Guest guest Posted July 3, 2003 Report Share Posted July 3, 2003 || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha, May I join in this discussion? If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis-à-vis our understanding of a jataka, the confusion about Arudha Padas will dissolve to a great extent. "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - that which relates to "Atma" and "Parmatma" . This material world is in fact "maya" - an illusion, but we treat this world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules of "satya" to it. Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this world of "maya" and, hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are more relevant to this material existence. Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana-arudha, Gaja-arudha, etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level". So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made by the individual (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards achieving the highest ability/ perfection. Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood as "manifestation" or "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I think we will be able to better appreciate this concept of "arudha". Of course, this is only as per my understanding - hopefully, Gurus and seniors will correct, or confirm, it. Regards & best wishes, Shailesh V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5 ] Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PM vedic astrology [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear chandrashekhar Om Namah SHivaya Dear Chandrashekhar ji I have a habit of saving all important messages by the various gurus and learned members. I have around 50 MB material just by this work (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the old message for your perusal regards partha om tat sat """"""- Narasimha P.V.R. Rao vedic astrology Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha Dear Imran, > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > Namaste, > > The concept of Arudha of different houses beautifully eloborates the difference between reality(Satya) and perception(Maya). Sage Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat and tackle these Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold specific posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas collectively, thus require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa and vorgottama of Arudhas. > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. For example in case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in Scorpio (9th from lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) is to be assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and 10th lords, Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with respect of lagna position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in chart of Dalai Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th from lagna. > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association(sambndha) with the help of rashi aspect? > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead of lagan? or its not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields satisfactory results at a certain level. > > Regards > > Imran You are on the right track and Visti has nicely addressed the points in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points. (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the activity/things shown by the houses. My communication skills are not a "tangible thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises out of my communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house shows my communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this mail (tangible). Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), they are the only tangible things - the only reality - in this material world! They are very important. (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) together in D-10, be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing them will be great. (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. However, note that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are different from the rules of the world of maya (illusion). For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's interactions. It is the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed house of kama trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) and the intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc (shaping of desire and working on the desire) and the culmination house (11th) shows the final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th house shows dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. While the seed house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the intermediate house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), the culmination house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall duty). The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the world of maya, but the meanings are different. In the world of truth, shaping of desire and working on the desires happens through interactions and finally leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. But the world of maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the world of maya, shaping of desire and working on the desire happens only thru domination and the results are only material gains. So the 7th from arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and domination. The 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include religiousness, righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma (duty) - protect itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about protecting the status and image. The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which trikona it belongs to and whether it is the seed house, intermediate house or the culmination house of that trikona) is constant for all references. But building the meaning further based on the axioms requires an understanding of the two worlds - world of satya and world of maya. I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish Workshop" and the CD will be available for buying online in a day or two at most. (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana dasa that is computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the changing impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the resulting luck) on one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana Dasa" by Pt. Sanjay Rath. (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa interpretation, but you can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition to transits from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits from natal arudha lagna! However, again, different rules may apply in the case of arudha lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma from Moon or lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter loves dharma. However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha lagna, the wise teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the rules of the world of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a shallow dharma (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So there will be material setbacks and the illusion is broken. However, if Jupiter has a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal chart also, the negative results may be mitigated. Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally different worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one understands and appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha lagna. Try to give it some thought. Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck with your arudha pada studies! May Jupiter's light shine on us, Narasimha"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" <boxdel> wrote: > Dear Partha, > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I indicated(About pada > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji says verbatim " > Use of arudha lagna > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha lagna is maya peetha or > the seat of > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for different shades of self. > Lagna stands for > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived self. Arudha lagna stands > for "self, as > peceived by this maya world". > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to comment. Regards, > Chandrashekhar. > > > ---- > > vedic astrology > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > vedic astrology > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse -dear Anu > > Om namah shivaya > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this world of Maya. This > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages. > regards > partha > om tat sat > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" > <boxdel> wrote: > > Dear Hari, > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are perception of what > people think > > about one, this is the only logical inference. Chandrashekhar. > > > > ---- > > > > vedic astrology > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > vedic astrology > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse -dear Anu > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with the consummation > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it correct? > > > > regards > > Hari > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of Service. > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > ------------------------ Sponsor ---------------------~--> Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click./Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/ySSFAA/.8XolB/TM ---~-> Your use of is subject to --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release 6/25/2003 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release 6/25/2003 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 3, 2003 Report Share Posted July 3, 2003 || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || Dear Amol, The terms used in classics (incl. BPHS & JUpS) are "pada", "adhuda" and "padarudha" . Any one familiar with (sanskrit based) Indian languages will recognise these words, which mean "position", "risen" and "risen to (and occuping the) position". I hope you do not mind my saying so but your interpretation in more of a distortion. And as Partha has mentioned very clearly, ARUDHA & LAGNA cannot be same - though some do hold a contray view. Try to understand the 'pada/ arudha' concept as an extension of the 'BHAVAT BHAVAM' principle and most of the things will become clear, including why "Pada" and "Lagna" cannot be same. Regards & best wishes, Shailesh - "amolmandar" <amolmandar > <vedic astrology> Thursday, July 03, 2003 4:03 PM [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear chandrashekhar Dear ShaileshIf you allow me to join this discussion.....I think we should read it as AruDha or aaruDha. Literally ruDha means popular or traditional and 'aa' prefix makes it more popular or more traditional. The prefix 'a' to ruDha will make it opposite. aruDha will be that is not popular.So aaruDha means morepopular or we can say Maha-popular. That way aaruDha will make what is popularly known about you. It need not be other than Satya. If you are fortunate enough your Lagna(true identity) and Arudha Lagna(Popular identity) will be same. All great persons should belong to that class. Both identies are govern by satya i.e.you(Lagna) and hence Lagna is more important. After all we say satyam eva jayate!Thanks a lot for your Time and Space.AmolMandar--- In vedic astrology, "Shailesh Chadha" <scc@s...> wrote:> || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya ||> > Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha,> May I join in this discussion?> If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis-à-vis our> understanding of a jataka, the confusion about Arudha Padas will> dissolve to a great extent.> "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - that which relates to> "Atma" and "Parmatma" .> This material world is in fact "maya" - an illusion, but we treat this> world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules of "satya" to it.> Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this world of "maya" and,> hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are more relevant to this> material existence.> Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana-arudha, Gaja-arudha,> etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level".