Guest guest Posted May 15, 1999 Report Share Posted May 15, 1999 On 15 May 1999, Janesvara Dasa wrote: > If Satsvarupa Maharaja is such a mahabhagavata as you imply then shouldn't he > be installed as the next acarya, number 33 on the list? This would certainly > put to rest any further argumentation as to who should be the acarya in the > movement and he could give diksa to everyone seeking the same. It would really > end a lot of devisiveness. I'm serious. Long ago, somebody in this movement, I can't remember who, quoted Prabhupada as saying that " After me, finished. No more acarya for the next 10,000 years. Could somebody authoritatively substantiate or refute this? ys, Tulai-priya dasi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 1999 Report Share Posted May 16, 1999 WWW: Tulasi-priya (Devi > Long ago, somebody in this movement, I can't remember who, quoted > Prabhupada > as saying that " After me, finished. No more acarya for the next > 10,000 years. > > Could somebody authoritatively substantiate or refute this? > > ys, > Tulai-priya dasi Would this authoritatively refute it? And to become acarya is not very difficult. First of all, to become very faithful servant of your acarya, follow strictly what he says. Try to please him and spread Krsna consciousness. That's all. It is not at all difficult. Try to follow the instruction of your Guru Maharaja and spread Krsna consciousness. That is the order of Lord Caitanya. amara ajnaya guru hana tara' ei desa yare dekha tare kaha ‘krsna'-upadesa [Cc. Madhya 7.128] "By following My order, you become guru." And if we strictly follow the acarya system and try our best to spread the instruction of Krsna... Yare dekha tare kaha ‘krsna'-upadesa [Cc. Madhya 7.128]. There are two kinds of krsna-upadesa. Upadesa means instruction. Instruction given by Krsna, that is also ‘krsna'-upadesa, and instruction received about Krsna, that is also ‘krsna'-upadesa. Krsnasya upadesa iti krsna upadesa. Samasa, sasti-tat-purusa-samasa. And Krsna visaya upadesa, that is also Krsna upadesa. Bahu-vrihi-samasa. This is the way of analyzing Sanskrit grammar. So Krsna's upadesa is Bhagavad-gita. He's directly giving instruction. So one who is spreading Krsna-upadesa, simply repeat what is said by Krsna, then you become acarya. Not difficult at all. Everything is stated there. We have to simply repeat like parrot. Not exactly parrot. Parrot does not understand the meaning; he simply vibrates. But you should understand the meaning also; otherwise how you can explain? So, so we want to spread Krsna consciousness. Simply prepare yourself how to repeat Krsna's instructions very nicely, without any malinterpretation. Then, in future... Suppose you have got now ten thousand. We shall expand to hundred thousand. That is required. Then hundred thousand to million, and million to ten million. Devotees: Jaya! Prabhupada: So there will be no scarcity of acarya, and people will understand Krsna consciousness very easily. So make that organization. Don't be falsely puffed up. Follow the acarya's instruction and try to make yourself perfect, mature. Then it will be very easy to fight out maya. Yes. Acaryas, they declare war against maya's activities, that maya instructing that "Here is wine. Here is cigarette. Here is that..." In your country these advertisements are very prominent, holding both ways, wine advertisement, cigarette advertisement, naked woman advertisements, and sometimes gambling also, advertisement. What is that? Congo? Devotees: Bingo. Prabhupada: Bingo. (laughter) Yes. So this is maya. And our declaration of war with maya -- no intoxication, no meat-eating, no bingo -- (laughter) these are our declaration of war. So we have to fight in that way because nobody can understand Krsna without being free from all sinful activities. These are sinful activities. Therefore it is acarya's business to stop these nonsense activities. Otherwise they'll not be able to understand, especially the meat-eaters. They cannot understand. >>> Ref. VedaBase => Sri Caitanya-caritamrta, Adi-lila 1.13 -- Mayapur, April 6, 1975 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 1999 Report Share Posted May 16, 1999 > > I thought you said he sauced you for going along with Tokyo Rose > fandango? > > That > > sounded pretty personal. > > > > Never did he he say to me directly, "Janesvara dasa, you are rascal > for..." He > told his ritviks that we in the NY temple were foolish if we went > along with > Bali Mardan's nonsense. They let us know about it in no uncertain > terms. First, a rittvik is an officiating priest engaged for a specific purpose of ritualistic ceremony. A TP may act as a rittvik on occasion, but when passing on info from Srila Prabhupada, that is a little differnet, not exactly a rittvik. Second, On my first visit, His Divine Grace said that it was necessary for educated boys like me to go to foreign countries and preach the gospel of Caitanya Mahaprabhu. I replied that India was a foreign-dominated nation and that no one would hear our messages. Actually, at the time foreigners considered Indians very insignificant because in the face of so many independent nations India was still dependent, being dominated by Britain. At the time there was one Bengali poet who actually lamented that even uncivilized nations were independent, whereas India was dependent on the British. His Divine Grace convinced me that dependence and independence are simply temporary conditions, and he pointed out that because we are concerned with the eternal benefit of humanity, we should take up this challenge of Caitanya Mahaprabhu. This meeting with His Divine Grace, my Guru Maharaja, took place in 1922, half a century ago. I was officially initiated in 1933, just three years before the passing of Guru Maharaja from this mortal world. At the last moment, just a fortnight before his passing away, he wrote me a letter repeating his instructions. He specifically