To Chandrashekhar: Where exactly is the challenge?: Astrological... your

[Guest guest]

Dear Chandrashekharji,

Thank you for your explanation of the difference between Adhana and

Nisheka. Perhaps in this particular case you are correct - i.e. that

from Nisheka onwards everything proceeds naturally, so the principles

of Jyotish are directly applicable from Nisheka onwards. But

nevertheless, my point still remains - i.e. in general, when natural

laws are toyed with or held in abeyance, Jyotish should not be called

upon to explain the results. Let me give some examples of what

medicine may hold for us in the future, and you (or anyone else) tell

me how Jyotish will go about explaining such events:

 

1) You are aware of gene replacement for therapeutic purposes, I

presume? i.e. the specific replacement of genes that cause deadly

diseases that have genetic origin? What if there is a time in the

near future that humans make the technological advances to select the

best genes for health and replace them in all newly fertilized

embryos? Conceivably the genes in the resulting embryo would be from

many different mothers and fathers. Who would the father and mother

be in the resulting child's chart? Genetic father, companion of one

of the genetic mothers, companion of the child-delivering mother, or

what?

 

2) You are also obviously aware of IVF (In Vitro Fertilization). I

personally know many many people who have used it, and these days it

seems to be on the rise. Of course, IVF works the same as natural

pregnancy from Nisheka onwards as you say. But the success rate of

IVF is very low (people go through 5-6 cycles at 15,000 dollars per

cycle) simply because Nisheka (embryonic attachment to uterine wall)

does not occur. What if there is a time when technological

advancement has reached the point at which the embryo is developed to

maturity outside a real woman's womb. In such a case, who would the

mother be? Especially if this technique were coupled with the one in

point 1 above (therapeutic manipulation of genes)?

 

3) Even worse, medical research does not only restrict itself to

humans. Many animals are studied to find why they do not contract

certain diseases. If genes are uncovered in animals which help fight

certain diseases in humans, and they are then correspondingly

activated in newly fertilized embryos (with the aim of improving the

resultant child's health), the child's genetic heritage will not only

include a few humans, but some animals as well. Would this be

correspondingly reflected in the child's chart as well? And if your

point if going to be that human genes are completely different from

animals, I must remind you that we shared an astounding 90% of our

genetic material with monkeys.

 

 

4) Are you aware of the huge amount of research currently going on in

the field of aging? i.e. biologically, what is the reason that our

physical body gets weaker as we grow older. Several biological causes

have been determined. Technology may reach a point in which aging can

be "cured" to a large extent i.e. the only reason you would die would

be because of an accident or malicious action of another. The average

life span (projected by at least one such article I read) can

theoretically reach 750 years or more. Would this then be in exact

correspondence to Jyotish techniques of predicting lifespan in

Kaliyug?

 

My point taking into consideration the above possibilities remains

somewhat like the following: It seems to me that Jyotish will work

well under natural circumstances. But when we start playing around

with the laws e.g. preventing someone from dying when they naturally

would or being born when they naturally would (after Adhana, that

is), the (perhaps approximate) concomitance of physical action (e.g.

birth, death) and karmic action (entering of soul, leaving of soul)

would probably be lost, causing the basic Jyotish techniques, which

are based on laws of karma and the soul, to fail. There are enough

challenges in Jyotish of natural circumstances for any student of

astrology to be wasting time in challenges which may actually break

such basic assumptions..

 

 

Sundeep

[Guest guest]

Dear Sundeep,

There is no harm in imagining future scenarios. In so far as IVF and

its success rate, even natural copulation has similar success rate. So

not much difference, or is there?

About gene manipulation and cloning, did you read that though Dolly

clone was supposed to be identical, it died much earlier than Dolly

who is still alive. So anything may be theoretically possible but when

it comes to real life situations things come out differently. Even the

much toutd BT Cotton failed in farmer's field. So may be nature has

more mysteries than science assumes it to hold.

If you feel that the tenets of jyotish would not apply in future, you

are at liberty to give up Jyotish and find other means of trying to

predict future. I am too old to change my ways and unless someone can

demonstrate that the forthcoming science made life does not follow the

law of jyotish based on time of birth, I would not accept the theories

advanced.

