Translation of slokas from Mani Mala on Planetary G...

February 20, 2006

Dear Sriman,

The translations of Mani Mala by Tagore - Verses 79-81 are correct. I have

uploaded the

original Sanskrit texts to the PHOTOS section of this group for anyone to check.

Verses 80-81 make no sense. Therefore it appears that Mani Mala is an imperfect

source

of gem knowledge. And it should not be followed as is.

One thing interesting is that books on Indian gemology, like Mani Mala, they

only talk

about adverse planets. And they never mention what to do for Anukul planets

(which is

obviously to wear the gem for the Anukul graha, viz., Anukula-vad)!??

Point is that for Pratikul Graha we DONATE the gem (ratna-arpana), and for

Anukul Graha

we WEAR the gem. Based on the philosophy that gems strengthen their plant when

worn,

and reduce their planet when donated. One is accepting, other is giving away.

Best rgds,

Richard

vedic astrology, yobrevol wrote:

>

> || Hare Rama Krishna ||

>

> Namaste Richard Ji,

>

> So they are actually correct. Please understand that my reservations were

> not personal towards you in nature, rather towards the stated translation. I

am

> in agreement with you with the sloka 79 as I also come from Anukul school of

> thought as taught by my guru.

>

> I am just trying to figure out why would mani mala say what it states in

> sloka 80+...have you read another version of mani mala translated by another

> author...?

>

> To think that we should wear Blue sapphire for adverse moon is beyond my

> limited understanding, specially when we make a blunt general statement like

> that...I mean moon is neither exalted nor debilitated in saturn signs, and

then

> the author of mani mala further suggests wearing a pearl for adverse

> Jupiter...where jupiter gets exalted, so their is inconsistency here...

>

> Having said that, may be Guru Ji and other learned will throw some light...

>

> Namaste

> Gaurav Jain

>

> In a message dated 2/20/2006 3:57:55 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

> rsbj66 writes:

>

> Dear Sriman,

>

> Namaste!!! I am not suggesting anything, these are three slokas taken from

> Mani Mala

> written by SM Tagore published in 1879. I'm just putting these slokas out

> for comment.

>

> I personally agree with the first sloka 79. When Sun is adverse one should

> DONATE a ruby,

> for adverse Moon one should donate a pearl, as in Ratna-dana-vidhi

>

> And when these planets are beneficial (anukul) then one should WEAR the

> associated gem,

> as if Sun is anukul in the chart then Ruby can be worn, as in ratna-dharana.

>

> Gem should be WORN for good planet / gem should be DONATED for bad planet.

>

> I personally disagree with slokas 80-81. But as they are from the famous

> Mani Mali so I

> have put them for your interest.

>

> Best regards,

> Richard

>

> vedic astrology, yobrevol@ wrote:

> >

> > || Hare Rama Krishna ||

> >

> > Namaste richard ji,

> >

> > If I am reading it correctly , what you are suggesting via these slokas is

>

> > that we should give away diamond to propitiate venus, and at the same time

> wear

> > diamond when venus is adverse? and that we wear blue sapphire to nullify

> > adverse effects of moon?....lets not forget that jupiter exalts in

> cancer, so

> > how in the right mind can we suggest wearing pearl to "ward off" the

> adverse

> > effects of jupiter...?

> >

> > are you sure about the authenticity of the translations?

> >

> > Also, to the learned, where can I get a copy of Mani mala?

> >

> > Namaste

> > Gaurav Jain

> >

> > In a message dated 2/20/2006 2:50:03 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

> > rsbj66@ writes:

> >

> > Translation 79: Ill Stars and how to propitiate them by bestowal (dana)

> > of gems:

> >

> > When the Sun is hostile (donate) a pure ruby; when the Moon, a good

> > pearl; when Mangala, a good coral; when Budha, a good emerald; when

> > Brihaspati, a good yellow sapphire; when Shukra, the diamond; when

> > Shani, a good blue sapphire; when Rahu, the gomeda; and when Ketu, a

> > good cat's eye, should be donated

> >

> > Translation 80-81: Ill Stars and how to ward them off by wearing

> > (dharan) of gems:

> >

> > If the Sun is adverse, (wear) the cat's eye; if the Moon, the blue

> > sapphire; if Mangala, the ruby; if Budha, the ruby too; if Vrihaspati,

> > the pearl; if Shukra, the diamond; if Shani, the great blue sapphire;

> > if Rahu, the gomeda, and if Ketu, the emerald, should be worn.

> >

> > Send instant messages to your online friends

> http://uk.messenger.

> >

> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> >

> > ------------------------ Groups Sponsor --------------------~-->

> > Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and

> healing

> > _Click Here!_ (http://us.click./lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/.8XolB/TM)

> > --~->

> >

> > Archives: vedic astrology

> >

> > Group info: vedic astrology/info.html

> >

> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-

> >

> > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

> >

> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||

> > Links

> >

> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> >

------------------------ Groups Sponsor --------------------~-->

> Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with hope and healing

> _Click Here!_ (http://us.click./lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/.8XolB/TM)

> --~->

>

> Group info: vedic astrology/info.html

>

> To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-

>

> ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

>

> || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||

> Links

>

February 20, 2006

namaste richard ji

the simple rule of anukul/pratikul remedies are clear like this.

retain or wear the objects of a beneficial planet.

donate or throw in water the objects of a malefic planet.

in lalkitab system of remedies, this is what is followed precisely.

after years of research through lalkitab remedies, i found stones

would work positively only if those planets are beneficial to the

native in a chart. when the planets are malefic, since natives

cannot afford donating precious stones, they can donate objects

related to those malefic planets. this is where lalkitab comes

handy.

i do not agree with gauravji's observation that if you wear a pearn

for moon, besides moon, jupiter would also be benefited and at the

same time mars gets debilitated. in my knowledge stones have

scientific properties and their single objective is to

receive/absorb the cosmic energies of the respective planets.

simply put, if you wear a stone for a particular planet, if that

planet is a benefic the native gets positive results, and if that

planet is malefic, the native gets negative results.

because of these ambivalence in stone recommendations, i recommend

rudraksha as several puranas attribute lords to each rudaksha and

also attribute what benefits the wearer gets. no anukul, no

pratikul. also it has no negative affects.

with best wishes

arjun

vedic astrology, "Richard Shaw-Brown II"

<rsbj66 wrote:

>

> Dear Sriman,

>

> The translations of Mani Mala by Tagore - Verses 79-81 are

correct. I have uploaded the

> original Sanskrit texts to the PHOTOS section of this group for

anyone to check.

>

> Verses 80-81 make no sense. Therefore it appears that Mani Mala is

an imperfect source

> of gem knowledge. And it should not be followed as is.

>

> One thing interesting is that books on Indian gemology, like Mani

Mala, they only talk

> about adverse planets. And they never mention what to do for

Anukul planets (which is

> obviously to wear the gem for the Anukul graha, viz., Anukula-

vad)!??

>

> Point is that for Pratikul Graha we DONATE the gem (ratna-arpana),

and for Anukul Graha

> we WEAR the gem. Based on the philosophy that gems strengthen

their plant when worn,

> and reduce their planet when donated. One is accepting, other is

giving away.

>

> Best rgds,

> Richard

>

> vedic astrology, yobrevol@ wrote:

> >

> > || Hare Rama Krishna ||

> >

> > Namaste Richard Ji,

> >

> > So they are actually correct. Please understand that my

reservations were

> > not personal towards you in nature, rather towards the stated

translation. I am

> > in agreement with you with the sloka 79 as I also come from

Anukul school of

> > thought as taught by my guru.

> >

> > I am just trying to figure out why would mani mala say what it

states in

> > sloka 80+...have you read another version of mani mala

translated by another

> > author...?

> >

> > To think that we should wear Blue sapphire for adverse moon is

beyond my

> > limited understanding, specially when we make a blunt general

statement like

> > that...I mean moon is neither exalted nor debilitated in saturn

signs, and then

> > the author of mani mala further suggests wearing a pearl for

adverse

> > Jupiter...where jupiter gets exalted, so their is inconsistency

here...

> >

> > Having said that, may be Guru Ji and other learned will throw

some light...

