Guest guest Posted April 22, 2005 Report Share Posted April 22, 2005 Namaste, I can understand 2 for vak ( speech), 5 for higher knowledge, 8 for Goodh/occult vidya. Why 11 ? .... On 4/22/05, Sourav Chowdhury <sourav12 wrote: > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > Dear Pandit-ji, > Namaste. No we are talking specifically about what > can make a native a successful astrologer (success in divination; > its not material success in earning from astrology). These > considerations are only for D-1 and D-24. > > Regards, > > Sourav > ==================================================================== > vedic astrology, Panditji <navagraha@g...> > wrote: > > Namaste, > > > > 2,5,8,11 these are bhavas looked for dhana yogas. Are you using the > > word "successful" in terms of money ? > > > > ... > > > > On 4/22/05, Sourav Chowdhury <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > > > Dear Pathak-bhai, > > > Namaskar. Your 5-points on 11H and AK are fine > and > > > we already discussed them extensively. Remember that 11 is only > one > > > of the houses in the 2,5,8,11 houses that we have to see for a > > > successful jyotishi. See the keyword here is to have > *successful*. A > > > very strong combination of 5th and 8th without 11th can give a > > > native with strong interest in jyotisha/occult but not > necessarily > > > make him a successful one. It has also to involve 2H (vak > siddhi) > > > and 11 h (success and wisdom). So please dont focus strongly on > 11H > > > alone. This that I am telling is what I learnt from Guru > Narasimha- > > > ji's classes. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Sourav > > > > ==================================================================== > > > > > > vedic astrology, "utpal pathak" > > > <vedic_pathak> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Souravji & Parthaji, > > > > > > > > I was thinking a lot on the issue of 11th house placement of > > > Atmakarak > > > > & learning of Jyotish, for last half an hour. > > > > as i have already written in my previous mail that I am not > > > > understanding the much importance given to 11th house for the > > > subject > > > > of Astrlogy (Occult) though only thing was obvious that it is > a > > > 4th > > > > house from 8th and a Panafar as well as Upachaya. > > > > > > > > but I have found a good reasoning by which i can technically > > > accept > > > > the rule which is described as under > > > > > > > > as we know that > > > > 1) Panafar are the house of seeing future i.e 2nd, 5th, 8th & > > > 11th. > > > > as it is said that connection of the above houses may generate > > > > interest in astrology and allied studies. > > > > > > > > 2)Atmakarka is the king of a chart. it Represents the > > > > Direction/desire of one's atma > > > > > > > > 3)Primary Argala's are 2nd, 4th & 11th > > > > > > > > 4)8th House is a basic & pivotal house for occult knowledge > such > > > as > > > > astrology. > > > > > > > > 5)11th house beside being a house of Fructification of > desires, > > > also > > > > the 4th (Learning) house from 8th (Jyotisha Shastra) > > > > > > > > Now if we combined the above 5 points than very intresting > product > > > > comes out of the fusion. i.e 11th house gets connected with > all > > > the > > > > above points. The most important point in favour of 11th house > is > > > > that it can only Cause Argala(Conclusive interference) to th > 8th > > > > house. the other Panfar namely 2nd, 5th can not cause argala > to > > > 8th > > > > and 5th even causes virodh argala. > > > > > > > > With the above explanation to myself, I can now without dowbt > > > accept > > > > the rule of Atmakarka in 11th and intrest in jyotish or any > other > > > > occult knowledge. > > > > > > > > will be hapy to know your views. > > > > > > > > best regards > > > > > > > > Utpal > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "V.Partha sarathy" > > > > <partvinu@g...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sourav > > > > > > > > > > The basis of all the divisional charts is a Modulo, for > example > > > d- > > > > 20, > > > > > 20/12=8 thus 8th house is the seed for d-20 > > > > > Similarly, for d-16, 16/12, remainder is 4, Thus fourth > house is > > > > the > > > > > basis of d-16, that is the chart for sukha. > > > > > Now for d-24, 24/12= Remainder is 0, which should be taken > as 12 > > > > > itself and thus 12th house represents the Para Vidya. > > > > > > > > > > 4th house represents the school till 12th class.in siddhamsa > > > > > 9th represents undergraduate > > > > > 2nd house-post graduation > > > > > 7th house-doctoral > > > > > 12th house -post doctoral. > > > > > > > > > > Now this is for mundane level studies. > > > > > > > > > > In rasi when we talk of initial learning we see 2nd house, > 4th > > > > house > > > > > schooling, 5th house for mantra shastra and higher learning > > > > > 9th house for Guru based scriptural learning > > > > > 12th house for Spiritual learning. > > > > > The karaka argument doesnot hold, as Jupiter is also Karaka > of > > > 9th > > > > > and 11th house. Jupiter is not only for mantra(5th house) > but > > > also > > > > > for gurupadesa. > > > > > The karaka for 12th house is saturn. Now it is your turn to > > > think > > > > as > > > > > to what Saturn represents and how it is the karaka for 12th > > > house. > > > > > Pouranmi Tithi is ruled by saturn. > > > > > There is no redundancy when you think harder regarding 8th > > > house. > > > > 8th > > > > > house is the body of knowledge itself, whereas 11th house > shows > > > > > learning of the same. > > > > > Similary 8th can also show speculation, but the actual > activity > > > is > > > > > seen from 5th house. > > > > > AK will remove blockage as AK represents the Light of > paramatma. > > > > > > > > > > best wishes > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Sourav Chowdhury" > > > > > <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Partha-ji, > > > > > > Namaskar. I understand your logic. Its nice. However > > > > > > there are two issues: > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. 4H represents formal knowledge and material knowledge. > It is > > > > > > apara-vidya and this knowledge is needed for sustenance of > the > > > > > > native abd hence is in kendra to the Lagna. Mercury is the > > > karaka > > > > of > > > > > > this house. Moon is the other karaka being the lord of the > 4th > > > > house > > > > > > in the natural zodiac and represents Manas. Moon > represents > > > > samsara > > > > > > (world of Maya) and w/o having its own light reflects the > > > light of > > > > > > the Sun and thus represents Maya not Satya. Knowledge > > > associated > > > > > > with Maya (material knowledge) is aparavidya and not para- > > > vidya. > > > > > > > > > > > > 5H represents mantra vidya and para-vidya (spiritual > > > knowledge) > > > > and > > > > > > its karaka is none other than Ju. The other karaka is Su > as he > > > is > > > > > > the ruler of the 5th house of the natural zodiac. Thus 5H > has > > > to > > > > be > > > > > > associated with true knowledge or para-vidya. > > > > > > > > > > > > 12H doesnt necessarily means higher knowledge. It shows > > > knowledge > > > > of > > > > > > the immediate elders like mother, father, teacher who are > one > > > or > > > > two > > > > > > generations ahead of the native. > > > > > > > > > > > > More of this in Guru Sarajit-ji's article on Siddhamsa > (Chap. > > > 11, > > > > > > Varga Chakra, Sagar Publications) > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. I agree with you about 11H being 4th (learning) from 8H > > > > (occult) > > > > > > from the bhavatbhavam concept. However, I am uneasy with > this > > > to > > > > be > > > > > > the only reason why 11H is included in the scheme of > things. > > > The > > > > > > reason is that there is a redundancy of the 8th being > > > considered > > > > > > twice - once by itself and another time by being the house > from > > > > > > which 11H is the 4th. > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. I am not sure about why AK will remove blockage. Is > this a > > > > > > conceptual thumb rule or is it mentioned somewhere. If so, > I > > > > intend > > > > > > to learn this carefully. > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav > > > > > > > > > > > > > > =================================================================== > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "V.Partha sarathy" > > > > > > <partvinu@g...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sourav > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 11th house is the 7th house or maraka to the fifth house > of > > > > > Mantra > > > > > > > and Sacred spells, how can it give knowledge of > Astrology > > > then? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 5th house is the house of material knowledge and also > > > mantra. > > > > It > > > > > > is > > > > > > > not para vidya , as paravidya has to be seen from the > 12th > > > house > > > > > > (8th > > > > > > > from 5th). 12th shows the meaning(8th) of the fifth house > > > > (mantra). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now coming to the doubt i raised. Atma karaka is not the > > > > > Jeevatman > > > > > > > but the representative or rather the theme of the > jivatma. > > > No > > > > > > planet > > > > > > > can actually represent Atma, as Atma is beyond all the > > > > rupa/guna. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When AK is in 11th house it is learning(4th house) the > > > secrets > > > > of > > > > > > the > > > > > > > world(8th house). This could be through astrology, but > need > > > not > > > > > be > > > > > > > the only way. I talked of block to 5th house. When AK is > in > > > > 11th > > > > > > > house, the Block of fifth house is removed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thus there is no hard and fast rule that AK in 11th can > give > > > > > > interest > > > > > > > in astrology alone, it can be any other occult practice. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best wishes > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Sourav > Chowdhury" > > > > > > > <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pathak-bhai, > > > > > > > > Namaskar. It is difficult for me to > > > exactly > > > > > > > > ascertain what Sanjay-ji was thinking at that point of > > > time > > > > but > > > > > > let > > > > > > > > me share my thoughts. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2H (speech) 5H > (intelligence/memory/paraavidya) > > > 8H (occult > > > > > > > > knowledge) and 11H (fulfilment) are all four houses > apart > > > and > > > > > > hence > > > > > > > > are mutually supportive. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Looking at 11H alone, it is the last house of the > > > > kaamatrikona. > > > > > > It > > > > > > > > has the significance of gains and all kinds of > receipts. > > > It > > > > > > > > additionally has the significances (amongst other > things) > > > of > > > > > > > > - worshipping the deities and the good > > > > > > > > - extreme cunningness > > > > > > > > - wishfulfillment > > > > > > > > - wisdom > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AK is the representative of the jeevatman and its > > > involvement > > > > > in > > > > > > > any > > > > > > > > of these houses is good. I can only imagine that AK in > 11H > > > > > > > > strengthens fulfilment. Any sign occupied my AK > becomes > > > very > > > > > > > > important in the chart. See what happens when AK is in > the > > > > 11H > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > the D-9. It shows a brave and successful native > capable of > > > > > > > > performing any task. Also AK in the 11H has direct > > > > opportunity > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > aspect the 5H (what Sanjay-ji called the key house)!! > > > Graha > > > > > > drishti > > > > > > > > of AK is very strong as it is indicative of soul's > desire. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is only to my understanding and interpretation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ===================================================================== > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "utpal pathak" > > > > > > > > <vedic_pathak> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav Bhai, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sanjayji gave a lot of weightage to Atmakarka's > > > placement > > > > in > > > > > > 11th > > > > > > > > > house. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I can understand that 11th house is 4th from 8th & > > > > knowledge > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > hidden/occult , also a Panafar but why so much > > > importance > > > > of > > > > > > > > > Atmakarka to only 11th house? can you enlighten me. > I am > > > > not > > > > > > > > asking > > > > > > > > > this because i have that perticular combination but > I > > > need > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > more > > > > > > > > > technical clarifications. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > utpal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Sourav > > > Chowdhury" > > > > > > > > > <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pathak-bhai, > > > > > > > > > > Namaskar. Good point made. May I > add > > > a > > > > > > fresh > > > > > > > > view > > > > > > > > > > to your point? Guru Sanjay-ji said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ".... Jyotisha is given by planets who have the > ability > > > > > > > > > > to see the future (Panapara houses 2,5,8,11). Of > > > these, > > > > the > > > > > > > > fifth > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > the controlling house for the future. Jupiter and > Rahu > > > > have > > > > > > > > special > > > > > > > > > > aspect on the fifth house, and are hte best > > > astrologers. > > > > > > They > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > followed by Mars who can aspect the 8th house." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H shows paravidya (worldly knowledge, 5H shows > aparaa- > > > > > vidya > > > > > > > > > > (spiritual knowledge, mantra diksha etc) and 8H > shows > > > > > occult > > > > > > > > > > knowledge. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thus jyotisha knowledge is definitely part of 5H > and > > > 8H > > > > > > > quality. > > > > > > > > > > Hence, planets having 5th and 8th aspects can give > > > > jyotisha > > > > > > > > > > understandings, if that is what Guru Sanjay-ji > meant. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ju and Ra are planets that can give 5th aspects, > and > > > Mars > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > > 8th aspect. Hence these planets are significant. > As > > > you > > > > > > rightly > > > > > > > > > > pointed out, Ra is a planet of wrong desires and > can > > > lead > > > > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > > > > to negative channels or selfishness. Ju in > addition to > > > > > > having a > > > > > > > > 5th > > > > > > > > > > aspect is himself the planet of dhi - intelligence > and > > > > > > sashtras > > > > > > > > > > traditional knowledge. Hence Ju has an added > > > significance > > > > > > over > > > > > > > > Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > There is another significance of Ra, that of > > > > a 'researcher' > > > > > > > > hence > > > > > > > > > > Rahu aspect can show intense research that is good > to > > > > > > > understand > > > > > > > > > > jyotisha. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, I tend to keep my views on assessment of > > > > jyotisha > > > > > > > > talent > > > > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > > seeing any good connection between 2H, 5H, 8H and > 11H > > > or > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > > > lords. All planets have different qualities and > can > > > > > > influence > > > > > > > > > > jyotisha learning in different ways. For example, > Sa > > > > > > signifies > > > > > > > > > > discipline and hardwork and such is a necessary > > > component > > > > > > for a > > > > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > > jyotishi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Again, thanks for your good posting. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ===================================================================== > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Utpal > Pathak > > > > > > > > > > <vedic_pathak> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > dear Saurav bhai & Cramer, > > > > > > > > > > > [ > > > > > > > > > > > Why is Rahu/North Node having a aspect on 5th > > > house: > > > > It > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > not a > > > > > > > > > > > > planet right? > > > > > > > > > > > ] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu & Ketu though not physical bodies, are > accepted > > > as > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > important by ancient writers. > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu doesn't aspect becuase it is headless but > what > > > > about > > > > > > > > Rahu's > > > > > > > > > > 5th, 9th & 12th Drashti? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I came to know a good explanation for this and > pass > > > it > > > > on > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > > for your intrest.. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is a enemy of guru & vice versa (Guru is > only > > > > > > inimical > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > Rahu). so wherever Guru want to cast his benign > > > aspect, > > > > our > > > > > > > dear > > > > > > > > > > demon Rahu wants to wreck it. Guru wants to teach > > > Jyotish > > > > > so > > > > > > > > Rahu > > > > > > > > > > also wants to Teach it but in entirely different > way > > > and > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > opposite motives. Guru want to give good qualities > > > wants > > > > a > > > > > > > > person > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > follow dharma and make him 'Tolerable' by > aspecting > > > 9th > > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > Rahu > > > > > > > > > > wants to destroy the Dharma by casting the same > 9th > > > house > > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > wants to make him 'Nastika' and 'Intolerable' > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > just occured to write few lines to a already > better > > > > > > learned > > > > > > > > > person. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > utpal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav Chowdhury <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Kramer, > > > > > > > > > > > Namaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. In my Rasi, Navamsa, D-10 and D-24 I see that > > > > > > connection. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. Strong 9H means you will follow dharma. Not > > > > > necessarily > > > > > > > > become > > > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > > > astrologer. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. I am not sure why he mentioned Ra. I know > Ke's > > > > > > involvement > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > definite. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ============================================================= > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic- > > > astrology, "giddyupguys" > > > > > > > > > > > <giddyupguys> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Three questions: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not sure about others, but I have some > > > > > reasonably > > > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > > > > > connections in my D-24. But I believe that > > > without > > > > > > Guru's > > > > > > > > > > > blessings > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How about in rasi chart? Where are the planets > > > > > according > > > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > > > rising > > > > > > > > > > > > sign? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why is 9th house not taken by Sanjay Rath for > one > > > to > > > > be > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > > > > astrologer. One has to have a good 9th > house/lord > > > is > > > > > > what I > > > > > > > > > > > thought. > > > > > > > > > > > > Can somebody explain? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why is Rahu/North Node having a aspect on 5th > > > house: > > > > It > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > > planet right? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kramer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: > > > vedic- > > > astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: > > > vedic- > > > > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > > > Krishnaarpanamastu > > > > || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To from this group, send an email > to: > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the > > > > > > > > > Terms > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? 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Guest guest Posted April 22, 2005 Report Share Posted April 22, 2005 || Hare Rama Krishna || Dear Pandit-ji, Namaskar. Kindly read all the messages starting from message # 55229 with this Subject line " Re: Combination to become an astrologer ". I would be interested in our thoughts. Regards, Sourav =================================================================== vedic astrology, Panditji <navagraha@g...> wrote: > Namaste, > > I can understand 2 for vak ( speech), 5 for higher knowledge, 8 for > Goodh/occult vidya. Why 11 ? > > ... > > On 4/22/05, Sourav Chowdhury <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > Dear Pandit-ji, > > Namaste. No we are talking specifically about what > > can make a native a successful astrologer (success in divination; > > its not material success in earning from astrology). These > > considerations are only for D-1 and D-24. > > > > Regards, > > > > Sourav > > ==================================================================== > > vedic astrology, Panditji <navagraha@g...> > > wrote: > > > Namaste, > > > > > > 2,5,8,11 these are bhavas looked for dhana yogas. Are you using the > > > word "successful" in terms of money ? > > > > > > ... > > > > > > On 4/22/05, Sourav Chowdhury <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > > > > > Dear Pathak-bhai, > > > > Namaskar. Your 5-points on 11H and AK are fine > > and > > > > we already discussed them extensively. Remember that 11 is only > > one > > > > of the houses in the 2,5,8,11 houses that we have to see for a > > > > successful jyotishi. See the keyword here is to have > > *successful*. A > > > > very strong combination of 5th and 8th without 11th can give a > > > > native with strong interest in jyotisha/occult but not > > necessarily > > > > make him a successful one. It has also to involve 2H (vak > > siddhi) > > > > and 11 h (success and wisdom). So please dont focus strongly on > > 11H > > > > alone. This that I am telling is what I learnt from Guru > > Narasimha- > > > > ji's classes. > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > Sourav > > > > > > ==================================================================== > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "utpal pathak" > > > > <vedic_pathak> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Souravji & Parthaji, > > > > > > > > > > I was thinking a lot on the issue of 11th house placement of > > > > Atmakarak > > > > > & learning of Jyotish, for last half an hour. > > > > > as i have already written in my previous mail that I am not > > > > > understanding the much importance given to 11th house for the > > > > subject > > > > > of Astrlogy (Occult) though only thing was obvious that it is > > a > > > > 4th > > > > > house from 8th and a Panafar as well as Upachaya. > > > > > > > > > > but I have found a good reasoning by which i can technically > > > > accept > > > > > the rule which is described as under > > > > > > > > > > as we know that > > > > > 1) Panafar are the house of seeing future i.e 2nd, 5th, 8th & > > > > 11th. > > > > > as it is said that connection of the above houses may generate > > > > > interest in astrology and allied studies. > > > > > > > > > > 2)Atmakarka is the king of a chart. it Represents the > > > > > Direction/desire of one's atma > > > > > > > > > > 3)Primary Argala's are 2nd, 4th & 11th > > > > > > > > > > 4)8th House is a basic & pivotal house for occult knowledge > > such > > > > as > > > > > astrology. > > > > > > > > > > 5)11th house beside being a house of Fructification of > > desires, > > > > also > > > > > the 4th (Learning) house from 8th (Jyotisha Shastra) > > > > > > > > > > Now if we combined the above 5 points than very intresting > > product > > > > > comes out of the fusion. i.e 11th house gets connected with > > all > > > > the > > > > > above points. The most important point in favour of 11th house > > is > > > > > that it can only Cause Argala(Conclusive interference) to th > > 8th > > > > > house. the other Panfar namely 2nd, 5th can not cause argala > > to > > > > 8th > > > > > and 5th even causes virodh argala. > > > > > > > > > > With the above explanation to myself, I can now without dowbt > > > > accept > > > > > the rule of Atmakarka in 11th and intrest in jyotish or any > > other > > > > > occult knowledge. > > > > > > > > > > will be hapy to know your views. > > > > > > > > > > best regards > > > > > > > > > > Utpal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "V.Partha sarathy" > > > > > <partvinu@g...