intelligence

[Guest guest]

>>Intelligence is defined also as an ability to hold two contradictory

>>statements in one's mind without becoming confused...

 

>I've heard devotees say that quote (or variants upon it)

>as though it were siddhanta; I even recall seeing it before

>on the old "Discussions" forum. It always sounded funny to

>me, and now it's confirmed.

---s-----

>that I've never bought this defintion over the

>non-contradictory definition supported by pratyaksha (through

>the personal example of Srila Prabhupada and others),

>anumaaNa (through the law of the excluded middle), and shabda

>(in the Bhagavad Gita, Katha Upanishad, etc). When all 3

>forms of pramaaNa come together like that...

 

· Muni or rsi means 'intelligent'. Na casav rsir yasya matam na bhinnam.

"One who can agitate his mind in various ways for mental speculation without

coming to a factual conclusion." BG 2.56 purp

 

· LC has explained Atmarama verce not just in two ways but in 18 different

ways. (And it is evidence to the fact that LC in Krsna himself

"caitanya-gosani--`sri-krsna', nirdharila".)

 

(But of course it is not a definition of the intelligence but just one of

the simptoms.)

 

 

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18 DIFFERENT WAYS

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Madhya-lila:

Chapter Twenty-four

 

TEXT 4

 

`purve suniyachon, tumi sarvabhauma-sthane

eka sloke athara artha kairacha vyakhyane

 

Sanatana Gosvami said, "My Lord, I have heard that previously, at the home

of Sarvabhauma Bhattacarya, You explained the atmarama verse in eighteen

different ways.

 

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atmaramas ca munayo.

 

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7 DIFFERENT MEANING OF ATMA

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Madhya-lila:

Chapter Twenty-four

TEXT 11

 

`atma'-sabde brahma, deha, mana, yatna, dhrti

buddhi, svabhava,--ei sata artha-prapti

 

"The seven different meanings of the word atma are the Absolute Truth, the

body, the mind, endeavor, firmness, intelligence and nature.

 

 

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MUNI EXPLAINED

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Madhya-lila:

Chapter Twenty-four

TEXT 15

 

`muni'-sabde manana-sila, ara kahe mauni

tapasvi vrati, yati, ara rsi, muni

 

"The word muni refers to one who is thoughtful, one who is grave or silent,

an ascetic, one who keeps great vows, one in the renounced order, a saint.

These are the different meanings of the word muni.

 

· BG Chapter 2, Text 56 PURPORT

 

The word muni means one who can agitate his mind in

various ways for mental speculation without coming to a factual

conclusion. It is said that every muni has a different angle of vision, and

unless a muni differs from other munis, he cannot be called a muni in the

strict sense of the term. Na casav rsir yasya matam na bhinnam (Mahabharata,

Vana-parva 313.117).

 

· June 1974:

"Tarko apratisthah srutayo vibhinnah. If you study

scriptures, so in the world there are many varieties of scriptures. There is

Bible, there is Bhagavad-gita, there is Koran, there is so on so on. So

which one is correct? That also you cannot decide. Srutayo vibhinnah, and

nasau munir yasya matam na ... he cannot become a big scientist. He must

give a different view; then he is big scientist. So nasau munir yasya matam

na bhinnam. Then where is the way to understand? The conclusion is mahajano

yena gatah sa panthah: "Mahajana, great personalities, recognized acarya,

what they say, you follow." That is the best system. So anyone who is

speaking about God with authority--take for example Jesus Christ; he is

speaking in the western world--you accept him. We Indians, we accept

Caitanya or Ramanujacarya, Madhvacarya. That is the way."

 

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Just an example

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Madhya-lila:

Chapter Twenty-four 16-17

 

The word nirgrantha refers to one who is liberated from the material knots

of ignorance....

 

Nirgrantha also refers to one who is illiterate, lowborn, misbehaved,

unregulated and devoid of respect for Vedic literature...

 

****************

"I am the source of everything." Devotees have no problem

understanding the ultimate cause of everything, but nondevotees must face

many opposing elements because everyone who wants to be a prominent

philosopher invents his own way. In India there are many parties of

philosophers, such as the dvaita-vadis, advaita-vadis, vaisesikas,

mimamsakas, Mayavadis and svabhava-vadis, and each of them opposes the

others. Similarly, in the Western countries ...

