We have come from Radha Krsna lila!

[Guest guest]

> Srila Prabhupada said that once we were all with Krishna. The statement of

> our Founder-Acarya seems clear. Someone with a folio, kindly check the

> reference and send it in.

 

> Many people inquire, "How did the living entity, who was with Krsna,

> fall into the material world?" That question is answered here (in this

> verse) . The living entities condition is simply the influence of the

> material energy; actually he has not fallen. An example is given: The moon

> appears to be moving when clouds pass in front of it. Actually the moon is

> not moving. Similarly, the living entity, because he is a spiritual spark

> of the Supreme, has not fallen. But he is thinking, "I am fallen. I am

> material. I am this body."

Lecture by Srila Prabhupada(Tokyo Apr 20 , 72) ---Srimad Bhagavatam 2.9.1

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 08/30/1999 4:38:57 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Sruto writes:

 

> Text 2591928 from COM]

>

> > Srila Prabhupada said that once we were all with Krishna. The statement

of

> > our Founder-Acarya seems clear. Someone with a folio, kindly check the

> > reference and send it in.

>

> > Many people inquire, "How did the living entity, who was with Krsna,

> > fall into the material world?" That question is answered here (in this

> > verse) . The living entities condition is simply the influence of the

> > material energy; actually he has not fallen. An example is given: The

moon

> > appears to be moving when clouds pass in front of it. Actually the moon

is

> > not moving. Similarly, the living entity, because he is a spiritual spark

> > of the Supreme, has not fallen. But he is thinking, "I am fallen. I am

> > material. I am this body."

> Lecture by Srila Prabhupada(Tokyo Apr 20 , 72) ---Srimad Bhagavatam 2.9.1

>

Lecture by Srila Prabhupada(Tokyo Apr 20 , 72) (reprinted by permission

from BTG magazine)

 

THE SOUL'S FALL

 

Sri-suka uvacha

atma-mayam rite rajam

parasyanubhavatmanah

na ghatetartha-sambandhah

svapna-drastur ivanjasa

 

Sri Sukedeva Goswami said: O kings, unless one is influenced by the energy

of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, there is no meaning to the

relationship of the pure soul in pure consciousness with the material body.

The relationship is just like a dreamer's seeing his own body working,

---Srimad Bhagavatam 2.9.1

Many people inquire, "How did the living entity, who was with Krsna, fall

into the material world?" That question is answered here (in this verse) .

The living entities condition is simply the influence of the material energy;

actually he has not fallen. An example is given: The moon appears to be

moving when clouds pass in front of it. Actually the moon is not moving.

Similarly, the living entity, because he is a spiritual spark of the Supreme,

has not fallen. But he is thinking, "I am fallen. I am material. I am this

body."

The body has no connection to the soul. We can experience this. The body

is changing, dying, but I am the same. The idea that we have a connection

with the body is due to the handling of the illusory energy of Krsna. That

illusory energy develops when we forget Krsna.

In other words, our illusory identification with the body is simply due to

our forgetfulness. We wanted to forget: we wanted to give up Krsna and enjoy

the materiasl world. Therefore Krsna is giving us the chance. For example,

when you play a part in a drama, if you feel, "I am king," then you can talk

very nicely. And if you feel, "I am Kasrandhar," ( referring to a disciple

sitting in the audience) then you cannot play the part of a king so nicely.

The feelings must be there. If you are playing the part of a king,you must

believe you are the king and have his courage. You have to forget that you

are Karandhar. Then you can play the part very nicely, and the audience will

appreciate. But if you think simultaneously," I am Karandar, and I am playing

the part of a king," then you cannot play.

So because we wanted to play the part of Krsna ,the enjoyer, Krsna is

giving us the chance---"You feel like me!" The feeling that "I am master, I

am king, I am Krsna, I am God" is created by Krsna: "Alright, you want to

play the part of King. I shall train you in such a way."

The director of a play tries to create the feelings within you for the part

that you are playing. In my younger age I played in a drama about Lord

Chaitanya. Our director, Amrital Bose, repeatedly said, especially to me,

"Feel like that." So when we performed under his direction, all the people in

the audience were crying. The play was artificial, but the effect on the

audience was so nice.

Similarly, we have nothing to do with the material world, but we have been

trained by the illusory energy in such a way that we think ,"I am Indian,I

am American,I am brahman,I am sudra,I am this,I am that,""I have

to do this,I have to do so many duties." These are all illusions. We have

nothing to do with all this nonsense, but still we are taking it very

seriously:" I have to do like this. I am this. I am that."

