Guest guest Posted January 1, 2004 Report Share Posted January 1, 2004 As a cowherd monitor and servant of our herd at New Varshan in Auckland New Zealand I'm sorry prabhu but your methods are not practical in every situation. Most of the Iskcon farms have limited grazing and devotee service but not only that, our fences need maintaining, water troughs etc etc. We have a very strict breeding programme. As many devotees are FINALLY realizing, keeping a herd is a huge responsibility as much if not more so than having a child yourself. Therefore the value of "protected" milk is very great. New Zealand is at the heart of the milking industry. Famous for its butter and ghee. A beautiful sight, driving through the Waikato seeing large herds of Jerseys grazing our lush green pastures, until you go on a morning when the 3 day old Bobby calves are in the boxes out the front gate awaiting collection for the slaughter house for their veal. But as an Iskcon farm, I cant accept these sweet calves. I am approached by members of the Indian community all the time, wanting to donate a calf. sometimes already pre purchased. I have to turn them away. Not only do Radha Giridhari receive no side benefit of the milk but it just puts extra strain on us that have to care for that calf albeit very sweet and pretty, still needs care and maintainence for the next 15 years. I feel very fortunate to have been serving here for 20 years at New Varshan and have seen this service change hands many times. It always falls back on me. Im always the one that has to get the hay in every year, always the one phoned if a cow gets stuck in a creek or the cows get out. Now a days as our herd gets older, I'm serving our geriatrics. Making sure, they are safe etc. Dealing with SPCA representitives etc. I know for sure, there are many devotees quietly doing the same service around the world. All glories to you all. But we are not some open house dumping ground for others whimsical sentimental rash descisions. If someone wants to protect a cow, thats exactly what it means - for her whole life. They cant just expect to be able to dump her onto an Iskcon farm and carry on with their life. That is not proper cow protection. Strict rules must be in place. Sorry for the ramble but it is an on going issue that every one needs to be clear on. We may come and go but the cows are on the farm and proper standards must be set world wide in Iskcon. So to the devotee who left his cow at New Vrndarvan, the sooner you start making a regular donation for her up keep, the better. Jai your servant Ananta Krsna Dasi. Ann Fletcher ann (AT) aucklandinsulation (DOT) co.nz - "Rosalie Malik" <labangalatika (AT) vsnl (DOT) net> "Mark Middle Mountain" <gourdmad (AT) ovnet (DOT) com>; "Noma Petroff" <npetroff (AT) bowdoin (DOT) edu> Cc: <Ekabuddh (AT) aol (DOT) com>; <Dasgopal (AT) aol (DOT) com>; <d_4h (AT) hotmail (DOT) com>; <doctorox (AT) pa (DOT) net>; "Cow (Protection and related issues)" <Cow (AT) pamho (DOT) net> Thursday, January 01, 2004 5:31 AM Re: Giving up on Commercial Milk saves cows? > Haribol Hrimati well said > He saved Ekadasi from the butcher so he deserves only praise not harsh > words. The temple shouldnt gripe about taking care of unproductive cows. > They should be glad to serve them. They are getting so much benefit from > the cows, more than they can ever give and even the overworked cowherd > should be happy the poor cow is alive and safe. > It seems the prabhu had to leave NV community and anything can happen in > life unexpectedly. but taking up the responsibility of keeping a cow is > better than never taking it up . > > We accepted a cow a year ago because her owner couldnt take care of her > and as soon as she walked in the gate she sat down and gave birth to a > beautiful black calf, Kalindi... after a 5 km walk on the road. We are > controlling our breeding, but we are a Trust for cow protection so we have > an obligation to accept cows in difficulty. Another one is Bandi who > was beaten and left to die in the jungle with a broken leg by a drunken > farmer and she delivered her calf 2 months later and is an extremely > happy cow tho lame. And Parvati whose mother died of neglect ( septic > wound) at another farm and we fed on a baby bottel for 9 months. In > the past I had given away a couple of cows on demand but i have brought > them back as they didnt like their other homes. So call it sentiment > but compassion is also a sentiment that Vaisnavas can develop. The > money part is not much of a problem and cow protection is a challenge, > Just because my husband and I are old doesnt mean we should ignore the > challenge of saving these cows. Actually they are saving us. Because > you cant see everything in the future