report Share Posted April 4, 2006 Divination (including Jyotish) can only reduce uncertainty, and never eliminate it. You are right. , "rishi_2000in" <rishi_2000in wrote: > > RRji, > "All we see around is more individuals interested in > > jyotish but not increasing certainty in the average person's > life. " > Being lazy by copying n pasting but......arent we negating life > itself by seeking total caertainty. Afterall, life should remain > uncertain to a certain extent. > regards > rishi > > , "crystal pages" > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > The name is Rohiniranjan, Krishnan! > > > > There is no room for laziness and I see that quite a bit out > there! > > New students don't want to work their bacon, pardon my non-sattwic > > expression -- and all of them are waiting for that yellow (hardly > > Jovian-jupitarian) titled, "Jyotish for Dummies" (I hope some of > the > > members would be familiar with that series and not take this as > some > > personal insult and waste many lines on that subject :-( > > > > Actually, Jyotish for dummies has been written and rewritten in > small > > booklet (pocketbooks they called when I was growing up in India > > decades ago) format for now many many decades. Many of Raman and > > Raoji's and Shrimaliji and Gopesh Ojha and Chowdhriji (OOPS!) have > > been small books. All we see around is more individuals interested > in > > jyotish but not increasing certainty in the average person's life. > > Maharshi Yogi stated very clearly that if there are a critical > > numbers of Yogis, the world would be quieter, peaceful and more > > importantly be still here! Hmm... > > > > I like ASTROLOGY better because it is more directly testable and > on > > an individual basis! NO disrespect to any TEACHER intended! When a > > prediction fails, most astrologers of any sincerity automatically > > blame themselves and work harder -- and not blame others because > > nowhere in astrology is it claimed that there need to be a > critical > > number or mass (as in the atom bomb) before the world will begin > to > > see the benefits! > > > > RR > > > > , vattem krishnan > > <bursar_99@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > Progressively Jyotish is catching to the imagination of > educated > > people.people evince interest not only just 'coz of personal > interest > > but also find many vague issues bothering them. > > > un like some other lighter branches of futuristic > > explorartions,jyotish particularly vedic jyostish needs some > > regimentation to learn more through phladeepika,sarvardha > chintamani > > and Brihat parasarhora. > > > As we read some of these books and basics are clear,you will > get > > many other aids to help in understanding jyotish. > > > ceratinly the ongoing works in Astrology(particularly sideral) > > and even in fixed zodiac etc are no doubt interesting but their > value > > addition to resolve problems and find consistency is a mute > > point.when questions are asked and apprehensions are made known,we > > have to take rescue of the fundamentals.unflinching faith is > > rudimenatary to vedic jyotish and various pariharas have > significance. > > > To speak of an instance one of my colleague worried much for > not > > having progeny even after 13/14 years of married life,has atlast > been > > blessed recently.Though frustated due to various interrogations,it > > was really difficult to have answered.At 40s to fulfil wish of > having > > a child is difficult to explain.I know the parents at coimbatore > in > > their old age must be greatly delighted.This has taken place with > > faith and ofcourse awareness of jyotish.the lady,my friend had > done > > all kind of poojas.the blessings were delayed but not denied. > > > The soldier approach of ICAS was helpful as to grind the > > principles.once the element of confidence is instilled,we are able > to > > decipher and speak palnetary language.i think curiosity is > momentary > > to know of the issues involved.when however serious bother many > > people and find no logic,we have to pound through basics and > resolve. > > > Ecclestical approach,is always helpful and KP is more specific > of > > the stellar roles in resolving many issues and helps in > > application.Clarity is fundamental to explore futuristic studies > and > > these approaches that supplement are of great value additions > > > krishnan > > > > > > crystal pages <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > Dear Krishnan ji, > > > > > > I thought ICAS trained jyotishis but you say soldiers! :-) > Pardon > > my > > > levity!! > > > > > > I myself am indebted to Prof. Raman's scholarly written books > and > > > articles which was pretty much what was written in lucid and > > logical > > > english. There were books in hindi and other authors in english > too > > > but let us not go there. More importantly, I am indebted to his > > > ayanamsha which together with K.P. opened my mind to the real > > > possibility of using vimshottari dasha and I am indebted to Sri > > > Nirmal Chandra Lahiri for his value without which I would not > have > > > seriously opened my eyes to dasa durations other than the > > > conveniently prevailing norm imposed by recent Masters and Lords. > > > > > > I have already written about illustrious Sri KN Rao and I am > fast > > > approaching the line-limit that irritates some minds. > > > > > > It was nice of you to share your thoughts about your