Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 || Hare Rama Krishna || Dear Rosemary, Namaskar. Before you make suggestions please consider that it means different things for different people and different backgrounds. While I already said, we should not be addicted to free resources always, I do not agree with your comment that "You get what you pay for". Here the situation is guru-sishya or college tuition ? It depends on perspective. What we receive from Guru is what we cannot pay for. Tuition of $1100/year is something I cannot afford at present. I have invested a significat amount of savings in books and MP3's already. Even in case of scholarship, I may not be able to give back what is desired in terms of involvement, physical helps etc. And you cannot suggest scholarship to every poor student, would you?. The figure is important and must have been set in order to build and run an institution in US where the economic equations are different than in India or Africa, say. However the involvement and sharing or knowledge by the Guru's in the list is entirely philanthropic and of a different cause. That is why I have every praise (and constructive criticism) for SJC's operations. We have to do our own sadhana in our own ways. The questions you raised earlier were different. It was about SJCERC and that is why I commented. SJCERC doesn't seem to be active for a long period. We all know to start SJC and make it into a world organization there are plenty of teething troubles and will also be there in future. We were very enthusiastic when SJCERC started. Without being too involved in your perspective, why don't you also try to understand other's perspectives and realities. I hope you don't take me in the wrong/hurtful way. Best wishes, Sourav ================================================================== , "Rosemary Innes-Jones" <rf.innes-jones wrote: > > Om Brihaspataye Namah > > Dear Sourav, > If you are still interested , JIVA has scholarships. Look on line and see what is said. There may be something you can offer in return. www.jiva.us > > > The price is very cheap for what you get, and the old lawful adage "You get what you pay for" is worth considering. > > Yes the volume of material, the books that have been written already and are coming, all the mails on the lists are huge...........almost too much. > The founding universal Advaita principals from the beginning is what helps with this as the simplicity keeps the order in the focus. > Visti's work. like all the SJC gurus is enormous, so what would help? > Patience. perhaps.Sadhana and Quiet reflection.Truth shines in many ways. > > Best wishes > > Rosemary Innes-Jones > Vishvamitra > SJC New Zealand > - > Sourav > > Monday, May 15, 2006 11:02 AM > [Om Krishna Guru] SJCERC/JIVA + > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > Dear Michal and Rosemary, > > Namaskar. I have this question too. I was registered for SJCERC and later lost interest as there was no interaction for a period of time. There are several fora and blogs launched that are forgotten after some time and a new venture is started this makes life of a sincere student difficult. For JIVA, I am interested but I find the price too much for myself. I know we shouldn't be addicted to free resources but then its not possible for me to pay for this course. I have to rely on a few resources I will list them below: > > 1. Narasimha-ji's, Visti-ji's and Sanjay-ji's Mp3 classes. There is a lot of variation of standard. Some content may be too advanced and and some regular, so the consistent, step-by-step approach is difficult (personal experience only). But I am grateful to all of them for providing these free and regularly. > > 2. Blogs like Sarajit Poddar's (varamamihira.blogspot.com) and Swee-ji's website (brihaspati.net) which gives a wealth of classical information for ready reference. > > 3. Mp3 lectures of conferences. > > 4. Text books of classics and SJC authors. Books are such things that cannot be replaced by any amount of mp3's and web resources. > > These sources have a very wide scope and if consistenly read will make one a very good astrologer no doubt. But sometimes we don't take the step by step approach and that hurts the rythym of learning. I am sorely lacking this consideration and I have promised myself that when I get a 2-3 months period I will totally dedicate to organizing all of this, but I do not have that time at present. > > I would like to know what Visti-ji's learning experience is. He seems to be very methodical and organized in his approach. > > Rosemary, there is a term called adhibhuta in sanskrit but I am not understanding your context in order to explain. There is another term called anubhuti. Which one are you looking for ? > > Best wishes, > > Sourav > > ================================================================== , Michal Dziwulski nearmichal@ wrote: > > > > [ Hare Rama Krsna ] > > > > Dear Rosemary, > > > > >Dont all the students