> >

> > Namaste

> > Gaurav Jain

> >

> > In a message dated 2/20/2006 3:57:55 P.M. Eastern Standard

Time,

> > rsbj66@ writes:

> >

> > Dear Sriman,

> >

> > Namaste!!! I am not suggesting anything, these are three slokas

taken from

> > Mani Mala

> > written by SM Tagore published in 1879. I'm just putting these

slokas out

> > for comment.

> >

> > I personally agree with the first sloka 79. When Sun is adverse

one should

> > DONATE a ruby,

> > for adverse Moon one should donate a pearl, as in Ratna-dana-

vidhi

> >

> > And when these planets are beneficial (anukul) then one should

WEAR the

> > associated gem,

> > as if Sun is anukul in the chart then Ruby can be worn, as in

ratna-dharana.

> >

> > Gem should be WORN for good planet / gem should be DONATED for

bad planet.

> >

> > I personally disagree with slokas 80-81. But as they are from

the famous

> > Mani Mali so I

> > have put them for your interest.

> >

> > Best regards,

> > Richard

> >

> > vedic astrology, yobrevol@ wrote:

> > >

> > > || Hare Rama Krishna ||

> > >

> > > Namaste richard ji,

> > >

> > > If I am reading it correctly , what you are suggesting via

these slokas is

> >

> > > that we should give away diamond to propitiate venus, and at

the same time

> > wear

> > > diamond when venus is adverse? and that we wear blue

sapphire to nullify

> > > adverse effects of moon?....lets not forget that jupiter

exalts in

> > cancer, so

> > > how in the right mind can we suggest wearing pearl to "ward

off" the

> > adverse

> > > effects of jupiter...?

> > >

> > > are you sure about the authenticity of the translations?

> > >

> > > Also, to the learned, where can I get a copy of Mani mala?

> > >

> > > Namaste

> > > Gaurav Jain

> > >

> > > In a message dated 2/20/2006 2:50:03 P.M. Eastern Standard

Time,

> > > rsbj66@ writes:

> > >

> > > Translation 79: Ill Stars and how to propitiate them by

bestowal (dana)

> > > of gems:

> > >

> > > When the Sun is hostile (donate) a pure ruby; when the Moon,

a good

> > > pearl; when Mangala, a good coral; when Budha, a good

emerald; when

> > > Brihaspati, a good yellow sapphire; when Shukra, the

diamond; when

> > > Shani, a good blue sapphire; when Rahu, the gomeda; and when

Ketu, a

> > > good cat's eye, should be donated

> > >

> > > Translation 80-81: Ill Stars and how to ward them off by

wearing

> > > (dharan) of gems:

> > >

> > > If the Sun is adverse, (wear) the cat's eye; if the Moon,

the blue

> > > sapphire; if Mangala, the ruby; if Budha, the ruby too; if

Vrihaspati,

> > > the pearl; if Shukra, the diamond; if Shani, the great blue

sapphire;

> > > if Rahu, the gomeda, and if Ketu, the emerald, should be

worn.

> > >

> > > Send instant messages to your online friends

> > http://uk.messenger.

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> > >

> > > ------------------------ Groups Sponsor --------------

------~-->

> > > Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with

hope and

> > healing

> > > _Click Here!_

(http://us.click./lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/.8XolB/TM)

> > > -----------------------------

------~->

> > >

> > > Archives: vedic astrology

> > >

> > > Group info: vedic-

astrology/info.html

> > >

> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-

> > >

> > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

> > >

> > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||

> > > Links

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> > >

> >

> > ------------------------ Groups Sponsor -----------------

---~-->

> > Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with

hope and healing

> > _Click Here!_

(http://us.click./lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/.8XolB/TM)

> > --------------------------------

---~->

> >

> > Group info: vedic-

astrology/info.html

> >

> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-

> >

> > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

> >

> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||

> > Links

> >

>

February 21, 2006

Dear Sriman,

Namaste!!! Yes, exactly!!!

> namaste richard ji

>

> the simple rule of anukul/pratikul remedies are clear like this.

>

> retain or wear the objects of a beneficial planet.

> donate or throw in water the objects of a malefic planet.

February 21, 2006

Jaya Jagannatha

Dear Richard and Arjun,

Namaste

I do not to donating a gomeda to a leper. Do you? What's he going

to do? Take away your bad karma on your behalf when he himself is riddled

with disease?

We need to be more realistic here. The Puranas do not to such

remedies. Instead, they do suggest dakshina to a Brahmana/Purohit. This is

so that we hope the Brahmana/Purohit can take away some of our bad karma.

This can be done in one of several ways: When transits are averse or just

before the person dies/or during a shraddha.

My suggestion is that, gifts (of gems and other items) have to be new and

not your cast offs.

Regarding the slokas sent by Richard (embedded below), these are my initial

thoughts:

The language is not ancient Sanskrit where there was less tendency of using

synonyms there (an opinion after reading tomes of it; but am no expert!!)

The slokas are more modern phenomenon to use words like "Avaneya". It is

interesting to note that midway in the first line of shloka 81 the author

has forgotten that he is writing for Viguna graha Dharanaa. Certainly not

something the ancients would do! I venture a guess that this comes from

Jaina source of astrological texts which are of a much later origin. Gaurav,

what do you think?

But there does not appear to be any variance about the ratnas that need to

be worn from that of Narada Purana as long as we relate the Ratnas which are

recommended for Dana as they relate to the grahas.

What is in variance is in the matter of those that need to be worn.

A careful look indicates that the shlokas are describing Viguna - meaning

that when the grahas are inimical - for example, Jupiter is malefic

(functional malefic), the recommendation is to wear Pearl. For Cancer lagna

Jupiter will be malefic being the 6th moolatrikona lord, and here

strengthening Moon will certainly make sense as Jupiter is going to create

health problems and also since Moon does not own any bad house. More so if

Jupiter is occupying the 8th House!

In the 3rd sloka, the author appears to have changed the basis on which he's

written the first two shlokas.

For the meaning to be clear, one must also get the shlokas, that indicate

what is Viguna. I assume that it must be given the book. Much would depend

on which position of a graha or its rasi is called as Viguna.

Love,

Swee

vedic astrology

[vedic astrology] On Behalf Of panditarjun2004

Tuesday, February 21, 2006 5:28 AM

vedic astrology

[vedic astrology] Re: Translation of slokas from Mani Mala on

Planetary G...

namaste richard ji

the simple rule of anukul/pratikul remedies are clear like this.

retain or wear the objects of a beneficial planet.

donate or throw in water the objects of a malefic planet.

in lalkitab system of remedies, this is what is followed precisely.

after years of research through lalkitab remedies, i found stones

would work positively only if those planets are beneficial to the

native in a chart. when the planets are malefic, since natives

cannot afford donating precious stones, they can donate objects

related to those malefic planets. this is where lalkitab comes

handy.

i do not agree with gauravji's observation that if you wear a pearn

for moon, besides moon, jupiter would also be benefited and at the

same time mars gets debilitated. in my knowledge stones have

scientific properties and their single objective is to

receive/absorb the cosmic energies of the respective planets.

simply put, if you wear a stone for a particular planet, if that

planet is a benefic the native gets positive results, and if that

planet is malefic, the native gets negative results.

because of these ambivalence in stone recommendations, i recommend

rudraksha as several puranas attribute lords to each rudaksha and

also attribute what benefits the wearer gets. no anukul, no

pratikul. also it has no negative affects.

with best wishes

arjun

vedic astrology, "Richard Shaw-Brown II"

<rsbj66 wrote:

>

> Dear Sriman,

>

> The translations of Mani Mala by Tagore - Verses 79-81 are

correct. I have uploaded the

> original Sanskrit texts to the PHOTOS section of this group for

anyone to check.

>

> Verses 80-81 make no sense. Therefore it appears that Mani Mala is

an imperfect source

> of gem knowledge. And it should not be followed as is.

>

> One thing interesting is that books on Indian gemology, like Mani

Mala, they only talk

> about adverse planets. And they never mention what to do for

Anukul planets (which is

> obviously to wear the gem for the Anukul graha, viz., Anukula-

vad)!??

>

> Point is that for Pratikul Graha we DONATE the gem (ratna-arpana),

and for Anukul Graha

> we WEAR the gem. Based on the philosophy that gems strengthen

their plant when worn,

> and reduce their planet when donated. One is accepting, other is

giving away.

