Questions about I am not the experiencer

[Guest guest]

Namaste.

 

Shri Lakshmi Jayaram-ji, in a private correspondence, in

reference to   my post #31652,  writes as follows: “You

mentioned about the attitude of "I am not the experiencer".

How should this idea be assimilated ? Also I have learnt

the concept of I am not the BMI, that I am consciousness.

How to detach from the mind ? What is the right way to

understand this concept for life ? Also what does it mean

to not identify with the intellect ?”

 

Lakshmi-ji, your questions are three:

1.      How to assimilate the idea of ‘I am not the

experiencer’?

2.      How to detach from the mind and be a witness of the

mind? And what is the right manner in which this concept

can be made practical for use?

3.      What is the meaning of not identifying with the

intellect?

 

These are substantial questions.  I don’t think I can

answer these questions fully and honestly. ‘Honestly’,

because, your questions 1 and 2 can be rightly answered

only by a sthita-prajna or ‘jnAni’. With these disclaimers

let me venture into some kind of answering. I am sure there

are more enlightened minds on this list and they will help

us.

 

“na ahaM bhoktA” (I am not the experiencer) is a constant

refrain in  advaita writings and teachings. In all the

different appearances of the JIva, though it takes

different bodies, the same mind sticks on to it. (XV – 7,

8). In each such life of the JIva, the mind accumulates

vAsanAs and samskAras that go on with it into succeeding

lives. It is these vAsanAs that give a character to the

mind. This character is a mixture of satva, rajas and

tamas.

 

Without BMI the JIva cannot express itself as an

individual. Without the sentient JIva, mind is just inert

matter. But when it sticks on to the JIva in the latter’s

physical expression through BMI, it gets sentience. Now the

JIva interacts with the universe of matter as well as with

the other living beings.  But even this interaction has to

take place  only through the medium of the BMI.

 

This is therefore a seemingly endless play of the sentient

Consciousness within and the insentient universe of matter

outside through the medium of the BMI.  This is the

cit-jaDa-granthi that Ramana Maharshi talks about. The

sentient Consciousness within, which is nothing but a spark

of the parAshakti, is called Purushha. Everything else,

including the interaction with other beings,  is of course

prakRti.  This interplay of Purushha and prakRti is what

constitutes our passage through life.

 

Now the Lord says: There are two Purushhas. (15.16)

 

They are kshhara-purushha  (the perishable purushha) and

akshara-purushha (the imperishable purushha). The kshhara

is the familiar JIva.  It is expressing itself through the

BMI. But in so expressing itself, it invariably makes the

mistake of thinking it is just BMI and nothing more. In

other words, the kshhara-purushha commits the colossal

error of identifying itself with the BMI. This colossal

error is called ‘anAdi avidyA’ (Beginningless Ignorance).

And here starts all the problems of life. All the pleasure

and pain, ups and downs, light and darkness, good and bad,

that the BMI suffers through, are mistakenly assumed by the

kshhara-purushha as its own experiences. Not only this. All

the actions of the BMI are also appropriated by the

kshhara. Thus arises the common expressions: ‘I am the doer

(kartA)’ and ‘I am the experiencer (bhoktA)’.

 

The kshara purushha is involved in the actions of Nature.

He reflects the varied workings of the Gunas of prakRti.

He is saguNa, personal.  He associates himself with the

doings of prakRti and thinks he is the doer.  He identifies

himself with the play of personality and clouds his

self-knowledge with the ego-sense in PrakRti so that he

thinks himself as the ego-doer of works. (III - 27):

 

Some one pinches my body. It hurts. Who feels this hurt? I

feel the hurt.  Who is this I that is speaking? It is the

kshhara-purushha. Why does the kshhara-purushha feel the

hurt? Because it has identified itself with the BMI.

Therefore it becomes the ‘bhoktA’ the experiencer.

 

Not only do I feel the hurt, but I flare up at the other

person. Who is this I that is flaring up now? It is again

the kshhara-purushha.  Why does the kshhara-purushha flare

up? Because it has identified itself with the BMI. As a

consequence of this identification, it not only experiences

the hurt, but falls into the trap of the gang of krodha

(anger) and ahamkAra (ego)  and flares back. So it becomes

the ‘kartA’ (doer).

