Q & A on Sannyasa & talking to wmen

[Guest guest]

> We see that in ISKCON we still have women serving sanyasis as personal

> secretaries and cooks.What is your opinion about them?

 

It's simply maya. Not only the guru ends up being severely effected (in

almost all cases) but I have also seen in many cases the brahmacari servant

of the guru gets entrapped and enchanted due to repeated contact with the

lady secretaries and cooks. It is the primary duty of the guru to protect

his personal brahmacari servant (a sannyasi is supposed to have a brahmacari

servant) and that is one reason why he should reject the idea of having lady

secretary or cooks. Like for eg Lord Caitanya considered His prime duty to

protect Kala Krsnadasa, His personal servant and that is why He personally

rushed to the place of the violent Bhattaharies to rescue him.

 

> If you ask a sanyasi this question he will refute it by saying 'Well Srila

> Prabhupada was taking prasad cooked by women, he many times glorified them

> also.'

 

A sannyasi keeping lady cooks is what Prabhupada himself did not like. How

can they justify this?

 

TKG's Diary Feb 22 - April 9:

 

Nava-yogendra Maharaja offered his services as cook, and Srila Prabhupada

proclaimed, "Yes, from now on no more women will cook for me; you will do

all of my cooking."

 

And a sannyasi keeping a lady secretary is strictly against Srila

Prabhupada's instructions:

 

>From Servant of the Servant, Part One, Chp Three:

 

While the cooking proceeded, Prabhupada again returned to speaking with me.

"It is better that I have a male secretary. Govinda dasi should join her

husband in helping to preach in Hawaii. People may criticize me, saying that

I am too closely connected with a woman. Of course, I do not find any

difficulty personally, nor any complaint with her service. But we must

consider the public's opinion." Prabhupada explained that a sannyasi's

character must be beyond fault and cited the popular example of "Caesar's

wife must be above suspicion." Prabhupada described how Lord Caitanya had

always acted in an exemplary manner and was the ideal sannyasi. Then,

speaking in a hushed tone so that what he said would not be overheard by

Govinda dasi, Prabhupada handed me a letter which he wanted me to mail. It

was addressed to his disciple Purusottama in New York. Prabhupada explained

that he was calling Purusottama to Los Angeles to replace Govinda dasi. It

was better that I mailed the letter, because he doubted whether she would do

so. After Purusottama came, he would gradually induce her to go to Hawaii.

 

Secondly as I have pointed out in my original message that we cannot imitate

what Srila Prabhupada has done regards to preaching because he was

specifically empowered by Lord Caitanya.

 

ORDINARY PERSONS SHOULD NOT IMITATE THE ACTIVITIES OF NARADA MUNI, HARIDASA

THAKURA & ACARYAS (LIKE SRILA PRABHUPADA) ESPECIALLY EMPOWERED TO BROADCAST

THE GLORIES OF THE LORD. ORDINARY PERSONS MUST STRICTLY OBSERVE THE RULES &

REGULATIONS BY STAYING ALOOF FROM THE ASSOCIATION OF WOMEN.

 

SB 7.7.14 purp:

 

One should not remain in a secluded place with a woman, even one's mother,

sister, or daughter. Nonetheless, although one is strictly prohibited from

staying with a woman in a secluded place, Narada Muni gave shelter to

Prahlada Maharaja's young mother, who rendered service to him with great

devotion and faith. Does this mean that Narada Muni transgressed the Vedic

injunctions? Certainly he did not. Such injunctions are intended for mundane

creatures, but Narada Muni is transcendental to mundane categories. Narada

Muni is a great saint and is transcendentally situated. Therefore, although

he was a young man, he could give shelter to a young woman and accept her

service. Haridasa Thakura also spoke with a young woman, a prostitute, in

the dead of night, but the woman could not deviate his mind. Instead, she

became a Vaisnavi, a pure devotee, by the benediction of Haridasa Thakura.

Ordinary persons, however, should not imitate such highly elevated devotees.

Ordinary persons must strictly observe the rules and regulations by staying

aloof from the association of women. No one should imitate Narada Muni or

Haridasa Thakura. It is said, vaisnavera kriya-mudra vijne na bujhaya. Even

if a man is very advanced in learning, he cannot understand the behavior of

a Vaisnava. Anyone can take shelter of a pure Vaisnava, without fear.

Therefore in the previous verse it has been distinctly said, devarser antike

sakuto-bhaya: Kayadhu, the mother of Prahlada Maharaja, stayed under the

protection of Narada Muni without fear from any direction. Similarly, Narada

Muni, in his transcendental position, stayed with the young woman without

fear of deviation. Narada Muni, Haridasa Thakura and similar acaryas

especially empowered to broadcast the glories of the Lord cannot be brought

down to the material platform. Therefore one is strictly forbidden to think

that the acarya is an ordinary human being (gurusu nara-matih).

 

In Thakura Bhaktivinoda's purport quoted in the original message, it is

clear that one cannot transgress the strict sannyasa rules unless one has

reached the bhava platform. So no one can imitate Prabhupada.

 

And the final word is that according to the 10th Canto, we should not do

what great personalities have done but follow their instructions and can

follow in the footsteps of those activities done by them which are confirmed

by their instructions. Those activities which are special and extraordinary

are not confirmed by their explicit instructions should never be imitated.

 

> Secondly what about initiation? Until a sanyasi speak to or know the

> candidate well how can he give initiation?

 

That has to be handled by the counsellor system like in the case of Srila

Prabhupada as well as Srila Sarasvati Thakura. The new matajis perform

spiritual practices under the guidance of a senior mataji who in turn can

report to a senior grhastha counsellor, who may recommend the concerned

mataji for initiation to the guru. If the sannyasi guru can't make a system

like this (which is quite easy to make even with a few disciples around),

it does not justify in any way his talking to his aspiring lady disciples.

It is his shortcoming that he cannot make such a system. He should go slow

on accepting lady disciples till he has such a system in place.

 

About mataji disciples' philosophical queries, I have suggested that guru

can answer them in the q & a session at the end of any public lecture or

forum or darshan. Or they can also be answered by email or thro letter. his

is concession but imho it can be made for preaching because it does'nt

involve directly seeing a matajis' face or hearing her voice. Or they can

also be asked thro a male devotee who can communicate the answer to the

mataji. Once sannyasis start talking to matajis then it develops such an

unhealthy atmosphere for everyone around because of the contamination of the

prakrta-sahajiya mentality. This is my personal opinion based on the quotes

posted earlier.

 

I will end with a very strong by TB in his commentary on Cc Antya 2.120:

 

Amrta-pravaha-bhasya (Thakura Bhaktivinoda): Only such a sadhaka in whose

heart bhava has arisen and thus real renunciation has taken birth, after

seriously and sincerely practicing sadhana-bhakti for a prolonged period of

time, is actually eligible for the renounced order of life. One who accepts

the saffron garments of a sannyasi before achieving such a platform is known

as a markata-vairagi. When such unqualified souls due to various reasons

accept the renounced order of life, they are pushed by the urges of their

senses and thus they go and talk with prakrti or women. Such people even

though in the renounced order of life, they are called dharma-dhvajis

(dangerous pretenders) and dharma-kalankas (black spots on pure religion)

and THEIR ASSOCIATION SHOULD BE COMPUSORILY AVOIDED.