>

> Best rgds,

> Richard

>

> vedic astrology, yobrevol@ wrote:

> >

> > || Hare Rama Krishna ||

> >

> > Namaste Richard Ji,

> >

> > So they are actually correct. Please understand that my

reservations were

> > not personal towards you in nature, rather towards the stated

translation. I am

> > in agreement with you with the sloka 79 as I also come from

Anukul school of

> > thought as taught by my guru.

> >

> > I am just trying to figure out why would mani mala say what it

states in

> > sloka 80+...have you read another version of mani mala

translated by another

> > author...?

> >

> > To think that we should wear Blue sapphire for adverse moon is

beyond my

> > limited understanding, specially when we make a blunt general

statement like

> > that...I mean moon is neither exalted nor debilitated in saturn

signs, and then

> > the author of mani mala further suggests wearing a pearl for

adverse

> > Jupiter...where jupiter gets exalted, so their is inconsistency

here...

> >

> > Having said that, may be Guru Ji and other learned will throw

some light...

> >

> > Namaste

> > Gaurav Jain

> >

> > In a message dated 2/20/2006 3:57:55 P.M. Eastern Standard

Time,

> > rsbj66@ writes:

> >

> > Dear Sriman,

> >

> > Namaste!!! I am not suggesting anything, these are three slokas

taken from

> > Mani Mala

> > written by SM Tagore published in 1879. I'm just putting these

slokas out

> > for comment.

> >

> > I personally agree with the first sloka 79. When Sun is adverse

one should

> > DONATE a ruby,

> > for adverse Moon one should donate a pearl, as in Ratna-dana-

vidhi

> >

> > And when these planets are beneficial (anukul) then one should

WEAR the

> > associated gem,

> > as if Sun is anukul in the chart then Ruby can be worn, as in

ratna-dharana.

> >

> > Gem should be WORN for good planet / gem should be DONATED for

bad planet.

> >

> > I personally disagree with slokas 80-81. But as they are from

the famous

> > Mani Mali so I

> > have put them for your interest.

> >

> > Best regards,

> > Richard

> >

> > vedic astrology, yobrevol@ wrote:

> > >

> > > || Hare Rama Krishna ||

> > >

> > > Namaste richard ji,

> > >

> > > If I am reading it correctly , what you are suggesting via

these slokas is

> >

> > > that we should give away diamond to propitiate venus, and at

the same time

> > wear

> > > diamond when venus is adverse? and that we wear blue

sapphire to nullify

> > > adverse effects of moon?....lets not forget that jupiter

exalts in

> > cancer, so

> > > how in the right mind can we suggest wearing pearl to "ward

off" the

> > adverse

> > > effects of jupiter...?

> > >

> > > are you sure about the authenticity of the translations?

> > >

> > > Also, to the learned, where can I get a copy of Mani mala?

> > >

> > > Namaste

> > > Gaurav Jain

> > >

> > > In a message dated 2/20/2006 2:50:03 P.M. Eastern Standard

Time,

> > > rsbj66@ writes:

> > >

> > > Translation 79: Ill Stars and how to propitiate them by

bestowal (dana)

> > > of gems:

> > >

> > > When the Sun is hostile (donate) a pure ruby; when the Moon,

a good

> > > pearl; when Mangala, a good coral; when Budha, a good

emerald; when

> > > Brihaspati, a good yellow sapphire; when Shukra, the

diamond; when

> > > Shani, a good blue sapphire; when Rahu, the gomeda; and when

Ketu, a

> > > good cat's eye, should be donated

> > >

> > > Translation 80-81: Ill Stars and how to ward them off by

wearing

> > > (dharan) of gems:

> > >

> > > If the Sun is adverse, (wear) the cat's eye; if the Moon,

the blue

> > > sapphire; if Mangala, the ruby; if Budha, the ruby too; if

Vrihaspati,

> > > the pearl; if Shukra, the diamond; if Shani, the great blue

sapphire;

> > > if Rahu, the gomeda, and if Ketu, the emerald, should be

worn.

> > >

> > > Send instant messages to your online friends

> > http://uk.messenger.

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> > >

> > > ------------------------ Groups Sponsor --------------

------~-->

> > > Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with

hope and

> > healing

> > > _Click Here!_

(http://us.click./lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/.8XolB/TM)

> > > -----------------------------

------~->

> > >

> > > Archives: vedic astrology

> > >

> > > Group info: vedic-

astrology/info.html

> > >

> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-

> > >

> > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

> > >

> > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||

> > > Links

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> > >

> >

> > ------------------------ Groups Sponsor -----------------

---~-->

> > Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with

hope and healing

> > _Click Here!_

(http://us.click./lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/.8XolB/TM)

> > --------------------------------

---~->

> >

> > Group info: vedic-

astrology/info.html

> >

> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-

> >

> > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

> >

> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||

> > Links

> >

>

vedic astrology/

vedic astrology

February 21, 2006

dear swee

namaste

you are absolutely right in saying that donating precious gems in

such fashion do not yield any dividends. i wish to extend your

observation on the brahmin/purohit further.

jupiter dwells in a righteous brahmin or purohit who practice all

holy karmas. in olden days people used to give godaan and

suvarnadaan to such brahmins. sages, saints, jyotishis, gurus or

priests, jupiter dwells in all of them and a native can benefit

greatly by treating them well and seeking their blessings.

this is the precise reason why jupiter is the most benefic planet in

the entire solar system and also why a guru is equated to brahma,

vishnu and maheshwar. this is also the reason why most practicing

astrologers in india recommend yellow sapphire blindly to most of

their customers.

by the way, i never recommend donation of precious stones and only

objects in new/good condition which can be used by the receipient.

with best wishes

arjun

vedic astrology, "Swee Chan" <swee wrote:

>

> Jaya Jagannatha

>

> Dear Richard and Arjun,

>

> Namaste

>

> I do not to donating a gomeda to a leper. Do you? What's

he going

> to do? Take away your bad karma on your behalf when he himself is

riddled

> with disease?

>

> We need to be more realistic here. The Puranas do not to

such

> remedies. Instead, they do suggest dakshina to a Brahmana/Purohit.

This is

> so that we hope the Brahmana/Purohit can take away some of our bad

karma.

> This can be done in one of several ways: When transits are averse

or just

> before the person dies/or during a shraddha.

>

> My suggestion is that, gifts (of gems and other items) have to be

new and

> not your cast offs.

>

> Regarding the slokas sent by Richard (embedded below), these are

my initial

> thoughts:

>

> The language is not ancient Sanskrit where there was less tendency

of using

> synonyms there (an opinion after reading tomes of it; but am no

expert!!)

>

> The slokas are more modern phenomenon to use words like "Avaneya".

It is

> interesting to note that midway in the first line of shloka 81 the

author

> has forgotten that he is writing for Viguna graha Dharanaa.

Certainly not

> something the ancients would do! I venture a guess that this

comes from

> Jaina source of astrological texts which are of a much later

origin. Gaurav,

> what do you think?

>

> But there does not appear to be any variance about the ratnas that

need to

> be worn from that of Narada Purana as long as we relate the Ratnas

which are

> recommended for Dana as they relate to the grahas.

>

> What is in variance is in the matter of those that need to be worn.

>

> A careful look indicates that the shlokas are describing Viguna -

meaning

> that when the grahas are inimical - for example, Jupiter is malefic

> (functional malefic), the recommendation is to wear Pearl. For

Cancer lagna

> Jupiter will be malefic being the 6th moolatrikona lord, and here

> strengthening Moon will certainly make sense as Jupiter is going

to create

> health problems and also since Moon does not own any bad house.

More so if

> Jupiter is occupying the 8th House!

>

> In the 3rd sloka, the author appears to have changed the basis on

which he's

> written the first two shlokas.

>

> For the meaning to be clear, one must also get the shlokas, that

indicate

> what is Viguna. I assume that it must be given the book. Much

would depend

> on which position of a graha or its rasi is called as Viguna.

>

> Love,

>

> Swee

>

> vedic astrology

> [vedic astrology] On Behalf Of

panditarjun2004

> Tuesday, February 21, 2006 5:28 AM

> vedic astrology

> [vedic astrology] Re: Translation of slokas from Mani

Mala on

> Planetary G...

>

> namaste richard ji

>

> the simple rule of anukul/pratikul remedies are clear like this.

>

> retain or wear the objects of a beneficial planet.

>

> donate or throw in water the objects of a malefic planet.

>

> in lalkitab system of remedies, this is what is followed precisely.

