environment

[Guest guest]

it seems to me that cow protection is earth protection in that the earth takes

the form of the cow.

 

are we making the effort to contact the environmental groups that have a lot

more resources to explain how the happiness of the cow and bull is reflected

upon human society?

 

if we are, who is making the presentation? what is the content, format, and

tone of the presentation? whom are we approaching?

 

if we are not, i suggest that we start. when we have such a brilliant solution

to humanity's perpetual suffering, it's nice to share.

 

rpd

[Guest guest]

"WWW: Ram Prasad (Dasa) (?)" wrote:

 

> [Text 2941359 from COM]

>

> it seems to me that cow protection is earth protection in that the earth

takes

> the form of the cow.

>

> are we making the effort to contact the environmental groups that have a lot

> more resources to explain how the happiness of the cow and bull is reflected

> upon human society?

>

> if we are, who is making the presentation? what is the content, format, and

> tone of the presentation? whom are we approaching?

>

> if we are not, i suggest that we start. when we have such a brilliant

solution

> to humanity's perpetual suffering, it's nice to share.

>

> rpd

 

Hare Krsna dasi comments:

 

Certainly this is a nice sentiment. Possibly the ones to make the presentation

might be the Ministry of Cow Protection and Agriculture.

 

The problem as I see it is this: I don't believe -- please correct me if I am

wrong -- that the Ministry of Cow Protection and Agriculture is in a position

to

be confident that ISKCON plans to give official backing to the practice of cow

protection beyond mere lip service.

 

In March 1999, the GBC very nicely passed ISKCON Law 507 which provides for

minimum standards worldwide for cow protection on ISKCON's farms. Those

standards

were formulated by a year of hard work by ISKCON cowherds around the world,

facilitated by Mother Chaya and Balabhadra Prabhu of the Ministry of Cow

Protection and Agriculture.

 

Those standards, if conscientiously applied around the world, would insure that

ISKCON is carrying out the practice of cow protection in a way which would be

in

harmony with Srila Prabhupada's teachings to us.

 

Most unfortunately, however -- and again, please correct me if I am mistaken

about

this -- the GBC has done almost zero in the way of seeing that ISKCON Law 507

is

actually being carried out. I say "almost zero." The fact is that in a few

instances, GBC members have taken some action to help bring certain farms

towards

compliance with the standards.

 

A cornerstone of the minimum standards for cow protection is that the GBC must

fulfill its duty of making sure ISKCON's standards are fulfilled in all temples

around the world. Srila Prabhupada stated that the GBC should travel from

temple

to temple and if there is some discrepency, they must make suggestions and see

that things are brought up to standard.

 

In particular, the GBC are specifically required by the standards to make a

quarterly visit to each farm, inspect the cow and ox facilities, have a private

one-hour meeting with the cowherds, and file a report. For 3 meetings of the

year, the GBC is given the option of appointing an outside monitor to fulfill

this

duty -- but at the very minimum, the GBC must personally visit each farm,

inspect

the cow and ox facilities (including the records), and have a private one-hour

meeting with the cowherds.

 

As far as I know -- correct me if I am wrong -- not one single GBC member has

had

one single private one hour meeting with the cowherds, etc. In other to comply

with the law, they all must do so by April 1st, which will mark the beginning

of

the second year that the law is in effect.

 

As it happens, on many farms there are various discrepencies, but if the

cowherd

cannot gain the personal, private audience of the GBC, then there is little

chance

to correct different discrepencies.

 

Therefore, our programs are generally less than ideal, and in some cases there

have been substantial indications that cows have been abused or even

slaughtered.

 

Under such conditions, who will want to call the public's attention to our

programs? There may be certain individual programs that look pretty good at

the

moment, but without that personal visit by the GBC, actually not one single one

of

them is even up to the standard required by ISKCON law.

 

It's a very embarassing situation, and one which makes it look that all our

talk

about the importance of cow protection is pretty much hypocrisy. Please do not

misunderstand. Without a doubt there may be dozens of sincere and hardworking

cowherds and ox teamsters around the world, working as hard as they can to

protect

Krsna's cows. But, they are pretty much doing it on their own volition and out

of

their own *personal* dedication to Srila Prabhupada. They are not effectively

given institutional support by the GBC - as evidenced by the apparent

phenomenon

that the GBC does not bother to fulfill its portion of ISKCON's duties to

protect

the cows.

