More on Gaurava

[Guest guest]

Krishna as the guru told them to GO. As the Antaryami he told them to stay.

[Kripamoya]

Jagat said:

 

It is a question of adhikara, and lobha gives the adhikara. As with all human endeavors, by making the leap of faith, one gets the benefit. Without the leap, one will never know.

 

Nobody can argue that.

But, lobha must have a qualifier.

The qualifier is intense and exclusive service to the spiritual master.

 

Studying the Vaishnava canon endlessly without a genuine commitment to a life of sacrifice and service to the spiritual master will not get anyone to the perfect stage.

 

Serving the spiritual master with sacrifice and hardship is the proof that the lobha is genuine, not just a lot of wishful thinking and book reading.

 

The Saraswata creedo is sacrifice, sacrifice, sacrifice.

 

There is so much more to sacrifice and service to the spiritual master than just learning philosophy and trying to be better than everybody else.

 

People know sacrifice and service when they see it.

 

Serve the spiritual master till you collapse.

Reading books is not the test of lobha.

 

Service to the spiritual master.

That is genuine lobha.

 

Service will give you prema.

Strong, consistant, unbreaking, sacrificing service.

 

Don't fool yourself.

If you want prema, then you must pay a very high price.

 

You can't get your hand out of the cookie jar if you have a handful of cookies.

 

Let go of the cookies and you will be free.

 

Hardworking, sacrificing devotees who are committed to serving the spiritual master can never be fooled with this bookworm bhakti process.

[shiva]

 

Of course, this objection is to be expected. Just see how you use the term "monkey" to describe these babajis. I am sure the "monkey babajis" are all going to hell.

 

I have no idea about any group of people. I cannot speak of a class of people. Everyone will have to answer for their spiritual life before God. Sexuality is an aspect of human life. A philosophy that says sexuality is fundamentally against spiritual life is making a statement that denies humanity. The assumption that any Vaishnava who has taken a female companion is automatically a monkey is prejudicial in the extreme and shows that you are a victim of propaganda.

 

A society that has prejudices against all forms of human sexuality except for its procreative function tends to create an unnatural state of affairs in the most important areas of individual affective and physical need. Sexuality is obviously a complex area of human psychology, prone to corruption and misuse, but to make its denial the summum bonum of human spiritual achievement is simply wrong. To make hearing and chanting about Radha and Krishna somehow dependent on attaining this obscure and rarified state is, as I said, a bit of elitism that leads to sexism and all kinds of other nonsense. In fact, it may well be this attitude that creates the "monkey babajis."

 

Then why was Sri Caitanya so strict about celibacy? Look Jagat what you are saying is nothing new, people lile Rajneesh make the same arguments as do other yogis including vaisnavas who claim to follow the path of Mahapabhu. So the question is; if you and they are right then why is celibacy promoted not only in the gaudiya tradition but in many other vaisnava traditions as well? Are they all deviating from the true message of Vedanta?

 

The teaching on celibacy isn't that one's spiritual status is equal to one's level of celibacy (even if some people consider that to be true), it's that sexuality has the power to take one's time and energy away from the higher pursuit. Just like the person who is obese is told to stay away from sweets in order to get healthy. It's not that sweets are bad and that anyone who eats sweets is going to die of diabetes. The prohibition against sex is there to make spiritual advancement swift, just like the reouncing of sweets will make weight loss swifter. For a person who is serious about quickly attaining the higher level of God consciousness it is advised to give up other pursuits. If you don't give up sex you can still advance in spiritual understanding, but that path slows down the attaining of the highest realizations. Sex is like an addictive drug in that it leaves you wanting more and more and more. So the prohibition is there for those who have yet to attain to the highest level that they should be strict in their sense control. Those on the highest level have no rules nor regulations, they don't need them. Why? Once gaining entrance into the highest realm, once attaining the goal of bhakti, then nothing can bring you down and there is nowhere higher to attain. If someone who is on a lower level thinks that celibacy or any other sacrifice of sense enjoyment is unecessary, they still may advance on the spiritual path. Sravanam and Kirtanam will still aid that person in his or her development of spiritual realization, but the fact is that sense enjoyment is addicting. The more you have the more you want. Those who give up unecessary sense enjoyment will have more time and energy to devote to spiritual pursuits. It's that simple.

