Why Guru shows Dual character PART II... GUKET and SAKE

[Guest guest]

Dear Friends,

 

Self is posting some more thoughts on Guru and palnetary nodes to

explain DUAL NATURE of Guru.

Hope it would invoke some more interest outside tha ambit of BPHS .

 

 

DUAL NATURE OF GURU

 

 

Guru Bhagawan as Giver of DHI Intellectual Aura, Tejas, Brilliance of

Dhi shakti etc. is highly reveared in Vedic Astrology. His aspect

infuses life, fortifies athe Bhava he aspects and gives superior

grasping power of shastras.

 

In my last posting on Guru I have tried and posted some charts to

corroborate the dictum BHAVA NASHA KARO JEEVA, I had posted its

effects till 5th bhava. Some time back, in other postings in Another

discussion group, I had posted my findings on Guru in 7th bhava also .

 

I have found Guru in 7th bhava delaying marriages and also giving an

inclination of straying from normal marital life .It has been found

to give love marriages and Extra marital interests.

 

Guru in 8th bhava has been found to take life and give

Alpayu/Madhyayu to jatakas.

Guru in 9th has been found by me to be very detrimental to father in

a lot of cases. Father's luck starts dwindling after the jatakas are

born.

 

Guru in 10th bhava has been observed by me to give failures in

business to self and loss of property to father.

 

Guru in 11th makes a person first born or 1st male child or it

denotes miscarriage/short life to previous borns of the siblings

elder to jataka. Father is found to be eldest born or he outsurvives

all his siblings.

 

Guru in 12th bhava gives destruction of Shaiya sukham resulting in

very late marriages , remarriage and inflow of money.I have found

people with 12th Guru earning in excess and spending little.

 

Guru and Sani , always give something and take away something.

If in 9th, if a person becomes lucky, his father suffers or dies.

In second house, he gives a lot of money and then lands the man in

neck deep debts.

 

In 4th house, if he gives a house, he takes away vahana or mother or

somerthing connected with 4th house.

 

 

My whole exercise in giving examples of negetive traits of Guru is

not to demean Guru but trying to enter in an excercise to reach the

bottom of the thing and find out why GURU gives very bad results.

 

 

I have done research into the causes and found the cause to be very

simple as always. As written before, Guru takes root in a bhava and

in order to give something in aspects to other bhavas, it sucks the

inner strength of the bhava like a tube well or a wick of a lamp.In

this process some attributes of a bhava are destoyed.The examples are

already given as above.

 

The cause may lie in his ownership of Dhanur Rasi.

 

What is so special about Dhanur Rasi?

 

Dhanur is an Agni Tatwa rasi which is termed as KRURA or PITILESS .

It is the sign that falls in 9th house of kalapurusha chart.Over this

sign, a Jathaka has no control as it signifies Bhagya and Pita.

 

If Mesha is the jathaka, then Dhanur Rasi is the father. Nakshatras

in Dhanur rasi are, MOOLA, belonging to Ketu, Purvashadha of Shukra

and U.Shadha of Surya.If you think the significance of this, it

means, Father puts Atma Tatwa(Sun) in His sperms(Shukra) and thereby

reduces his own life (ketu)

..

Since only 1st pada of U.Shadha is in Dhanur Rasi, it means Father

puts only a part of his Atma tatwa in the Sperm. As he may have many

other children.

 

Guru is made the owner of this sign as the combination of Sperm,

Atma tatwa signifies Sum total of Jeeva or Life.This is why Guru is

also known as JEEVA. It may look paradoxical that a dry sign should

signify life. But it is true.

 

Why the sign is Krura? This sign is Krura because When the Ojas of

Father leaves him, he reduces his Tejas and his Atma shakti becomes

depleated or KSHINA.

 

This is a krura karma.

 

All these is ok so far.

 

But why should the Dhanur Rasi be affecting its owner so much ?

I would like to take you back to my work on Plantery Nodes .

Out of the Nodes of Guru and Sani, we are concerned with the

following nodes.

 

Jupiter'e Northen node GURA (My termonology)falls in

Gemini,17Deg.40mts in Aridra Nakshatra.

 

Jupiter'e southern node GUKE falls in Dhanur Rasi .17Deg.40 mt

in P.Shadha Nakshatra.

 

Saturn's Northern Node SARA falls in Gemini.0.Deg 56mts.

in Mrigshirsha Nakshatra.

 

Saturn's southern node SAKE falls in Dhanur Rasi.0.Deg 56.mts

Southern Node in MULA nakshatra.

