Guest guest Posted July 9, 2002 Report Share Posted July 9, 2002 Can someone explain to me which system - Shadbala or Ashtakavarga - is the one to use when trying to estimate house strength? I anticipate the answer being Shadbala. But then, of what use is Ashtakavarga if Shadbala is more complete? Here are two examples I have seen: 1) Strength of 2nd house is 5.07 rupas using Shadbala system - It is the weakest house in the chart. However, in the Ashtakavarga system, it has 39 bindus (in the Rasi) - making it the "strongest". 2) Strength of 8th house is 9.25 rupas using Shadbala system - It is the second strongest house in the chart. However, in the Ashtakavarga system it has 20 bindus - making it the "weakest". A related question - is there some such thing as a mean or average house strength in the Shadbala system? For example, is 9.25 rupas considered to be a strong house or not? I ask this because, for planets, Shadbala strength is cited as a percentage (125% of average, 95% of average), but not for houses. Why? Thanks VAS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2002 Report Share Posted July 9, 2002 Dear Vedic astro student(is that your name) Shadbala and ashtakavarga are used for different purposes. ashtakavarga is very much used for transits and to read it directly on its face is not the correct approach. One needs to learn the technique of ashtakavarga and its usage. Shadbala is itslef consisting of various components, like kala bala, stana bala , uchcha bala, drig bala, digbala etc. you try to understand all these and where they are useful and where they are used. shadbala shows the potential of a house. regards partha vedic astrology, "vedicastrostudent" <vedicastrostudent> wrote: > Can someone explain to me which system - Shadbala or Ashtakavarga - > is the one to use when trying to estimate house strength? I > anticipate the answer being Shadbala. But then, of what use is > Ashtakavarga if Shadbala is more complete? Here are two examples I > have seen: > 1) Strength of 2nd house is 5.07 rupas using Shadbala system - It is > the weakest house in the chart. However, in the Ashtakavarga system, > it has 39 bindus (in the Rasi) - making it the "strongest". > 2) Strength of 8th house is 9.25 rupas using Shadbala system - It is > the second strongest house in the chart. However, in the Ashtakavarga > system it has 20 bindus - making it the "weakest". > A related question - is there some such thing as a mean or average > house strength in the Shadbala system? For example, is 9.25 rupas > considered to be a strong house or not? I ask this because, for > planets, Shadbala strength is cited as a percentage (125% of average, > 95% of average), but not for houses. Why? > > Thanks > VAS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2002 Report Share Posted July 9, 2002 As far as my understanding goes, Astakavarga gives info on how the planets are influencing a particular house. If a planet is benefic influence on a particular house, it is marked with 1 point otherwise not. These charts are drawn taking into account of planetary positions with reference to a particular planet. For example, sun is taken as reference in sun ashtakavarga etc. It does not give the strength of the house. Where as the shadbala is used to calculate the strength of planets and bhavas. Regards Muruli partvinu5 [partvinu5 ]Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2002 10:22 AMvedic astrologySubject: [vedic astrology] Re: Shadbala vs AshtakavargaDear Vedic astro student(is that your name)Shadbala and ashtakavarga are used for different purposes. ashtakavarga is very much used for transits and to read it directly on its face is not the correct approach. One needs to learn the technique of ashtakavarga and its usage.Shadbala is itslef consisting of various components, like kala bala, stana bala , uchcha bala, drig bala, digbala etc. you try to understand all these and where they are useful and where they are used.shadbala shows the potential of a house.regardsparthavedic astrology, "vedicastrostudent" <vedicastrostudent> wrote:> Can someone explain to me which system - Shadbala or Ashtakavarga - > is the one to use when trying to estimate house strength? I > anticipate the answer being Shadbala. But then, of what use is > Ashtakavarga if Shadbala is more complete? Here are two examples I > have seen:> 1) Strength of 2nd house is 5.07 rupas using Shadbala system - It is > the weakest house in the chart. However, in the Ashtakavarga system, > it has 39 bindus (in the Rasi) - making it the "strongest".> 2) Strength of 8th house is 9.25 rupas using Shadbala system - It is > the second strongest house in the chart. However, in the Ashtakavarga > system it has 20 bindus - making it the "weakest".> A related question - is there some such thing as a mean or average > house strength in the Shadbala system? For example, is 9.25 rupas > considered to be a strong house or not? I ask this because, for > planets, Shadbala strength is cited as a percentage (125% of average, > 95% of average), but not for houses. Why?> > Thanks> VASArchives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2002 Report Share Posted July 9, 2002 Vyam VedaVyasaaya Namah Dear VAS, Strength todo what? - Ask yourself this. Shad Bala is for grahas alone, and those being the 7 grahas from Sun-Saturn. Shad Bala is used to see the extent to which the Grahas indications will be felt. I.e. an example from BPHS: "A planet in deep exaltation, and fully equipped with the Shad Bala, confers Great Raja Yoga.. etc" Zoran has earlier given an example of this usage in an Article about Avasthas, but unfortunately i can't find it on the http://sjvcusa.org site. Astakavarga is more advanced, and relates to the 7 Grahas influence on the various houses, from themselves. Hence this is related to activity and the place where there is activity. There is something called Bhava Balas as well. Otherwise see the house. Treat the friends and enemies of the house, as per the karaka of it, and hence decide the results. I.e. for Mother see 4th house, and Moon being karaka gives; Saturn, Venus and Mercury as enemies towards Moon. Hence Saturn, Venus or Mercury in the 4th house, can be bad for the health of mother. Education is also the 4th house, and its Karaka is Mercury. Mars is very enimical towards Mercury, and its placement in the 4th obstructs education, and the person has trouble reading, learning math etc. Hence Mars occupying the Siddhamsa-Narayana Dasa Rasi also gives problems with education during its Dasa. I assume you are checking for wealth of the person. Well 2nd house doesn't show wealth gained but shows he sustaining forces of ones life. i.e. which factors keeps one alive, and how one keeps alive. Karaka for wealth is Jupiter. Hence Rahu and Saturn in 2nd is very troubling for the person and gives a poor upbringing. 