Guest guest Posted August 10, 2006 Report Share Posted August 10, 2006 Dear Anshul At the outset, let me clearly state that I am not an astrologer or a learned man. Check your friend with the following question: 1. Does he believes in astronomy (9 planets and solar system) 2. Does he believes in gravitational force between the planets and sun. 3. Is he accepting the fact that the waves in the ocean is influenced by the gravitational pull of moon? 4. Is he accpeting that using a small lense we can burn a piece of paper if we focus the sun light passing through the lense? 5. Coming to the materialistic world : does he believes that his boss can influence his career growth? Well, the above questions may be irrelevant, but if we start thinking of answers to such numberous questions, we may find an answer somewhere? His other question of why we have to go to doctor instead of pleasing the lord to get rid of illness? Pleasing the lord to get rid of illness is for "prevention" and going to the doctor is for "cure". Choice is his, whether he wants a cure or prevention. Can he answer a question of why we need to earn for living, despite the fact that one day we have to die? These are some question that came to my mind immediately. I hope there are lot of professionals and scholars in this group, who can give better answer. Regards Sridhar , "Kapoor, Anshul" <anshul.kapoor wrote: > > Dear guruji's, > > > > I was in conversation with my friend who doesn't believe in > astrology and thinks that all this is a waste. I tried to explain him > the relevance of a hororscope but he was very adament doesn't believe in > puja. He thinks all this is a waste of time. > > > > As a justification he said why do we go to doctor when we are ill > instead we could have pleased the lord and get rid of illness? I told > him doctors are just the means of human world, whatever has to happen > will happen, no matter how good the doctor is. Still he was very > adament. > > > > However, I am studying subject with great interest and firmly believe in > this. > > My question here is: > > > > Q1. Which is the lord here who gives this kind of thinking? > > Q2. One should be religious or one should be spiritual? > > Q3. Long time ago, when I was young. My mother went to an astrologer, > he said I have VAAK SIDHI. What does this actually means, I know the > meaning of vaak(Bolna in hindi) > > Q4. There are 12 houses, 12 bhav and 9 planets. After some > permutation, like 12 ! * 12 ! * 9 ! . Does hororscope will be same? I > don't know how to explain, in nutshell no. of signs, no. planets, no. of > houses are fixed in nos. then after certain lakhs, does hororscope of > two person match? > > Q5. What is the need of Navamsha? For eg: we see marriage from 7 in > rashi or lagna as well as navamsha both signifies the native chart, > again for career from 10 gains from 11. whats the need of navamsha? I > have found out dharma, artha, kaam and moksha specific to native is > found out. > > > > Regards, > > Anshul kapoor > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 11, 2006 Report Share Posted August 11, 2006 Dear Anshul, Tell your friend that there are also a few on this earth astrologers who do not believe in the concept of God. If he becomes eager to know any such astrologer, give him my email address. There is no use in trying to make anyone a believer. He has his own way of life and thoughts. Let him live at peace with himself. Astrology can be quite a headache for those who do not have the capacity to understand it. Best wishes, Ashutosh - ashwin_062k Thursday, 10 August, 2006 16:42 Re: Why astrology Dear Anshul At the outset, let me clearly state that I am not an astrologer or a learned man. Check your friend with the following question: 1. Does he believes in astronomy (9 planets and solar system) 2. Does he believes in gravitational force between the planets and sun. 3. Is he accepting the fact that the waves in the ocean is influenced by the gravitational pull of moon? 4. Is he accpeting that using a small lense we can burn a piece of paper if we focus the sun light passing through the lense? 5. Coming to the materialistic world : does he believes that his boss can influence his career growth? Well, the above questions may be irrelevant, but if we start thinking of answers to such numberous questions, we may find an answer somewhere? His other question of why we have to go to doctor instead of pleasing the lord to get rid of illness? Pleasing the lord to get rid of illness is for "prevention" and going to the doctor is for "cure". Choice is his, whether he wants a cure or prevention. Can he answer a question of why we need to earn for living, despite the fact that one day we have to die? These are some question that came to my mind immediately. I hope there are lot of professionals and scholars in this group, who can give better answer. Regards Sridhar , "Kapoor, Anshul" <anshul.kapoor wrote: > > Dear guruji's, > > > > I was in conversation with my friend who doesn't believe in > astrology and thinks that all this is a waste. I tried to explain him > the relevance of a hororscope but he was very adament doesn't believe in > puja. He thinks all this is a waste of time. > > > > As a justification he said why do we go to doctor when we are ill > instead we could have pleased the lord and get rid of illness? I told > him doctors are just the means of human world, whatever has to happen > will happen, no matter how good the doctor is. Still he was very > adament. > > > > However, I am studying subject with great interest and firmly believe in > this. > > My question here is: > > > > Q1. Which is the lord here who gives this kind of thinking? > > Q2. One should be religious or one should be spiritual? > > Q3. Long time ago, when I was young. My mother went to an astrologer, > he said I have VAAK SIDHI. What does this actually means, I know the > meaning of vaak(Bolna in hindi) > > Q4. There are 12 houses, 12 bhav and 9 planets. After some > permutation, like 12 ! * 12 ! * 9 ! . Does hororscope will be same? I > don't know