Guest guest Posted September 1, 2006 Report Share Posted September 1, 2006 or heard of anyone who became so enlightened they just dropped dead? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2006 Report Share Posted September 1, 2006 David, I am not sure what you are asking. Once in a while, we hear of yogis going into samadhi and passing away like that, although it is not common. My teacher's teacher's teacher was well over a 100 when he called his students and went into samadhi and left the body. That does happen and some yogi adepts can consciously leave their bodies at the time of their death. I don't think this is equated with Self-Realization, although it is possible that some Self-Realized sages have left in this manner due to their karmic destiny. A second way, the way in my teacher's teacher left was through gradual fasting and meditating over a prolonged period. This is an accepted traditional way of leaving and is believed can lead to Self-Realization and liberation for some people. Harsha David wrote: > > or heard of anyone who became so enlightened > they just dropped dead? > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2006 Report Share Posted September 1, 2006 Oh yes.. Many. I haven't known any of them personally, except for one who nearly died. There are many such instances... Ramana Maharshi himself might of died while he was in his months long Samadhi in the Patala Lingam cellar at Arunachalashwar Temple. He was saved by Seshadri Swamigal. The following is an excerpt from a story about Seshadri Swamigal that can be found here http://www.angelfire.com/realm/bodhisattva/seshadri.html . In fact it was Seshadri Swamigal who rescued the young Ramana when the latter was immersed in penance in the underground vault called Patala Lingam located in the Thousand-pillared Hall of the Arunachaleshwarar temple, while ants and other insects were gnawing away at his body. I am leaving for an appointment now. Perhaps later this weekend I can give you some more examples. Love to all, michael _____ [] On Behalf Of David Friday, September 01, 2006 1:14 PM Does anybody know anyone or heard of anyone who became so enlightened they just dropped dead? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2006 Report Share Posted September 1, 2006 Harsha wrote: > > David, > > I am not sure what you are asking. What I was asking was, can Self-Realization Itself be the Cause of physical death. Thanks very much Harsha & Michael for your responses. > Once in a while, we hear of yogis > going into samadhi and passing away like that, although it is not > common. My teacher's teacher's teacher was well over a 100 when he > called his students and went into samadhi and left the body. That does > happen and some yogi adepts can consciously leave their bodies at the > time of their death. I don't think this is equated with > Self-Realization, although it is possible that some Self-Realized sages > have left in this manner due to their karmic destiny. A second way, the > way in my teacher's teacher left was through gradual fasting and > meditating over a prolonged period. This is an accepted traditional way > of leaving and is believed can lead to Self-Realization and liberation > for some people. > David wrote: > > > > or heard of anyone who became so enlightened > > they just dropped dead? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2006 Report Share Posted September 1, 2006 Actually, there is a Sufi tale about a Persian poet who became so transported during a Zikr that the musicians were fearful of stopping their playing because they did not want to end his ecstatic trance. But after several days, their strength gave out, they stopped, and the poet promptly died. I heard this story perhaps five or six years ago. David <david.bozzi (AT) softhome (DOT) net> wrote: or heard of anyone who became so enlightened they just dropped dead? Everyone is raving about the all-new Mail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 2, 2006 Report Share Posted September 2, 2006 _____ [] On Behalf Of David Friday, September 01, 2006 1:14 PM Does anybody know anyone or heard of anyone who became so enlightened they just dropped dead? Certain "real I zations" exert a tremendous force upon the body that can, and sometimes do, result in death and or suicide. (Death and or suicide?) Certain other realities i.e. nirvikalpa samdhi, deny One the ability to function in the "world" some times resulting in the death of the realizer. The enlightenment supposition is nothing more than an observation of evolution..... There is an evolutionary process in motion that sometimes results in over supply of shakti and it can kill.. But it ain't no thang 'cause everyBody's gonna die... Not you; but yo body.. Don't panic. There's nothing to worry about, because most people will never get anywhere near the "real thing".. Love and bliss and peace There is no peace (shanti) without power (shakti) michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 2, 2006 Report Share Posted September 2, 2006 Every now and then, a trip into conceptual hell is useful. Okay, lemme