 

From the purport to Caitanya Caritamrta Madhya 8.221

 

 

In all, there are sixty-four items listed for the rendering of service unto Krsna, and these are the regulative principles enjoined in the sastras and given by the spiritual master. One has to serve Krsna according to these regulative principles, but if one develops spontaneous love for Krsna as exhibited in the activities of those who live in Vrajabhumi, one attains the platform of raganuga-bhakti. One who has developed this spontaneous love is eligible for elevation to the platform enjoyed by the inhabitants of Vrajabhumi. In Vrajabhumi, there are no regulative principles set forth for Krsna’s service. Rather, everything is carried out in spontaneous, natural love for Krsna. There is no question of following the principles of the Vedic system. Such principles are followed within this material world, and as long as one is on the material platform, he has to execute them. However, spontaneous love of Krsna is transcendental. It may seem that the regulative principles are being violated, but the devotee is on the transcendental platform. Such service is called gunatita, or nirguna, for it is not contaminated by the three modes of material nature.

 

Then again if you believe in a philosophy which uses sex as sadhana then these words will mean nothing to you. Jagat you follow the tantric sahajiya path, or so you have claimed? Fine. There may be some people who will be attracted to that and I guess that is why you are here preaching. The mainstream gaudiya tradition rejects that path, you know this. They're not going to change because someone tells them that sex is healthy and that celibacy is unhealthy.

[muralidhar_das]

Jagat it is true there are many wonderful things in the scriptures, such as Kaviraj Goswami's commentary to

 

ahus ca te nalina-nabha padaravindam

yogesvarair hrdi vicintyam agadha-bodhaih

samsara-kupa-patitottaranavalambam

geham jusam api manasy udiyat sada nah

But these are not things that people should discuss in chat sessions.

 

The highest acme of devotional life, and it becomes an item of discussion for people who are engaged in mudane life!

 

Even the rishis who are engaged for meditation in siddha-loka for aeons and aeons don't get to hear about the Name of Srimate. How many aenos will it be, before they hear the Gaura-sankirtana? Before they hear about how Sri Radhika has become a brahmana and become engaged in service of Tota-Gopinatha. As Gadadhara Pandit, the Absolute Being (one aspect of the five, the five aspects in Panca Tattva (bhakta-akhyam)) was told "You cannot go to Vrindaban" -- what degree of surrender, vipralambha and bliss was there in that Brahmana serving Tota Gopinath? Do the siddhas understand that? NO, The siddhas are all so exalted, so why should a worm like me think he has should have the ability to, like an epicure, dally in readings about aesthetic wonders such as madhura-rasa. Have I undestood how the brahmana serving in the Gaura-kirtan is feeling, when the brahmana in Gaura-lila is looking up towards the Vraja-lila on the slopes of Govardhana? Have I undestood the things the brahmana said, when he was reading bhagavatam and washing the words off the pages with the tears falling like a stream from those lotus eyes? I belong within the Sankirtan group who are Gaura-bhaktas and who are listening to the Gaura-kirtan. Somewhere in this group doing Gaura-kirtana there is that brahmana who serves Tota-Gopinatha. Should I go off to Radha-kunda when I know that brahmana is in Puri crying tears that flow like a river. Who is that Brahmana? Who am I? Should I go to a pancaratrika-mantra trader and get him to sell me a siddha-deha for a cheap price?

 

So many things are bubbling around in my mind.

 

It is best if I simply chant my prescribed number of rounds, concentrating on the sound (as my Guru taught) instead of trying to "picture" things with my mind.

 

Gaurahari bol!

[Kripamoya]

 

Jagat it is true there are many wonderful things in the scriptures, such as Kaviraj Goswami's commentary to

 

ahus ca te nalina-nabha padaravindam

yogesvarair hrdi vicintyam agadha-bodhaih

samsara-kupa-patitottaranavalambam

geham jusam api manasy udiyat sada nah

But these are not things that people should discuss in chat sessions.

