Official Ramakanta vs. IRM discussion thread

[Guest guest]

Posted by Yaduraja on May 21, 2006:

 

Dear Ramakanta Prabhu,

PAMHO. AGTSP!

You wrote:

 

> In your last text you claimed that if it was not Krishna’s plan to have

> Srila Prabhupada become the sole diksa guru for ISKCON in 1966, then Srila

> Prabhupada would not have been a bona fide spiritual master.

>

> Can you please prove that.

 

Good heavens! This is such an obvious point!!

 

If Srila Prabhupada set himself up in a position contrary to Krishna’s plan

then he would not be acting consistently with the following description of a

devotee or spiritual master:

 

> “Every plan is made by the Supreme Personality of Godhead, but He is so

> kind and merciful to His devotees that He wants to give the credit to His

> devotees who carry out His plan according to His desire. Life should

> therefore move in such a way that everyone acts in Krishna consciousness

> and understands the Supreme Personality of Godhead through the medium of a

> spiritual master. The plans of the Supreme Personality of Godhead are

> understood by His mercy, and the plans of the devotees are as good as His

> plans. One should follow such plans and be victorious in the struggle for

> existence.”

Bg 11.34

 

How can a ‘spiritual master’ who does not know/follow Krishna’s plan help

anyone else to know or follow it? I am amazed you even have to ask!!!!

 

If he became the sole diksa guru for ISKCON against the Will of the Supreme

Lord then he would not have been guided by the Lord:

 

> “A Vaisnava knows his own business; whatever he does is precisely right

> because he is always guided by the Supreme Personality of Godhead.” SB

> 9.4.68 purport

 

And we can see Srila Prabhupada not only set himself up as the sole diksa

guru in 1966, he carried this on for year after year with no hint that it

was a problem, a temporary measure, an embaressment etc. In later years

there is no hint that this was a situation he never wanted. Quite the

opposite. The following instruction was directed to the GBC:

 

> I am in due receipt of your GBC report and have noted the contents

> carefully. (i) The GBC should all be the instructor gurus. I am in the

> initiator guru, and you should be the instructor guru by teaching what I

> am teaching and doing what I am doing. This is not a title, but you must

> actually come to this platform. This I want.

(Letter to GBC member 4.8.75)

 

This was broadcast all over the air ways:

 

> English.” Now, are you a guru?

> Prabhupäda: Yes, I am the spiritual master of this institution, and all

> the members of the society, they’re supposed to be my disciples. They

> follow the rules and regulations which I ask them to follow, and they are

> initiated by me spiritually.

Radio interview March 12, 1968

 

This to the media:

 

> "Just like in this institution, I am guru, and if everyone becomes guru,

> then who will carry out the order of guru? There must be disciple also,

> who will carry out the order of guru."

(Conversation with Press March 21.75)

 

Everyone in the institution was described by Srila Prabhupada as either his

disciple, manager, follower or student:

 

> There are so many students in this institution. We are not paying

> anything, but they will do everything for me.

7.12.74 lecture

 

Indeed he compared ISKCON with his own spiritual master’s institution in

which there was also only one diksa guru:

 

> “...so in the future we can form a central governing body for the whole

> institution. Therefore the management should be done very cautiously so

> that everyone is satisfied in their autonomous managing capacity. Of

> course, the central point is the order of the Spiritual Master, and I am

> very glad that you are trying to give importance to this aspect of

> management. The difficulty is sometimes things are interpreted in a manner

> dovetailing one's own sense gratification. I have got this personal

> experience in my Guru Maharaja's institution.”

(letter Tamal 69.10.18)

 

And then to cap it all Srila Prabhupada set up a system just prior to his

physical departure that allowed his continued sole diksa status to carry on

without any physical involvement from him (see the July 9th letter).

 

If you doubted it was Krishna’s plan that Srila Prabhupada become the sole

diksa guru for ISKCON in 1966 then clearly you would not accept he was

carrying out Krishna’s plan since that is what he arranged and set up.

 

If this was your position then we could end the debate here and you would

need to go off and find a guru who you have faith in.

 

If you accept Srila Prabhupada was carrying out Krishna’s plan in 1966 and

thereafter with regards initiation in ISKCON, then obviously Srila

Prabhupada wanted to do what he did to become what he became, since what he

became (the sole diksa guru) would have been part of Krishna’s plan.

 

Hope that is clearer for you now.

Ys

Yadu