KANDAVAPRASTHA: Varnasrama Currilculum Development sessions

[Guest guest]

Hare Krsna dasi

**************************

[my humble apologies for the long text]

 

Home-made Varnasrama Curriculum Development Sessions at Kandavaprastha.

 

Phalguna prabhu, who has recently assumed duties as head of the boys gurukula

at

New Ramana Reti in Florida recently called me up to ask some questions about

how

to develop a varnasrama curriculum. He is from Colombia and has long been

interested in self sufficiency, and together with several friends spent some

time camping in the jungles of Columbia trying to think of how to develop a

self-sufficient community. Gradually, they came to see that the missing

element

from their plans was Krsna, and all three of them became devotees. Now they

are

all in the U.S.

 

In the course of the conversation, it became clear that the best thing would be

if they could come up to Maine and spend some time discussing different aspects

of developing curriculum (that means thinking of which courses to have - the

word "curriculum" means "collection of courses) and what the different courses

would be like.

 

As it worked out, we have invited them up to Maine for June 27-July 3. At this

point Phalguna is not 100 % positive that he can arrange things at the gurukula

so that he can come himself, but he has already spread the word to others and

has requested me to post an invitation to all of you as soon as possible.

 

So, this is just a home-made conference of like minded devotees getting

together

and figuring out how to serve Srila Prabhupada. It's not an official ISKCON

event. We're not planning to have any big "stars" here. The focus will be on

training self-sufficiency skills and village organization, not on integrating

devotees into urban industrial life. And, it is still Tentative. If by next

Wednesday I have 6 devotees who are planning to attend, it's on. If not, maybe

we'll try again next year.

 

This is a low-budget, low-input event. I cannot afford to spend too much time

organizing it, because my goal is to complete volume 2 of the Prabhupada

varnasrama book before the conference. So I need to keep this small scale,

since I can't spend too much time organizing it. Bhakta Bob and my son and his

high school buddies are planning to put in the muscle work needed to organize

tent sites and set up facilities.

 

But even if it's small and informal, I think that if a few sincere devotees can

get together and earnestly discuss this topic we can try to please Srila

Prabhupada and get Krsna's mercy. I wish I could have notified you all

earlier,

and I hope that our many dear friends around the world who probably won't be

able to join us will try to put together similar informal meetings in your own

countries. (But, if anyone can come to Maine from abroad, that would be great,

too.)

 

So, here is my edited letter to Phalguna. You are all invited to attend, and

if

you cannot attend in person, please send the devotees at these sessions your

very valuable blessings.

 

your servant,

 

Hare Krsna dasi

 

*********************

 

Dear Phalguna prabhu,

 

Please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada!

 

Please accept my apologies -- I definitely intended to get back to you earlier.

 

Are you still interested in coming up to Maine at the end of June to discuss

developing a varnasrama curriculum?

 

I spoke with Bhakta Bob [bob Swett] and his wife Velma at our Lord Nrsimhadeva

feast last Sunday. They are very agreeable for devotees to come up to their

property and hold varnasrama curriculum development sessions for a week. As

soon

as I started to think about this, I thought probably other devotees would like

to come as well. I hope that you would not mind.

 

Ideally, I would envision it as follows. I have very little funds, Bob & Velma

also have little funds, but often Krsna will help us out on projects that we

want to do. So, ideally, here is my plan. I would think that at most probably

20

devotees would join us, probably fewer than that because it will be somewhat

austere.

 

We would have Sunday, June 27 as a day of registration, setting up tents and

campfires, and touring Kandavaprastha (which is what Bhakta Bob calls their

property) on John Brown Mountain and seeing many 200 year-old trees, streams,

etc. End the day with a campfire kirtan.