doesnt mean you just stop and do > nothing. At least every devotee can Adopt a cow. > your servant labangalatika > - > Noma Petroff <npetroff (AT) bowdoin (DOT) edu> > Mark Middle Mountain <gourdmad (AT) ovnet (DOT) com> > Cc: <Ekabuddh (AT) aol (DOT) com>; <Dasgopal (AT) aol (DOT) com>; <labangalatika (AT) vsnl (DOT) net>; > <d_4h (AT) hotmail (DOT) com>; <doctorox (AT) pa (DOT) net>; Cow (Protection and related issues) > <Cow (AT) pamho (DOT) net> > Tuesday, December 30, 2003 4:41 AM > Re: Giving up on Commercial Milk saves cows? > > > > > > > > Mark Middle Mountain wrote: > > > > > > > > > > >>Beautiful. You mention that perhaps they were right to tell you not to > > >> > > >> > > >take > > > > > > > > >>on another cow when there were already so many there. However you gave > > >> > > >> > > >this > > > > > > > > >>mother cow a time of life where she was loved and cared for. And she > > >>reciprocated. This was a great gift you gave her. obeisances eka > > >> > > >> Ann Fletcher ann (AT) aucklandinsulation (DOT) co.nz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 1, 2004 Report Share Posted January 1, 2004 This is certainly true; strict rules must be in place. Again, my original point was to illustrate that a cow will provide milk out of affection for its maintainer long after it has willingly weened its calf; not that I was right to buy a cow or right to leave my previous wife. These are not things we can justify on shastric grounds. The only justification is that we are still alive (myself, Ekadasi and her calf). The fact that I eventually left (and left the cow with my ex-wife who abandoned it to the community-she has since remaried (3rd time) and has the same amount of land as before) was a side note pointed out by Ghosh. However, as I also previously indicated, I do not support the donating of cows to ISKCON communities--Donate the money to support a cowherd family who is willing to sacrifice their lives in order to maintain the temple's cows. I was one of the cowherds in NV, as was my previous neighbor (Govardhan) who also left NV after years of service the cows. We were both involved with the cows in NV since we were 18 & 19 year old brahmacaris. After marriage we still took care of the herd (300+ at the time). He worked for the goshalla full-time and I would help put as much as I could. I would daily count the cows and inspect them. Every two days I was able to visually inspect and count every one of NV's cows (243 when I left). When I found one that was injured or old and getting thin (because her teeth had worn due to age) I would arrange to have them removed from the pastures and taken to a small family pasture (like Ghosh's) or to the main barn so they could recover or retire and be protected from the larger animals. There was over 25 miles of fence line which Govershan almost single handedly maintained. I would also help to organize the fall migration back to the winter barn. Govardhan and I were almost killed trying to save our maniac dairy bull (who hadn't been bred in many years) from himself when he finaly broke out. One neighbor vowed to shoot him if he found him. We tracked him for several days and finally we snuck up on him with my hand burried in a bucket of drugged grain and I hooked his nose ring with my lead. He eventually snapped the brass ring (not his nose,-but the ring itself) he was so violent. Nevertheless, he was saved. Every cowherd had these stories and these memories are our greated joys. That's not why we left. I fully understand the issue of not leaving a cow with the temple. But I think we all must understand. Govardhan and I (and many many others) do not leave NV because of another cow- or another hundred cows- (they were a source of joy--sometimes bitter joy, but joy nonetheless). We left because of the humans. We left because of dysfunctional human relationships. We left because managment was not willing to support stable families or the sometimes the cows themselves. The cows in NV made enough in donations to support themselves to a lesser degree. However, the temple taxed the cow donations 10% or more, while they remodled the room and office of the resident sanyassi (former sanyassi now but still resident). Then complained that they were unable to pay the bills. It was not because we had so many cows-it was the human faulty dynamics. In my experience, cowherds do not get fried bacuse of another lotus eyed cow (or even a non-lotus eyed cow); cowherds get fried bacuse we, in ISKCON, do not know how to treat eachother with compassion and integrety and because the upper most managment is not willing to or not able to figure out how to support good men and women (and families) to do the service right. They know that a new wandering