Guest guest Posted May 28, 2006 Report Share Posted May 28, 2006 SRIMATHE RAMANUJAYA NAMAHA APPAN THIRUVADIGALE SARANAM. Dear Pattangi Swamin, Accept Adiyen’s pranam. Would you help in clearing some doubts? 1. The temple activities are covered by Agamas.(Vaikanas and Pancha rathra) 2. The priest hood is occupied by brahmins only in both the systems. In vaikanasa Agama temples only descendents of vaikanasa sect only can occupy this position. In respect of Panchatathra temples, other brahmins can be initiated to this post. 3. Agamas are given veda samya. So, does the all temple activities become automatically vedic rituals? Or only the post of priest hood alone should be reserved to brahmins? The replies may kindly be supported by proper vedic authority. 4. THIRUVAIMOZHI is the exposition of LORD HIMSLF through Nammazhvar who is not a brahmin and he is regarded as ‘KULAPTHI’ in Srivaishnavam and finds a place in Guruparampara. Subsequent Acharyas only are brahmins .How and Why? 5. AND THIRUVAIMAOZHI is accorded the status of UBHAYA VEDHANTHAM. Can Arulicheyal recitals (GHOSTI) be treated as Vedic RITUAL ? 6. Thirukachhi Nambhi was doing ALAVATTKAINKARYAM AND PUSHPA KAINKARYAM. Is there any yard stick to distinguish between vedic and others in temple service? 7. Vedic rituals (Nithya and Naimithika) attached to household activities are based on Varnasrma dharma. .But,temple activities based on Agamas are different. Any body can do Kainkarym. If this contested, 8. What is the value of the Pasuram PARIVTHIL EESANAI PDI VIRIVATHU MEVALURUVER….and similar Pasurams? 9. Can any body do Thiruvaradham at home? Those who are not brahmins should exclude vedic verses? 10. In the present day context, the adherence to varnasrama dharma by birth, how far is this practicable and will be effective? 11. Can Srivaishnavam survive and prosper under this climate? Though this letter is addressed to you, all learned and interested persons can enlighten the issues. THIS IS FOR THE WELFARE OF SRIVAISHNAVAM Yours Adiyen Ramanuja dasan, T.Parthasarathy On Sun, 28 May 2006 ramanuja wrote : > >There are 2 messages in this issue. > >Topics in this digest: > > 1. Srinivaasa Vaibhavam - NammAzhwAr's divine anubhavams- Thiruviruttha > "Madhavakkannan V" srivaishnavan > 2. Re: Caste System - "Walking the walk" or Just "Talking the talk" > "pritesh patel" tesh_tel (AT) (DOT) co.uk > >______________________ >______________________ > >Message 1 > "Madhavakkannan V" srivaishnavan > Sat May 27, 2006 9:00pm(PDT) >Srinivaasa Vaibhavam - NammAzhwAr's divine anubhavams- Thiruviruttha > >SrI: >SrImathE Gopaladesika mahadesikaya namah: >Dearest all > >After Nammazhwar anubhavams of Thiruvaymozhi [on >Thiruvenkatamudaiyaan], let us take up his other works >namely Tiruviruttham. > >Today’s verse on ThiruvEnkatam from this wonderful >work is the 10th verse of Tiruviruttham >Let us continue to enjoy > >maayOn vadathiru vEngada > naada,val likkodikaaL! >nOyO vuraikkilum kEtkinRi > liirurai yiir numadhu >vaayO adhuvanRi valvinai > yEnum kiLiyumeLgum >aayO adumthoNdai yO,aRai > yOvi thaRivaridhE. 10 > >Essence: the male after having spent some time with >our lady, had left and has now desired to be with her >again; he makes an appeal through her friend and lets >her [the friend] know of his intention and his mind >[that is called “mathi udan padhutthudhal]; > >Oh flower -creeper like most beautiful girls! You both >have adopted the place of ThiruvEnkatam as the >residence; the place where the Lord of most auspicious >kalyANa guNAs and the Mysterious, Most wonderful Lord >is! Don’t you all know of my love? Even if you don’t >know by yourself, at elast can you not understand when >I tell you of my love? Can you not hear my words? Your >mouth beauty tortures me… Not only that; my parrot and >myself melt hearing the word “aayO” the red bimbhA >fruit like lips are killing me; oh creeper like girls! >The word “aayO:, the red bimbhA fruit like lips- which >one kills me- I am not able to comprehend. After >hearing my plea at least, please tell me and >elucidate. > >Inner meaning: > >This verse may also be interpreted as the talk of >SrIvaishnava bhaagawathaas about the way they get >immersed themselves in the kalyANa guNAs of AzhwAr’s >and their bhakti for him. These Srivaishnava >bhaagawathas lose themselves in the ThirumEni >sonwdharyam of AzhwAr as well as His beauty of his >mouth [meaing: the words that come out of these lips- >jOthi vaay thiRandhu pEsum Thiruvaaymozhi… ] Aayo- >Thirumaymozhi words. So these bhaagwathas are not >aware as to which one melts them most. Bhaagathaas are >asking the same.. AzhwAr! The One who enslaves himself >as the only hold of ThiruvEnkatam! You are so divinely >beautiful. Due to the enormous bhakti for the Lord, >you do not hear our pleas and queries. Your bhakti >laden verses; your dhivya mangaLa divinely beautiful >ThirumEni [body] have melted me and my parrot as well. >Which one is more grand- please tell us.. your >ThirumEni or your words from that beautiful jOthi vaay >[mouth] ? > >AzhwAr ThiruvaDigaLE SaraNam >Regards >Namo narayana >dAsan > > > > > > > > > > >______________________ >______________________ > >Message 2 > "pritesh patel" tesh_tel (AT) (DOT) co.uk > Sat May 27, 2006 9:01pm(PDT) >Re: Caste System - "Walking the walk" or Just "Talking the talk" > >Jai Sri Krishna > > I would like to thank Bhaktha Pattangi for clearing our doubts in regard to Srivaishnavam and Varna. I think we can conclude that within that Sri Ramanuja upheld the Vedic rules of Varna ashrama, but made cleat the position