 

IF YOU LOOK AT SOUTHERN NODE OF SATURN (Sani's Ketu), IT IS IN MULA

AND THIS EXPLAINS WHY MULA NAKSHATRA IS SO POISONOUS.!!!Remarkable

isn't it?

 

IF YOU LOOK AT SOUTHERN NODE OF GURU, (Ketu of Jupiter) IT IS IN

SAGGITARIUS.!!

No wonder Guru is the Lord of Knowledge and Intelligence.

 

These nodes are as good as planets in those signs. Of the above

nodes, it has been found that nodes of Mars,Jupiter and Saturn are

very important and have a remarkable effect in mundane and personal

life.

 

Since each node takes over 30,000 to 40,000 years to change a sign,

we can practically say that they do not change their fixed positions

during our lifetime.

 

Dhanur rasi is represented by A Hunter.

Dhanur Rasi has SAKE,and GUKE the southern nodes of Sani and Guru. It

also has Mula Nakshatra of Lunar southern node Ketu.

Having three Ketus power is something very very powerful thing.

 

Ketu is termed as Daruna, Tikshna,Hangman,Atirogi, Sinful planet,

karaka of Pain and suffering,Tamasika, living in cremation ground,

without any Rasa,a snake, he is very old of Vayu prakriti,Akash

Tatwa ,Headless spirit.

 

On the positive side, Ketu is Moksha karaka and Antargyani.

So when Guru becomes the lord of Dhanur Rasi, he is responsible for

imbibing the attributes of Ketus of Dhanu Rasi.

 

Imagine how will it be when there are Two Permenent Ketus in Dhanur

rasi and aspect of Sani's Rahu SARA and Guru's Rahu GURA on Dhanur

Rasi ??.

 

Compared to this, Meena Rasi which is another Rasi owned by Guru , is

totally opposite in nature more in tune with Guru's good attributes.

Hence Guru gives two types of results whenever he occupies anysign.

This result is part negetive and part positive.

 

So when we talk of Guru and his effects, we are talking of a planet

with almost exactly opposite attributes.

 

He is a hangman and a killer and at the same time Giver of Life.

He is the chief cause of disease and he is the medicine.

 

Guru is very mighty and has very benign aspect.Guru gives us oxygen

and is Jeeva.Without Guru's help, we would all be Mudha and lifeless.

Let us pray Guru with all our heart and full faith.

 

Brum Bruhaspataye Namah:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

vedic astrology, "nameisego" <nameisego>

wrote:

>

> Dear Learned Friends ,

> Self has done some work on both Rahu, Guru and Rashis which clearly

> shows there is more to it than meets the eye.

> If interested to know, undersigned can post some articles of

research

> here which may throw some light on this issue.

>

> Rgds

> Tatvam-Asi

>

>

>

>

> vedic astrology, "Sarajit Poddar"

> <sarajit@s...> wrote:

> > || Jaya Jagannath ||

> > Dear Chandrashekhar,

> >

> > Thank you for the comment from the puranas.

> > " Lord Rama had to undergo vanvaas on account of Guru in Lagna,

> Guru in third sent Bali to Patala. Guru in fourth tested Satwa of

> King Harishchandra, Guru in sixth made Draupadi face Cheerharana.

> Guru in eighth destroyed (Nasha) Ravana, Tenth house Guru killed

> Duryodhana and 12th house Guru sent Pandu to forest." It further

says

> that Bhishma was deprived of Kingdom on account of Guru in 2nd,

King

> Dasharath had to loose his Son Rama (Putrashoka) on account of Guru

> in 5th. Aja Raja had to suffer separation from his wife on account

of

> Guru in Seventh. Vishwamitra had to consume non eatables

(Abhakshya)

> on account of his Guru in 9th."

> >

> > Regards

> > Sarajit

> > -

> > Chandrashekhar

> > PNRazdan

> > Cc: Prafulla Gang ; vedic astrology

> > Wednesday, September 22, 2004 5:00 AM

> > Re: [vedic astrology] Re: 2nd house Jup in various

roles-

> -to Chandraji

> >

> >

> > Dear Razdan,

> >

> > Read BPHS again, Sage Parashara states opinion of Narada in

> Ghatika Lagna shloka, refers to opinions of the learned (not

Brahma)

> in shloka 15 Ch.11, shloka 15 Ch.12. First shloka of Bhava Pada

> Adhyaya again mentions that he is telling the special effects of

Pada

> as told by other Sages (again not Brahma). He he also mentions

> opinion of others in first shloka of Karaka Adhyaya. The great Sage

> has in almost all Adhyayas given credit to other learneds in one or

> other of the shlokas, besides what Maitreya himself said to Sage

> Parashara in the beginning of Ashtakavarga Adhyaya. In Shloka 1 of

> that Adhyaya Maitreya clearly says that Parashara has given

opinions

> of many Rishis and Acharyas. So saying that Parashara only told

what

> had been revealed to him by Lord Brahma would be showing disrespect

> to the Great sage who had the magnanimity to give credit to other

> Rishis and Acharyas.