That is explained here in this verse. Atmamayam rite rajan

parasyanubhavat-manah: "Unless one is influenced by the energy of the Supreme

Personality of Godhead, there is no meaning to the relationship of the pure

soul in pure consciousness with the material body"

The example is given of a man dreaming, "Oh, there is a tiger, a tiger! Save

me!" He is crying. An awake man observing may say, "Where is the tiger? Why

are you crying?" But the dreaming man is actually feeling, "The tiger is

attacking me."

Therefore this example is given: na ghatetartha--sambandhah. there cannot

be any meaning of the relationship of the soul and the body except that it is

like a dreaming man creating a situation. He is dreaming there is a tiger,

and he is creating a fearful situation. Actually there is no cause of fear.

There is no tiger. The situation is created by a dream.

Similarly, we have created the material world and material activities.

People are running around--"Oh , I am the manager. I am the factory owner. I

am this. I am that. We know his politics, we have to defeat our

competitors."All these things are created just like a man creates a situation

in a dream-- svapna--drastur ivanjasa .

So when someone asks, "When did we come into contact with the material

nature?" The answer is that we have not come into contact. By the influence

of the material energy we THINK that we are in contact. Actually we are not

fallen.We cannot be fallen. We have simply created a situation. Rather, we

have not created a situation; Krsna has given us a situation. Because we

wanted to imitate Krsna, Krsna has given an opportunity: "All right. You want

to imitate? You want to be an imitation king on the stage. So feel like this.

Play like this. Do like this. People will applaud--"Oh , a very nice king!"

Everyone in the material world is playing some part. "I want to be prime

minister I want to be very big business magnate.I want to be a leader."

":I want to be a philosopher.I want to be a scientist." They are trying to

play all these nonsense parts and Krsna is giving the opportunity--"All

right."

But these things are all nonsense. Simply dreaming. When you dream , the

next moment the dream is gone, and everything in the dream is finished. No

more tiger. No more jungle.. Similarly, as long as the body continues, I

think, "I am a responsible leader. I am this, I am that." but as soon as the

body is finished, these ideas are gone.

 

" Krsna says, mrityu sarva-haras ca-ham: 'I am death. I take everything

away.' Just think of our past life. Suppose I was a king or something like

that. From the Bhrighu-samhita it was ascertained that I was a big

physician in by last life, with a spotless character, no sins. I dont know.

It may be .But I have no rememberence that I was a physician. So what do we

know? I might have been a very big influencial physician, with a good

practice, but where is it all now? All gone!

So our contact with matter is just like a dream. We are not fallen.,

therefore at any moment we can revive our Krsna consciousness.We become

liberated as soon as we understand "I have nothing to do with matter. I am

simply Krsna's eternal servant." Sometimes when a fearful dream becomes

intolerable we break the dream. Similarly, we can break the material

connection at any moment as soon as we come to the point of Krsna

consciousness. "Oh, Krsna is my eternal master. I am His servant." That's all

.. That is the way.

Actually, we are not fallen. We cannot be fallen. The same example:

Actually there is no tiger; it is dreaming. We are not fallen. We can

simply give up that illusory condition at any moment.

So if you study all these verse very nicely, you will get all this

knowledge quickly. Now(Prabhupada says to his disciple), What is the

purport?

[A disciple reads:] "Maharaja Pariksit's question as to how a living entity

began his material life, although he is apart from the material body and

mind, is perfectly answered. The spirit soul is distinct from the material

conception of his life, but he is absorbed in such a material conception

because of being influenced by the external energy of the lord, called atma

--maya. This has already been explained in the First Canto in connection

with Vyasadeva's realization of the Supreme Lord and His external energy. The

external energy is controlled by the Lord and the living entities are

controlled by the external energy."

[Prabhupada continues] Krsna says mam eva ye prapadyante mayam etam taranti

te: "As soon as one surrenders unto Me, he has no more illusion." People are

conditioned, encaged. Mayavadis, or impersonalists, undergo austerities and

penances just to become liberated. Yogis also try to become "one" So many

endeavors are going on. But the simple process is that as soon as you

surrender you are not fallen. "It was illusion. I was dreaming. I am

Krsna's." By thinking in this way , one becomes liberated . immediately,

within a second.

Liberation can be attained within a second, provided that we abide by the

order of the Supreme, or Krsna. Sarva--dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam

vraja. This is the position. We are not fallen. We are thinking that we are

fallen. So we have to give up this nonsense thinking. Then we are liberated.