> So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made by the individual> (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards achieving the highest> ability/ perfection.> Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood as "manifestation" or> "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I think we will be able to> better appreciate this concept of "arudha".> Of course, this is only as per my understanding - hopefully, Gurus and> seniors will correct, or confirm, it.> Regards & best wishes,> Shailesh> > > V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5] > Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PM> To: vedic astrology> [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear chandrashekhar> > Om Namah SHivaya> > Dear Chandrashekhar ji> > I have a habit of saving all important messages by the various gurus > and learned members. I have around 50 MB material just by this work> (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the old message for > your perusal> > regards> partha> om tat sat> > > """"""- > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > vedic astrology > Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM> [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha> > Dear Imran,> > > Respected Gurus and Dear Members,> > > > Namaste,> > > > The concept of Arudha of different houses beautifully eloborates> the difference between reality(Satya) and perception(Maya). Sage > Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat and tackle these > Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold specific > posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas.> > > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas collectively, thus> require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa and vorgottama > of Arudhas.> > > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. For example in> case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in Scorpio (9th from > lagna). How can these shoud be read?> > > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) is to be> assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and 10th lords, > Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not?> > > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with respect of lagna> position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in chart of Dalai > Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th from lagna. > > > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association(sambndha) with the> help of rashi aspect?> > > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead of lagan? or its> not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields satisfactory > results at a certain level. > > > > Regards> > > > Imran> > You are on the right track and Visti has nicely addressed the points > in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points.> > (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the activity/things > shown by the houses. My communication skills are not a "tangible > thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises out of my > communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house shows my > communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this mail (tangible).> > Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), they are the > only tangible things - the only reality - in this material world! > They are very important.> > (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) together in D-10, > be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing them will be > great.> > (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. However, note > that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are different from the > rules of the world of maya (illusion).> > For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's interactions. It is > the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed house of kama > trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) and the > intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc (shaping of desire > and working on the desire) and the culmination house (11th) shows the > final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th house shows > dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. While the seed > house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the intermediate > house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), the culmination > house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall duty).> > The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the world of maya, but > the meanings are different. In the world of truth, shaping of desire > and working on the desires happens through interactions and finally > leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. But the world of > maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the world of maya, > shaping of desire and working on the desire happens only thru > domination and the results are only material gains. So the 7th from > arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and domination. The > 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include religiousness, > righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma (duty) - protect > itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about protecting the > status and image.> > The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which trikona it > belongs to and whether it is the seed house, intermediate house or > the culmination house of that trikona) is constant for all > references. But building the meaning further based on the axioms > requires an understanding of the two worlds - world of satya and > world of maya.> > I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish Workshop" and the CD > will be available for buying online in a day or two at most.> > (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa > interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana dasa that is > computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the changing > impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the resulting luck) on > one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana Dasa" by Pt. > Sanjay Rath.> > (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa interpretation, but you > can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition to transits > from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits from natal arudha > lagna!> > However, again, different rules may apply in the case of arudha > lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma from Moon or > lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter loves dharma. > However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha lagna, the wise > teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the rules of the world > of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a shallow dharma > (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So there will be > material setbacks and the illusion is broken. However, if Jupiter has > a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal chart also, the > negative results may be mitigated.> > Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally different > worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one understands and > appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha lagna. Try to > give it some thought.> > Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck with your > arudha pada studies!> > May Jupiter's light shine on us,> Narasimha"""""""> """""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""> > > > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" > <boxdel> wrote:> > Dear Partha,> > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I indicated(About> pada> > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji says verbatim "> > Use of arudha lagna> > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha lagna is maya > peetha or> > the seat of> > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for different shades> of self.> > Lagna stands for> > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived self. Arudha lagna> stands> > for "self, as> > peceived by this maya world".> > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to comment. Regards,> > Chandrashekhar.> > > > > > ----> > > > vedic astrology> > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM> > vedic astrology> > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse -dear Anu> > > > Om namah shivaya> > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari> > > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this world of Maya.> This > > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages.> > regards> > partha> > om tat sat> > > > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma"> > <boxdel> wrote:> > > Dear Hari,> > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are perception of what> > people think> > > about one, this is the only logical inference. Chandrashekhar.> > > > > > ----> > > > > > vedic astrology> > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM> > > vedic astrology> > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse -dear Anu> > > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah---> > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha,> > > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with the> consummation > > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it correct?> > > > > > regards> > > Hari> > > > > > > > > Sponsor> > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic astrology> > > > > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the Terms of> Service.> > > > > > Sponsor> > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic astrology> > > > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > > > > ........ May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > Your use of is subject to the > > > > Archives: vedic astrology> > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > Your use of is subject to> > > > > > ---> Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).> Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release 6/25/2003> > > ---> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).> Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release 6/25/2003------------------------ Sponsor ---------------------~-->Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions.http://us.click./Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/ySSFAA/.8XolB/TM---~->Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Your use of is subject to ---Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).Version: 6.0.478 / Virus Database: 275 - Release Date: 5/6/2003 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 3, 2003 Report Share Posted July 3, 2003 Dear Partha, An admirable habit. However Narasimharaoji has also given an example of a person having a lowly vehicle and other's perceiving him to be unhappy, when he was not and another of one owning 3 vehicles and other perceiving him having sukha of vahanas when again he did not experience such sukha. These are on the article on Padas available on Varahamihira list. You might like to read it and let me know your opinion. Regards, Chandrashekhar. V.Partha sarathy wrote: Om Namah SHivaya Dear Chandrashekhar ji I have a habit of saving all important messages by the various gurus and learned members. I have around 50 MB material just by this work (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the old message for your perusal regards partha om tat sat """"""- Narasimha P.V.R. Rao vedic astrology Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha Dear Imran, > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > Namaste, > > The concept of Arudha of different houses beautifully eloborates the difference between reality(Satya) and perception(Maya). Sage Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat and tackle these Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold specific posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas collectively, thus require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa and vorgottama of Arudhas. > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. For example in case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in Scorpio (9th from lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) is to be assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and 10th lords, Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with respect of lagna position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in chart of Dalai Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th from lagna. > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association(sambndha) with the help of rashi aspect? > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead of lagan? or its not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields satisfactory results at a certain level. > > Regards > > Imran You are on the right track and Visti has nicely addressed the points in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points. (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the activity/things shown by the houses. My communication skills are not a "tangible thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises out of my communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house shows my communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this mail (tangible). Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), they are the only tangible things - the only reality - in this material world! They are very important. (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) together in D-10, be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing them will be great. (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. However, note that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are different from the rules of the world of maya (illusion). For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's interactions. It is the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed house of kama trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) and the intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc (shaping of desire and working on the desire) and the culmination house (11th) shows the final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th house shows dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. While the seed house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the intermediate house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), the culmination house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall duty). The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the world of maya, but the meanings are different. In the world of truth, shaping of desire and working on the desires happens through interactions and finally leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. But the world of maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the world of maya, shaping of desire and working on the desire happens only thru domination and the results are only material gains. So the 7th from arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and domination. The 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include religiousness, righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma (duty) - protect itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about protecting the status and image. The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which trikona it belongs to and whether it is the seed house, intermediate house or the culmination house of that trikona) is constant for all references. But building the meaning further based on the axioms requires an understanding of the two worlds - world of satya and world of maya. I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish Workshop" and the CD will be available for buying online in a day or two at most. (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana dasa that is computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the changing impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the resulting luck) on one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana Dasa" by Pt. Sanjay Rath. (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa interpretation, but you can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition to transits from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits from natal arudha lagna! However, again, different rules may apply in the case of arudha lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma from Moon or lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter loves dharma. However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha lagna, the wise teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the rules of the world of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a shallow dharma (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So there will be material setbacks and the illusion is broken. However, if Jupiter has a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal chart also, the negative results may be mitigated. Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally different worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one understands and appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha lagna. Try to give it some thought. Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck with your arudha pada studies! May Jupiter's light shine on us, Narasimha""""""" """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" <boxdel> wrote: > Dear Partha, > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I indicated(About pada > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji says verbatim " > Use of arudha lagna > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha lagna is maya peetha or > the seat of > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for different shades of self. > Lagna stands for > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived self. Arudha lagna stands > for "self, as > peceived by this maya world". > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to comment. > Regards, > Chandrashekhar. > > > ---- > > vedic astrology > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > vedic astrology > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse -dear Anu > > Om namah shivaya > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this world of Maya. This > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages. > regards > partha > om tat sat > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" > <boxdel> wrote: > > Dear Hari, > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are perception of what > people think > > about one, this is the only logical inference. > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > ---- > > > > vedic astrology > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > vedic astrology > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse -dear Anu > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with the consummation > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it correct? > > > > regards > > Hari > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of Service. > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > Terms of Service. 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Guest guest Posted July 3, 2003 Report Share Posted July 3, 2003 Dear Shailesh, I do not doubt efficacy of the Padas,merely understanding their role. My post is about interpretation of the Maya and Satya part. Are these to be understood as in the scriptures, as is being implied ? If this is so,then why are the yogas not applied to Padas instead of houses? As the logic being advanced is that Satya/Maya as in scriptures are to be considered, then one should apply the yogas to the Padas, since satya in scriptures refers to Atman and not the mundane world. As this is neither done nor recommended, the Maya reffered to must be perception of other regarding the jataka's actions or state of hapiness or unhappiness by others and Satya must refer to what actually exists. I am awaiting Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji's opinion on this . Chandrashekhar. Shailesh Chadha wrote: RE: [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear chandrashekhar || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha, May I join in this discussion? If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis-à-vis our understanding of a jataka, the confusion about Arudha Padas will dissolve to a great extent. "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - that which relates to "Atma" and "Parmatma" . This material world is in fact "maya" - an illusion, but we treat this world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules of "satya" to it. Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this world of "maya" and, hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are more relevant to this material existence. Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana-arudha, Gaja-arudha, etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level". So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made by the individual (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards achieving the highest ability/ perfection. Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood as "manifestation" or "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I think we will be able to better appreciate this concept of "arudha". Of course, this is only as per my understanding - hopefully, Gurus and seniors will correct, or confirm, it. Regards & best wishes, Shailesh -----Original Message----- V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5 ] Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PM vedic astrology [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear chandrashekhar Om Namah SHivaya Dear Chandrashekhar ji I have a habit of saving all important messages by the various gurus and learned members. I have around 50 MB material just by this work (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the old message for your perusal regards partha om tat sat """"""----- Original Message ----- Narasimha P.V.R. Rao To: vedic astrology Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM Subject: [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha Dear Imran, > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > Namaste, > > The concept of Arudha of different houses beautifully eloborates the difference between reality(Satya) and perception(Maya). Sage Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat and tackle these Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold specific posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas collectively, thus require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa and vorgottama of Arudhas. > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. For example in case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in Scorpio (9th from lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) is to be assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and 10th lords, Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with respect of lagna position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in chart of Dalai Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th from lagna. > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association(sambndha) with the help of rashi aspect? > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead of lagan? or its not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields satisfactory results at a certain level. > > Regards > > Imran You are on the right track and Visti has nicely addressed the points in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points. (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the activity/things shown by the houses. My communication skills are not a "tangible thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises out of my communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house shows my communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this mail (tangible). Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), they are the only tangible things - the only reality - in this material world! They are very important. (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) together in D-10, be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing them will be great. (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. However, note that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are different from the rules of the world of maya (illusion). For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's interactions. It is the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed house of kama trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) and the intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc (shaping of desire and working on the desire) and the culmination house (11th) shows the final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th house shows dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. While the seed house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the intermediate house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), the culmination house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall duty). The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the world of maya, but the meanings are different. In the world of truth, shaping of desire and working on the desires happens through interactions and finally leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. But the world of maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the world of maya, shaping of desire and working on the desire happens only thru domination and the results are only material gains. So the 7th from arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and domination. The 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include religiousness, righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma (duty) - protect itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about protecting the status and image. The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which trikona it belongs to and whether it is the seed house, intermediate house or the culmination house of that trikona) is constant for all references. But building the meaning further based on the axioms requires an understanding of the two worlds - world of satya and world of maya. I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish Workshop" and the CD will be available for buying online in a day or two at most. (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana dasa that is computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the changing impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the resulting luck) on one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana Dasa" by Pt. Sanjay Rath. (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa interpretation, but you can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition to transits from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits from natal arudha lagna! However, again, different rules may apply in the case of arudha lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma from Moon or lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter loves dharma. However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha lagna, the wise teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the rules of the world of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a shallow dharma (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So there will be material setbacks and the illusion is broken. However, if Jupiter has a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal chart also, the negative results may be mitigated. Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally different worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one understands and appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha lagna. Try to give it some thought. Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck with your arudha pada studies! May Jupiter's light shine on us, Narasimha""""""" """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" --- In vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" <boxdel> wrote: > Dear Partha, > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I indicated(About pada > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji says verbatim " > Use of arudha lagna > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha lagna is maya peetha or > the seat of > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for different shades of self. > Lagna stands for > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived self. Arudha lagna stands > for "self, as > peceived by this maya world". > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to comment. Regards, > Chandrashekhar. > > > ---- > > vedic astrology > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > vedic astrology > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse -dear Anu > > Om namah shivaya > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this world of Maya. This > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages. > regards > partha > om tat sat > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" > <boxdel> wrote: > > Dear Hari, > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are perception of what > people think > > about one, this is the only logical inference. Chandrashekhar. > > > > ---- > > > > vedic astrology > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > vedic astrology > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse -dear Anu > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with the consummation > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it correct? > > > > regards > > Hari > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of Service. > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > . > > > > ------------------------ Sponsor ---------------------~--> Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click./Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/ySSFAA/.8XolB/TM ---~-> Archives: vedic astrology Group info: vedic astrology/info.html To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- ........ May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || Your use of is subject to --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release 6/25/2003 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). 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Guest guest Posted July 3, 2003 Report Share Posted July 3, 2003 || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || Dear Chandrashekhar ji, Let me try to test my understanding - once again. "Yoga" is understood as as "association", or an "occurance". It will happen when any planet is placed in a particular situation or a combination. The Yogas are either planet specific, or lordship specific and, in some cases, karakatwa specific. In lordship specific yogas, the pada becomes involved automatically. And the rules for the results of pada/ arudhas, as enunciated in the classics (BPHS, JUpS, etc.) are yogas - though they are not specificaly referred to as such. For example, the adverse results declared for malefics situated in 12th from UL, or the effects on the marital relations interpreted from mutual position of AL & UL, or dhana-yogas occuring from the placements/ aspects on 11th from AL - these are all akin to what we popularly understand as "yogas". I will be interested in learning whateher my own undertsnading is correct - or I am compounding the confusion? Regards & best wishes, Shailesh - Chandrashekhar Sharma vedic astrology Friday, July 04, 2003 2:04 AM Re: [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear chandrashekhar Dear Shailesh,I do not doubt efficacy of the Padas,merely understanding their role. My post is about interpretation of the Maya and Satya part. Are these to be understood as in the scriptures, as is being implied ? If this is so,then why are the yogas not applied to Padas instead of houses? As the logic being advanced is that Satya/Maya as in scriptures are to be considered, then one should apply the yogas to the Padas, since satya in scriptures refers to Atman and not the mundane world.As this is neither done nor recommended, the Maya reffered to must be perception of other regarding the jataka's actions or state of hapiness or unhappiness by others and Satya must refer to what actually exists. I am awaiting Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji's opinion on this ..Chandrashekhar. Shailesh Chadha wrote: || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha, May I join in this discussion? If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis-à-vis our understanding of a jataka, the confusion about Arudha Padas will dissolve to a great extent. "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - that which relates to "Atma" and "Parmatma" . This material world is in fact "maya" - an illusion, but we treat this world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules of "satya" to it. Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this world of "maya" and, hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are more relevant to this material existence. Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana-arudha, Gaja-arudha, etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level". So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made by the individual (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards achieving the highest ability/ perfection. Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood as "manifestation" or "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I think we will be able to better appreciate this concept of "arudha". Of course, this is only as per my understanding - hopefully, Gurus and seniors will correct, or confirm, it. Regards & best wishes, Shailesh V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5 ]Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PMTo: vedic astrologySubject: [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear chandrashekhar Om Namah SHivaya Dear Chandrashekhar ji I have a habit of saving all important messages by the various gurus and learned members. I have around 50 MB material just by this work (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the old message for your perusal regards partha om tat sat """"""- Narasimha P.V.R. Rao vedic astrology Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha Dear Imran, > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > Namaste, > > The concept of Arudha of different houses beautifully eloborates the difference between reality(Satya) and perception(Maya). Sage Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat and tackle these Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold specific posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas collectively, thus require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa and vorgottama of Arudhas. > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. For example in case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in Scorpio (9th from lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) is to be assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and 10th lords, Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with respect of lagna position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in chart of Dalai Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th from lagna. > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association(sambndha) with the help of rashi aspect? > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead of lagan? or its not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields satisfactory results at a certain level. > > Regards > > Imran You are on the right track and Visti has nicely addressed the points in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points. (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the activity/things shown by the houses. My communication skills are not a "tangible thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises out of my communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house shows my communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this mail (tangible). Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), they are the only tangible things - the only reality - in this material world! They are very important. (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) together in D-10, be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing them will be great. (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. However, note that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are different from the rules of the world of maya (illusion). For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's interactions. It is the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed house of kama trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) and the intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc (shaping of desire and working on the desire) and the culmination house (11th) shows the final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th house shows dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. While the seed house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the intermediate house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), the culmination house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall duty). The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the world of maya, but the meanings are different. In the world of truth, shaping of desire and working on the desires happens through interactions and finally leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. But the world of maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the world of maya, shaping of desire and working on the desire happens only thru domination and the results are only material gains. So the 7th from arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and domination. The 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include religiousness, righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma (duty) - protect itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about protecting the status and image. The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which trikona it belongs to and whether it is the seed house, intermediate house or the culmination house of that trikona) is constant for all references. But building the meaning further based on the axioms requires an understanding of the two worlds - world of satya and world of maya. I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish Workshop" and the CD will be available for buying online in a day or two at most. (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana dasa that is computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the changing impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the resulting luck) on one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana Dasa" by Pt. Sanjay Rath. (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa interpretation, but you can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition to transits from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits from natal arudha lagna! However, again, different rules may apply in the case of arudha lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma from Moon or lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter loves dharma. However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha lagna, the wise teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the rules of the world of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a shallow dharma (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So there will be material setbacks and the illusion is broken. However, if Jupiter has a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal chart also, the negative results may be mitigated. Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally different worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one understands and appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha lagna. Try to give it some thought. Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck with your arudha pada studies! May Jupiter's light shine on us, Narasimha"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" <boxdel> wrote: > Dear Partha, > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I indicated(About pada > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji says verbatim " > Use of arudha lagna > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha lagna is maya peetha or > the seat of > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for different shades of self. > Lagna stands for > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived self. Arudha lagna stands > for "self, as > peceived by this maya world". > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to comment. Regards, > Chandrashekhar. > > > ---- > > vedic astrology > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > vedic astrology > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse -dear Anu > > Om namah shivaya > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this world of Maya. This > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages. > regards > partha > om tat sat > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" > <boxdel> wrote: > > Dear Hari, > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are perception of what > people think > > about one, this is the only logical inference. Chandrashekhar. > > > > ---- > > > > vedic astrology > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > vedic astrology > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse -dear Anu > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with the consummation > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it correct? > > > > regards > > Hari > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of Service. > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > ------------------------ Sponsor ---------------------~--> Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click./Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/ySSFAA/.8XolB/TM ---~-> Your use of is subject to --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release 6/25/2003 ---Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: 6/25/2003 Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... 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Guest guest Posted July 3, 2003 Report Share Posted July 3, 2003 || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || Dear Amol, Your interpretation of the word 'rudha' is correct, and also about the normal rule about prefixing of 'aa' - no doubt about that. But the word under discussion - arudha- is from 'aaroha' - which, as you know, means 'to climb'. 'Arudha' is the present-perfect tense of 'aaroha'. And, I am no sanskrit scholar either :-). Regards & best wishes, Shailesh - "amolmandar" <amolmandar <vedic astrology> Friday, July 04, 2003 1:15 AM [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear chandrashekhar Dear Shailesh If we accept the meaning of words by dictionary then we have to accept it in totality. When we say litrally, we have to stick to dictionary meanings. ruDha in sanskrit means 'popular or traditional'.From this only we have a word ruDhi of similar semantics in many of the Indian (Sanskrit based) languages. I hope you are not targeted being 'ruDhivadi'! The prefix 'aa' means more or amplified or all pervading. 'nannda' is happiness and 'aanannda' is more happiness.'graha' means seizing or holding and 'aagraha' means strong holding or strong persistence. May be I am not familier well with sanskrit and sanskrit based indian languages but if we are discussing Sanskrit words then we should not apply the meaning of other sanskrit based indian languages for that word this is what I understand well. Like in 'aaram'. Ram means happiness and therefore aaram is more happiness in sanskrit. But by the time 'aaram' reaches to Hindi (Sanskrit based Indian language) it changes to 'relaxing' that is why we say 'aaram haram hain'. So I suppose it is not easy to dismiss the semantic of a word. Meaning of Sanskrit word in Sanskrit is 'Satya' and in Sankrit based Indian language is its 'AruDha'!. Therefore, to consider aaruDha as popular or traditional is the correct approch. Hence Lagna is real identity or Satya or 'You' and aaruDha Lagna is popular identity or maya. Shri Partha has rightly pointed out that astrologically Lagna and aaruDha lagna can not be same. 1st and 7th house can not be aaruDha is what BPHS says. For general public it is true but for great men Lagna and AL should be same. Can we not say same thing about maharishi valmiki, VedaVyasa? I am sure. Even in todays age we can say this about person like Mahatma Gandhi. All these men should have their real and popular identity same. Sociology and astrology are not going in tandem regarding this issuse that is why I put my thought. If you feel that I am crossing my boundries please excuse me. I really dont mind you saying anything to me. So far as my 'Lagna' is intact why should I worry about my 'aaruDha'! Thanks a lot for Your Time and Sapce. AmolMandar vedic astrology, "Shailesh Chadha" <scc@s...> wrote: > || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || > > Dear Amol, > > The terms used in classics (incl. BPHS & JUpS) are "pada", "adhuda" and "padarudha" . > > Any one familiar with (sanskrit based) Indian languages will recognise these words, which mean "position", "risen" and "risen to (and occuping the) position". > > I hope you do not mind my saying so but your interpretation in more of a distortion. > > And as Partha has mentioned very clearly, ARUDHA & LAGNA cannot be same - though some do hold a contray view. > > Try to understand the 'pada/ arudha' concept as an extension of the 'BHAVAT BHAVAM' principle and most of the things will become clear, including why "Pada" and "Lagna" cannot be same. > > Regards & best wishes, > > Shailesh > - > "amolmandar" <amolmandar> > <vedic astrology> > Thursday, July 03, 2003 4:03 PM > [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear chandrashekhar > > > Dear Shailesh > > If you allow me to join this discussion..... > > I think we should read it as AruDha or aaruDha. Literally ruDha means > popular or traditional and 'aa' prefix makes it more popular or more > traditional. The prefix 'a' to ruDha will make it opposite. aruDha > will be that is not popular.So aaruDha means morepopular or we can > say Maha-popular. That way aaruDha will make what is popularly known > about you. It need not be other than Satya. If you are fortunate > enough your Lagna(true identity) and Arudha Lagna(Popular identity) > will be same. All great persons should belong to that class. Both > identies are govern by satya i.e.you(Lagna) and hence Lagna is more > important. > > After all we say satyam eva jayate! > > Thanks a lot for your Time and Space. > > AmolMandar > > vedic astrology, "Shailesh Chadha" <scc@s...> > wrote: > > || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha, > > May I join in this discussion? > > If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis-à-vis our > > understanding of a jataka, the confusion about Arudha Padas will > > dissolve to a great extent. > > "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - that which > relates to > > "Atma" and "Parmatma" . > > This material world is in fact "maya" - an illusion, but we treat > this > > world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules of "satya" to it. > > Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this world of "maya" and, > > hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are more relevant to > this > > material existence. > > Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana-arudha, Gaja- arudha, > > etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level". > > So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made by the > individual > > (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards achieving the highest > > ability/ perfection. > > Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood as "manifestation" or > > "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I think we will be > able to > > better appreciate this concept of "arudha". > > Of course, this is only as per my understanding - hopefully, Gurus > and > > seniors will correct, or confirm, it. > > Regards & best wishes, > > Shailesh > > > > > > V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5] > > Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PM > > vedic astrology > > [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear chandrashekhar > > > > Om Namah SHivaya > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji > > > > I have a habit of saving all important messages by the various > gurus > > and learned members. I have around 50 MB material just by this work > > (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the old message for > > your perusal > > > > regards > > partha > > om tat sat > > > > > > """"""- > > Narasimha P.V.R. Rao > > vedic astrology > > Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM > > [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha > > > > Dear Imran, > > > > > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > > > > > Namaste, > > > > > > The concept of Arudha of different houses beautifully eloborates > > the difference between reality(Satya) and perception(Maya). Sage > > Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat and tackle > these > > Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold specific > > posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > > > > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas collectively, thus > > require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa and vorgottama > > of Arudhas. > > > > > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. For example in > > case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in Scorpio (9th from > > lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > > > > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) is to be > > assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and 10th lords, > > Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > > > > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with respect of lagna > > position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in chart of Dalai > > Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th from lagna. > > > > > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association(sambndha) with > the > > help of rashi aspect? > > > > > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead of lagan? or > its > > not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields satisfactory > > results at a certain level. > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > Imran > > > > You are on the right track and Visti has nicely addressed the > points > > in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points. > > > > (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the > activity/things > > shown by the houses. My communication skills are not a "tangible > > thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises out of my > > communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house shows my > > communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this mail (tangible). > > > > Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), they are the > > only tangible things - the only reality - in this material world! > > They are very important. > > > > (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) together in D- 10, > > be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing them will be > > great. > > > > (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. However, note > > that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are different from the > > rules of the world of maya (illusion). > > > > For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's interactions. It > is > > the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed house of kama > > trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) and the > > intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc (shaping of desire > > and working on the desire) and the culmination house (11th) shows > the > > final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th house shows > > dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. While the seed > > house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the intermediate > > house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), the culmination > > house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall duty). > > > > The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the world of maya, > but > > the meanings are different. In the world of truth, shaping of > desire > > and working on the desires happens through interactions and finally > > leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. But the world > of > > maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the world of > maya, > > shaping of desire and working on the desire happens only thru > > domination and the results are only material gains. So the 7th from > > arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and domination. > The > > 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include religiousness, > > righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma (duty) - > protect > > itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about protecting > the > > status and image. > > > > The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which trikona it > > belongs to and whether it is the seed house, intermediate house or > > the culmination house of that trikona) is constant for all > > references. But building the meaning further based on the axioms > > requires an understanding of the two worlds - world of satya and > > world of maya. > > > > I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish Workshop" and the CD > > will be available for buying online in a day or two at most. > > > > (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa > > interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana dasa that is > > computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the changing > > impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the resulting luck) on > > one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana Dasa" by Pt. > > Sanjay Rath. > > > > (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa interpretation, but > you > > can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition to transits > > from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits from natal arudha > > lagna! > > > > However, again, different rules may apply in the case of arudha > > lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma from Moon or > > lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter loves dharma. > > However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha lagna, the wise > > teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the rules of the > world > > of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a shallow dharma > > (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So there will be > > material setbacks and the illusion is broken. However, if Jupiter > has > > a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal chart also, > the > > negative results may be mitigated. > > > > Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally different > > worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one understands > and > > appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha lagna. Try to > > give it some thought. > > > > Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck with your > > arudha pada studies! > > > > May Jupiter's light shine on us, > > Narasimha""""""" > > """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > Dear Partha, > > > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I indicated > (About > > pada > > > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji says verbatim " > > > Use of arudha lagna > > > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha lagna is maya > > peetha or > > > the seat of > > > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for different shades > > of self. > > > Lagna stands for > > > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived self. Arudha lagna > > stands > > > for "self, as > > > peceived by this maya world". > > > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to comment. > Regards, > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > > > vedic astrology > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse -dear Anu > > > > > > Om namah shivaya > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > > > > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this world of Maya. > > This > > > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages. > > > regards > > > partha > > > om tat sat > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" > > > <boxdel> wrote: > > > > Dear Hari, > > > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are perception of what > > > people think > > > > about one, this is the only logical inference. Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > ---- > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > > > vedic astrology > > > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse -dear Anu > > > > > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with the > > consummation > > > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it correct? > > > > > > > > regards > > > > Hari > > > > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- astrology/info.html > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release 6/25/2003 > > > > > > --- > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release 6/25/2003 > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > Your use of is subject to > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.478 / Virus Database: 275 - Release 5/6/2003 Your use of is subject to --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). 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Guest guest Posted July 4, 2003 Report Share Posted July 4, 2003 Dear Shailesh, Yoga is arrived at from Yuj, joining. So as you rightly said it is a particular combination of planets with respect to different conditions. Yoga is also used to indicate some combination of planets that enables one to predict certain happenings in future. There is no confusion about what constitutes yoga, whether wrt Pada Lagna,upapadaLagna, Karakmsha or Lagna, Rasi etc. I was pointing to the fact that no clear cut information is available about what is to be interpreted when the results indicated by Yogas arising due to certain combination of planets wrt Laganaarudha or Upa Pada Lagna are contraindicated by yogas ocuring wrt Lagna ,12th house or 7th house. If some one has a reference to classic texts , which mentions which yoga overrides other (As navamsha Exaltation/debilitation overrides Natal similarly placed planet indications), I would be obliged much. Chandrashekhar. Shailesh Chadha wrote: || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || Dear Chandrashekhar ji, Let me try to test my understanding - once again. "Yoga" is understood as as "association", or an "occurance". It will happen when any planet is placed in a particular situation or a combination. The Yogas are either planet specific, or lordship specific and, in some cases, karakatwa specific. In lordship specific yogas, the pada becomes involved automatically. And the rules for the results of pada/ arudhas, as enunciated in the classics (BPHS, JUpS, etc.) are yogas - though they are not specificaly referred to as such. For example, the adverse results declared for malefics situated in 12th from UL, or the effects on the marital relations interpreted from mutual position of AL & UL, or dhana-yogas occuring from the placements/ aspects on 11th from AL - these are all akin to what we popularly understand as "yogas". I will be interested in learning whateher my own undertsnading is correct - or I am compounding the confusion? Regards & best wishes, Shailesh ----- Original Message ----- Chandrashekhar Sharma To: vedic astrology Sent: Friday, July 04, 2003 2:04 AM Subject: Re: [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear chandrashekhar Dear Shailesh, I do not doubt efficacy of the Padas,merely understanding their role. My post is about interpretation of the Maya and Satya part. Are these to be understood as in the scriptures, as is being implied ? If this is so,then why are the yogas not applied to Padas instead of houses? As the logic being advanced is that Satya/Maya as in scriptures are to be considered, then one should apply the yogas to the Padas, since satya in scriptures refers to Atman and not the mundane world. As this is neither done nor recommended, the Maya reffered to must be perception of other regarding the jataka's actions or state of hapiness or unhappiness by others and Satya must refer to what actually exists. I am awaiting Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji's opinion on this . Chandrashekhar. Shailesh Chadha wrote: || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha, May I join in this discussion? If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis-à-vis our understanding of a jataka, the confusion about Arudha Padas will dissolve to a great extent. "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - that which relates to "Atma" and "Parmatma" . This material world is in fact "maya" - an illusion, but we treat this world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules of "satya" to it. Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this world of "maya" and, hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are more relevant to this material existence. Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana-arudha, Gaja-arudha, etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level". So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made by the individual (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards achieving the highest ability/ perfection. Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood as "manifestation" or "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I think we will be able to better appreciate this concept of "arudha". Of course, this is only as per my understanding - hopefully, Gurus and seniors will correct, or confirm, it. Regards & best wishes, Shailesh V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5 ] Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PM vedic astrology [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear chandrashekhar Om Namah SHivaya Dear Chandrashekhar ji I have a habit of saving all important messages by the various gurus and learned members. I have around 50 MB material just by this work (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the old message for your perusal regards partha om tat sat """"""- Narasimha P.V.R. Rao vedic astrology Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha Dear Imran, > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > Namaste, > > The concept of Arudha of different houses beautifully eloborates the difference between reality(Satya) and perception(Maya). Sage Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat and tackle these Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold specific posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas collectively, thus require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa and vorgottama of Arudhas. > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. For example in case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in Scorpio (9th from lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) is to be assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and 10th lords, Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with respect of lagna position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in chart of Dalai Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th from lagna. > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association(sambndha) with the help of rashi aspect? > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead of lagan? or its not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields satisfactory results at a certain level. > > Regards > > Imran You are on the right track and Visti has nicely addressed the points in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points. (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the activity/things shown by the houses. My communication skills are not a "tangible thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises out of my communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house shows my communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this mail (tangible). Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), they are the only tangible things - the only reality - in this material world! They are very important. (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) together in D-10, be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing them will be great. (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. However, note that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are different from the rules of the world of maya (illusion). For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's interactions. It is the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed house of kama trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) and the intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc (shaping of desire and working on the desire) and the culmination house (11th) shows the final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th house shows dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. While the seed house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the intermediate house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), the culmination house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall duty). The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the world of maya, but the meanings are different. In the world of truth, shaping of desire and working on the desires happens through interactions and finally leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. But the world of maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the world of maya, shaping of desire and working on the desire happens only thru domination and the results are only material gains. So the 7th from arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and domination. The 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include religiousness, righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma (duty) - protect itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about protecting the status and image. The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which trikona it belongs to and whether it is the seed house, intermediate house or the culmination house of that trikona) is constant for all references. But building the meaning further based on the axioms requires an understanding of the two worlds - world of satya and world of maya. I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish Workshop" and the CD will be available for buying online in a day or two at most. (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana dasa that is computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the changing impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the resulting luck) on one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana Dasa" by Pt. Sanjay Rath. (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa interpretation, but you can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition to transits from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits from natal arudha lagna! However, again, different rules may apply in the case of arudha lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma from Moon or lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter loves dharma. However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha lagna, the wise teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the rules of the world of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a shallow dharma (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So there will be material setbacks and the illusion is broken. However, if Jupiter has a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal chart also, the negative results may be mitigated. Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally different worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one understands and appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha lagna. Try to give it some thought. Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck with your arudha pada studies! May Jupiter's light shine on us, Narasimha""""""" """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" <boxdel> wrote: > Dear Partha, > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I indicated(About pada > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji says verbatim " > Use of arudha lagna > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha lagna is maya peetha or > the seat of > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for different shades of self. > Lagna stands for > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived self. Arudha lagna stands > for "self, as > peceived by this maya world". > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to comment. Regards, > Chandrashekhar. > > > ---- > > vedic astrology > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > vedic astrology > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse -dear Anu > > Om namah shivaya > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this world of Maya. This > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages. > regards > partha > om tat sat > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" > <boxdel> wrote: > > Dear Hari, > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are perception of what > people think > > about one, this is the only logical inference. Chandrashekhar. > > > > ---- > > > > vedic astrology > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > vedic astrology > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse -dear Anu > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with the consummation > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it correct? > > > > regards > > Hari > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > > > Terms of Service. > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || > > Terms of Service. ------------------------ Sponsor ---------------------~--> Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click./Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/ySSFAA/.8XolB/TM ---~-> Your use of is subject to --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release Date: 6/25/2003 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release 6/25/2003 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.478 / Virus Database: 275 - Release 5/7/2003 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 4, 2003 Report Share Posted July 4, 2003 || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || Dear Chandrashekhar ji, Yes, we do need guidance/ elaboration on resolving such contradictions - byt not just in application of 'pada' rules vis-a-vis other rules. Don't you think we face similar contradictions in several other areas as well - for which we do not have sufficient guidance. For example yogas read from planets vs from karakas - or even placement related (ie a planet in airavtamsa but in gandanta, an exalted yogakaraka & AK in gandanta, a yoga karaka in exaltation but in marana sthana) - or even dasa vs transit. The apparent contradiction shuold be on account of our incopmelet eknowledge - also from loss/ corruption of classic knowledge. I do hope our Gurus will help us to understand the subtle rules. Regards & best wishes, Shailesh - Chandrashekhar Sharma vedic astrology Saturday, July 05, 2003 1:19 AM Re: [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear chandrashekhar Dear Shailesh, <<snip>> I was pointing to the fact that no clear cut information is available about what is to be interpreted when the results indicated by Yogas arising due to certain combination of planets wrt Laganaarudha or Upa Pada Lagna are contraindicated by yogas ocuring wrt Lagna ,12th house or 7th house.If some one has a reference to classic texts , which mentions which yoga overrides other (As navamsha Exaltation/debilitation overrides Natal similarly placed planet indications), I would be obliged much. Chandrashekhar. ---Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).Version: 6.0.478 / Virus Database: 275 - Release Date: 5/6/2003 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 5, 2003 Report Share Posted July 5, 2003 Dear Shailesh, You are right. Much confusion arises due to one's attempt to follow too many different systems simutaneously, before mastering one first. I think one should try to understand the logic behind yogas, awasthaas,Karakatwa etc. and should adopt them if found logical. The problem also arises because of a tendency to corelate all principles with scriptures and also sometimes because the commentators have taken a particular view of a shloka, which is in apparent variance to the basic principles. It is good that lists such as this exist so that the confusion can be discussed and an attempt can be made to remove them. Regards, Chandrashekhar. Shailesh wrote: || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || Dear Chandrashekhar ji, Yes, we do need guidance/ elaboration on resolving such contradictions - byt not just in application of 'pada' rules vis-a-vis other rules. Don't you think we face similar contradictions in several other areas as well - for which we do not have sufficient guidance. For example yogas read from planets vs from karakas - or even placement related (ie a planet in airavtamsa but in gandanta, an exalted yogakaraka & AK in gandanta, a yoga karaka in exaltation but in marana sthana) - or even dasa vs transit. The apparent contradiction shuold be on account of our incopmelet eknowledge - also from loss/ corruption of classic knowledge. I do hope our Gurus will help us to understand the subtle rules. Regards & best wishes, Shailesh ----- Original Message ----- Chandrashekhar Sharma To: vedic astrology Sent: Saturday, July 05, 2003 1:19 AM Subject: Re: [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear chandrashekhar Dear Shailesh, <<snip>> I was pointing to the fact that no clear cut information is available about what is to be interpreted when the results indicated by Yogas arising due to