11th from Arudha Lagna should be check to determine the wealth propperly. The more grahas aspecting/joining this place, gives more sources of gains. I hope this helps. Best wishes, Visti. - vedicastrostudent vedic astrology Wednesday, July 10, 2002 6:13 AM [vedic astrology] Shadbala vs Ashtakavarga Can someone explain to me which system - Shadbala or Ashtakavarga - is the one to use when trying to estimate house strength? I anticipate the answer being Shadbala. But then, of what use is Ashtakavarga if Shadbala is more complete? Here are two examples I have seen:1) Strength of 2nd house is 5.07 rupas using Shadbala system - It is the weakest house in the chart. However, in the Ashtakavarga system, it has 39 bindus (in the Rasi) - making it the "strongest".2) Strength of 8th house is 9.25 rupas using Shadbala system - It is the second strongest house in the chart. However, in the Ashtakavarga system it has 20 bindus - making it the "weakest".A related question - is there some such thing as a mean or average house strength in the Shadbala system? For example, is 9.25 rupas considered to be a strong house or not? I ask this because, for planets, Shadbala strength is cited as a percentage (125% of average, 95% of average), but not for houses. Why?ThanksVASArchives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2002 Report Share Posted July 9, 2002 Vyam VedaVysaaya Namah Dear VAS, I thought you might want this. This is from BPHS: Summary of minimum strengths Su 6,5Mo 6,0Ma 5,0Me 7,0Ju 6,5Ve 5,5Sa 5,0 Break-Up Sthaana Dig Kaala Cheshta AyanaSu,Me,Ju 165 35 50 112 30Mo,Ve 133 50 30 100 40Ma,Sa 96 30 40 67 20 Maharishi Parasara states, that "if say Saturn has high Shad Bala, then it confers long life, but lots of miseries". Best wishes, Visti. - vedicastrostudent vedic astrology Wednesday, July 10, 2002 6:13 AM [vedic astrology] Shadbala vs Ashtakavarga Can someone explain to me which system - Shadbala or Ashtakavarga - is the one to use when trying to estimate house strength? I anticipate the answer being Shadbala. But then, of what use is Ashtakavarga if Shadbala is more complete? Here are two examples I have seen:1) Strength of 2nd house is 5.07 rupas using Shadbala system - It is the weakest house in the chart. However, in the Ashtakavarga system, it has 39 bindus (in the Rasi) - making it the "strongest".2) Strength of 8th house is 9.25 rupas using Shadbala system - It is the second strongest house in the chart. However, in the Ashtakavarga system it has 20 bindus - making it the "weakest".A related question - is there some such thing as a mean or average house strength in the Shadbala system? For example, is 9.25 rupas considered to be a strong house or not? I ask this because, for planets, Shadbala strength is cited as a percentage (125% of average, 95% of average), but not for houses. Why?ThanksVASArchives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 10, 2002 Report Share Posted July 10, 2002 Om Namo Narayanaya, Dear Visti, Zoran has earlier given an example of this usage in an Article about Avasthas, but unfortunately i can't find it on the http://sjvcusa.org site. ZORAN: I cannot find it as well. Yet, if necessary I can post it to you. I cannot find my article on Atmakarak. Have you perhaps saved it? If yes, do kindly send it to me. In my friend chart, most of grahas have low shadbal. Only mangal and surya are strong. She had too many opportunites yet low achievements. That is the case of low shadbal. We can discuss the chart if you wish Astakavarga is more advanced, and relates to the 7 Grahas influence on the various houses, from themselves. Hence this is related to activity and the place where there is activity. There is something called Bhava Balas as well. Otherwise see the house. Treat the friends and enemies of the house, as per the karaka of it, and hence decide the results. I.e. for Mother see 4th house, and Moon being karaka gives; Saturn, Venus and Mercury as enemies towards Moon. Hence Saturn, Venus or Mercury in the 4th house, can be bad for the health of mother. Education is also the 4th house, and its Karaka is Mercury. Mars is very enimical towards Mercury, and its placement in the 4th obstructs education, and the person has trouble reading, learning math etc. Hence Mars occupying the Siddhamsa-Narayana Dasa Rasi also gives problems with education during its Dasa. I assume you are checking for wealth of the person. Well 2nd house doesn't show wealth gained but shows he sustaining forces of ones life. i.e. which factors keeps one alive, and how one keeps alive. Karaka for wealth is Jupiter. Hence Rahu and Saturn in 2nd is very troubling for the person and gives a poor upbringing. 11th from Arudha Lagna should be check to determine the wealth propperly. The more grahas aspecting/joining this place, gives more sources of gains. I hope this helps.Best wishes, Visti. - vedicastrostudent vedic astrology Wednesday, July 10, 2002 6:13 AM [vedic astrology] Shadbala vs Ashtakavarga Can someone explain to me which system - Shadbala or Ashtakavarga - is the one to use when trying to estimate house strength? I anticipate the answer being Shadbala. But then, of what use is Ashtakavarga if Shadbala is more complete? Here are two examples I have seen: 1) Strength of 2nd house is 5.07 rupas using Shadbala system - It is the weakest house in the chart. However, in the Ashtakavarga system, it has 39 bindus (in the Rasi) - making it the "strongest". 2) Strength of 8th house is 9.25 rupas using Shadbala system - It is the second strongest house in the chart. However, in the Ashtakavarga system it has 20 bindus - making it the "weakest". A related question - is there some such thing as a mean or average house strength in the Shadbala system? For example, is 9.25 rupas considered to be a strong house or not? I ask this because, for planets, Shadbala strength is cited as a percentage (125% of average, 95% of average), but not for houses. Why? Thanks VAS || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || Terms of Service. || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || Terms of Service. -- Zoran Radosavljevic Jyotish Teacher at Shri Jagannath Vedic Centre mails: ahimsa (AT) NSpoint (DOT) net ahimsa (AT) neobee (DOT) net web address: http://www.sjvc.co.yu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 10, 2002 Report Share Posted July 10, 2002 Dear Vedic Astrology Student, As Visti has pointed out, try to understand the calculations that are involved in finding out the Sarvashtakavarga and Shad Bala. Those would answer a lot of your questions. I can talk a little bit on Ashtkavarga only as I am not well versed in Shad Bal. Ashtakavarga gives the strength based on how planets affect and influence each other. Ashtakvarga is based on 7 grahas and Lagna making it 8 (Ashtak). Ashtakavarga is a mathematical model and there is a whole system that is used with Ashtakavarga for prediction. Its use is not just for transits but its whole system for predictions. Hope that helps, Cheer !!! Ash vedic astrology, "vedicastrostudent" <vedicastrostudent> wrote: > Can someone explain to me which system - Shadbala or Ashtakavarga - > is the one to use when trying to estimate house strength? I > anticipate the answer being Shadbala. But then, of what use is > Ashtakavarga if Shadbala is more complete? Here are two examples I > have seen: > 1) Strength of 2nd house is 5.07 rupas using Shadbala system - It is > the weakest house in the chart. However, in the Ashtakavarga system, > it has 39 bindus (in the Rasi) - making it the "strongest". > 2) Strength of 8th house is 9.25 rupas using Shadbala system - It is > the second strongest house in the chart. However, in the Ashtakavarga > system it has 20 bindus - making it the "weakest". > A related question - is there some such thing as a mean or average > house strength in the Shadbala system? For example, is 9.25 rupas > considered to be a strong house or not? I ask this because, for > planets, Shadbala strength is cited as a percentage (125% of average, > 95% of average), but not for houses. Why? > > Thanks > VAS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 10, 2002 Report Share Posted July 10, 2002 Vyam VedaVyasaaya Namah Dear Zoran, Nope sorry, i don't have the articles. I hope our sjvc-webmaster saved them so that they can be displayed on the website, its very unfortunate that theres so little action on that page. It would be very good for us to discuss the chart for the benefit of list members. Personally, i'm very much interested in the intrinsic details of Ashtakavarga. Best wishes, Visti. - Zoran Radosavljevic vedic astrology Wednesday, July 10, 2002 1:36 PM Re: [vedic astrology] Shadbala vs Ashtakavarga Om Namo Narayanaya, Dear Visti, Zoran has earlier given an example of this usage in an Article about Avasthas, but unfortunately i can't find it on the http://sjvcusa.org site. ZORAN: I cannot find it as well. Yet, if necessary I can post it to you. I cannot find my article on Atmakarak. Have you perhaps saved it? If yes, do kindly send it to me. In my friend chart, most of grahas have low shadbal. Only mangal and surya are strong. She had too many opportunites yet low achievements. That