>

> after years of research through lalkitab remedies, i found stones

>

> would work positively only if those planets are beneficial to the

>

> native in a chart. when the planets are malefic, since natives

>

> cannot afford donating precious stones, they can donate objects

>

> related to those malefic planets. this is where lalkitab comes

>

> handy.

>

> i do not agree with gauravji's observation that if you wear a

pearn

>

> for moon, besides moon, jupiter would also be benefited and at the

>

> same time mars gets debilitated. in my knowledge stones have

>

> scientific properties and their single objective is to

>

> receive/absorb the cosmic energies of the respective planets.

>

> simply put, if you wear a stone for a particular planet, if that

>

> planet is a benefic the native gets positive results, and if that

>

> planet is malefic, the native gets negative results.

>

> because of these ambivalence in stone recommendations, i recommend

>

> rudraksha as several puranas attribute lords to each rudaksha and

>

> also attribute what benefits the wearer gets. no anukul, no

>

> pratikul. also it has no negative affects.

>

> with best wishes

>

> arjun

>

> vedic astrology, "Richard Shaw-Brown II"

>

> <rsbj66@> wrote:

>

> >

>

> > Dear Sriman,

>

> >

>

> > The translations of Mani Mala by Tagore - Verses 79-81 are

>

> correct. I have uploaded the

>

> > original Sanskrit texts to the PHOTOS section of this group for

>

> anyone to check.

>

> >

>

> > Verses 80-81 make no sense. Therefore it appears that Mani Mala

is

>

> an imperfect source

>

> > of gem knowledge. And it should not be followed as is.

>

> >

>

> > One thing interesting is that books on Indian gemology, like

Mani

>

> Mala, they only talk

>

> > about adverse planets. And they never mention what to do for

>

> Anukul planets (which is

>

> > obviously to wear the gem for the Anukul graha, viz., Anukula-

>

> vad)!??

>

> >

>

> > Point is that for Pratikul Graha we DONATE the gem (ratna-

arpana),

>

> and for Anukul Graha

>

> > we WEAR the gem. Based on the philosophy that gems strengthen

>

> their plant when worn,

>

> > and reduce their planet when donated. One is accepting, other is

>

> giving away.

>

> >

>

> > Best rgds,

>

> > Richard

>

> >

>

> > vedic astrology, yobrevol@ wrote:

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > > || Hare Rama Krishna ||

>

> > >

>

> > > Namaste Richard Ji,

>

> > >

>

> > > So they are actually correct. Please understand that my

>

> reservations were

>

> > > not personal towards you in nature, rather towards the stated

>

> translation. I am

>

> > > in agreement with you with the sloka 79 as I also come from

>

> Anukul school of

>

> > > thought as taught by my guru.

>

> > >

>

> > > I am just trying to figure out why would mani mala say what it

>

> states in

>

> > > sloka 80+...have you read another version of mani mala

>

> translated by another

>

> > > author...?

>

> > >

>

> > > To think that we should wear Blue sapphire for adverse moon is

>

> beyond my

>

> > > limited understanding, specially when we make a blunt general

>

> statement like

>

> > > that...I mean moon is neither exalted nor debilitated in

saturn

>

> signs, and then

>

> > > the author of mani mala further suggests wearing a pearl for

>

> adverse

>

> > > Jupiter...where jupiter gets exalted, so their is

inconsistency

>

> here...

>

> > >

>

> > > Having said that, may be Guru Ji and other learned will throw

>

> some light...

>

> > >

>

> > > Namaste

>

> > > Gaurav Jain

>

> > >

>

> > > In a message dated 2/20/2006 3:57:55 P.M. Eastern Standard

>

> Time,

>

> > > rsbj66@ writes:

>

> > >

>

> > > Dear Sriman,

>

> > >

>

> > > Namaste!!! I am not suggesting anything, these are three

slokas

>

> taken from

>

> > > Mani Mala

>

> > > written by SM Tagore published in 1879. I'm just putting

these

>

> slokas out

>

> > > for comment.

>

> > >

>

> > > I personally agree with the first sloka 79. When Sun is

adverse

>

> one should

>

> > > DONATE a ruby,

>

> > > for adverse Moon one should donate a pearl, as in Ratna-dana-

>

> vidhi

>

> > >

>

> > > And when these planets are beneficial (anukul) then one

should

>

> WEAR the

>

> > > associated gem,

>

> > > as if Sun is anukul in the chart then Ruby can be worn, as in

>

> ratna-dharana.

>

> > >

>

> > > Gem should be WORN for good planet / gem should be DONATED

for

>

> bad planet.

>

> > >

>

> > > I personally disagree with slokas 80-81. But as they are from

>

> the famous

>

> > > Mani Mali so I

>

> > > have put them for your interest.

>

> > >

>

> > > Best regards,

>

> > > Richard

>

> > >

>

> > > vedic astrology, yobrevol@ wrote:

>

> > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > > > || Hare Rama Krishna ||

>

> > > >

>

> > > > Namaste richard ji,

>

> > > >

>

> > > > If I am reading it correctly , what you are suggesting via

>

> these slokas is

>

> > >

>

> > > > that we should give away diamond to propitiate venus, and

at

>

> the same time

>

> > > wear

>

> > > > diamond when venus is adverse? and that we wear blue

>

> sapphire to nullify

>

> > > > adverse effects of moon?....lets not forget that jupiter

>

> exalts in

>

> > > cancer, so

>

> > > > how in the right mind can we suggest wearing pearl

to "ward

>

> off" the

>

> > > adverse

>

> > > > effects of jupiter...?

>

> > > >

>

> > > > are you sure about the authenticity of the translations?

>

> > > >

>

> > > > Also, to the learned, where can I get a copy of Mani mala?

>

> > > >

>

> > > > Namaste

>

> > > > Gaurav Jain

>

> > > >

>

> > > > In a message dated 2/20/2006 2:50:03 P.M. Eastern Standard

>

> Time,

>

> > > > rsbj66@ writes:

>

> > > >

>

> > > > Translation 79: Ill Stars and how to propitiate them by

>

> bestowal (dana)

>

> > > > of gems:

>

> > > >

>

> > > > When the Sun is hostile (donate) a pure ruby; when the

Moon,

>

> a good

>

> > > > pearl; when Mangala, a good coral; when Budha, a good

>

> emerald; when

>

> > > > Brihaspati, a good yellow sapphire; when Shukra, the

>

> diamond; when

>

> > > > Shani, a good blue sapphire; when Rahu, the gomeda; and

when

>

> Ketu, a

>

> > > > good cat's eye, should be donated

>

> > > >

>

> > > > Translation 80-81: Ill Stars and how to ward them off by

>

> wearing

>

> > > > (dharan) of gems:

>

> > > >

>

> > > > If the Sun is adverse, (wear) the cat's eye; if the Moon,

>

> the blue

>

> > > > sapphire; if Mangala, the ruby; if Budha, the ruby too;

if

>

> Vrihaspati,

>

> > > > the pearl; if Shukra, the diamond; if Shani, the great

blue

>

> sapphire;

>

> > > > if Rahu, the gomeda, and if Ketu, the emerald, should be

>

> worn.

>

> > > >

>

> > > > Send instant messages to your online friends

>

> > > http://uk.messenger.

>

> > > >

>

> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

>

> > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > > > ------------------------ Groups Sponsor ------------

--

>

> ------~-->

>

> > > > Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor

with

>

> hope and

>

> > > healing

>

> > > > _Click Here!_

>

> (http://us.click./lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/.8XolB/TM)

>

> > > > ---------------------------

--

>

> ------~->

>

> > > >

>

> > > > Archives: vedic astrology

>

> > > >

>

> > > > Group info: vedic-

>

> astrology/info.html

>

> > > >

>

> > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-

>

> > > >

>

> > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

>

> > > >

>

> > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||

>

> > > > Links

>

> > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

>

> > > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > > ------------------------ Groups Sponsor ---------------

--

>

> ---~-->

>

> > > Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with

>

> hope and healing

>

> > > _Click Here!_

>

> (http://us.click./lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/.8XolB/TM)

>

> > > ------------------------------

--

>

> ---~->

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > > Group info: vedic-

>

> astrology/info.html

>

> > >

>

> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-

>

> > >

>

> > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

>

> > >

>

> > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||

>

> > > Links

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> >

>

> To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-

>

> ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

>

> Links

>

> vedic astrology/

>

> vedic astrology

>

February 21, 2006

Namaste Sri Swee,

You wrote: "We need to be more realistic here. The Puranas do not

to such remedies. Instead, they do suggest dakshina to a

Brahmana/Purohit. This is so that we hope the Brahmana/Purohit can take away

some of our bad karma."