brahmacari (or bachlarcari) is going to come and do the service for a bowl of kichari and a new dhoti. When you go for the lowest bidder, you get soemone who is typicaly unstable, unsettled or ready to bug-out on a moments notice. Someone who is not attached. Or someone who will eventually get married and want a little more than the next lowest bidder. Again, it is true that it is condemable to abandon a cow to the temple (as much as it is to abaondon your child to a temple-which was also done and had horrible personal consequences). While it was great that I saved a cow from slaughter, it was not great that I was not able to maintain that cow and that it eventually was left to the temple. In the end, many of those who served the cows, were not even able to maintain themselves (physically and otherwise)-so I do encourage anyone who thinks they want a family cow, to check themselves. Consider every aspect of your life, consider history, consider whether you love your wife, or yourself. Having a cow (or family) means that you have enough love and compassion within your self that you can share it. If you are not properly situated or not sincere, or are doing things for the wrong reasons, you will most certainly crack when tested by the Lord and time ("the destroyer of ALL things [material]"). When our personal human relationships are healthy, our communities will be healthy. When that day comes, cows will not be seen as a burden given by the one or the one hundred. Krishna will provide the people, the land the, finances (the fences). In NV, the people came, but we were not engaged or were misused, the money mispent, and so they were again taken away. I am rambling again. Please keep in mind, WE DID NOT leave becasue of another cow, we left because we had to in order to servive and grow and thrive in Krishna consciouness as individuals. It is unfortunate that at the time we were unable to do that in NV. If one argues that we were, then why did every new family from that time end up in either Columbus, Pittsburg, or Iowa City? The young familes (like Govardhan's), were also shattered and in turn he left by himself [last I heard] leaving cows, wife and daughter. In order to grow we must realize what previousy kept us from growing and remove it or remove ourselves. We young families were unable to change the status quo of NV. Perhaps things have since changed and I hope things have. I am currently banned from NV for life because I got the first of 3 or 4 divorices out of that batch of kids. They could not have banned all of them (I hope not). However, I know, everytime I am down town preaching, and everytime I tell my son something about the Lord that he previously did not know, that this was Krishna's arrangement. But it will be better if we can reduce the pain and hurt for the next batch -of cows and people. Again, sorry to carry on. -Gopal dasa In a message dated 1/1/2004 3:30:29 AM Central Standard Time, ann (AT) akn (DOT) quik.co.nz writes: As a cowherd monitor and servant of our herd at New Varshan in Auckland New Zealand I'm sorry prabhu but your methods are not practical in every situation. Most of the Iskcon farms have limited grazing and devotee service but not only that, our fences need maintaining, water troughs etc etc. We have a very strict breeding programme. As many devotees are FINALLY realizing, keeping a herd is a huge responsibility as much if not more so than having a child yourself. Therefore the value of "protected" milk is very great. New Zealand is at the heart of the milking industry. Famous for its butter and ghee. A beautiful sight, driving through the Waikato seeing large herds of Jerseys grazing our lush green pastures, until you go on a morning when the 3 day old Bobby calves are in the boxes out the front gate awaiting collection for the slaughter house for their veal. But as an Iskcon farm, I cant accept these sweet calves. I am approached by members of the Indian community all the time, wanting to donate a calf. sometimes already pre purchased. I have to turn them away. Not only do Radha Giridhari receive no side benefit of the milk but it just puts extra strain on us that have to care for that calf albeit very sweet and pretty, still needs care and maintainence for the next 15 years. I feel very fortunate to have been serving here for 20 years at New Varshan and have seen this service change hands many times. It always falls back on me. Im always the one that has to get the hay in every year, always the one phoned if a cow gets stuck in a creek or the cows get out. Now a days as our herd gets older, I'm serving our geriatrics. Making sure, they are safe etc. Dealing with SPCA representitives etc. I know for sure, there are many devotees quietly doing the same