 

What does the Lord say on this now? He says there are two

purushhas – kshhara and akshhara. The akshhara is never

hurt and can never be hurt, says He.

“acchedyoyam adAhyoyam akledyo’shoshhya eva ca” (II – 24).

“This cannot be cut into pieces; this cannot be burnt; this

cannot be tainted; this cannot be dried”.

 

So He says: “My dear Arjuna, You (the kshhara-purushha /

JIva) are wrongly identifying yourself with this BMI. Don’t

do this. Identify yourself with the akshhara-purushha

within you. Then there will be no hurt. Only Happiness”

 

This is the bottom line. This is the essential

philosophical content of the entire teaching of the Gita.

This is the message of all spiritual teaching.

 

To assimilate this teaching into practical life, which

means to learn to detach the mind from its associations

with the non-Self, one has to start from simple things.

Like the example of somebody pinching you, as in the above

discussion.  Let us learn to take every happening lightly.

The Mother (of Aurobindo Ashram)  says: Don’t you watch a

street-scuffle through your window, without being affected

by it?  Learn to watch the goings-on in the mind in the

same maner.  Well, it is easier said than done. But that is

our goal. We have to practise it in every happening to us.

Somebody next door insults us.  Somebody in our own

household misinterprets a statement of ours in the most

undesirable way. After the first few attempts to correct

this, learn to be immune and unaffected.  Lean back on the

Lord’s teaching that You are not the kshara-purusha who

associates with these happenings  to the BMI.

 

Not identifying with the intellect means not succumbing to

the so-called ‘rationale’ of the intellect when its logic

questions the supremeness of the Akshara-purusha and tends

to identify with the body and mind almost imperceptibly.

This imperceptible identification is what the intellect

does (and justifies) with all its scholarship and

smartness. We have to use the intellect itself to sort this

out in our own mind. This is the most difficult part. Well

this is where we need the intervention of the Guru and all

the spiritual teachings that we can absorb through

Sat-sangh.

 

PraNAms to all advaitins.

profvk

[Guest guest]

Namaste Prof Ji,

Thanks for your detailed explanation. That was very clear.

Lakshmi

 

"V. Krishnamurthy" <profvk > wrote:

Namaste.

 

Shri Lakshmi Jayaram-ji, in a private correspondence, in

reference to my post #31652, writes as follows: “You

mentioned about the attitude of "I am not the experiencer".

How should this idea be assimilated ? Also I have learnt

the concept of I am not the BMI, that I am consciousness.

How to detach from the mind ? What is the right way to

understand this concept for life ? Also what does it mean

to not identify with the intellect ?”

 

Lakshmi-ji, your questions are three:

1. How to assimilate the idea of ‘I am not the

experiencer’?

2. How to detach from the mind and be a witness of the

mind? And what is the right manner in which this concept

can be made practical for use?

3. What is the meaning of not identifying with the

intellect?

 

These are substantial questions. I don’t think I can

answer these questions fully and honestly. ‘Honestly’,

because, your questions 1 and 2 can be rightly answered

only by a sthita-prajna or ‘jnAni’. With these disclaimers

let me venture into some kind of answering. I am sure there

are more enlightened minds on this list and they will help

us.

 

“na ahaM bhoktA” (I am not the experiencer) is a constant

refrain in advaita writings and teachings. In all the

different appearances of the JIva, though it takes

different bodies, the same mind sticks on to it. (XV – 7,

8). In each such life of the JIva, the mind accumulates

vAsanAs and samskAras that go on with it into succeeding

lives. It is these vAsanAs that give a character to the

mind. This character is a mixture of satva, rajas and

tamas.

 

Without BMI the JIva cannot express itself as an

individual. Without the sentient JIva, mind is just inert

matter. But when it sticks on to the JIva in the latter’s

physical expression through BMI, it gets sentience. Now the

JIva interacts with the universe of matter as well as with

the other living beings. But even this interaction has to

take place only through the medium of the BMI.

