Introducing varnasrama

[Guest guest]

> > Really it seems to me that we are not going to see a highly evolved

> > varnasrama society for many generations, and it is our offspring, and

> > young converts who are the future.

 

> I think we could go a lot farther on the road to not just implementing,

> but establishing varnasrama, by thinking that it can be done, MUST be

> done, now, with the willingness to put our own individual desires aside at

> least some of the time to see that it does.

 

I am not sure if you missed the point of my text, but to reiterate, I agree

that we have to do whatever it takes to start the process of varnasrama

right now. Implement implies something that is ready for implementation,

that all the work has been done in planning, and now it is time to

implement. As Sthita Prabhu has alluded, varnasrama inherently consists of

interwoven webs of social interaction, of very evolved ways of dealing with

social problems. Daivi Varnasrama is to be introduced in the midst of an

asuric varansrama system, which has its own demonic cultural ways and webs

of relationships, built on sense gratification.

 

Changing a persons cultural baggage, is often not an easy or speedy process.

Also in order for daivi varnasrama systems to be introduced, people have to

be convinced it is needed, and many in ISKCON are not convinced of this,

because many of our people do not read the Bhagavatam, or others of

Prabhupadas instructions often enough, and others who do, are not in the

consciousness of noticing the varnasrama slant in his teachings.

 

 

Whoever says they want VAD has

> to be willing to make the sacrifices and commitment necessary, even if

> it's just to grow a garden or to become an entrepeneur or whatever seems

> most pressing to that person.

 

Here in Mauritius my family are very keen to try to start varnasrama, and we

are looking for land for this. But we also know that we can do very little

on our own. Varanasrama is the sum of several families, or even a village or

town. It is a social system, that requires all the members of society to add

their contribution to before it can exist, as a holistic social body. One

can obviously take up more simple ways of life individualy, as you suggest,

and that should definitely be done, but for the actual varnasrama social

system to occur, it needs a critical mass of people who can provide all the

spiritual, cultural, social, and material needs.

>

> It seems though that if one person could spread the monumental philosophy

> of KC around the world in one lifetime, a whole society of that person's

> followers (and it certainly matters if they're following and not just

> idolizing their leader), or even just a few of them, or even just ONE of

> them, could marshall the same faith, accomplishing what is a comparatively

> easier goal in the same amount of time. Empowerment comes from surrender,

> from commitment, in the face of all obstacles.

 

I personaly feel the reason varnasrama has not been embraced by the society,

and especialy pushed by the leaders, is because it requires a push towards

simple living, and the real surrrender that implies. Most of our people are

not ready to give up their comfortable city apartments, where they can get

international produce just around the corner, jump into their AC car, and

generaly take advantage of the results of ugrakarmic activity, provided by

others forced by economic conditions to slave in factories, or drive long

distance trucks.

 

 

> There's room for all kinds of activities, it's simply a matter of what the

> society chooses to focus on.

 

Certainly, I suggested that we focus on varnasrama as opposed to massive

praching, simply because there are already millions of books out there,

describing an ideal varnasrama society of simple living and high thinking,

but not even one active varnasrama community anywhere in Srila Prabhupadas

ISKCON. Shouldnt that now be the priority? I agree that the preaching should

still go on, but let the society focus on something we have ignored, but

which was central to Srila Prabhupadas teaching.

 

As Prabhupada once said, "We have enough

> devotees, it's time to boil the milk." Of course, it's possible that the

> shrinking temple population is a sign of milk being reduced as it's being

> boiled, resulting in a sweeter, more concentrated and devoted temple

> population.

 

I dont think so. Prabhupada's suggestion to boil down the milk, meant to

implement the training courses, of bhakti Sastri etc, along with his

previous orders to start varnasrama. Training in most ISKCON centers is

almos nill. It does not take much to see that the dwindling temple

populations are due to the fact that many devotees are seeking a more loving

spiritual life, and are running off to other groups becasue they think they

can get that there. If only we could provide a more loving caring and

nurturing environment. Varnasrama could give us that.

 

I want varnasrama now also, and we can start. But for us to have the full

thing with all the cultural activity, (drama, dance, the arts, etc etc) the

networks. Vaisnava ettiquette enshrined in our hearts, independant Brahmins,

land holding ksatrias, etc. That is going to take a long time.

 

YS Sd

[Guest guest]

On 21 Apr 1999, Madhava Gosh wrote:

 

> The problem in an incomplete implementation is that the

> social

> vision is constrained to a point where the mISKCONception is that the

college

> is

> the society and once devotees move on in their lives there are considered as

> fallen or blooped instead of as alumni. Ther is more to VAD than being a

> brahman, more career paths than becoming a swami.

 

 

 

I find that the mentality of being considered blooped not so prevalent as

before, especially if you can say you're doing some kind of preaching.