is the case of low shadbal. We can discuss the chart if you wish Astakavarga is more advanced, and relates to the 7 Grahas influence on the various houses, from themselves. Hence this is related to activity and the place where there is activity. There is something called Bhava Balas as well. Otherwise see the house. Treat the friends and enemies of the house, as per the karaka of it, and hence decide the results. I.e. for Mother see 4th house, and Moon being karaka gives; Saturn, Venus and Mercury as enemies towards Moon. Hence Saturn, Venus or Mercury in the 4th house, can be bad for the health of mother. Education is also the 4th house, and its Karaka is Mercury. Mars is very enimical towards Mercury, and its placement in the 4th obstructs education, and the person has trouble reading, learning math etc. Hence Mars occupying the Siddhamsa-Narayana Dasa Rasi also gives problems with education during its Dasa. I assume you are checking for wealth of the person. Well 2nd house doesn't show wealth gained but shows he sustaining forces of ones life. i.e. which factors keeps one alive, and how one keeps alive. Karaka for wealth is Jupiter. Hence Rahu and Saturn in 2nd is very troubling for the person and gives a poor upbringing. 11th from Arudha Lagna should be check to determine the wealth propperly. The more grahas aspecting/joining this place, gives more sources of gains. I hope this helps.Best wishes, Visti. - vedicastrostudent vedic astrology Wednesday, July 10, 2002 6:13 AM [vedic astrology] Shadbala vs Ashtakavarga Can someone explain to me which system - Shadbala or Ashtakavarga - is the one to use when trying to estimate house strength? I anticipate the answer being Shadbala. But then, of what use is Ashtakavarga if Shadbala is more complete? Here are two examples I have seen: 1) Strength of 2nd house is 5.07 rupas using Shadbala system - It is the weakest house in the chart. However, in the Ashtakavarga system, it has 39 bindus (in the Rasi) - making it the "strongest". 2) Strength of 8th house is 9.25 rupas using Shadbala system - It is the second strongest house in the chart. However, in the Ashtakavarga system it has 20 bindus - making it the "weakest". A related question - is there some such thing as a mean or average house strength in the Shadbala system? For example, is 9.25 rupas considered to be a strong house or not? I ask this because, for planets, Shadbala strength is cited as a percentage (125% of average, 95% of average), but not for houses. Why? Thanks VAS Group info: vedic astrology/info.html To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || Group info: vedic astrology/info.html To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... -- Zoran Radosavljevic Jyotish Teacher at Shri Jagannath Vedic Centre mails: ahimsa (AT) NSpoint (DOT) net ahimsa (AT) neobee (DOT) net web address: http://www.sjvc.co.yu Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 10, 2002 Report Share Posted July 10, 2002 Namaste friends, I am giving an extract from my book "Vedic Astrology: An Integrated Approach" below. This clarifies the difference between Shadbalas of planets and Ashtakavarga bala of planets. After teaching shadbalas and the associated bhava balas, Parasara clearly mentioned that the results of a yoga formed by various planets or houses are given by the strongest among them. So shadbala's main use is in deciding which of the n planets forming a yoga gives the result. Ashtakavarga is far more important and decides how the energies of various planets aid the job of a planet or a house (in a particular area of life). Vimsopaka bala is even more important and covers various areas of life. The extract below tries to explain all this using an analogy. May Jupiter's light shine on us, Narasimha ------ [Copyrights reserved for P.V.R. Narasimha Rao] 15.2 Why Different Strengths Why do we need different strengths for different purposes? Why can't we use the same strength? To understand this, let us consider an analogy. Suppose X is an engineer. Suppose Y is another engineer with exactly the same background and suppose Y comes to the house of X for a few days. Suppose Y sleeps in the afternoon and X doesn't. Suppose it is 1 pm and Y is ready for his afternoon nap. Suppose the two engineers have promised a charity in town that they would give a big donation together and suppose someone from the charity comes to X's house. Because it is not his house and because he is sleepy, Y is probably not going to play a prominent role and X is probably going to talk pleasantries and then give a check on behalf of Y and himself. The money is both his and Y's, but X is in a better position to handle it. Shadbalas are similar to this. When two or more planets take part in a yoga, the one that is stronger as per shadbala ends up giving the results. Both X and Y may have to deal with contractors, workers and vendors for their professional work. If Y has better relations with the people he deals with, he will be more productive at his work as an engineer. Similarly, strength as per ashtakavarga shows the ability of planets to deliver their goods in harmony with other planetary forces at work in a chart. Even if a planet has good shadbala, it will be unable to deliver its goods if it is at odds with other planets in the chart, i.e. has a low ashtakavarga strength. An engineer who has good relations with workers, vendors and contractors related to one project may not go along well with people involved in another project. In that case, he will produce excellent results in the former project and he may not be effective in the latter. Similarly, a planet may have good ashtakavarga strength in one divisional chart and poor ashtakavarga strength in another divisional chart. Then it will give its results more effectively in the area of life related to the first chart. Despite good capabilities and potential to get work done, Y may be unable to get his work done if he is depressed about something or if he is absent-minded for some reason. If he is in a cheerful state, he may get his work done well. Thus the state one is in decides one's final output. Similarly, a planet must be in a good "avastha" (state) to give good results. There are different kinds of states – states related to age, states related to alertness, states related to mood and states related to activity. When one hires an engineer as an employee or when one assigns a project to an engineer, one is concerned about how effective he will be in the project. But suppose one is considering the same engineer as a partner in business. Then his effectiveness in a particular project does not matter much. What matters now is how well rounded he is. He should have good overall knowledge of various projects. Vimsopaka bala is analogous to this. When we consider the overall effectiveness of a planet in one's life, we no longer look at its effectiveness to give results in a specific area of life. Instead, we look at Vimsopaka bala. It shows the overall strength of a planet and its ability to play an important role in one's life (rather than a specific area of life). If X and Y have to decide who eats a cake first or who gets to drink the only can of soft drink left in the refrigerator, they are probably not going to argue about it. Their qualifications or productivity at work or mental state or overall ability are not going to matter. For something so trivial, they will probably toss a coin or have a friendly arm-wrestling or simply do what their friends present in the room suggest. If Y has more friends in the room and they say "let Y have it", then Y is going to have it. Similarly, for trivial things like determining who initiates dasas, antardasas etc, we have very simple rules that are different from shadbala, ashtakavarga bala, avastha bala, Vimsopaka bala etc. As it has been emphasized many times in this book, Vedic astrology has a rich variety of parameters, tools and techniques. Attempting to use various techniques in an interchangable manner only leads to confusion. One should strive to understand the meanings of various parameters and tools and use the right set of parameters and tools for the occasion. Though we have different ways of measuring a planet's strength, their meanings are different and accordingly they are used for different purposes. We will learn the most common ones in this chapter. 