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sourav > > > > > > > > > > > > The basis of all the divisional charts is a Modulo, for > > example > > > > d- > > > > > 20, > > > > > > 20/12=8 thus 8th house is the seed for d-20 > > > > > > Similarly, for d-16, 16/12, remainder is 4, Thus fourth > > house is > > > > > the > > > > > > basis of d-16, that is the chart for sukha. > > > > > > Now for d-24, 24/12= Remainder is 0, which should be taken > > as 12 > > > > > > itself and thus 12th house represents the Para Vidya. > > > > > > > > > > > > 4th house represents the school till 12th class.in siddhamsa > > > > > > 9th represents undergraduate > > > > > > 2nd house-post graduation > > > > > > 7th house-doctoral > > > > > > 12th house -post doctoral. > > > > > > > > > > > > Now this is for mundane level studies. > > > > > > > > > > > > In rasi when we talk of initial learning we see 2nd house, > > 4th > > > > > house > > > > > > schooling, 5th house for mantra shastra and higher learning > > > > > > 9th house for Guru based scriptural learning > > > > > > 12th house for Spiritual learning. > > > > > > The karaka argument doesnot hold, as Jupiter is also Karaka > > of > > > > 9th > > > > > > and 11th house. Jupiter is not only for mantra(5th house) > > but > > > > also > > > > > > for gurupadesa. > > > > > > The karaka for 12th house is saturn. Now it is your turn to > > > > think > > > > > as > > > > > > to what Saturn represents and how it is the karaka for 12th > > > > house. > > > > > > Pouranmi Tithi is ruled by saturn. > > > > > > There is no redundancy when you think harder regarding 8th > > > > house. > > > > > 8th > > > > > > house is the body of knowledge itself, whereas 11th house > > shows > > > > > > learning of the same. > > > > > > Similary 8th can also show speculation, but the actual > > activity > > > > is > > > > > > seen from 5th house. > > > > > > AK will remove blockage as AK represents the Light of > > paramatma. > > > > > > > > > > > > best wishes > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Sourav Chowdhury" > > > > > > <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Partha-ji, > > > > > > > Namaskar. I understand your logic. Its nice. However > > > > > > > there are two issues: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. 4H represents formal knowledge and material knowledge. > > It is > > > > > > > apara-vidya and this knowledge is needed for sustenance of > > the > > > > > > > native abd hence is in kendra to the Lagna. Mercury is the > > > > karaka > > > > > of > > > > > > > this house. Moon is the other karaka being the lord of the > > 4th > > > > > house > > > > > > > in the natural zodiac and represents Manas. Moon > > represents > > > > > samsara > > > > > > > (world of Maya) and w/o having its own light reflects the > > > > light of > > > > > > > the Sun and thus represents Maya not Satya. Knowledge > > > > associated > > > > > > > with Maya (material knowledge) is aparavidya and not para- > > > > vidya. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 5H represents mantra vidya and para-vidya (spiritual > > > > knowledge) > > > > > and > > > > > > > its karaka is none other than Ju. The other karaka is Su > > as he > > > > is > > > > > > > the ruler of the 5th house of the natural zodiac. Thus 5H > > has > > > > to > > > > > be > > > > > > > associated with true knowledge or para-vidya. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 12H doesnt necessarily means higher knowledge. It shows > > > > knowledge > > > > > of > > > > > > > the immediate elders like mother, father, teacher who are > > one > > > > or > > > > > two > > > > > > > generations ahead of the native. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > More of this in Guru Sarajit-ji's article on Siddhamsa > > (Chap. > > > > 11, > > > > > > > Varga Chakra, Sagar Publications) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. I agree with you about 11H being 4th (learning) from 8H > > > > > (occult) > > > > > > > from the bhavatbhavam concept. However, I am uneasy with > > this > > > > to > > > > > be > > > > > > > the only reason why 11H is included in the scheme of > > things. > > > > The > > > > > > > reason is that there is a redundancy of the 8th being > > > > considered > > > > > > > twice - once by itself and another time by being the house > > from > > > > > > > which 11H is the 4th. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. I am not sure about why AK will remove blockage. Is > > this a > > > > > > > conceptual thumb rule or is it mentioned somewhere. If so, > > I > > > > > intend > > > > > > > to learn this carefully. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > =================================================================== > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "V.Partha sarathy" > > > > > > > <partvinu@g...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sourav > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 11th house is the 7th house or maraka to the fifth house > > of > > > > > > Mantra > > > > > > > > and Sacred spells, how can it give knowledge of > > Astrology > > > > then? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 5th house is the house of material knowledge and also > > > > mantra. > > > > > It > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > not para vidya , as paravidya has to be seen from the > > 12th > > > > house > > > > > > > (8th > > > > > > > > from 5th). 12th shows the meaning(8th) of the fifth house > > > > > (mantra). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now coming to the doubt i raised. Atma karaka is not the > > > > > > Jeevatman > > > > > > > > but the representative or rather the theme of the > > jivatma. > > > > No > > > > > > > planet > > > > > > > > can actually represent Atma, as Atma is beyond all the > > > > > rupa/guna. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When AK is in 11th house it is learning(4th house) the > > > > secrets > > > > > of > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > world(8th house). This could be through astrology, but > > need > > > > not > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > the only way. I talked of block to 5th house. When AK is > > in > > > > > 11th > > > > > > > > house, the Block of fifth house is removed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thus there is no hard and fast rule that AK in 11th can > > give > > > > > > > interest > > > > > > > > in astrology alone, it can be any other occult practice. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best wishes > > > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Sourav > > Chowdhury" > > > > > > > > <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pathak-bhai, > > > > > > > > > Namaskar. It is difficult for me to > > > > exactly > > > > > > > > > ascertain what Sanjay-ji was thinking at that point of > > > > time > > > > > but > > > > > > > let > > > > > > > > > me share my thoughts. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2H (speech) 5H > > (intelligence/memory/paraavidya) > > > > 8H (occult > > > > > > > > > knowledge) and 11H (fulfilment) are all four houses > > apart > > > > and > > > > > > > hence > > > > > > > > > are mutually supportive. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Looking at 11H alone, it is the last house of the > > > > > kaamatrikona. > > > > > > > It > > > > > > > > > has the significance of gains and all kinds of > > receipts. > > > > It > > > > > > > > > additionally has the significances (amongst other > > things) > > > > of > > > > > > > > > - worshipping the deities and the good > > > > > > > > > - extreme cunningness > > > > > > > > > - wishfulfillment > > > > > > > > > - wisdom > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AK is the representative of the jeevatman and its > > > > involvement > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > any > > > > > > > > > of these houses is good. I can only imagine that AK in > > 11H > > > > > > > > > strengthens fulfilment. Any sign occupied my AK > > becomes > > > > very > > > > > > > > > important in the chart. See what happens when AK is in > > the > > > > > 11H > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > the D-9. It shows a brave and successful native > > capable of > > > > > > > > > performing any task. Also AK in the 11H has direct > > > > > opportunity > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > aspect the 5H (what Sanjay-ji called the key house)!! > > > > Graha > > > > > > > drishti > > > > > > > > > of AK is very strong as it is indicative of soul's > > desire. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is only to my understanding and interpretation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ===================================================================== > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "utpal pathak" > > > > > > > > > <vedic_pathak> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav Bhai, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sanjayji gave a lot of weightage to Atmakarka's > > > > placement > > > > > in > > > > > > > 11th > > > > > > > > > > house. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I can understand that 11th house is 4th from 8th & > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > hidden/occult , also a Panafar but why so much > > > > importance > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > Atmakarka to only 11th house? can you enlighten me. > > I am > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > asking > > > > > > > > > > this because i have that perticular combination but > > I > > > > need > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > more > > > > > > > > > > technical clarifications. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > utpal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Sourav > > > > Chowdhury" > > > > > > > > > > <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pathak-bhai, > > > > > > > > > > > Namaskar. Good point made. May I > > add > > > > a > > > > > > > fresh > > > > > > > > > view > > > > > > > > > > > to your point? Guru Sanjay-ji said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ".... Jyotisha is given by planets who have the > > ability > > > > > > > > > > > to see the future (Panapara houses 2,5,8,11). Of > > > > these, > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > fifth > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > the controlling house for the future. Jupiter and > > Rahu > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > special > > > > > > > > > > > aspect on the fifth house, and are hte best > > > > astrologers. > > > > > > > They > > > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > > > followed by Mars who can aspect the 8th house." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H shows paravidya (worldly knowledge, 5H shows > > aparaa- > > > > > > vidya > > > > > > > > > > > (spiritual knowledge, mantra diksha etc) and 8H > > shows > > > > > > occult > > > > > > > > > > > knowledge. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thus jyotisha knowledge is definitely part of 5H > > and > > > > 8H > > > > > > > > quality. > > > > > > > > > > > Hence, planets having 5th and 8th aspects can give > > > > > jyotisha > > > > > > > > > > > understandings, if that is what Guru Sanjay-ji > > meant. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ju and Ra are planets that can give 5th aspects, > > and > > > > Mars > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > > > 8th aspect. Hence these planets are significant. > > As > > > > you > > > > > > > rightly > > > > > > > > > > > pointed out, Ra is a planet of wrong desires and > > can > > > > lead > > > > > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > > > > > to negative channels or selfishness. Ju in > > addition to > > > > > > > having a > > > > > > > > > 5th > > > > > > > > > > > aspect is himself the planet of dhi - intelligence > > and > > > > > > > sashtras > > > > > > > > > > > traditional knowledge. Hence Ju has an added > > > > significance > > > > > > > over > > > > > > > > > Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > > There is another significance of Ra, that of > > > > > a 'researcher' > > > > > > > > > hence > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu aspect can show intense research that is good > > to > > > > > > > > understand > > > > > > > > > > > jyotisha. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, I tend to keep my views on assessment of > > > > > jyotisha > > > > > > > > > talent > > > > > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > > > seeing any good connection between 2H, 5H, 8H and > > 11H > > > > or > > > > > > > their > > > > > > > > > > > lords. All planets have different qualities and > > can > > > > > > > influence > > > > > > > > > > > jyotisha learning in different ways. For example, > > Sa > > > > > > > signifies > > > > > > > > > > > discipline and hardwork and such is a necessary > > > > component > > > > > > > for a > > > > > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > > > jyotishi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Again, thanks for your good posting. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ===================================================================== > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Utpal > > Pathak > > > > > > > > > > > <vedic_pathak> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > dear Saurav bhai & Cramer, > > > > > > > > > > > > [ > > > > > > > > > > > > Why is Rahu/North Node having a aspect on 5th > > > > house: > > > > > It > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > not a > > > > > > > > > > > > > planet right? > > > > > > > > > > > > ] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu & Ketu though not physical bodies, are > > accepted > > > > as > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > > important by ancient writers. > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu doesn't aspect becuase it is headless but > > what > > > > > about > > > > > > > > > Rahu's > > > > > > > > > > > 5th, 9th & 12th Drashti? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I came to know a good explanation for this and > > pass > > > > it > > > > > on > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > > > for your intrest.. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is a enemy of guru & vice versa (Guru is > > only > > > > > > > inimical > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu). so wherever Guru want to cast his benign > > > > aspect, > > > > > our > > > > > > > > dear > > > > > > > > > > > demon Rahu wants to wreck it. Guru wants to teach > > > > Jyotish > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > also wants to Teach it but in entirely different > > way > > > > and > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > > opposite motives. Guru want to give good qualities > > > > wants > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > person > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > follow dharma and make him 'Tolerable' by > > aspecting > > > > 9th > > > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > > Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > wants to destroy the Dharma by casting the same > > 9th > > > > house > > > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > wants to make him 'Nastika' and 'Intolerable' > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > just occured to write few lines to a already > > better > > > > > > > learned > > > > > > > > > > person. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > utpal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav Chowdhury <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Kramer, > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. In my Rasi, Navamsa, D-10 and D-24 I see that > > > > > > > connection. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. Strong 9H means you will follow dharma. Not > > > > > > necessarily > > > > > > > > > become > > > > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > > > > astrologer. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. I am not sure why he mentioned Ra. I know > > Ke's > > > > > > > involvement > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > definite. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ============================================================= > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic- > > > > astrology, "giddyupguys" > > > > > > > > > > > > <giddyupguys> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Three questions: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not sure about others, but I have some > > > > > > reasonably > > > > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > > > > > > connections in my D-24. But I believe that > > > > without > > > > > > > Guru's > > > > > > > > > > > > blessings > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How about in rasi chart? Where are the planets > > > > > > according > > > > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > > > > rising > > > > > > > > > > > > > sign? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why is 9th house not taken by Sanjay Rath for > > one > > > > to > > > > > be > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > > > > > astrologer. One has to have a good 9th > > house/lord > > > > is > > > > > > > what I > > > > > > > > > > > > thought. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Can somebody explain? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why is Rahu/North Node having a aspect on 5th > > > > house: > > > > > It > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > > > planet right? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kramer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: > > > > vedic- > > > > astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: > > > > vedic- > > > > > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic- astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > > > > Krishnaarpanamastu > > > > > || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To from this group, send an email > > to: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the > > > > > > > > > > > Terms > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam > > > > > protection > > > > > > > > > around > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: > > > > vedic astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to > > > > vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > > > Links > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology/ > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > Terms of > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: > > vedic astrology/info.html > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to > > vedic astrology- > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > Links > > > > > > vedic astrology/ > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > Terms of Service. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 22, 2005 Report Share Posted April 22, 2005 Om Krishna Guru Namaste Pandit, Why 11th house is important because, if you take 8th house for Occult Sciences/knowledge, then 4th from 8th is 11th, which is learning of Occult sciences/knolwedge. Is it not? Regards Raghunatha Rao vedic astrology, Panditji <navagraha@g...> wrote: > Namaste, > > I can understand 2 for vak ( speech), 5 for higher knowledge, 8 for > Goodh/occult vidya. Why 11 ? > > ... > > On 4/22/05, Sourav Chowdhury <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > Dear Pandit-ji, > > Namaste. No we are talking specifically about what > > can make a native a successful astrologer (success in divination; > > its not material success in earning from astrology). These > > considerations are only for D-1 and D-24. > > > > Regards, > > > > Sourav > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 22, 2005 Report Share Posted April 22, 2005 Namaskar, I think I am not properly being understood. I'll repost the reply I sent to Partha Garu yesterday [ Respected Partha Garu, Absolutely, As consistent with my nature i always take any rule with a pinch of salt, there can not be a thumb rule working for every chart. i just wanted to find out the acceptibilty or otherwise of a peculier combination (11th house). but thanks for your valuable suggetion as it will only strenghthen my mind set about 'rules'.] for the combination we are discussing presently, or let it be any combination which we discuss in future, It is out of question to judge it in isolation when seeing a chart. I am taking any rule with the combination of other relevent rules always. Thank you very much for your suggetions & knowledge which is always a welcome. Utpal Sourav Chowdhury <sourav12 (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote: || Hare Rama Krishna ||Dear Pathak-bhai, Namaskar. Your 5-points on 11H and AK are fine and we already discussed them extensively. Remember that 11 is only one of the houses in the 2,5,8,11 houses that we have to see for a successful jyotishi. See the keyword here is to have *successful*. A very strong combination of 5th and 8th without 11th can give a native with strong interest in jyotisha/occult but not necessarily make him a successful one. It has also to involve 2H (vak siddhi) and 11 h (success and wisdom). So please dont focus strongly on 11H alone. This that I am telling is what I learnt from Guru Narasimha-ji's classes.Regards,Sourav====================================================================--- In vedic astrology, "utpal pathak" <vedic_pathak> wrote:> > Dear Souravji & Parthaji,> > I was thinking a lot on the issue of 11th house placement of Atmakarak> & learning of Jyotish, for last half an hour.> as i have already written in my previous mail that I am not > understanding the much importance given to 11th house for the subject > of Astrlogy (Occult) though only thing was obvious that it is a 4th > house from 8th and a Panafar as well as Upachaya.> > but I have found a good reasoning by which i can technically accept > the rule which is described as under> > as we know that> 1) Panafar are the house of seeing future i.e 2nd, 5th, 8th & 11th. > as it is said that connection of the above houses may generate > interest in astrology and allied studies.> > 2)Atmakarka is the king of a chart. it Represents the > Direction/desire of one's atma> > 3)Primary Argala's are 2nd, 4th & 11th> > 4)8th House is a basic & pivotal house for occult knowledge such as > astrology.> > 5)11th house beside being a house of Fructification of desires, also > the 4th (Learning) house from 8th (Jyotisha Shastra)> > Now if we combined the above 5 points than very intresting product > comes out of the fusion. i.e 11th house gets connected with all the > above points. The most important point in favour of 11th house is > that it can only Cause Argala(Conclusive interference) to th 8th > house. the other Panfar namely 2nd, 5th can not cause argala to 8th > and 5th even causes virodh argala.> > With the above explanation to myself, I can now without dowbt accept > the rule of Atmakarka in 11th and intrest in jyotish or any other > occult knowledge.> > will be hapy to know your views.> > best regards> > Utpal> > > --- In vedic astrology, "V.Partha sarathy" > <partvinu@g...> wrote:> > > > Dear Sourav> > > > The basis of all the divisional charts is a Modulo, for example d-> 20, > > 20/12=8 thus 8th house is the seed for d-20> > Similarly, for d-16, 16/12, remainder is 4, Thus fourth house is > the > > basis of d-16, that is the chart for sukha.> > Now for d-24, 24/12= Remainder is 0, which should be taken as 12 > > itself and thus 12th house represents the Para Vidya.> > > > 4th house represents the school till 12th class.in siddhamsa> > 9th represents undergraduate> > 2nd house-post graduation> > 7th house-doctoral> > 12th house -post doctoral.> > > > Now this is for mundane level studies.> > > > In rasi when we talk of initial learning we see 2nd house, 4th > house > > schooling, 5th house for mantra shastra and higher learning> > 9th house for Guru based scriptural learning> > 12th house for Spiritual learning.> > The karaka argument doesnot hold, as Jupiter is also Karaka of 9th > > and 11th house. Jupiter is not only for mantra(5th house) but also > > for gurupadesa.> > The karaka for 12th house is saturn. Now it is your turn to think > as > > to what Saturn represents and how it is the karaka for 12th house.> > Pouranmi Tithi is ruled by saturn.> > There is no redundancy when you think harder regarding 8th house. > 8th > > house is the body of knowledge itself, whereas 11th house shows > > learning of the same.> > Similary 8th can also show speculation, but the actual activity is > > seen from 5th house.> > AK will remove blockage as AK represents the Light of paramatma.> > > > best wishes> > partha> > > > > > > > > > > > --- In vedic astrology, "Sourav Chowdhury" > > <sourav12@h...> wrote:> > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna ||> > > > > > Dear Partha-ji,> > > Namaskar. I understand your logic. Its nice. However> > > there are two issues:> > > > > > 1. 4H represents formal knowledge and material knowledge. It is> > > apara-vidya and this knowledge is needed for sustenance of the> > > native abd hence is in kendra to the Lagna. Mercury is the karaka > of> > > this house. Moon is the other karaka being the lord of the 4th > house> > > in the natural zodiac and represents Manas. Moon represents > samsara> > > (world of Maya) and w/o having its own light reflects the light of> > > the Sun and thus represents Maya not Satya. Knowledge associated> > > with Maya (material knowledge) is aparavidya and not para-vidya.> > > > > > 5H represents mantra vidya and para-vidya (spiritual knowledge) > and> > > its karaka is none other than Ju. The other karaka is Su as he is> > > the ruler of the 5th house of the natural zodiac. Thus 5H has to > be> > > associated with true knowledge or para-vidya.> > > > > > 12H doesnt necessarily means higher knowledge. It shows knowledge > of> > > the immediate elders like mother, father, teacher who are one or > two> > > generations ahead of the native.> > > > > > More of this in Guru Sarajit-ji's article on Siddhamsa (Chap. 11,> > > Varga Chakra, Sagar Publications)> > > > > > 2. I agree with you about 11H being 4th (learning) from 8H > (occult)> > > from the bhavatbhavam concept. However, I am uneasy with this to > be> > > the only reason why 11H is included in the scheme of things. The> > > reason is that there is a redundancy of the 8th being considered> > > twice - once by itself and another time by being the house from> > > which 11H is the 4th.> > > > > > 3. I am not sure about why AK will remove blockage. Is this a> > > conceptual thumb rule or is it mentioned somewhere. If so, I > intend> > > to learn this carefully.> > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > Sourav> > > > ===================================================================> > > > > > vedic astrology, "V.Partha sarathy" > > > <partvinu@g...