Prabhupada's Varnasrama, Transitional Varnasrama

[Guest guest]

> Nevertheless, features such as this may prove valuable and even

> indispensible in building a transitional model of varnasrama that will

> ultimately lead us to Srila Prabhupada's ideal model.

 

After so many discussions about this matter and seeing the present situation

of the world and ISKCON, I ask myself If it would not be also wise to think

about how a society of spiritualists can work in the real world instead of

one wich may be in our dreams, in who knows what future.

 

Is Varnasrama indeed the final form of society in this age, which can be

revived, or should it be moore understood as a research tool which can be

examined to find out the basic principles which made it work in the past for

the people of the past?

 

Varnasrama and its principles seeem indeed to be universal but can they

therefore be applied everywhere under all circumstances equally or do they

have moore of a relevance when applied to the needs of the time and its

people?

 

Sure one will always find classes of people but isn,t there not much more to

life than that. Will the idea of "you have to divide" indeed succed although

it doesnt capture many people,s imagination, including that of many

devotees?

 

Is there a need to hang on to that which may have lost its relevance to time

place and circumstances and the present age?

 

Just some food of thought for further discussions.

 

Ys

Harsi das

[Guest guest]

Haribol Hare Krisna Dasi

I read this posting with great interest and concern. Where in the world

do you live that the government will accept taxes in kind? Thirty years ago

in Guatemala rural farmers were given a date and location along with their

tax bill. If they had no cash to pay taxes they had to show up with machetes

or hoes and build roads or repair trails or clear the brush next to the road

or what ever. I don't know of any countries doing that now!

In most countries we must pay cash taxes! While it would be ideal to

pay in kind it just doesn't happen in most countries. Your excellent

explanation of Prabhupada concept of Varnasrama just doesn't exist in the

real world. I have to sell my crops to support my self and my farm. I also

have a full time business as plumbing contractor. The farm could support

easily fifty to a hundred people with food. The fact is that can hardly pay

its taxes and make a profit. That is reality! In the USA Big Agra Biz is

wiping us out. Three hundred family farms a week go bankrupt. Less than

three percent of the population of the USA are family farmers, and that

number is dropping every day. The family farms are for all intents and

purposes are a thing of the past, In this country. I have no one who will

take over my farm after I am to old to farm, no one in my family wants to

work that hard for so little. Farming is a labor of love. Farmers are very

close to God, of course, you pray for rain, for sun ...but not to much, for a

cool summer and for a short winter with lots of rain/snow. You Pray the

cotton weevils won't get your crop. You pray for a good crop, for less pests

and pray that the wind wont blow the farmers next doors pesticides into your

fields. You pray for the health of your earthworms. ( I take a shoe box full

of them into the annual blessing of the animals by the Catholics). Farmers

pray all the time. Some time it helps ... sometimes well it doesn't.

Then some land developer comes into your area, offers every body a fist

full of money for their farm and they sell out. I hang on, because I love to

farm. Then the taxes start to skyrocket. My neighbors complain of the dust

when I plow. They have neighborhood meetings about the smell of the manure I

put on my land they grip about my "eyesore" house lowering the property value

of their trendy Styrofoam and chicken wire "country Villas and ranches"! The

county steps in and inspects to find something to fine me for or place an

additional tax on me.

Oh, would that there were such places, where the king gave the land for

free, to the farmers who paid in kind when crops were good and was forgiven

the taxes when crops were not so good.

In the real world we sweat blood to pay our taxes, we give up the opera

and the shows, friends and quick medical attention. We live isolated lives

of desperation, We have jobs in town to pay for the bad crops. Our lives are

filled with hope and prayers and tomato worms and grackles (a kind of bird)

that can wipe out a peach crop in a day. Some times people will come out and

spend several days or even a week. When they leave they tell me about what a

wonderful life I live and they envy me. No of course they didn't help me!

Oh well yes, They did pick some green beans and a few squashes. They were

aghast that I didn't have a smoke house full of slow curing hams and a

chicken coop full of egg laying contented hens. They said I should have at

least one cow just for looks if nothing else. If I got tired of the cow. I

could sell it to the slaughter house. Were amazed that it is forty-five

minutes to the nearest food store. and longer for entertainment like movies

or museums or restaurants.

The real world I fear is still a long way away from Prabhupada dream

Varnasrama. Perhaps when the cites are destroyed we can start over!

Carol

[Guest guest]

>

>

> On one hand we must maintain our recognition of the truth: Capitalism

> contains many elements which if unchecked will undermine the establishment

> of varnasrama. Prabhupada has discussed some of these detrimental aspects

> of capitalism.

 

Let us differentiate between capitalism and financial capitalism.