 

The highest acme of devotional life, and it becomes an item of discussion for people who are engaged in mudane life!

 

Even the rishis who are engaged for meditation in siddha-loka for aeons and aeons don't get to hear about the Name of Srimate. How many aenos will it be, before they hear the Gaura-sankirtana? Before they hear about how Sri Radhika has become a brahmana and become engaged in service of Tota-Gopinatha. As Gadadhara Pandit, the Absolute Being (one aspect of the five, the five aspects in Panca Tattva (bhakta-akhyam)) was told "You cannot go to Vrindaban" -- what degree of surrender, vipralambha and bliss was there in that Brahmana serving Tota Gopinath? Do the siddhas understand that? NO, The siddhas are all so exalted, so why should a worm like me think he has should have the ability to, like an epicure, dally in readings about aesthetic wonders such as madhura-rasa. Have I undestood how the brahmana serving in the Gaura-kirtan is feeling, when the brahmana in Gaura-lila is looking up towards the Vraja-lila on the slopes of Govardhana? Have I undestood the things the brahmana said, when he was reading bhagavatam and washing the words off the pages with the tears falling like a stream from those lotus eyes? I belong within the Sankirtan group who are Gaura-bhaktas and who are listening to the Gaura-kirtan. Somewhere in this group doing Gaura-kirtana there is that brahmana who serves Tota-Gopinatha. Should I go off to Radha-kunda when I know that brahmana is in Puri crying tears that flow like a river. Who is that Brahmana? Who am I? Should I go to a pancaratrika-mantra trader and get him to sell me a siddha-deha for a cheap price?

 

So many things are bubbling around in my mind.

 

It is best if I simply chant my prescribed number of rounds, concentrating on the sound (as my Guru taught) instead of trying to "picture" things with my mind.

 

Gaurahari bol!

 

[Kripamoya]

Jagat says:

 

How then can I consider as an ultimate authority a person who states that he never read Rupa Goswami's most important contribution, Ujjvala-nilamani?

 

Unlike the modern voyeurs of today, Sridhar Maharaja was not a PEEPING TOM to intrude into the most elevated descriptions of Ujjvala-nilamani.

 

Without proper adhikar, to intrude into those topics amounts to no more than voyeurism.

 

 

There is not much difference between intruding into the conjugal affairs of the divine couple by reading Ujjvala-nilamani and these guys in high rise apartments with binoculars looking at people in a bedroom in the building across the street.

[SishirSaha]

Jagat I saw your comments directed to me. I've been reading this discussion carefully. But I don't feel I should make any comments myself at this time.

[Guest guest]

Seems there is a balance in approaching Srila Rupa Gosvami's books that neither denies the ultimate goal of raga marga and simultaneously does not cheapen the approach to that prayojana by minmizing the adhikara required for genuinely approaching its actual practice.

 

D. An interview with Sripad Madhava Maharaja

 

Sripad Bhaktivedanta Madhava Maharaja is a disciple of Srila Bhaktivedanta Vamana Gosvami Maharaja. He is a siksa disciple of Srila Bhaktivedanta Narayana Gosvami Maharaja, and has been his personal servant and secretary since 1979. In the following interview of May 4, 2006, he was asked to share his understanding regarding statement 3 of the video/documentary:

 

[Question:] "The narrator of the documentary 'The Universal Teacher' quoted Srila Sarasvati Thakura Prabhupada's verse, 'matala hari-jane visaya range, pujala raga-patha gaurava-bhange.' Then he gave the translation, 'Always worship the path of raga-marga, spontaneous devotion. Do not rush ahead. Keep yourself a little distant and below. One who transgresses these instructions will be cast down. That was the motto of Gaudiya Matha.'

 

"Can you explain the verse further?"

 

[sripad Madhava Maharaja:] "The English you quoted is not the translation. It is a statement by Prapujya-carana Bhakti Raksaka Sridhara Maharaja. He did not mean for his statement to be the translation."

 

[Question:] "Then what is the translation?"

 

[sripad Madhava Maharaja:] "'Pujala raga-patha gaurava bhange.' Raga-patha means spontaneous devotion. What is spontaneous devotion?