said that I should try to preach this gospel among English-speaking people. >>> Ref. VedaBase => The Perfection of Self-realization Even though Srila Bhaktisiddhanta wasn't personally present all the time with Srial Prabhupada, Srila Prabhupada was still rendering personal service, and following personal instructions. Personal association doesn't need to mean actual physuical presence daily, as you seem to be struggling with. You had Srila Prabhupada's personal approval for your initiation, and you recieved personal instructions from him, even though he wasn't personally looking you in the eye at the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 1999 Report Share Posted May 16, 1999 > Is this what diksa means? Chanting on someone's beads? I thought that > was > HariNama initiation or something like that. Doesn't diksa require > surrendering > to a living guru and serving him personally/directly with inquiries > and > instructions? There is the heart connection of diksa, and there is the external ritual acknowledging that connection. In the ritual, the guru chants on the beads and gives them to his disciple. > Did you receive your knowledge of Krsna directly from Srila > Prabhupada or was it primarily through his books and tapes and other > devotees? I think you are obsessing on this point way beyond what is productive. Of course it was books, tapes, and other devotees. So what? If I personally plant the seeds in my garden, or I employ someone to plant them for me, what is the difference? They are still my plants. Srila Prabhupada is available to everyone through his books etc as siksa. I think everyone agrees on that point. What are you trying to prove by this insistence on making this point about physical presence? > > > Also, if it was KSwami who chanted on the beads does this negate the > diksa > because of his subsequent major fall down? > > > > > About June, 1974, in NV. Srila Prabhupada was there personally > and did > hand > > me > > my beads directly. > > I never had that happen to me. Did I miss the diksa bus? > > > > How was it "performed". Did you speak/hear directly/personally to > Srila > > > Prabhupada when it happened. > > > > > > Not other than the question he asked "What are the 4 regulative > principles?" > > which I did manage to croak out. Then he said my name, but I > didn't really > > understand what it was exactly, only Madhava something, until later > when the > > letter or whatever came with it in writing. > > Is this the meaning of diksa initiation? > > Why didn't Srila Prabhupada arrange to meet every single one of his > disciples > personally/directly to give diksa association/instructions? When Srila > > Prabhupada visited each temple wasn't it possible to set up a room in > each > temple where Srila Prabhupada could have sat and received each > disciple in a > temple one by one and given them direct/personal/bodily > instructions/diksa? > > > > > > For all his initiations, hewas physically present on the same > planet at the > > same > > time and aware of each individual candidate with a veto power, > just > sometimes > > he > > used agents due to logistical difficulties. > > Did he ever "veto" anyone after his trusted ritviks sponsored a > prospective > candidate? > > Did he get a detailed biography of each candidate's qualifications so > he knew > the intimate details of this prospective disciple's service attitude > and level > of surrender before granting initiation? Or did he know the candidate > because > of his connection to Paramatma? Or did he rely upon his ritviks to > train the > prospective disciple through instructions from the guru's books and > lectures. > If he knew each one of his disciples because he was "physically > present" on > the same planet why then did he not veto Kirtanananda's, Bhavananda's, > > Jayatirtha's, Harikesha's, etc. ad nauseum, initiations knowing that > they > would commit such offenses in the future? > > If Srila Prabhupada is now preaching on a neighboring planet a few > thousand > miles away cannot his ritviks continue to train prospective disciples > the same > way they did previously and present the candidates to Srila > Prabhpada's murti > in the temple? Does he refuse to accept our service to his murti in > the temple > because he is not "here" to tell us if we are serving his murti > properly? > Certainly our seva is not spotless. Should we take away all murti's of > Srila > Prabhupada? Or does he trust us to serve his murti sufficiently? Does > he trust > us to sufficiently train prospective disciples in the same way we did > before? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 1999 Report Share Posted May 16, 1999 Thanks very much Prabhu. > Search of Veda base for > > Kali not "age of kali" not kali-yuga and movement > > yielded 45 hits. The only thing close was the following, which talks > about devotees of Kali, not Kali directly. You might have heard that > story from Jayatirtha. > > Prabhupada: Devotees.... To become devotee is not so cheap thing. You > don't think that because you have got a tilaka you have become devotee. > Why do you think like that? > Pusta Krsna: Jaya Prabhupada. > Prabhupada: That Bhaktivinoda Thakura, eita eka kalira chela, nake tilaka, > galaya mala:(?) "Here is another follower of Kali. He has got tilaka and > mala." Sahaja bhajana kacen mamu, sanga laiya parera wala (?): "He is > worshiping, bhajana, taking another's wife." Sahaja bhajana kacen mamu, > sanga laiya parera wala, ei ta eka kalira chela: "Here is a servant of > Kali. Simply he has changed his dress with tilaka and mala." Bhaktivinoda > Thakura says. If you take tilaka and mala and do all nonsense things, then > you are not a devotee. You are Kali-chela. To become a devotee is not so > easy thing. > > >>> Ref. VedaBase => Morning Walk -- March 25, 1976, Delhi > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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