 

Under such circumstances, it is very, very awkward to invite the public to look

at

our cow protection, when it seems pretty clear that ISKCON -- as an institution

--

is not prepared to do much to back up the practice of cow protection. Even the

Ministry of Cow Protection and Agriculture itself is completely unfunded in

ISKCON. It does not recieve one single dollar from the GBC. So, it's pretty

clear that cow protection is one of the GBC's very lowest priorities. I am

sorry

to be cynical, but realistically speaking, I would not be too surprised if the

GBC

simply phases out the Ministry of Cow Protection and Agriculture. Hopefully

this

will not happen, but I certainly would not be very surprised.

 

So, how can we preach the glories of cow protection to the outside world, if

even

we as an institution are not willing to make a substantial commitment to it?

 

Just imagine if you wanted to preach how important it is to worship the Lord in

His Deity form. You are telling everyone that by a nice program of Deity

worship,

you can actually purify your material senses and feel yourself making spiritual

advancement. Maybe you have even preached like this to a friend. Then you

take

them to your temple, and they can see the practical example of what you a

preaching. Even if your temple is not very opulent, they see that the pujari

is

punctual and clean and that the altar is clean with fresh flowers for the

Deity.

They see that Radha and Krsna are very beautifully dressed. They smell the

nice

incense being offered to the Deities. And they can feel the palpable effects.

What you say is in fact true. They can feel that they are making spiritual

advancement.

 

But, now think of it another way. What if your temple was very neglected and

the

devotees there did not maintain the Deity worship program very nicely at all.

What if the pujari was likely to show up late or intoxicated. What if the

Deities

were wearing the same dusty clothes They had been dressed in 3 months ago.

What

if there were dried up, withering flowers in Their vases?

 

Then would you want to bring your friend to the temple to show him the

spiritual

benefits of Deity worship?

 

Unfortunately, without tangible, practical support from the GBC, this is the

situation that much of ISKCON is in with regards to cow protection. So in

general, we don't want to invite the public in to look at what we are doing,

because the GBC is not practically in support of it.

 

********************

 

So, I have made some fairly strong statements here, based on my perception and

my

observation, but also I want to say that I am not an official in this regard.

Therefore, some of the things I say may not be totally acurate. That's why I

hope

that I will be corrected in the instances in which I am mistaken.

 

On the other hand, by virtue of the fact that I do not hold any official

position

in ISKCON, it is a little easier for me to give a very frank and

straightforward

presentation of the situation to the best of my understanding. Once I have

started the conversation, it may be much easier for others to address some of

these issues.

 

*********************

 

So, I hope I have not dissappointed you. Basically, your idea is a very good

one. But, unfortunately, until the brahmanas who are leading ISKCON make cow

protection and the following of ISKCON law a priority -- I'm afraid that at the

moment it would not be a very productive idea for us to preach to loudly about

the

benefits of cow protection. It will merely be brushed off as hypocrisy.

 

your servant,

 

Hare Krsna dasi

[Guest guest]

>[Text 2941359 from COM]

>

>it seems to me that cow protection is earth protection in that the earth

>takes

>the form of the cow.

>

>are we making the effort to contact the environmental groups that have a

>lot

>more resources to explain how the happiness of the cow and bull is

>reflected

>upon human society?

>

>if we are, who is making the presentation?

 

I don't know if its been thought of yet, but the booklet, Dung is Gold Mine

is EXCELLENT to "explain how the happiness of the cow and bull is reflected

upon human society" Chockers full of statistics how cow slaughter has led to

intense human suffering, and degradation of the environment, and society.

Practically all ills can be traced back to it. Its a brilliant expose, we

should broadly propagate.

- niscala

 

____

Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

[Guest guest]

Dung is Gold Mine is currently under construction for posting on the ISCOWP

web site at www.iscowp.com

 

Hopefully eraly next week.

 

ys

Gary

 

On 18 Jan 2000, Noelene Hawkins wrote:

> I don't know if its been thought of yet, but the booklet, Dung is Gold Mine

> is EXCELLENT to "explain how the happiness of the cow and bull is reflected

> upon human society" Chockers full of statistics how cow slaughter has led to

 

> intense human suffering, and degradation of the environment, and society.

[Guest guest]

"WWW: Ram Prasad (Dasa) (?)" wrote:

 

> [Text 2941359 from COM]

>

> it seems to me that cow protection is earth protection in that the earth

takes

> the form of the cow.

>

> are we making the effort to contact the environmental groups that have a lot

> more resources to explain how the happiness of the cow and bull is reflected

> upon human society?

>

> if we are, who is making the presentation? what is the content, format, and

> tone of the presentation? whom are we approaching?

>

> if we are not, i suggest that we start. when we have such a brilliant

solution

> to humanity's perpetual suffering, it's nice to share.