 

iste svarasiki ragah

paramavistata bhavet

tan-mayi ya bhaved bhaktih

satra ragatmikodita

 

["When one becomes attached to the Supreme Personality of Godhead, his natural inclination to love is fully absorbed in thoughts of the Lord. That is called transcendental attachment, and devotional service according to that attachment is called ragatmika, or spontaneous devotional service." (Bhakti-rasamrta-sindhu 1.2.272, and Sri Caitanya-caritamrta, Madhya-lila 22.150)]

 

 

 

"Raga-bhakti is the devotion situated in the hearts of the eternal associates of Krsna in Vraja. Here, the word gaurava-bhange refers to the breaking (bhange means break) of the awe and reverence mood (gaurava) by raga-bhakti. The word matala means complete absorption. Such liberated devotees have only one visaya (object of love), and that is Sri Krsna. The word range refers to Sri Krsna's many pastimes. Hari-jana means those who are the kith and kin or intimate associates of Sri Hari or Krsna. They are absorbed in visaya-range. Sri Krsna is the only visaya (the supreme Enjoyer of His devotees' devotion), and all others are asraya (the repository or container of devotion to Him). These devotees are absorbed in His pastimes.

 

"Because of the raga in their hearts, they have no awe and reverence mood. In this world they worship raga-patha; that is, the path of complete absorption in and attachment to Sri Krsna. By this they also teach us how to enter and then practice raganuga-bhakti.

 

"Why do we want to worship this path? We are now aspiring sadhaka-jivas, and our ultimate object is to attain raga-bhakti. For that we have to go step by step. By following the correct process we will gradually enter raganuga-bhakti, and then we will attain raga-bhakti."

 

*****************************************

 

"Sarasvati Thakura's caution was:

 

matala hari-jane visaya range

pujala raga patha gaurava bange

 

'Always worship the path of raga-marga, spontaneous devotion. Do not rush ahead. Keep yourself a little distant and below. One who transgresses these instructions will be cast down.' That was the motto of Gaudiya Matha."

 

Appreciation:

 

It was not mentioned by the documentary narrator, but it is stated on one of Sripad Narasingha Maharaja's websites that this statement is quoted from Srila Sridhara Maharaja's explanation of a poem by Srila Sarasvati Thakura.

 

Srila Sridhara Maharaja did not intend his statement to be the translation of the verse. His explanation given here focuses on the phrase "pujala raga-patha," indicating that the path of raga is worthy of our worship. The implication of this idea is that one can gain a genuine entrance into raga-marga only by mercy from above. There is no other way.

 

Such mercy will not descend upon those who proudly think themselves qualified, but upon those who, realizing their ineligibility, humbly worship raga-marga from a lower position.

 

It goes without saying that in practice it is impossible to worship something that you are absolutely forbidden to hear, speak or read about. So there must also be a preliminary stage before raga-marga proper wherein one is exposed, in a limited capacity, to the tenets of raga-marga. The rate of exposure is to be determined on an individual basis by one's self-realized Guru."

[Guest guest]

 

Srila Sridhara Maharaja did not intend his statement to be the translation of the verse.

 

How does Madhava Maharaja know this? Did he ever approach Srila Sridhara Maharaja and ask Srila Sridhara Maharaja about this?

[Guest guest]

What is that on top of Govardhana, Sri Caitanya Saraswat Math?

 

pramada-madana-lilah kandare kandare te

racayati nava-yunor-dvandvam asminn-amandam

iti kila kalanartham lagna-kastad-dvayor me

nija-nikata-nivasam dehi govardhana! tvam

 

["Oh Govardhana! Please grant me a dwelling near your side so that I can easily witness and serve the youthful lovers Sri Radha-Krsna as They perform newer and newer secret, amorous lilas within your many caves where They become completely maddened from drinking prema. You are present and making everything possible."] (Sri Govardhana-Vasa-Prarthana-Dasakam, verse 2 by Srila Raghunatha dasa Gosvami)

 

"Oh Govardhana, Sri Sri Radha and Krsna are playing in your groves. Be pleased with us. Please give us your mercy so that we can always have the fortune to see that Radha and Krsna are playing in your kunjas. Be merciful so that we can be in Govardhana. Oh Govardhana, be pleased. Give a place where, under your guidance, we can see the sweet pastimes of Radha and Krsna. We want to be maidservants of Srimati Radhika. We don't want anything else. Please remove all our worldly desires. O Govardhana, this is our prayer."