 

Then every day after that the schedule would be arranged somewhat as follows:

 

**Morning program, with the Bhagavatam class focussing on a principle verse in

which Srila Prabhupada discusses an aspect of varnasrama

 

**Breakfast prasadam

 

**A sample varnasrama class -- some days by devotees, some days by non-devotees

 

**Lunch prasadam and camp housekeeping 12:00-2:00

 

** 20-minute focus overview of a varna (which I would give) and round table

discussion of what type of training courses to offer for one particular varna

(probably 2-3 hours each day)

 

**Light dinner prasadam

 

** Kirtan or bhajanas

 

** Rest

 

*********************************

Now, here is my ideal schedule for the week for the afternoon round-table

discussions:

 

Monday - Overview for Varnasrama training and Course offerings for Sudra skills

 

Tuesday - Course offerings for Vaisya skills

 

Wednesday - Course offerings for Ksatriya skills

 

Thursday - Course offerings for Brahmana skills

 

Friday - Discussion of appropriate training opportunities for Women

 

Saturday, July 3 - Very small-scale Ratha Yatra (our decorated child's wagon

and

10-20 devotees) Wait til you see Lord Jagannatha!

 

**********************************

 

Possible morning sample varnasrama courses for the morning. All teachers would

be from the state of Maine, with part of the emphasis being how to utilize the

talent that Krsna has provided locally to provide knowledge and preaching

opportunities *PLEASE KEEP IN MIND THAT I HAVE *NOT* CONFIRMED THIS WITH *ANY*

OF THESE TEACHERS, this is just what I would like to arrange. What actually

happens depends on other people's schedules and what kind of funding we can

pull

together:

 

**Herbal studies by Mrs. Garland (my son's biology teacher, and a student of

James A. Duke, one of the country's leading herbologists)

 

**Economics by Jaya Lalita dasi (a friend of mine who is completing her masters

degree in Resource Economics at the Univeristy of New Hampshire)

 

**Ox power by Leslie Smith (a man who judges 4-H children in ox power events at

local fairs (there are 8 year old girls in Maine who can work oxen without

using

nose rings or halter - only a small stick), he also trains Brown Swiss oxen;

this is a chance to deal with the problem of how we get important knowledge

from

people who work with cows, but do not yet practice cow protection; how do we

build friendships that will lead to future preaching opportunities)

 

**Carpentry or Blacksmithing class by one of the local experts from the nearby

town of Vienna (pronounced locally as VAY-enna, as in "Vayu")

 

**Social Structure by Hare Krsna dasi (possibly based on my paper, "How not to

have an industrial revolution: Rural Economic Development in England, France,

Germany and Russia compared with the Vedic Varnasrama Model")

 

*************************

 

I have asked the director of the Bowdoin College Outing Club and he says that I

could probably sign out some tents and possibly other equipment for the week. I

am also encouraging my son Astottara to buy a tent.

 

As I explained, there are no buildings at Kandavaprastha, just one storage

trailer. Bathing will mean using water from the stream. We may be using sawdust

toilets, or Bhakta Bob may have his septic system hooked up by then. Probably

there will be no electricity, although possibly the electricity will be

connected by then. I'm not counting on that. There is a lake at the bottom of

the hill, so following the afternoon sessions, devotees may want to bathe in

the

lake.

 

Insects: This is Krsna's test to see if we are sincere. These are definitely

in

the adi-bhutic category of miseries. There are mosquitos, blackflies and

midges. Neem is an excellent repellent, but we ran out of it. We'll see what

else works. Also, if we can, we'll try to get ahold of a screen tent for the

afternoon discussion sessions. I think most tents have screens, so it should

not be a big problem at night. (At least Maine has no poisonous snakes.)

 

Food: As I say, we are all very poor. But with determination, we can make at

least simple offerings with not much expense. My son has volunteered to feed

the devotees with the rice and split peas if necessary. Hopefully our herbal

expert can show us edibles from the woods also. If devotees can contribute a

little toward prasadam, we can have something a little fancier. One way or

another, we will have a nice feast for Lord Jagannatha on Saturday.

 

*************************

 

The closest airport to us is the Portland Jetport, which is 45 minutes south of

where I live (Brunswick) and about 1.5 hours south of Vienna, where Bob and

Velma's land is (Kandavaprastha).

 

For flying, most people just fly to the Boston airport and take the bus to

Maine

(connections are easy to make at the airport). I can get more information on

this. I believe you could take a bus to AUGUSTA, MAINE (20 minutes south of

Kandavaprastha, and we could pick you up there). It's also possible you could

take a bus from Florida all the way to Augusta. Amtrack train does not come

into

Maine. It only goes to Boston, but you can easily transfer to a bus in Boston,

right at the train station.