>

> rpd

 

I share your conclusion. How to do so is the challenge. The problem is we

aren't

living up to our standards, and have failed so miserably in the execution in

so

many projects.

[Guest guest]

Dear Hare Krishna Dasi:

 

You amaze me. So brilliant yet you can't see your own light. In the complete

darkness of cow slaughter, you are a very bright woman.

 

"Krishna can not be satisfied where cow protection is lacking."--Srila

Prabhupada.

 

We are all captivated by flickering lights exactly as a doe is frightened by

the headlights of an oncoming car. In our bewilderment, the machinations of

Kali-yuga are gearing up for our slaughter.

 

The fate of the cow and our fate are one. If some leaders think not, then they

are not the cowherd boys whom I trust to take me home out of this horrible

slaughterhouse.

 

Your articles have inspired me. Now I'm an inspired city boy. I understand the

principle of cow protection--of mercy, and I want some.

 

I also understand exploitation--as I have eaten the earthen cow before it was

transformed into food. If we as a society continue to exploit the daughters

and not care for the mothers, then will we not be karmically bound? GBC man:

"We distributed 4 billion books." Krishna: "Did you protect any cows?" GBC

man: "No." Krishna: "Not one?" GBC man: "Well, not in my zone." Krishna: "I

guess they didn't read Srila Prabhupada's books." GBC man: "We told 'em not to

worry about the cow, that the only instructions that they had to follow were

1. the GBC is the ultimate managing authority and 2. distribute books, give

the money to the BBT, and don't ask what happens to it and 3. there's no need

to improve on anything that Shrila Prabhupada set up.

 

Uh oh, I'm being negative. Of course, the greatest negative is death, and

that's what the cows are facing, and that's what we're facing. Here's my

challenge: "I will not eat dairy products from any cows that aren't

protected."

 

Several years ago, His Holiness B.H. Mangal Maharaja (before ISKCON disinvited

him to their temples), a lifelong brahmacari (he was 57 at the time), told me

that grains and cheese carry consciousness. I just recalled this fact years

after he made the statement because we don't eat karmi grains--so why should

we eat karmi cheese? Certainly we don't want that karma.

 

Thank you very much for your noble work in protecting the cow, and I assure

you, it is not for naught. In the right light, cow protection will look good,

and that's what we're selling, cow protection itself, as the cure for karma.

 

Let's put cow protection in the right light--as you have been doing. Your

articles are excellent, and I'd like to compile some of the information that

you have with some of the information that other devotees have to make a

first-class presentation.

 

rpd

[Guest guest]

>

>

> Uh oh, I'm being negative. Of course, the greatest negative is death, and

> that's what the cows are facing, and that's what we're facing. Here's my

> challenge: "I will not eat dairy products from any cows that aren't

> protected."

 

When you get hungery, come visit NV. There is not enough for eveyone, so I

do

buy karmi milk, but the yoghurt I eat every day comes from a protected cow. I

could introduce you to her. The temple's milk is all from protected cows

(maybe

not during festivals). So you could at least get a taste.

[Guest guest]

"WWW: Ram Prasad (Dasa) (?)" wrote:

 

> Dear Hare Krishna Dasi:

>

> You amaze me. So brilliant yet you can't see your own light. In the complete

> darkness of cow slaughter, you are a very bright woman.

 

Thank you for your very kind comments. If they were honest, Balabhadra and

Chaya

could explain to you that I'm just a bag of wind. Just a wannabe. But, I have

never forgotten those few years of taking care of the cows at Gita-nagari. It

definitely made me a better person. It softened my heart to make me a better

devotee. And, I'm positive that if we could somehow or other build

self-sufficient communities with excellent training for city boys such as

yourself, and also city girls, and with many small-scale, protected farms,

people

would become Krsna conscious very quickly and would very quickly become very

happy

and peaceful.

 

I have a brain. I now admit that, and I thank Krsna for that. It helps me to

train our son Asto. Wait til you see him in a couple years. He's seventeen

now.

An up-coming ksatriya. So I have to learn all about economics and politics.

 

BUT-- what if we already had the varnasrama society I'm fighting for. What

could

a woman with a brain do then? I know what I would do. I would have the most

fun

in the world. I'd do what I used to do at Gita-nagari. I'd work with other

women

to help organize great festivals for the Deities, to help plan and devise

beautiful outfits for them. I'd devise gardening and canning plans. And just

for

transcendental pleasure I would take care of Krsna's cows. That would be

great.

I wish we could all live like that.

 

> "Krishna can not be satisfied where cow protection is lacking."--Srila

> Prabhupada.