see........An individualized perspective (a human) arises spontaneously out of Consciousness as a kind of energy of unrealized experience. IOW, you seemingly exist only because you represent an aspect of the Totality of Consciousness that was not currently being experientially realized. In this respect, you're absolutely unique in all of creation, and the reflection would not be complete without you. As such, your experience arises from within your own dynamics of awareness, desire, thought feeling, etc that 'caused' you to seemingly exist in the first place. You could say that your purpose is to experience and express that aspect, but purpose is just a human conceptualization of a 'process' that occurs spontaneously and without design. This experiential aspect seemingly dies when the experience is complete, in much the same way that a nightly dream ends when the mental/emotional energy that initiates the dream has been exhausted in it's expression. While the purpose of life is not to attain enlightenment, desire for completion is the force that gives life movement, and the movement is necessary for experience to occur. This is a movement 'occurring' within Consciousness. Once Consciousness has withdrawn it's fixated 'deer in the headlights' identification with the experiential vehicle (enlightenment), we might ponder in what way that vehicle continues to serve it's 'purpose' in it's role as an experiential aspect of Consciousness. We can certainly imagine the meaning of an enlightened master who teaches a conceptualized version of what is known beyond the limitations of this vehicle, and we can imagine this is why many remain in physical form. But for many others, we can see how the journey has truly come to an end and the experiential vehicle simply serves no purpose and dissolves from the experiential dreamscape. The actual physical 'cause' of this death is simply an experiential expression of an exit that takes place because the energy that formed the perspective is no longer present. Cause/effect is part of the illusion, and nobody ever dies from a physical cause. It is, of course, of no consequence at all to the individual. There is no longer an individual. Hencely, there's nothing at all to fear. Phil [] On Behalf Of David Friday, September 01, 2006 1:14 PM Does anybody know anyone or heard of anyone who became so enlightened they just dropped dead? Certain “real I zations†exert a tremendous force upon the body that can, and sometimes do, result in death and or suicide. (Death and or suicide?) Certain other realities i.e. nirvikalpa samdhi, deny One the ability to function in the “world†some times resulting in the death of the realizer… The enlightenment supposition is nothing more than an observation of evolution…………… There is an evolutionary process in motion that sometimes results in over supply of shakti and it can kill…. But it ain’t no thang ‘cause everyBody’s gonna die……… Not you; but yo body…… Don’t panic. There’s nothing to worry about, because most people will never get anywhere near the “real thingâ€â€¦â€¦ Love and bliss and peace There is no peace (shanti) without power (shakti) michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 2, 2006 Report Share Posted September 2, 2006 , ADHHUB wrote: > > > Every now and then, a trip into conceptual hell is useful. > Okay, lemme see........An individualized perspective (a human) arises > spontaneously out of Consciousness as a kind of energy of unrealized experience. > IOW, you seemingly exist only because you represent an aspect of the Totality of > Consciousness that was not currently being experientially realized. In this > respect, you're absolutely unique in all of creation, and the reflection > would not be complete without you. > > As such, your experience arises from within your own dynamics of awareness, > desire, thought feeling, etc that 'caused' you to seemingly exist in the first > place. You could say that your purpose is to experience and express that > aspect, but purpose is just a human conceptualization of a 'process' that occurs > spontaneously and without design. > > This experiential aspect seemingly dies when the experience is complete, in > much the same way that a nightly dream ends when the mental/emotional energy > that initiates the dream has been exhausted in it's expression. > > While the purpose of life is not to attain enlightenment, desire for > completion is the force that gives life movement, and the movement is necessary for > experience to occur. This is a movement 'occurring' within Consciousness. > Once Consciousness has withdrawn it's fixated 'deer in the headlights' > identification with the experiential vehicle (enlightenment), we might ponder in what > way that vehicle continues to serve it's 'purpose' in it's role as an > experiential aspect of Consciousness. > > We can certainly imagine the meaning of an enlightened master who teaches a > conceptualized version of what is known beyond the limitations of this > vehicle, and we can imagine this is why many remain in physical form. But for many > others, we can see how the journey