all devotees have within the system of Bhagavath Bhakthi, and in doing so gave a lot of encouragement and selfesteem to non-brahmin people. > > However in reply to the point raised by Bhaktha Pattangi regarding non-brahmins becoming acharayas, i just wanted to know what position Sri Rama Ramanuja acarya holds in the sampradaya. Sri Rama Ramanuja acarya, established the Australian branch of the Sri Yatiraja Jeeyar Matham. Sri Rama Ramanuja acarya clearly holds an esteemed position in the matham, but is often White Western origin and i am curious as waht is his position (is he a acharaya etc..) and how that fits in with the rules of Varnashrama. > > Thank you. >Pattangi <danp (AT) uic (DOT) edu> wrote: > Sri: >Adiyen's pranam to all Devotees: > >Multiple questions from other devotees addressed in this mail. > >Q1: How come no madadhipathis and Acharya Pururhsas are non-brahmins? >Q2: How come there are no great scholars, writers and upanyasakas among non-brahmins? >Q3: Why are non-brahmins not in services in temple? > >Are all the talk about all caste are treated equal in Srivaishanvam just "talk". > > >=====In this mail ======================================== >=> Madadhipathis still need Upaveetham and have Vaidhika duties >=> There are many scholars, writers and upanyasakas who are non-brahmins, > women and from other religion with a Brahmin following. >=> A personal question for all to think (please read carefully and answer) >====================================================== > > >=> Madadhipathis still need Upaveetham and have Vaidhika duties >=========================================== >Sri Thirukoviloor Jeeyar Swami, has many thousands of sishyas >most of them are for lack of a better word, backward castes and very poor. > >Many of them do not have ample and good housing, clothes or food, but know the 4000, >Mummukshuppadi (rahsya grantham), SriVachanaBhooshanam etc by heart >and have learnt the meanings over and over again. > >He says, >==="Our sishyas even though they know the arulicheyal material better that many Brahmins, >they never try to boast their knowledge and seem to cry in the anubhavams. >These tears of anubhavams are all the joy a devotee needs. > >None of them ever came to me asking, "let me be the next Jeeyar or the Archaka". >This is because they are in the anubhavam and they are in the sampradaya. >They know the material and they know that only one with upaveetham can do all >Veidhika duties attached to the duties of the Madadhipathi. " ==== > >PS: Though usually Jeeyars (yathis) cannot do AgniKariyam, they still have other duties, >and the agni kariyam done before any samashreyanam is done under the supervision of the Jeeyar. > >=> Non-Brahmin scholars in todays world: >================================ >There are many non-brahmin scholars and upanyasakas >and they are accepted by "brahmin" srivaishnavas as well. > >D.A Joeseph Bhagawathar: >===================== >He is extremely popular and has received the title "Vaishanva Sudaraazhi" >and is writing an article series in the current Geethacharyan >(a magazine by Dr. MA Venkartakrishana - Brahmin run magazine) >he has many books, upanyasams and following. > >Sri Purushottama Naidu Swamin: The most popular tamil translation of Eedu, (the Vykhyanam for 4000) that > many Brahmins carry is of Sri Purushottama Naidu. Many brahmins refer to him and owe allegance to > his work. > >Sri Pandithia Krisha Veni Ammiar (a woman): Very famous for Mumukshuppadi Vyakhyanam and books. >Sri SubbuReddiar Swamin, Nathalla Sampath Chettiar and many many others. >I can give you many examples of current day scholars, upanyasakas and writers who are non-brahmins >and others who came from other faith and still carry their original faith name, sri Ali Swamin, Joeseph Swamin etc. > >There are Brahmins who sit in their upanyasa goshti and enjoy the divine nectar. > > >In Sri Vaishnavam all are equal. >In Veidhikam, all are still equal in the eyes of the LORD and in their capacity to love him >and to attain moksha, but only certain people can perform certain tasks. Those are the >rules in Veidhikam. > >Allow me to elaborate: > >=> A personal question for all to think and Answer. >====================================================== >Knowing well that tri-kala sandhya is the basic requirement to even qualify to >perform Veidhika Karyams like homam, yagyams etc. > >** Would a non-brahmin devotee with faith call for a non-brahmin preist to >perform any Veidhika agni-karyam in his home for his home function. > >** Would a brahmin devotee with faith call for a non-brahmin preist to >perform any Veidhika agni-karyam in his home for his home function. > >If the answer to both is "NO", then think why would anyone say YES do this to the Temple (esp. Dhivya Desams) >====================================================================== > >True devotees know and respect these rules. If service to Lord in the temple is the intention, >there are many ways to serve. There are many devotee non-brahmins engaged in temple service >and they never come forward seeking the any Vaidhika service that specifically needs brahmins. > >I do agree that there are many brahmin priests who are not following the rules, >and that needs to be addressed and specified rules need to be implemented. > > > Azhvar Emberumanar Jeeyar ThiruvadigalE sharanam > >adiyEn rAmAnuja dAsan >Mukundan Vangkipuram Pattangi > >http://www.radioramanuja.com http://www.vedics.net > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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