 

If you can drive, that would be very good. But Florida is a couple days' trip.

 

**********************

 

So, as I explained, the above would be my ideal offering. The main thing that

would depend on funding would be whether we can offer sample courses in the

morning session, as I would want to offer some type of honorarium or

contribution to the people giving the classes (except for myself, of course).

My son is determined to provide the funding for his biology teacher to offer

the

herbal class for us (but he has not confirmed the schedule with her yet).

 

If I see that you are indeed interested in this type of event, then we will go

ahead and announce it to the devotees on the COW and VARNASRAMA conferences.

Also, even though it is a very informal event, I think it would be appropriate

if you could contact the current head of ISKCON's education department and ask

if he or she is interested in attending (at no fee). I can't remember who it is

this year, so it would be good if you could do this.

 

*******************

 

In general, my view of varnasrama curriculum is that Srila Prabhupada planned

for it to serve two purposes: to provide advanced education (occupational

training) for our gurukula students and also to provide training opportunities

for non-devotees, who would gradually become devotees by our association. I

believe that he also wanted to provide training for our young devotees who may

not have previously been to gurukula. This is a perspective that I would bring

to these sessions.

 

*******************

 

BOOKS for Varnasrama Courses

 

*Prabhupada on Varnasrama and Farm Community Development* The reason that I

have not responded to you is that I have been struggling to complete formatting

on the manuscript for Vol. 1, which is called "Speaking About Varnasrama" which

includes 40 conversations and lectures on varnasrama topics. Yesterday I sent

the manuscript to Bhaktivedanta Archives, and if there are no big problems with

it, there is a chance we will have copies of the book available at the

Varnasrama Curriculum Development sessions. I will request at least 20 copies

to

sell at the sessions.

 

In addition, my husband and I are friends some people who own a book store in

Brunswick. I will inquire whether they can provide us various self-sufficiency

titles for sale.

 

Also, I will bring books from my own self-sufficiency and farming library which

we can look at as possible class-room texts.

 

********************

 

What to bring:

 

THE USUAL,

 

bead bag

sleeping bag

dhoti/sari

suci kit

towel

any medications

 

AND

 

long pants (we might be able to help any women who don't have these)

socks

shoes or hiking boots (for herb walk, etc.)

 

ALSO GOOD

 

flash light

bug repellent (neem is good)

hat

sun screen

canteen

swim suit

rain poncho

your favorite self-sufficiency books, articles, etc., as texts for varnasrama

courses

(If you e-mail me the titles and I own a copy, I can bring mine so you don't

have to.)

 

****************************

 

There is no phone at Kandavaprastha. You would have to go one mile into Vienna

and make any phone calls from the "Dam Shop" (next to the dam). Vienna has a

population of about 800 so don't count on any big shopping trips.

 

*****************************

 

How to register

 

1. E-mail me at Hare.Krsna.dasi (AT) com (DOT) bbt.se with your name and phone number and

which days you can attend.

 

2. Next, please send a contribution for the varnasrama curriculum sessions to

me at

 

Noma Petroff

9B Stetson St.

Brunswick ME 04011

 

$20 - poverty level

$50 - towards donations for varnarama teachers

$100+ towards bringing in genuine devotee cooks (I'll refund anything over $50

if we don't have enough to bring the cooks.)

 

ALONG WITH THE FOLLOWING INFORMATION:

 

1. Name(s) [devotee and karmi names please] of those in your group

2. Address

3. Phone number

4. E-mail

 

5. Mode of transportation [own car, bus, plane, etc.]

6. Bringing your own tent/sleeping van; or requiring use of tent (you will

probably be asked to share our tents)

7. Dates of attendance [if your airfare arrangements require you to stay

longer,

that may be possible if we make arrangements in advance.]