has truly come to an end and the > experiential vehicle simply serves no purpose and dissolves from the experiential > dreamscape. The actual physical 'cause' of this death is simply an experiential > expression of an exit that takes place because the energy that formed the > perspective is no longer present. Cause/effect is part of the illusion, and nobody > ever dies from a physical cause. > > It is, of course, of no consequence at all to the individual. There is no > longer an individual. Hencely, there's nothing at all to fear. > > Phil Hi Phil, Nice to see 'you' 'here';-) Every endeavor found by human ingenuity inquiry and the will to survive has been given a name : philosophy, psychology, quantum physics, religion, etc., as a method to explain the inexplicable: how it is that it is. This miracle and mystery of presence, called life. I think 'enlightenment' is just the first step in the evolution of mankind. So far, every -ology has evolved the possible human. Now as an enlightened - Be-Ing - wo/mankind is evolving as an evolutionary force in and of itself. Something we have not yet experienced. Or perhapas this is the end of all. And those of us who still have speaking parts in this play, are leaving, one by one. ;-) Anna > > > > > > > > [] On Behalf Of David > Friday, September 01, 2006 1:14 PM > > Does anybody know anyone > > > > > > or heard of anyone who became so enlightened > they just dropped dead? > Certain “real I zations†exert a tremendous force upon the body that can, > and sometimes do, result in death and or suicide. (Death and or suicide?) > Certain other realities i.e. nirvikalpa samdhi, deny One the ability to > function in the “world†some times resulting in the death of the realizer… > The enlightenment supposition is nothing more than an observation of > evolution…………… > There is an evolutionary process in motion that sometimes results in over > supply of shakti and it can kill…. > But it ain’t no thang ‘cause everyBody’s gonna die……… Not you; but yo > body…… > Don’t panic. There’s nothing to worry about, because most people will > never get anywhere near the “real thingâ€â€¦â€¦ > Love and bliss and peace > There is no peace (shanti) without power (shakti) > michael > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 2, 2006 Report Share Posted September 2, 2006 , "David" <david.bozzi wrote: > > or heard of anyone who became so enlightened > they just dropped dead? > david dear, "enlightenment" is death of the apparent ego identity, realization that the self is not personal, and has nothing to do with form, name, birth and death, etc... thus the sufis say: "die before you die". so it may be said that whoever 'becomes enlightened' dies then and there. as for the way it appears - it does not matter in the slightest... yosy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 2, 2006 Report Share Posted September 2, 2006 _____ [] On Behalf Of yosyx Saturday, September 02, 2006 6:14 AM Re: Does anybody know anyone @ <%40> , "David" <david.bozzi wrote: > > or heard of anyone who became so enlightened > they just dropped dead? > david dear, "enlightenment" is death of the apparent ego identity, realization that the self is not personal, and has nothing to do with form, name, birth and death, etc... thus the sufis say: "die before you die". so it may be said that whoever 'becomes enlightened' dies then and there. as for the way it appears - it does not matter in the slightest... yosy In the Bible Jesus says: He who seeks to save his life shall lose it; but he who loses his life (for the sake of knowledge) will save it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 2, 2006 Report Share Posted September 2, 2006 , "yosyx" <yosyflug wrote: > > , "David" <david.bozzi@> wrote: > > > > or heard of anyone who became so enlightened > > they just dropped dead? > > > > > david dear, "enlightenment" is death of the apparent > ego identity, realization that the self is not personal, > and has nothing to do with form, name, birth and death, > etc... thus the sufis say: "die before you die". so it > may be said that whoever 'becomes enlightened' dies then > and there. as for the way it appears - it does not matter > in the slightest... > > yosy > ahhh, identities SHADOLAND Release me from my Poet's heart, my Darling, I cannot stay this near and be so far away I cannot hold you and let you go with the same hands, I am incarcerated in time and distance, and you and I, wet wilderness to open sky and frothy dialogue of moon to rising sea only the night air lingers now as our shadows gather beyond the stars, break waves. Anna 9/2/06 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 2, 2006 Report Share Posted September 2, 2006 In a message dated 9/2/2006 4:25:38 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, kailashana (AT) cox (DOT) net writes: , ADHHUB wrote: > > > Every now and then, a trip into conceptual hell is useful. > Okay, lemme see........An individualized perspective (a human) arises > spontaneously out of Consciousness as a kind of energy of unrealized experience. > IOW, you seemingly exist only because