Guest guest Posted August 22, 2006 Report Share Posted August 22, 2006 "Although the distinctions are often ignored or blurred, it can be observed that there is more than one "I" in Awareness. While some current Nondualists point almost exclusively to the separative "I" logic which creates a sense of separation (I versus other), Nisargadatta Maharaj also speaks of the "I Am" and going beyond the "I Am," and Ramana Maharshi speaks of the "I-I." As we grow from childhood to adulthood, it is normal to develop a strong sense of a separate self (ego) that seems to stand apart from all else. When we refer to ourselves or say "I," we unconsciously assume and include a complex set of identifications and memories (I am this), such as our name, body, family, education, career, personal history, and so on. But, through persistent self-inquiry and observation, it can be seen that the sense of a separate "I" does not exist except as a concept. It is nothing more than an illusory, fuzzy, abstract reference point in Awareness. Moreover, it is accompanied by a supporting logic which interprets all events as happening to that reference point. In other words, the "I" logic always interprets events as happening to a centralized "me" rather than just happening in the field of Awareness. That false interpretation creates a veil of separation, an illusion of "me" versus other. In the minimalist description of enlightenment adopted by many Nondualists, enlightenment means undermining that separative "I" logic through a deep understanding of it. The undermining of it reveals that you have never been separate from the world. It reveals that you are the world and that reality, here and now, just as it is, is your own Self. The revelation can be described as a shift in consciousness from identifying with the illusion of a separate self to identifying with the all-inclusive Self. But, as the term suggests, the "Self" is itself an "I." Although it is spacious, all-inclusive and de-centralized, the Self expresses itself assertively as "I Am." It is, in fact, the real you expressing itself through a body-mind as the self-evident certainty that it (you) exists.. Some call it Presence and may describe it further as creative, intelligent energy, because the "I Am" includes both the creation and the recognition of the world as one's Self. In its creative aspect, and as expressed through a body-mind, it is an act of individualization (sometimes called "Atman"), a personal expression of Self which arises from the Heart. The "I Am" is also an inseparable part of the "I-I" continuity that Ramana Maharshi refers to when he points out that the Self shines in the Heart as "I-I." The other part of the "I-I" is the impersonal Self, and it is also what Nisargadatta Maharaj refers to as beyond "I Am." Through further self-inquiry, observation, and reversal of the mind's exteriorization, the "I Am" dissolves back into the Heart, into nameless, indescribable, ineffable, impersonal being (Brahman), the "I" of Awareness without attributes. This impersonal "I" is the true and pure Witness, or Awareness, that is always present, shining through creation, but prior to creation. As mentioned previously, all of these "I's" can be observed and distinguished. No part of your nature is really hidden. For example, you get a taste of the creation and dissolution of the "I Am" whenever you fall into or awaken from deep sleep. When the "I Am" arises, the world appears; when it dissolves, the world disappears. You also get a taste of the impersonal bliss of Brahman when you disappear into deep sleep. But the bliss that can occur in the waking state is usually the experience of the creative energy, sometimes called shakti, which arises from the Heart." * * * When the 'I am myself' goes, the 'I am all' comes. When the 'I am all' goes, 'I am' comes. When even 'I am' goes, reality alone is.. ~Nisargadatta Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 22, 2006 Report Share Posted August 22, 2006 , "Era Molnar" <n0ndual wrote: > > "Although the distinctions are often ignored or blurred, it can be observed that there is more than one "I" in Awareness. While some current Nondualists point almost exclusively to the separative "I" logic which creates a sense of separation (I versus other), Nisargadatta Maharaj also speaks of the "I Am" and going beyond the "I Am," and Ramana Maharshi speaks of the "I-I." > > As we grow from childhood to adulthood, it is normal to develop a strong sense of a separate self (ego) that seems to stand apart from all else. When we refer to ourselves or say "I," we unconsciously assume and include a complex set of identifications and memories (I am this), such as our name, body, family, education, career, personal history, and so on. > > But, through persistent self-inquiry and observation, it can be seen that the sense of a separate "I" does not exist except as a concept. It is nothing more than an illusory, fuzzy, abstract reference point in Awareness. Moreover, it is accompanied by a supporting logic which interprets all events as happening to that reference point. In other words, the "I" logic always interprets events as happening to a centralized "me" rather than just happening in the field of Awareness. > > That false interpretation creates a veil of separation, an illusion of "me" versus other. > In the minimalist description of enlightenment adopted by many Nondualists, enlightenment means undermining that separative "I" logic through a deep understanding of it. > > The undermining of it