Spiritual Chakras and Planets

December 3, 2003

om namo näräyaëäya|Dear Narasimha Ji,

Really this makes some sence.Thanks for the detailed information.

With Sri Hari Vaayu Naama Smarana,

Ramadas Rao."Narasimha P.V.R. Rao" <pvr (AT) charter (DOT) net> wrote:

Om Gurave Namah

Namaste friends,

Going by a couple of mails that I read today, there seems to have been a nice

discussion on spiritual chakras and their astrological links. Unfortunately, I

missed this whole discussion as I did not read any of the mails.

Though I am certainly not an expert on this subject, I wanted to share my little

knowledge and my thoughts on this matter with the list. The following is not

from any book or from any external teacher. It is from the internal teacher.

A few quick comments before I go to sleep:

(1) Mooladhara chakra has Lam as its beeja. It is of earthy nature. In other

words, the challenges presented by it to a sadhaka are of earthy nature. The

challenges presented by it are shown by Mercury (earthy nature), while the

planet who shows overcoming those challenges is Saturn. Saturn's airy nature

reduces the heaviness of Mercury's earthy nature. Mooladhara attracts one

towards physical happiness and physical achievements. The vairagya given by

airy Saturn helps one overcome these attractions and the physical senses.

Thus, some scholars may associate Mercury with this chakra and some may associate Saturn.

(2) Swadhishthana chakra has Vam as its beeja. It is of watery nature. In other

words, the challenges presented by it to a sadhaka are of watery nature. Its

challenges are shown by Venus (watery nature), while the planet who shows

overcoming them is Mars. Mars' fiery nature controls the fluentness of Venus'

watery nature. Swadhishthana challenges one by increasing sexual impulses. The

fire/determination of Mars (Hanuman) can extinguish the water/passion of Venus.

(3) Manipura chakra has Ram as its beeja. It is of fiery nature. In other words,

the challenges presented by it to a sadhaka are of fiery nature. Its challenges

are shown by Mars (fiery nature), while the planet who shows overcoming those

challenges is Venus. Venus' watery nature reduces the fire of Mars. Manipura

attracts one towards domination and fights. The harmony and understanding

brought in by watery Venus helps one overcome instincts of domination and

fighting shown by Mars.

(4) Anahata chakra has Yam as its beeja. It is of airy nature. In other words,

the challenges presented by it to a sadhaka are of airy nature. Its challenges

are shown by Saturn (airy nature), while the planet who shows overcoming those

challenges is Moon (watery luminary). Anahata attracts one towards emotions,

anxieties, attachments etc (airy nature). Moon, the watery luminary, shows mind

and he offers a base to these emotions. Thus, Moon is the key to overcome these

challenges. Another way to look at this is that Saturn shows submission and

Moon shows Krishna, the ishta devata who resides in the heart. Thus, Saturn

shows the challenges involved with Anahata chakra and Moon shows the aid in

overcoming the challenges.

(5) Visuddha chakra has Ham as its beeja. It is of ethery nature. In other

words, the challenges presented by it to a sadhaka are of ethery nature. Its

challenges are shown by Jupiter (ethery nature), while the planet who shows

overcoming those challenges is Mercury. Mercury's earthy nature gives form to

the ethery nature of Jupiter! Jupiter shows the guru inside one and Mercury

shows the student inside one. For drawing from the universe and communicating

with it, both are needed. Thus, Jupiter (perception, wisdom and understanding)

shows the challenges presented by this chakra and Mercury (learning like a

student and communication) shows the aid in overcoming the challenges.

OK, it is getting late. I have to sleep. I will wind up quickly.

(6) Ajna chalra is a combination of all the five tattvas (earth, water, fire,

air and ether) in their purest forms and essences. Its challenges are shown by

Moon (mind, the perceiver) and the aid in overcoming the challenges is shown by

Jupiter (intellect).

(7) Sahasrara chakra is a state of no tattva. It is shown by Sun. Both the

challenges presented by it and the ways to overcome the challenges are shown by

Sun and Sun alone.

Thus, I have presented two planets each for each chakra. One symbolizes the

nature of the chakra and the challenges presented by it and the other shows the

ways to overcome the challenges.

I sincerely hope it makes some sense to the more learned members.

May Jupiter's light shine on us,

Narasimha

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December 5, 2003

Dear Gili,

Well it appears I am not alone in this line of thinking. Thanks for the info.

Love,

Chandrashekhar.