you represent an aspect of the Totality of > Consciousness that was not currently being experientially realized. In this > respect, you're absolutely unique in all of creation, and the reflection > would not be complete without you. > > As such, your experience arises from within your own dynamics of awareness, > desire, thought feeling, etc that 'caused' you to seemingly exist in the first > place. You could say that your purpose is to experience and express that > aspect, but purpose is just a human conceptualization of a 'process' that occurs > spontaneously and without design. > > This experiential aspect seemingly dies when the experience is complete, in > much the same way that a nightly dream ends when the mental/emotional energy > that initiates the dream has been exhausted in it's expression. > > While the purpose of life is not to attain enlightenment, desire for > completion is the force that gives life movement, and the movement is necessary for > experience to occur. This is a movement 'occurring' within Consciousness. > Once Consciousness has withdrawn it's fixated 'deer in the headlights' > identification with the experiential vehicle (enlightenment), we might ponder in what > way that vehicle continues to serve it's 'purpose' in it's role as an > experiential aspect of Consciousness. > > We can certainly imagine the meaning of an enlightened master who teaches a > conceptualized version of what is known beyond the limitations of this > vehicle, and we can imagine this is why many remain in physical form. But for many > others, we can see how the journey has truly come to an end and the > experiential vehicle simply serves no purpose and dissolves from the experiential > dreamscape. The actual physical 'cause' of this death is simply an experiential > expression of an exit that takes place because the energy that formed the > perspective is no longer present. Cause/effect is part of the illusion, and nobody > ever dies from a physical cause. > > It is, of course, of no consequence at all to the individual. There is no > longer an individual. Hencely, there's nothing at all to fear. > > Phil Hi Phil, Nice to see 'you' 'here';-) Every endeavor found by human ingenuity inquiry and the will to survive has been given a name : philosophy, psychology, quantum physics, religion, etc., as a method to explain the inexplicable: how it is that it is. This miracle and mystery of presence, called life. I think 'enlightenment' is just the first step in the evolution of mankind. So far, every -ology has evolved the possible human. Now as an enlightened - Be-Ing - wo/mankind is evolving as an evolutionary force in and of itself. Something we have not yet experienced. Or perhapas this is the end of all. And those of us who still have speaking parts in this play, are leaving, one by one. ;-) Anna Hard to keep a good Phil-osopher down. ~ Funny thing about 'ology' evolution; it's actually an expression of an evolution of awareness rather than any sort of cause. Yeah, I would say that, once humanity awakens from the dream, the dreamscape is no longer meaningful, and planet ego dissolves. It's difficult to see how this particular game of perception and dissection with a dualistic mind could continue. Howsoever, it seems likely we can invent a new game, the rules of which couldn't possibly be seen from a dualistic perspective........Okay, God's sitting here nudging me saying, 'Phil, that's all nonsense. Stop that before you embarrass yourself.' Okay, then you write it! 'You're just digging yourself in deeper, ya know.' OOOOkaaaay, I'm done now.....Sheesh! Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 2, 2006 Report Share Posted September 2, 2006 , ADHHUB wrote: > > > In a message dated 9/2/2006 4:25:38 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, > kailashana writes: > > , ADHHUB@ wrote: > > > > > > Every now and then, a trip into conceptual hell is useful. > > Okay, lemme see........An individualized perspective (a human) > arises > > spontaneously out of Consciousness as a kind of energy of > unrealized experience. > > IOW, you seemingly exist only because you represent an aspect of > the Totality of > > Consciousness that was not currently being experientially > realized. In this > > respect, you're absolutely unique in all of creation, and the > reflection > > would not be complete without you. > > > > As such, your experience arises from within your own dynamics of > awareness, > > desire, thought feeling, etc that 'caused' you to seemingly exist > in the first > > place. You could say that your purpose is to experience and > express that > > aspect, but purpose is just a human conceptualization of > a 'process' that occurs > > spontaneously and without design. > > > > This experiential aspect seemingly dies when the experience is > complete, in > > much the same way that a nightly dream ends when the > mental/emotional energy > > that initiates the dream has been exhausted in it's expression. > > > > While the purpose of life is not to attain enlightenment, desire > for > > completion is the force that gives life