I thought that dakshina/donation was out of compassion than anything else, but

here you mention that puranas suggests dakshina to Brahmin so that we can pass

on our bad karmas to that Brahmin??? We should always have good wishes for the

person taking dakshina and not to have any intention of pass on our bad karmas.

Why should they suffer for our bad karmas. This idea has come as a shock to me

that our scriptures are suggesting this. In this case our scriptures are making

us perform a very bad karma here, and as such it has to stop. Everything should

be done with a pure mind. I am not criticizing you in anyway, but I understand

that you are stating it the way it is written in scriptures.

Devika.

Swee Chan <swee wrote:

Jaya Jagannatha

Dear Richard and Arjun,

Namaste

I do not to donating a gomeda to a leper. Do you? What's he going

to do? Take away your bad karma on your behalf when he himself is riddled

with disease?

We need to be more realistic here. The Puranas do not to such

remedies. Instead, they do suggest dakshina to a Brahmana/Purohit. This is

so that we hope the Brahmana/Purohit can take away some of our bad karma.

This can be done in one of several ways: When transits are averse or just

before the person dies/or during a shraddha.

My suggestion is that, gifts (of gems and other items) have to be new and

not your cast offs.

Regarding the slokas sent by Richard (embedded below), these are my initial

thoughts:

The language is not ancient Sanskrit where there was less tendency of using

synonyms there (an opinion after reading tomes of it; but am no expert!!)

The slokas are more modern phenomenon to use words like "Avaneya". It is

interesting to note that midway in the first line of shloka 81 the author

has forgotten that he is writing for Viguna graha Dharanaa. Certainly not

something the ancients would do! I venture a guess that this comes from

Jaina source of astrological texts which are of a much later origin. Gaurav,

what do you think?

But there does not appear to be any variance about the ratnas that need to

be worn from that of Narada Purana as long as we relate the Ratnas which are

recommended for Dana as they relate to the grahas.

What is in variance is in the matter of those that need to be worn.

A careful look indicates that the shlokas are describing Viguna - meaning

that when the grahas are inimical - for example, Jupiter is malefic

(functional malefic), the recommendation is to wear Pearl. For Cancer lagna

Jupiter will be malefic being the 6th moolatrikona lord, and here

strengthening Moon will certainly make sense as Jupiter is going to create

health problems and also since Moon does not own any bad house. More so if

Jupiter is occupying the 8th House!

In the 3rd sloka, the author appears to have changed the basis on which he's

written the first two shlokas.

For the meaning to be clear, one must also get the shlokas, that indicate

what is Viguna. I assume that it must be given the book. Much would depend

on which position of a graha or its rasi is called as Viguna.

Love,

Swee

vedic astrology

[vedic astrology] On Behalf Of panditarjun2004

Tuesday, February 21, 2006 5:28 AM

vedic astrology

[vedic astrology] Re: Translation of slokas from Mani Mala on

Planetary G...

namaste richard ji

the simple rule of anukul/pratikul remedies are clear like this.

retain or wear the objects of a beneficial planet.

donate or throw in water the objects of a malefic planet.

in lalkitab system of remedies, this is what is followed precisely.

after years of research through lalkitab remedies, i found stones

would work positively only if those planets are beneficial to the

native in a chart. when the planets are malefic, since natives

cannot afford donating precious stones, they can donate objects

related to those malefic planets. this is where lalkitab comes

handy.

i do not agree with gauravji's observation that if you wear a pearn

for moon, besides moon, jupiter would also be benefited and at the

same time mars gets debilitated. in my knowledge stones have

scientific properties and their single objective is to

receive/absorb the cosmic energies of the respective planets.

simply put, if you wear a stone for a particular planet, if that

planet is a benefic the native gets positive results, and if that

planet is malefic, the native gets negative results.

because of these ambivalence in stone recommendations, i recommend

rudraksha as several puranas attribute lords to each rudaksha and

also attribute what benefits the wearer gets. no anukul, no

pratikul. also it has no negative affects.

with best wishes

arjun

vedic astrology, "Richard Shaw-Brown II"

<rsbj66 wrote:

>

> Dear Sriman,

>

> The translations of Mani Mala by Tagore - Verses 79-81 are

correct. I have uploaded the

> original Sanskrit texts to the PHOTOS section of this group for

anyone to check.

>

> Verses 80-81 make no sense. Therefore it appears that Mani Mala is

an imperfect source

> of gem knowledge. And it should not be followed as is.

>

> One thing interesting is that books on Indian gemology, like Mani

Mala, they only talk

> about adverse planets. And they never mention what to do for

Anukul planets (which is

> obviously to wear the gem for the Anukul graha, viz., Anukula-

vad)!??

>

> Point is that for Pratikul Graha we DONATE the gem (ratna-arpana),

and for Anukul Graha

> we WEAR the gem. Based on the philosophy that gems strengthen

their plant when worn,

> and reduce their planet when donated. One is accepting, other is

giving away.

>

> Best rgds,

> Richard

>

> vedic astrology, yobrevol@ wrote:

> >

> > || Hare Rama Krishna ||

> >

> > Namaste Richard Ji,

> >

> > So they are actually correct. Please understand that my

reservations were

> > not personal towards you in nature, rather towards the stated

translation. I am

> > in agreement with you with the sloka 79 as I also come from

Anukul school of

> > thought as taught by my guru.

> >

> > I am just trying to figure out why would mani mala say what it

states in

> > sloka 80+...have you read another version of mani mala

translated by another

> > author...?

> >

> > To think that we should wear Blue sapphire for adverse moon is

beyond my

> > limited understanding, specially when we make a blunt general

statement like

> > that...I mean moon is neither exalted nor debilitated in saturn

signs, and then

> > the author of mani mala further suggests wearing a pearl for

adverse

> > Jupiter...where jupiter gets exalted, so their is inconsistency

here...

> >

> > Having said that, may be Guru Ji and other learned will throw

some light...

> >

> > Namaste

> > Gaurav Jain

> >

> > In a message dated 2/20/2006 3:57:55 P.M. Eastern Standard

Time,

> > rsbj66@ writes:

> >

> > Dear Sriman,

> >

> > Namaste!!! I am not suggesting anything, these are three slokas

taken from

> > Mani Mala

> > written by SM Tagore published in 1879. I'm just putting these

slokas out

> > for comment.

> >

> > I personally agree with the first sloka 79. When Sun is adverse

one should

> > DONATE a ruby,

> > for adverse Moon one should donate a pearl, as in Ratna-dana-

vidhi

> >

> > And when these planets are beneficial (anukul) then one should

WEAR the

> > associated gem,

> > as if Sun is anukul in the chart then Ruby can be worn, as in

ratna-dharana.

> >

> > Gem should be WORN for good planet / gem should be DONATED for

bad planet.

> >

> > I personally disagree with slokas 80-81. But as they are from

the famous

> > Mani Mali so I

> > have put them for your interest.

> >

> > Best regards,

> > Richard

> >

> > vedic astrology, yobrevol@ wrote:

> > >

> > > || Hare Rama Krishna ||

> > >

> > > Namaste richard ji,

> > >

> > > If I am reading it correctly , what you are suggesting via

these slokas is

> >

> > > that we should give away diamond to propitiate venus, and at

the same time

> > wear

> > > diamond when venus is adverse? and that we wear blue

sapphire to nullify

> > > adverse effects of moon?....lets not forget that jupiter

exalts in

> > cancer, so

> > > how in the right mind can we suggest wearing pearl to "ward

off" the

> > adverse

> > > effects of jupiter...?

> > >

> > > are you sure about the authenticity of the translations?

> > >

> > > Also, to the learned, where can I get a copy of Mani mala?

