Initiation?

[Guest guest]

Please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada.

 

I know I am on dangerous ground here, so please bear with me Prabhu. I can

only speak from my limited understanding, so please correct me if my

conclusions are inconsistent.

 

> Can't Srila Prabhupada deliver a soul to

> Krsna's lotus feet if that person is living anywhere and happens to read

> one of Srila Prabhupada's books with sincerity? Isn't this why Srila

> Prabhupada wanted us to distribute millions and millions of his books?

If such a person would have absolutely no other choice, I am quite

confident that Srila Prabhupada or The Supreme Lord could do such a thing.

However the books tells us to seek and pray for the association of the

vaisnavas. These vaisnavas might very well be present where we expect it the

least, they might even be disguised as our children, Krishnas friends or

even plants or animals. Or what do you think?

We have Guru, Sadhu and sastra, thats the security-system Srila Prabhupada

gave us in his books.

 

 

> > Srila Prabhupada did not associate very much with

> > Srila Bhaktisidhanta, but the few instructions he got he served so

> > seriously that the result is amazing. Just one instruction is enough or

> > even one word.

>

>

> Cannot that instruction or one word come from Srila Prabhupada's

> vani/books? Isn't that why we distribute the books?

I would think so.

 

>

>

> > As for me who came later I can speculate left and right to be accepted

> > by

> > Srila Prabhupada but where is my confirmation?

>

>

>

> What kind of "confirmation" are you looking for? Some people look for

> "recognition" instead of "confirmation". That is not such a good idea.

> You, I don't feel, are doing that. Are you not advancing spiritually? Has

> not Srila Prabhupada's books been any assistance to you? We shouldn't

> doubt the potency of Srila Prabhupada - he can accept billions of

> disciples - because Krsna protects His pure devotee. Srila Prabhupada

> accepts the sinful reactions of his disciples but remember, even once

> chanting one Holy Name of the Lord (offenselessly)relieves one of more

> sinful reaction than one can incur in a lifetime. I think Srila Prabhupada

> chants offenselessly and he chants more than one Name a day.

>

>

Maybe it is not exactly a doubt in the potency of Srila Prabhupada but

rather the question of how exactly he wanted that things should go on after

his departure. In Srila Prabhupadas books I have always found confirmation

that I should surrender to a spiritual master.

I am looking for the kind of confirmation that shows me that what I am

doing is actually pleasing to Krishna and yes to read Srila Prabhupadas

books have proven to be just that. I can see now later on, that many of my

past activities were actually only performed out of a desire for fame and

recognition as you say, allthough I tried to seriously serve the Lord. As

the years pass by it becomes more and more evident to me how far away I am

from that goal of being accepted as a servant of the servant. However if I

would have seen this in the start I guess I would have given up immediately,

but my spiritual master and the vaisnavas could see me better than myself.

They took the time, raised me, were patient and realistic and they still

are. That is my situation, your situation is different and I am convinced

that Srila Prabhupada is personally taking care of you because he promised

to.

 

 

> Obviously, there is absolutely nothing wrong with approaching a personal

> spiritual master as the Goswamis and many others have. But did not the

> Goswamis also "approachnon-livingnon-bodily present" spiritual

> masters through reading their books and teachings?

 

I believe they did.

 

> If both are there, vapu and vani, take full advantage of both. But vani is

> always available and accessible for siksa.

Only if the vaisnavas/sadhus go out there and give it out, and only because

Srila Prabhupada in his elevated age took the trouble to come and establish

the connection.

 

> Another problem, obviously apparent in ISKCON, is approaching someone who

> claims to be a "spiritual master" but does not possess the qualifications.

> I have nothing against my Godbrothers becoming gurus. I have many friends

> in ISKCON whom I consider my guru because they have given me spiritual

> instruction. I have full faith that our Guru Maharaja's program is fully

> capable of developing pure devotees and maha-bhagavata gurus even out of

> low meat-eating humans born into candala families. They will be fully

> qualified to perform diksa ceremonies, in time. The question is when? This

> could take many decades of practice. These are very, very high

> qualifications we are speaking of. Let's not cheapen them out of an

> impatient desire to take another name so we are recognized as the formal

> member of a religious institution. This will not benefit us.

You are right of course but then again there is also death just around some

corner.

I have a hard time relating to the term of someone claiming to be a

spiritual master. As my spiritual master said on my initiation if a vaisnava

claims to be a guru he becomes an avaisnava. He simply does his work as a

guru as a service to his spiritual master. But he never considers himself as

such. My spiritual master never accepted any kind of worship from his

disciples but he was always available when I needed any help, he served

Srila Prabhupada as a fulltime-pujari for more than 20 years without asking

for any recognition and he still does. He could have written your last three

lines above.

 

> I was lucky, I happened to "approach" a spiritual master who did not "fall

> down" while he was "present" and while I was his practicing disciple. But,

> please know that my "approach" to him to the point of initiation was fully

> through "non-personalnon-bodily" indirect service and I never asked him

> one single direct question and he never gave me one direct, personal

> instruction. I had the merciful assistance and guidance of my senior

> Godbrothers who acted as my gurus's representative (Ritviks? - officiating

> priests). Cannot anyone do the same now?

I would consider such a representative a spiritual master if the guru had

left. You had the possibility of approaching Srila Prabhupada , but you

humbly accepted his mercyful arrangement and after so many years of serving

him how could anyone doubt that he is giving his mercy to you Prabhu. Your

humble attitude was a personal approach to a living spiritual master. We

cannot approach Srila Prabhupada in the same way all though he also speaks

to us through his books.

To my understanding your connection is unique but in the same time I also

dont think that he is indifferent to those of his granddisciples who finds

themselves lost because their spiritual master for some reason or other

could not uphold his position.

 

 

> I would be very happy to sponsor someone to Srila Prabhupada for

> acceptance as a disciple similar to the way me and thousands of my

> godbrothers were disciples. In fact, I have been doing that for several

> years for a good friend of mine who is trying to develop his spiritual

> life. My "sponsoring" would be through prayer and service that Srila

> Prabhupada please accept this sincere person the same way I pray and serve

> and offer food to Srila Prabhupada's pictures every morning. Does he not

> hear my prayers anymore now that he is "gone"?

Please dont feel offended by my unqualified attempts to make sense. As far

as I can see what you are doing is the work of a guru, a siksa-relationship

which could in time result in diksa. I think we have many more qualified

guru's in ISKCON than we know of, but they will never step forward by

themselves being naturally humble and purehearted. The real gurus are not

after recognition, they fear it. However they are also responsible to those

under their wings. They dont simply act as officiating priest and when the

trouble comes they wash their hands. A guru gives himself as a token to save

his disciple. Being a mother I can imagine the mental anxieties . Srila

Prabhupada seemed to be very emotionelly tied to his disciples with love in

every book I have read about him. Concerned to tears.

All these external shows of power or recognition, what are they worth?

Being a Guru is the most serious and demanding service anyone could take up.

Dangerous too, it could ruin his spiritual life, which might be what we are

seeing now and then. Therefore I have heard it is not advisable to take too

many materialistic disciples.

What do I know? Why do I even intrude on these areas? I want to learn and

know the truth and these were my doubts and reflections. Please forgive my

offensive attitude.

 

Your servant Gunamani d.d.