> wrote:> > > > > > > > Dear Sourav> > > > > > > > 11th house is the 7th house or maraka to the fifth house of > > Mantra > > > > and Sacred spells, how can it give knowledge of Astrology then?> > > > > > > > 5th house is the house of material knowledge and also mantra. > It > > > is > > > > not para vidya , as paravidya has to be seen from the 12th house> > > (8th > > > > from 5th). 12th shows the meaning(8th) of the fifth house> (mantra).> > > > > > > > Now coming to the doubt i raised. Atma karaka is not the > > Jeevatman > > > > but the representative or rather the theme of the jivatma. No > > > planet > > > > can actually represent Atma, as Atma is beyond all the > rupa/guna.> > > > > > > > When AK is in 11th house it is learning(4th house) the secrets > of > > > the > > > > world(8th house). This could be through astrology, but need not > > be > > > > the only way. I talked of block to 5th house. When AK is in > 11th > > > > house, the Block of fifth house is removed.> > > > > > > > Thus there is no hard and fast rule that AK in 11th can give > > > interest > > > > in astrology alone, it can be any other occult practice.> > > > > > > > Best wishes> > > > partha> > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Sourav Chowdhury" > > > > <sourav12@h...> wrote:> > > > > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna ||> > > > > > > > > > Dear Pathak-bhai,> > > > > Namaskar. It is difficult for me to exactly > > > > > ascertain what Sanjay-ji was thinking at that point of time > but > > > let > > > > > me share my thoughts.> > > > > > > > > > 2H (speech) 5H (intelligence/memory/paraavidya) 8H (occult > > > > > knowledge) and 11H (fulfilment) are all four houses apart and > > > hence > > > > > are mutually supportive. > > > > > > > > > > Looking at 11H alone, it is the last house of the > kaamatrikona. > > > It > > > > > has the significance of gains and all kinds of receipts. It > > > > > additionally has the significances (amongst other things) of > > > > > - worshipping the deities and the good> > > > > - extreme cunningness> > > > > - wishfulfillment> > > > > - wisdom> > > > > > > > > > AK is the representative of the jeevatman and its involvement > > in > > > > any > > > > > of these houses is good. I can only imagine that AK in 11H > > > > > strengthens fulfilment. Any sign occupied my AK becomes very > > > > > important in the chart. See what happens when AK is in the > 11H > > > in > > > > > the D-9. It shows a brave and successful native capable of > > > > > performing any task. Also AK in the 11H has direct > opportunity > > > to > > > > > aspect the 5H (what Sanjay-ji called the key house)!! Graha > > > drishti > > > > > of AK is very strong as it is indicative of soul's desire.> > > > > > > > > > This is only to my understanding and interpretation.> > > > > > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > > > > > Sourav> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > =====================================================================> > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "utpal pathak" > > > > > <vedic_pathak> wrote:> > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav Bhai,> > > > > > > > > > > > Sanjayji gave a lot of weightage to Atmakarka's placement > in > > > 11th > > > > > > house.> > > > > > > > > > > > I can understand that 11th house is 4th from 8th & > knowledge > > > for > > > > > > hidden/occult , also a Panafar but why so much importance > of > > > > > > Atmakarka to only 11th house? can you enlighten me. I am > not > > > > > asking > > > > > > this because i have that perticular combination but I need > > > some > > > > > more > > > > > > technical clarifications.> > > > > > > > > > > > utpal> > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Sourav Chowdhury" > > > > > > <sourav12@h...> wrote:> > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna ||> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pathak-bhai,> > > > > > > Namaskar. Good point made. May I add a > > > fresh > > > > > view > > > > > > > to your point? Guru Sanjay-ji said:> > > > > > > > > > > > > > ".... Jyotisha is given by planets who have the ability> > > > > > > to see the future (Panapara houses 2,5,8,11). Of these, > the > > > > > fifth > > > > > > is > > > > > > > the controlling house for the future. Jupiter and Rahu > have > > > > > special> > > > > > > aspect on the fifth house, and are hte best astrologers. > > > They > > > > > are > > > > > > > followed by Mars who can aspect the 8th house."> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H shows paravidya (worldly knowledge, 5H shows aparaa-> > vidya > > > > > > > (spiritual knowledge, mantra diksha etc) and 8H shows > > occult > > > > > > > knowledge.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thus jyotisha knowledge is definitely part of 5H and 8H > > > > quality. > > > > > > > Hence, planets having 5th and 8th aspects can give > jyotisha > > > > > > > understandings, if that is what Guru Sanjay-ji meant.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ju and Ra are planets that can give 5th aspects, and Mars > > > can > > > > > give > > > > > > > 8th aspect. Hence these planets are significant. As you > > > rightly > > > > > > > pointed out, Ra is a planet of wrong desires and can lead > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > to negative channels or selfishness. Ju in addition to > > > having a > > > > > 5th > > > > > > > aspect is himself the planet of dhi - intelligence and > > > sashtras > > > > > > > traditional knowledge. Hence Ju has an added significance > > > over > > > > > Rahu.> > > > > > > There is another significance of Ra, that of > a 'researcher' > > > > > hence > > > > > > > Rahu aspect can show intense research that is good to > > > > understand > > > > > > > jyotisha.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, I tend to keep my views on assessment of > jyotisha > > > > > talent > > > > > > by > > > > > > > seeing any good connection between 2H, 5H, 8H and 11H or > > > their > > > > > > > lords. All planets have different qualities and can > > > influence > > > > > > > jyotisha learning in different ways. For example, Sa > > > signifies > > > > > > > discipline and hardwork and such is a necessary component > > > for a > > > > > > good > > > > > > > jyotishi.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Again, thanks for your good posting.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > =====================================================================> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Utpal Pathak > > > > > > > <vedic_pathak> wrote:> > > > > > > > dear Saurav bhai & Cramer,> > > > > > > > [> > > > > > > > Why is Rahu/North Node having a aspect on 5th house: > It > > > is > > > > > not a > > > > > > > > > planet right?> > > > > > > > ]> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu & Ketu though not physical bodies, are accepted as > > > very > > > > > > > important by ancient writers.> > > > > > > > Ketu doesn't aspect becuase it is headless but what > about > > > > > Rahu's > > > > > > > 5th, 9th & 12th Drashti?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I came to know a good explanation for this and pass it > on > > > to > > > > > you > > > > > > > for your intrest..> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is a enemy of guru & vice versa (Guru is only > > > inimical > > > > to > > > > > > > Rahu). so wherever Guru want to cast his benign aspect, > our > > > > dear > > > > > > > demon Rahu wants to wreck it. Guru wants to teach Jyotish > > so > > > > > Rahu > > > > > > > also wants to Teach it but in entirely different way and > > for > > > > > > > opposite motives. Guru want to give good qualities wants > a > > > > > person > > > > > > to > > > > > > > follow dharma and make him 'Tolerable' by aspecting 9th > > > house, > > > > > Rahu > > > > > > > wants to destroy the Dharma by casting the same 9th house > > > > aspect > > > > > > and > > > > > > > wants to make him 'Nastika' and 'Intolerable'> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > just occured to write few lines to a already better > > > learned > > > > > > person.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > utpal> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav Chowdhury <sourav12@h...> wrote:> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna ||> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Kramer,> > > > > > > > Namaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. In my Rasi, Navamsa, D-10 and D-24 I see that > > > connection.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. Strong 9H means you will follow dharma. Not > > necessarily > > > > > become > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > astrologer.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. I am not sure why he mentioned Ra. I know Ke's > > > involvement > > > > > is > > > > > > > > definite.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav> > > > > > > > > > > ============================================================= > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "giddyupguys" > > > > > > > > <giddyupguys> wrote:> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Three questions:> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not sure about others, but I have some > > reasonably > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > > connections in my D-24. But I believe that without > > > Guru's > > > > > > > > blessings > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How about in rasi chart? Where are the planets > > according > > > > > your > > > > > > > > rising > > > > > > > > > sign?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why is 9th house not taken by Sanjay Rath for one to > be > > > a > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > astrologer. One has to have a good 9th house/lord is > > > what I > > > > > > > > thought.> > > > > > > > > Can somebody explain?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why is Rahu/North Node having a aspect on 5th house: > It > > > is > > > > > not > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > planet right?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kramer> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic astrology> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic-> > > > > astrology/info.html> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu > || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Links> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology/> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terms > > > > of > > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Do You ?> > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam > protection > > > > > around > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic astrologyGroup info: vedic astrology/info.htmlTo UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam protection around Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 22, 2005 Report Share Posted April 22, 2005 || Hare Rama Krishna || Dear Pathak-bhai, Namaskar. I most certainly understand your point. Lot of things are learnt and clarified with this 11H house discussions. It does signifies gains isn't it ? See how much we have gained by this discussion. Regards, Sourav ==================================================================== vedic astrology, Utpal Pathak <vedic_pathak> wrote: > Dear Surav Dada !! > Namaskar, > > I think I am not properly being understood. I'll repost the reply I sent to Partha Garu yesterday > [ > Respected Partha Garu, > > Absolutely, As consistent with my nature i always take any rule with a pinch of salt, there can not be a thumb rule working for every chart. i just wanted to find out the acceptibilty or otherwise of a peculier combination (11th house). but thanks for your valuable suggetion as it will only strenghthen my mind set about 'rules'.] > > for the combination we are discussing presently, or let it be any combination which we discuss in future, It is out of question to judge it in isolation when seeing a chart. I am taking any rule with the combination of other relevent rules always. > > Thank you very much for your suggetions & knowledge which is always a welcome. > > Utpal > > > Sourav Chowdhury <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > Dear Pathak-bhai, > Namaskar. Your 5-points on 11H and AK are fine and > we already discussed them extensively. Remember that 11 is only one > of the houses in the 2,5,8,11 houses that we have to see for a > successful jyotishi. See the keyword here is to have *successful*. A > very strong combination of 5th and 8th without 11th can give a > native with strong interest in jyotisha/occult but not necessarily > make him a successful one. It has also to involve 2H (vak siddhi) > and 11 h (success and wisdom). So please dont focus strongly on 11H > alone. This that I am telling is what I learnt from Guru Narasimha- > ji's classes. > > Regards, > > Sourav > ==================================================================== > > vedic astrology, "utpal pathak" > <vedic_pathak> wrote: > > > > Dear Souravji & Parthaji, > > > > I was thinking a lot on the issue of 11th house placement of > Atmakarak > > & learning of Jyotish, for last half an hour. > > as i have already written in my previous mail that I am not > > understanding the much importance given to 11th house for the > subject > > of Astrlogy (Occult) though only thing was obvious that it is a > 4th > > house from 8th and a Panafar as well as Upachaya. > > > > but I have found a good reasoning by which i can technically > accept > > the rule which is described as under > > > > as we know that > > 1) Panafar are the house of seeing future i.e 2nd, 5th, 8th & > 11th. > > as it is said that connection of the above houses may generate > > interest in astrology and allied studies. > > > > 2)Atmakarka is the king of a chart. it Represents the > > Direction/desire of one's atma > > > > 3)Primary Argala's are 2nd, 4th & 11th > > > > 4)8th House is a basic & pivotal house for occult knowledge such > as > > astrology. > > > > 5)11th house beside being a house of Fructification of desires, > also > > the 4th (Learning) house from 8th (Jyotisha Shastra) > > > > Now if we combined the above 5 points than very intresting product > > comes out of the fusion. i.e 11th house gets connected with all > the > > above points. The most important point in favour of 11th house is > > that it can only Cause Argala(Conclusive interference) to th 8th > > house. the other Panfar namely 2nd, 5th can not cause argala to > 8th > > and 5th even causes virodh argala. > > > > With the above explanation to myself, I can now without dowbt > accept > > the rule of Atmakarka in 11th and intrest in jyotish or any other > > occult knowledge. > > > > will be hapy to know your views. > > > > best regards > > > > Utpal > > > > > > vedic astrology, "V.Partha sarathy" > > <partvinu@g...> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Sourav > > > > > > The basis of all the divisional charts is a Modulo, for example > d- > > 20, > > > 20/12=8 thus 8th house is the seed for d-20 > > > Similarly, for d-16, 16/12, remainder is 4, Thus fourth house is > > the > > > basis of d-16, that is the chart for sukha. > > > Now for d-24, 24/12= Remainder is 0, which should be taken as 12 > > > itself and thus 12th house represents the Para Vidya. > > > > > > 4th house represents the school till 12th class.in siddhamsa > > > 9th represents undergraduate > > > 2nd house-post graduation > > > 7th house-doctoral > > > 12th house -post doctoral. > > > > > > Now this is for mundane level studies. > > > > > > In rasi when we talk of initial learning we see 2nd house, 4th > > house > > > schooling, 5th house for mantra shastra and higher learning > > > 9th house for Guru based scriptural learning > > > 12th house for Spiritual learning. > > > The karaka argument doesnot hold, as Jupiter is also Karaka of > 9th > > > and 11th house. Jupiter is not only for mantra(5th house) but > also > > > for gurupadesa. > > > The karaka for 12th house is saturn. Now it is your turn to > think > > as > > > to what Saturn represents and how it is the karaka for 12th > house. > > > Pouranmi Tithi is ruled by saturn. > > > There is no redundancy when you think harder regarding 8th > house. > > 8th > > > house is the body of knowledge itself, whereas 11th house shows > > > learning of the same. > > > Similary 8th can also show speculation, but the actual activity > is > > > seen from 5th house. > > > AK will remove blockage as AK represents the Light of paramatma. > > > > > > best wishes > > > partha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Sourav Chowdhury" > > > <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > > > > > Dear Partha-ji, > > > > Namaskar. I understand your logic. Its nice. However > > > > there are two issues: > > > > > > > > 1. 4H represents formal knowledge and material knowledge. It is > > > > apara-vidya and this knowledge is needed for sustenance of the > > > > native abd hence is in kendra to the Lagna. Mercury is the > karaka > > of > > > > this house. Moon is the other karaka being the lord of the 4th > > house > > > > in the natural zodiac and represents Manas. Moon represents > > samsara > > > > (world of Maya) and w/o having its own light reflects the > light of > > > > the Sun and thus represents Maya not Satya. Knowledge > associated > > > > with Maya (material knowledge) is aparavidya and not para- > vidya. > > > > > > > > 5H represents mantra vidya and para-vidya (spiritual > knowledge) > > and > > > > its karaka is none other than Ju. The other karaka is Su as he > is > > > > the ruler of the 5th house of the natural zodiac. Thus 5H has > to > > be > > > > associated with true knowledge or para-vidya. > > > > > > > > 12H doesnt necessarily means higher knowledge. It shows > knowledge > > of > > > > the immediate elders like mother, father, teacher who are one > or > > two > > > > generations ahead of the native. > > > > > > > > More of this in Guru Sarajit-ji's article on Siddhamsa (Chap. > 11, > > > > Varga Chakra, Sagar Publications) > > > > > > > > 2. I agree with you about 11H being 4th (learning) from 8H > > (occult) > > > > from the bhavatbhavam concept. However, I am uneasy with this > to > > be > > > > the only reason why 11H is included in the scheme of things. > The > > > > reason is that there is a redundancy of the 8th being > considered > > > > twice - once by itself and another time by being the house from > > > > which 11H is the 4th. > > > > > > > > 3. I am not sure about why AK will remove blockage. Is this a > > > > conceptual thumb rule or is it mentioned somewhere. If so, I > > intend > > > > to learn this carefully. > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > Sourav > > > > > > =================================================================== > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "V.Partha sarathy" > > > > <partvinu@g...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sourav > > > > > > > > > > 11th house is the 7th house or maraka to the fifth house of > > > Mantra > > > > > and Sacred spells, how can it give knowledge of Astrology > then? > > > > > > > > > > 5th house is the house of material knowledge and also > mantra. > > It > > > > is > > > > > not para vidya , as paravidya has to be seen from the 12th > house > > > > (8th > > > > > from 5th). 12th shows the meaning(8th) of the fifth house > > (mantra). > > > > > > > > > > Now coming to the doubt i raised. Atma karaka is not the > > > Jeevatman > > > > > but the representative or rather the theme of the jivatma. > No > > > > planet > > > > > can actually represent Atma, as Atma is beyond all the > > rupa/guna. > > > > > > > > > > When AK is in 11th house it is learning(4th house) the > secrets > > of > > > > the > > > > > world(8th house). This could be through astrology, but need > not > > > be > > > > > the only way. I talked of block to 5th house. When AK is in > > 11th > > > > > house, the Block of fifth house is removed. > > > > > > > > > > Thus there is no hard and fast rule that AK in 11th can give > > > > interest > > > > > in astrology alone, it can be any other occult practice. > > > > > > > > > > Best wishes > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Sourav Chowdhury" > > > > > <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pathak-bhai, > > > > > > Namaskar. It is difficult for me to > exactly > > > > > > ascertain what Sanjay-ji was thinking at that point of > time > > but > > > > let > > > > > > me share my thoughts. > > > > > > > > > > > > 2H (speech) 5H (intelligence/memory/paraavidya) 8H (occult > > > > > > knowledge) and 11H (fulfilment) are all four houses apart > and > > > > hence > > > > > > are mutually supportive. > > > > > > > > > > > > Looking at 11H alone, it is the last house of the > > kaamatrikona. > > > > It > > > > > > has the significance of gains and all kinds of receipts. > It > > > > > > additionally has the significances (amongst other things) > of > > > > > > - worshipping the deities and the good > > > > > > - extreme cunningness > > > > > > - wishfulfillment > > > > > > - wisdom > > > > > > > > > > > > AK is the representative of the jeevatman and its > involvement > > > in > > > > > any > > > > > > of these houses is good. I can only imagine that AK in 11H > > > > > > strengthens fulfilment. Any sign occupied my AK becomes > very > > > > > > important in the chart. See what happens when AK is in the > > 11H > > > > in > > > > > > the D-9. It shows a brave and successful native capable of > > > > > > performing any task. Also AK in the 11H has direct > > opportunity > > > > to > > > > > > aspect the 5H (what Sanjay-ji called the key house)!! > Graha > > > > drishti > > > > > > of AK is very strong as it is indicative of soul's desire. > > > > > > > > > > > > This is only to my understanding and interpretation. > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ===================================================================== > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "utpal pathak" > > > > > > <vedic_pathak> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav Bhai, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sanjayji gave a lot of weightage to Atmakarka's > placement > > in > > > > 11th > > > > > > > house. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I can understand that 11th house is 4th from 8th & > > knowledge > > > > for > > > > > > > hidden/occult , also a Panafar but why so much > importance > > of > > > > > > > Atmakarka to only 11th house? can you enlighten me. I am > > not > > > > > > asking > > > > > > > this because i have that perticular combination but I > need > > > > some > > > > > > more > > > > > > > technical clarifications. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > utpal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Sourav > Chowdhury" > > > > > > > <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pathak-bhai, > > > > > > > > Namaskar. Good point made. May I add > a > > > > fresh > > > > > > view > > > > > > > > to your point? Guru Sanjay-ji said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ".... Jyotisha is given by planets who have the ability > > > > > > > > to see the future (Panapara houses 2,5,8,11). Of > these, > > the > > > > > > fifth > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > the controlling house for the future. Jupiter and Rahu > > have > > > > > > special > > > > > > > > aspect on the fifth house, and are hte best > astrologers. > > > > They > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > followed by Mars who can aspect the 8th house." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H shows paravidya (worldly knowledge, 5H shows aparaa- > > > vidya > > > > > > > > (spiritual knowledge, mantra diksha etc) and 8H shows > > > occult > > > > > > > > knowledge. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thus jyotisha knowledge is definitely part of 5H and > 8H > > > > > quality. > > > > > > > > Hence, planets having 5th and 8th aspects can give > > jyotisha > > > > > > > > understandings, if that is what Guru Sanjay-ji meant. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ju and Ra are planets that can give 5th aspects, and > Mars > > > > can > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > 8th aspect. Hence these planets are significant. As > you > > > > rightly > > > > > > > > pointed out, Ra is a planet of wrong desires and can > lead > > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > > to negative channels or selfishness. Ju in addition to > > > > having a > > > > > > 5th > > > > > > > > aspect is himself the planet of dhi - intelligence and > > > > sashtras > > > > > > > > traditional knowledge. Hence Ju has an added > significance > > > > over > > > > > > Rahu. > > > > > > > > There is another significance of Ra, that of > > a 'researcher' > > > > > > hence > > > > > > > > Rahu aspect can show intense research that is good to > > > > > understand > > > > > > > > jyotisha. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, I tend to keep my views on assessment of > > jyotisha > > > > > > talent > > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > seeing any good connection between 2H, 5H, 8H and 11H > or > > > > their > > > > > > > > lords. All planets have different qualities and can > > > > influence > > > > > > > > jyotisha learning in different ways. For example, Sa > > > > signifies > > > > > > > > discipline and hardwork and such is a necessary > component > > > > for a > > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > jyotishi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Again, thanks for your good posting. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ===================================================================== > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Utpal Pathak > > > > > > > > <vedic_pathak> wrote: > > > > > > > > > dear Saurav bhai & Cramer, > > > > > > > > > [ > > > > > > > > > Why is Rahu/North Node having a aspect on 5th > house: > > It > > > > is > > > > > > not a > > > > > > > > > > planet right? > > > > > > > > > ] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu & Ketu though not physical bodies, are accepted > as > > > > very > > > > > > > > important by ancient writers. > > > > > > > > > Ketu doesn't aspect becuase it is headless but what > > about > > > > > > Rahu's > > > > > > > > 5th, 9th & 12th Drashti? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I came to know a good explanation for this and pass > it > > on > > > > to > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > for your intrest.. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is a enemy of guru & vice versa (Guru is only > > > > inimical > > > > > to > > > > > > > > Rahu). so wherever Guru want to cast his benign > aspect, > > our > > > > > dear > > > > > > > > demon Rahu wants to wreck it. Guru wants to teach > Jyotish > > > so > > > > > > Rahu > > > > > > > > also wants to Teach it but in entirely different way > and > > > for > > > > > > > > opposite motives. Guru want to give good qualities > wants > > a > > > > > > person > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > follow dharma and make him 'Tolerable' by aspecting > 9th > > > > house, > > > > > > Rahu > > > > > > > > wants to destroy the Dharma by casting the same 9th > house > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > wants to make him 'Nastika' and 'Intolerable' > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > just occured to write few lines to a already better > > > > learned > > > > > > > person. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > utpal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav Chowdhury <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Kramer, > > > > > > > > > Namaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. In my Rasi, Navamsa, D-10 and D-24 I see that > > > > connection. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. Strong 9H means you will follow dharma. Not > > > necessarily > > > > > > become > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > astrologer. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. I am not sure why he mentioned Ra. I know Ke's > > > > involvement > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > definite. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav > > > > > > > > > > > > > ============================================================= > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic- > astrology, "giddyupguys" > > > > > > > > > <giddyupguys> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Three questions: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not sure about others, but I have some > > > reasonably > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > > > connections in my D-24. But I believe that > without > > > > Guru's > > > > > > > > > blessings > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How about in rasi chart? Where are the planets > > > according > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > rising > > > > > > > > > > sign? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why is 9th house not taken by Sanjay Rath for one > to > > be > > > > a > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > > astrologer. One has to have a good 9th house/lord > is > > > > what I > > > > > > > > > thought. > > > > > > > > > > Can somebody explain? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why is Rahu/North Node having a aspect on 5th > house: > > It > > > > is > > > > > > not > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > planet right? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kramer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic- > astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > Krishnaarpanamastu > > || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To from this group, send an email to: > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the > > > > > Terms > > > > > of > > > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam > > protection > > > > > > around > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > Links > > > vedic astrology/ > > > vedic astrology > > Terms of Service. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 22, 2005 Report Share Posted April 22, 2005 Sourav da certainly !! No book can give so much gain that we had from our discussions :-> :-> yours, utpal chandrakant pathak vedic astrology, "Sourav Chowdhury" <souravc108> wrote: > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > Dear Pathak-bhai, > Namaskar. I most certainly understand your point. > Lot of things are learnt and clarified with this 11H house > discussions. It does signifies gains isn't it ? See how much we have > gained by this discussion. > > Regards, > > Sourav > ==================================================================== > > vedic astrology, Utpal Pathak > <vedic_pathak> wrote: > > Dear Surav Dada !! > > Namaskar, > > > > I think I am not properly being understood. I'll repost the reply > I sent to Partha Garu yesterday > > [ > > Respected Partha Garu, > > > > Absolutely, As consistent with my nature i always take any rule > with a pinch of salt, there can not be a thumb rule working for > every chart. i just wanted to find out the acceptibilty or otherwise > of a peculier combination (11th house). but thanks for your valuable > suggetion as it will only strenghthen my mind set about 'rules'.] > > > > for the combination we are discussing presently, or let it be any > combination which we discuss in future, It is out of question to > judge it in isolation when seeing a chart. I am taking any rule with > the combination of other relevent rules always. > > > > Thank you very much for your suggetions & knowledge which is > always a welcome. > > > > Utpal > > > > > > Sourav Chowdhury <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > Dear Pathak-bhai, > > Namaskar. Your 5-points on 11H and AK are fine > and > > we already discussed them extensively. Remember that 11 is only > one > > of the houses in the 2,5,8,11 houses that we have to see for a > > successful jyotishi. See the keyword here is to have *successful*. > A > > very strong combination of 5th and 8th without 11th can give a > > native with strong interest in jyotisha/occult but not necessarily > > make him a successful one. It has also to involve 2H (vak siddhi) > > and 11 h (success and wisdom). So please dont focus strongly on > 11H > > alone. This that I am telling is what I learnt from Guru Narasimha- > > ji's classes. > > > > Regards, > > > > Sourav > > > ==================================================================== > > > > vedic astrology, "utpal pathak" > > <vedic_pathak> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Souravji & Parthaji, > > > > > > I was thinking a lot on the issue of 11th house placement of > > Atmakarak > > > & learning of Jyotish, for last half an hour. > > > as i have already written in my previous mail that I am not > > > understanding the much importance given to 11th house for the > > subject > > > of Astrlogy (Occult) though only thing was obvious that it is a > > 4th > > > house from 8th and a Panafar as well as Upachaya. > > > > > > but I have found a good reasoning by which i can technically > > accept > > > the rule which is described as under > > > > > > as we know that > > > 1) Panafar are the house of seeing future i.e 2nd, 5th, 8th & > > 11th. > > > as it is said that connection of the above houses may generate > > > interest in astrology and allied studies. > > > > > > 2)Atmakarka is the king of a chart. it Represents the > > > Direction/desire of one's atma > > > > > > 3)Primary Argala's are 2nd, 4th & 11th > > > > > > 4)8th House is a basic & pivotal house for occult knowledge such > > as > > > astrology. > > > > > > 5)11th house beside being a house of Fructification of desires, > > also > > > the 4th (Learning) house from 8th (Jyotisha Shastra) > > > > > > Now if we combined the above 5 points than very intresting > product > > > comes out of the fusion. i.e 11th house gets connected with all > > the > > > above points. The most important point in favour of 11th house > is > > > that it can only Cause Argala(Conclusive interference) to th 8th > > > house. the other Panfar namely 2nd, 5th can not cause argala to > > 8th > > > and 5th even causes virodh argala. > > > > > > With the above explanation to myself, I can now without dowbt > > accept > > > the rule of Atmakarka in 11th and intrest in jyotish or any > other > > > occult knowledge. > > > > > > will be hapy to know your views. > > > > > > best regards > > > > > > Utpal > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "V.Partha sarathy" > > > <partvinu@g...> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Sourav > > > > > > > > The basis of all the divisional charts is a Modulo, for > example > > d- > > > 20, > > > > 20/12=8 thus 8th house is the seed for d-20 > > > > Similarly, for d-16, 16/12, remainder is 4, Thus fourth house > is > > > the > > > > basis of d-16, that is the chart for sukha. > > > > Now for d-24, 24/12= Remainder is 0, which should be taken as > 12 > > > > itself and thus 12th house represents the Para Vidya. > > > > > > > > 4th house represents the school till 12th class.in siddhamsa > > > > 9th represents undergraduate > > > > 2nd house-post graduation > > > > 7th house-doctoral > > > > 12th house -post doctoral. > > > > > > > > Now this is for mundane level studies. > > > > > > > > In rasi when we talk of initial learning we see 2nd house, 4th > > > house > > > > schooling, 5th house for mantra shastra and higher learning > > > > 9th house for Guru based scriptural learning > > > > 12th house for Spiritual learning. > > > > The karaka argument doesnot hold, as Jupiter is also Karaka of > > 9th > > > > and 11th house. Jupiter is not only for mantra(5th house) but > > also > > > > for gurupadesa. > > > > The karaka for 12th house is saturn. Now it is your turn to > > think > > > as > > > > to what Saturn represents and how it is the karaka for 12th > > house. > > > > Pouranmi Tithi is ruled by saturn. > > > > There is no redundancy when you think harder regarding 8th > > house. > > > 8th > > > > house is the body of knowledge itself, whereas 11th house > shows > > > > learning of the same. > > > > Similary 8th can also show speculation, but the actual > activity > > is > > > > seen from 5th house. > > > > AK will remove blockage as AK represents the Light of > paramatma. > > > > > > > > best wishes > > > > partha > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Sourav Chowdhury" > > > > <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > > > > > > > Dear Partha-ji, > > > > > Namaskar. I understand your logic. Its nice. However > > > > > there are two issues: > > > > > > > > > > 1. 4H represents formal knowledge and material knowledge. It > is > > > > > apara-vidya and this knowledge is needed for sustenance of > the > > > > > native abd hence is in kendra to the Lagna. Mercury is the > > karaka > > > of > > > > > this house. Moon is the other karaka being the lord of the > 4th > > > house > > > > > in the natural zodiac and represents Manas. Moon represents > > > samsara > > > > > (world of Maya) and w/o having its own light reflects the > > light of > > > > > the Sun and thus represents Maya not Satya. Knowledge > > associated > > > > > with Maya (material knowledge) is aparavidya and not para- > > vidya. > > > > > > > > > > 5H represents mantra vidya and para-vidya (spiritual > > knowledge) > > > and > > > > > its karaka is none other than Ju. The other karaka is Su as > he > > is > > > > > the ruler of the 5th house of the natural zodiac. Thus 5H > has > > to > > > be > > > > > associated with true knowledge or para-vidya. > > > > > > > > > > 12H doesnt necessarily means higher knowledge. It shows > > knowledge > > > of > > > > > the immediate elders like mother, father, teacher who are > one > > or > > > two > > > > > generations ahead of the native. > > > > > > > > > > More of this in Guru Sarajit-ji's article on Siddhamsa > (Chap. > > 11, > > > > > Varga Chakra, Sagar Publications) > > > > > > > > > > 2. I agree with you about 11H being 4th (learning) from 8H > > > (occult) > > > > > from the bhavatbhavam concept. However, I am uneasy with > this > > to > > > be > > > > > the only reason why 11H is included in the scheme of things. > > The > > > > > reason is that there is a redundancy of the 8th being > > considered > > > > > twice - once by itself and another time by being the house > from > > > > > which 11H is the 4th. > > > > > > > > > > 3. I am not sure about why AK will remove blockage. Is this a > > > > > conceptual thumb rule or is it mentioned somewhere. If so, I > > > intend > > > > > to learn this carefully. > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > Sourav > > > > > > > > > =================================================================== > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "V.Partha sarathy" > > > > > <partvinu@g...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sourav > > > > > > > > > > > > 11th house is the 7th house or maraka to the fifth house > of > > > > Mantra > > > > > > and Sacred spells, how can it give knowledge of Astrology > > then? > > > > > > > > > > > > 5th house is the house of material knowledge and also > > mantra. > > > It > > > > > is > > > > > > not para vidya , as paravidya has to be seen from the 12th > > house > > > > > (8th > > > > > > from 5th). 