Initiation (?)

[Guest guest]

>

> I have tried to show through several of my texts lately that the reason

> why I want to discuss these things is not to win a discussion, it is to

> start to find out the truth. To defeat me in such a discussion may not be

> very difficult, because I don't know so much about it.

 

Well, you are not really sitting there, infront of your "comp",

in the cross-legged posture with your hands folded together,

like Maharaja Pariksit sat infront of Sukadeva, are you?

 

It's a kind of discussion-debate, where arguments are thrown

in back and forts. I try to defeat the arguments (not _you_,

however it's you the one who is placing them, so... good greef)

that I find "suitable for defeating". What to do. Forgive me my

bad habit.

 

Anyway, Vainavas (opps.. "Vaisnava candidates") don't mind to be

defeated in such debates by another.. hmmm... if it serves, finally,

for increasing the understanding.

 

 

>

> > For him it did not matter that she was not maha-bhagavata. He took the

> > instruction into the heart.

>

> Yes, but he got good instructions before he got attatched to the

> prostitute, is it not? (I am sorry to say that I am not sure about all the

> details of the story).

 

Quite the opposite. He was mad after her, runninig through the

storm, jumping over crocodiles,... just to meet her. Then she

instructed him to better transer that attachment, from her to

Krsna. So he did.

 

 

> So that meant that he was spiritually

> "re-awakened", and he took it that Krishna was speaking through her.

 

That's exactly the case of all us -- re-awakining our spirituality.

 

And that's exactly the case of a bona fide guru -- via media, someone

who Krsna speaks through.

 

And that's exactly how we should see someone who gives us good,

spiritual instruction -- our guru. One that Krsna (Paramatama)

inspired to tell us something for our spiritual benefit.

 

 

 

>

> I have heard so many things in different lectures and read som many things

> in Srila Prabhupada's books, but one thing which somehow is stuck in my

> consciousness is that the only was to get out of the material world is

> through the mercy of a pure devotee. Am I completely off having this idea?

 

Not completely off.

 

But how shall I say it, and in the same time avoid repeating myself

for the third time, and... I mean.. The instructing gurus are also

available for this purpose, not only the ONE, the initiating guru.

(I know, you already told me that you are in agreement with this)

 

 

 

>

> In this quote it says "they cannot". Anyway, the point is obviously that

> Prabhupada does not really recommend such a solution, isn't it?

 

Well, let's read a few words further:

 

In this quote it says "they cannot advance very well". Take "very

well" out, and we are left with "they cannot advance". Is that's what

you are proposing to be the meaning?

 

Yes, obviously Srila Prabhupada does not recommend the inferior

type of advancement, through the inferior guru. But he does not

reject the inferior guru as bogus, as simply useless, that

you can't get any spiritual advancement from/through. And that

is the point we are discussing/debating here.

 

 

 

ys mnd