15.3 Shadbala and Astakavarga Bala There are six sources of strength – strength due to placement, strength due to time, strength due to directions, strength due to aspects, strength due to motion and strength due to inherent nature. Shadbala is a measure of the strength of a planet based on these six sources of strength. Explaining the computation of shadbalas is beyond the scope of this book. For the details of its computation, one may refer to "Brihat Parasara Hora Sastram" by Parasara or "Graha and Bhava Balas" by Dr. B.V. Raman. Most computer software programs give shadbala, though there are minor differences between the definitions used by them. When two or more planets influence the same house or when they participate in a yoga, then the planet with the highest shadbala is the most likely give the results. The planet with the strongest shadbala is like a group leader who acts on the group's behalf. On the other hand, ashtakavarga bala shows how other planets support or oppose a planet. It does not show how capable the planet is of leading and giving the results of a group of planets, unlike shadbala. It shows how capable a planet is of giving its own results, in harmony with other planetary forces. ------ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 10, 2002 Report Share Posted July 10, 2002 Dear List, Continuing on the simillar lines can somebody explain also the Bhava Balas wrt Ashtakavarga Balas.It will be helpful for most of us knowing the same. Thanks Brahma --- pvr108 <pvr wrote: > Namaste friends, > > I am giving an extract from my book "Vedic > Astrology: An Integrated > Approach" below. This clarifies the difference > between Shadbalas of > planets and Ashtakavarga bala of planets. > > After teaching shadbalas and the associated bhava > balas, Parasara > clearly mentioned that the results of a yoga formed > by various > planets or houses are given by the strongest among > them. So > shadbala's main use is in deciding which of the n > planets forming a > yoga gives the result. > > Ashtakavarga is far more important and decides how > the energies of > various planets aid the job of a planet or a house > (in a particular > area of life). Vimsopaka bala is even more important > and covers > various areas of life. > > The extract below tries to explain all this using an > analogy. > > May Jupiter's light shine on us, > Narasimha > ------ > [Copyrights reserved for P.V.R. Narasimha Rao] > > 15.2 Why Different Strengths > > Why do we need different strengths for different > purposes? Why can't > we use the same strength? To understand this, let us > consider an > analogy. > > Suppose X is an engineer. Suppose Y is another > engineer with exactly > the same background and suppose Y comes to the house > of X for a few > days. Suppose Y sleeps in the afternoon and X > doesn't. Suppose it is > 1 pm and Y is ready for his afternoon nap. Suppose > the two engineers > have promised a charity in town that they would give > a big donation > together and suppose someone from the charity comes > to X's house. > Because it is not his house and because he is > sleepy, Y is probably > not going to play a prominent role and X is probably > going to talk > pleasantries and then give a check on behalf of Y > and himself. The > money is both his and Y's, but X is in a better > position to handle > it. Shadbalas are similar to this. When two or more > planets take part > in a yoga, the one that is stronger as per shadbala > ends up giving > the results. > > Both X and Y may have to deal with contractors, > workers and vendors > for their professional work. If Y has better > relations with the > people he deals with, he will be more productive at > his work as an > engineer. Similarly, strength as per ashtakavarga > shows the ability > of planets to deliver their goods in harmony with > other planetary > forces at work in a chart. Even if a planet has good > shadbala, it > will be unable to deliver its goods if it is at odds > with other > planets in the chart, i.e. has a low ashtakavarga > strength. > > An engineer who has good relations with workers, > vendors and > contractors related to one project may not go along > well with people > involved in another project. In that case, he will > produce excellent > results in the former project and he may not be > effective in the > latter. Similarly, a planet may have good > ashtakavarga strength in > one divisional chart and poor ashtakavarga strength > in another > divisional chart. Then it will give its results more > effectively in > the area of life related to the first chart. > > Despite good capabilities and potential to get work > done, Y may be > unable to get his work done if he is depressed about > something or if > he is absent-minded for some reason. If he is in a > cheerful state, he > may get his work done well. Thus the state one is in > decides one's > final output. Similarly, a planet must be in a good > "avastha" (state) > to give good results. There are different kinds of > states – states > related to age, states related to alertness, states > related to mood > and states related to activity. > > When one hires an engineer as an employee or when > one assigns a > project to an engineer, one is concerned about how > effective he will > be in the project. But suppose one is considering > the same engineer > as a partner in business. Then his effectiveness in > a particular > project does not matter much. What matters now is > how well rounded he > is. He should have good overall knowledge of various > projects. > Vimsopaka bala is analogous to this. When we > consider the overall > effectiveness of a planet in one's life, we no > longer look at its > effectiveness to give results in a specific area of > life. Instead, we > look at Vimsopaka bala. It shows the overall > strength of a planet and > its ability to play an important role in one's life > (rather than a > specific area of life). > > If X and Y have to decide who eats a cake first or > who gets to drink > the only can of soft drink left in the refrigerator, > they are > probably not going to argue about it. Their > qualifications or > productivity at work or mental state or overall > ability are not going > to matter. For something so trivial, they will > probably toss a coin > or have a friendly arm-wrestling or simply do what > their friends > present in the room suggest. If Y has more friends > in the room and > they say "let Y have it", then Y is going to have > it. Similarly, for > trivial things like determining who initiates dasas, > antardasas etc, > we have very simple rules that are different from > shadbala, > ashtakavarga bala, avastha bala, Vimsopaka bala etc. > > As it has been emphasized many times in this book, > Vedic astrology > has a rich variety of parameters, tools and > techniques. Attempting to > use various techniques in an interchangable manner > only leads to > confusion. One should strive to understand the > meanings of various > parameters and tools and use the right set of > parameters and tools > for the occasion. Though we have different ways of > measuring a > planet's strength, their meanings are different and > accordingly they > are used for different purposes. We will learn the > most common ones > in this chapter. > > 15.3 Shadbala and Astakavarga Bala > > There are six sources of strength – strength due to > placement, > strength due to time, strength due to directions, > strength due to > aspects, strength due to motion and strength due to > inherent nature. > Shadbala is a measure of the strength of a planet > based on these six > sources of strength. Explaining the computation of > shadbalas is > beyond the