Guest guest Posted November 22, 2002 Report Share Posted November 22, 2002 I'll start. Others can revise and embellish. Your sand is dead matter. Plants cannot survive in dead matter. The soil needs to be alive so they can grow. You can get an excellent book called "The Soul of Soil" by Grace Gershuny and Joe Smillie that will elaborate on this point more scientifically (but still readably). Basic principle is this: you need to add organic matter to your soil. Manure contains all the wonderful tiny organisms that Krsna created to help plants grow. It will make your soil alive. I would suggest that you get several truck loads of manure from one of California's huge dairy farms and add this to your soil. My guess would be to apply it to the surface and then go over it with a plow and disc harrow to work the manure into the soil. In a year you can plant on it. Your soil will hold water and be more drought-resistant that the surrounding country side. Now, the real farmers can move into the discussion and give you the details. your servant, Hare Krsna dasi -- "Vrndavana Lila (dd) LOK (Los Angeles, CA - USA)" wrote: > Hare Krsna! I have a piece of land here in california that has too much > sand. I can't build or put anything on it until I get it compacted. Some > people say I should just take some of the sand out and throw in some dirt. > Others say I should just use a particular heavy equipment to do the job but > that I would need to do that a few times to get the result. If you have any > suggestions for me please let me know. Thank you very much. > > Vrndavana Lila Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 23, 2002 Report Share Posted November 23, 2002 Jai Chaitanya Das wrote: > Hare Krishna! > > Is the land for building or farming? For farming, I would agree 100% > about the cow manure, but it will be good to add about 60% bio-mass > (organic plant waste like dry leaves, twigs etc.) This would be an > insitue composting. Good point. Plant wastes are good to help get a better carbon-nitrogen ratio -- which I think should be about 3 to 1. Generally, plants supply carbon; manure supplies nitrogen. The exception is a few nitrogen fixing crops -- legumes -- like alfalfa, clover, beans, etc. Madhava Gosh -- I think we need your input here. Depending on how you plan to use the soil, you can also get carbon from processed "plant" wastes, such as shredded paper, cardboard, etc. Due to possible chemicals contained, you might not want to use this for organic vegetable production, but for your front yard or even for trees, this might be a useful source of soil-building carbon. > Provide about 3 inches of these two and I am sure > in 6 months you can plant. While planting first plant legumes like > Crotelaria, or sesbania varieties., these fix atmospheric Nitrogen into > the soil If you have enough manure I'm not sure why you need to grow legumes -- as that's the main thing that the manure provides: Nitrogen. Maybe a cover crop like rye or buckwheat would be good -- to provide allelopathic suppression of any dormant weed seeds in the manure. > and when the plants start to flower cut them and mulch them > covering the soil. This will do the job. Ofcourse you will have to > keep the surface moist, so, a long sprinkler would be helpful. If' she's in a dry area, this might be an expensive idea. Sounds like it's time to get out the Bill Mollison Permaculture book. Are there still any Australians on the cow conference? Mulching will help preserve moisture. Finally -- don't forget to call your local agricultural extention agent and ask him or her for water-saving techniques appropriate for your locale. Maybe they can suggest local farms you could visit to get more ideas. > The > organic matter would bring in all the required to the soil to growth > healthy plants. > You could do much more, but this would be the starting point. Its > important to keep the top soil covered from harsh sunlight and wind, so > fast growing shrubs would help too by providing semi-shade. > > Your servant, > Jai Chaitanya das > Hare Krishna Nature Farm, > Mysore, south India. > > > Cow (AT) pamho (DOT) net [Cow (AT) pamho (DOT) net] On Behalf Of Noma T. Petroff > Friday, November 22, 2002 11:14 PM > Cc: Cow (Protection and related issues) > Re: sandy land - add cow manure > > I'll start. Others can revise and embellish. > > Your sand is dead matter. Plants cannot survive in dead matter. The > soil > needs to be alive so they can grow. > > You can get an excellent book called "The Soul of Soil" by Grace > Gershuny and > Joe Smillie that will elaborate on this point more scientifically (but > still > readably). > > Basic principle is this: you need to add organic matter to your soil. > Manure > contains all the wonderful tiny organisms that Krsna created to help > plants > grow. It will make your soil alive. I would suggest that you get > several > truck loads of manure from one of California's huge dairy farms and add > this to > your soil. > > My guess would be to apply it to the surface and then go over it with a > plow > and disc harrow to work the manure into the soil. > > In a year you can plant on it. Your soil will hold water and be more > drought-resistant that the surrounding country side. > > Now, the real farmers can move into the discussion and give you the > details. > > your servant, > > Hare Krsna dasi > > -- > > "Vrndavana Lila (dd) LOK (Los Angeles, CA - USA)" wrote: > > > Hare Krsna! I have a piece of land here in california that