reveals that you have never been separate from the world. It reveals that you are the world and that reality, here and now, just as it is, is your own Self. The revelation can be described as a shift in consciousness from identifying with the illusion of a separate self to identifying with the all-inclusive Self. > But, as the term suggests, the "Self" is itself an "I." > > Although it is spacious, all-inclusive and de-centralized, the Self expresses itself assertively as "I Am." It is, in fact, the real you expressing itself through a body-mind as the self-evident certainty that it (you) exists. > > Some call it Presence and may describe it further as creative, intelligent energy, because the "I Am" includes both the creation and the recognition of the world as one's Self. In its creative aspect, and as expressed through a body-mind, it is an act of individualization (sometimes called "Atman"), a personal expression of Self which arises from the Heart. > > The "I Am" is also an inseparable part of the "I-I" continuity that Ramana Maharshi refers to when he points out that the Self shines in the Heart as "I-I." The other part of the "I-I" is the impersonal Self, and it is also what Nisargadatta Maharaj refers to as beyond "I Am." Through further self-inquiry, observation, and reversal of the mind's exteriorization, the "I Am" dissolves back into the Heart, into nameless, indescribable, ineffable, impersonal being (Brahman), the "I" of Awareness without attributes. This impersonal "I" is the true and pure Witness, or Awareness, that is always present, shining through creation, but prior to creation. > As mentioned previously, all of these "I's" can be observed and distinguished. No part of your nature is really hidden. For example, you get a taste of the creation and dissolution of the "I Am" whenever you fall into or awaken from deep sleep. When the "I Am" arises, the world appears; when it dissolves, the world disappears. You also get a taste of the impersonal bliss of Brahman when you disappear into deep sleep. But the bliss that can occur in the waking state is usually the experience of the creative energy, sometimes called shakti, which arises from the Heart." > > * * * > When the 'I am myself' goes, the 'I am all' comes. When the 'I am all' goes, 'I am' comes. When even 'I am' goes, reality alone is.. ~Nisargadatta > ) ayayay... yosy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 23, 2006 Report Share Posted August 23, 2006 , "Era Molnar" <n0ndual wrote: > > "Although the distinctions are often ignored or blurred, it can be observed that there is more than one "I" in Awareness. While some current Nondualists point almost exclusively to the separative "I" logic which creates a sense of separation (I versus other), Nisargadatta Maharaj also speaks of the "I Am" and going beyond the "I Am," and Ramana Maharshi speaks of the "I-I." > > As we grow from childhood to adulthood, it is normal to develop a strong sense of a separate self (ego) that seems to stand apart from all else. When we refer to ourselves or say "I," we unconsciously assume and include a complex set of identifications and memories (I am this), such as our name, body, family, education, career, personal history, and so on. > > But, through persistent self-inquiry and observation, it can be seen that the sense of a separate "I" does not exist except as a concept. It is nothing more than an illusory, fuzzy, abstract reference point in Awareness. Moreover, it is accompanied by a supporting logic which interprets all events as happening to that reference point. In other words, the "I" logic always interprets events as happening to a centralized "me" rather than just happening in the field of Awareness. > > That false interpretation creates a veil of separation, an illusion of "me" versus other. > In the minimalist description of enlightenment adopted by many Nondualists, enlightenment means undermining that separative "I" logic through a deep understanding of it. > > The undermining of it reveals that you have never been separate from the world. It reveals that you are the world and that reality, here and now, just as it is, is your own Self. The revelation can be described as a shift in consciousness from identifying with the illusion of a separate self to identifying with the all-inclusive Self. > But, as the term suggests, the "Self" is itself an "I." > > Although it is spacious, all-inclusive and de-centralized, the Self expresses itself assertively as "I Am." It is, in fact, the real you expressing itself through a body-mind as the self-evident certainty that it (you) exists. > > Some call it Presence and may describe it further as creative, intelligent energy, because the "I Am" includes both the creation and the recognition of the world as one's Self. In its creative aspect, and as expressed through a body-mind, it is an act of individualization (sometimes called "Atman"), a personal expression of Self which arises from the Heart. > > The "I Am" is also an inseparable part of the "I-I" continuity that Ramana Maharshi refers to when he points out that the Self shines in the Heart as "I-I." The other part of the "I-I" is the impersonal Self, and it is also what Nisargadatta Maharaj refers to as beyond "I Am." Through further self-inquiry, observation, and reversal of the mind's exteriorization, the "I Am" dissolves back into the Heart, into nameless, indescribable, ineffable, impersonal being (Brahman), the "I" of Awareness without attributes. This impersonal "I" is the true and pure