scope of this book. For the details of > its computation, > one may refer to "Brihat Parasara Hora Sastram" by > Parasara or "Graha > and Bhava Balas" by Dr. B.V. Raman. Most computer > software programs > give shadbala, though there are minor differences > between the > === message truncated === Sign up for SBC Dial - First Month Free http://sbc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 10, 2002 Report Share Posted July 10, 2002 Thank you very much, Narasimha, Visti and all others who replied. Although I have gained a lot of knowledge, I am still a little confused, I must say. I have some followup questions and replies. Please try and follow my line of reasoning so you may see exactly why I made this request in the first place, and also choose to contradict/validate it at specific places: (1) The reason I chose the 2nd house in that particular chart was not actually to study wealth. It just leapt out to me because according to Shadbala it was the weakest house (5.07 rupas) and according to Ashtakavarga, it was the strongest (39 bindus). (2) (A followup question): It is said (as Narasimha noted, and as I also read in BVR's "Graha and Bhava Balas") that Shadbala captures (i) placement strength (ii) time strength (iii) directional strength (iv) aspect strength (v) motional strength (vi) inherent strength. If you look at the Ashtakavarga computation technique in detail however, a planet contributes/does-not-contribute an Ashtakavarga bindu to a particular planet in a particular house based ONLY on it's RELATIVE distance from the house, correct? So, it follows that the Ashtakavarga computation technique cannot take into account, for example, motional strength. Whether or not a planet has a certain motion, it will still contribute/not-contribute exactly the same bindu value to a planet in a house at a given relative distance. You can easily apply the same reasoning to time strength and directional strength and conclude that those planetary attributes (i.e. time strength, directional strength) do not contribute to the Ashtakavarga value. From this, it appears that one can conclude that the Ashtakavarga technique can at best capture only aspect strength and perhaps inherent strength, nothing else. Additionally, the Ashtakavarga technique ONLY takes into account planetary positions of a SINGLE divisional chart (D-1 or D-2.. etc). So, the exact position of the planet in the house is irrelevant in terms of assigning Ashtakavarga bindus, correct? In other words, for example, if a planet is in the 1st degree or 15th degree of a particular house in the Rasi chart, it will still contribute/not-contribute exactly the same Ashtakavarga bindu value to a house at a given relative distance (also in the Rasi chart). Visti, you specifically mentioned Avasthas. I found Zoran's article on Avastha in SJVC Jyotish News, August 2000. I'm not attaching it since I dont want to inadvertently communicate a virus. But from a cursory examination of that article, it is quite clear that Avasthas take into account degree position of a graha, which Ashtakavarga does not. From all of this, it further solidifies the reasoning that whatever strength Ashtakavarga calculates, it CAN ONLY be based on aspects and perhaps the inherent nature of the planet, nothing else, simply because it does not even take into account anything else. The question that then naturally arises is: How does the strength predicted by Ashtakavarga compare with the ASPECT strength predicted by Shadbala? It seems to me that the answer to this question is that the aspect strength predicted by Shadbala is more of a "general and overall" aspect strength (as also seems to be indicated by Narasimha in his analogy), whereas Ashtakavarga strength is specific to a PARTICULAR house and a PARTICULAR divisional chart. Please verify. For example, in a chart that I'm looking at, in the Rasi chart, Saturn has 0 bindus of support in a 26 bindus house in the 9th house, but in general has 4.9 positive points of Drigbala and overall Shadbala strength of 105.5%. So the meaning of this, it would seem, is that while the overall strength of Saturn is 105.5% and it has 4.9 positive points of Drigbala, but WHILE transiting the 9th house of the native, as far as the 9th house indications of the RASI chart are concerned, Saturn has no support from any other planet. The house itself has almost medium support (average being 28 bindus) from other planets. Am I correct in this reasoning? VAS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 11, 2002 Report Share Posted July 11, 2002 Namaste Zoran ji & Visti, I am attaching Zoran's article on AK, though chart inserts are missing. Hope it helps. Regards Shailesh Chandra Chadhascchadha (AT) hotmail (DOT) com - Visti Larsen vedic astrology Wednesday, July 10, 2002 6:47 PM Re: [vedic astrology] Shadbala vs Ashtakavarga Vyam VedaVyasaaya Namah Dear Zoran, Nope sorry, i don't have the articles. I hope our sjvc-webmaster saved them so that they can be displayed on the website, its very unfortunate that theres so little action on that page. It would be very good for us to discuss the chart for the benefit of list members. Personally, i'm very much interested in the intrinsic details of Ashtakavarga. Best wishes, Visti. - Zoran Radosavljevic vedic astrology Wednesday, July 10, 2002 1:36 PM Re: [vedic astrology] Shadbala vs Ashtakavarga Om Namo Narayanaya, Dear Visti, Zoran has earlier given an example of this usage in an Article about Avasthas, but unfortunately i can't find it on the http://sjvcusa.org site. ZORAN: I cannot find it as well. Yet, if necessary I can post it to you. I cannot find my article on Atmakarak. Have you perhaps saved it? If yes, do kindly send it to me. In my friend chart, most of grahas have low shadbal. Only mangal and surya are strong. She had too many opportunites yet low achievements. That is the case of low shadbal. We can discuss the chart if you wish Astakavarga is more advanced, and relates to the 7 Grahas influence on the various houses, from themselves. Hence this is related to activity and the place where there is activity. There is something called Bhava Balas as well. Otherwise see the house. Treat the friends and enemies of the house, as per the karaka of it, and hence decide the results. I.e. for Mother see 4th house, and Moon being karaka gives; Saturn, Venus and Mercury as enemies towards Moon. Hence Saturn, Venus or Mercury in the 4th house, can be bad for the health of mother. Education is also the 4th house, and its Karaka is Mercury. Mars is very enimical towards Mercury, and its placement in the 4th obstructs education, and the person has trouble reading, learning math etc. Hence Mars occupying the Siddhamsa-Narayana Dasa Rasi also gives problems with education during its Dasa. I assume you are checking for wealth of the person. Well 2nd house doesn't show wealth gained but shows he sustaining forces of ones life. i.e. which factors keeps one alive, and how one keeps alive. Karaka for wealth is Jupiter. Hence Rahu and Saturn in 2nd is very troubling for the person and gives a poor upbringing. 11th from Arudha Lagna should be check to determine the wealth propperly. The more grahas aspecting/joining this place, gives more sources of gains. I hope this helps.Best wishes, Visti. - vedicastrostudent vedic astrology Wednesday, July 10, 2002 6:13 AM [vedic astrology] Shadbala vs Ashtakavarga Can someone explain to me which system - Shadbala or Ashtakavarga - is the one to use when trying to estimate house strength? I anticipate the answer being Shadbala. But then, of what use is Ashtakavarga if Shadbala is more complete? Here are two examples I have seen: 1) Strength of 2nd house is 5.07 rupas using Shadbala system - It is the weakest house in the chart. However, in the Ashtakavarga system, it has 39 bindus (in the Rasi) - making it the "strongest". 