movement, and the movement > is necessary for > > experience to occur. This is a movement 'occurring' within > Consciousness. > > Once Consciousness has withdrawn it's fixated 'deer in the > headlights' > > identification with the experiential vehicle (enlightenment), we > might ponder in what > > way that vehicle continues to serve it's 'purpose' in it's role as > an > > experiential aspect of Consciousness. > > > > We can certainly imagine the meaning of an enlightened master who > teaches a > > conceptualized version of what is known beyond the limitations of > this > > vehicle, and we can imagine this is why many remain in physical > form. But for many > > others, we can see how the journey has truly come to an end and > the > > experiential vehicle simply serves no purpose and dissolves from > the experiential > > dreamscape. The actual physical 'cause' of this death is simply > an experiential > > expression of an exit that takes place because the energy that > formed the > > perspective is no longer present. Cause/effect is part of the > illusion, and nobody > > ever dies from a physical cause. > > > > It is, of course, of no consequence at all to the individual. > There is no > > longer an individual. Hencely, there's nothing at all to fear. > > > > Phil > > > Hi Phil, > > Nice to see 'you' 'here';-) > > Every endeavor found by human ingenuity inquiry and the will to > survive has been given a name : philosophy, psychology, quantum > physics, religion, etc., as a method to explain the inexplicable: > how it is that it is. This miracle and mystery of presence, called > life. > > I think 'enlightenment' is just the first step in the evolution of > mankind. So far, every -ology has evolved the possible human. Now > as an enlightened - Be-Ing - wo/mankind is evolving as an > evolutionary force in and of itself. Something we have not yet > experienced. Or perhapas this is the end of all. And those of us > who still have speaking parts in this play, are leaving, one by one. > > ;-) > > Anna > > > > > > > > Hard to keep a good Phil-osopher down. ~ > > > > Funny thing about 'ology' evolution; it's actually an expression of an > evolution of awareness rather than any sort of cause. > Yeah, I would say that, once humanity awakens from the dream, the dreamscape > is no longer meaningful, and planet ego dissolves. It's difficult to see how > this particular game of perception and dissection with a dualistic mind > could continue. > > Howsoever, it seems likely we can invent a new game, the rules of which > couldn't possibly be seen from a dualistic perspective........Okay, God's sitting > here nudging me saying, 'Phil, that's all nonsense. Stop that before you > embarrass yourself.' > > Okay, then you write it! > > 'You're just digging yourself in deeper, ya know.' > > OOOOkaaaay, I'm done now.....Sheesh! > > Phil > LOL 'Phil', funny funny things we say when there's noOne left to talk to but ourselves. ROFLMarseO. wink. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 3, 2006 Report Share Posted September 3, 2006 In a message dated 9/2/2006 4:35:09 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, kailashana (AT) cox (DOT) net writes: , ADHHUB wrote: > > > In a message dated 9/2/2006 4:25:38 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, > kailashana writes: > > , ADHHUB@ wrote: > > > > > > Every now and then, a trip into conceptual hell is useful. > > Okay, lemme see........An individualized perspective (a human) > arises > > spontaneously out of Consciousness as a kind of energy of > unrealized experience. > > IOW, you seemingly exist only because you represent an aspect of > the Totality of > > Consciousness that was not currently being experientially > realized. In this > > respect, you're absolutely unique in all of creation, and the > reflection > > would not be complete without you. > > > > As such, your experience arises from within your own dynamics of > awareness, > > desire, thought feeling, etc that 'caused' you to seemingly exist > in the first > > place. You could say that your purpose is to experience and > express that > > aspect, but purpose is just a human conceptualization of > a 'process' that occurs > > spontaneously and without design. > > > > This experiential aspect seemingly dies when the experience is > complete, in > > much the same way that a nightly dream ends when the > mental/emotional energy > > that initiates the dream has been exhausted in it's expression. > > > > While the purpose of life is not to attain enlightenment, desire > for > > completion is the force that gives life movement, and the movement > is necessary for > > experience to occur. This is a movement 'occurring' within > Consciousness. > > Once Consciousness has withdrawn it's fixated 'deer in the > headlights' > > identification with the experiential vehicle (enlightenment), we > might ponder in what > > way that vehicle continues to serve it's 'purpose' in it's role as > an > > experiential aspect of Consciousness. > > > > We can certainly imagine the meaning of an enlightened master who > teaches a > > conceptualized version of