how to explain, in nutshell no. of signs, no. planets, no. of > houses are fixed in nos. then after certain lakhs, does hororscope of > two person match? > > Q5. What is the need of Navamsha? For eg: we see marriage from 7 in > rashi or lagna as well as navamsha both signifies the native chart, > again for career from 10 gains from 11. whats the need of navamsha? I > have found out dharma, artha, kaam and moksha specific to native is > found out. > > > > Regards, > > Anshul kapoor > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 12, 2006 Report Share Posted August 12, 2006 Dear Asutosh, It surprises me and sure other readers that in a Jyotish remedies there can be a atheist as where remedies are part of some form of god, prayers symbolic or idol or any activity=mediating, puja, homa ,Dana, Bhajans, etc. I am sure there is every religion on the earth that has some form of remedy and all cultures that had Astrology has their own remedies schemes laid out. this is like saying I DON'T NEED OXYGEN, WATER to live, and say all planets can have life as well as these two make life. i wud pref it topical and never personal in what i say, My paternal grandfather was an atheist but just before his lat breath asked my fatter to recite any of his school prayers. my fatter and me r rationalists but do agree on some higher beings who can design, stimulate, play with the life around the cosmos at his will. ASTROLOGERS CAN give a very small %age interpretation of a few lives max, never his full scheme. WE NEED GOD AS BASE OR FOCAL POINT TO GIVE US A LIFT TO TAKE OFF just like how the rockets tospace are held till they take off later u don't need it as ocne u r in flight u r there with him. HUMAINS NEED SOME FAITH ELSE HUMANITY ITSELF IS IN PERIL astrologerashutosh <astrologerashutosh (AT) (DOT) fr> wrote: Dear Anshul, Tell your friend that there are also a few on this earth astrologers who do not believe in the concept of God. If he becomes eager to know any such astrologer, give him my email address. There is no use in trying to make anyone a believer. He has his own way of life and thoughts. Let him live at peace with himself. Astrology can be quite a headache for those who do not have the capacity to understand it. Best wishes, Ashutosh - ashwin_062k Thursday, 10 August, 2006 16:42 Re: Why astrology Dear Anshul At the outset, let me clearly state that I am not an astrologer or a learned man. Check your friend with the following question: 1. Does he believes in astronomy (9 planets and solar system) 2. Does he believes in gravitational force between the planets and sun. 3. Is he accepting the fact that the waves in the ocean is influenced by the gravitational pull of moon? 4. Is he accpeting that using a small lense we can burn a piece of paper if we focus the sun light passing through the lense? 5. Coming to the materialistic world : does he believes that his boss can influence his career growth? Well, the above questions may be irrelevant, but if we start thinking of answers to such numberous questions, we may find an answer somewhere? His other question of why we have to go to doctor instead of pleasing the lord to get rid of illness? Pleasing the lord to get rid of illness is for "prevention" and going to the doctor is for "cure". Choice is his, whether he wants a cure or prevention. Can he answer a question of why we need to earn for living, despite the fact that one day we have to die? These are some question that came to my mind immediately. I hope there are lot of professionals and scholars in this group, who can give better answer. Regards Sridhar , "Kapoor, Anshul" <anshul.kapoor wrote: > > Dear guruji's, > > > > I was in conversation with my friend who doesn't believe in > astrology and thinks that all this is a waste. I tried to explain him > the relevance of a hororscope but he was very adament doesn't believe in > puja. He thinks all this is a waste of time. > > > > As a justification he said why do we go to doctor when we are ill > instead we could have pleased the lord and get rid of illness? I told > him doctors are just the means of human world, whatever has to happen > will happen, no matter how good the doctor is. Still he was very > adament. > > > > However, I am studying subject with great interest and firmly believe in > this. > > My question here is: > > > > Q1. Which is the lord here who gives this kind of thinking? > > Q2. One should be religious or one should be spiritual? > > Q3. Long time ago, when I was young. My mother went to an astrologer, > he said I have VAAK SIDHI. What does this actually means, I know the > meaning of vaak(Bolna in hindi) > > Q4. There are 12 houses, 12 bhav and 9 planets. After some > permutation, like 12 ! * 12 ! * 9 ! . Does hororscope will be same? I > don't know how to explain, in nutshell no. of signs, no. planets, no. of > houses are fixed in nos. then after certain lakhs, does hororscope of > two person match? > > Q5. What is the need of Navamsha? For eg: we see marriage from 7 in > rashi or lagna as well as navamsha both signifies the native chart, > again for career from 10 gains from 11. whats the need of navamsha? I > have found out dharma, artha, kaam and moksha specific to native is > found out. > > > > Regards, > > Anshul kapoor > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 12, 2006 Report Share Posted August 12, 2006 Dear Shri Kumar ji yes, vedic remedies certainly require belief in schema of "God". There are many civilizations and communities (including communists), where god's very existence were questioned - but they were not pursuing vedic remedies !!! I will like to know, how DMK chief pursues his remedies / predictions (as he claims to be athiest)!!! Budhism, where so many reliance is made to tantra (of highest order), god's very existence is not answered. So is Jainism. Atma is considered as "Parmatma" and much more emphasis is put on to self realization. Many religions like Islam, also do not believe in rebirth (which according to karmic fundamentals of Hinduism and many more religions, are the very basis of