Witness, or Awareness, that is always present, shining through creation, but prior to creation. > As mentioned previously, all of these "I's" can be observed and distinguished. No part of your nature is really hidden. For example, you get a taste of the creation and dissolution of the "I Am" whenever you fall into or awaken from deep sleep. When the "I Am" arises, the world appears; when it dissolves, the world disappears. You also get a taste of the impersonal bliss of Brahman when you disappear into deep sleep. But the bliss that can occur in the waking state is usually the experience of the creative energy, sometimes called shakti, which arises from the Heart." > > * * * > When the 'I am myself' goes, the 'I am all' comes. When the 'I am all' goes, 'I am' comes. When even 'I am' goes, reality alone is.. ~Nisargadatta > ...and these three states of "I" co-arise and co-create the reality of illusions as well as the dissolution of all worlds even as the Self abides in Nothng but the Self. An experience in/as/of Life itself. Is this not so? YIL Anna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 23, 2006 Report Share Posted August 23, 2006 Aye, aye……… _____ [] On Behalf Of anabebe57 Wednesday, August 23, 2006 1:44 AM Re: "What Is the Difference Between "I,I Am" and "I-I"? @ <%40> , "Era Molnar" <n0ndual wrote: > > "Although the distinctions are often ignored or blurred, it can be observed that there is more than one "I" in Awareness. While some current Nondualists point almost exclusively to the separative "I" logic which creates a sense of separation (I versus other), Nisargadatta Maharaj also speaks of the "I Am" and going beyond the "I Am," and Ramana Maharshi speaks of the "I-I." > > As we grow from childhood to adulthood, it is normal to develop a strong sense of a separate self (ego) that seems to stand apart from all else. When we refer to ourselves or say "I," we unconsciously assume and include a complex set of identifications and memories (I am this), such as our name, body, family, education, career, personal history, and so on. > > But, through persistent self-inquiry and observation, it can be seen that the sense of a separate "I" does not exist except as a concept. It is nothing more than an illusory, fuzzy, abstract reference point in Awareness. Moreover, it is accompanied by a supporting logic which interprets all events as happening to that reference point. In other words, the "I" logic always interprets events as happening to a centralized "me" rather than just happening in the field of Awareness. > > That false interpretation creates a veil of separation, an illusion of "me" versus other. > In the minimalist description of enlightenment adopted by many Nondualists, enlightenment means undermining that separative "I" logic through a deep understanding of it. > > The undermining of it reveals that you have never been separate from the world. It reveals that you are the world and that reality, here and now, just as it is, is your own Self. The revelation can be described as a shift in consciousness from identifying with the illusion of a separate self to identifying with the all-inclusive Self. > But, as the term suggests, the "Self" is itself an "I." > > Although it is spacious, all-inclusive and de-centralized, the Self expresses itself assertively as "I Am." It is, in fact, the real you expressing itself through a body-mind as the self-evident certainty that it (you) exists. > > Some call it Presence and may describe it further as creative, intelligent energy, because the "I Am" includes both the creation and the recognition of the world as one's Self. In its creative aspect, and as expressed through a body-mind, it is an act of individualization (sometimes called "Atman"), a personal expression of Self which arises from the Heart. > > The "I Am" is also an inseparable part of the "I-I" continuity that Ramana Maharshi refers to when he points out that the Self shines in the Heart as "I-I." The other part of the "I-I" is the impersonal Self, and it is also what Nisargadatta Maharaj refers to as beyond "I Am." Through further self-inquiry, observation, and reversal of the mind's exteriorization, the "I Am" dissolves back into the Heart, into nameless, indescribable, ineffable, impersonal being (Brahman), the "I" of Awareness without attributes. This impersonal "I" is the true and pure Witness, or Awareness, that is always present, shining through creation, but prior to creation. > As mentioned previously, all of these "I's" can be observed and distinguished. No part of your nature is really hidden. For example, you get a taste of the creation and dissolution of the "I Am" whenever you fall into or awaken from deep sleep. When the "I Am" arises, the world appears; when it dissolves, the world disappears. You also get a taste of the impersonal bliss of Brahman when you disappear into deep sleep. But the bliss that can occur in the waking state is usually the experience of the creative energy, sometimes called shakti, which arises from the Heart." > > * * * > When the 'I am myself' goes, the 'I am all' comes. When the 'I am all' goes, 'I am' comes. When even 'I am' goes, reality alone is.. ~Nisargadatta > ...and these three states of "I" co-arise and co-create the reality of illusions as well as the dissolution of all worlds even as the Self abides in Nothng but the Self. An experience in/as/of Life itself. Is this not so? YIL Anna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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