gurus. They > > > are/were all great men and great souls. My sense is, though, > that > > > none of them would be happy if we turn jyotish into some holy > > shrine > > > where questioning is not permitted and curiosity is squashed. I > > would > > > consider that akin to infanticide! > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > , vattem krishnan > > > <bursar_99@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Sir, > > > > I am ICAS trained soldier as far jyotish aspects are > > concerned.my > > > unflinching faith in late B.V.Raman's approach (was very good) > makes > > > to pursue jyotish from research and academic point of view. > > > > .i have little to say on the controversies of ayanamsa.In > ICAS > > it > > > is not certainly Raman's ayanamsa which was not given really > given > > > any crdence. > > > > .Some how recognition in 90s earned by shri K.N.Rao (when > was > > in > > > his peak days) and decided to settle down to Bharateeya vidya > > > bahvan's Institute and start on his own,the justification made > by > > him > > > to differ with shri B.V.Raman)was never taken kindly even today. > > > > it is ofcourse,the stars that play a vital even in the life > of > > > learned men.Today however he is the one who is very quite and > > > ceratinly the year 2002 was also disappointing from predictions > > point > > > of view for many many astrologers in the circuit as what really > > > happened from mudane perspective was never an easy task to > > > corroborate with jyotish theory.any way these stories now form > part > > > of history. > > > > Between two different poles(ICAS vs K.N.rao's school of > > thoughts) > > > iam able to put up and continue.My reverences to Shri K.N.rao as > my > > > guru are unmistakable.we meet on different fora and i get his > > > blessings with whcih iam happy. > > > > The ICAS today works more silently and is fulfiling it's > > > objectives with out media glare.where as my guru is now often > made > > > busy by various T.V and print media.Probably he airs his views > very > > > strongly however unconvincing might be.For me Shri.K.n.rao is > man > > of > > > strong convictions and his style is totally different and is not > at > > > all client oriented.we are happy with his teachings as he aims > in > > all > > > of us to understand jyotish in most prudent and convincing > > ways.gives > > > lot of emphais on statistical methods.His earnest desire today > is > > > that this spirit and interest evinced should be furthered.From > this > > > perspective he is a moving spirit for us > > > > krishnan > > > > > > > > crystal pages <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > Dear Krishnanji, > > > > > > > > I have never been fortunate to be Shri KN Rao ji's student but > > > my ... > > > > is he a breath of fresh air ever that blew over the stale > plains > > of > > > > complacent jyotish? Despite his fairly strong and to some > > > irritating > > > > views, some almost consider them abrasive -- I have never had > any > > > > problems in accepting his fire for his sincerity and passion > is > > so > > > > obvious and visible. Lord knows I have given him hard times > > almost > > > to > > > > the point of confornting him on Ben's list and questioning > about > > > his > > > > statistics and sources (82% he said publicly and not 85 but > small > > > > difference) and yet there is no other modern jyotishi who > after > > > B.V. > > > > Raman has done what KN Rao has done to revive jyotish globally > > > since > > > > the early 90s! If you read his postings, and I have followed > his > > > for > > > > some years, his personal reverence for Raman and what he has > done > > > is > > > > unmistakable, as is his love for truth, no matter what, at > least > > as > > > > he sees it and no one should ever be blamed for that. > > > > > > > > It has always pained me to my core to hear/read Shri Rao talk > > > rather > > > > negatively about contemporary jyotishis in India and > elsewhere -- > > > but > > > > though originally astounded and dumb-founded the more I see, > the > > > more > > > > I see what he has talked about when he talks about > the 'jyotish' > > > > scenario! > > > > > > > > It is up to all of us, one and all, successful or not, high or > > low > > > on > > > > the ladder, accomplished or not, to question, question and > > question > > > > and if someone low or high gets upset or insulted by that or > > > attacks > > > > us -- well obviously we have pressed some buttons rightly and > > > > prevented those from getting complacent and rusted! > > > > > > > > As PVR says, May Jupiter's LIGHT shine upon us, one bulb at a > > time! > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > , vattem krishnan > > > > <bursar_99@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Friends, > > > > > In my contacts with Shri K.N.Rao at his residence I always > > > found > > > > him not very happy to volunteer for making any > > > prediction .certainly > > > > through paraasara light he makes a chakra on his own computer > and > > > > assigns an Id but never gave yes or no immediately to > > problems.we > > > > all know his theory and principles of jyotish were never found > > > > wanting and in some cases hea made revealing forecasts which > > > > normal,ordinary astrologer would not have made. > > > > > But to us as his students and discipels he always advised > to > > be > > > > systematic and also pragmatic.he