Gili Mary [xapsarax (AT) hotmail (DOT) com]Sent:

Friday, December 05, 2003 5:50 AMvedic astrologySubject:

RE: [vedic astrology] Re: Spiritual Chakras and PlanetsDear Chandrashekhar,Both

T.Subba Row and Bepin Behari suggest this too. As I posted before, it seems so

simple and so tidy that it 'feels' right to me but I am just an inexperienced

novice in this field.Love,Gili>Dear Narasimha,>I am not much in to religion

interpretation per-se. But since there is an>ongoing attempt to relate Chakras

to Planet karakatwa, would you check up>the following and let me know whether

this logic can be applied to>Chakra-Karaka relationship?>I think the Karakatwas

could relate from Sun to Saturn in descending order>depending distance of

planets from Sun, from Saharara to Mooladhara as the>locations relate to the

planets in question. I may be completely off the>track,but could you check

up.>Regards,>Chandrashekhar.>_______________Use

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December 6, 2003

Namaste all,

Before I start, a learned friend said she did not know the Sanskrit names of

chakras and asked me for a definition of chakras. She and others in the same

situation may kindly check out

http://www.sanatansociety.org/yoga_and_meditation/seven_chakras.htm

* * *

What Bepin Behari and Subba Row apparently gave seems to be the most popular

version on the internet. Most sites seem to associate Sun, Moon, Mercury,

Venus, Mars, Jupiter and Saturn with the 7 chakras (from sahasrara to

mooladhara).

Well, the motivation must be as given by Chendrashekhar ji. But this approach has loopholes.

If it is based on the distance from Sun, why is ajna chakra given to Moon?

Mercury is closer to Sun than Moon. Why not give ajna to Mercury, Visuddhi to

Venus and Anahata to Moon? So it is not exactly based on distance from Sun.

Basically, this approach (of Behari and others) is based on seeing ajna and

sahasrara chakra from Cancer and Leo (which do not have Ida and Pingala -

female and male nadis - but have only one nadi) and seeing the 2 nadis of other

five chakras from the signs Cp, Sg, Sc, Li and Vi or Aq, Pi, Ae, Ta and Ge

(bisect the zodiac and assign two signs owned by the same planet to one

chakra). This corresponds to Saturn, Jupiter, Mars, Venus and Mercury for

Mooladhara, ..., Visuddha.

I am showing their approach pictorially below:

* * *

But the five non-luminary planets represent the five tattwas. When we give

importance to physical distance, the tattvas get reversed (and they get messed

up in the case of Saturn and Jupiter. It is not just reversal). For example,

Mooladhara chakra is said to represent earthy nature (bhoo tattva), but Mercury

(planet of bhoo tattva) is being given to Visuddha chakra above. Swadhishthana

chakra is said to represent watery nature (jala tattva), but Venus (planet of

jala tattva) is being given to Anahata. Why this reversal?

This reversal is coming from the fact that we are counting from Mooladhara to

Sahasrara. However, in all religious rituals involving chakras, the natural

order of invoking the chakras is different. It is

Visuddha, Anahata, Manipoora, Swadhishthana, Mooladhara, Ajna, Sahasrara

This is the natural order of invoking chakras as per rituals. Even when chakras

are mentioned in Lalita sahasra nama stotram, this is the order in which they

are mentioned! So the order used by most authors is wrong.

Also, you may note that Sg, Cp, Ar, Ta, Ge and Cn are night-strong signs

according to Parasara and taken in Moon's hora in Kashinatha Hora chart.

Similarly, Le, Vi, Li, Sc, Aq and Pi are day-strong signs according to Parasara

and taken in Sun's hora in Kashinatha hora. This discontinuity is said to be due

to a "Brahma sutra" involvind Jupiter and Saturn (I don't understand it quite

well, but this discontinuity is a fact as per Parasara's classification of

signs into day-strong and night-strong ones).

But these authors end up getting Aq, Pi, Ar, Ta, Ge and Cn for Ida (female/Moon

hora) and others for Pingala (male/Sun hora). This is incorrect for the signs

owned by Saturn and Jupiter! Thus, the above picture does not obey Parasara's

classification of day-strong and night-strong signs!

* * *

My approach is very similar to that of others, but differs in two key aspects:

(1) I put the night-strong signs together in one half and day-strong signs

together in the other half and assign them to Ida and Pingala nadis (i.e. obey

the Brahma sutra), (2) I take the natural order of chakras as used in religious

rituals and not based on any physical order.

With this approach, I get Mercury for Mooladhara chakra, which shows bhoo

tattva, Venus for Swadhshthana chakra, which shows jala tattva, and so on. Even

airy and ethery tattvas fall in place!!