2) Strength of 8th house is 9.25 rupas using Shadbala system - It is the second strongest house in the chart. However, in the Ashtakavarga system it has 20 bindus - making it the "weakest". A related question - is there some such thing as a mean or average house strength in the Shadbala system? For example, is 9.25 rupas considered to be a strong house or not? I ask this because, for planets, Shadbala strength is cited as a percentage (125% of average, 95% of average), but not for houses. Why? Thanks VAS Group info: vedic astrology/info.html To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || Group info: vedic astrology/info.html To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... -- Zoran Radosavljevic Jyotish Teacher at Shri Jagannath Vedic Centre mails: ahimsa (AT) NSpoint (DOT) net ahimsa (AT) neobee (DOT) net web address: http://www.sjvc.co.yu Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Download sites of SJVC Europe Asia Last edited May 07, 2001 Indian Site www.sjvc.net THE ROLE OF ATMAKARAKA IN THE CHART mso-bidi-font-family:Arial;color:red"> mso-list:none">By ZORAN RADOSAVLJEVIC Atma means Self, while karaka means Indicator. There are naturally two grahas that are called Atmakaraka in the chart. One is natural (naisargik) and another is temporal (chara). Natural Atmakaraka in each chart is Surya, while chara Atmakaraka in each chart is calculated in accordance with a placement of a Graha in a sign. SUN Sun is an indicator of dharma (Natural Law principle). It rules self, innate nature and intelligence. While Moon rules manas (mind), sun is an indicator of Atman (a transcendental Self) which is unborn and undying, beyond the relative field of existence. Sun is a natural indicator for a first house affairs or Lagna. It rules natural 5th house of a zodiac, and along with Guru, it has a say over Dhi-Shakti, an intelligence coupled with wisdom, proper growth of the mind, and mantra-primordial sound that reflects the transcendental Impulse of Natural Law. CHAR ATMAKARAKA While the scholars are still divided in opinion whether to use seven or eight charakarak scheme, Parasara and Jaimini are clear in their preference to the latter. Thus I am describing the role of Atmakaraka, having in mind 8 Chara karaka scheme, as recommended by the sages. Let’s see what Parasara says about Atmakaraka: “O Brahmin, just as the minister cannot go against the king, the other karakas, viz, Putrakaraka, Amatyakaraka etc. cannot predominate over Atmakaraka in the affairs of the native. If the Atmakaraka is adverse, other karakas cannot give their benefic effects (fully). Similarly, if Atmakaraka is favorable, other karakas cannot predominate with their malefic influences.” Atmakaraka is the most personal planet in the chart. It is the king of the horoscope. Its role is to protect, as the king protects his kingdom and territory. Being the most personal planet, it has the strongest say over Moksha (final emancipation) and for that reason, the 12th house from the Atmakaraka in the Navamsa chart (dharmamsa) is used to ascertain the ishtadevata or the personal Deity who will guide the soul to its real home - Moksha. Thus, the main role of Atmakaraka is to purify the soul. Therefore, the position of Atmakaraka in a chart describes the suffering of a soul, obstacles and bad karma which are all meant to cleanse the soul from its sins, and promote rise and evolution. It is for that reason that house placement of Atmakaraka as well as Arudha ruled by it are indicative of disturbed areas of life, where a person has to work unselfishly to ward off the previous sins. For that reason, a person will suffer most while given the opportunity to progress most through the instrument of Atmakaraka power. While different astrologers opine that Atmakaraka places will be beneficial for a chart owner, it has been the case that house placement of Atmakaraka becomes very sensitive in a person’s life, where the obstacles and sufferings are found, giving rise to personal growth and evolution. However, to make it clear, Atmakaraka doesn’t necessarily indicate suffering by its mere placement. There may be happiness under the conditions set by Atmakaraka/spiritual inclinations. Let’s examine a few charts: Case one o:spt="75" o:preferrelative="t" path="m@4@5l@4@11@9@11@9@5xe" filled="f" stroked="f"> height:182.25pt' fillcolor="window"> o:title="Backup_oNATALIJA"/> Shani is both Atmakaraka and yoga karaka, and it is retrograde and placed in mritavasta, as well as Rasi sandhi. Shani is placed in dharmamsa (Mithun Navamsa). Shani is also strong in own sign while its placement in 8th house from Al is not good. In shani mahadasha, a lady gave birth to 3 children, the 1st pregnancy was lost, due to mrith avasta of Shani and dristi of a strong Maraka - Mangal. After the last childbirth, she has developed post child-birth depression. Being a very caring mother, she is too concerned for her children. Her huge sense of responsibility (Shani) towards her children, made her give up all personal enjoyment. Due to these troubles, this person started meditation and finished a homeopathic course, and she spends a few hours daily in meditation and prayers. Thus we can see both the punishing and purifying role of Shani in her chart. Arial">Case two id="_x0000_i1026" type="#_x0000_t75" style='width:182.25pt;height:182.25pt' fillcolor="window"> o:title="TAURUSMAJAPUR"/> Atmakaraka Mangal is in own sign in 7th house and the person is a dedicated ISKCON follower. He is still unmarried and his spiritualism and ascetic way of living are very pronounced so far. Otherwise, Guru and Mangal combination in 7th house should be conducive to an early householders life. Arial">Case three id="_x0000_i1027" type="#_x0000_t75" style='width:182.25pt;height:182.25pt' fillcolor="window"> o:title="Bzoran"/> Atmakaraka Shani is placed in 4th house and the person had to renounce a part of his own property for the benefit of his elder sister. yes"> The difficulties met by this person and the responsibilities in domestic life were huge. These had a purifying effect and firmly grounded the personal life into a spiritual direction. Arial">Case four id="_x0000_i1028" type="#_x0000_t75" style='width:182.25pt;height:182.25pt' fillcolor="window"> o:title="ariesMiraemti"/> Atmakaraka Mangal in the 4th house has given the most terrible experiences in 4th house affairs – viz., early loss of mother and a younger brother falling ill. The person’s Mangal mahadasha was the most terrible. The person spent it in prayers and meditation. Her Rahu mahadasha is on at present and she has completely dedicated herself to the spiritual life. Arial">Case five id="_x0000_i1032" type="#_x0000_t75" style='width:182.25pt;height:182.25pt' fillcolor="window"> o:title="LEOJASNA"/> Atmakaraka Mangal is in neecha in 12th house (deepest debilitation degree), and in Mangal mahadasha she lost her property, kept facing losses and expenses, had great difficulties, however, her life views have changed and she took an interest in Jyotish (astrology) and spiritualism. Arial">Case six id="_x0000_i1029" type="#_x0000_t75" style='width:182.25pt;height:182.25pt' fillcolor="window"> o:title="PAJA"/> Atmakaraka Venus is exalted in 10th house giving rise to Pancha Maha Purusha Yoga. The person is a businessman, while in Venus mahadasha he has to work very hard, facing with a great difficulties and troubles in professional life, while at the same time started to fast, changed his attitudes and has taken life more seriously admitting its spiritual dimension. It is worth mentioning that Venus has given excellent professional growth, yet coupled with immense difficulties sometimes. It is my own observation that natural benefic Atmakaraka tends to punish in a milder way, comparing to natural malefic Atmakaraka normal">. Arial">Case seven id="_x0000_i1030" type="#_x0000_t75" style='width:182.25pt;height:182.25pt' fillcolor="window"> o:title="SANDRAemti"/> Atmakaraka Mercury has lost a planetary war to Jupiter, and even though in own sign (Virgo) in Kendra to Al, the person is still unmarried and unsuccessful in personal life and profession. Note that mercury is both 7th and 10th lord. She has met various