> > >

> > > Namaste

> > > Gaurav Jain

> > >

> > > In a message dated 2/20/2006 2:50:03 P.M. Eastern Standard

Time,

> > > rsbj66@ writes:

> > >

> > > Translation 79: Ill Stars and how to propitiate them by

bestowal (dana)

> > > of gems:

> > >

> > > When the Sun is hostile (donate) a pure ruby; when the Moon,

a good

> > > pearl; when Mangala, a good coral; when Budha, a good

emerald; when

> > > Brihaspati, a good yellow sapphire; when Shukra, the

diamond; when

> > > Shani, a good blue sapphire; when Rahu, the gomeda; and when

Ketu, a

> > > good cat's eye, should be donated

> > >

> > > Translation 80-81: Ill Stars and how to ward them off by

wearing

> > > (dharan) of gems:

> > >

> > > If the Sun is adverse, (wear) the cat's eye; if the Moon,

the blue

> > > sapphire; if Mangala, the ruby; if Budha, the ruby too; if

Vrihaspati,

> > > the pearl; if Shukra, the diamond; if Shani, the great blue

sapphire;

> > > if Rahu, the gomeda, and if Ketu, the emerald, should be

worn.

> > >

> > > Send instant messages to your online friends

> > http://uk.messenger.

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> > >

> > > ------------------------ Groups Sponsor --------------

------~-->

> > > Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with

hope and

> > healing

> > > _Click Here!_

(http://us.click./lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/.8XolB/TM)

> > > -----------------------------

------~->

> > >

> > > Archives: vedic astrology

> > >

> > > Group info: vedic-

astrology/info.html

> > >

> > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-

> > >

> > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

> > >

> > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||

> > > Links

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> > >

> >

> > ------------------------ Groups Sponsor -----------------

---~-->

> > Join modern day disciples reach the disfigured and poor with

hope and healing

> > _Click Here!_

(http://us.click./lMct6A/Vp3LAA/i1hLAA/.8XolB/TM)

> > --------------------------------

---~->

> >

> > Group info: vedic-

astrology/info.html

> >

> > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-

> >

> > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

> >

> > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||

> > Links

> >

>

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February 21, 2006

Namaskaar Sri Devika, Sri Swee and Sri Ajit

I am sorry for the intrusion.

Never think of transference of dosha to the Gemstone. This thinking itself

is the Dosha.

Supposing Saturn is malefic in one's chart, it means what:

1. One is insensitive and non-democratic in nature. This also means that one

is autocratic (if Mars and Sun are in relevant positions)

2. One does not take care of one's elders or treat poor and the servants

kindly. Disrespect, etc is also there.

3. One is passionate enough not to see many ground realities of life.

and on similar thinking one can go on.....Now these actions could have been

done in the unknowable past (previous birth, etc) or the vrittis are still

present.

Upon realization of this folly, one sacrifices the very things he/she was

selfish about. So the dana is in both attitude and in material. I usually

ask to donate to the diety "Tera tujhko arpan, kya lage mera"

Now, Sri Ajit - one gives a new stone because to the Lord you always give

new. Atleast in our eyes it should be new. We do not know the history of

each stone and whether or not it has been worn by someone else. So we do the

necessary puja before the donation.

Sri Devika: there is no attempt to transfer our bad karma on the Pundit.

This right of Result of Karma is not in our hands. Bhagavad Gita is very

clear. Lord dictates the result of the karmas. We cannot even say that after

donating the Gemstone, the malefic results will be nullified. To say such a

thing, is arrogance. So one should say, it is likely and logical that by

donating the Gemstone, we rid ourselves of our selfish or "bad" karma.

Surely, it wouldn't transfer to the Pundit taking our stone. He did not ask

for it, so it is not his karma.

I will write a small post on the order of Uttama Dana as derived from the

Veda.

Thanks and Regards

Bharat

On 2/22/06, Devika Dhillon <devikadhillon wrote:

>

> Namaste Sri Swee,

> You wrote: "We need to be more realistic here. The Puranas do not

> to such remedies. Instead, they do suggest dakshina to a

> Brahmana/Purohit. This is so that we hope the Brahmana/Purohit can take away

> some of our bad karma."

> I thought that dakshina/donation was out of compassion than anything

> else, but here you mention that puranas suggests dakshina to Brahmin so that

> we can pass on our bad karmas to that Brahmin??? We should always have good

> wishes for the person taking dakshina and not to have any intention of pass

> on our bad karmas. Why should they suffer for our bad karmas. This idea has

> come as a shock to me that our scriptures are suggesting this. In this case

> our scriptures are making us perform a very bad karma here, and as such it

> has to stop. Everything should be done with a pure mind. I am not

> criticizing you in anyway, but I understand that you are stating it the way

> it is written in scriptures.

>

> Devika.

>

> Swee Chan <swee wrote:

> Jaya Jagannatha

>

> Dear Richard and Arjun,

>

> Namaste

>

> I do not to donating a gomeda to a leper. Do you? What's he

> going

> to do? Take away your bad karma on your behalf when he himself is riddled

> with disease?

>

> We need to be more realistic here. The Puranas do not to such

> remedies. Instead, they do suggest dakshina to a Brahmana/Purohit. This is

> so that we hope the Brahmana/Purohit can take away some of our bad karma.

> This can be done in one of several ways: When transits are averse or just

> before the person dies/or during a shraddha.

>

> My suggestion is that, gifts (of gems and other items) have to be new and

> not your cast offs.

>

> Regarding the slokas sent by Richard (embedded below), these are my

> initial

> thoughts:

>

> The language is not ancient Sanskrit where there was less tendency of

> using

> synonyms there (an opinion after reading tomes of it; but am no expert!!)

>

> The slokas are more modern phenomenon to use words like "Avaneya". It is

> interesting to note that midway in the first line of shloka 81 the author

> has forgotten that he is writing for Viguna graha Dharanaa. Certainly not

> something the ancients would do! I venture a guess that this comes from

> Jaina source of astrological texts which are of a much later origin.

> Gaurav,

> what do you think?

>

> But there does not appear to be any variance about the ratnas that need to

> be worn from that of Narada Purana as long as we relate the Ratnas which

> are

> recommended for Dana as they relate to the grahas.

>

> What is in variance is in the matter of those that need to be worn.

>

> A careful look indicates that the shlokas are describing Viguna - meaning

> that when the grahas are inimical - for example, Jupiter is malefic

> (functional malefic), the recommendation is to wear Pearl. For Cancer

> lagna

> Jupiter will be malefic being the 6th moolatrikona lord, and here

> strengthening Moon will certainly make sense as Jupiter is going to create

> health problems and also since Moon does not own any bad house. More so if

> Jupiter is occupying the 8th House!

>

> In the 3rd sloka, the author appears to have changed the basis on which

> he's

> written the first two shlokas.

>

> For the meaning to be clear, one must also get the shlokas, that indicate

> what is Viguna. I assume that it must be given the book. Much would depend

> on which position of a graha or its rasi is called as Viguna.

>

> Love,

>

> Swee

>

> vedic astrology

> [vedic astrology] On Behalf Of panditarjun2004

> Tuesday, February 21, 2006 5:28 AM

> vedic astrology

> [vedic astrology] Re: Translation of slokas from Mani Mala on

> Planetary G...

>

> namaste richard ji

>

> the simple rule of anukul/pratikul remedies are clear like this.

>

> retain or wear the objects of a beneficial planet.

>

> donate or throw in water the objects of a malefic planet.

>

> in lalkitab system of remedies, this is what is followed precisely.

>

> after years of research through lalkitab remedies, i found stones

>

> would work positively only if those planets are beneficial to the

>

> native in a chart. when the planets are malefic, since natives

>

> cannot afford donating precious stones, they can donate objects

>

> related to those malefic planets. this is where lalkitab comes

>

> handy.

>

> i do not agree with gauravji's observation that if you wear a pearn

>

> for moon, besides moon, jupiter would also be benefited and at the

>

> same time mars gets debilitated. in my knowledge stones have

>

> scientific properties and their single objective is to

>

> receive/absorb the cosmic energies of the respective planets.

>

> simply put, if you wear a stone for a particular planet, if that

>

> planet is a benefic the native gets positive results, and if that

>

> planet is malefic, the native gets negative results.

>

> because of these ambivalence in stone recommendations, i recommend

>

> rudraksha as several puranas attribute lords to each rudaksha and

>

> also attribute what benefits the wearer gets. no anukul, no

>

> pratikul. also it has no negative affects.

>

> with best wishes

>

> arjun

>

> vedic astrology, "Richard Shaw-Brown II"

>

> <rsbj66 wrote:

>

> >

>

> > Dear Sriman,

>

> >

>

> > The translations of Mani Mala by Tagore - Verses 79-81 are

>

> correct. I have uploaded the

>

> > original Sanskrit texts to the PHOTOS section of this group for

>

> anyone to check.