Chandrashekhar.

vedicastrostudent wrote:

Dear Chandrashekharji,

Thank you for your explanation of the difference between Adhana and

Nisheka. Perhaps in this particular case you are correct - i.e. that

from Nisheka onwards everything proceeds naturally, so the principles

of Jyotish are directly applicable from Nisheka onwards. But

nevertheless, my point still remains - i.e. in general, when natural

laws are toyed with or held in abeyance, Jyotish should not be called

upon to explain the results. Let me give some examples of what

medicine may hold for us in the future, and you (or anyone else) tell

me how Jyotish will go about explaining such events:

1) You are aware of gene replacement for therapeutic purposes, I

presume? i.e. the specific replacement of genes that cause deadly

diseases that have genetic origin? What if there is a time in the

near future that humans make the technological advances to select the

best genes for health and replace them in all newly fertilized

embryos? Conceivably the genes in the resulting embryo would be from

many different mothers and fathers. Who would the father and mother

be in the resulting child's chart? Genetic father, companion of one

of the genetic mothers, companion of the child-delivering mother, or

what?

2) You are also obviously aware of IVF (In Vitro Fertilization). I

personally know many many people who have used it, and these days it

seems to be on the rise. Of course, IVF works the same as natural

pregnancy from Nisheka onwards as you say. But the success rate of

IVF is very low (people go through 5-6 cycles at 15,000 dollars per

cycle) simply because Nisheka (embryonic attachment to uterine wall)

does not occur. What if there is a time when technological

advancement has reached the point at which the embryo is developed to

maturity outside a real woman's womb. In such a case, who would the

mother be? Especially if this technique were coupled with the one in

point 1 above (therapeutic manipulation of genes)?

3) Even worse, medical research does not only restrict itself to

humans. Many animals are studied to find why they do not contract

certain diseases. If genes are uncovered in animals which help fight

certain diseases in humans, and they are then correspondingly

activated in newly fertilized embryos (with the aim of improving the

resultant child's health), the child's genetic heritage will not only

include a few humans, but some animals as well. Would this be

correspondingly reflected in the child's chart as well? And if your

point if going to be that human genes are completely different from

animals, I must remind you that we shared an astounding 90% of our

genetic material with monkeys.

4) Are you aware of the huge amount of research currently going on in

the field of aging? i.e. biologically, what is the reason that our

physical body gets weaker as we grow older. Several biological causes

have been determined. Technology may reach a point in which aging can

be "cured" to a large extent i.e. the only reason you would die would

be because of an accident or malicious action of another. The average

life span (projected by at least one such article I read) can

theoretically reach 750 years or more. Would this then be in exact

correspondence to Jyotish techniques of predicting lifespan in

Kaliyug?

My point taking into consideration the above possibilities remains

somewhat like the following: It seems to me that Jyotish will work

well under natural circumstances. But when we start playing around

with the laws e.g. preventing someone from dying when they naturally

would or being born when they naturally would (after Adhana, that

is), the (perhaps approximate) concomitance of physical action (e.g.

birth, death) and karmic action (entering of soul, leaving of soul)

would probably be lost, causing the basic Jyotish techniques, which

are based on laws of karma and the soul, to fail. There are enough

challenges in Jyotish of natural circumstances for any student of

astrology to be wasting time in challenges which may actually break

such basic assumptions..

Sundeep

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Dear Dhananjaya,

Kalamadhaviam might indicate Adhana and Nisheka being the same. However

if you have heard of Garbhaadaana vidhi, the meaning of Adhana would be

clear to you. It refers to coitus. I have not contradicted what I have

said.

Chandrashekhar.

Dhananjayan Brahma wrote:

 

Mr. Sundeep,

`` Dear Chandrashekharji,

Thank you for your explanation of the difference between Adhana and

Nisheka. Perhaps in this particular case you are

correct’’

The findings of yours are a hasty statement, appended below

are the statements made by Mr.Chandrasekharji, he contradicts his own

statements, and see items marked (1)&(3). Adhana and Nisheka Lagna

in item (2) are one and the same, refer Kalamadhaviam.

(1) ``Are we not confusing the issues. The discussion refers to

fixing of

Adhana Lagna. Prediction is always based on the time of birth, per

principles of Jyotish. The soul enters one born at that time. So there

is no reason to apply different principles, in so far as prediction

based on Natal chart are concerned.’’

