self-sufficiency

[Guest guest]

> We have studied the system developed at Findhorn, called 'Living

>Machine', but it is pretty much a hype and not at all cost effective.

>I really appreciate Radha Krsna's spirit and ideas, but hope that he finds

>some practical ways to give us the benefit of his wisdom at Mayapur. ys

>Abhirama

 

My popint is that if we are to have 500 self-sufficient devotees at Mayapur

then my suggestion remains the most sustainable and practicle method that

Srila Prabhupada would approve of.It is in accordance with Manu Samhita.

 

The other householders that are living in high rise blocks I understand that

they will have more of a problem. However it still can be arranged as I have

described. If there is a will to live simply and give up chemical farming!

 

Why are we saving the bungees from opression? There is no opression in being

a bungee. It is part of one of the eternal varnas and is in accordance with

sastra. In fact if you look at my book you will see that we are saving them

from having to get into full septic tanks in a gumsha and empty them out by

hand all over the pathway! This we have done and documented 1996-7

Following the system of the Satvik Indore Toilet involves no smell, and no

flies at ANY stage. No pollution to pathways and no nitrate pollution to

ground water. According to British Environmentalists septic tanks eventually

cause pollution to ground water.

 

Therefore we are enlightening the bungee occupation. Meanwhile I am prepared

to do this myself as I see the handling of ones own waste in a responsible

manner, which also benefits others, as brahminical practice. And it is in

accordance with Manu Samhita.

 

You agreed that even Dwaraka must have used this simple dry system, it was a

question of proper design for access. It was also used at Radha Kund, so why

not for the preaching movement of Srila Prabhupada, at least on some sort of

scale for an example.

 

I even found approval from the rich class in Calcutta. They told me they

didn't care about whether bungees would do it or not, they said: "If you

want a good job done do it yourself!" I wonder where this idea came from.

 

>I don't think you will get very

>far with the devotees with this idea.

 

The first customer I had while there was the head teacher of the childrens

school and she was prepared to carry out the Satvik Indore method living on

the first floor in conjunction with her garden below. I must say that I find

the same everywhere I go and that is that teachers and head teachers are the

first interested parties in this concept of sustainbility.

 

However there is still another addition that can be adapted to existing muti

stoery buildings see footnote below.

 

The second customers whom I found approval with was the three classes at

the boys Gurukula at a presentation I gave to them, and they are using

toilets on ground level, not in multi unit developemts. Only they had just

spent, unfortunately, a large and avoidable amount of money on conventional

and smelly toilets. Ganaga prabhu informed me if I had come there earlier

they would have employed my system.

 

The head of ladies Gurukula also accepted my proposals but didn't have the

funds to invest in a few 'special buckets'

 

I had many inquiries from householders about how to live in this sustainable

fashion.

 

So I think with the right direction being pointed you will get at least some

devotees who would support the system and become ecstatic about producing

chemical free food that they can offer to Krsna and which will make them

healthy.

 

>I wish he had a suggestion that was practical

 

This is practical it is only a question of consciousness. Remember it is

sinful to put stool into water/ I cannot change what Manu Samhita says and

what is inferred in Bhagavad Gita.

See the article I wrote previously to all concerned from Bhagavad Gita. It

is called "Bhagavad Gita - Manu Samhita". It is philosophically sound and

states that any leader should represent the teachings of Manu Samhita.

(Srila Prabhupada's purport). And also Srila Prabhupada has said himself.:

 

 

"We don't need cinemas, clubs, bars, soaps and toilets..." why did he say

this? There should be some explanation. We feel we have found the

explanation. At least for some self-sufficient devotees that he wanted to be

living at Mayapur (500) see Siksamrta...

 

To survive into the future we have to go back to a sustainable lifestyle.

 

This principle should be at least addressed to some degree and not

forgotten.

 

Like in Vrndavan you can come up with any system costing any amount but

still real ecology means to live simply and follow the sastra. There should

be room for both approaches and then people can choose for themselves by

understanding the examples and seeing the results..on the one hand instant

organic fertility and the employment of animals and on the other the high

cost electrical energy and machinery involved.

 

>but hope that he finds some practical ways to give us the benefit of his

>wisdom at Mayapur.

>ys Abhirama

 

Are we not realizing that things may not be working out the way we might

have hoped??? What is practical...I think any devotee would agree that

simple living high thinking is practical. It is the philosophy Srila

Prabhupada has given us. He made so many statements like the western

civilization is already finished...There will be no more grains, no more,

rice, no more so many things...Therefore we must have vision we have to live

with his words in mind, not just leave them in a shut book......Thus I see

the urgency to do these simple systems for long term survival. How do we

want Mayapur to develop? This should be a topic for everyones debate.

My book is all about sustainable fuel and sanitation, good food and water

and no disease or drugs for both man and animal. Have you read it? Two

copies were ordered for your office by Samba prabhu.

 

This all may seem simplistic, but I see, as Sir Albert Howard C.I.E. did,

that good basic agricultural practice is the solution to so many problems,

including employment (and that of the animals).

A western city does not account and is not built for the welfare of the Cows

and bulls, it simply provides restaurants to eat them. They have no place in

them for animal transport or is the understanding brought home that they are

the cause of fertility and one of our Mothers. We have to engage them, treat

them properly and see their value both materially and spiritually or

otherwise they will be taken for granted and exploited for milk only.

 

It would be intelligent to have comparative systems of waste disposal, so if

one fails another can be taken up. How do you propose to deal with other

organic waste disposal? without landfil.

 

Maybe there could be different areas to the city where there are different

systems of management; different infrastructure systems, employing animals

and men on the one hand and electricity and machines on the other. We have

heard many discussions about householders keeping cows an a personal level

rather that being kept away at a Goshala (Hare Krsna Dasi). Many devotees

have said to me that they see the big attraction to Mayapur would be the

simple living in beautiful indigenous houses with adjoining gardens full of

flowers and vegetables grown by themselves. This is simple living. This is

the mode of goodness. They have said they think the westerners would be more

attracted by this mode of preaching and demonstration of simple living, that

you cannot find in L A for example, than anything else. And when you have

won their hearts and they are satisfied that this way of life is the real

way forward for survival into the future, as surely it was in the past, then

another preaching can begin.

 

There are many, and increasing, groups that are trying to live in a low tech

sustainable way. After all when it comes to it we won't be able to go to the

factory and order so many complicated items to run a complicated

system...What did Srila Prabhupada say: Best man is one who does everything

for himself! (or words to that effect).

 

 

 

 

 

footnote.

an enclosed shaft is attached to the outside of the buildings alighned with

the stool rooms. An opening door is thus fitted in the stool room and a full

filtered bucket is placed on one of the hooks of a geared manual lift. A

clean bucket then replaces the full one. The liquid is filtered through a

quatre inch plastic pipe from the toilet and this can then go out through

the wall and down to ground level to be collected in sealed five gallon

containers. (see British Environment Agency progress of approval of this

system of human waste disposal for use in British agriculture)

 

This last week four devotees attended at the Centre for Alternative

Technology in Wales where we were well received with our presentation of the

Satvik Indore Toilet; one of which we left with Peter Harper (head of

Biology) also one copy of our book explaining the development of this system

tried and tested in Sri Dham Mayapur. He said out of all the toilets he had

there he had not seen one quite like this and that they had just printed a

book on the subject and he would liked to have included our model.