>

> >

>

> > Verses 80-81 make no sense. Therefore it appears that Mani Mala is

>

> an imperfect source

>

> > of gem knowledge. And it should not be followed as is.

>

> >

>

> > One thing interesting is that books on Indian gemology, like Mani

>

> Mala, they only talk

>

> > about adverse planets. And they never mention what to do for

>

> Anukul planets (which is

>

> > obviously to wear the gem for the Anukul graha, viz., Anukula-

>

> vad)!??

>

> >

>

> > Point is that for Pratikul Graha we DONATE the gem (ratna-arpana),

>

> and for Anukul Graha

>

> > we WEAR the gem. Based on the philosophy that gems strengthen

>

> their plant when worn,

>

> > and reduce their planet when donated. One is accepting, other is

>

> giving away.

>

> >

>

> > Best rgds,

>

> > Richard

>

> >

>

> > vedic astrology, yobrevol@ wrote:

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > > || Hare Rama Krishna ||

>

> > >

>

> > > Namaste Richard Ji,

>

> > >

>

> > > So they are actually correct. Please understand that my

>

> reservations were

>

> > > not personal towards you in nature, rather towards the stated

>

> translation. I am

>

> > > in agreement with you with the sloka 79 as I also come from

>

> Anukul school of

>

> > > thought as taught by my guru.

>

> > >

>

> > > I am just trying to figure out why would mani mala say what it

>

> states in

>

> > > sloka 80+...have you read another version of mani mala

>

> translated by another

>

> > > author...?

>

> > >

>

> > > To think that we should wear Blue sapphire for adverse moon is

>

> beyond my

>

> > > limited understanding, specially when we make a blunt general

>

> statement like

>

> > > that...I mean moon is neither exalted nor debilitated in saturn

>

> signs, and then

>

> > > the author of mani mala further suggests wearing a pearl for

>

> adverse

>

> > > Jupiter...where jupiter gets exalted, so their is inconsistency

>

> here...

>

> > >

>

> > > Having said that, may be Guru Ji and other learned will throw

>

> some light...

>

> > >

>

> > > Namaste

>

> > > Gaurav Jain

>

> > >

>

> > > In a message dated 2/20/2006 3:57:55 P.M. Eastern Standard

>

> Time,

>

> > > rsbj66@ writes:

>

> > >

>

> > > Dear Sriman,

>

> > >

>

> > > Namaste!!! I am not suggesting anything, these are three slokas

>

> taken from

>

> > > Mani Mala

>

> > > written by SM Tagore published in 1879. I'm just putting these

>

> slokas out

>

> > > for comment.

>

> > >

>

> > > I personally agree with the first sloka 79. When Sun is adverse

>

> one should

>

> > > DONATE a ruby,

>

> > > for adverse Moon one should donate a pearl, as in Ratna-dana-

>

> vidhi

>

> > >

>

> > > And when these planets are beneficial (anukul) then one should

>

> WEAR the

>

> > > associated gem,

>

> > > as if Sun is anukul in the chart then Ruby can be worn, as in

>

> ratna-dharana.

>

> > >

>

> > > Gem should be WORN for good planet / gem should be DONATED for

>

> bad planet.

>

> > >

>

> > > I personally disagree with slokas 80-81. But as they are from

>

> the famous

>

> > > Mani Mali so I

>

> > > have put them for your interest.

>

> > >

>

> > > Best regards,

>

> > > Richard

>

> > >

>

> > > vedic astrology, yobrevol@ wrote:

>

> > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > > > || Hare Rama Krishna ||

>

> > > >

>

> > > > Namaste richard ji,

>

> > > >

>

> > > > If I am reading it correctly , what you are suggesting via

>

> these slokas is

>

> > >

>

> > > > that we should give away diamond to propitiate venus, and at

>

> the same time

>

> > > wear

>

> > > > diamond when venus is adverse? and that we wear blue

>

> sapphire to nullify

>

> > > > adverse effects of moon?....lets not forget that jupiter

>

> exalts in

>

> > > cancer, so

>

> > > > how in the right mind can we suggest wearing pearl to "ward

>

> off" the

>

> > > adverse

>

> > > > effects of jupiter...?

>

> > > >

>

> > > > are you sure about the authenticity of the translations?

>

> > > >

>

> > > > Also, to the learned, where can I get a copy of Mani mala?

>

> > > >

>

> > > > Namaste

>

> > > > Gaurav Jain

>

> > > >

>

> > > > In a message dated 2/20/2006 2:50:03 P.M. Eastern Standard

>

> Time,

>

> > > > rsbj66@ writes:

>

> > > >

>

> > > > Translation 79: Ill Stars and how to propitiate them by

>

> bestowal (dana)

>

> > > > of gems:

>

> > > >

>

> > > > When the Sun is hostile (donate) a pure ruby; when the Moon,

>

> a good

>

> > > > pearl; when Mangala, a good coral; when Budha, a good

>

> emerald; when

>

> > > > Brihaspati, a good yellow sapphire; when Shukra, the

>

> diamond; when

>

> > > > Shani, a good blue sapphire; when Rahu, the gomeda; and when

>

> Ketu, a

>

> > > > good cat's eye, should be donated

>

> > > >

>

> > > > Translation 80-81: Ill Stars and how to ward them off by

>

> wearing

>

> > > > (dharan) of gems:

>

> > > >

>

> > > > If the Sun is adverse, (wear) the cat's eye; if the Moon,

>

> the blue

>

> > > > sapphire; if Mangala, the ruby; if Budha, the ruby too; if

>

> Vrihaspati,

>

> > > > the pearl; if Shukra, the diamond; if Shani, the great blue

>

> sapphire;

>

> > > > if Rahu, the gomeda, and if Ketu, the emerald, should be

>

> worn.

>

> > > >

>

> > > > Send instant messages to your online friends

>

> > > http://uk.messenger.

>

> > > >

>

> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

>

> > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > > > ------------------------ Groups Sponsor --------------

>

> ------~-->

>

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February 22, 2006

Jaya Jagannatha

Dear Devika,

Namaste

Your notion is completely wrong. Please leave things be and look at it again

in a different light in a couple of weeks

Love,

Swee

vedic astrology

[vedic astrology] On Behalf Of Devika Dhillon

Tuesday, February 21, 2006 11:10 PM

vedic astrology

RE: [vedic astrology] Re: Translation of slokas from Mani Mala on

Planetary G...

Namaste Sri Swee,

You wrote: "We need to be more realistic here. The Puranas do not

to such remedies. Instead, they do suggest dakshina to a

Brahmana/Purohit. This is so that we hope the Brahmana/Purohit can take away

some of our bad karma."

I thought that dakshina/donation was out of compassion than anything else,

but here you mention that puranas suggests dakshina to Brahmin so that we

can pass on our bad karmas to that Brahmin??? We should always have good

wishes for the person taking dakshina and not to have any intention of pass

on our bad karmas. Why should they suffer for our bad karmas. This idea has

come as a shock to me that our scriptures are suggesting this. In this case

our scriptures are making us perform a very bad karma here, and as such it

has to stop. Everything should be done with a pure mind. I am not

criticizing you in anyway, but I understand that you are stating it the way

it is written in scriptures.

Devika.

Swee Chan <swee wrote:

Jaya Jagannatha

Dear Richard and Arjun,

Namaste

I do not to donating a gomeda to a leper. Do you? What's he going

to do? Take away your bad karma on your behalf when he himself is riddled

with disease?

We need to be more realistic here. The Puranas do not to such

remedies. Instead, they do suggest dakshina to a Brahmana/Purohit. This is

so that we hope the Brahmana/Purohit can take away some of our bad karma.

This can be done in one of several ways: When transits are averse or just

before the person dies/or during a shraddha.

My suggestion is that, gifts (of gems and other items) have to be new and

not your cast offs.

Regarding the slokas sent by Richard (embedded below), these are my initial

thoughts:

The language is not ancient Sanskrit where there was less tendency of using

synonyms there (an opinion after reading tomes of it; but am no expert!!)