 

Sun 27 June (registation)___

Mon 28 June (overview and sudra skills curriculum)___

Tues 29 June (vaisya)___

Wed 30 June (ksatriya)___

Thurs 1 July (brahmana)___

Fri 2 July (women)___

Sat 3 July (Small-scale Ratha Yatra)___

(Leaving Sunday)

 

*****************************

 

Final note. This will be a home-made, low budget get-together. This is for

those earnestly desire to serve Srila Prabhupada by helping to devise (whether

you plan to actually be a teacher personally or not) a varnasrama curriculum to

train both devotees and non-devotees (who are prospective devotees).

 

There will be no mass mailings to announce this conference. I'm sorry to say

this, because some of our most skilled self-sufficient devotees probably don't

have computers. Please help me out by printing out this letter and handing

them

a copy.

 

I encourage anyone who wants to bring their wife. This will make things much

more comfortable and convenient for me because my husband's health is not

sufficient to attend the whole conference, so I would appreciate having another

married woman present in the camp.

 

If we cannot afford to bring in a special devotee cook, we will all have to

pitch in with the cooking, cleaning, etc. In fact, I would love to personally

do this for the devotees, but since I am trying to organize this whole thing, I

am afraid the schedule will fall apart if I try to do that single-handedly.

 

*****************************

 

I think that's about it. I hope to hear from some of you very soon, and we'll

get together and plan how we can serve Srila Prabhupada.

 

Your servant,

 

Hare Krsna dasi

[Guest guest]

Haribol Hari Krishna Das

Where and when exactly will this be? Are they just going to plan

curriculum development, or self sufficiency?

Whether the Y2K thing is a boom or a bust. The best thing to come out of

it is that devotees are for the first time in twenty plus years actually

planning to follow Prabhupada suggestion and prepare for the cites being

destroyed and getting farms and becoming self sufficient. As far as the Y2K

thing, for all our sakes I hope for the nucence value of small annoying

quickly repaired problems. If that is the case great! We can pick up the

disaster supplies that some prudent people purchased at a discount! Plus we

will have the kick start some of us needed to start doing what we were

supposed to do twenty-five years ago. The Y2,000 thing if it is a bust, got

us out of our complacency off our butts and at least thinking about becoming

self sufficient. Now all we need is to keep going, and not to loose the

momentum we have just finally gotten. The cites being distorted may be a

physical thing like fire, flood,war,cycolone,earthquake. we just don't know

and speculation is a waste of time. We need to move even more quickly now.

If Y2K isn't the disaster we had all planned and worked so hard for great!

Now don't stop because the world didn't end at the stroke of midnight. We

know it is coming our spiritual master told us so, Y2K just jolted us out of

our creature comfort cocoon into reality.

Thank you Hare Krsna dasi, You sent us a wise and timely thoughts keep

it up!

Carol

[Guest guest]

DGilsen (AT) aol (DOT) com wrote:

 

> [Text 2324609 from COM]

>

> Haribol Hari Krishna Das

> Where and when exactly will this be? Are they just going to plan

> curriculum development, or self sufficiency?

 

As I say, this is still tentative. At this time, I only have a couple devotees

who have told me they are interested in coming. I also heard from another

devotee in Colorado who says he cannot come, but would like to make a

contribution. So I am waiting to see if people actually want to get together

for

this -- it may seem too far to travel on such a short notice. But, please

remember that by Krsna's mercy, the whole state of Maine is air conditioned

every

night -- so camping should be good in that respect.

 

So, to repeat:

 

KANDAVAPRASTHA: Varnasrama Curriculum Development sessions

 

Sunday June 27 - Saturday July 3 at Kandavaprastha in Vienna,

Maine (about 20 minutes from Augusta, Maine)

 

 

 

You ask "Are they just going to plan curriculum development, or

self-sufficiency?"

 

I'm not sure how to answer that. I guess I would say "both."

 

It's like if I wanted to set up a medical college, and you asked me if we were

just going to figure out what courses to have or whether we were going to study

the human body.

 

 

>From what I have seen of Srila Prabhupada's instructions, any attempt to start

varnasrama must begin with proper training for the varnas. ("Varna first, then

asrama" -- and I *know* that Madhava Gosh can find that in the VedaBase).

 

And, according to Prabhupada's vision for training the varnas, they must be

based

on self sufficiency. In the varnasrama walks in March 1974, when Srila

Prabhupada is asked how a vaisya should be trained, he makes it clear that the

vaisya would learn cow protection and how to plow -- in other words how to live

off the land.