current birth, miseries, sorrows and good results). In the name of scientific notions, many people do not believe in GOD, but want to pursue astrology (on both sides - astrloger as well natives). It is interesting case studies, when convenience driven selective practices are adopted. If No God, then why rely on vedic literature for jyotish and remedies !!! Is it duality or attainment of self realization??? If no god then, why to follow lots of things like badhaka (prasna marg has distinctly defined it with god), pitra dosha and so on. and It is equally interesting to know the remedies suggested / pursued for the same. Though in Jainism, there is no pitra trapti etc, but most followers - do get pitra trapti pooja done. Whether belief / faith on god, helps or distracts an individual in his worldly pursuits, is very difficult to ascertain as well !!! regards / Prafulla Gang The long span of the bridge of your life is supported by countless cables called habits, attitudes, and desires. What you do in life depends upon what you are and what you want. What you get from life depends upon how much you want it, how much you are willing to work and plan and co-operate and use your resources. The long span of the bridge of your life is supported by countless cables that you are spinning now, and that is why today is such an important day. Make the cables strong!! > > gbp_kumar > Fri, 11 Aug 2006 22:09:29 -0700 (PDT) > > Re: Re: Why astrology > > Dear Asutosh, > It surprises me and sure other readers that in a Jyotish remedies there > can be a atheist as where remedies are part of some form of god, prayers > symbolic or idol or any activity=mediating, puja, homa ,Dana, Bhajans, > etc. I am sure there is every religion on the earth that has some form > of remedy and all cultures that had Astrology has their own remedies > schemes laid out. > > this is like saying I DON'T NEED OXYGEN, WATER to live, and say all > planets can have life as well as these two make life. > > i wud pref it topical and never personal in what i say, > My paternal grandfather was an atheist but just before his lat breath > asked my fatter to recite any of his school prayers. > my fatter and me r rationalists but do agree on some higher beings who > can design, stimulate, play with the life around the cosmos at his will. > ASTROLOGERS CAN give a very small %age interpretation of a few lives > max, never his full scheme. > > WE NEED GOD AS BASE OR FOCAL POINT TO GIVE US A LIFT TO TAKE OFF just > like how the rockets tospace are held till they take off later u don't > need it as ocne u r in flight u r there with him. > > HUMAINS NEED SOME FAITH ELSE HUMANITY ITSELF IS IN PERIL > > astrologerashutosh <astrologerashutosh (AT) (DOT) fr> wrote: > Dear Anshul, > > Tell your friend that there are also a few on this earth astrologers who > do not believe in the concept of God. If he becomes eager to know any > such astrologer, give him my email address. > > There is no use in trying to make anyone a believer. He has his own way > of life and thoughts. Let him live at peace with himself. Astrology can > be quite a headache for those who do not have the capacity to understand > it. > > Best wishes, > > Ashutosh > > - > ashwin_062k > > Thursday, 10 August, 2006 16:42 > Re: Why astrology > > Dear Anshul > > At the outset, let me clearly state that I am not an astrologer or a > learned man. Check your friend with the following question: > > 1. Does he believes in astronomy (9 planets and solar system) > 2. Does he believes in gravitational force between the planets and > sun. > 3. Is he accepting the fact that the waves in the ocean is > influenced by the gravitational pull of moon? > 4. Is he accpeting that using a small lense we can burn a piece of > paper if we focus the sun light passing through the lense? > 5. Coming to the materialistic world : does he believes that his > boss can influence his career growth? > > Well, the above questions may be irrelevant, but if we start > thinking of answers to such numberous questions, we may find an > answer somewhere? > > His other question of why we have to go to doctor instead of > pleasing the lord to get rid of illness? Pleasing the lord to get > rid of illness is for "prevention" and going to the doctor is > for "cure". Choice is his, whether he wants a cure or prevention. > > Can he answer a question of why we need to earn for living, despite > the fact that one day we have to die? > > These are some question that came to my mind immediately. I hope > there are lot of professionals and scholars in this group, who can > give better answer. > > Regards > Sridhar > > , "Kapoor, Anshul" > <anshul.kapoor wrote: > > > > Dear guruji's, > > > > > > > > I was in conversation with my friend who doesn't believe in > > astrology and thinks that all this is a waste. I tried to explain > him > > the relevance of a hororscope but he was very adament doesn't > believe in > > puja. He thinks all this is a waste of time. > > > > > > > > As a justification he said why do we go to doctor when we are > ill > > instead we could have pleased the lord and get rid of illness? I > told > > him doctors are just the means of human world, whatever has to > happen > > will happen, no matter how good the doctor is. Still he was very > > adament. > > > > > > > > However, I am studying subject with great interest and firmly > believe in > > this. > > > > My question here is: > > > > > > > > Q1. Which is the lord here who gives this kind of thinking? > > > > Q2. One should be religious or one should be spiritual? > > > > Q3. Long time ago, when I was young. My mother went to an > astrologer, > > he said I have VAAK SIDHI. What does this actually means, I know > the > > meaning of vaak(Bolna in hindi) > > > > Q4. There are 12 houses, 12 bhav and 9 planets. After some > > permutation, like 12 ! * 12 ! * 9 ! . Does hororscope will be > same? I > > don't know how to explain, in nutshell no. of signs, no. planets, > no. of > > houses are fixed in nos. then after certain lakhs, does hororscope > of > > two person match? > > > > Q5. What