obstacles in professional life and a great source of difficulties. However, due to her humble and chaste character she is dealing with troubles well. She has developed utmost patience and servitude in her life. Arial">Case eight id="_x0000_i1031" type="#_x0000_t75" style='width:182.25pt;height:182.25pt' fillcolor="window"> o:title="LJILJA"/> Atmakaraka Sun is well placed in 4th house along with Mercury with Neechabhanga. She is an instructor of meditation, while her troubles with property, and all 4th house significations started after the relatively premature death of her father. She has met various troubles from influential people in spiritual movement. She is still unmarried (sun is lord of Upapada) CONCLUSION It is evident in all cases, that Atmakaraka has created disturbances in all matters signified by its placement. Depending on the person’s attitude, one has either learnt the lessons given by Atmakaraka and turned to spiritual life, or continued suffering. Thus, by no means will Atmakaraka improve the house significations in a standard way (as will lord of Lagna for example) The king of the chart has one single motive - to ward off the sins from previous birth, and to cleanse the person by giving suffering and pains, thereby setting the soul towards the higher planes. "AGaramond Bold";mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";mso-bidi-font-family: Arial;color:red;mso-ansi-language:EN-US;mso-fareast-language:EN-US;mso-bidi-language: AR-SA">OM TAT SAT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 12, 2002 Report Share Posted July 12, 2002 Hello All Here is Link where I found Online BPHS. And Here in CH 27 there is good explaination about Shadbala. http://mailerindia.com/parasar/hsastra/ch27.php Hope this could be useful for someone who want to know more. KPK --- pvr108 <pvr wrote: > Namaste friends, > > I am giving an extract from my book "Vedic > Astrology: An Integrated > Approach" below. This clarifies the difference > between Shadbalas of > planets and Ashtakavarga bala of planets. > > After teaching shadbalas and the associated bhava > balas, Parasara > clearly mentioned that the results of a yoga formed > by various > planets or houses are given by the strongest among > them. So > shadbala's main use is in deciding which of the n > planets forming a > yoga gives the result. > > Ashtakavarga is far more important and decides how > the energies of > various planets aid the job of a planet or a house > (in a particular > area of life). Vimsopaka bala is even more important > and covers > various areas of life. > > The extract below tries to explain all this using an > analogy. > > May Jupiter's light shine on us, > Narasimha > ------ > [Copyrights reserved for P.V.R. Narasimha Rao] > > 15.2 Why Different Strengths > > Why do we need different strengths for different > purposes? Why can't > we use the same strength? To understand this, let us > consider an > analogy. > > Suppose X is an engineer. Suppose Y is another > engineer with exactly > the same background and suppose Y comes to the house > of X for a few > days. Suppose Y sleeps in the afternoon and X > doesn't. Suppose it is > 1 pm and Y is ready for his afternoon nap. Suppose > the two engineers > have promised a charity in town that they would give > a big donation > together and suppose someone from the charity comes > to X's house. > Because it is not his house and because he is > sleepy, Y is probably > not going to play a prominent role and X is probably > going to talk > pleasantries and then give a check on behalf of Y > and himself. The > money is both his and Y's, but X is in a better > position to handle > it. Shadbalas are similar to this. When two or more > planets take part > in a yoga, the one that is stronger as per shadbala > ends up giving > the results. > > Both X and Y may have to deal with contractors, > workers and vendors > for their professional work. If Y has better > relations with the > people he deals with, he will be more productive at > his work as an > engineer. Similarly, strength as per ashtakavarga > shows the ability > of planets to deliver their goods in harmony with > other planetary > forces at work in a chart. Even if a planet has good > shadbala, it > will be unable to deliver its goods if it is at odds > with other > planets in the chart, i.e. has a low ashtakavarga > strength. > > An engineer who has good relations with workers, > vendors and > contractors related to one project may not go along > well with people > involved in another project. In that case, he will > produce excellent > results in the former project and he may not be > effective in the > latter. Similarly, a planet may have good > ashtakavarga strength in > one divisional chart and poor ashtakavarga strength > in another > divisional chart. Then it will give its results more > effectively in > the area of life related to the first chart. > > Despite good capabilities and potential to get work > done, Y may be > unable to get his work done if he is depressed about > something or if > he is absent-minded for some reason. If he is in a > cheerful state, he > may get his work done well. Thus the state one is in > decides one's > final output. Similarly, a planet must be in a good > "avastha" (state) > to give good results. There are different kinds of > states – states > related to age, states related to alertness, states > related to mood > and states related to activity. > > When one hires an engineer as an employee or when > one assigns a > project to an engineer, one is concerned about how > effective he will > be in the project. But suppose one is considering > the same engineer > as a partner in business. Then his effectiveness in > a particular > project does not matter much. What matters now is > how well rounded he > is. He should have good overall knowledge of various > projects. > Vimsopaka bala is analogous to this. When we > consider the overall > effectiveness of a planet in one's life, we no > longer look at its > effectiveness to give results in a specific area of > life. Instead, we > look at Vimsopaka bala. It shows the overall > strength of a planet and > its ability to play an important role in one's life > (rather than a > specific area of life). > > If X and Y have to decide who eats a cake first or > who gets to drink > the only can of soft drink left in the refrigerator, > they are > probably not going to argue about it. Their > qualifications or > productivity at work or mental state or overall > ability are not going > to matter. For something so trivial, they will > probably toss a coin > or have a friendly arm-wrestling or simply do what > their friends > present in the room suggest. If Y has more friends > in the room and > they say "let Y have it", then Y is going to have > it. Similarly, for > trivial things like determining who initiates dasas, > antardasas etc, > we have very simple rules that are different from > shadbala, > ashtakavarga bala, avastha bala, Vimsopaka bala etc. > > As it has been emphasized many times in this book, > Vedic astrology > has a rich variety of parameters, tools and > techniques. Attempting to > use various techniques in an interchangable manner > only leads to > confusion. One should strive to understand the > meanings of various > parameters and tools and use the right set of > parameters and tools > for the occasion. Though we have different ways of > measuring a > planet's strength, their meanings are different and > accordingly they > are used for different purposes. We will learn the > most common ones > in this chapter. > > 15.3 Shadbala and Astakavarga Bala > > There are six sources of strength – strength due to > placement, > strength due to time, strength due to directions, > strength due to > aspects, strength due to motion and strength due to > inherent nature. > Shadbala is a measure of the strength of a planet > based on these six > sources of strength. Explaining the computation of > shadbalas is > beyond the scope of this book. For the