has too > much > > sand. I can't build or put anything on it until I get it compacted. > Some > > people say I should just take some of the sand out and throw in some > dirt. > > Others say I should just use a particular heavy equipment to do the > job but > > that I would need to do that a few times to get the result. If you > have any > > suggestions for me please let me know. Thank you very much. > > > > Vrndavana Lila -- Noma Petroff Academic Department Coordinator BOWDOIN COLLEGE Department of Theater & Dance 9100 College Station Brunswick ME 04011-8491 Phone: (207) 725-3663 FAX: (207) 725-3372 http://academic.bowdoin.edu/theaterdance/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 23, 2002 Report Share Posted November 23, 2002 I also recommend that you read the Hare Krsna Rural Life articles by Vyapaka and others at http://hkrl.com/ There are many good articles about soil management and waste management there. your servant, Hare Krsna dasi "Noma T. Petroff" wrote: > Jai Chaitanya Das wrote: > > > Hare Krishna! > > > > Is the land for building or farming? For farming, I would agree 100% > > about the cow manure, but it will be good to add about 60% bio-mass > > (organic plant waste like dry leaves, twigs etc.) This would be an > > insitue composting. > > Good point. Plant wastes are good to help get a better carbon-nitrogen > ratio -- which I think should be about 3 to 1. Generally, plants supply > carbon; manure supplies nitrogen. The exception is a few nitrogen fixing > crops -- legumes -- like alfalfa, clover, beans, etc. Madhava Gosh -- I > think we need your input here. > > Depending on how you plan to use the soil, you can also get carbon from > processed "plant" wastes, such as shredded paper, cardboard, etc. Due to > possible chemicals contained, you might not want to use this for organic > vegetable production, but for your front yard or even for trees, this might > be a useful source of soil-building carbon. > > > Provide about 3 inches of these two and I am sure > > in 6 months you can plant. While planting first plant legumes like > > Crotelaria, or sesbania varieties., these fix atmospheric Nitrogen into > > the soil > > If you have enough manure I'm not sure why you need to grow legumes -- as > that's the main thing that the manure provides: Nitrogen. Maybe a cover crop > like rye or buckwheat would be good -- to provide allelopathic suppression > of any dormant weed seeds in the manure. > > > and when the plants start to flower cut them and mulch them > > covering the soil. This will do the job. Ofcourse you will have to > > keep the surface moist, so, a long sprinkler would be helpful. > > If' she's in a dry area, this might be an expensive idea. Sounds like it's > time to get out the Bill Mollison Permaculture book. Are there still any > Australians on the cow conference? Mulching will help preserve moisture. > > Finally -- don't forget to call your local agricultural extention agent and > ask him or her for water-saving techniques appropriate for your locale. > Maybe they can suggest local farms you could visit to get more ideas. > > > The > > organic matter would bring in all the required to the soil to growth > > healthy plants. > > You could do much more, but this would be the starting point. Its > > important to keep the top soil covered from harsh sunlight and wind, so > > fast growing shrubs would help too by providing semi-shade. > > > > Your servant, > > Jai Chaitanya das > > Hare Krishna Nature Farm, > > Mysore, south India. > > > > > > Cow (AT) pamho (DOT) net [Cow (AT) pamho (DOT) net] On Behalf Of Noma T. Petroff > > Friday, November 22, 2002 11:14 PM > > Cc: Cow (Protection and related issues) > > Re: sandy land - add cow manure > > > > I'll start. Others can revise and embellish. > > > > Your sand is dead matter. Plants cannot survive in dead matter. The > > soil > > needs to be alive so they can grow. > > > > You can get an excellent book called "The Soul of Soil" by Grace > > Gershuny and > > Joe Smillie that will elaborate on this point more scientifically (but > > still > > readably). > > > > Basic principle is this: you need to add organic matter to your soil. > > Manure > > contains all the wonderful tiny organisms that Krsna created to help > > plants > > grow. It will make your soil alive. I would suggest that you get > > several > > truck loads of manure from one of California's huge dairy farms and add > > this to > > your soil. > > > > My guess would be to apply it to the surface and then go over it with a > > plow > > and disc harrow to work the manure into the soil. > > > > In a year you can plant on it. Your soil will hold water and be more > > drought-resistant that the surrounding country side. > > > > Now, the real farmers can move into the discussion and give you the > > details. > > > > your servant, > > > > Hare Krsna dasi > > > > -- > > > > "Vrndavana Lila (dd) LOK (Los Angeles, CA - USA)" wrote: > > > > > Hare Krsna! I have a piece of land here in california that has too > > much > > > sand. I can't build or put anything on it until I get it compacted. > > Some > > > people say I should just take some of the sand out and throw in some > > dirt. > > > Others say I should just use a particular heavy equipment to do the > > job but > > > that I would need to do that a few times to get the result. If you > > have any > > > suggestions for me please let me know. Thank you very much. > > > > > > Vrndavana Lila > > -- > Noma Petroff > Academic Department