[shiva]

Regardless of what was meant the point that I see which is worthy is that the *true* raga marga is not something which you should or even can whimsically decide to follow. Raga marga is something which is organic to the bhakta, it is not an artificial imposition, not that one decides "Oh I think I will be a raganuga bhakta now" and then presto he becomes a true follower of the raga marga. That's not how the raga marga is introduced to the bhakta. People who don't understand the raga marga and who seek to advance themselves by their own willpower simply are deluded when they think their smaranam on asta kaliya lila is anything remotely similar to the real raga marga.

 

The real raga marga is not something which you can enter, it is given directly to you by the Lord when you are ready, when you can see the Lord within. Anyone who considers that reading about the descriptions of rasa in books like Ujjvala-nilamani to be some kind of rite of passage or essential component of the raga marga, they are exposing themselves as being clueless when it comes to the real raga marga. There is nothing essentially bad or wrong about those types of books, nor are they particularly vastly more intimate then numerous other gaudiya writings. The reason that book and some others were pointed out as something to avoid by recent past acaryas is because they are trying to make a point. Those people who champion the faux raga marga cite those works as all important and as some kind of rite of passage or secret initiation necessary for the raga marga when in truth those writings are no such thing. What they do seem to inspire in some people is faux emotional states, false bhava, narcissism masquerading as enlightenment. So the point the acaryas made was in stating that those writings can only be misunderstood by those unqualified to read them who have a propensity for seeing themselves on a higher level of bhakti then they are really on. And as we have seen this has been playing out all over the gaudiya world.

[muralidhar_das]

bahu-bhagye keha sei dughasvada paya

chidananda-deha labhi krsna-loka yaya

"Sometimes, by great fortune, someone will get to taste the water of Govinda Kunda as the milk of Surabhi, the divine cow, attain a transcendental form, and go to Krishna Loka."

 

From the Sri Govinda Kunda Mahima, translation by Srila Govinda Maharaj

[Guest guest]

No, that was not me. I was mulling over responses to Kshamabuddhi's and Shiva's posts.

[Guest guest]

Srila Govinda Maharaja told that this is Srila Saraswati Thakur's original verse:

matala hari-jane visaya range

pujala raja patha gaurava bange

Srila Sridhar Maharaja changed it to:

matala hari-jane kirtana range

pujala raga patha gaurava bange

Notice that in Srila Saraswati Thakur's original version he uses the phrase "raja patha" rather than "raga patha". According to Srila Govinda Maharaja "raja patha" means the king of paths, which implies raga patha. There Srila Sridhar Maharaja followed the system of commenting on the previous acarya's verse by changing in slightly to bring out the deeper or more relevant meanings. Srila Sridhar Maharaja is bringing out the relevant meaning for his audience. To assume that there is another angle of vision in Srila Saraswati Thakur's verse that is also there is not offensive to Srila Sridhar Maharaja in and of itself. Many of those in the Narayana Maharaja camp do not have much familiarity with Srila Sridhar Maharaja's teachings although I am aware that there are significant exceptions. Thus when those persons on the plea that "guru is one" suddenly feel the need to analyze Srila Sridhar Maharaja's composition may receive, accordingly a negative response. But negative responses are what is too often showing up on the internet in the name of the Sri Caitanya Saraswat Math. The Sri Caitanya Saraswat Math certainly has a big and wonderful devotional world existing within it, and it IS quite wonderful. It's time to show this side on the forums and web sites that devotees from other camps visit. I think that Muralidhar Prabhu is now doing this very thing and deserves some recognition.

