Vaikuntha

[Guest guest]

Thank you for quotations, Visista-ji.

 

>But from the point of view of devotees in Goloka Vrindavana or some

>raganuga practitioners such knowledge of the Lord's majesty is in itself a

>contamination because it is considered to be antagonistic to their

>absorbtion in the Lord's madhurya aspect.

 

Just as the knowledge of Krsna's madhurya is considered an aberration by

Vaikunthavasis -- as shown in Brhad-bhagavatamrta when Gopa Kumara started

glorifying Krsna in Vaikuntha. The Vaikunthavasis though it highly

inappropriate, however even that impropriety intensified their bhava towards

Narayana.

 

As one senior Vaisnava very well put it:

 

"In Goloka the Gaudiyas will think of Krsna as their friend or lover and

that Narayana is God. Thus, in the end the Gaudiyas and Madhvas agree in the

sense that from the vantage point of their bhava in Goloka the Gaudiyas

accept Narayana as the Supreme God and Krsna, who is their lover or friend,

as subordinate to Narayana. Still, they love Krsna more, and who can deny

that Krsna is more charming?"

 

Looks like the idea that the impure devotees go to Vaikuntha partially stems

from the famous verse:

 

SB 3.29.13

 

salokya-sarsti-samipya-

sarupyaikatvam apy uta

diyamanam na grhnanti

vina mat-sevanam janah

 

A pure devotee does not accept any kind of liberation—salokya, sarsti,

samipya, sarupya or ekatva—even though they are offered by the Supreme

Personality of Godhead.

 

 

in combination with Rupa Goswami's statement in BRS you have just quoted:

 

yathoktam pancaratre –

 

mahatmya-jnana-purvas tu sudrdhah sarvato’dhikah

sneho bhaktir iti proktas taya sarsty-adi nanyatha

 

"The affection which is very strong and exceeds everything else in all

respects and which is connected to the knowledge of greatness of the Lord

(mahatmya-jnana-prema) is called bhakti and by such love a devotee attains

one of the four kinds of liberation in Vaikuntha. There is no other means to

attain such liberation."

 

which may make one erroneously conclude that those who are not pure devotees

end up in Vaikuntha. Actually, devotees just get those 4 (5) types of

liberation as "add-ons" to their reestalished eternal relations with Krsna

or Narayana, even without aspiring for them.

 

Your servant,

Madana-mohana das

[Guest guest]

At 07:21 30/07/2006, Madana-mohana MG they said to all of us:

I read the contents carefully, and submit my reply

 

> >Vaikuntha is also transcendental place, but the mood of awe and reverence

> >is there.But its not that one can enter it as long on is impure.Its also

> >completely transcendental, but according to rasa its not so intimate.

 

I think what I should have written, is, if ones devotional service is

incomplete, not "impure", however I am still struggling to find out

where I read it. So I think I have not properly remembered what I read.

 

Thank you both for your input so far.

 

 

 

 

Your servant,

 

 

Ananta Purusottama das.

[Guest guest]

What I am wondering from reading below, is who are those devotees who

would attain the types of liberation offered, at what stage of

devotional service?

 

 

There are different kinds of salvation. There is salokya liberation, to

live on the same planet as the Supreme Lord. The residents of the

Vaikuntha planets live on the same planet as the Supreme Personality of

Godhead. Sarsti liberation means to have almost the same opulence as

Narayana. The liberated individual soul can appear just like Narayana,

with four hands, the four emblems, almost the same bodily features, the

same opulence, the same ornaments, the same buildings, everything. Sarupya

means to have the same form or features. Samipya means never to be far

away but always to be associated with the Supreme Lord. For example, just

as we are sitting together, so one can associate with the Lord. This is

called samipya-mukti, the liberation of being nearer.

 

"Pure devotees", however, do not accept these various forms of

liberation. They only want

to be engaged in Krsna's service. Does this imply some are "impure",

or tainted I wonder?

 

 

 

They are not concerned with any kind of liberation. Those who are

actually Krsna conscious achieve the association of the Supreme Lord,

but they do not desire it; their only ambition is to

be engaged in the transcendental loving service of the Lord. The highest

perfection of devotional service, or Krsna consciousness, is exhibited

when a devotee refuses to accept any benediction or profit from the

Supreme Lord. Prahlada Maharaja was offered whatever he liked, he had only

to ask for it, but he said, "My Lord, I am Your eternal servant. It is my

duty to serve You, so how can I accept any benefit from it? Then I would

not be Your servant; I would be a merchant." He replied in that way, and

that is the sign of a pure person. Krsna is so kind that He fulfills all

the desires of a devotee, even if he wants material benedictions. If at

the bottom of the devotee's heart there is some desire, He also fulfills

that. He is so kind. But the sublime position of bhakti-yoga, or

devotional service, is that a pure devotee refuses to accept the various

kinds of liberation, even if offered by the Supreme Lord.