is the need of Navamsha? For eg: we see marriage from 7 > in > > rashi or lagna as well as navamsha both signifies the native chart, > > again for career from 10 gains from 11. whats the need of > navamsha? I > > have found out dharma, artha, kaam and moksha specific to native is > > found out. > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > Anshul kapoor > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 Dear Prashant, I have never felt the need for god or any concept like that in my 15 years of astrological practice. Still, none of my clients question my atheism (they are not illeterate either) and no one has had any problem with it either. It is also not necessary that all remedies should centre around pooja and gods. Astrology has nothing to do with God or religion, it is a science and a very interesting science. Regards, Ashutosh - Prashant Kumar G B Saturday, 12 August, 2006 10:39 Re: Re: Why astrology Dear Asutosh, It surprises me and sure other readers that in a Jyotish remedies there can be a atheist as where remedies are part of some form of god, prayers symbolic or idol or any activity=mediating, puja, homa ,Dana, Bhajans, etc. I am sure there is every religion on the earth that has some form of remedy and all cultures that had Astrology has their own remedies schemes laid out. this is like saying I DON'T NEED OXYGEN, WATER to live, and say all planets can have life as well as these two make life. i wud pref it topical and never personal in what i say, My paternal grandfather was an atheist but just before his lat breath asked my fatter to recite any of his school prayers. my fatter and me r rationalists but do agree on some higher beings who can design, stimulate, play with the life around the cosmos at his will. ASTROLOGERS CAN give a very small %age interpretation of a few lives max, never his full scheme. WE NEED GOD AS BASE OR FOCAL POINT TO GIVE US A LIFT TO TAKE OFF just like how the rockets tospace are held till they take off later u don't need it as ocne u r in flight u r there with him. HUMAINS NEED SOME FAITH ELSE HUMANITY ITSELF IS IN PERIL astrologerashutosh <astrologerashutosh (AT) (DOT) fr> wrote: Dear Anshul, Tell your friend that there are also a few on this earth astrologers who do not believe in the concept of God. If he becomes eager to know any such astrologer, give him my email address. There is no use in trying to make anyone a believer. He has his own way of life and thoughts. Let him live at peace with himself. Astrology can be quite a headache for those who do not have the capacity to understand it. Best wishes, Ashutosh - ashwin_062k Thursday, 10 August, 2006 16:42 Re: Why astrology Dear Anshul At the outset, let me clearly state that I am not an astrologer or a learned man. Check your friend with the following question: 1. Does he believes in astronomy (9 planets and solar system) 2. Does he believes in gravitational force between the planets and sun. 3. Is he accepting the fact that the waves in the ocean is influenced by the gravitational pull of moon? 4. Is he accpeting that using a small lense we can burn a piece of paper if we focus the sun light passing through the lense? 5. Coming to the materialistic world : does he believes that his boss can influence his career growth? Well, the above questions may be irrelevant, but if we start thinking of answers to such numberous questions, we may find an answer somewhere? His other question of why we have to go to doctor instead of pleasing the lord to get rid of illness? Pleasing the lord to get rid of illness is for "prevention" and going to the doctor is for "cure". Choice is his, whether he wants a cure or prevention. Can he answer a question of why we need to earn for living, despite the fact that one day we have to die? These are some question that came to my mind immediately. I hope there are lot of professionals and scholars in this group, who can give better answer. Regards Sridhar , "Kapoor, Anshul" <anshul.kapoor wrote: > > Dear guruji's, > > > > I was in conversation with my friend who doesn't believe in > astrology and thinks that all this is a waste. I tried to explain him > the relevance of a hororscope but he was very adament doesn't believe in > puja. He thinks all this is a waste of time. > > > > As a justification he said why do we go to doctor when we are ill > instead we could have pleased the lord and get rid of illness? I told > him doctors are just the means of human world, whatever has to happen > will happen, no matter how good the doctor is. Still he was very > adament. > > > > However, I am studying subject with great interest and firmly believe in > this. > > My question here is: > > > > Q1. Which is the lord here who gives this kind of thinking? > > Q2. One should be religious or one should be spiritual? > > Q3. Long time ago, when I was young. My mother went to an astrologer, > he said I have VAAK SIDHI. What does this actually means, I know the > meaning of vaak(Bolna in hindi) > > Q4. There are 12 houses, 12 bhav and 9 planets. After some > permutation, like 12 ! * 12 ! * 9 ! . Does hororscope will be same? I > don't know how to explain, in nutshell no. of signs, no. planets, no. of > houses are fixed in nos. then after certain lakhs, does hororscope of > two person match? > > Q5. What is the need of Navamsha? For eg: we see marriage from 7 in > rashi or lagna as well as navamsha both signifies the native chart, > again for career from 10 gains from 11. whats the need of navamsha? I > have found out dharma, artha, kaam and moksha specific to native is > found out. > > > > Regards, > > Anshul kapoor > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 Dear Shri Kumar ji I heard that DMK in south is atheist in practice. What are their religious practices, when they have birth of child, marriages in their families and when their family members die !! Just out of curiosity, and do not link it to any thread. regards / Prafulla Gang The problem is not that there are problems. The problem is expecting otherwise and thinking that having problems is a problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 Dear Shri Sharma ji I know many communist leaders, DMK followers, Russian natives (atheist one) and so on. They all claim to be atheist, but all these basic events have necessary religious pursuits !!! I personally, have yet to see the religious ceremonies not pursued, when their family members die. regards / Prafulla Gang The problem is not that there are problems. The problem is expecting otherwise and thinking that having problems is a problem. > > polite_astro > Sun, 13 Aug 2006 00:36:30 -0700 (PDT) > , > Re: religious practices of atheist societies > > ll HARE RAM ll > > Very good question indeed. > > Shashie Shekhar > > Prafulla Gang <jyotish (AT) inbox (DOT) com> wrote: > Dear Shri Kumar ji > > I heard that DMK in south is atheist in practice. What are their > religious practices, when they have birth of child, marriages in their > families and when their family members die !! Just out of curiosity, and > do not link it to any thread. > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > The problem is not that there are problems. The problem is expecting > otherwise and thinking that having problems is a problem. > > > > > SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE ULTIMATE DIVINITY AND RELISH THE > TASTE OF ABSOLUTE BLISS. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 Dear Prafulla, Religion is a system of rituals and traditions. It is a way of life. There may or may not be a concept of God in it. We can even term 'atheism' a religion. What we practice in India is not a religion, but a culture. Very few people know that only our culture permits and encourages debates. It also allows all kinds of beliefs, even atheism. One need not necessarily believe in God to be a Hindu. Even Gautam Buddha did not preach about any concept of God, but he himself was converted into a God by his followers. As an astrologer, I will never leave anything on God or destiny. It is my duty to strive to find out the exact future and also the ways to make that future better. The moment I start believing in God, my strength of efforts will falter, because then I will have a mental handicap of leaving everything on God. Also, which worship would I prescribe to someone who belongs to a different religion, or to someone who does not believe in any religion? I have always focused on remedies which can be followed by all, irrespective of their religious beliefs. Marx defined religion as an "Opium for the masses". It should not become an opium for us astrologers. Just like other sciences, astrology should be acceptable to all and should be easier for all to practice. Over-emphasis on religious remedies or worships of Gods, will deter people from other parts of the globe from studying this science. This is something which was clear to me ever since I started studying jyotish. But, I do not expect all to understand my point of views or to follow them. My proclamations of my atheism are my efforts to clarify my ways of living, not to prod others to be like me. One should choose the beliefs with which one feels comfortable. In India, all sciences were kept alive due to the religious garb which was given to them. In ancient times, there were no other means to preserve knowledge. Even, the famous granth by Kautilya, "Arthashastra", was saved from extinction by this means. It was rediscovered in 1905, in a Hindu monastry in Kerala, kept preserved but written in Malayalam script. Now, it is our duty to make astrology acceptable as a science and not just a belief or a subject of faith. Otherwise, the more scientific minded west will take over this science of ours just like they took over yoga and ayurveda. No one asks a doctor or a scientist or a psychologist whether they believe in God or not. One is concerned only with the services one gets from these professionals. Why not the same with astrologers too? Regards, Ashutosh - Prafulla Gang Sunday, 13 August, 2006 13:12 Re: religious practices of atheist societies Dear Shri Sharma ji I know many communist leaders, DMK followers, Russian natives (atheist one) and so on. They all claim to be atheist, but all these basic events have necessary religious pursuits !!! I personally, have yet to see the religious ceremonies not pursued, when their family members die. regards / Prafulla Gang The problem is not that there are problems. The problem is expecting otherwise and thinking that having problems is a problem. > > polite_astro > Sun, 13 Aug 2006 00:36:30 -0700 (PDT) > , > Re: religious practices of atheist societies > > ll HARE RAM ll > > Very good question indeed. > > Shashie Shekhar > > Prafulla Gang <jyotish (AT) inbox (DOT) com> wrote: > Dear Shri Kumar ji > > I heard that DMK in south is atheist in practice. What are their > religious practices, when they have birth of child, marriages in their > families and when their family members die !! Just out of curiosity, and > do not link it to any thread. > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > The problem is not that there are problems. The problem is expecting > otherwise and thinking that having problems is a problem. > > > > > SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE ULTIMATE DIVINITY AND RELISH THE > TASTE OF ABSOLUTE BLISS. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 Dear Shri Kumar ji Many thanks. How about rituals at funerals? I observed them pursuing all rituals. regards / Prafulla Gang The problem is not that there are problems. The problem is expecting otherwise and thinking that having problems is a problem. > > gbp_kumar > Sun, 13 Aug 2006 01:47:17 -0700 (PDT) > > Re: religious practices of atheist societies 13/8 > > Dear {rafulla, > thats true tey r atheists but for their sake alone wil follow what they > want to, their caders get marrie in simple garland exchange one of th > party seniors will bles the couple. wedding cards also have images of > not the bride, bride groom but party bosses, dead and alive. > again rememebr DMK wants reservations with already 69% +27 for meeeit > among them reminder is opeb for all even other states. > but all DMK minister r leaders get treatment by not avg pass or grac > emarks [that i sfor their voters to suffer] they will go to APOLLO or > US, SWISS for treatment even months Mursulai maran was inUS for a yr on > tax payers money. they Dayanidhi studied in Harward not here. so is > ramdas family these leaders want the the state to have engineerign > medicien taught in tamil only, their chlldren, grand children study > overseas. > IT IS HYPORCISY at its height. > > > Prafulla Gang <jyotish (AT) inbox (DOT) com> wrote: > Dear Shri Kumar ji > > I heard that DMK in south is atheist in practice. What are their > religious practices, when they have birth of child, marriages in their > families and when their family members die !! Just out of curiosity, and > do not link it to any thread. > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > The problem is not that there are problems. The problem is expecting > otherwise and thinking that having problems is a problem. > > > > > > Prashantkumar G B > > -*- The services of this astrologer are free on group > but > off the group consultations are chargeable by chat, mail or phone. > Please fix times for this in advance -*- > 09840051861 > > > > > > > Everyone is raving about the all-new Mail Beta. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2006 Report Share Posted August 13, 2006 Dear Ashutosh ji Firstly, let me clarify you that - I am Jain by religion, were too like budhism - there is no God. But there are rituals, practices, prayers, tirthankars who attained moksha are prayed; and above all - there is detailed reference to swraga / naraka and devi devatas (superior souls at different plain) etc. Yes, rationalization of any knowledge is most welcome and it will help in spreading the jyotish, if remedies are such - which can be pursued by all people from all religions / faith. I have no issues in anyone pursuing his own faith / religion. But if we follow jyotish (vedic astrology), then we can not override its very basis. Lal kitab too, defines remedies for planetary afflictions etc, but at some stage - when we come to complex issues of tantra, black magic, pitra dosha, pret badha etc, then dependence upon superior souls (departed one) increases for remedies; and at that stage of jyotish pursuance, existence of "God" surfaces as most superior soul (we may name it to suit our faith). Even, when we discuss the vastu dosha, (if we want to put reliance on vastu related vedic literature), then again generalized remedies can not remove the dosha. How can be we selective in reference to those literature, in the name of rationalization? Many of fatalistic issues are just beyond jyotish. But again, it is matter of faith and practice. You might have observed that, at many stages of different threads, I too, question the application of remedies, religious rituals etc. But my comments are more around the selective references by practising astrologers. In my limited experiences with yogis, "good" saints etc, I have observed miracles happening. I have observed their "superior" powers for the things to happen, which many great astrologers could not resolve for years. Yes, these knowledge may not be available to normal human beings like me, but they do exist. Many of past karma's debt just can not be traced / rectfied in normal course of astrology. So, there is certainly something which is above jyotishi. Best wishes for your jytoish pursuance. regards / Prafulla Gang The problem is not that there are problems. The problem is expecting otherwise and thinking that having problems is a problem. > > astrologerashutosh (AT) (DOT) fr > Sun, 13 Aug 2006 14:54:50 +0530 > > Re: religious practices of atheist societies > > Dear Prafulla, > > Religion is a system of rituals and traditions. It > is a way of life. There may or may not be a concept of God in it. We can > even term 'atheism' a religion. > > What we practice in India is not a religion, but a culture. Very > few people know that only our culture permits and encourages debates. It > also allows all kinds of beliefs, even atheism. One need not necessarily > believe in God to be a Hindu. > > Even Gautam Buddha did not preach about any concept of God, but > he himself was converted into a God by his followers. > > As an astrologer, I will never leave anything on God or destiny. > It is my duty to strive to find out the exact future and also the ways to > make that future better. The moment I start believing in God, my strength > of efforts will falter, because then I will have a mental handicap of > leaving everything on God. > > Also, which worship would I prescribe to someone who belongs to a > different religion, or to someone who does not believe in any religion? I > have always focused on remedies which can be followed by all, > irrespective of their religious beliefs. > > Marx defined religion as an "Opium for the masses". It should not > become an opium for us astrologers. Just like other sciences, astrology > should be acceptable to all and should be easier for all to practice. > Over-emphasis on religious remedies or worships of Gods, will deter > people from other parts of the globe from studying this science. > > This is something which was clear to me ever since I started > studying jyotish. But, I do not expect all to understand my point of > views or to follow them. My proclamations of my atheism are my efforts to > clarify my ways of living, not to prod others to be like me. One should > choose the beliefs with which one feels comfortable. > > In India, all sciences were kept alive due to the religious garb > which was given to them. In ancient times, there were no other means to > preserve knowledge. Even, the famous granth by Kautilya, "Arthashastra", > was saved from extinction by this means. It was rediscovered in 1905, in > a Hindu monastry in Kerala, kept preserved but written in Malayalam > script. > > Now, it is our duty to make astrology acceptable as a science and > not just a belief or a subject of faith. Otherwise, the more