 

Again, in 1977, Abhirama prabhu reports that when Prabhupada said he wanted to

go

to America to start Varnasrama, devotees asked him how he would do that, and

Prabhupada replied, "I will go to Gita-nagari, I will sit down, and I will

teach

you how to live off the land."

 

So, it appears that Srila Prabhupada's vision of how to teach varnasrama was

integrally tied to teaching self-sufficiency. His version of self-sufficiency

might be a little more broad than some people's because he also wanted the

ksatriyas to be trained in how to take care of the self-sufficient village, and

he wanted the brahmanas to be able to provide the spiritual "nutrition" in the

form of scriptural guidance, sacrifice (especially chanting the Holy Names),

and

leading the population in spiritual festivals.

 

But, Srila Prabhupada's vision of a varnasrama village was very much focussed

on

self-sufficiency. As he told devotees in Mauritius, "The first necessity is to

be self-sufficient. That is God's arrangement."

 

So, let us say that our goal is to build a varnasrama village that would

fulfill

Srila Prabhupada's vision. The first step in building such a village is proper

training. In the varnasrama walks and other times, Srila Prabhupada spoke

about

creating a "varnasrama college" to provide this training.

 

So, our discussion at Kandavaprastha will be to focus in on that specific

desire

of Srila Prabhupada's and pray for guidance to figure out the kinds of courses

that he would like to see offered for each of the different varnas. What will

be

the "collection of courses" or "curriculum" for each different varna?

 

If that is our focus -- who should come? Is this only for teachers?

 

No, this is definitely not just for teachers. The teachers, especially the

ones

from the Florida gurukula, are desiring to learn from others who have a little

expertise in different areas of self-sufficiency -- so they can devise the most

appropriate subject matter to have for courses.

 

They say, "It takes a village to raise a child." So, in this instance, the

teachers are saying "It takes a whole ISKCON community to devise a good

curriculum to give a devotee varnasrama training."

 

Part of the idea here, if we can afford it, is to have some sample classes

based

on subject matter that might be included in a varnasrama curriculum.

 

Another thing to keep in mind is that although varnasrama training is geared

toward developing self-sufficient Krsna conscious villages, the skills that a

student learns should help him in other possible careers.

 

For example, I work at a liberal arts college, and I often see that students

will

pursue a major in arts or literature, but after graduating they take a job in

some other area. Nevertheless, the analytical, problem-solving and

communications skills they have learned, and the ability to work on projects in

cooperation with others, is an asset to them in another career, even though on

the surface it doesn't look like what they trained themselves for. So that is

one other factor to keep in mind: although the focus is on self-sufficiency,

because Srila Prabhupada saw the philosophy of simple living and high thinking

as

most compatible with spiritual life, individual students may eventually use

their

training for other careers, but still retaining the values of a strong

spiritual

foundation in life.

 

So, does that answer your question? Should I reserve a tent for you? >: )

 

your servant,

 

Hare Krsna dasi

[Guest guest]

>"COM: Hare Krsna dasi (Brunswick, Maine - USA)"

><Hare.Krsna.dasi (AT) com (DOT) bbt.se>

>Hare.Krsna.dasi (AT) com (DOT) bbt.se, Cow (AT) com (DOT) bbt.se,

>Varnasrama.development (AT) com (DOT) bbt.se, Apocalypse.1999?@com.bbt.se

>"COM: Madhusudana (das) HKS (Mayapur - IN)"

><Madhusudana.HKS (AT) com (DOT) bbt.se>, DGilsen (AT) aol (DOT) com, "COM: Cow (Protection

>and related issues)" <Cow (AT) com (DOT) bbt.se>, "COM: Varnasrama development"

><Varnasrama.development (AT) com (DOT) bbt.se>

>Re: KANDAVAPRASTHA: Varnasrama Currilculum Development sessions

>Thu, 20 May 99 14:53 -040

>

 

>

>And, according to Prabhupada's vision for training the varnas, they must be

>based

>on self sufficiency. In the varnasrama walks in March 1974, when Srila

>Prabhupada is asked how a vaisya should be trained, he makes it clear that

>the

>vaisya would learn cow protection and how to plow -- in other words how to

>live

>off the land.