> >

> > Since you are questioning veracity and authority of the

shlokas

> that I quoted, I would like to give you the Texts in which the

> shlokas appear. If you read Tatvapradeepjataka and Chamatkaar

> Chintamani you will find them. The first text has the shlokas and

the

> later again mentions same shlokas. If you read Chamatkar Chintamani

> further you will find Jupiter giving harm to at least one

indication

> of each of the houses/bhavas he occupies. It also mentions a shloka

> from Purana which says:

> >

> > " Lord Rama had to undergo vanvaas on account of Guru in

Lagna,

> Guru in third sent Bali to Patala. Guru in fourth tested Satwa of

> King Harishchandra, Guru in sixth made Draupadi face Cheerharana.

> Guru in eighth destroyed (Nasha) Ravana, Tenth house Guru killed

> Duryodhana and 12th house Guru sent Pandu to forest." It further

says

> that Bhishma was deprived of Kingdom on account of Guru in 2nd,

King

> Dasharath had to loose his Son Rama (Putrashoka) on account of Guru

> in 5th. Aja Raja had to suffer separation from his wife on account

of

> Guru in Seventh. Vishwamitra had to consume non eatables

(Abhakshya)

> on account of his Guru in 9th."

> >

> > I would not like to respond to your other comments but would

like

> to mention here that the group is formed with an intention of

> learning and discussing principles of astrology. I do not

> to your assumption of astrology being a rigid science not open to

> interpretation. Some of your comments are uncalled for.

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> > PNRazdan wrote:

> >

> > Dear Chandarshekhar,

> > There is nothing amusing in my reasoning. Parashara is quoting no

> > ordinary Muni but Lord Brahma himself which gave us the

> BPHS.Similarly

> > Prithuysas is quoting his father the great Vrahmihir which gave

us

> the

> > Horasastra. Equating your shaloka quoting a nameless sage (not

> sages as

> > I said earlier, but only one sage-I was incorrect because the

noun

> and

> > verb is singular) would be like showing candle to the Sun.

> > I dont think this discussion is going to serve any purpose. You

are

> not

> > prepared to reveal the origin of the shalok you are so much

> depending

> > upon. By now it seems it is something casually said to which I

> attached

> > more than necessary importance. You seem to have attained the

role

> of

> > some sort of a master in this group wanting your disciples to

hunt

> for

> > themselves what you hint at. But I dont think this is an Ashram.

> This

> > is a forum of discussion where an academic discussion takes place

> > openly without reservations. Or possibly there may be other

reasons

> for

> > you not to come out openly.

> > The moral of this story however is clear. Astrology is a science.

It

> > has a method. Under this method several books have all along

treated

> > Jup as a benefic planet and all interpretations are based on this

> > principle with modifications depending on its functionality,

place,

> > lordship, strength etc etc. If you now put forth a crazy idea that

> > Jupiter is a malefic or malefic like planet ( destroys the house

it

> is

> > placed in), it turns the science from a method into a madness. It

> will

> > put doubts into the minds of all astrologists while interpreting

its

> > effects, particularly on young minds aspiring to learn jyotish.

> Already

> > I see a discussion started on these lines on this group which in

my

> > opinion is energy wasted on a wrong notion. Everytime one sees

Jup

> in a

> > house, a doubt will arise as to whether it is good or bad. Some

will

> > associate it with good they had in that house and others with

> whatever

> > bad they had.

> >

> > So if you are determined to reap cheap publicity by making

radical,

> > unauthenticated and unconventional "advices", you may do so as

this

> is

> > a free forum. But the least I can say is that this would be the

> > greatest disservice to the field of Vedic Astrology.

> > My humble suggestion to learned members would be to accept any

> advice

> > only after their own study and research and use dependable

> commentators

> > like Raman, Rao etc.for clarifications. It would be fair to treat

> any

> > advice seriously only if it is backed up by its source so as to

make

> > independent verification possible unless the author says it to be

> his

> > own research/ experience.

> >

> > Chandarshekharji, so let us decide to close this discussion as

> friends

> > (not by coincidence are we both having Jup as lagnesh).

> > So far I didnot discuss specifics with you since I was on a

> headlines

> > discussion.