(2)``Adhana Lagna has also to be properly understood. It refers to

time of

coitus.It definitely is not Nisheka Lagna, though these terms are

somewhat loosely interchanged by many "

(3)``Nisheka only occurs(in case of embryo transplantation cases)

when it

(embryo) is transplanted in the recipient's uterus and when it attaches

to the uterus. From then on it would again be about 279 days for the

birth to take place. So no where are the principles, of Jyotish,

violated when you apply them to such birth, based on either Nisheka or

Birth time.As such there is no need to reinvent jyotish to suit the

new(?) techniques."

Dhananjayan.B

vedicastrostudent <vedicastrostudent >

wrote:

Dear

Chandrashekharji,

Thank you for your explanation of the difference between Adhana and

Nisheka. Perhaps in this particular case you are correct - i.e. that

from Nisheka onwards everything proceeds naturally, so the principles

of Jyotish are directly applicable from Nisheka onwards. But

nevertheless, my point still remains - i.e. in general, when natural

laws are toyed with or held in abeyance, Jyotish should not be called

upon to explain the results. Let me give some examples of what

medicine may hold for us in the future, and you (or anyone else) tell

me how Jyotish will go about explaining such events:

1) You are aware of gene replacement for therapeutic purposes, I

presume? i.e. the specific replacement of genes that cause deadly

diseases that have genetic origin? What if there is a time in the

near future that humans make the technological advances to select the

best genes for health and replace them in all newly fertilized

embryos? Conceivably the genes in the resulting embryo would be from

many different mothers and fathers. Who would the father and mother

be in the resulting child's chart? Genetic father, companion of one

of the genetic mothers, companion of the child-delivering mother, or

what?

2) You are also obviously aware of IVF (In Vitro Fertilization). I

personally know many many people who have used it, and these days it

seems to be on the rise. Of course, IVF works the same as natural

pregnancy from Nisheka onwards as you say. But the success rate of

IVF is very low (people go through 5-6 cycles at 15,000 dollars per

cycle) simply because Nisheka (embryonic attachment to uterine wall)

does not occur. What if there is a time when technological

advancement has reached the point at which the embryo is developed to

maturity outside a real woman's womb. In such a case, who would the

mother be? Especially if this technique were coupled with the one in

point 1 above (therapeutic manipulation of genes)?

3) Even worse, medical research does not only restrict itself to

humans. Many animals are studied to find why they do not contract

certain diseases. If genes are uncovered in animals which help fight

certain diseases in humans, and they are then correspondingly

activated in newly fertilized embryos (with the aim of improving the

resultant child's health), the child's genetic heritage will not only

include a few humans, but some animals as well. Would this be

correspondingly reflected in the child's chart as well? And if your

point if going to be that human genes are completely different from

animals, I must remind you that we shared an astounding 90% of our

genetic material with monkeys.

4) Are you aware of the huge amount of research currently going on in

the field of aging? i.e. biologically, what is the reason that our

physical body gets weaker as we grow older. Several biological causes

have been determined. Technology may reach a point in which aging can

be "cured" to a large extent i.e. the only reason you would die would

be because of an accident or malicious action of another. The average

life span (projected by at least one such article I read) can

theoretically reach 750 years or more. Would this then be in exact

correspondence to Jyotish techniques of predicting lifespan in

Kaliyug?

My point taking into consideration the above possibilities remains

somewhat like the following: It seems to me that Jyotish will work

well under natural circumstances. But when we start playing around

with the laws e.g. preventing someone from dying when they naturally

would or being born when they naturally would (after Adhana, that

is), the (perhaps approximate) concomitance of physical action (e.g.

birth, death) and karmic action (entering of soul, leaving of soul)

would probably be lost, causing the basic Jyotish techniques, which

are based on laws of karma and the soul, to fail. There are enough

challenges in Jyotish of natural circumstances for any student of

astrology to be wasting time in challenges which may actually break

such basic assumptions..

Sundeep

 

 

 

 

 

 

Groups Sponsor

 

 

Messenger - Communicate instantly..."Ping" your friends

today! Download

Messenger Now