To those who haven't yet got it, the following picture should make it clear:

With this, you can see that

(1) the Pingala nadi side has all the day-strong signs and Ida nadi side has all

the night-strong signs

(2) the order of the chakras is in the natural order of invocation in Hindu rituals.

(3) the tattvas fall in place. For example, visuddha chakra has ether (Jupiter),

anahata chakra has air (Saturn) and so on.

Thus, everything falls in place beautifully. I sincerely believe that this is

the correct approach and the other approach is based on faulty logic. I cannot

accept the list given by Bepin Behari.

However, I have no problem with a different list given by Sri Harish Johari. It

makes perfect sense, when you visualize the form of the Divine Mother in

various chakras and her spiritual blessings. In fact, I have given four lists

assigning various aspects of chakras to planets. The classification in the

picture above is only one of the four! Please read the previous mails if you

haven't done so already.

Disclaimer: I have done a lot of reading and thinking on this matter, but I am

certainly not an expert. So use your own discretion when getting influenced!

;-)

May Jupiter's light shine on us,

Narasimha

> Dear Gili,> Well it appears I am not alone in this line of thinking. Thanks

for the> info.> Love,> Chandrashekhar.> >

Gili Mary [xapsarax@h...]> Friday, December 05, 2003 5:50 AM>

vedic astrology> RE: [vedic astrology] Re:

Spiritual Chakras and Planets> > > Dear Chandrashekhar,> Both T.Subba Row

and Bepin Behari suggest this too. As I posted before,> it> seems so simple

and so tidy that it 'feels' right to me but I am just an> inexperienced

novice in this field.> Love,> Gili> > >Dear Narasimha,> >I am not much

in to religion interpretation per-se. But since there is an> >ongoing attempt

to relate Chakras to Planet karakatwa, would you check up> >the following and

let me know whether this logic can be applied to> >Chakra-Karaka

relationship?> >I think the Karakatwas could relate from Sun to Saturn in

descending> order> >depending distance of planets from Sun, from Saharara to

Mooladhara as> the> >locations relate to the planets in question. I may be

completely off the> >track,but could you check up.> >Regards,>

>Chandrashekhar.

Attachment: (image/gif) zodi1.GIF [not stored]

Attachment: (image/gif) zodi2.GIF [not stored]

December 7, 2003

Dear Mr. Rao,

Thanks for sharing your knowledge, the link and helping to sort this out.

My references were all from books in my collecton. I don't have them here

in hospital so will serch the web. The truth is more important to me than

being right or wrong.

Love

Gili

>http://www.sanatansociety.org/yoga_and_meditation/seven_chakras.htm

>What Bepin Behari and Subba Row apparently gave seems to be the most

>popular version on the internet. Most sites seem to associate Sun, Moon,

>Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter and Saturn with the 7 chakras (from sahasrara

>to mooladhara).

>

>Well, the motivation must be as given by Chendrashekhar ji. But this

>approach has loopholes.

_______________

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December 7, 2003

Dear Mr. Rao,

PS. Is there any reason why the karakas for the chakras may, or may not, be

connected to the pattern of lordships of the signs? Sun, Moon, Mercury,

Venus, Mars. JUpiter, Saturn?

Love,

Gili

_______________

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December 7, 2003

Dear Gili,

> The truth is more important to me than > being right or wrong.

Absolutely, same here.

More than knowing the truth, actually, it is important to know what to do with that truth! :-)

How do you use these planetary links in analyzing charts is the real key. With

all the four planetary lists I have given, I have explained my idea of how they

are to be used.

In addition to what I have already written, the picture I sent yesterday has further clues.

The Ida nadi (female) of Visuddha, Anahata, Manipoora, Swadhishthana and

Mooladhara chakras corresponds to the signs Sg (night-strong, ethery), Cp

(night-strong, airy), Ar (night-strong, fiery), Ta (night-strong, watery) and

Ge (night-strong, earthy), respectively.

The Pingala nadi (male) of Visuddha, Anahata, Manipoora, Swadhishthana and

Mooladhara chakras corresponds to the signs Pi (day-strong, ethery), Aq

(day-strong, airy), Sc (day-strong, fiery), Li (day-strong, watery) and Vi

(day-strong, earthy), respectively. > Dear Mr. Rao,> PS. Is there any reason

why the karakas for the chakras may, or may not, be > connected to the pattern

of lordships of the signs? Sun, Moon, Mercury, > Venus, Mars. JUpiter, Saturn?