I only wish that Sripad Bhakti Sudhir Goswami Maharaja would take the same tact. He's been calling "a spade a spade" for most of the time that he has been back in his sanyasa from the nether regions and I hope that he too can share the positve teachings of Srila Sridhar Maharaja and his successor Srila Govinda Maharaja with those in other camps through the internet. Other wise another sabbatical from sanyasa and a return trip to the underworld could very likely be the result and none of us would want to see it again. We missed him too much the first time. Sorry for being anonomous but...

[muralidhar_das]

I can say one thing for sure. The person who wrote the statement above has no connection whatsoever with Srila Bhakti Sundar Govinda Maharaj.

[Kripamoya]

Sridhar Maharaja didn't read Ujjvala-nilamani.

 

But, on an occasion of making pilgrimage to Ekachakra, Lord Nityananda appeared to him and instructed him to begin giving initiations.

 

Sridhar Maharaja was a self-realized maha-bhagavat.

He didn't believe that reading the most confidential writings of the Goswamis was a qualifier for attaining prema.

 

He understood that it was sacrifice and service.

Part of his sacrifice was to resist certain books of the goswamis.

 

It paid off.

Sridhar Maharaja didn't have to play around with some mentally conceived siddha-deha like a dimestore superhero doll.

[Jahnava Nitai Das]

All guests participating in this thread need to choose a name or nickname and sign it at the bottom of their posts so people can identify which posts belong to which person. Any posts without any identifier will be removed from now on for this particular thread.

[muralidhar_das]

Jagat,

 

I have decided I won't be looking back at this page again.

 

If you want to continue this conversation you can contact me at sydney {at} scsmath.com

[Shakti-Fan]

 

I can say one thing for sure. The person who wrote the statement above has no connection whatsoever with Srila Bhakti Sundar Govinda Maharaj.

Let's just say that he/she doesn't have a recent connection, otherwise he would know that Srila Bhakti Sundar Govinda Maharaja is actually behind Bhakti Sudhir Goswami's most recent article on Narayana Maharaja. Despite his correct assessment Muralidhar's approach is quite harsh on this devotee, but he won't read this post because he (Muralidhar) left the kitchen because the fire is too hot.

[Beggar]

 

Sridhar Maharaja didn't read Ujjvala-nilamani.

 

But, on an occasion of making pilgrimage to Ekachakra, Lord Nityananda appeared to him and instructed him to begin giving initiations.

 

Sridhar Maharaja was a self-realized maha-bhagavat.

He didn't believe that reading the most confidential writings of the Goswamis was a qualifier for attaining prema.

 

He understood that it was sacrifice and service.

Part of his sacrifice was to resist certain books of the goswamis.

 

It paid off.

Sridhar Maharaja didn't have to play around with some mentally conceived siddha-deha like a dimestore superhero doll.

You are is assuming that Srila Sridhar Maharaja reavealed his entire realisation and experience to the general devotee class. Given his nature and conception, I'm not so sure about this.

[Kripamoya]

 

You are is assuming that Srila Sridhar Maharaja reavealed his entire realisation and experience to the general devotee class. Given his nature and conception, I'm not so sure about this.

I guess you are trying to say that Sridhar Maharaja got siddha-pranali from Saraswati Goswami?

Otherwise, I don't see how I are appear to assuming anything.

 

Sridhar Maharaja said emphatically that "we are not believers in that".

 

I think he made it quite clear about his position on the siddha-pranali concept.

[Guest guest]

 

You are is assuming that Srila Sridhar Maharaja reavealed his entire realisation and experience to the general devotee class. Given his nature and conception, I'm not so sure about this.

 

Sridhar Maharaj gave sannyas to Kesava Maharaj.

 

Would Kesava Maharaj (who we know DID receive his siddha-identity from Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakur, as did a few other known disciples like Kunjada) have accepted sannyas from someone with lesser realization than his own?

 

Sridhar Maharaj was, by his own admission, posted as the "gatekeeper" to madhurya-bhakti. His mission was to keep out the unqualified. So, by definition, he did not share his full realization with the general devotee class.

 

Yet, by dint of his giving sannyas to Kesava Maharaj, we can understand that both of these devotees had received the highest realizations from their gurudeva.