Is there any difficulty in understanding this point? Just see how

important this verse is. (To his disciples) It is already there , but you

are not reading. read each verse; read every day carefully. Try to

assimilate, understand, and you will get more profit--every day, a hundred

yards forward. They are such important verses. How nicely composed by

Vyasadeva! In two lines the whole thing is explained. This is called

shastra.

Read the purport.

[The disciple reads:] "The external energy is controlled by the lord, and the

living entities are controlled by the external energy--by the will of the

Lord. Therefore, although the living entity is purely conscious in his pure

state, he is subordinate to the will of the Lord in being influenced by the

external energy of the Lord. In the Bhagavad-gita (15.15) also the same thing

is confirmed; the Lord is present within the heart of every living entity,

and all the living entity's consciousness and forgetfullness are influenced

by the Lord."

Prabhupada: Now people may ask, "Why does Krsna within the heart give one

type of consciousness to one and a different type of consciousness to

another?" That is His kindness. I wanted to forget Krsna, so Krsna is giving

the appropriate consciousness: "All right , you can forget Me in this way."

The ordinary materialists (karmis), the mayavadis, the so-called yogis

wanted to forget Krsna. So Krsna is giving them intelligence: "All right. You

forget Me like this." And if you want to revive your relationship with Krsna,

He will give you intelligence. Dadmi buddhi-yogam tam yena mam upayanti te "I

shall give you intelligence to come to me" Ye yatha mam prapadyante. As

youwant, Krsna gives you facility..

(to disciple) Go on reading

 

[Disciple reads] "Now the next question automatically made wiil be why the

Lord influences the living entity to such consciousness and forgetfulness.

The answer is that the Lord clearly wishes that every living entity be in his

pure consciousness as the part and parcel of the Lord as he is

constitutionally made; but because the living entity is partially independent

also, he may not be willing to serve the Lord, but may try to become as

independent as the Lord is. All the nondevotee living entities are desirous

of becoming equally as powerful as the Lord, although they are not fit to

become so."

Prabhupada: The living entity will never be God, but we see by the

influence of the illusory energy many people think, "I am God," or "I shall

become God by pressing my nose like this" This is going on. But they will

never be able to become God. That is not possible. If everyone can become

God, then there is no meaning of God.

Karmis(fruitive workers) say, "I shall become a millionaire I shall become

head of state I shall become prime minister" They struggle to attain

these

things.

And for yogis to think, "I shall become God" is simply another struggle.

It is illusion. Krsna may give them some yoga success. In India there is a

yogi

who makes gold appear. And people are after him--"Oh , he is God, he is

God"

By producing a little gold, he becomes God.

Another yogi makes two rasagullas[sweets] appear. So by producing two

rasagullas, four cents worth, he becomes God. You see? This is illusion. I

can purchase two rasagullas from the market for four cents, so he has become

God for four cents. People think, "Oh he is God. He can produce rasagullas."

They have no sense. I can produce rasagullas in our kitchen. But they think,

"Oh , this yogi is wonderful."

So Krsna gives a person some power of yogic siddhi, or perfection, and the

person thinks, "I have become God." And some others think "Oh , you are God."

Such yogis are in the same dream as the karmis. And as soon as death comes,

everything is finished--your Godhood and everything, finished. Now comes

doghood. And another dream, "I am dog." First of all "I am God," then "I

am

dog." this is going on.

Therefore, Bhaktivenode Thakura has said, (miche) mayar bose, jaccho

bhese': "Why are you being washed away by the waves of maya? Just stand up."

(Jiv) krsna-das,ei biswas. korle to ar duhkho nai. "Simply stay fixed on

this

point: ' I am the eternal servant of Krsna' Then there is no more dream."

And if you allow yourself to be washed away, Krsna gives you facility: "All

right, come on , be washed away."

Then?

[Disciple reads] "The living entities are illusioned by the will of the

Lord because they wanted to become Him. Like a person who thinks of becoming

a king without possessing the necessary qualifications, similarly, when the

living entity desires to become the Lord Himself, he is put is a condition of

dreaming that he is king. Therefore the first sinful will of the living

entity is to become the Lord, and the consequent will of the Lord is that the

living entity forget his actual life and thus dream of the land of utopia

where he may become one like the Lord. The child cries to have the moon from

the mother, and the mother gives the child a mirror to satisfy the crying

and disturbing child with the reflection of the moon. Similarly the crying

child of the Lord is given over to the reflection, the material world, to

lord it over as a karmi and to give this up in frustration to become one with

the Lord .Both these stages are dreaming illusions only. There is no

necessity

of tracing out the history of when the living entity desired this. But the

fact is that as soon as he desired it , he was put under the control of

atma--maya by the direction of the Lord.

