Initiation (?)

[Guest guest]

>

> Some, who may not like to wait, and in order to feel like they belong, may

> have a strong desire to take a guru in ISKCON even if there is not an

> uttama apparent.

 

I know that it is just a theoretical premisse, but since you

have yourself already given the kind of an ascertation what

would be better not to do 20 years ago, so I feel free to do

it:

 

What would ISCKON look alike if, in that apparent absence of

such nitya-siddha acaryas, no initiation would have taken place?

Would it be better that these were left "on ice" till that

moment that you are praying for? To wait. Is that what Prabhupada

would recommend? Seeing Prabhupada not waiting whatsoever till his

disciples reach the required maturity of 50-year old experienced

Vaisnava-grhstas before promoting them into sannyas order of

life, I have all my doubts.

 

 

> For someone who is a rank beginnner, a Madhayama devotee

> can give a lot of good instruction, but he cant take you home. He needs

> himself to find an uttama devotee to help him on the path, and if he is

> honest he will accept that.

 

The question is wether he may or may not connect us to Prabhupada.

Then the possibility of surpassing the level of own guru is open.

There is no prohibition to it, is there? If initiating guru is not

able to bring you there, "all way up", then all is needed is that he

is honest enough to not object you to advance further by aproaching

another siksa gurus. Then he himself benefits as well as.

 

 

> So one can accept a madhyama guru, and render

> service in ISKCON to his best ability, and the Lord will be pleased with

> any sincere surrender he sees and the sisya will certainly make progress,

> not pure spiritual progress, but certainly very good pious progress, until

> he is so pure that his service is completely unmotivated.

 

 

Questions:

 

Is advancing till the level of madhyama-adhikari Vaisnava a

"pious progress"?

 

At what point "pious activities" turn into "completely

unmotivated pure spiritual progress"? What is it that determines

what is "pious activity" and what "spiritual"? The type of somebody's

guru's spiritual advancement, or the type of person's own activity?

 

 

 

ys mnd