converse on a SJCERC list? > > > > No, they do not. There has been no activity on this list for over a year now. > > > > >Just out of curiosity, what do you see is missing for your SJCERC course here? > > > > Ahh, I think you are missing a very basic point about exams. If there is no material being issued, no one contacting you, and no course available to overseas students, then how could I possibly sit an exam? > > > > Please can we end this ridiculous suggestion that SJCERC is widely available and I am somehow ignoring it, or finding something missing in it. > > > > > > > > We all have knowledge, and there is a lot of information out there that is not widely available. What is of interest is information and knowledge that will help to transform us, that will help to break our habits, help awaken us to the elegance that exists. Something we can use. If you can share some of this, then everyone who wants to will appreciate it. > > > > Respectfully, > > Michal > > > > [ Om Namo Narayanaya ] > > > > Rosemary Innes-Jones rf.innes-jones@ wrote: Om Brihaspataye Namah > > > > Dear Michal, > > Yes, Please let us all understand. If at any time you want to do the SJCERC exam. There IS AN EXAM . Why shouldnt it be done in New Zealand? The activity factor is between you and SJCERC. Just out of curiosity, what do you see is missing for your SJCERC course here? Dont all the students converse on a SJCERC list? > > > > Yes,These are interesting questions on Karma, and shakti and Buddhi, they promote good research and much deep consideration. Sanjayji is writing on Shakti at the moment in regard to drishti, see Raths Rhapsody Rath�s Rhapsody it is copywrite to JIVA. > > > > My credentials dont include professor in vedic studies, much that I may like them to be! The source is conversations of His Holiness Shankaracharya Shantananda Saraswati of Jyotir Math He is my Diksha guru, so there is a lot of faith in them from my heart, I guess. > > > > Regardless of this, on this forum we should be able to consider these suggestions, to carefully penetrate them , check out other references and sift out the chaffe, to reveal the gold hidden . > > > > A Shankaracharya's words are never given lightly, and are given for this time, and this age.This makes them very powerful yet easier to absorb. Some of the things I quote are not yet freely available , even to Sanjay Rath . So perhaps that in itself is a good lesson for me. > > > > Never the less, What we hear from them is up to us, and our own karma to hear. For something to be true, it should line up in all 4 sources. Sruti, Smriti, Mahaparusha ( a self-realised sage ) and abhunuti ( undoubting consonance from the individual) > > > > Note to Sourav= Is it in sanskrit - abhunuti or adhibhuta ?? > > > > > > There will be good reason for your questions Michal, nothing happens by chance, and i thankyou, as it has made me look at my own words and see their error. Rosemary's not Shankaracharya's. > > > > More Later........ > > > > Best Wishes > > > > Rosemary Innes-Jones > > Vishvamitra > > SJC New Zealand > > > > - > > Michal Dziwulski > > > > Sunday, May 14, 2006 4:53 PM > > Re: [Om Krishna Guru] JIVA -a vote for conscious study > > > > > > [ Hare Rama Krsna ] > > > > Dear Rosemary, > > > > As I said earlier in this thread, there does not seem to be any SJCERC activity available to students outside India and Serbia. I may be wrong. Certainly there is no activity in New Zealand. So it is not because I do not wish to do an exam, but that there is no exam. Please understand. > > > > Regarding the information about children not having any karma, but taking part in their parents karma - who or what is the source of this? To delineate results from a childs birthchart, should we be looking at their parent's horoscopes? > > > > What do you mean by "At 16 the being has all the shakti to meet the karma he has earned"? How could we verify this? Is there some way to do it in analysing the chart? > > > > Why does Buddhi kick in at 16? I realise this correlates to the natural age of Jupiter, but there are many children that display a high level of intelligence (and ability to respond) before this age. > > > > Sorry for all the questions, and specifics, but I just am not the kind of person that can take such statements for truth until I understand why. There are many views on Shakti, Karma and Buddhi from many different people and interpretaions of Vedas, and many are different. If someone can give a viable explanation then I will believe it. But I will not believe it blindly. > > > > Respectfully, > > Michal > > > > [ Om Namo Narayanaya ] > > > > Rosemary Innes-Jones rf.innes-jones@ wrote: Om Brihaspataye Namah > > > > OM BRIHASPATAYE NAMAH > > > > Dear Michal, > > Ok . so you dont want to do the SJCERC exams, but maybe following up officially on the course can fix any confusion .Good Luck. > > > > Whatever is happening around the age of 16 physically, is not what I am talking about. > > > > It