insisted that accuracy of > data > > is > > > > always to be checked and tested.somehow he always felt that in > > 85% > > > of > > > > cases data accuracy was questionable that makes predictions go > > > > awary.ceratinly he was never comfortable with the the success > > rate > > > of > > > > predictions. > > > > > So if this could be the feeling we as novices and always > with > > > > several if and buts always safe to depend on parrots from > > accuracy > > > > point of view than to count on individual abilities.it is not > > that > > > > principles of jyotish are wrong.our predictive techics need > > > > refinement.This will always be a question mark and we need to > be > > > > dediacted to the cause even if we feel and convince that > jyotish > > > can > > > > hand out 60--65% > > > > > of correct predictions.the safe bet ceratinly nature's gift > in > > a > > > > parrot.this should not be controversial issue how ever good > and > > bad > > > > our forecasts abilities appear to be > > > > > krishnan > > > > > auromirra19 <nalini2818@> wrote: > > > > > Rishiji, > > > > > Sad isnt it, but true. though I would refute that we are > both > > in > > > > the > > > > > same rung of the ladder. I am far down and all others are > way > > up > > > > and > > > > > I have vertigo! and confusion to confound it. > > > > > It all started innocently, I read a few files/posts/articles > of > > > > > learned members in the fora. Now I am back to where I > started. > > > Why > > > > is > > > > > this? Where have I gone wrong? I hate to be "all sound and > > fury" > > > > but > > > > > no susbtance. But I dont give up, shall prod on, let it take > > this > > > > > lifetime. > > > > > Regards > > > > > Nalini > > > > > , rishi shukla > > > > > <rishi_2000in@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > The parrot is a good learner. > > > > > > Us beginners in Jyotish not so good as parrots so we > > > > > > get confused with ayanamshas, the nodes, the vargas, > > > > > > the dasha years ..the list can go on merely > > > > > > illustrative and not exhaustive. > > > > > > So there we go again, counting the stars in the skies > > > > > > till eons. > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > > > rishi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- crystal pages <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > I hate it when it comes to duel between the psychic > > > > > > > parrot or the pot- > > > > > > > bellied astropundit! The parrot in some instances > > > > > > > may be more > > > > > > > accurate, demands fewer resources, a few fistfuls of > > > > > > > bengal gram, a > > > > > > > few pecks at the gulabi amrud and a few handfuls of > > > > > > > green chillies as > > > > > > > opposed to the pundit (let us not go there, > > > > > > > please!)--- In > > > > > > > , rishi shukla > > > > > > > <rishi_2000in@> > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > True, Sir, but that exactly is the point, either > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > predict through a set of principles or you predict > > > > > > > > through intutive methods. The prediction through a > > > > > > > set > > > > > > > > of principles need an understanding of the > > > > > > > principles > > > > > > > > and when a variety of views float, which is but > > > > > > > > natural then confusion gets compounded. > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rishi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- crystal pages <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rishi ji and interested others, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As Shri K.N. Rao ji has expressed on Ben's list > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > few times and I > > > > > > > > > hope I am not quoting him incorrectly or out of > > > > > > > > > context: The only > > > > > > > > > true test for jyotish and jyotishi is through > > > > > > > > > prediction and only > > > > > > > > > through consistently correct predictions. To > > > > > > > which I > > > > > > > > > add -- who needs > > > > > > > > > further proof or discussion and only silence can > > > > > > > > > prevail! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes -- difficult to impossible for most of us > > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > > something to strive > > > > > > > > > for by those who respect and admire Mr. K.N. > > > > > > > Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > > > > > > > > "rishi_2000in" > > > > > > > > > <rishi_2000in@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Welcome, naliniji, to the club wherein > > > > > > > realities > > > > > > > > > and shadows merge > > > > > > > > > > and create confusion for beginners like us. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is so interesting that while various > > > > > > > approaches > > > > > > > > > to Jyotish can > > > > > > > > > > glibly explain the same chart accurately in > > > > > > > > > various forms, its > > > > > > > > > still > > > > > > > > > > contending with major issues > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > Rishi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > > > > > > > > "auromirra19" > > > > > > > > > > <nalini2818@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -[Om Namo Narayanaya] > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divya, > > > > > > > > > > > When it comes to learning or knowledge, age > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > no criterion. I > > > > > > > > > > > welcome your advice. Yes I have been mixing > > > > > > > up > > > > > > > > > too many things. I > > > > > > > > > > > thought it prudent to start my study of > > > > > > > jyotish > > > > > > > > > diligently, > > > > > > > > > > > systematically on a particular muhurta. I > > > > > > > shall > > > > > > > > > certainly , as > > > > > > > > > > > advised by you start only from the > > > > > > > > > basics/classics. > > > > > > > > > > > I did read a couple of articles/lectures of > > > > > > > > > learned members in > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > fora, both of Jaimini and Parashara. The > > > > > > > > > assimilation part was > > > > > > > > > ok, > > > > > > > > > > > should have slotted them in the respective > > > > > > > > > places but > > > > > > > > > > inexperienced > > > > > > > > > > > that I am, have bungled. And you know the > > > > > > > net > > > > > > > > > result, confusion. > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > > > > God Bless > > > > > > > > > > > Nalini > > > > > > > > > > > -- In , > > > > > > > Divya > > > > > > > > > <touchbase_divya@> > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ||Hare Rama Krsna|| > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Naliniji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What I am writing is little off the > > > > > > > topic of > > > > > > > > > discussion. > > > > > > > > > Also, > > > > > > > > > > I > > > > > > > > > > > am no expert on the topic. But, being a > > > > > > > beginner > > > > > > > > > student myself, > > > > > > > > > I > > > > > > > > > > > am able to understand why you are feeling > > > > > > > > > confused. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The topic of discussion was whether Rahu > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > Ketu have > > > > > > > > > > aspects. > > > > > > > > > > > > You felt that since Ketu is described as > > > > > > > > > Mokshakaraka, it > > > > > > > > > must > > > > > > > > > > > be important. Also you wondered if it is > > > > > > > > > considered as a planet > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > > all. Later you have also added the word > > > > > > > Chara > > > > > > > > > Karaka. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think we should go step by step. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What is important is - What is a Graha > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > what forms the > > > > > > > > > > basis > > > > > > > > > > > of aspects. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why did you feel that being a Karaka, is > > > > > > > > > related to aspects? > > > > > > > > > I > > > > > > > > > > > thought Karaka was a separate topic. Are we > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > mixing up too > > > > > > > > > many > > > > > > > > > > > things? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The reason I wrote the earlier mail > > > > > > > (asking > > > > > > > > > you to > > > > > > > > > > concentrate > > > > > > > > > > > more on the word Graha rather than 'planet') > > > > > > > > > was, that I feel > > > > > > > > > > > sometimes the English words (which do not > > > > > > > > > exactly fit) take our > > > > > > > > > > line > > > > > > > > > > > of thought in a different direction. Later > > > > > > > they > > > > > > > > > cause more > > > > > > > > > doubts. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But, if we concentrate on 'Graha', their > > > > > > > > > nature, why Rahu - > > > > > > > > > > Ketu > > > > > > > > > > > are called Chaya Graha, also their nature, > > > > > > > then > > > > > > > > > it is a little > > > > > > > > > > > easier to grasp the concept. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Also, one thing I have realised (the > > > > > > > hard > > > > > > > > > way) is that if I > > > > > > > > > > > study basics first and then read the > > > > > > > comments of > > > > > > > > > learned members > > > > > > > > > > > here, I am able to learn and understand > > > > > > > better > > > > > > > > > than if I try the > > > > > > > > > > > other way round. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I thought I'll share my experience with > > > > > > > you. > > > > > > > > > If there's > > > > > > > > > > anything > > > > > > > > > > > you didn't like, then being elder to me, > > > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > forgive it as my > > > > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated === > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? 