narayana-para veda includes Manu-samhita

[Guest guest]

>

> The above

> statement of mine has to be considered in light of the context of the

> entire discussion which has been going on, which started out as a

> challenge of my use of the term "asuri varnasrama" to describe any

> practice of varnasrama principles in which aspiration for the pleasure of

> Lord Vishnu was not anything more than incidental. My statement above is

> simply pointing out that either the desire for one's own pleasure, local

> or extended, is the focus of one's life or the desire for Krishna's

> pleasure is the focus.

 

We have still seen no references from Srila Prabhupada's books

that would confirm how the presence/absence of devotion in one's

hearth is the criteria for evaluating the type of the social

system that one is situated in. Please try to qualify your position

on best way, instead of simply noticing how it has been challenged,

and repeating it in different tunes.

 

 

---------------------------

 

Your assumption defeats the very purpose of varnasrma system.

Those who got the desire for Krsna's pleasure as their driving

force or/and focus of life, are already trancendentally situated

to the execution of the social duties as per varna and asrama,

and they do not even need it. These are known as Vaisnavas.

Varnasrma system is specifically meant for those who are still in

the *bodily* conception of life, so to eneble them to gradually rise

up to the platform of spirituality. VAD is *external*. So long

you do it according to the rules and regulation as per God's

instructions, you are following a godly system. Not perhaps

some atheistic. (And that's what "asuri" in essence should be

referring to - atheism, or godlessness.)

 

 

In support what I am saying here, I have already presented the quote

from Srila Prabhupada's purport of Bhagavat-gita (2.31). There, he

speaks about varnasrama dharma as sva-dharma of those still in the

material conception of life. It really doesn't matter which type of

attribute you want to attach to it, "daivi" or "asuri" or "coca-cola".

So long we understand wether that is the varnasrama dharma that

Srila Prabhupada is promoting as the system to be established

in this world, or may be not, is what counts really.

 

In the same purport, it is remarkable to notice Srila Prabhupada's

conception of the relationship between an individual's state of

hearth/consciousness and the type of varnasrama system that one

is situated in. There is no external difference! It is still the

*same* performance of the *same* specific duties within the *same*

social system of varnasrama. The difference is *internal* -- one

performer has become spiritually situated, while the other one is

still in the material bodily concept. But no change of "asuri" or

"no asuri" varnasrama system occurs with the change of one's heart

desires or status.

 

 

Now, if anybody would expect from those in the material bodily

concept to have as the focus of their life the desire for God's

pleasure, and not their personal, I would say it is a blind shot

into darkness. You kick them all out from your varnasrama system

in one stroke. What system they would be performing? Perhaps that

one ("asuri") that ISCKON members would be turning their backs

to? It's actually ISCKON members who need it for themselves.

 

 

 

- mnd