is about Karma, and taking responsibility, for our actions. > > responsibility=ability to respond. > > At 16 the being has all shakti to meet the karma he has earnt. Before that the karma is of the parents.Buddhi takes sometimes till 19 to fully mature, but it kicks in from 16.For me at 16 I suddenly had this huge desire to be awake, and ran around jumping out of perfectly good aeroplanes, in an attempt to realise I was!! )) > > Study did not even feature unless it was passing flying or Jumping Instructor exams!! > > > > yes i have seen 2 sons grow through this age and hundreds through my youth training programme, but what I have shared with you is knowledge from the vedas, from Shankaracharya of Jyotir Math Conversations specifically on education. It rung a bell in Delhi for me with Guruji also when he was teaching , and he agreed about matri-kaa. The point was here about Jupiter , having the natural age of 16 which is what we are taught and I linked it to this issue of wanting independent study. I shall try to find the exact quote, but maybe Visti can help. He may have even been there. > > > > Hope this helps > > Best Wishes > > > > Rosemary Innes-Jones > > SJC New Zealand > > Vishvamitra > > - > > Michal Dziwulski > > > > Saturday, May 13, 2006 4:56 PM > > Re: [Om Krishna Guru] JIVA -a vote for conscious study > > > > > > [ Hare Rama Krsna ] > > > > Dear Rosemary, > > > > I probably would have made it to Serbia last year for an exam if I had known about it and I had won a lottery a week prior. I think that programme has had real success in Serbia and perhaps India, from what I can gather. But you don't need to bother anybody in Novi Sad about it, I'll just keep on. Thanks. > > > > I think there is a plethora of physiological activity occuring at around the age of 16. I noticed a few things, though I don't know about 'lights going out'. Though honing charachter and buddhi activating seems familiar. You have seen three children go through this age, so maybe it is your experience. > > > > Respectfully, > > Michal > > > > [ Om Namo Narayanaya ] > > > > Rosemary Innes-Jones rf.innes-jones@ wrote: Om Brihaspataye Namah > > > > Dear Michal, > > > > JIVA can be enrolled in at any time. I only enrolled 7 days ago, and I have had the conference call, the material received the passwords and got the homeworks all within a few days. The System has been specifically designed for the distance learner, whereas SJCERC has not. For JIVA you dont have to be a wiz at the computer either, and the course assumes the student is unfamiliar with even the most basic sanskrit terms like veda!! > > > > I do not understand what is happening with SJERC, as I know 2nd year students in Serbia are having their exams on 15th June, this year. It was this that created the problem initially for getting Zoran and Sanjay out to New Zealand in May06. Whilst in London in March I came across a student who also had enrolled in SJCERC , but had not had any activity either. In his case I dont think he had even the material, but this may have changed by now, and he is probably turning up in Serbia to sit his exams!! > > I can only suggest asking through your Guru Vistiji what is happening. Certainly I will ask on your behalf when I am there in Novi Sad if you would like. Perhaps I can arrange to get the exams done here in Gulf Harbour, with Wentworth College .They are registered with Cambridge . Would this help? Do you know of any other SJCERC student in New Zealand? > > > > From my Advaita studies16, is a special point in the life of a human being. I think it is related to the 16 matrika, 16 shaktis. It is here that a being starts earning and paying for Karma. some have described it as "the light going out" Did you notice anything at that time yourself? Before this, education is a case of preserving the intelligence, whereas after this point it is more a case of honing charachter. A much harder task, and is why education of our children , especially from 4 1/2 to 16years is of supreme importance. All the shaktis are in place by 16 and the being then starts to expend this energy. At the time of turning 16, a persons Buddhi starts operating. > > > > Yes, I remember Sanjay saying these ages as you have described, but I remember them more as flavours of the mind. My reference to Jupiter is more related to Karma. > > > > Hope this helps > > Best Wishes > > > > Rosemary Innes-Jones > > SJC New Zealand > > Vishvamitra > > > > > > - > > Michal Dziwulski > > > > Saturday, May 13, 2006 11:56 AM > > Re: [Om Krishna Guru] JIVA -a vote for conscious study > > > > > > [ Hare Rama Krsna ] > > > > Dear Rosemary, > > > > There has been no activity in SJCERC for almost a year now, as far as I am aware. There is a wealth of material available however and I am trying to work my way through it in as ordered a fashion as I can muster. I owe so much to Visti for his contribution, but so does virtually everyone participating on this list. > > > > As long as the