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Guest guest Posted April 4, 2006 Report Share Posted April 4, 2006 Dear Friends, The issue that has been bothering me much was(when I was really not exposed to jyotish) the issue related to divination.infact it was very intersting that I was growing as a bright student and with respectable numbers i never thought that devination was a necessary elements. All of a sudden, one afternoon I realised that a person's confidence is most vital in every sphere of life.More so if Jupiter aspects naughty mercury placed in 7th in own sign that is dual as well as airy in nature.ceratinly It is also true(it is my gut) when venus afflicts jupiter in one's chart, it is only devination that can rescue an individual.probably that with these planetary configurations not knowing present in one's chart ventures to make predictions.This must be intutive attempts every one makes.Divination props confidence to toy with most difficult of difficult situations and skills. That afternoon i was present all of sudden in ICAS class room getting introduced to the President,ICAS.All most 2 decades(prior to that) I tried to learn jyotish through late B.V.Raman's Higginbotham editions and must have made some predictions too by looking into the chart's of some well established academic personalities. Now only I could really flash back only Shri Rishi ji quipped"are we not neagting life itself by seeking certainity and R.R.ji's brevity"never eliminate it" Sir, You are forth right when you said so krishnan crystal pages <jyotish_vani wrote: Divination (including Jyotish) can only reduce uncertainty, and never eliminate it. You are right. , "rishi_2000in" <rishi_2000in wrote: > > RRji, > "All we see around is more individuals interested in > > jyotish but not increasing certainty in the average person's > life. " > Being lazy by copying n pasting but......arent we negating life > itself by seeking total caertainty. Afterall, life should remain > uncertain to a certain extent. > regards > rishi > > , "crystal pages" > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > The name is Rohiniranjan, Krishnan! > > > > There is no room for laziness and I see that quite a bit out > there! > > New students don't want to work their bacon, pardon my non-sattwic > > expression -- and all of them are waiting for that yellow (hardly > > Jovian-jupitarian) titled, "Jyotish for Dummies" (I hope some of > the > > members would be familiar with that series and not take this as > some > > personal insult and waste many lines on that subject :-( > > > > Actually, Jyotish for dummies has been written and rewritten in > small > > booklet (pocketbooks they called when I was growing up in India > > decades ago) format for now many many decades. Many of Raman and > > Raoji's and Shrimaliji and Gopesh Ojha and Chowdhriji (OOPS!) have > > been small books. All we see around is more individuals interested > in > > jyotish but not increasing certainty in the average person's life. > > Maharshi Yogi stated very clearly that if there are a critical > > numbers of Yogis, the world would be quieter, peaceful and more > > importantly be still here! Hmm... > > > > I like ASTROLOGY better because it is more directly testable and > on > > an individual basis! NO disrespect to any TEACHER intended! When a > > prediction fails, most astrologers of any sincerity automatically > > blame themselves and work harder -- and not blame others because > > nowhere in astrology is it claimed that there need to be a > critical > > number or mass (as in the atom bomb) before the world will begin > to > > see the benefits! > > > > RR > > > > , vattem krishnan > > <bursar_99@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > Progressively Jyotish is catching to the imagination of > educated > > people.people evince interest not only just 'coz of personal > interest > > but also find many vague issues bothering them. > > > un like some other lighter branches of futuristic > > explorartions,jyotish particularly vedic jyostish needs some > > regimentation to learn more through phladeepika,sarvardha > chintamani > > and Brihat parasarhora. > > > As we read some of these books and basics are clear,you will > get > > many other aids to help in understanding jyotish. > > > ceratinly the ongoing works in Astrology(particularly sideral) > > and even in fixed zodiac etc are no doubt interesting but their > value > > addition to resolve problems and find consistency is a mute > > point.when questions are asked and apprehensions are made known,we > > have to take rescue of the fundamentals.unflinching faith is > > rudimenatary to vedic jyotish and various pariharas have > significance. > > > To speak of an instance one of my colleague worried much for > not > > having progeny even after 13/14 years of married life,has atlast > been > > blessed recently.Though frustated due to various interrogations,it > > was really difficult to have answered.At 40s to fulfil wish of > having > > a child is difficult to explain.I know the parents at coimbatore > in > > their old age must be greatly delighted.This has taken place with > > faith and ofcourse awareness of jyotish.the lady,my friend had > done > > all kind of poojas.the blessings were delayed but not denied. > > > The soldier approach of ICAS was helpful as to grind the > > principles.once the element of confidence is instilled,we are able > to > > decipher and speak palnetary language.i think curiosity is > momentary > > to know of the issues involved.when however serious bother many > > people and find no logic,we have to pound through basics and > resolve. > > > Ecclestical approach,is always helpful and KP is more specific > of > > the stellar roles in resolving many issues and helps in > > application.Clarity is fundamental to explore futuristic studies > and > > these approaches that supplement are of great value additions > > > krishnan > > > > > > crystal pages <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > Dear Krishnan ji, > > > > > > I thought ICAS trained jyotishis but you say soldiers! :-) > Pardon > > my > > > levity!! > > > > > > I myself am indebted to Prof. Raman's scholarly written books > and > > > articles