what is known beyond the limitations of > this > > vehicle, and we can imagine this is why many remain in physical > form. But for many > > others, we can see how the journey has truly come to an end and > the > > experiential vehicle simply serves no purpose and dissolves from > the experiential > > dreamscape. The actual physical 'cause' of this death is simply > an experiential > > expression of an exit that takes place because the energy that > formed the > > perspective is no longer present. Cause/effect is part of the > illusion, and nobody > > ever dies from a physical cause. > > > > It is, of course, of no consequence at all to the individual. > There is no > > longer an individual. Hencely, there's nothing at all to fear. > > > > Phil > > > Hi Phil, > > Nice to see 'you' 'here';-) > > Every endeavor found by human ingenuity inquiry and the will to > survive has been given a name : philosophy, psychology, quantum > physics, religion, etc., as a method to explain the inexplicable: > how it is that it is. This miracle and mystery of presence, called > life. > > I think 'enlightenment' is just the first step in the evolution of > mankind. So far, every -ology has evolved the possible human. Now > as an enlightened - Be-Ing - wo/mankind is evolving as an > evolutionary force in and of itself. Something we have not yet > experienced. Or perhapas this is the end of all. And those of us > who still have speaking parts in this play, are leaving, one by one. > > ;-) > > Anna > > > > > > > > Hard to keep a good Phil-osopher down. ~ > > > > Funny thing about 'ology' evolution; it's actually an expression of an > evolution of awareness rather than any sort of cause. > Yeah, I would say that, once humanity awakens from the dream, the dreamscape > is no longer meaningful, and planet ego dissolves. It's difficult to see how > this particular game of perception and dissection with a dualistic mind > could continue. > > Howsoever, it seems likely we can invent a new game, the rules of which > couldn't possibly be seen from a dualistic perspective........Okay, God's sitting > here nudging me saying, 'Phil, that's all nonsense. Stop that before you > embarrass yourself.' > > Okay, then you write it! > > 'You're just digging yourself in deeper, ya know.' > > OOOOkaaaay, I'm done now.....Sheesh! > > Phil > LOL 'Phil', funny funny things we say when there's noOne left to talk to but ourselves. ROFLMarseO. wink. Hehe. Trouble is the arguing just gets worse all the time! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 3, 2006 Report Share Posted September 3, 2006 , "anabebe57" <kailashana wrote: > > , "yosyx" <yosyflug@> wrote: > > > > , "David" <david.bozzi@> > wrote: > > > > > > or heard of anyone who became so enlightened > > > they just dropped dead? > > > > > > > > > david dear, "enlightenment" is death of the apparent > > ego identity, realization that the self is not personal, > > and has nothing to do with form, name, birth and death, > > etc... thus the sufis say: "die before you die". so it > > may be said that whoever 'becomes enlightened' dies then > > and there. as for the way it appears - it does not matter > > in the slightest... > > > > yosy > > > > > ahhh, identities > > SHADOLAND > > Release me from my Poet's heart, > my Darling, > > I cannot stay this near and be so > far away > > I cannot hold you and let you go > with the same hands, > > I am incarcerated in time and distance, > and you and I, > > wet wilderness to open sky and > frothy dialogue of moon to > rising sea > > only the night air > lingers now > > as our shadows gather > beyond the stars, > break waves. > > > > Anna > 9/2/06 > what dies is the attachment to identity... you and i were never born. i and you will never die. beloved, "you" and "i" is just a dream reflecting in eternal eye @}->,->'-- enjoy! yosy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 5, 2006 Report Share Posted September 5, 2006 Vanakkam! are we all internalising or externalising here? if its externalising, then it cant be Advaita. who Realizes and who dies? physical death has nothing to do with Realization. Brahman is Real. the universe is not real. Brahman is the universe...... lets not intellectualise everything......perhaps the habits of the mind are hard to break... Aum Namoh Bhagavathey, Brahma Jnani Sri Ramanayaa... Anbudan Philip Miller <pem218 > wrote: Actually, there is a Sufi tale about a Persian poet who became so transported during a Zikr that the musicians were fearful of stopping their playing because they did not want to end his ecstatic trance. But after several days, their strength gave out, they stopped, and the poet promptly died. I heard this story perhaps five or six years ago. David <david.bozzi (AT) softhome (DOT) net> wrote: or heard of anyone who became so enlightened they just dropped dead? Everyone is raving about the all-new Mail. PEACE through SURRENDER ... Get your own web address for just $1.99/1st yr. We'll help. Small Business. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 5, 2006 Report Share Posted September 5, 2006 mango tree wrote: > are we all internalising or externalising here? if its > externalising, then it cant be Advaita. Yeah and neither is eating, breathing and defecating. (or your post) > who Realizes and who dies? physical death has nothing to do with > Realization. I would never pretend to know that. Afterall, what is the prize for pretending to know? > Brahman is Real. the universe is not real. Brahman is the > universe...... There are parrorts that can say this. (BTW saying that it is duality) > lets not intellectualise everything......perhaps the habits of the > mind are hard to break... The body even tougher. Good luck with holding your breath and your new starvation diet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 5, 2006 Report Share Posted September 5, 2006 Welp, yes, there is a mental misalignment with the concepts in this discussion. On the other hand, unless it is KNOWN that there is nobody to realize who dies and that the universe is not real, I accept these concerns as genuine expressions of an ego identity that prefers to face those concerns rather than conceptualize them into oblivion. There's much to be said for being honest with oneself as to difference between concepts embraced by the mind, and a knowing that has nothing to do with mind or it's habits. Phil In a message dated 9/5/2006 6:01:33 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, oldmangotree writes: Vanakkam! are we all internalising or externalising here? if its externalising, then it cant be Advaita. who Realizes and who dies? physical death has nothing to do with Realization. Brahman is Real. the universe is not real. Brahman is the universe...... lets not intellectualise everything......perhaps the habits of the mind are hard to break... Aum Namoh Bhagavathey, Brahma Jnani Sri Ramanayaa... Anbudan Philip Miller <pem218 > wrote: Actually, there is a Sufi tale about a Persian poet who became so transported during a Zikr that the musicians were fearful of stopping their playing because they did not want to end his ecstatic trance. But after several days, their strength gave out, they stopped, and the poet promptly died. I heard this story perhaps five or six years ago. David <david.bozzi (AT) david (DOT) bozdav> wrote: or heard of anyone who became so enlightened they just dropped dead? __ Everyone is raving about the _all-new Mail._ (http://us.rd./evt=42297/*http://advision.webevents./mailbeta) PEACE through SURRENDER ... __ Get your own _web address for just $1.99/1st yr_ (http://us.rd./evt=43290/*http://smallbusiness./domains) . We'll help. _ Small Business_ (http://us.rd./evt=41244/*http://smallbusiness./) . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 5, 2006 Report Share Posted September 5, 2006 How's this for a bewildering story: The ego death or the seeing through the first cause, the I Am embodiment, is only the first stage of 'enlightenment'. The next death is the death of the body as APPEARS to the living; however this appearance, a parallel of the appearance of the 'thinking body' before 'enlightenment' can only be witnessed by those who have dropped both the false thinking ego-body, and the appearance body. Ergo life beyond any/all appearances in any/all duality. Proof? Can you prove enlightenment? Questions for a Tuesday. Wink. , ADHHUB wrote: > > > Welp, yes, there is a mental misalignment with the concepts in this > discussion. On the other hand, unless it is KNOWN that there is nobody to realize who > dies and that the universe is not real, I accept these concerns as genuine > expressions of an ego identity that prefers to face those concerns rather than > conceptualize them into oblivion. There's much to be said for being honest > with oneself as to difference between concepts embraced by the mind, and a > knowing that has nothing to do with mind or it's habits. > > Phil > > > > In a message dated 9/5/2006 6:01:33 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, > oldmangotree writes: > > Vanakkam! > > are we all internalising or externalising here? if its externalising, then > it cant be Advaita. who Realizes and who dies? physical death has nothing to > do with Realization. > > Brahman is Real. the universe is not real. Brahman is the universe...... > > lets not intellectualise everything......perhaps the habits of the mind are > hard to break... > > Aum Namoh Bhagavathey, Brahma Jnani Sri Ramanayaa... > > Anbudan > > Philip Miller <pem218 wrote: > > > > Actually, there is a Sufi tale about a Persian poet who became so > transported during a Zikr that the musicians were fearful of stopping their playing > because they did not want to end his ecstatic trance. But after several days, > their strength gave out, they stopped, and the poet promptly died. > > I heard this story perhaps five or six years ago. > > David <david.bozzi wrote: > > > or heard of anyone who became so enlightened > they just dropped dead? > > > > > > > __ > > Everyone is raving about the _all-new Mail._ > (http://us.rd./evt=42297/*http://advision.webevents..co m/mailbeta) > > > > > > > > > PEACE through SURRENDER ... > > __ > Get your own _web address for just $1.99/1st yr_ > (http://us.rd./evt=43290/*http://smallbusiness./dom ains) . We'll help. _ Small > Business_ (http://us.rd./evt=41244/*http://smallbusiness./) . > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 5, 2006 Report Share Posted September 5, 2006 Sorry, Anna. I dunno where you're comin from or where you're goin with it. ~ I guess the bewilderment worked! In a message dated 9/5/2006 10:31:03 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, kailashana (AT) cox (DOT) net writes: How's this for a bewildering story: The ego death or the seeing through the first cause, the I Am embodiment, is only the first stage of 'enlightenment'. The next death is the death of the body as APPEARS to the living; however this appearance, a parallel of the appearance of the 'thinking body' before 'enlightenment' can only be witnessed by those who have dropped both the false thinking ego-body, and the appearance body. Ergo life beyond any/all appearances in any/all duality. Proof? Can you prove enlightenment? Questions for a Tuesday. Wink. , ADHHUB wrote: > > > Welp, yes, there is a mental misalignment with the concepts in this > discussion. On the other hand, unless it is KNOWN that there is nobody to realize who > dies and that the universe is not real, I accept these concerns as genuine > expressions of an ego identity that prefers to face those concerns rather than > conceptualize them into oblivion. There's much to be said for being honest > with oneself as to difference between concepts embraced by the mind, and a > knowing that has nothing to do with mind or it's habits. > > Phil > > > > In a message dated 9/5/2006 6:01:33 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, > oldmangotree writes: > > Vanakkam! > > are we all internalising or externalising here? if its externalising, then > it cant be Advaita. who Realizes and who dies? physical death has nothing to > do with Realization. > > Brahman is Real. the universe is not real. Brahman is the universe...... > > lets not intellectualise everything......perhaps the habits of the mind are > hard to break... > > Aum Namoh Bhagavathey, Brahma Jnani Sri Ramanayaa... > > Anbudan > > Philip Miller <pem218 wrote: > > > > Actually, there is a Sufi tale about a Persian poet who became so > transported during a Zikr that the musicians were fearful of stopping their playing > because they did not want to end his ecstatic trance. But after several days, > their strength gave out, they stopped, and the poet promptly died. > > I heard this story perhaps five or six years ago. > > David <david.bozzi wrote: > > > or heard of anyone who became so enlightened > they just dropped dead? > > > > > > > __ > > Everyone is raving about the _all-new Mail._ > (http://us.rd./evt=42297/*http://advision.webevents..co m/mailbeta) > > > > > > > > > PEACE through SURRENDER ... > > __ > Get your own _web address for just $1.99/1st yr_ > (http://us.rd./evt=43290/*http://smallbusiness./dom ains) . We'll help. _ Small > Business_ (http://us.rd./evt=41244/*http://smallbusiness./) . > Magazine and Website is at community blog is at http://.net/blog/ "Love itself is the actual form of God." Sri Ramana In "Letters from Sri Ramanasramam" by Suri Nagamma Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 6, 2006 Report Share Posted September 6, 2006 Dear friend, _____ [] On Behalf Of mango tree Tuesday, September 05, 2006 5:59 AM Re: Does anybody know anyone Vanakkam! are we all internalising or externalising here? if its externalising, then it cant be Advaita. who Realizes and who dies? physical death has nothing to do with Realization. I'm not sure that there is an "internal" or an "external". Brahman is Real. the universe is not real. Brahman is the universe...... let's not intellectualise everything......perhaps the habits of the mind are hard to break... Correctomundo.... Let's don't intellectualize everything. But my friend, the problem is that how are we to share with one another on an online group without using words? Anything that is expressed here, including your wise words, can be deemed to be an intellectualization. Shall we not communicate? Would that make you happy? Aum Namoh Bhagavathey, Brahma Jnani Sri Ramanayaa... Anbudan Peace and love, michael Philip Miller <pem218 > wrote: Actually, there is a Sufi tale about a Persian poet who became so transported during a Zikr that the musicians were fearful of stopping their playing because they did not want to end his ecstatic trance. But after several days, their strength gave out, they stopped, and the poet promptly died. I heard this story perhaps five or six years ago. David <david.bozzi (AT) softhome (DOT) net> wrote: or heard of anyone who became so enlightened they just dropped dead? _____ Everyone is raving about the all-new <http://us.rd./evt=42297/*http:/advision.webevents./mailbe ta> Mail. PEACE through SURRENDER ... _____ Get your own web address for just $1.99/1st yr. We'll help. <http://us.rd./evt=41244/*http:/smallbusiness./> Small Business. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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