service around the world. All glories to you all. But we are not some open house dumping ground for others whimsical sentimental rash descisions. If someone wants to protect a cow, thats exactly what it means - for her whole life. They cant just expect to be able to dump her onto an Iskcon farm and carry on with their life. That is not proper cow protection. Strict rules must be in place. Sorry for the ramble but it is an on going issue that every one needs to be clear on. We may come and go but the cows are on the farm and proper standards must be set world wide in Iskcon. So to the devotee who left his cow at New Vrndarvan, the sooner you start making a regular donation for her up keep, the better. Jai your servant Ananta Krsna Dasi. Ann Fletcher ann (AT) aucklandinsulation (DOT) co.nz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 1, 2004 Report Share Posted January 1, 2004 > But > we are not some open house dumping ground for others whimsical sentimental > rash descisions. If someone wants to protect a cow, thats exactly what it > means - for her whole life. They cant just expect to be able to dump her > onto an Iskcon farm and carry on with their life. That is not proper cow > protection. Strict rules must be in place. Bingo! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 3, 2004 Report Share Posted January 3, 2004 I do understand your position and the need to c0ntrol breeding on the ISKCON farms. and that your work load must be tremendous. In India I do have people to do all the heavy work and manage the oxen.We are not breeding for milk... more than a little becomes a hassle. The calves get plenty. However we are Trust so we are obliged to do more for cow protection than just maintain our own herd . Obviously you cant save all the calves from the slaughterhouse. and take care of them. A man my husabnd had some dealings with personally asked us to take his cow ,.and some others ,so he agreed because we are a Trust tp protect cows and otherwise she would have gone to the cattle traders. The 4 othrs who came at the same time a s the one who calved inside our gate I placed on a farm near Pune where they need cow dung and urine for producing organic vegetables, roses for export, vanilla etc under strict signed agrement. I see them every 6 months and may bring them here again if necessary. We have a hold on them. We fed 50 village cows outside our gate last summer of drought because they were really starving. We fed them enough to make a difference. These are not beef cattle... They are village cows and oxen forced to scrounge on less and less land and why should m y cows be fat only and outside they die. One calf nearly did. She collapsed and I brought her in and she couldnt get to her feet fpr a whole month unaided. But then she got fine . After 6 months her owner from the village, found out she was here and claimed her and I have seen she is ok grazing with her herd as this year there is plenty of grass. But in India you cant live in a vacuum and cow protection means doing the needful and it is preaching. We have just bought 100 acres of barren land near for 15 lakhs rupees. And we will do rain water harvesting and it is to be for cattle saved from slaughter only. We cant develop it ourselves further but the opportunity was too good to pass up. Because we feed cows we get free hay delivered and a truck load of fodder too. So this helps. See what Kurma Rupa is doing in Care for Cows Vrindaban at www. care for cows .org.He never turns injured cows or bulls or calves away and Krsna is pouring blessings and wealth on him from all sides. We also are making products from cow urine and gobar and sell vermi compost. This covers a lot of costs. In India it is different. Your cows are all heavy milkers . However just one idea please dont take offence...it might be a good idea to take a calf ,if already prepaid maybe, from the Indian and ask them to pay handsomely for her upkeep for life . They will and will help you more with your project too. The Indian community will defintely reciprocate. your servant labangalatika dasi , January 01, 2004 2:45 PM Responsibiltiy of Cow ownership > As a cowherd monitor and servant of our herd at New Varshan in Auckland New > Zealand I'm sorry prabhu but your methods are not practical in every > situation. Most of the Iskcon farms have limited grazing and devotee service > but not only that, our fences need maintaining, water troughs etc etc. We > have a very strict breeding programme. As many devotees are FINALLY > realizing, keeping a herd is a huge responsibility as much if not more so > than having a child yourself. Therefore the value of "protected" milk is > very great. New Zealand is at the heart of the milking industry. Famous for > its butter and ghee. A beautiful sight, driving through the Waikato seeing > large herds of Jerseys grazing our lush green pastures, until you go on a > morning when the 3 day old Bobby calves are in the boxes out the front gate > awaiting collection for the slaughter house for their veal. > > But as an Iskcon farm, I cant accept these sweet calves. I am approached by > members of the Indian community all the time, wanting to donate a calf. > sometimes already pre purchased. I have to turn them away. Not only do Radha > Giridhari receive no side benefit of the milk but it just puts extra strain > on us that have to care for that calf albeit very sweet and pretty, still > needs care and maintainence for the next 15 years. I feel very fortunate to > have been serving here for 20 years at New Varshan and have seen this > service change hands many times. It always falls back on me. Im always the > one that has to get the hay in every year, always the one phoned if a cow > gets stuck in a creek or the cows get out. Now a days as our herd gets > older, I'm serving our geriatrics. Making sure, they are safe etc. Dealing > with SPCA representitives etc. I know for sure, there are many devotees > quietly doing the same service around the world. All glories to you all. But > we are not some open house dumping ground for others whimsical sentimental > rash descisions. If someone wants to protect a cow, thats exactly what it > means - for her whole life. They cant just expect to be able to dump her > onto an Iskcon farm and carry on with their life. That is not proper cow > protection. Strict rules must be in place. > Sorry for the ramble but it is an on going issue that every one needs to be > clear on. We may come and go but the cows are on the farm and proper > standards must be set world wide in Iskcon. So to the devotee who left his > cow at New Vrndarvan, the sooner you start making a regular donation for her > up keep, the better. > Jai > your servant > Ananta Krsna Dasi. > Ann Fletcher > ann (AT) aucklandinsulation (DOT) co.nz > - > "Rosalie Malik" <labangalatika (AT) vsnl (DOT) net> > "Mark Middle Mountain" <gourdmad (AT) ovnet (DOT) com>; "Noma Petroff" > <npetroff (AT) bowdoin (DOT) edu> > Cc: <Ekabuddh (AT) aol (DOT) com>; <Dasgopal (AT) aol (DOT) com>; <d_4h (AT) hotmail (DOT) com>; > <doctorox (AT) pa (DOT) net>; "Cow (Protection and related issues)" <Cow (AT) pamho (DOT) net> > Thursday, January 01, 2004 5:31 AM > Re: Giving up on Commercial Milk saves cows? > > > > Haribol Hrimati well said > > He saved Ekadasi from the butcher so he deserves only praise not harsh > > words. The temple shouldnt gripe about taking care of unproductive cows. > > They should be glad to serve them. They are getting so much benefit from > > the cows, more than they can ever give and even the overworked cowherd > > should be happy the poor cow is alive and safe. > > It seems the prabhu had to leave NV community and anything can happen in > > life unexpectedly. but taking up the responsibility of keeping a cow is > > better than never taking it up . > > > > We accepted a cow a year ago because her owner couldnt take care of > her > > and as soon as she walked in the gate she sat down and gave birth to a > > beautiful black calf, Kalindi... after a 5 km walk on the road. We are > > controlling our breeding, but we are a Trust for cow protection so we > have > > an obligation to accept cows in difficulty. Another one is Bandi who > > was beaten and left to die in the jungle with a broken leg by a drunken > > farmer and she delivered her calf 2 months later and is an extremely > > happy cow tho lame. And Parvati whose mother died of neglect ( septic > > wound) at another farm and we fed on a baby bottel for 9 months. In > > the past I had given away a couple of cows on demand but i have > brought > > them back as they didnt like their other homes. So call it sentiment > > but compassion is also a sentiment that Vaisnavas can develop. The > > money part is not much of a problem and cow protection is a challenge, > > Just because my husband and I are old doesnt mean we should ignore > the > > challenge of saving these cows. Actually they are saving us. Because > > you cant see everything in the future doesnt mean you just stop and do > > nothing. At least every devotee can Adopt a cow. > > your servant labangalatika > > - > > Noma Petroff <npetroff (AT) bowdoin (DOT) edu> > > Mark Middle Mountain <gourdmad (AT) ovnet (DOT) com> > > Cc: <Ekabuddh (AT) aol (DOT) com>; <Dasgopal (AT) aol (DOT) com>; <labangalatika (AT) vsnl (DOT) net>; > > <d_4h (AT) hotmail (DOT) com>; <doctorox (AT) pa (DOT) net>; Cow (Protection and related issues) > > <Cow (AT) pamho (DOT) net> > > Tuesday, December 30, 2003 4:41 AM > > Re: Giving up on Commercial Milk saves cows? > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mark Middle Mountain wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >>Beautiful. You mention that perhaps they were right to tell you not > to > > > >> > > > >> > > > >take > > > > > > > > > > > >>on another cow when there were already so many there. However you > gave > > > >> > > > >> > > > >this > > > > > > > > > > > >>mother cow a time of life where she was loved and cared for. And she > > > >>reciprocated. This was a great gift you gave her. obeisances eka > > > >> > > > >> > > Ann Fletcher > ann (AT) aucklandinsulation (DOT) co.nz > > > ----------------------- > To from this mailing list, send an email to: > Cow-Owner (AT) pamho (DOT) net Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 4, 2004 Report Share Posted January 4, 2004 > However just > one idea please dont take offence...it might be a good idea to take a > calf ,if already prepaid maybe, from the Indian and ask them to pay > handsomely for her upkeep for life . They will and will help you more with > your project too. The Indian community will defintely reciprocate. That idea has been around for a while and is well within the scope of the Cow Protection Standards, and has been included in many ideas for developing devotee communities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 4, 2004 Report Share Posted January 4, 2004 - Mark Middle Mountain <gourdmad (AT) ovnet (DOT) com> Sunday, January 4, 2004 2:00 pm Re: Responsibiltiy of Cow ownership > > > However just > > one idea please dont take offence...it might be a good idea to > take a > > calf ,if already prepaid maybe, from the Indian and ask them > to pay > > handsomely for her upkeep for life . This suggestion sounds in line with Srila Prabhupada's instruction that the devotees should not accept any donation of cows unless the owner pays 5,000 rupees with the cows (allowing for inflation, of course it would be much more now). But the other important thing for a devotee farm is to make sure they have enough dependable cowherds to take care of another animal. In western countries that may be much more difficult in India. ys hkdd They will and will help > you more > with > > your project too. The Indian community will defintely > reciprocate. > That idea has been around for a while and is well within the scope > of the > Cow Protection Standards, and has been included in many ideas for > developingdevotee communities. > > > ----------------------- > To from this mailing list, send an email to: > Cow-Owner (AT) pamho (DOT) net > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 5, 2004 Report Share Posted January 5, 2004 ------------------------------ Content-Type: message/rfc822 Return-path: <Dasgopal (AT) aol (DOT) com> Dasgopal (AT) aol (DOT) com Full-name: Dasgopal Message-ID: <148.1fecea2c.2d2a00d1 (AT) aol (DOT) com> Sun, 4 Jan 2004 18:50:41 EST Re: Responsibiltiy of Cow ownership npetroff (AT) bowdoin (DOT) edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="-----------------------------1073260241" X-Mailer: 9.0 for Windows sub 5007 -------------------------------1073260241 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Actually, there are pleanty of cowherds in the US. The issue is not lack of cowherds, its lack of support for those willing to do the service correcty and steadily. As I mentioned previously, we will always have the loner who will do the service for a bowl of kichari and a dhoti, (and by all means these individuals should be groomed and supported to become mature in their service and in the correct understandiong of what cow protection entails). However, if not supported beyond their initial leap into the glorious world of gorakshya seva, or not allowed to become settled (including having a family), they burn out and move on to a place where they can support their familes and thrive devotionally and practically (like Iowa City). The cowherds will be dependable, or are, but the system is not. We still think it can all be done with one or two people on a volunteer basis--there will never be commitment that way. The cowherds and those running the programs must OWN it or be alowed to own it (this is not in the 'owning or buying-into property' sense, but in the 'this-IS-my-duty' and 'I will be allowed to do what it takes to make this situaltion right' sense). I have been lookinng for this since I joined--it is not to be found, yet. We have to remember that the one in charge is a cowherd (Gopal), we simply have to let His will flow all the way down; currenlty there is a hold-up somewhere--we have to find it and clear it away. ys-Gopal das In a message dated 1/4/2004 3:30:45 PM Central Standard Time, npetroff (AT) bowdoin (DOT) edu writes: But the other important thing for a devotee farm is to make sure they have enough dependable cowherds to take care of another animal. In western countries that may be much more difficult in India. ys hkdd -------------------------------1073260241 Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <HTML><HEAD> <META charset=3DUTF-8 http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; charse= t=3Dutf-8"> <META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2723.2500" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD> <BODY style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffff= f"> <DIV> <DIV>Actually, there are pleanty of cowherds in the US. The issue is no= t lack of cowherds, its lack of support for those willing to do the service=20= correcty and steadily. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>As I mentioned previously, we will always have the loner who will=20= do the service for a bowl of kichari and a dhoti, (and by all means these in= dividuals should be groomed and supported to become mature in their service=20= and in the correct understandiong of what cow protection entails). Howe= ver, if not supported beyond their initial leap into the glorious world of g= orakshya seva, or not allowed to become settled (including having a family),= they burn out and move on to a place where they can support their familes a= nd thrive devotionally and practically (like Iowa City). </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>The cowherds will be dependable, or are, but the system is not. We stil= l think it can all be done with one or two people on a volunteer basis-= -there will never be commitment that way. The cowherds and those running the= programs must OWN it or be alowed to own it (this is not in the 'owning or=20= buying-into property' sense, but in the 'this-IS-my-duty' and 'I will be all= owed to do what it takes to make this situaltion right' sense). I=20= have been lookinng for this since I joined--it is not to be found, yet. = ;</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>We have to remember that the one in charge is a cowherd (Gopal), we sim= ply have to let His will flow all the way down; currenlty there is a ho= ld-up somewhere--we have to find it and clear it away.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>ys-Gopal das</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>In a message dated 1/4/2004 3:30:45 PM Central Standard Time, npetroff@= bowdoin.edu writes:</DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: blue=20= 2px solid"><FONT face=3DArial>But the other important thing for a devotee fa= rm is to make sure they have<BR>enough dependable cowherds to take care of a= nother animal. In western<BR>countries that may be much more difficult= in India. <BR><BR>ys<BR>hkdd</FONT></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV> <DIV></DIV></BODY></HTML> -------------------------------1073260241-- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 5, 2004 Report Share Posted January 5, 2004 > As I mentioned previously, we will always have the loner who will do the > service for a bowl of kichari and a dhoti, (and by all means these individuals > should be groomed and supported to become mature in their service and in the > correct understandiong of what cow protection entails). However, if not > supported > beyond their initial leap into the glorious world of gorakshya seva, or not > allowed to become settled (including having a family), they burn out and move > on > to a place where they can support their familes and thrive devotionally and > practically (like Iowa City). > Or become bitter long term brahmacary "fanatics" making mountains out of molehills, angry at anyone not living like themselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 6, 2004 Report Share Posted January 6, 2004 In a message dated 1/4/2004 2:03:00 PM Eastern Standard Time, Dasgopal writes: > 'I will be allowed to do what > it > takes to make this situaltion right' sense). This is the type of cowherd that should be sponsored. I would suggest, those already involved in successfully applying varnashrama cow protection be back by all others, half doing, or "thinking about" doing. NOW. Pool together to have successful projects that can become training grounds for future "successful" projects. My suggestion is to concentrate on Balabadhra/Chaya, Alachua, Iowa City, and maybe one more small family project that is communicating on this conference....I don't know if Krishna Caitanya is on?? in Sandy ridge. Make 3 or 4 highly successful projects happen and others will follow. obeisances ekaB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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