Therefore the living entity in his material condition is dreaming falsely

that this is "mine" and this is "I." The dream is that the conditioned soul

thinks of the material body as ' I ' or falsely thinks that he is the Lord

and

that everything in connection with that material body is ' mine' Thus only

in dream does the misconception of ' I and mine ' persist life after life.

This continues life after life, as long as the living entity is not purely

conscious of his identity as the subordinate part and parcel of the Lord.

"In his pure consciousnss, however, ther is no such misconceived dream,

and in that pure conscious state the living entity does not forget that he is

never the Lord, but he is eternally the servitor of the Lord in

transcendental love."

Prabhupada: Thank you very much.

[Guest guest]

rRADHA KRSNA AND KRSNAS LILAS ARE VERY ADVANCE AND DANGEROUS TERRITORY FOR A

NEOFITE,SPECIALLY TRYING TO UNDERSTAND THE POEMS AND LILAS OF PURE DEVOTEES,

PREMANANDA GOURA

PD

Im the neofite,low unintelligent,at least for me is to advance

prema

[Guest guest]

>>RADHA KRSNA AND KRSNAS LILAS ARE VERY ADVANCE AND DANGEROUS TERRITORY FOR

>>A NEOFITE,SPECIALLY TRYING TO UNDERSTAND THE POEMS AND LILAS OF PURE

>>DEVOTEES, PREMANANDA GOURA PD

 

How's that? Please back up your statement.

 

When hearing from the proper source, in a proper state of mind, they are our

means of purification. When speculated upon, they become a path to

bewilderment, for they are not subject to our speculations.

 

nivrtta-tarsair upagiyamanad

bhavausadhac chrotra-mano-'bhiramat

ka uttamasloka-gunanuvadat

puman virajyeta vina pasughnat

(SB 10.1.3)

 

This verse explains how descriptions of Lord Krishna are relished by those

free from material attachment, and for those bound by attachments, these

very same narratives act as an agent of purification for our material

disease. Who else, but a butcher, or one killing himself, would cease to

hear such glorification of the Lord?

 

That is my question. And the question of Maharaja Pariksit.

 

I can't see any problem in understanding the verse quoted from Bhaktivinode

Thakura, especially since it's message doesn't even apparently contradict

the teachings of Srila Prabhupada, and thus no interpretation is called for.

 

Dear Premananda Gaura Prabhu, is there a problem? There is the danger of

throwing the baby out the window with the bathing water in your

presentation. For Krishna manifests His divine pastimes here to attract the

fallen souls back to the spiritual world.

 

Why in the world should these pastimes not be discussed about? Did Srila

Prabhupada write his Krishna-book for the paramahamsas only? Or perhaps

there were neophytes also back in the times when he wrote the book, and he

wrote to benefit them. He is certainly a pure devotee, and Krishna-book is

certainly his beautiful poetry.

 

ys. ekatma das.

[Guest guest]

Hari bol,AGSP,and all the vaisnavas devotees of the Lord,thanks for the

letter,I dont want you to try to put me in the position os starting a

controversy or nothing like thet,reading krsnas pastimes,explain by SRILA

PRABHUPADA are perfectBAKTIVINODA TAKURA poems are full of trancendental

expresions of a pure devotee,as far im concern this is my personal opinion,I

want to understand first goura lila and then be ready to hear statments like

WE HAVE COME FROM RADHA AND KRSNA LILA,sorry I am to low and sinfull to even

begin to imagine myself being part of the transcendental pastimes of their

LORDSHIPS RADHA SYAMASUNDARA,I am wrong???please forgive me if I ofend you or

any vaisnava devotte of KRSNA,please I humbly beg for you to pray for me,so I

can develop pure love for guru and gouranga

your servant

[Guest guest]

dear Premananda Gauranga Prabhu,

 

>>as far im concern this is my personal opinion,I

>>want to understand first goura lila and then be ready to hear statments

>>like WE HAVE COME FROM RADHA AND KRSNA LILA,sorry I am to low and sinfull

>>to even begin to imagine myself being part of the transcendental pastimes

>>of their LORDSHIPS RADHA SYAMASUNDARA,I am wrong???