 

SB Canto 6: Chapter Four, 31

*******************

 

This, all these Vedic scriptures, they are interrelated. They are not

contradictory. If somebody says that "We find some contradiction from Vedic

literature, from this literature to that literature," no. There is nothing

at all, any contradiction, even, even in the preachings of the great

acaryas. I am speaking of India. There were many great acaryas, I mean to

say, reformers, came. Lord Buddha also appeared in India. Then, after Lord

Buddha, Sankaracarya came. Then, after Sankaracarya, Sri Ramanujacarya came.

Then, after Sri Ramanujacarya, Madhvacarya, and then, lately, Sri Caitanya,

Lord Caitanya. He came. But you will find a link, a link, although

superficially we may see that Lord Buddha is speaking something which is

contradictory to Lord Sankaracarya's teaching, or Ramanujacarya is speaking

something which is contradiction to Sankara. No. There is no contradiction.

******************

 

Adi-lila

Chapter Five,

Text 41

In reply to the commentary of Sankaracarya on the forty-fourth

verse, it may be said that no pure devotees strictly following the

principles of Pancaratra will ever accept the statement that all the

expansions of Visnu are different identities, for this idea is completely

false. Even Sripad Sankaracarya, in his commentary on the forty-second

verse, has accepted that the Personality of Godhead can automatically expand

Himself variously. Therefore his commentary on the forty-second verse and

his commentary on the forty-fourth verse are contradictory.

 

It is a defect of Mayavada commentaries that they make

one statement in one place and a contradictory statement in another place as

a tactic to refute the Bhagavata school.

********************

 

Dkdd:

 

>>Obviously, Jiva Gosvami's Vairagya Martanda was not written for women

>>either. There was no danger they would ever hear it.

 

Obviously? No. It was written for the benefit of everyone. There's no

evidence to the fact that Goswamis wrote thier books just for men or just

for brahmanas or ... etc., "For the benefit of ALL in human society, they

left behind them immense literatures". However it may be true for the

Niti-Sastra by Canakya to some degree.

 

Still Prabhupada has recomended to use the NS: "All the slokas of Canakya

Pandita are very useful for daily affairs". Vrnd nov 24 76

 

<Srila Prabhupada also made it clear that these statemtents about women

apply to materialistic women. "Never trust tha politician or a woman. Of

course, when a woman comes to Krishna Counsciousness, that position is

different." London July 1973> from NSaqbSP by SDG

 

I think it is essential to understand that the cultural situation and family

institution and social structure were quite different and are still quite

different in Bharata varsa, but we cannot say that Prabhupada or Six

Goswamis did'n really mean it to be heard by women, or sudras, or yavanas

etc. TIMHO

 

YS CCD

 

<<The first duty of a person in the renounced order of life is to contribute

some literary work for the benefit of the human being in order to give him

realized direction toward self-realization. Amongst the other duties in the

renounced order of life of Srila Sanatana, Srila Rupa and the other Gosvamis

of Vrndavana, the foremost duty discharged by them was to hold learned

discourses amongst themselves at Sevakunja, Vrndavana (the spot where Sri

Radha-Damodara Temple was established by Srila Jiva Gosvami and where the

actual samadhi tombs of Srila Rupa Gosvami and Srila Jiva Gosvami are laid).

For the benefit of ALL in human society, they left behind them immense

literatures of transcendental importance.>> SB 2.2.5 Purport

[Guest guest]

>Of course we all want ISKCON to last, but this is not guaranteed.

>Unfortunately it does not say in scriptures that this will be the case.

>Lord Caitanya's movement will last for 10,000 years, but that does not

>have to be in the form of ISKCON. That kind of complacency can be

>dangerous. How can anyone think that Prabnhupada or Lord Caitanya will be

>pleased if we allow abuse of women, children, cows and the elderly to go

>on? How convenient to simply sit back and say that we don't need to

>change anythning because ISKCON is predestined to last. How sad.

>

>Before you jump all over my case, PLEASE read the recent letter from

>Harikesa Maharaja that addresses many of these points. It seems like the

>GBC executive committee has woken up and realized it's time for some

>serious changes. Time for the rest of ISKCON to follow. Jiv jago!

>

>Ys, Madhusudani

 

· · · · · ·

 

Nice points. Especially about 'complacency'. If we start changing around or

just an opposite: sit and don't do anything to manage Prabhupadas movement,

both can be fatal. There is definitely an optimistic note in your text. Even

ones Prabhupada privately said: 'Even such a strong organization as ISKCON

may fall apart' And there are many other warnings from him, he even made up

his printing house to be legally independent from his temples. But if

devotees follow Prabhupadas instructions I firmly belive that ISKCON will

last. If not: punar musiko bhava.

 

Your servant,

 

Caitanya candrodaya dasa

 

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