scientific > minded west will take over this science of ours just like they took over > yoga and ayurveda. > > No one asks a doctor or a scientist or a psychologist whether > they believe in God or not. One is concerned only with the services one > gets from these professionals. Why not the same with astrologers too? > > > Regards, > > Ashutosh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > Prafulla Gang > > Sunday, 13 August, 2006 13:12 > Re: religious practices of atheist societies > > > Dear Shri Sharma ji > > I know many communist leaders, DMK followers, Russian natives (atheist > one) and so on. They all claim to be atheist, but all these basic events > have necessary religious pursuits !!! I personally, have yet to see the > religious ceremonies not pursued, when their family members die. > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > The problem is not that there are problems. The problem is expecting > otherwise and thinking that having problems is a problem. > > > > > polite_astro > > Sun, 13 Aug 2006 00:36:30 -0700 (PDT) > > , > > > Re: religious practices of atheist societies > > > > ll HARE RAM ll > > > > Very good question indeed. > > > > Shashie Shekhar > > > > Prafulla Gang <jyotish (AT) inbox (DOT) com> wrote: > > Dear Shri Kumar ji > > > > I heard that DMK in south is atheist in practice. What are their > > religious practices, when they have birth of child, marriages in > their > > families and when their family members die !! Just out of curiosity, > and > > do not link it to any thread. > > > > regards / Prafulla Gang > > > > The problem is not that there are problems. The problem is expecting > > otherwise and thinking that having problems is a problem. > > > > > > > > > > SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE ULTIMATE DIVINITY AND RELISH > THE > > TASTE OF ABSOLUTE BLISS. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 14, 2006 Report Share Posted August 14, 2006 Dear Ranjan ji Yes, in almost all cultures - lots of respect is given to "body". The funeral carries additional religious rituals in almost all societies. How about atheists!! regards / Prafulla Gang The problem is not that there are problems. The problem is expecting otherwise and thinking that having problems is a problem. > > jyotish_vani (AT) hotmail (DOT) com > Mon, 14 Aug 2006 07:40:03 -0000 > > Re: religious practices of atheist societies 13/8 > > Prafulla, > > Funerals are very interesting social rituals, and lest I be blamed > for a wrong reason, I do not use the term 'interesting' in > its 'positive' sense -- perhaps I meant "intriguing". > > Having participated in a few funerals of individuals from different > religions and belief systems, I have been stricken by their > predominant preoccupation with the 'body'. Sure -- the spirit and > soul is mentioned and its permanence and supremacy is mentioned, > extolled and celebrated, the body remains *central* to the rituals > and procedures. The 'disposal' of the body with dignity, with > respect and to bring a closure to the worldly existence of the > entity is what it is about, in my comprehension. > > Such disposal is absolutely unavoidable, for obvious reasons, and > needs to be done delicately, gently, and appropriately in a manner > that is acceptable to a community, religion, region, etc. > The 'delicate/gentle' label is something that is very culture > specific and personal. If I were to describe, even briefly, the > methods used by the different prevailing cultures, I am sure it > would offend some or many individuals I am sure. Hence, I must leave > it at that other than just mentioning that the procedure/protocol > reflects the degree of significance and thus respect given to the > physical body that essentially has been abandoned by spirit which > though indestructible and permanent does not really come with an > earthly accommodation-plan that is going to last forever. > > RR > > > > > , Prafulla Gang <jyotish > wrote: >> >> Dear Shri Kumar ji >> >> Many thanks. How about rituals at funerals? >> >> I observed them pursuing all rituals. >> >> regards / Prafulla Gang >> >> The problem is not that there are problems. The problem is > expecting otherwise and thinking that having problems is a problem. >> >> >>> >>> gbp_kumar >>> Sun, 13 Aug 2006 01:47:17 -0700 (PDT) >>> >>> Re: religious practices of atheist societies 13/8 >>> >>> Dear {rafulla, >>> thats true tey r atheists but for their sake alone wil follow > what they >>> want to, their caders get marrie in simple garland exchange one > of th >>> party seniors will bles the couple. wedding cards also have > images of >>> not the bride, bride groom but party bosses, dead and alive. >>> again rememebr DMK wants reservations with already 69% +27 for > meeeit >>> among them reminder is opeb for all even other states. >>> but all DMK minister r leaders get treatment by not avg pass > or grac >>> emarks [that i sfor their voters to suffer] they will go to > APOLLO or >>> US, SWISS for treatment even months Mursulai maran was inUS for > a yr on >>> tax payers money. they Dayanidhi studied in Harward not here. so > is >>> ramdas family these leaders want the the state to have > engineerign >>> medicien taught in tamil only, their chlldren, grand children > study >>> overseas. >>> IT IS HYPORCISY at its height. >>> >>> >>> Prafulla Gang <jyotish wrote: >>> Dear Shri Kumar ji >>> >>> I heard that DMK in south is atheist in practice. What are their >>> religious practices, when they have birth of child, marriages in > their >>> families and when their family members die !! Just out of > curiosity, and >>> do not link it to any thread. >>> >>> regards / Prafulla Gang >>> >>> The problem is not that there are problems. The problem is > expecting >>> otherwise and thinking that having problems is a problem. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Prashantkumar G B >>> >>> -*- The services of this astrologer are free on > group >>> but >>> off the group consultations are chargeable by chat, mail or > phone. >>> Please fix times for this in advance -*- >>> 09840051861 >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Everyone is raving about the all-new Mail Beta. >>> >>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 15, 2006 Report Share Posted August 15, 2006 Dear Ranjan ji I agree. it is the person dying, whose last wishes must be honoured. regards / Prafulla Gang Witch, n. (1) An ugly and repulsive old woman, in a wicked league with the devil. (2) A beautiful and attractive young woman, in wickedness a league beyond the devil. > > jyotish_vani (AT) hotmail (DOT) com > Tue, 15 Aug 2006 04:48:32 -0000 > > Re: religious practices of atheist societies 13/8 > > Dear Prafulla, > > Atheist or believer -- if they are deceased, their bodies would need > to be taken care of by society in an appropriate manner. And if the > one who ends up being responsible for the last rites of the deceased > body, there could be a bit of an interesting situation! > > Whose beliefs are the most important after death? Those of the > person dying or those of the person who is discharging the final > rites to the dead individual? > > It is best to give some thought to this and leave final instructions > in details so that loved ones, atheists and believers are not left > second guessing what the dying person might have preferred! > > RR > > , Prafulla Gang <jyotish > wrote: >> >> Dear Ranjan ji >> >> Yes, in almost all cultures - lots of respect is given to "body". > The funeral carries additional religious rituals in almost all > societies. How about atheists!! >> >> regards / Prafulla Gang >> >> The problem is not that there are problems. The problem is > expecting otherwise and thinking that having problems is a problem. >> >> >>> >>> jyotish_vani >>> Mon, 14 Aug 2006 07:40:03 -0000 >>> >>> Re: religious practices of atheist societies 13/8 >>> >>> Prafulla, >>> >>> Funerals are very interesting social rituals, and lest I be > blamed >>> for a wrong reason, I do not use the term 'interesting' in >>> its 'positive' sense -- perhaps I meant "intriguing". >>> >>> Having participated in a few funerals of individuals from > different >>> religions and belief systems, I have been stricken by their >>> predominant preoccupation with the 'body'. Sure -- the spirit and >>> soul is mentioned and its permanence and supremacy is mentioned, >>> extolled and celebrated, the body remains *central* to the > rituals >>> and procedures. The 'disposal' of the body with dignity, with >>> respect and to bring a closure to the worldly existence of the >>> entity is what it is about, in my comprehension. >>> >>> Such disposal is absolutely unavoidable, for obvious reasons, and >>> needs to be done delicately, gently, and appropriately in a > manner >>> that is acceptable to a community, religion, region, etc. >>> The 'delicate/gentle' label is something that is very culture >>> specific and personal. If I were to describe, even briefly, the >>> methods used by the different prevailing cultures, I am sure it >>> would offend some or many individuals I am sure. Hence, I must > leave >>> it at that other than just mentioning that the procedure/protocol >>> reflects the degree of significance and thus respect given to the >>> physical body that essentially has been abandoned by spirit which >>> though indestructible and permanent does not really come with an >>> earthly accommodation-plan that is going to last forever. >>> >>> RR >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> , Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> >>> wrote: >>>> >>>> Dear Shri Kumar ji >>>> >>>> Many thanks. How about rituals at funerals? >>>> >>>> I observed them pursuing all rituals. >>>> >>>> regards / Prafulla Gang >>>> >>>> The problem is not that there are problems. The problem is >>> expecting otherwise and thinking that having problems is a > problem. >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>> gbp_kumar@ >>>>> Sun, 13 Aug 2006 01:47:17 -0700 (PDT) >>>>> >>>>> Re: religious practices of atheist societies 13/8 >>>>> >>>>> Dear {rafulla, >>>>> thats true tey r atheists but for their sake alone wil follow >>> what they >>>>> want to, their caders get marrie in simple garland exchange one >>> of th >>>>> party seniors will bles the couple. wedding cards also have >>> images of >>>>> not the bride, bride groom but party bosses, dead and alive. >>>>> again rememebr DMK wants reservations with already 69% +27 > for >>> meeeit >>>>> among them reminder is opeb for all even other states. >>>>> but all DMK minister r leaders get treatment by not avg pass >>> or grac >>>>> emarks [that i sfor their voters to suffer] they will go to >>> APOLLO or >>>>> US, SWISS for treatment even months Mursulai maran was inUS for >>> a yr on >>>>> tax payers money. they Dayanidhi studied in Harward not here. > so >>> is >>>>> ramdas family these leaders want the the state to have >>> engineerign >>>>> medicien taught in tamil only, their chlldren, grand children >>> study >>>>> overseas. >>>>> IT IS HYPORCISY at its height. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Prafulla Gang <jyotish@> wrote: >>>>> Dear Shri Kumar ji >>>>> >>>>> I heard that DMK in south is atheist in practice. What are > their >>>>> religious practices, when they have birth of child, marriages > in >>> their >>>>> families and when their family members die !! Just out of >>> curiosity, and >>>>> do not link it to any thread. >>>>> >>>>> regards / Prafulla Gang >>>>> >>>>> The problem is not that there are problems. The problem is >>> expecting >>>>> otherwise and thinking that having problems is a problem. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Prashantkumar G B >>>>> >>>>> -*- The services of this astrologer are free on >>> group >>>>> but >>>>> off the group consultations are chargeable by chat, mail or >>> phone. >>>>> Please fix times for this in advance -*- >>>>> 09840051861 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Everyone is raving about the all-new Mail Beta. >>>>> >>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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