organisation continues to serve the furthering of this great science, as it has done as far as I can see, then all will benefit. Difficulties arise when people are self-serving. > > > > I was using the natural age of Venus with regard to the impact on knowledge which is from an article in JD some time ago. > > > > 0-4 - Moon > > 5-14 - Mercury > > 15-22 - Venus > > 23-41 - Sun > > 42-56 - Mars > > 57-68 - Jupiter > > 69-108 - Saturn, Rahu, and Ketu > > > > Respectfully, > > Michal > > > > [ Om Namo Narayanaya ] > > > > Rosemary Innes-Jones rf.innes-jones@ wrote: Om Brihaspataye Namah > > > > Dear Michal, > > Forgive me, but arent you studying SJERC material and are attended by your Guru, Vistiji? If this is the case then you are one of the extremely blessed. > > > > From your posts, , I see a lot of conscious study being done, and you are extremely hardworking. What you are doing is working perfectly.To borrow your phrase, about prefering to find out "who or what I am " rather than titles, it is the discovery of this which is what I mean by conscious. All the SJC materials, the Cd.s and the discussions and most especially our SJC Gurus who give so much of their time promote this discovery of consciousness in us. What I personally found from following the JIVA programme, was new and refreshing insight from its simplicity. This created order for this mind, and opened up what has been recognised before. Rather than pouring knowledge in, as what passes for education these days, JIVA tries to come from uncovering the existing knowledge ..........that we all have. > > > > > > Why I shared this on this most eminent list of dedicated Jyotishi's , was because often when new people come to this study, we give them the books and show them the lists, and unless they are as hardworking as yourself, they give up as it appears to be far too complex and confusing. Unless we can recognise ourselves , our true self, in our study it becomes a dry intellectual thing. Then often the interest wanes.The student who enrolled upon my reccomendation, is delighted as although she has been on a SJC list ( Not Visti's) for 3 years, she is learning from simple Advaita principles first. Maybe its the timing , but JIVA seems to suit her. It fits with her 30 years meditation and Shankya philosophy. So the "vote" for JIVA , goes alongside all the "votes" for study on all the SJC lists! The > > fact that this non-profit organisation has been set up to fund Jyotish research and Jyotish publications that all of us enjoy, should also be supported, dont you think? > > > > In regard to your chart questions, I will look at it over the next few days. Natural age of Jupiter i thought was 16. > > > > hope this helps, > > Best wishes and warm regards > > > > Rosemary Innes--Jones > > SJC New Zealand > > Vishvamitra > > > > - > > Michal Dziwulski > > > > Friday, May 12, 2006 2:45 PM > > Re: [Om Krishna Guru] JIVA -a vote for conscious study > > > > > > [ Hare Rama Krsna ] > > > > Dear Rosemary, > > > > Indeed Jiva is a Godsend. Unfortunately, I think I missed the boat for enrolling. Which may not be an entirely conscious decision, if I may borrow the term, but something perhaps more destined in the stars. > > > > Recently I examined my D24 chart. It has Aquarius rising with Venus in MKS in the 6th house. Venus owns the 4th house of formal education as well as the 9th house of higher studies, so naturally these houses suffer. And suffer they have. When I saw this combination all the struggle I had experienced in high school and University became abundantly clear, and I realised that more informal, personal and self disciplined teachings were more suited to me. > > > > In a way it feels like a bit of a shame, because I am very attracted to the titles, logos and credentials that all these formal institutions have to offer, including Jiva, but I always just try to remember that for me it is not about the organisation and the letters after a name, but about who (or what!) I am, and what good I can do with this knowledge. So, with the books I revere, the audio material available, and the discussions between students and gurus on the lists, I'll persevere. > > > > My birth details - 7th May 1981, 3:15am, Warsaw, Poland. > > > > respectfully, > > Michal Dziwulski > > B.A. History and Philosophy > > > > [ Om Namo Narayanaya ] > > > > Rosemary Innes-Jones rf.innes-jones@ wrote: > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah > > JIVA- A vote for Conscous Learning !! How blessed are we! > > To all those keen Jyotish learners, > > > > Nothing beats the presence and attendance of a Jyotish guru, to learn from our great parampara tradition. For those fortunate enough to learn at their guru's feet and attend a class, you have been extremely blessed. > > HOWEVER- for those of us learning from a distance, like me who is 000's of miles from just about anywhere, Sanjay has started JIVA and SJERC. > > The latest impulse, JIVA( www.jiva.us ) I recently joined