certain combination of planets wrt Laganaarudha or Upa Pada Lagna are contraindicated by yogas ocuring wrt Lagna ,12th house or 7th house. If some one has a reference to classic texts , which mentions which yoga overrides other (As navamsha Exaltation/debilitation overrides Natal similarly placed planet indications), I would be obliged much. Chandrashekhar. --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.478 / Virus Database: 275 - Release 5/6/2003 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 6, 2003 Report Share Posted July 6, 2003 Dear Sanjayji, I agree with you. This is what I was trying to point out. Sun and Moon's Karakatwa of Atma and Arudha is never in doubt. So I am not very much off the mark in terepreting Lagna as the truth)Known to Jataka) and Pada Lagna as perceived truth(Perceived by others), or am I? Regards, Chandrashekhar. Sanjay Rath wrote: |brihaspatim varenyam| Dear Chandrasekhar ji Sun the natural ATMA karaka is also the karaka for the Lagna, and Moon the naisargika Mana karaka is also the karaka for the Arudha...this should ring a bell. No it is not possible to realise the absolute truth in this body and with this mana unless in very very rare cases. The Satya we speak of is the relative truth, the apparant truth..more on this when we discuss the sapta loka in the west coast with a few examples for life after death... ~ om tat sat ~ Yours truly, Sanjay Rath --------------------------- H-5, B.J.B Nagar, Bhubaneswar 751014, India +91-674-2436871 http://srath.com --------------------------- Chandrashekhar Sharma [boxdel (AT) (DOT) co.uk] Friday, July 04, 2003 2:05 AM vedic astrology Re: [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear chandrashekhar Dear Shailesh, I do not doubt efficacy of the Padas,merely understanding their role. My post is about interpretation of the Maya and Satya part. Are these to be understood as in the scriptures, as is being implied ? If this is so,then why are the yogas not applied to Padas instead of houses? As the logic being advanced is that Satya/Maya as in scriptures are to be considered, then one should apply the yogas to the Padas, since satya in scriptures refers to Atman and not the mundane world. As this is neither done nor recommended, the Maya reffered to must be perception of other regarding the jataka's actions or state of hapiness or unhappiness by others and Satya must refer to what actually exists. I am awaiting Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji's opinion on this . Chandrashekhar. Shailesh Chadha wrote: || Om Gurave Namah :: Om Namo Naaraayanaaya || Dear Chandrasekhar ji & Partha, May I join in this discussion? If we are clear about the "Satya" and "Maya", vis-à-vis our understanding of a jataka, the confusion about Arudha Padas will dissolve to a great extent. "Satya" is the "sashwata" or the spiritual truth - that which relates to "Atma" and "Parmatma" . This material world is in fact "maya" - an illusion, but we treat this world as the 'truth' and try to apply the rules of "satya" to it. Our physical actions, and fruits, occur in this world of "maya" and, hence, the results as shown by Arudha padas are more relevant to this material existence. Literally, "arudha" means "mounted" (Simhasana-arudha, Gaja-arudha, etc.) and "pada" means "step"/ "level". So, maybe, arudha padas represent the progress made by the individual (his atma), in that particular sphere, towards achieving the highest ability/ perfection. Therefore, if "Arudha Padas" are understood as "manifestation" or "perception" in the physical/ material sense, I think we will be able to better appreciate this concept of "arudha". Of course, this is only as per my understanding - hopefully, Gurus and seniors will correct, or confirm, it. Regards & best wishes, Shailesh -----Original Message----- V.Partha sarathy [partvinu5 ] Thursday, July 03, 2003 12:41 PM vedic astrology [vedic astrology] Re: arudha padas-dear chandrashekhar Om Namah SHivaya Dear Chandrashekhar ji I have a habit of saving all important messages by the various gurus and learned members. I have around 50 MB material just by this work (mercury in dhanu lagna at work). I am pasting the old message for your perusal regards partha om tat sat """"""----- Original Message ----- Narasimha P.V.R. Rao To: vedic astrology Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 6:23 PM Subject: [vedic astrology] Re: Thoughts on Arudha Dear Imran, > Respected Gurus and Dear Members, > > Namaste, > > The concept of Arudha of different houses beautifully eloborates the difference between reality(Satya) and perception(Maya). Sage Jaimini has described some golden rules how to treat and tackle these Arudha-Pada. AL (Arudh lagna) and A12(Upapada) hold specific posiotion among heirarchy of arudhas. > > I am not much aware, how to read these arudhas collectively, thus require guidance regarding association, aspect, dasa and vorgottama of Arudhas. > > Some time, a cluster of Padas is seen in a chart. For example in case of Tagore, where AL, UL, A5 and A7 fall in Scorpio (9th from lagna). How can these shoud be read? > > Similarly conjunction of A9 and A10 (H.P.Blavatsky) is to be assumed as "mirror image" of conjunction of 9th and 10th lords, Karama-Dharama Yoga. This holds any sence or not? > > Similarly different Arudhas either consider with respect of lagna position or only read from position of AL? e.g. in chart of Dalai Lama, where A9 (with A2) fall in 9th from AL and 12th from lagna. > > Either these Arudhas can comes under association(sambndha) with the help of rashi aspect? > > In case Rashi dasa, either AL can be taken instead of lagan? or its not logical? Because sometimes transit from AL, yields satisfactory results at a certain level. > > Regards > > Imran You are on the right track and Visti has nicely addressed the points in your wonderful mail. I will add a couple of points. (1) Arudhas are the _tangible_ things rising from the activity/things shown by the houses. My communication skills are not a "tangible thing", but this mail is a tangible thing that rises out of my communication skills. Accordingly, the 3rd house shows my communication skills (intangible) and A3 shows this mail (tangible). Even though we dismiss arudhas as "maya" (illusion), they are the only tangible things - the only reality - in this material world! They are very important. (2) If somebody has AL and A9 (or A10 and A9 etc) together in D-10, be sure that the Narayana dasa of the sign containing them will be great. (3) Houses from arudha lagna can certainly be seen. However, note that the rules of the world of satya (truth) are different from the rules of the world of maya (illusion). For example, the 7th house from lagna shows one's interactions. It is the intermediate house in kama trikona. The seed house of kama trikona (3rd) shows the initiative (seed of desire) and the intermediate house (7th) shows interactions etc (shaping of desire and working on the desire) and the culmination house (11th) shows the final gains (result of desire). Similarly, the 9th house shows dharma - it is culmination point of dharma trikona. While the seed house of lagna shows the self (seed of duty) and the intermediate house of 5th shows abilities etc (shaping of duty), the culmination house of 9th shows the final dharma (the overall duty). The same concepts, same trikonas etc apply in the world of maya, but the meanings are different. In the world of truth, shaping of desire and working on the desires happens through interactions and finally leads to gains (11th), which can be friendships too. But the world of maya is a world of selfishness and domination. In the world of maya, shaping of desire and working on the desire happens only thru domination and the results are only material gains. So the 7th from arudha lagna shows the opposition to one's image and domination. The 9th from lagna shows the dharma - which can include religiousness, righteousness etc. But the image has only one dharma (duty) - protect itself. So the 9th from arudha lagna is strictly about protecting the status and image. The basic axioms of what a house means (based on which trikona it belongs to and whether it is the seed house, intermediate house or the culmination house of that trikona) is constant for all references. But building the meaning further based on the axioms requires an understanding of the two worlds - world of satya and world of maya. I spoke on this at the recent "Achyuta Jyotish Workshop" and the CD will be available for buying online in a day or two at most. (4) Not only can you use arudha lagna in Narayana dasa interpretation, but there is a variation of Narayana dasa that is computed from arudha lagna. Padanadamsa dasa shows the changing impact of one's poorvapunya (past dharma and the resulting luck) on one's material status/image. Read the book "Narayana Dasa" by Pt. Sanjay Rath. (5) Not only can you use arudha lagna in dasa interpretation, but you can use it in transit interpretation too! In addition to transits from natal lagna and natal Moon, look at transits from natal arudha lagna! However, again, different rules may apply in the case of arudha lagna. When Jupiter transits the 9th house of dharma from Moon or lagna, he gives very good results. After Jupiter loves dharma. However, when he transits the 9th house from arudha lagna, the wise teacher of gods will not be excited to uphold the rules of the world of maya and protect the illusion. He sees it as a shallow dharma (duty). Instead of protecting, he will destroy it! So there will be material setbacks and the illusion is broken. However, if Jupiter has a role to play in the 9th from arudha lagna in natal chart also, the negative results may be mitigated. Bottomline is: arudha lagna and lagna show two totally different worlds with their own rules of existence. Unless one understands and appreciates this, one cannot master the use of arudha lagna. Try to give it some thought. Overall, Imran, you are on the right track. Good luck with your arudha pada studies! May Jupiter's light shine on us, Narasimha""""""" """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" --- In vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" <boxdel> wrote: > Dear Partha, > Are you certain,? I remember Sanjayji saying what I indicated(About pada > being perception). And here is what narasimharaoji says verbatim " > Use of arudha lagna > Lagna is satya peetha or the seat of truth. Arudha lagna is maya peetha or > the seat of > illusion. Both stand for self, but they stand for different shades of self. > Lagna stands for > true self and arudha lagna stands for perceived self. Arudha lagna stands > for "self, as > peceived by this maya world". > Perhaps Narasimharaoji and Sanjayji would like to comment. Regards, > Chandrashekhar. > > > ---- > > vedic astrology > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 10:41:07 AM > vedic astrology > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse -dear Anu > > Om namah shivaya > > Dear Chandrashekhar ji and Hari > > Padas are the only reality, the tangibles in this world of Maya. This > was clarified by Narasimha in his earlier messages. > regards > partha > om tat sat > > > vedic astrology, "Chandrashekhar Sharma" > <boxdel> wrote: > > Dear Hari, > > If we accept the premise that the Padas are perception of what > people think > > about one, this is the only logical inference. Chandrashekhar. > > > > ---- > > > > vedic astrology > > Tuesday, July 01, 2003 08:10:49 AM > > vedic astrology > > [vedic astrology] Re: Upapada when the spouse -dear Anu > > > > ---Om Brihaspataye Namah--- > > Dear Chandrasekhar and Partha, > > > > My thinking is that the UL has nothing to do with the consummation > > or non-consummation of the marriage. Is it correct? > > > > regards > > Hari > > > > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms of Service. > > > Sponsor > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > . > > > > ------------------------ Sponsor ---------------------~--> Get A Free Psychic Reading! Your Online Answer To Life's Important Questions. http://us.click./Lj3uPC/Me7FAA/ySSFAA/.8XolB/TM ---~-> Archives: vedic astrology Group info: vedic astrology/info.html To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- ........ May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu || Your use of is subject to --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release 6/25/2003 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.493 / Virus Database: 292 - Release 6/25/2003 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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