which was pretty much what was written in lucid and > > logical > > > english. There were books in hindi and other authors in english > too > > > but let us not go there. More importantly, I am indebted to his > > > ayanamsha which together with K.P. opened my mind to the real > > > possibility of using vimshottari dasha and I am indebted to Sri > > > Nirmal Chandra Lahiri for his value without which I would not > have > > > seriously opened my eyes to dasa durations other than the > > > conveniently prevailing norm imposed by recent Masters and Lords. > > > > > > I have already written about illustrious Sri KN Rao and I am > fast > > > approaching the line-limit that irritates some minds. > > > > > > It was nice of you to share your thoughts about your gurus. They > > > are/were all great men and great souls. My sense is, though, > that > > > none of them would be happy if we turn jyotish into some holy > > shrine > > > where questioning is not permitted and curiosity is squashed. I > > would > > > consider that akin to infanticide! > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > > , vattem krishnan > > > <bursar_99@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Sir, > > > > I am ICAS trained soldier as far jyotish aspects are > > concerned.my > > > unflinching faith in late B.V.Raman's approach (was very good) > makes > > > to pursue jyotish from research and academic point of view. > > > > .i have little to say on the controversies of ayanamsa.In > ICAS > > it > > > is not certainly Raman's ayanamsa which was not given really > given > > > any crdence. > > > > .Some how recognition in 90s earned by shri K.N.Rao (when > was > > in > > > his peak days) and decided to settle down to Bharateeya vidya > > > bahvan's Institute and start on his own,the justification made > by > > him > > > to differ with shri B.V.Raman)was never taken kindly even today. > > > > it is ofcourse,the stars that play a vital even in the life > of > > > learned men.Today however he is the one who is very quite and > > > ceratinly the year 2002 was also disappointing from predictions > > point > > > of view for many many astrologers in the circuit as what really > > > happened from mudane perspective was never an easy task to > > > corroborate with jyotish theory.any way these stories now form > part > > > of history. > > > > Between two different poles(ICAS vs K.N.rao's school of > > thoughts) > > > iam able to put up and continue.My reverences to Shri K.N.rao as > my > > > guru are unmistakable.we meet on different fora and i get his > > > blessings with whcih iam happy. > > > > The ICAS today works more silently and is fulfiling it's > > > objectives with out media glare.where as my guru is now often > made > > > busy by various T.V and print media.Probably he airs his views > very > > > strongly however unconvincing might be.For me Shri.K.n.rao is > man > > of > > > strong convictions and his style is totally different and is not > at > > > all client oriented.we are happy with his teachings as he aims > in > > all > > > of us to understand jyotish in most prudent and convincing > > ways.gives > > > lot of emphais on statistical methods.His earnest desire today > is > > > that this spirit and interest evinced should be furthered.From > this > > > perspective he is a moving spirit for us > > > > krishnan > > > > > > > > crystal pages <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > Dear Krishnanji, > > > > > > > > I have never been fortunate to be Shri KN Rao ji's student but > > > my ... > > > > is he a breath of fresh air ever that blew over the stale > plains > > of > > > > complacent jyotish? Despite his fairly strong and to some > > > irritating > > > > views, some almost consider them abrasive -- I have never had > any > > > > problems in accepting his fire for his sincerity and passion > is > > so > > > > obvious and visible. Lord knows I have given him hard times > > almost > > > to > > > > the point of confornting him on Ben's list and questioning > about > > > his > > > > statistics and sources (82% he said publicly and not 85 but > small > > > > difference) and yet there is no other modern jyotishi who > after > > > B.V. > > > > Raman has done what KN Rao has done to revive jyotish globally > > > since > > > > the early 90s! If you read his postings, and I have followed > his > > > for > > > > some years, his personal reverence for Raman and what he has > done > > > is > > > > unmistakable, as is his love for truth, no matter what, at > least > > as > > > > he sees it and no one should ever be blamed for that. > > > > > > > > It has always pained me to my core to hear/read Shri Rao talk > > > rather > > > > negatively about contemporary jyotishis in India and > elsewhere -- > > > but > > > > though originally astounded and dumb-founded the more I see, > the > > > more > > > > I see what he has talked about when he talks about > the 'jyotish' > > > > scenario! > > > > > > > > It is up to all of us, one and all, successful or not, high or > > low > > > on > > > > the ladder, accomplished or not, to question, question and > > question > > > > and if someone low or high gets upset or insulted by that or > > > attacks > > > > us -- well obviously we have pressed some buttons rightly and > > > > prevented those from getting complacent and rusted! > > > > > > > > As PVR says, May Jupiter's LIGHT shine upon us, one bulb at a > > time! > > > > > > > > RR > > > > > > > > , vattem krishnan > > > > <bursar_99@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Friends, > > > > > In my contacts with Shri K.N.Rao at his residence I always > > > found > > > > him not very happy to volunteer for making any > > > prediction .certainly > > > > through paraasara light he makes a chakra on his own computer > and > > > > assigns an Id but never gave yes or no immediately to > > problems.we > > > > all know his theory and principles of jyotish were never found > > > > wanting and in some cases hea made revealing forecasts which > > > > normal,ordinary astrologer would not have made. > > > > > But to us as his students and discipels he always advised > to > > be > > > > systematic and also pragmatic.he insisted that accuracy of > data > > is > > > > always to be checked and tested.somehow he always felt that in > > 85% > > > of > > > > cases data accuracy was questionable that makes predictions go > > > > awary.ceratinly he was never comfortable with the the success > > rate > > > of > > > > predictions. > > > > > So if this could be the feeling we as novices and always > with > > > > several if and buts always safe to depend on parrots from > > accuracy > > > > point of view than to count on individual abilities.it is not > > that > > > > principles of jyotish are wrong.our predictive techics need > > > > refinement.This will always be a question mark and we need to > be > > > > dediacted to the cause even if we feel and convince that > jyotish > > > can > > > > hand out 60--65% > > > > > of correct predictions.the safe bet ceratinly nature's gift > in > > a > > > > parrot.this should not be controversial issue how ever good > and > > bad > > > > our forecasts abilities appear to be > > > > > krishnan > > > > > auromirra19 <nalini2818@> wrote: > > > > > Rishiji, > > > > > Sad isnt it, but true. though I would refute that we are > both > > in > > > > the > > > > > same rung of the ladder. I am far down and all others are > way > > up > > > > and > > > > > I have vertigo! and confusion to confound it. > > > > > It all started innocently, I read a few files/posts/articles > of > > > > > learned members in the fora. Now I am back to where I > started. > > > Why > > > > is > > > > > this? Where have I gone wrong? I hate to be "all sound and > > fury" > > > > but > > > > > no susbtance. But I dont give up, shall prod on, let it take > > this > > > > > lifetime. > > > > > Regards > > > > > Nalini > > > > > , rishi shukla > > > > > <rishi_2000in@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > The parrot is a good learner. > > > > > > Us beginners in Jyotish not so good as parrots so we > > > > > > get confused with ayanamshas, the nodes, the vargas, > > > > > > the dasha years ..the list can go on merely > > > > > > illustrative and not exhaustive. > > > > > > So there we go again, counting the stars in the skies > > > > > > till eons. > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > > > rishi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- crystal pages <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > I hate it when it comes to duel between the psychic > > > > > > > parrot or the pot- > > > > > > > bellied astropundit! The parrot in some instances > > > > > > > may be more > > > > > > > accurate, demands fewer resources, a few fistfuls of > > > > > > > bengal gram, a > > > > > > > few pecks at the gulabi amrud and a few handfuls of > > > > > > > green chillies as > > > > > > > opposed to the pundit (let us not go there, > > > > > > > please!)--- In > > > > > > > , rishi shukla > > > > > > > <rishi_2000in@> > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > True, Sir, but that exactly is the point, either > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > predict through a set of principles or you predict > > > > > > > > through intutive methods. The prediction through a > > > > > > > set > > > > > > > > of principles need an understanding of the > > > > > > > principles > > > > > > > > and when a variety of views float, which is but > > > > > > > > natural then confusion gets compounded. > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rishi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- crystal pages <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rishi ji and interested others, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As Shri K.N. Rao ji has expressed on Ben's list > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > few times and I > > > > > > > > > hope I am not quoting him incorrectly or out of > > > > > > > > > context: The only > > > > > > > > > true test for jyotish and jyotishi is through > > > > > > > > > prediction and only > > > > > > > > > through consistently correct predictions. To > > > > > > > which I > > > > > > > > > add -- who needs > > > > > > > > > further proof or discussion and only silence can > > > > > > > > > prevail! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes -- difficult to impossible for most of us > > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > > something to strive > > > > > > > > > for by those who respect and admire Mr. K.N. > > > > > > > Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > > > > > > > > "rishi_2000in" > > > > > > > > > <rishi_2000in@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Welcome, naliniji, to the club wherein > > > > > > > realities > > > > > > > > > and shadows merge > > > > > > > > > > and create confusion for beginners like us. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is so interesting that while various > > > > > > > approaches > > > > > > > > > to Jyotish can > > > > > > > > > > glibly explain the same chart accurately in > > > > > > > > > various forms, its > > > > > > > > > still > > > > > > > > > > contending with major issues > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > > > > > > Rishi > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , > > > > > > > > > "auromirra19" > > > > > > > > > > <nalini2818@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -[Om Namo Narayanaya] > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Divya, > > > > > > > > > > > When it comes to learning or knowledge, age > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > no criterion. I > > > > > > > > > > > welcome your advice. Yes I have been mixing > > > > > > > up > > > > > > > > > too many things. I > > > > > > > > > > > thought it prudent to start my study of > > > > > > > jyotish > > > > > > > > > diligently, > > > > > > > > > > > systematically on a particular muhurta. I > > > > > > > shall > > > > > > > > > certainly , as > > > > > > > > > > > advised by you start only from the > > > > > > > > > basics/classics. > > > > > > > > > > > I did read a couple of articles/lectures of > > > > > > > > > learned members in > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > fora, both of Jaimini and Parashara. The > > > > > > > > > assimilation part was > > > > > > > > > ok, > > > > > > > > > > > should have slotted them in the respective > > > > > > > > > places but > > > > > > > > > > inexperienced > > > > > > > > > > > that I am, have bungled. And you know the > > > > > > > net > > > > > > > > > result, confusion. > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > > > > God Bless > > > > > > > > > > > Nalini > > > > > > > > > > > -- In , > > > > > > > Divya > > > > > > > > > <touchbase_divya@> > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ||Hare Rama Krsna|| > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Naliniji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What I am writing is little off the > > > > > > > topic of > > > > > > > > > discussion. > > > > > > > > > Also, > > > > > > > > > > I > > > > > > > > > > > am no expert on the topic. But, being a > > > > > > > beginner > > > > > > > > > student myself, > > > > > > > > > I > > > > > > > > > > > am able to understand why you are feeling > > > > > > > > > confused. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The topic of discussion was whether Rahu > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > Ketu have > > > > > > > > > > aspects. > > > > > > > > > > > > You felt that since Ketu is described as > > > > > > > > > Mokshakaraka, it > > > > > > > > > must > > > > > > > > > > > be important. Also you wondered if it is > > > > > > > > > considered as a planet > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > > all. Later you have also added the word > > > > > > > Chara > > > > > > > > > Karaka. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think we should go step by step. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What is important is - What is a Graha > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > what forms the > > > > > > > > > > basis > > > > > > > > > > > of aspects. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why did you feel that being a Karaka, is > > > > > > > > > related to aspects? > > > > > > > > > I > > > > > > > > > > > thought Karaka was a separate topic. Are we > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > mixing up too > > > > > > > > > many > > > > > > > > > > > things? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The reason I wrote the earlier mail > > > > > > > (asking > > > > > > > > > you to > > > > > > > > > > concentrate > > > > > > > > > > > more on the word Graha rather than 'planet') > > > > > > > > > was, that I feel > > > > > > > > > > > sometimes the English words (which do not > > > > > > > > > exactly fit) take our > > > > > > > > > > line > > > > > > > > > > > of thought in a different direction. Later > > > > > > > they > > > > > > > > > cause more > > > > > > > > > doubts. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But, if we concentrate on 'Graha', their > > > > > > > > > nature, why Rahu - > > > > > > > > > > Ketu > > > > > > > > > > > are called Chaya Graha, also their nature, > > > > > > > then > > > > > > > > > it is a little > > > > > > > > > > > easier to grasp the concept. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Also, one thing I have realised (the > > > > > > > hard > > > > > > > > > way) is that if I > > > > > > > > > > > study basics first and then read the > > > > > > > comments of > > > > > > > > > learned members > > > > > > > > > > > here, I am able to learn and understand > > > > > > > better > > > > > > > > > than if I try the > > > > > > > > > > > other way round. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I thought I'll share my experience with > > > > > > > you. > > > > > > > > > If there's > > > > > > > > > > anything > > > > > > > > > > > you didn't like, then being elder to me, > > > > > > > please > > > > > > > > > forgive it as my > > > > > > > > > > > > > === message truncated === > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? 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