Guest guest Posted February 3, 2004 Report Share Posted February 3, 2004 Dear Hari Kirtan Prabhu, Please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada. I am very sorry that I did not get around to answering your two letters. Sometimes on receiving an e mail you get the notion of answering it later. Then after a couple of days of e mail swamp you lose track of who has written and who needs a reply. I am dissappointed that you took to criticising a number of things about the New Goshalla and the current management which were not from a position of clear understanding. At the risk of inflamation I will comment on some of your points. > They had pledges for 1.72 million pound to build the new goshalla >but the building plans still had to be approved in october. Did anything >happen yet? We submitted a planning application to the local council and unfortunately they refused it. The principle of a new building was not the issue but rather they thought we should have more land to justify the size of the number of cows we were intending to house and the subsequent space allocations for such a size herd. We are attempting to secure more land and ideed have been trying for some years. Presently the local farmer we have been speaking to has acknowledged his intention to sell but as yet we have not done any transactions. He indicates end of Feb might look good. If we cannot secure more land then we will build for 44 cows and not the 60 we wanted. When we get more land then we can either alter our planning application or we can apply to build additional space to house up to 60 as we want. >In the plans there is no accomodation for the cowherds what so ever. >After bringing it up a few times he told me ; no, there is no plan for that >and we will not make it. The planning legislation in the UK is very tight and it is not easy to get any kind of accommodation on green fields. There are no plans to put married couples in the new complex and neither should we as living in a visitor attraction would not be condusive to families neither the visiting guests. There is provision for unmarried temporary personnel. >A cowherd cannot stay on the property unless he is an exemplary brahmana. >The best I could get provided by the temple was a 2 bedroom appartment >somewhere in town. All the families connected to the Manor are all living around the manor within 10 to 15 minutes drive. This is an unavoidable reality of working at the Manor. There is no scope whatsoever of a village of devotee families living at the Manor. The local council would not allow it and it would breach all the goverment planning regulations for green field sites. >The pay they can offer is such that if you want to survive you have to >apply >for help at the government. Not strictly true. I am on a low income and in my families case we are not dependant on the Government because both my wife and I work for the temple. The goshalla can only pay what it can afford and in any case it is according to the Agricultural wages board of the UK. Presently we have 4 persons employed at the Manor goshalla and certainly the incomw will not appeal or be possible for everyone. >Shyamasundara prabhu's goal is to provide enough milk for the whole temple. >(So not cow-protection but milk-production.) Please excuse me while I say something inflamitary. This is a stupid statement based on an uninformed position. Srila Prabhupada put the Manor in the same category as other farm communities in that he wanted it to be Self reliant. He also indicated that he wanted a herd of 150 cows. We are far short of Srila Prabhpadas dream however we are establishing a base which can be built on. In order for the goshalla to provide all the milk and its products for the temple we would require a herd around the size Srila Prabhupada has indicated. There is ablsolutely no question that the Manor is embarking in milk production without being based on the principles of Cow Protection. >There are two devotees living in the barn . A devotee with his father both >from former russia somewhere. The father milks the 4 milking cows. That is >his only service. It takes him 8 hrs a day. Isn't that a bit much? We are milking 7 cows per day and it takes 7 hours per day to milk the cows, put down bedding for 32 cows and oxen, to check each cow and ox, to ensure they all have access to good grazing or ad lib hay, to wash down the public corridors and the milking paraphernalia and spaces. It is not too much it is a reality as anyone who milks cows will know. >Once you have enough milking cows to provide the whole temple how many >milkman will you need, how many appartments downtown , how many cars to >drive up and down? One person can milk 10 to 12 cows per day. A herd of 150 cows would have about 25 to 30 cows milking and thus there would be 3 persons just milking the cows. The Manpower for working the oxen is extra. >Personally I think that to start a new project without providing living >facility for the cowherds on site is just a farce. I think that a plan that is not realistic remains a uttopian dream. >I would like to recomment not to nominate Shyamasundara prabhu I second that reccommendation ys syam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 3, 2004 Report Share Posted February 3, 2004 > > >I would like to recomment not to nominate Shyamasundara prabhu > > I second that reccommendation > > ys syam Sorry, I already sent in the nominations as the deadline was today. The conference members seemed to like all the nominations and the conference subject changed, as is the usually case, so I sent them not wanting to do it the last minute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2004 Report Share Posted February 4, 2004 Is one of these addresses Chaya and one Lakshmi #2???? love eka ------------------------------ Content-Type: message/rfc822 Return-path: <Ekabuddh (AT) aol (DOT) com> Ekabuddh (AT) aol (DOT) com Full-name: Ekabuddh Message-ID: <1de.1832571a.2d525616 (AT) aol (DOT) com> Wed, 4 Feb 2004 09:05:10 EST Re: nominations Syamasundara (AT) pamho (DOT) net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part2_15.21c5592d.2d525616_boundary" X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 121 --part2_15.21c5592d.2d525616_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/3/04 9:50:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, Syamasundara (AT) pamho (DOT) net writes: > >(So not cow-protection but milk-production.) > > Please excuse me while I say something inflamitary. This is a stupid > statement based on an uninformed position. Not happy about the use of the term "stupid". However, I don't understand how milk-production is a negative thing????????? and as much of a pollyana utopian I have been told I am....you can't get much done if you can't get the zoning. So if cowherds can't live on the land, is it better to NOT be doing Any project in an area where so many non-devotees will be shown working alternative to cows being produced for large scale milking and killing??? Though he does have a bite, I'm for Syam nomination. obeisances eka --part2_15.21c5592d.2d525616_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><HTML><FONT SIZE=3D2 PTSIZE=3D10>In a me= ssage dated 2/3/04 9:50:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, Syamasundara (AT) pamho (DOT) net=20= writes:<BR> <BR> <BR> <BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT= : 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">>(So not cow-protection but=20= milk-production.)<BR> <BR> Please excuse me while I say something inflamitary. This is a stupid<BR> statement based on an uninformed position. </BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <BR> Not happy about the use of the term "stupid". However, I don't underst= and how milk-production is a negative thing????????? and as much of a=20= pollyana utopian I have been told I am....you can't get much done if you can= 't get the zoning. So if cowherds can't live on the land, is it better= to NOT be doing Any project in an area where so many non-devotees will be s= hown working alternative to cows being produced for large scale milking and=20= killing??? Though he does have a bite, I'm for Syam nomination. obeisa= nces eka</FONT></HTML> --part2_15.21c5592d.2d525616_boundary-- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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