 

It is natural that understanding the pastimes of Gaura-Nitai and Radhe-Syam

go hand in hand.

 

gauranga-gunete jhure, nitya-lila tare sphure,

se jana bhakati-adhikari

 

If one appreciates the merciful pastimes of Lord Caitanya and feels ecstacy

and sometimes cries, this process will immediately help him to understand

the eternal pastimes of Radha and Krishna.

 

And having started to understand the mercy of Lord CAitanya, a natural

eagerness to discuss the qualities and pastimes of Radha-Krishna awakens

within one's heart.

 

>>then be ready to hear statments like

>>WE HAVE COME FROM RADHA AND KRSNA LILA,sorry I am to low and sinfull to

>>even begin to imagine myself being part of the transcendental pastimes of

>>their LORDSHIPS RADHA SYAMASUNDARA,I am wrong???

 

Yes, you are wrong. You are imagining. We are not to imagine to be low, or

sinful. It is nothing but a misconception. For the spirit soul, you, my dear

friend, is transcensental to attributes such as low or sinful. Jivera

svarupa haya krsnera nitya dasa - the living entity is an eternal servant of

the Lord. These statements are true - we have to face the fact. And if we

don't want to accept them, then what is our position? What is our claim for

an argument? For a position in maya is impossible and futile to defend.

 

By the way,

 

>>as far im concern this is my personal opinion,I

>>want to understand first goura lila and then be ready to hear statments

>>like WE HAVE COME FROM RADHA AND KRSNA LILA,

 

if you read Caitanya Caritamrita, the Gaura-lila, how in the world will you

avoid statements about Radha and Krishna, their loving pastimes? For the

pastimes of Lord Gaurasundara are extremely involved with

Radha-Krishna-lila, from the beginning 'til the end. For what was Lord

Caitanya thinking about? He was in the mood of Radharani, experiencing

intense separation from the Lord of Her life. And as these moods of ecstasy

are discussed in depth, what shall we read, if not narratives of the loving

relationship of Radha and Krishna? Shall we read just the numbers on the

bottom of each page?

 

Please let me know.

[Guest guest]

yes prabhuji talking about gouranga lila HES mood is that of SRIMATI

RADHARAN but im not separating nothing,you are just to advance for me,thanks

for your quoatations,still im trying to digest prabhupadas diary and if you

said im wrong im must be,please forgive me,all glories to RADHA KRSNA,

ypur servent

premananda goura

[Guest guest]

Premananda's mood of considering ourselves as low and sinful is the proper

mood for a humble Vaisnava who sees his true fallen condition within the

material atmosphere, and who realizes our utter dependence of Krsna to give

His mercy to us, so fallen and unfortunate. Yet Premananda Gour is being told

not to sat that, that it is improper.

 

So will we say the same thing about our beloved Srila Prabhupada, who calls

himself an insignificant beggar, in a genuine display of profound humility? Of

course we are spirit souls, but we are not Brahmavadis, we are personalists.

So our mood is that we are insignificant, fallen fools, not that we instead

philosophically we always think...no I am eternal spirit soul...I am Brahman.

Our exchange of loving service creates certain personal sentiments that are

unfamiliar to impersonalists. And for a devotee to consider himself fallen,

unqualified, insignificant, etc., is the only mood that will eventually

qualify him to ever receive the mercy of the guru and Krsna.

 

As far as always thinking philosophically about our ultimate position, Mother

Yasodas comes to mind. She thought Krsna was just her son, and she was filled

with a multitude of anxieties and loving feelings and moods for her precious

son. Not that "Oh, I am Brahma-- Spirit soul, the Supreme Absolute Person's

eternal servant." That highly philosophic mentality is not so compatible with

some loving exchanges that develop in the hearts of the devotees.

 

To be too quick to criticize in a public forum a Vaisnava's expressions

creates an atmosphere that spoils everything that would otherwise be

conducive to respectful exchanges between sincere devotees.

 

Respectfully Mahananda dasa

 

(besides, I know Premananda Gour, he is my dear friend. I happen to know that

he is low and sinful....LOL)

[Guest guest]

>>yes prabhuji talking about gouranga lila HES mood is that of SRIMATI

>>RADHARAN but im not separating nothing,you are just to advance for

>>me,thanks for your quoatations,still im trying to digest prabhupadas diary

>>and if you said im wrong im must be,please forgive me,all glories to RADHA

>>KRSNA,

 

thanks for trying to digest everything.