> > Let me now respond to your last two queries.The reference to Jup

in

> the

> > Second house discussion of BPHS has to be read in totality i.e

all

> the

> > three shalokas 1,2 and 3 and not the 3rd only. Let me give a gist

of

> > each here

> > First shaloka: Dhanesh in second, quadrants, trines is

> dhanvridhikarak

> > (wealth giving) in 6,8,12 opposite.

> > Second Shaloka: Benefics in 2nd house, conjunct or aspected by

> > benefics- wealth giving. Malefics in 2nd house opposite effect.

> Nowhere

> > is jupiter separated out as you claim to be.So long as it is

known

> as a

> > benefic, it qualifies to be a wealth giver according to this

> shaloka.

> > Third Shaloka: If 2nd lord is Jupiter and is also posited in the

> same

> > house. And if Mars is also placed with it, then the subject

becomes

> > wealthy. Period.

> > This does not mean that if Mars is not there, Jupiter alone will

> harm

> > the house. This is an implication which you are trying to make out

> > probably to make your Muni's dictum hold good. Parashara never

> means

> > it. He means to say that while a swagrahi jupiter in second is

> enough

> > to make one rich but with Mars there it adds to ones wealth. Mark

> the

> > sanskrit words "Vapi" meaning 'in addition".

> > And then you are contradicting your own self since even without

> Mars,

> > Jupiter would still be swagrahi which as per your shaloka is not

> bad.

> > So why Mars becomes necessary to support?

> > As regards your second point, I am unfortunately not getting the

> > shaloka since I have a different edition. There is no chapter on

> > Kakshya and I took it as Karkanshya Phal Adhyay which has no

shalok

> > wanting Jup to have support of benefics to give good results.

> > Sorry for the long mail. Regards

> > Pran Razdan

> >

> >

> > --- Chandrashekhar <boxdel> wrote:

> >

> >

> > Dear Razdan,

> > I am amused at the reasoning put forward by you that if some

author

> > quotes some other authority, he is not an authority on the

subject.

> > If

> > that be so all those you treat as authorities, including

Parashara,

> > Varahamihira (By the way I have not heard of Mantracharya) would

> also

> > be

> > reduced to the status of ignoramus. All of those who are treated

as

> > authorities have given opinions of others by either referring to

> > their

> > names or saying precisely what the shloka says that is "so say

> > Munis".

> > So rest assured none of the Acharyas and Pravartakas will tremble

> at

> > what I have stated. The reason I am not giving the name of the

> > authority

> > is I want people to read various texts and find out for

themselves.

> > There are numerous texts and it takes time to remember the name

of

> > author of each and every shloka one quotes is the other reason.

> > If you do not want to read commentaries, your choice of

> astrological

> > texts would be reduced to almost one or two as every author of

> note,

> > states at the beginning of his text that he is only telling what

> > others

> > have told before him in a more concise form, including Varaha

> Mihira.

> >

> > Maitreya also asks Parashara that as he has till now told

principles

> > of

> > astrology on the basis of what others have told he should give a

> > relatively easy method so that transit of planets could be used

for

> > prediction by those slow of grasp in the chapter on Ashtakavarga

in

> > BPHS.

> >

> > Could you explain the reason of shloka3 Chapter 13 of BPHS? What

is

> > the

> > reason for Parashara to qualify Jupiter's being Lord of the 2nd

> when

> > placed in 2nd or needing to be with Mars there to make one

wealthy,

> > implying that Jupiter in other cases by its mere presence in 2nd

> > would

> > not be capable of conferring wealth on one. I hope you do not

> dispute

> >

> > knowledge of Parashara himself or think he is quoting without

> > authority.

> > While at BPHS you may also like to reason out why CH.43 shloka 48

> > tells

> > that for Jupiter to give Kakshya Vridhi it has to be aspected by

a

> > benefic when in Lagna or 7th house. Think why Jupiter by himself

> does

> >

> > not give Kakshya Vriddhi in longevity.

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> > PNRazdan wrote:

> >

> >

> > Dear Chandarshekhar,

> >

> > As already informed I have already read the shalok quoted by you

in

> > support of your contention.

> >

> > jIv> SvSwanhNta vdit muinvra +iòrSy àzSta,

> > saEir SvSwanpal> prmÉykir +iòrSy ànòa.