 

This is therefore a seemingly endless play of the sentient

Consciousness within and the insentient universe of matter

outside through the medium of the BMI. This is the

cit-jaDa-granthi that Ramana Maharshi talks about. The

sentient Consciousness within, which is nothing but a spark

of the parAshakti, is called Purushha. Everything else,

including the interaction with other beings, is of course

prakRti. This interplay of Purushha and prakRti is what

constitutes our passage through life.

 

Now the Lord says: There are two Purushhas. (15.16)

 

They are kshhara-purushha (the perishable purushha) and

akshara-purushha (the imperishable purushha). The kshhara

is the familiar JIva. It is expressing itself through the

BMI. But in so expressing itself, it invariably makes the

mistake of thinking it is just BMI and nothing more. In

other words, the kshhara-purushha commits the colossal

error of identifying itself with the BMI. This colossal

error is called ‘anAdi avidyA’ (Beginningless Ignorance).

And here starts all the problems of life. All the pleasure

and pain, ups and downs, light and darkness, good and bad,

that the BMI suffers through, are mistakenly assumed by the

kshhara-purushha as its own experiences. Not only this. All

the actions of the BMI are also appropriated by the

kshhara. Thus arises the common expressions: ‘I am the doer

(kartA)’ and ‘I am the experiencer (bhoktA)’.

 

The kshara purushha is involved in the actions of Nature.

He reflects the varied workings of the Gunas of prakRti.

He is saguNa, personal. He associates himself with the

doings of prakRti and thinks he is the doer. He identifies

himself with the play of personality and clouds his

self-knowledge with the ego-sense in PrakRti so that he

thinks himself as the ego-doer of works. (III - 27):

 

Some one pinches my body. It hurts. Who feels this hurt? I

feel the hurt. Who is this I that is speaking? It is the

kshhara-purushha. Why does the kshhara-purushha feel the

hurt? Because it has identified itself with the BMI.

Therefore it becomes the ‘bhoktA’ the experiencer.

 

Not only do I feel the hurt, but I flare up at the other

person. Who is this I that is flaring up now? It is again

the kshhara-purushha. Why does the kshhara-purushha flare

up? Because it has identified itself with the BMI. As a

consequence of this identification, it not only experiences

the hurt, but falls into the trap of the gang of krodha

(anger) and ahamkAra (ego) and flares back. So it becomes

the ‘kartA’ (doer).

 

What does the Lord say on this now? He says there are two

purushhas – kshhara and akshhara. The akshhara is never

hurt and can never be hurt, says He.

“acchedyoyam adAhyoyam akledyo’shoshhya eva ca” (II – 24).

“This cannot be cut into pieces; this cannot be burnt; this

cannot be tainted; this cannot be dried”.

 

So He says: “My dear Arjuna, You (the kshhara-purushha /

JIva) are wrongly identifying yourself with this BMI. Don’t

do this. Identify yourself with the akshhara-purushha

within you. Then there will be no hurt. Only Happiness”

 

This is the bottom line. This is the essential

philosophical content of the entire teaching of the Gita.

This is the message of all spiritual teaching.

 

To assimilate this teaching into practical life, which

means to learn to detach the mind from its associations

with the non-Self, one has to start from simple things.

Like the example of somebody pinching you, as in the above

discussion. Let us learn to take every happening lightly.

The Mother (of Aurobindo Ashram) says: Don’t you watch a

street-scuffle through your window, without being affected

by it? Learn to watch the goings-on in the mind in the

same maner. Well, it is easier said than done. But that is

our goal. We have to practise it in every happening to us.

Somebody next door insults us. Somebody in our own

household misinterprets a statement of ours in the most

undesirable way. After the first few attempts to correct

this, learn to be immune and unaffected. Lean back on the

Lord’s teaching that You are not the kshara-purusha who

associates with these happenings to the BMI.

 

Not identifying with the intellect means not succumbing to

the so-called ‘rationale’ of the intellect when its logic

questions the supremeness of the Akshara-purusha and tends

to identify with the body and mind almost imperceptibly.

This imperceptible identification is what the intellect

does (and justifies) with all its scholarship and

smartness. We have to use the intellect itself to sort this

out in our own mind. This is the most difficult part. Well

this is where we need the intervention of the Guru and all

the spiritual teachings that we can absorb through

Sat-sangh.

 

PraNAms to all advaitins.

profvk