 

aham vaisvanaro bhutva.

 

I become the digestion in all the living entities.

 

-Krishna.

 

I can't personally digest the fact that an individual attempts to make his

subjective experience of Krishna consciousness, as per his level of

realization, into an absolute standard, and on that basis estimating the

conversations and insights of other devotees.

 

For we are all individuals, and have an individual relationship with

Krishna, as has been shown, and is to be seen for each of us. If we are to

understand the mercy of Caitanya Mahaprabhu, we ought to accept each

individual as a part of the beautiful sankirtana-movement. As we attempt to

build up stereotypes, to fit everyone into the same format, we are actually

killing our identity. Phalgu vairagya, they say.

 

For the Truth is personal, and to be a person means to possess individual

characteristics. And to spread love of the Supreme Truth, the prime

necessity for all living entities, we have to appreciate the individual

spark of Krishna consciousness burning in depths of the spirit soul, and fan

it, making it into a big fire, illuminating the darkness we are captured in.

 

Thank you for your understanding,

 

ys. ekatma das.

[Guest guest]

dear everyone,

 

>>Premananda's mood of considering ourselves as low and sinful is the

>>proper mood for a humble Vaisnava who sees his true fallen condition

>>within the material atmosphere, and who realizes our utter dependence of

>>Krsna to give His mercy to us, so fallen and unfortunate. Yet Premananda

>>Gour is being told not to sat that, that it is improper.

 

Absolutely I have no objection against someone considering himself low and

sinful. That was not the point of my presentation.

 

As for Srila Prabhupada, I doubt he ever said he's so sinful he could not

discuss topics of Krishna, His qualities and pastimes. If he did, I'd love

to know. For he wrote all these wonderful books filled with descriptions on

the topics above.

 

My point was, that on the plea of considering ourselves low and sinful, we

think we can't engage in hearing and chanting, or other devotional

practices. This is the philosophy of eternal anartha-nivritti. I meditate on

my disqualifications, how I'm completely incompetent for anything. And thus,

due to my incompetency, I don't do anything, for I'm so low and

disqualified. I meditate on my conditioned existence. And my thoughts carry

me on to the future, as we know from Gita. This is happening.

 

>>And for a devotee to consider himself fallen,

>>unqualified, insignificant, etc., is the only mood that will eventually

>>qualify him to ever receive the mercy of the guru and Krsna.

 

But why? Because in the midst of his lowly qualities he will come to see

that he possesses no love of God, and thus becomes anxious to attain it,

wherever it is available. Not that just due to his lowly qualities the mercy

will come, but due to the humility and eagerness to attain the mercy, due to

an intense desire to get it.

 

>>To be too quick to criticize in a public forum a Vaisnava's expressions

>>creates an atmosphere that spoils everything that would otherwise be

>>conducive to respectful exchanges between sincere devotees.

 

If I were to get on an individual's case, I'd write him private letters. If

I ever had any reason to do so, which I doubt. This is not meant to be an

individual criticism. What's the use. Criticism is not the word. Rather to

help each individual develop, by helping each other closer to understanding

these topics.

 

If an argument meant to produce discussion will be taken as criticism, I

feel sorry for that. An argument is meant to produce further and deeper

discussion, to boil things down to the ultimate essence, to help us give up

our own conceptions, and come up to Krishna's conceptions.

 

That's why I write. Please read my previous text, meant to explain my point.

 

Hare Krishna.

 

ys. ekatma das.

[Guest guest]

Yes, I agree with some of your points well made. But to carry every

discussion with so much argumentativeness as "I meant this" and "you said

that" and on and on, arguing, without taking a humble attitude and ignoring

Vaisnava etiquette is unattractive to a devotee that has tasted sweeter

things. So whatever you meant or said is good and we accept your instructions

and do not require to continue unless you feel a desire for such things.

Sometimes we have a comment about everything and always see whatever others

say in a 'better' light and want to correct them. But the whole forum becomes

a battlefield of one-up-man-ship and resembles the discussions of

unenlightened men in their unending arguments and defenses. You have also

observed this? Affectionately Mahananda dasa

[Guest guest]

Dear Ekatma das, after reading my last reply about arguing, etc., I wasn't

referring to you, necessarily, as it sounds when I reread it, but in general,

as I' ve seen in other unpleasant discussions. So please don't misunderstand

me as I wrote a reply hastily without enough consideration of how my words

might be understood as written. Mahananda dasa