as a student. I have been truly amazed at the depth of advanced material delivered . Always in simple yet universal, and spiritual form that is given in just the first two sessions. For me who has studied Jyotish for many years, (I think it is about 6!!) and attended many SJC conferences worldwide, ......................It is a Godsend!! > > > > The reason is, is that JIVA finally puts all that golden knowledge into conscious order!! Willa, who delivers the course , is very thorough by nature, and she has managed to work ,work and work with the JIVA team , on guruji's dictims until the order is refined and defined. The Guna and Tattwas take precedence, so the more universal leads , Samashti to the Vyashti NOT the other way around as in so many other courses available today in vedic astrology. This is the true direction of jyotish, as it establishes Advaita from the beginning and then differentiates. It is also why the actual presence of your teacher will be much more easily effective. Somehow some gift from the Rishis has blessed JIVA, as i have found deep and conscious learning > > taking place, despite the distance. Sanjay and his JIVA team seem to have achieved almost the impossible, as every subtle gap in my knowledge is being nourished to reveal deep understanding beneath. We are up to session 3 and planets have not yet been covered!! Session two included Panchanga, with the play of Tattwas and gunas amongst vara, Tithi, nakshatra, Yoga and Karana.!! > > > > Some may ask how can this be beginner material? > > Well the Rishis have the last word, as I found all the students keeping up with Guruji on our weekend conference call!! > > It also means all the conscious study that everyone on this list and others , have done has helped bring this great fruit of the tradition into being!! JIVA is a whole new impulse for SJC and it is a very great credit to those who have gone before, and those with it today. Already I have reccomended the course to other students, and they too have enroled and come under the care of its impulse. When you study on your own, so far away, it is not always easy to keep the BIG picture and Guruji's shakti in view. JIVA does this with its structure, its content, and its delivery. Even the On line Powerpoint displays follow the same flow of consciousness, and a student can replay the lecture, whilst pulling up all his charts that promote a question. Yes, there are > > some advantages of this modern age! But for me the real test came when i listened to Guruji on the conference call. ( 1:30am NZlocal time, Kali's hour) I heard the questions and the understanding from beginner students from all around the world.It was breathtaking!! As Sanjay being Sanjay delivered a brilliant explaination of guna and dharma, that I am STILL thinking about, yet one student clicked with instantly!! > > > > I hope those of you who read this, know of keen spiritual learners of Jyotish that need this foundation grounding, and will reccomend JIVA. By doing this you are honouring not only Guruji, and SJC but the Rishi's that have so clearly been the vidya behind it. > > > > May Jagannath continue to Bless Our studies > > In grateful thanks, > > > > Rosemary Innes-Jones > > SJC New Zealand > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Vedic astrology Sjc Jyotish > > > > > > > > Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1�/min. > > > > > > > > Mail goes everywhere you do. Get it on your phone. > > > > > > > > Love cheap thrills? Enjoy PC-to-Phone calls to 30+ countries for just 2�/min with Messenger with Voice. > > > > > > > > Love cheap thrills? Enjoy PC-to-Phone calls to 30+ countries for just 2�/min with Messenger with Voice. > > > > ~ om tat sat ~ > > Thank you for maintaining the decorum of the Achyuta Ashram. > > Reminders: (1) Recite the Shadakshari Mantra 'Hare Rama Krishna' > > (2) Try to become Vegetarian - remember Akbar the Great who said that the human stomach should not become a graveyard for animals. > > (3) Practise charity in thought and deed - do one free chart reading today > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Vedic astrology Sjc Jyotish > > > > > > > > > > > > Visit your group "" on the web. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > New Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from your PC and save big. > > > > > > > ~ om tat sat ~ > Thank you for maintaining the decorum of the Achyuta Ashram. > Reminders: (1) Recite the Shadakshari Mantra 'Hare Rama Krishna' > (2) Try to become Vegetarian - remember Akbar the Great who said that the human stomach should not become a graveyard for animals. > (3) Practise charity in thought and deed - do one free chart reading today > > > > Vedic Vedic astrology Sjc > Jyotish > > > ------\ ------ > > > a.. Visit your group "" on the web. > > b.. > > > c.. Terms of Service. > > > ------\ ------ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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