>

>Again, in 1977, Abhirama prabhu reports that when Prabhupada said he wanted

>to

>go

>to America to start Varnasrama, devotees asked him how he would do that,

>and

>Prabhupada replied, "I will go to Gita-nagari, I will sit down, and I will

>teach

>you how to live off the land."

 

Very interesting quote. Is that quote included in the conversations books?

Or where else might it be found?

>

>So, it appears that Srila Prabhupada's vision of how to teach varnasrama

>was

>integrally tied to teaching self-sufficiency. His version of

>self-sufficiency

>might be a little more broad than some people's because he also wanted the

>ksatriyas to be trained in how to take care of the self-sufficient village,

>and

>he wanted the brahmanas to be able to provide the spiritual "nutrition" in

>the

>form of scriptural guidance, sacrifice (especially chanting the Holy

>Names),

>and

>leading the population in spiritual festivals.

>

>But, Srila Prabhupada's vision of a varnasrama village was very much

>focussed

>on

>self-sufficiency. As he told devotees in Mauritius, "The first necessity

>is to

>be self-sufficient. That is God's arrangement."

>

>So, let us say that our goal is to build a varnasrama village that would

>fulfill

>Srila Prabhupada's vision.

 

Sounds great! Just wish I was in America...

 

 

The first step in building such a village is proper

>training. In the varnasrama walks and other times, Srila Prabhupada spoke

>about

>creating a "varnasrama college" to provide this training.

 

In that "varnasrama walk" you were mentioning, Srila Prabhupada describes

the brahmanas duty is to train the other classes, not just theoretically but

practically. To train vaisyas how to plow, for instance, they would have to

learn it themselves. Then after learning and teaching that most basic of all

skills, learn and teach how to plant, harvest and process the produce of the

field. (includes cloth)

The brahmanas duty is to be always learning something, and not hoarding that

knowledge, immediately, teaching it. Their teaching to the ksatriyas, should

be modelled after Srila Prabhupada's dealings with his managers, and the

descriptions of how Vedic ksatriyas treated their citizens. Ksatriyas should

be taught to 1. take advice from, act on it, and give respect to the

brahmanas, and 2.treat those under their protection as they would their own

family members. That is, with the utmost of personal care and concern. That

is good ksatriya, not one who simply tries to increase the treasury, or

maximize profit.

Everything depends on the good training and ideal character of the brahmana,

he's the head of the social body, and he directs the other classes. He has

the power to depose a ksatriya who is maximizing profit, at the expense of

those under him, or who is in anyway showing neglect of cow protection and

brahminical culture, or deviating in anyway from Srila Prabhupada's

directions.

The brahmana should not be dependent on wage, but be supported with all

necessities by those whom he teaches. Generously.

 

>So, our discussion at Kandavaprastha will be to focus in on that specific

>desire

>of Srila Prabhupada's and pray for guidance to figure out the kinds of

>courses

>that he would like to see offered for each of the different varnas. What

>will

>be

>the "collection of courses" or "curriculum" for each different varna?

 

How can we get this happening in other places? What was your procedure for

interesting devotees? Could you publicize the curriculum, and a

how-to-do-it-yourself agenda so this can be duplicated elsewhere?

 

 

>If that is our focus -- who should come? Is this only for teachers?

>

>No, this is definitely not just for teachers. The teachers, especially the

>ones

>from the Florida gurukula, are desiring to learn from others who have a

>little

>expertise in different areas of self-sufficiency -- so they can devise the

>most

>appropriate subject matter to have for courses.

>

>They say, "It takes a village to raise a child." So, in this instance, the

>teachers are saying "It takes a whole ISKCON community to devise a good

>curriculum to give a devotee varnasrama training."

 

Sorry, I was just throwing in a few ideas...

>

But you have my best wishes for a successful outcome. I'm sure Srila

Prabhupada will be pleased and bless this sincere endeavour...

>

>your servant,

>

>Niscala dasi

>

>

 

 

____

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