details of > its computation, > one may refer to "Brihat Parasara Hora Sastram" by > Parasara or "Graha > and Bhava Balas" by Dr. B.V. Raman. Most computer > software programs > give shadbala, though there are minor differences > between the > === message truncated === Sign up for SBC Dial - First Month Free http://sbc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 13, 2002 Report Share Posted July 13, 2002 Very interesting thread. The extract from Narasimhaji's book was a pleasure to read - fantastic analogy. I'd like to make a little contribution to the discussion but it will take a little while for me to assemble my thoughts. So hopefully I'll add something in the next week or two. In the meantime, just one thought... I think of shadbala and ashtakavarga as being quite *separate* systems. Ideally, *complementary* but certainly different. I do not think of ashtakavarga as a description of *aspects* - rather, one accumulates one's bindus based upon the *relationships* that have been specified in the rules. In other words, the 'connections' in ashtakavarga are not 'aspects'/ looks/ glances etc; their rules seem to embody a codified understanding of likely outcomes given an easily-defined placement. In yet other words, the ashtakavarga 'rules' are probably more abstracted than those of shadbala, which is more fundamentally astronomical. All the best, Kriya vedic astrology, "vedicastrostudent" <vedicastrostudent> wrote: > Thank you very much, Narasimha, Visti and all others who replied. > Although I have gained a lot of knowledge, I am still a little > confused, I must say. I have some followup questions and replies. > Please try and follow my line of reasoning so you may see exactly why > I made this request in the first place, and also choose to > contradict/validate it at specific places: > (1) The reason I chose the 2nd house in that particular chart was not > actually to study wealth. It just leapt out to me because according > to Shadbala it was the weakest house (5.07 rupas) and according to > Ashtakavarga, it was the strongest (39 bindus). > (2) (A followup question): It is said (as Narasimha noted, and as I > also read in BVR's "Graha and Bhava Balas") that Shadbala captures > (i) placement strength (ii) time strength (iii) directional strength > (iv) aspect strength (v) motional strength (vi) inherent strength. If > you look at the Ashtakavarga computation technique in detail however, > a planet contributes/does-not-contribute an Ashtakavarga bindu to a > particular planet in a particular house based ONLY on it's RELATIVE > distance from the house, correct? So, it follows that the > Ashtakavarga computation technique cannot take into account, for > example, motional strength. Whether or not a planet has a certain > motion, it will still contribute/not-contribute exactly the same > bindu value to a planet in a house at a given relative distance. You > can easily apply the same reasoning to time strength and directional > strength and conclude that those planetary attributes (i.e. time > strength, directional strength) do not contribute to the Ashtakavarga > value. From this, it appears that one can conclude that the > Ashtakavarga technique can at best capture only aspect strength and > perhaps inherent strength, nothing else. Additionally, the > Ashtakavarga technique ONLY takes into account planetary positions of > a SINGLE divisional chart (D-1 or D-2.. etc). So, the exact position > of the planet in the house is irrelevant in terms of assigning > Ashtakavarga bindus, correct? In other words, for example, if a > planet is in the 1st degree or 15th degree of a particular house in > the Rasi chart, it will still contribute/not-contribute exactly the > same Ashtakavarga bindu value to a house at a given relative distance > (also in the Rasi chart). Visti, you specifically mentioned Avasthas. > I found Zoran's article on Avastha in SJVC Jyotish News, August 2000. > I'm not attaching it since I dont want to inadvertently communicate a > virus. But from a cursory examination of that article, it is quite > clear that Avasthas take into account degree position of a graha, > which Ashtakavarga does not. From all of this, it further solidifies > the reasoning that whatever strength Ashtakavarga calculates, it CAN > ONLY be based on aspects and perhaps the inherent nature of the > planet, nothing else, simply because it does not even take into > account anything else. The question that then naturally arises is: > How does the strength predicted by Ashtakavarga compare with the > ASPECT strength predicted by Shadbala? It seems to me that the answer > to this question is that the aspect strength predicted by Shadbala is > more of a "general and overall" aspect strength (as also seems to be > indicated by Narasimha in his analogy), whereas Ashtakavarga strength > is specific to a PARTICULAR house and a PARTICULAR divisional chart. > Please verify. For example, in a chart that I'm looking at, in the > Rasi chart, Saturn has 0 bindus of support in a 26 bindus house in > the 9th house, but in general has 4.9 positive points of Drigbala and > overall Shadbala strength of 105.5%. So the meaning of this, it would > seem, is that while the overall strength of Saturn is 105.5% and it > has 4.9 positive points of Drigbala, but WHILE transiting the 9th > house of the native, as far as the 9th house indications of the RASI > chart are concerned, Saturn has no support from any other planet. The > house itself has almost medium support (average being 28 bindus) from > other planets. Am I correct in this reasoning? > > VAS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 15, 2002 Report Share Posted July 15, 2002 Hello Kriya, I will be looking forward to your post. I am simply doing a purely mathematical analysis of the technique (I wrote a program to compute it a few years ago, and I know it is correct because my program gives exactly the same results as many other well known ones), not one based on practical experience of it's application. But nevertheless, I still stand by what I say - from analyzing the technique, a planet in Ashtakavarga contributes/does-not-contribute "strength" (an ashtakavarga bindu) to a given planet in a given house, based ONLY on its RELATIVE distance (number of houses) from it. The speed of the planets does not change this contribution. The exact house placement does not change this contribution. The exact degree of the planets does not change this contribution as long as their relative distance in terms of number of houses does not change. The presence or absence of other planets in the same house does not change this contribution. Try it out and you will see for yourself. Consequently, it follows that Ashtakavarga's "strength" prediction is ONLY based on RELATIVE distances of planets. Aspects are defined based on relative distance, no? VAS vedic astrology, "jyotish2002au" <jyotish@m...> wrote: > Very interesting thread. The extract from Narasimhaji's book > was a pleasure to read - fantastic analogy. I'd like to make a little > contribution to the discussion but it will take a little while for me > to assemble my thoughts. So hopefully I'll add something in the > next week or two. In the meantime, just one thought... > > I think of shadbala and ashtakavarga as being quite *separate* > systems. Ideally, *complementary* but certainly different. > > I do not think of ashtakavarga as a description of *aspects* - > rather, one accumulates one's bindus based upon the > *relationships* that have been specified in the rules. > > In other words, the 'connections' in ashtakavarga are not > 'aspects'/ looks/ glances etc; their rules seem to embody a > codified understanding of likely outcomes given an > easily-defined placement. In yet other words, the ashtakavarga > 'rules' are probably more abstracted than those of shadbala, > which is more fundamentally astronomical. > > All the best, Kriya > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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