12th shows the meaning(8th) of the fifth house > > > (mantra). > > > > > > > > > > > > Now coming to the doubt i raised. Atma karaka is not the > > > > Jeevatman > > > > > > but the representative or rather the theme of the jivatma. > > No > > > > > planet > > > > > > can actually represent Atma, as Atma is beyond all the > > > rupa/guna. > > > > > > > > > > > > When AK is in 11th house it is learning(4th house) the > > secrets > > > of > > > > > the > > > > > > world(8th house). This could be through astrology, but > need > > not > > > > be > > > > > > the only way. I talked of block to 5th house. When AK is > in > > > 11th > > > > > > house, the Block of fifth house is removed. > > > > > > > > > > > > Thus there is no hard and fast rule that AK in 11th can > give > > > > > interest > > > > > > in astrology alone, it can be any other occult practice. > > > > > > > > > > > > Best wishes > > > > > > partha > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Sourav Chowdhury" > > > > > > <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pathak-bhai, > > > > > > > Namaskar. It is difficult for me to > > exactly > > > > > > > ascertain what Sanjay-ji was thinking at that point of > > time > > > but > > > > > let > > > > > > > me share my thoughts. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2H (speech) 5H (intelligence/memory/paraavidya) 8H > (occult > > > > > > > knowledge) and 11H (fulfilment) are all four houses > apart > > and > > > > > hence > > > > > > > are mutually supportive. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Looking at 11H alone, it is the last house of the > > > kaamatrikona. > > > > > It > > > > > > > has the significance of gains and all kinds of receipts. > > It > > > > > > > additionally has the significances (amongst other > things) > > of > > > > > > > - worshipping the deities and the good > > > > > > > - extreme cunningness > > > > > > > - wishfulfillment > > > > > > > - wisdom > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AK is the representative of the jeevatman and its > > involvement > > > > in > > > > > > any > > > > > > > of these houses is good. I can only imagine that AK in > 11H > > > > > > > strengthens fulfilment. Any sign occupied my AK becomes > > very > > > > > > > important in the chart. See what happens when AK is in > the > > > 11H > > > > > in > > > > > > > the D-9. It shows a brave and successful native capable > of > > > > > > > performing any task. Also AK in the 11H has direct > > > opportunity > > > > > to > > > > > > > aspect the 5H (what Sanjay-ji called the key house)!! > > Graha > > > > > drishti > > > > > > > of AK is very strong as it is indicative of soul's > desire. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is only to my understanding and interpretation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ===================================================================== > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "utpal pathak" > > > > > > > <vedic_pathak> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav Bhai, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sanjayji gave a lot of weightage to Atmakarka's > > placement > > > in > > > > > 11th > > > > > > > > house. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I can understand that 11th house is 4th from 8th & > > > knowledge > > > > > for > > > > > > > > hidden/occult , also a Panafar but why so much > > importance > > > of > > > > > > > > Atmakarka to only 11th house? can you enlighten me. I > am > > > not > > > > > > > asking > > > > > > > > this because i have that perticular combination but I > > need > > > > > some > > > > > > > more > > > > > > > > technical clarifications. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > utpal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, "Sourav > > Chowdhury" > > > > > > > > <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Pathak-bhai, > > > > > > > > > Namaskar. Good point made. May I > add > > a > > > > > fresh > > > > > > > view > > > > > > > > > to your point? Guru Sanjay-ji said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ".... Jyotisha is given by planets who have the > ability > > > > > > > > > to see the future (Panapara houses 2,5,8,11). Of > > these, > > > the > > > > > > > fifth > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > the controlling house for the future. Jupiter and > Rahu > > > have > > > > > > > special > > > > > > > > > aspect on the fifth house, and are hte best > > astrologers. > > > > > They > > > > > > > are > > > > > > > > > followed by Mars who can aspect the 8th house." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H shows paravidya (worldly knowledge, 5H shows > aparaa- > > > > vidya > > > > > > > > > (spiritual knowledge, mantra diksha etc) and 8H > shows > > > > occult > > > > > > > > > knowledge. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thus jyotisha knowledge is definitely part of 5H and > > 8H > > > > > > quality. > > > > > > > > > Hence, planets having 5th and 8th aspects can give > > > jyotisha > > > > > > > > > understandings, if that is what Guru Sanjay-ji meant. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ju and Ra are planets that can give 5th aspects, and > > Mars > > > > > can > > > > > > > give > > > > > > > > > 8th aspect. Hence these planets are significant. As > > you > > > > > rightly > > > > > > > > > pointed out, Ra is a planet of wrong desires and can > > lead > > > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > > > to negative channels or selfishness. Ju in addition > to > > > > > having a > > > > > > > 5th > > > > > > > > > aspect is himself the planet of dhi - intelligence > and > > > > > sashtras > > > > > > > > > traditional knowledge. Hence Ju has an added > > significance > > > > > over > > > > > > > Rahu. > > > > > > > > > There is another significance of Ra, that of > > > a 'researcher' > > > > > > > hence > > > > > > > > > Rahu aspect can show intense research that is good > to > > > > > > understand > > > > > > > > > jyotisha. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, I tend to keep my views on assessment of > > > jyotisha > > > > > > > talent > > > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > seeing any good connection between 2H, 5H, 8H and > 11H > > or > > > > > their > > > > > > > > > lords. All planets have different qualities and can > > > > > influence > > > > > > > > > jyotisha learning in different ways. For example, Sa > > > > > signifies > > > > > > > > > discipline and hardwork and such is a necessary > > component > > > > > for a > > > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > jyotishi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Again, thanks for your good posting. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ===================================================================== > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology, Utpal Pathak > > > > > > > > > <vedic_pathak> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > dear Saurav bhai & Cramer, > > > > > > > > > > [ > > > > > > > > > > Why is Rahu/North Node having a aspect on 5th > > house: > > > It > > > > > is > > > > > > > not a > > > > > > > > > > > planet right? > > > > > > > > > > ] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu & Ketu though not physical bodies, are > accepted > > as > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > important by ancient writers. > > > > > > > > > > Ketu doesn't aspect becuase it is headless but > what > > > about > > > > > > > Rahu's > > > > > > > > > 5th, 9th & 12th Drashti? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I came to know a good explanation for this and > pass > > it > > > on > > > > > to > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > > for your intrest.. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu is a enemy of guru & vice versa (Guru is only > > > > > inimical > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > Rahu). so wherever Guru want to cast his benign > > aspect, > > > our > > > > > > dear > > > > > > > > > demon Rahu wants to wreck it. Guru wants to teach > > Jyotish > > > > so > > > > > > > Rahu > > > > > > > > > also wants to Teach it but in entirely different way > > and > > > > for > > > > > > > > > opposite motives. Guru want to give good qualities > > wants > > > a > > > > > > > person > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > follow dharma and make him 'Tolerable' by aspecting > > 9th > > > > > house, > > > > > > > Rahu > > > > > > > > > wants to destroy the Dharma by casting the same 9th > > house > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > wants to make him 'Nastika' and 'Intolerable' > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > just occured to write few lines to a already > better > > > > > learned > > > > > > > > person. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > utpal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav Chowdhury <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Kramer, > > > > > > > > > > Namaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. In my Rasi, Navamsa, D-10 and D-24 I see that > > > > > connection. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. Strong 9H means you will follow dharma. Not > > > > necessarily > > > > > > > become > > > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > > astrologer. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. I am not sure why he mentioned Ra. I know Ke's > > > > > involvement > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > definite. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ============================================================= > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic- > > astrology, "giddyupguys" > > > > > > > > > > <giddyupguys> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sourav, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Three questions: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not sure about others, but I have some > > > > reasonably > > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > > > > connections in my D-24. But I believe that > > without > > > > > Guru's > > > > > > > > > > blessings > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > How about in rasi chart? Where are the planets > > > > according > > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > > rising > > > > > > > > > > > sign? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why is 9th house not taken by Sanjay Rath for > one > > to > > > be > > > > > a > > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > > > astrologer. One has to have a good 9th > house/lord > > is > > > > > what I > > > > > > > > > > thought. > > > > > > > > > > > Can somebody explain? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why is Rahu/North Node having a aspect on 5th > > house: > > > It > > > > > is > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > a > > > > > > > > > > > planet right? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kramer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Archives: vedic- > > astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Group info: vedic- > > > > > > > astrology/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri > > Krishnaarpanamastu > > > || > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To from this group, send an email > to: > > > > > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your use of is subject to the > > > > > > > Terms > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tired of spam? Mail has the best spam > > > protection > > > > > > > around > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology- > > > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us ....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Links > > > > > > vedic astrology/ > > > > > > vedic astrology > > > > Terms of > Service. > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 23, 2005 Report Share Posted April 23, 2005 Om Krishna Guru Dear Sri Rao This concept is given in Phaladeepika too and I agree by it. However Jyotish being a higher science should it include 12th house rather than 11th house as it is the 5th house from the 8th? You not only seem humble but a person who respects others. I admire your posts both in analysis and in the manner you present them. Best Regards vedic astrology, "Raghunatha RaoNemani" <raon1008> wrote: > > Om Krishna Guru > > Namaste Pandit, > > Why 11th house is important because, if you take 8th house > for Occult Sciences/knowledge, then 4th from 8th is 11th, > which is learning of Occult sciences/knolwedge. Is it not? > > Regards > Raghunatha Rao > > > vedic astrology, Panditji <navagraha@g...> > wrote: > > Namaste, > > > > I can understand 2 for vak ( speech), 5 for higher knowledge, 8 for > > Goodh/occult vidya. Why 11 ? > > > > ... > > > > On 4/22/05, Sourav Chowdhury <sourav12@h...> wrote: > > > > > > || Hare Rama Krishna || > > > > > > Dear Pandit-ji, > > > Namaste. No we are talking specifically about what > > > can make a native a successful astrologer (success in divination; > > > its not material success in earning from astrology). These > > > considerations are only for D-1 and D-24. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Sourav > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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