>

> We are all captivated by flickering lights exactly as a doe is frightened by

> the headlights of an oncoming car. In our bewilderment, the machinations of

> Kali-yuga are gearing up for our slaughter.

>

> The fate of the cow and our fate are one. If some leaders think not, then

they

> are not the cowherd boys whom I trust to take me home out of this horrible

> slaughterhouse.

>

> Your articles have inspired me. Now I'm an inspired city boy. I understand

the

> principle of cow protection--of mercy, and I want some.

 

As a mother, I pray that you get it. If you get a chance to care for Krsna's

cows, you will become incredibly happy.

 

 

>

> I also understand exploitation--as I have eaten the earthen cow before it was

> transformed into food. If we as a society continue to exploit the daughters

> and not care for the mothers, then will we not be karmically bound? GBC man:

> "We distributed 4 billion books." Krishna: "Did you protect any cows?" GBC

> man: "No." Krishna: "Not one?" GBC man: "Well, not in my zone." Krishna: "I

> guess they didn't read Srila Prabhupada's books." GBC man: "We told 'em not

to

> worry about the cow, that the only instructions that they had to follow were

> 1. the GBC is the ultimate managing authority and 2. distribute books, give

> the money to the BBT, and don't ask what happens to it and 3. there's no need

> to improve on anything that Shrila Prabhupada set up.

>

> Uh oh, I'm being negative. Of course, the greatest negative is death, and

> that's what the cows are facing, and that's what we're facing. Here's my

> challenge: "I will not eat dairy products from any cows that aren't

> protected."

>

> Several years ago, His Holiness B.H. Mangal Maharaja (before ISKCON

disinvited

> him to their temples), a lifelong brahmacari (he was 57 at the time), told me

> that grains and cheese carry consciousness. I just recalled this fact years

> after he made the statement because we don't eat karmi grains--so why should

> we eat karmi cheese? Certainly we don't want that karma.

>

> Thank you very much for your noble work in protecting the cow, and I assure

> you, it is not for naught. In the right light, cow protection will look good,

> and that's what we're selling, cow protection itself, as the cure for karma.

>

> Let's put cow protection in the right light--as you have been doing. Your

> articles are excellent, and I'd like to compile some of the information that

> you have with some of the information that other devotees have to make a

> first-class presentation.

>

> rpd

 

Again, thanks for your appreciation. Appreciation from other devotees is such

an

important thing for all of us. It's really one of the most important thing

that

keeps us plowing on with our devotional service. When a devotee encourages us

in

our service, that devotee becomes special because Krsna has agreed to speak

through him.

 

So, you thank me, and I thank you. We have to all keep pushing on in this

struggle. It will be all for the best for everyone, even our oft-maligned GBC

officers. As I keep reminding myself. They are after all devotees, too. And

they

need Krsna's mercy too. I just wish they knew that they would find it when

they

meet with Krsna's cowherds.

 

your servant,

 

Hare Krsna dasi

[Guest guest]

Thanks for the invitation, Prabhu. Maybe when I get a bit more upwardly

mobile, I'll journey there. I guess it would be fanatical to hope for a

bullock cart ride.

 

rpd

[Guest guest]

Or better yet come to New Talavan where there is so much milk only people

who don't understand the purpose of life drink karmic milk.

 

YS

Dvibhuja das

 

COM: Madhava Gosh (das) ACBSP (New Vrindavan - USA)

<Madhava.Gosh.ACBSP (AT) bbt (DOT) se>

ramprasad (AT) com (DOT) org <ramprasad (AT) com (DOT) org>; COM: Cow (Protection and related

issues) <Cow (AT) bbt (DOT) se>

Thursday, January 20, 2000 4:00 PM

Re: environment

 

 

>[Text 2947056 from COM]

>

>>

>>

>> Uh oh, I'm being negative. Of course, the greatest negative is death, and

>> that's what the cows are facing, and that's what we're facing. Here's my

>> challenge: "I will not eat dairy products from any cows that aren't

>> protected."

>

>When you get hungery, come visit NV. There is not enough for eveyone, so

I

>do

>buy karmi milk, but the yoghurt I eat every day comes from a protected

cow. I

>could introduce you to her. The temple's milk is all from protected cows

>(maybe

>not during festivals). So you could at least get a taste.

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

"WWW: Ram Prasad (Dasa) (?)" wrote:

 

> [Text 2947335 from COM]

>

> Thanks for the invitation, Prabhu. Maybe when I get a bit more upwardly

> mobile, I'll journey there. I guess it would be fanatical to hope for a

> bullock cart ride.

>

> rpd

 

I bicycled from Grand Forks North Dakota to Daytona Beach Florida. It only

took 30 days. Where are you located?