Coordinator > BOWDOIN COLLEGE > Department of Theater & Dance > 9100 College Station > Brunswick ME 04011-8491 > > Phone: (207) 725-3663 > FAX: (207) 725-3372 > > http://academic.bowdoin.edu/theaterdance/ -- Noma Petroff Academic Department Coordinator BOWDOIN COLLEGE Department of Theater & Dance 9100 College Station Brunswick ME 04011-8491 Phone: (207) 725-3663 FAX: (207) 725-3372 http://academic.bowdoin.edu/theaterdance/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 3, 2002 Report Share Posted December 3, 2002 Noma T. Petroff [npetroff (AT) bowdoin (DOT) edu] Sunday, November 24, 2002 1:37 AM Jai Chaitanya Das; cow (AT) pamho (DOT) net Re: sandy land - add cow manure Jai Chaitanya Das wrote: > Hare Krishna! > > Is the land for building or farming? For farming, I would agree 100% > about the cow manure, but it will be good to add about 60% bio-mass > (organic plant waste like dry leaves, twigs etc.) This would be an > insitue composting. Good point. Plant wastes are good to help get a better carbon-nitrogen ratio -- which I think should be about 3 to 1. Generally, plants supply carbon; manure supplies nitrogen. The exception is a few nitrogen fixing crops -- legumes -- like alfalfa, clover, beans, etc. Madhava Gosh -- I think we need your input here. I think the C:N ratio should be ideally 13:1 and not be wider than 21:1. Again there is N loss due to decomposition and planting legumes will help this and start a lot of microbial activity. It also the easiest way to get a lot of bio mass into the soil. Depending on how you plan to use the soil, you can also get carbon from processed "plant" wastes, such as shredded paper, cardboard, etc. Due to possible chemicals contained, you might not want to use this for organic vegetable production, but for your front yard or even for trees, this might be a useful source of soil-building carbon. > Provide about 3 inches of these two and I am sure > in 6 months you can plant. While planting first plant legumes like > Crotelaria, or sesbania varieties., these fix atmospheric Nitrogen into > the soil If you have enough manure I'm not sure why you need to grow legumes -- as that's the main thing that the manure provides: Nitrogen. Maybe a cover crop like rye or buckwheat would be good -- to provide allelopathic suppression of any dormant weed seeds in the manure. > and when the plants start to flower cut them and mulch them > covering the soil. This will do the job. Ofcourse you will have to > keep the surface moist, so, a long sprinkler would be helpful. If' she's in a dry area, this might be an expensive idea. Sounds like it's time to get out the Bill Mollison Permaculture book. Are there still any Australians on the cow conference? Mulching will help preserve moisture. Finally -- don't forget to call your local agricultural extention agent and ask him or her for water-saving techniques appropriate for your locale. Maybe they can suggest local farms you could visit to get more ideas. > The > organic matter would bring in all the required to the soil to growth > healthy plants. > You could do much more, but this would be the starting point. Its > important to keep the top soil covered from harsh sunlight and wind, so > fast growing shrubs would help too by providing semi-shade. > > Your servant, > Jai Chaitanya das > Hare Krishna Nature Farm, > Mysore, south India. > > > Cow (AT) pamho (DOT) net [Cow (AT) pamho (DOT) net] On Behalf Of Noma T. Petroff > Friday, November 22, 2002 11:14 PM > Cc: Cow (Protection and related issues) > Re: sandy land - add cow manure > > I'll start. Others can revise and embellish. > > Your sand is dead matter. Plants cannot survive in dead matter. The > soil > needs to be alive so they can grow. > > You can get an excellent book called "The Soul of Soil" by Grace > Gershuny and > Joe Smillie that will elaborate on this point more scientifically (but > still > readably). > > Basic principle is this: you need to add organic matter to your soil. > Manure > contains all the wonderful tiny organisms that Krsna created to help > plants > grow. It will make your soil alive. I would suggest that you get > several > truck loads of manure from one of California's huge dairy farms and add > this to > your soil. > > My guess would be to apply it to the surface and then go over it with a > plow > and disc harrow to work the manure into the soil. > > In a year you can plant on it. Your soil will hold water and be more > drought-resistant that the surrounding country side. > > Now, the real farmers can move into the discussion and give you the > details. > > your servant, > > Hare Krsna dasi > > -- > > "Vrndavana Lila (dd) LOK (Los Angeles, CA - USA)" wrote: > > > Hare Krsna! I have a piece of land here in california that has too > much > > sand. I can't build or put anything on it until I get it compacted. > Some > > people say I should just take some of the sand out and throw in some > dirt. > > Others say I should just use a particular heavy equipment to do the > job but > > that I would need to do that a few times to get the result. If you > have any > > suggestions for me please let me know. Thank you very much. > > > > Vrndavana Lila -- Noma Petroff Academic Department Coordinator BOWDOIN COLLEGE Department of Theater & Dance 9100 College Station Brunswick ME 04011-8491 Phone: (207) 725-3663 FAX: (207) 725-3372 http://academic.bowdoin.edu/theaterdance/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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