 

Sridhar Maharaj was also bhakta-vatsala. He was extraordinarily merciful to fallen devotees, and went to great lengths to engage them in service. When Jayatirtha Prabhu had fallen from sannyas, Sridhar Maharaj happily re-engaged him as a sannyasi. Yes, even fallen sannyasis were given maximum mercy by Sridhar Maharaj. This does not mean, however, that he shared with any of those fallen-and-re-engaged sannyasis the fullness of his own personal Krishna conception. Obviously he kept his most intimate realizations to be shared quietly with godbrothers and godnephews who had remained fixed up for their whole devotional lives.

[raga]

"Some ignorant people say that there is no siddha-pranali in the Gaudiya Matha. This vicious propaganda is erroneous in all respects. In the authentic literature written by Srila Gopala Bhatta Gosvami entitled Sat-kriya-sara-dipika and Samskara-dipika, which is a supplement to Sri Hari-bhakti-vilasa, there is an account of the tridandi-sannyasa samskara. . . . In this sannyasa samskara, dor-kaupina, bahir-vasa and the sannyasamantra for taking shelter of gopi-bhava are also given. The eka-dasa-bhava (eleven aspects of gopi-bhava), namely sambandha, vayah, nama, rupa, yutha, vesa, ajna, vasa, seva, parakashta-svasa and palya-dasi-bhava, are contained within this gopibhava. The identity of the siddha-deha is determined by the instructions of Sri Guru in accordance with the ruci of the sadhaka. One’s own nama, rupa, vayasa, vesa, sambandha, yutha, ajna, vasa, parakashta-svasa and palya-dasi bhava given by guru is called siddha-pranali."

 

-- B.V. Narayana Maharaja in the 4th chapter of Prabandha-pancakam

 

An interesting related note is to be found in Bhakti Vikasa Swami's upcoming title on the life of Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati:

 

Out of around ten thousand initiated disciples, he gave thirteen babaji initiations. Jyotisekhara recalls some of their names: Bhaktisvarupa Puri Goswami; Tirtha Goswami; Bhaktisaranga Maharaja, etc. They were so absorbed in bhajan that even when it was time for eating they were unaware.

...

Sarasvati Thakur gave trija (third birth), or manjari-svarupa (siddha-svarupa), to thirteen of his disciples; not all at once, but at different times, according to the rules given in Sat Kriya Sara Dipika - a book by Gopal Bhatta Goswami, which describes the different rituals for Vaishnava rites. Their samadhis were also made according to Sat Kriya Sara Dipika. Some of the samadhis are at Mayapur, and some at the Radha Damodar temple in Vrndavan. Some were grhasthas and some were tyagis. Since that time, in our line (Sarasvati Thakura's line), no one has given this trija.

. . .

He warned his babaji disciples not to tell their manjari svarup to others. They would stay in the Mathas, in the three dhamas of Vrndavan, Navadvip, and Puri, and attend all the temple functions, such as lectures and kirtans, but they themselves would not give lectures in the temple. They would go for bhiksa (begging for alms) and go outside for nagar sankirtan. They wouldn't go for preaching and most of their time would be spent in bhajan. Sometimes they would help with the Deity worship, or arcana.

 

Perhaps Sridhar Maharaj wasn't among them -- I couldn't say. Of interest is also the fact that...

 

Srila Govinda Maharaj received "siddha-pranali" from his father, Sri Nitaipada Dasadhikari, a Guru in the "Nityananda Vamsa".

 

-- Muralidhar Das @ 04/15/05 07:34 PM, Audarya-Fellowship

[Admin5]

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[Kripamoya]

 

He warned his babaji disciples not to tell their manjari svarup to others. They would stay in the Mathas, in the three dhamas of Vrndavan, Navadvip, and Puri, and attend all the temple functions, such as lectures and kirtans, but they themselves would not give lectures in the temple. They would go for bhiksa (begging for alms) and go outside for nagar sankirtan. They wouldn't go for preaching and most of their time would be spent in bhajan. Sometimes they would help with the Deity worship, or arcana.

somehow that sounds a little different than Jagat's hanging around Lalita Prasad for a few days, getting his manjari-svarupa and then coming back to Canada to get married and preach siddha-pranali from his job as a half-baked college teacher.