> >

> > But please understand, this shaloka by itself does not establish

the

> > thesis you are trying to put forward. It has to be backed up by

the

> > author, his standing in the astrological field, the time when it

was

> > said and the context in which it was said. Literally translated,

the

> > Shalok means "Guru destroys the house it is placed in and

dignifies

> >

> > the

> >

> > house it aspects, so say the sages. Saturn protects the house it

is

> >

> > in

> >

> > while its dangerous aspect destroys it". Mark the words "vdit

> >

> > muinvra"

> >

> > i.e.so say the sages. This means that this shaloka too is somebody

> > else's quote and not that of its author. Who is the author of this

> > blatant theory after all?

> >

> > Chandarshekharji, you are making an important and revolutionary

> > statement which if followed shall change the entire structure of

> >

> > Vedic

> >

> > Astrology. (I am sure Parasara, Varamihir, Mantracharya all must

> >

> > have

> >

> > stumbled in swargloka after hearing this shaloka). You have

> >

> > therefore

> >

> > to back it up equally strongly. Sanskrit shalokas can be written

by

> > anybody, even a primary class student studying sanskrit. It does

not

> > mean we should accept any shalok blindly simply because it is

> >

> > written

> >

> > in sanskrit.

> >

> > At one stage you said this is a shaloka and we need not go into

its

> > reasoning. OK but tell us the name of the author who is so

respected

> >

> > in

> >

> > this field that we donot question his authority.

> > In your other mail you have advised me to read commentaries of Pt.

> > Gopeshkumar Oza and Pt. Kedardatt Joshi. Why should I read

> >

> > commentaries

> >

> > and not the original shalokas if I know sanskrit very well.

> >

> > So, as a learned Guru please favour all of us with the background

> > information on the shaloka complete with your masterly reasoning

why

> > you are so convinced of its truth and applicability in the lives

of

> > human beings.

> > I shall not go into the discussion of individual charts as it is

> >

> > common

> >

> > knowledge that results depend on many factors. If you are now

> >

> > holding

> >

> > Jup responsible for any bad thing that happened in the lives of

> >

> > these

> >

> > people, then the debate would be endless. Besides Lakshmi has very

> > nicely handled this issue and replied the post point by point.

> >

> > Pran Razdan

> >

> > --- Chandrashekhar <boxdel> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Dear Razdan,

> > I have already given the relevant shloka and others have given

> >

> > other

> >

> > shlokas too. I have already advised you to go through the archives

> > but

> > it appears you have not done so. Have you found shloka about

> > Jupiter's

> > position in certain Rasis giving problems in progeny at least?

> >

> > You have mentioned many personalities, how much do you know about

> > their

> > personal lives to say that Jupiter has not harmed the house that

> > occupies? Does A.B. Vajpayee has his own family? Check up. Also

> >

> > check

> >

> > up

> > what lata Mangeshkar did to her sister to understand what Guru in

> > Lagna

> > can do.

> >

> > I have not made any sweeping statement. If you read the list, many

> > have

> > agreed to what I have said from their own experience. I have also

> > said

> > that one has to apply the dictum in proper perspective to get

> >

> > correct

> >

> > results. For this one has to know all the dictums, like all

planets

> > give

> > good results in own house and all planets are capable of giving

> >

> > good

> >

> > results in 11th house. I think I have written umpteen times that

no

> >

> > principle can be applied on standalone basis but has to be applied

> > after

> > taking into consideration all variables.

> > The case mentioned by dear Lakshmi have Jupiter in own house or

> > Saturn

> > who protects the house is also conjunct Jupiter, if I remember

> >

> > right.

> >

> > The dictum being Sthana Bhrashta karoti JeevaH , sthana rakshati

> > mandaH,

> > the results that are stated to be obtained are in keeping with the

> > dictum.

> > Chandrashekhar.

> >

> >

> > PNRazdan wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Dear Chandrashekhar,

> > I have been reading your posts on this subject all along but

> >

> > failed

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > to

> >

> >

> >

> > get your source of conviction.

> > We all agree that Jup too has its unfavourable positions and

> >

> >

> >

> > traits.

> >

> >

> >

> > We know it is a stronger Maraka, we also know that it is a

> >

> >

> >

> > functional

> >

> >

> >

> > malefic in Taurus, Libra, Capri etc laganas. We also know that it

> >

> >

> >

> > gets

> >

> >

> >

> > KP dosh in quadrant lordship, although KPdosh means only holding

> > beneficial/malefic qualities, nothing more, but we extend the

> >

> >

> >

> > argument

> >

> >

> >

> > further by making them good or bad. These are well established

> >

> >

> > === message truncated ===

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > _______________________________

> >

> > Express yourself with Y! Messenger! Free. Download now.

> > http://messenger.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Group info: vedic-

astrology/info.html

> >

> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-

>

> >

> > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Sponsor

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

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