Yes, there is a connection. That is what I talked about in great detail in the last mail:

vedic astrology/message/35793

vedic astrology/message/35794

Taking the zodiac in the normal way and taking the pattern of lordships leaves a

couple of absurdities like Aq and Pi being on the side of Ar, Ta, Ge and Cn

(Moon hora signs or night-strong signs, assigned to Ida/female nadi), despite

actually being day-strong signs and being associated with Le, Vi, Li and Sc

(Sun hora signs or day-strong signs, assigned to Pingala/male nadi). Also,

ether and air are reversed in the natural order of ether, air, fire, water and

earth.

If you go to

vedic astrologyChakras/

you will see two pictures, each linking signs and lordships to chakras and two

nadis in them (in two different ways - one mine and one standard).

Please read my mail carefully and look at the two pictures in the link above. I

am not arguing against associating the pattern of signs with chakras. But the

pattern has to be based on some natural things and not create any absurdities.

When we are talking about Sun/Moon bifurcation, the zodiac has a Brahma sutra

involving Saturn and Jupiter. This is like a Mobius strip kind of effect. The

natural pattern of signs is as shown by me in a picture in the link above. This

pattern partitions the zodiac into day-strong and night-strong signs and at the

same time, obeys the natural order of tattvas - ether, air, fire, water and

earth.

May Jupiter's light shine on us,

Narasimha

December 7, 2003

Dear Mr. Rao,

Thank you. I do understand though some of the vocabulary is new to me. i

am a simple soul looking for a simple answer when perhaps there isn't one.

Thank you so much for taking so much time and trouble with this. You have

guessed the next queston which was how do you use them in a chart analysis.

Forgive me for being so stubborn and thank you for your kindness to a

struggling student.

Love,

Gili

PS I also found this which if I've copied it successfully may help

http://www.anandamayi.org/devotees/jv/english/km2.htm#CHAPTER%203

>"Narasimha P.V.R. Rao" <pvr

>vedic astrology

>"Vedic Astrology Group" <vedic astrology>

>[vedic astrology] Re: Spiritual Chakras and Planets

>Sun, 7 Dec 2003 11:04:55 -0500

>

>Dear Gili,

>The Ida nadi (female) of Visuddha, Anahata, Manipoora, Swadhishthana and

>Mooladhara chakras corresponds to the signs Sg (night-strong, ethery), Cp

>(night-strong, airy), Ar (night-strong, fiery), Ta (night-strong, watery)

>and Ge (night-strong, earthy), respectively.

>

>The Pingala nadi (male) of Visuddha, Anahata, Manipoora, Swadhishthana and

>Mooladhara chakras corresponds to the signs Pi (day-strong, ethery), Aq

>(day-strong, airy), Sc (day-strong, fiery), Li (day-strong, watery) and Vi

>(day-strong, earthy), respectively.

>vedic astrology/message/35793

>vedic astrology/message/35794

>

>Taking the zodiac in the normal way and taking the pattern of lordships

>leaves a couple of absurdities like Aq and Pi being on the side of Ar, Ta,

>Ge and Cn (Moon hora signs or night-strong signs, assigned to Ida/female

>nadi), despite actually being day-strong signs and being associated with

>Le, Vi, Li and Sc (Sun hora signs or day-strong signs, assigned to

>Pingala/male nadi). Also, ether and air are reversed in the natural order

>of ether, air, fire, water and earth.

>

>If you go to

>

>vedic astrologyChakras/

>

>you will see two pictures, each linking signs and lordships to chakras and

>two nadis in them (in two different ways - one mine and one standard).

>

>Please read my mail carefully and look at the two pictures in the link

>above. I am not arguing against associating the pattern of signs with

>chakras. But the pattern has to be based on some natural things and not

>create any absurdities. When we are talking about Sun/Moon bifurcation, the

>zodiac has a Brahma sutra involving Saturn and Jupiter. This is like a

>Mobius strip kind of effect. The natural pattern of signs is as shown by me

>in a picture in the link above. This pattern partitions the zodiac into

>day-strong and night-strong signs and at the same time, obeys the natural

>order of tattvas - ether, air, fire, water and earth.

>

>May Jupiter's light shine on us,

>Narasimha

_______________

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December 7, 2003

Dear Narasimha Raoji,

Yes this approach seems to be more likely. This follows the rules of Planetary

cabinet housing pattern, and I am certain that Ajna Chakra relates to Moon.

Regards,

Chandrashekhar.

Narasimha P.V.R. Rao

[pvr (AT) charter (DOT) net]Sunday, December 07, 2003 7:32 AMVedic

Astrology Group[vedic astrology] Re: Spiritual Chakras and Planets