The slokas are more modern phenomenon to use words like "Avaneya". It is

interesting to note that midway in the first line of shloka 81 the author

has forgotten that he is writing for Viguna graha Dharanaa. Certainly not

something the ancients would do! I venture a guess that this comes from

Jaina source of astrological texts which are of a much later origin. Gaurav,

what do you think?

But there does not appear to be any variance about the ratnas that need to

be worn from that of Narada Purana as long as we relate the Ratnas which are

recommended for Dana as they relate to the grahas.

What is in variance is in the matter of those that need to be worn.

A careful look indicates that the shlokas are describing Viguna - meaning

that when the grahas are inimical - for example, Jupiter is malefic

(functional malefic), the recommendation is to wear Pearl. For Cancer lagna

Jupiter will be malefic being the 6th moolatrikona lord, and here

strengthening Moon will certainly make sense as Jupiter is going to create

health problems and also since Moon does not own any bad house. More so if

Jupiter is occupying the 8th House!

In the 3rd sloka, the author appears to have changed the basis on which he's

written the first two shlokas.

For the meaning to be clear, one must also get the shlokas, that indicate

what is Viguna. I assume that it must be given the book. Much would depend

on which position of a graha or its rasi is called as Viguna.

Love,

Swee

vedic astrology

[vedic astrology] On Behalf Of panditarjun2004

Tuesday, February 21, 2006 5:28 AM

vedic astrology

[vedic astrology] Re: Translation of slokas from Mani Mala on

Planetary G...

namaste richard ji

the simple rule of anukul/pratikul remedies are clear like this.

retain or wear the objects of a beneficial planet.

donate or throw in water the objects of a malefic planet.

in lalkitab system of remedies, this is what is followed precisely.

after years of research through lalkitab remedies, i found stones

would work positively only if those planets are beneficial to the

native in a chart. when the planets are malefic, since natives

cannot afford donating precious stones, they can donate objects

related to those malefic planets. this is where lalkitab comes

handy.

i do not agree with gauravji's observation that if you wear a pearn

for moon, besides moon, jupiter would also be benefited and at the

same time mars gets debilitated. in my knowledge stones have

scientific properties and their single objective is to

receive/absorb the cosmic energies of the respective planets.

simply put, if you wear a stone for a particular planet, if that

planet is a benefic the native gets positive results, and if that

planet is malefic, the native gets negative results.

because of these ambivalence in stone recommendations, i recommend

rudraksha as several puranas attribute lords to each rudaksha and

also attribute what benefits the wearer gets. no anukul, no

pratikul. also it has no negative affects.

with best wishes

arjun

vedic astrology, "Richard Shaw-Brown II"

<rsbj66 wrote:

>

> Dear Sriman,

>

> The translations of Mani Mala by Tagore - Verses 79-81 are

correct. I have uploaded the

> original Sanskrit texts to the PHOTOS section of this group for

anyone to check.

>

> Verses 80-81 make no sense. Therefore it appears that Mani Mala is

an imperfect source

> of gem knowledge. And it should not be followed as is.

>

> One thing interesting is that books on Indian gemology, like Mani

Mala, they only talk

> about adverse planets. And they never mention what to do for

Anukul planets (which is

> obviously to wear the gem for the Anukul graha, viz., Anukula-

vad)!??

>

> Point is that for Pratikul Graha we DONATE the gem (ratna-arpana),

and for Anukul Graha

> we WEAR the gem. Based on the philosophy that gems strengthen

their plant when worn,

> and reduce their planet when donated. One is accepting, other is

giving away.

>

> Best rgds,

> Richard

>

> vedic astrology, yobrevol@ wrote:

> >

> > || Hare Rama Krishna ||

> >

> > Namaste Richard Ji,

> >

> > So they are actually correct. Please understand that my

reservations were

> > not personal towards you in nature, rather towards the stated

translation. I am

> > in agreement with you with the sloka 79 as I also come from

Anukul school of

> > thought as taught by my guru.

> >

> > I am just trying to figure out why would mani mala say what it

states in

> > sloka 80+...have you read another version of mani mala

translated by another

> > author...?

> >

> > To think that we should wear Blue sapphire for adverse moon is

beyond my

> > limited understanding, specially when we make a blunt general

statement like

> > that...I mean moon is neither exalted nor debilitated in saturn

signs, and then

> > the author of mani mala further suggests wearing a pearl for

adverse

> > Jupiter...where jupiter gets exalted, so their is inconsistency

here...

> >

> > Having said that, may be Guru Ji and other learned will throw

some light...

> >

> > Namaste

> > Gaurav Jain

> >

> > In a message dated 2/20/2006 3:57:55 P.M. Eastern Standard

Time,

> > rsbj66@ writes:

> >

> > Dear Sriman,

> >

> > Namaste!!! I am not suggesting anything, these are three slokas

taken from

> > Mani Mala

> > written by SM Tagore published in 1879. I'm just putting these

slokas out

> > for comment.

> >

> > I personally agree with the first sloka 79. When Sun is adverse

one should

> > DONATE a ruby,

> > for adverse Moon one should donate a pearl, as in Ratna-dana-

vidhi

> >

> > And when these planets are beneficial (anukul) then one should

WEAR the

> > associated gem,

> > as if Sun is anukul in the chart then Ruby can be worn, as in

ratna-dharana.

> >

> > Gem should be WORN for good planet / gem should be DONATED for

bad planet.

> >

> > I personally disagree with slokas 80-81. But as they are from

the famous

> > Mani Mali so I

> > have put them for your interest.

> >

> > Best regards,

> > Richard

> >

> > vedic astrology, yobrevol@ wrote:

> > >

> > > || Hare Rama Krishna ||

> > >

> > > Namaste richard ji,

> > >

> > > If I am reading it correctly , what you are suggesting via

these slokas is

> >

> > > that we should give away diamond to propitiate venus, and at

the same time

> > wear

> > > diamond when venus is adverse? and that we wear blue

sapphire to nullify

> > > adverse effects of moon?....lets not forget that jupiter

exalts in

> > cancer, so

> > > how in the right mind can we suggest wearing pearl to "ward

off" the

> > adverse

> > > effects of jupiter...?

> > >

> > > are you sure about the authenticity of the translations?

> > >

> > > Also, to the learned, where can I get a copy of Mani mala?

> > >

> > > Namaste

> > > Gaurav Jain

> > >

> > > In a message dated 2/20/2006 2:50:03 P.M. Eastern Standard

Time,

> > > rsbj66@ writes:

> > >

> > > Translation 79: Ill Stars and how to propitiate them by

bestowal (dana)

> > > of gems:

> > >

> > > When the Sun is hostile (donate) a pure ruby; when the Moon,

a good

> > > pearl; when Mangala, a good coral; when Budha, a good

emerald; when

> > > Brihaspati, a good yellow sapphire; when Shukra, the

diamond; when

> > > Shani, a good blue sapphire; when Rahu, the gomeda; and when

Ketu, a

> > > good cat's eye, should be donated

> > >

> > > Translation 80-81: Ill Stars and how to ward them off by

wearing

> > > (dharan) of gems:

> > >

> > > If the Sun is adverse, (wear) the cat's eye; if the Moon,

the blue

> > > sapphire; if Mangala, the ruby; if Budha, the ruby too; if

Vrihaspati,

> > > the pearl; if Shukra, the diamond; if Shani, the great blue

sapphire;

> > > if Rahu, the gomeda, and if Ketu, the emerald, should be

worn.

> > >

> > > Send instant messages to your online friends

> > http://uk.messenger.

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> > >

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> > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us .......

> > >

> > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri Krishnaarpanamastu ||

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> > >

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February 22, 2006

Dear Swee,

You wrote: "Your notion is completely wrong"

and you also wrote: "We need to be more realistic here. The Puranas do not

to such remedies. Instead, they do suggest dakshina to a

Brahmana/Purohit. This is so that we hope the Brahmana/Purohit can take away

some of our bad karma."

Tell me what am I to understand reading the above statement?

Can we actually transfer our bad karmas to anyone? Is nature that cruel? This

is not a debate or argument, but it is rather a clarification for something that

may be a thought, which is unjust. A message to the believers is that I would

rather keep my karmas and cleanse them myself (no matter how bitter) rather than

passing it on to someone else. With this kind of intentions we are in turn

creating more karmas. I understand that in desperate situations people cannot

think right, but we always need to put others before ourselves. Always give

dakshina/donation with the intention that the receiver comes out of his own

karmas.

May compassion awake in one and all,